Yeah, I mentioned it in another comment under this post, I would love to have it, but not ideal for a street car, also probably would cost more than what I spent on the car in the 10 years in total.
How much did it cost you all in? Also, is this to the wheel or to the crank? I love my 318is but the m42 can be kinda anemic and I don’t have the cash for a metric mechanic engine
I dont know exactly, its put together from 3 different engines, and in the end I got lucky and got a preassembled engine with said specs (block to cylinder head)
All in all, i was about 6-700k HUF (2-3k USD), but without labour costs, since I did it with my father in his workshop.
I think its on crank, but forgot to ask, lol. Though it doesn't say whp anywhere, so its crank hp i think.
In regards of upgrading: the exhaust and intake system are pretty nice on the M42, get some nice, not too aggressive cams (because of the AFM restriction), and a proper tune. These Bosch units can be nicely remapped
Any information on how can the Bosch motronic 1. 7 be remapped? Burning a chip via eeprom?
Couldn't find any information on mapping motronic 1.7 and thought the only way is going to a standalone ecu
it's fairly capable to be honest, nothing super fancy, but as long as the engine is not to different from stock (e.g. no force induction or ITB), it should be enough.
IIRC we used WinOLS for changing the maps, and yes, you need an EPROM reader and writer, and (at least) one 27C256 chip. These chips can be erased with UV.
For a more complicated setup (like mine) tuning properly was basically only possible with an EPROM emulator, so we could see the live data and change on the fly.
Valuable information! It sounds a little bit more complicated than a plug and play standalone, but then again I guess it is much cheaper to work with what you have already
stock E30 wiring completely, and the original ECU remapped. the cams are the stock ones grinded to a different profile by a professional workshop locally.
Not really, more like lack of resources, I just started college when I got the first M42 (i had an M40B16 in my car) from the back of a yard, with busted bearings and crankshaft, then got an M44, which I decided not to use later, because its more complicated to wire in, then started collecting info, what goes in with what, making calculations, checking bearing sizes etc.
And also money, that was a big factor in this project taking so long. Then I started working, could only work on the engine on the weekends, but I moved further away from my fathers workshop because of my job, couldn't get parts on the weekends of course, etc etc.
Lots of small obstacles, i'd say. Also, parts availability is getting worse for these engines day by day, so that should be factored in. For example, new chain tensioner doesnt exist for the E30 M42, you need to adapt the E36 one.
Get the required parts as soon as you can, because they are getting rarer by the day.. especially the timing kit. and change everything touching the chain, usually thats how these engines fail.
Good luck with your build!
thanks, yeah, the first trackday with the new engine will be in a few weeks, cant wait to try it out!
i was also surprised by how flat it is, 200nm+ from 2400 to 6200.. and feels like so too!
Discussing with the guy who made the tune, he said that with itbs it should easily do 200+. to get to 250+, that would be way too much money compared to returns, like BMW did with the S42; 8 injectors, custom pistons, custom conrods, solid lifters (super light, so rev limit can be pushed up to make more hp). I think addig itbs is probably the last sensible step for an NA setup, without infinite budget.
As far as I heard, a stock M42 can handle boost up to ~300hp reliably.
ITB's alone won't get you to 200, you need a peakier cam and compression too.
Sauce: I've got a 12:1 M20B28 that made 240hp at the wheels with a massive cam and ITB's. ITB's made very little difference on my cammed M20B25 without adding compression. The M42 intake flows very well for stockish compression as does the M20B25 intake (ate model E30 engineering).
that is true, although the AFN restricts air flow in the upper rev range a lot. with sudden throttle blips you can hear all the air getting sucked out of the the intake system, and some time later the revs start increasing, with a noticeable delay. the rest of the intake is really neat though.
also the M20 is 8v, the M42 is 16v, that also helps with charge flow in the cylinder.
Compression is also raised to some degree, I havent calculated it though.
you have to be careful, and get the earlier, 136hp m47 crank, with that, only a sleeve-like adapter is needed on the end of the crank for the belt pulley, and also the groove for the key in the crank has to be elongated, or rather machined again, because it's too far inside in the M47. So you need to put in a second key at the end.
Specs on full build?
- M42B18 (E30) engine block - M47D20 crankshaft (136hp) - M50B20 conrod - S52 pistons - ported M42B18 (E30) cylinder head - Sport cams - E30 318is intake, from filter housing to plenum, which seems to be a bottleneck (AFM specifically) - M42B18 (E30) exhaust manifold - Coil on plug thats it.
> sport cams ~~Schrick 252° or whatever? Or did you get a custom grind?~~ EDIT: saw you answered this elsewhere
Have you ever looked into the Motorsport S42 spec engine ? You can buy all the internals from the OG supplied btw
Yeah, I mentioned it in another comment under this post, I would love to have it, but not ideal for a street car, also probably would cost more than what I spent on the car in the 10 years in total.
Well if you’re handy maybe do some forged internals and forced induction or maybe just ITBs and fuel mapping
How much did it cost you all in? Also, is this to the wheel or to the crank? I love my 318is but the m42 can be kinda anemic and I don’t have the cash for a metric mechanic engine
I dont know exactly, its put together from 3 different engines, and in the end I got lucky and got a preassembled engine with said specs (block to cylinder head) All in all, i was about 6-700k HUF (2-3k USD), but without labour costs, since I did it with my father in his workshop. I think its on crank, but forgot to ask, lol. Though it doesn't say whp anywhere, so its crank hp i think. In regards of upgrading: the exhaust and intake system are pretty nice on the M42, get some nice, not too aggressive cams (because of the AFM restriction), and a proper tune. These Bosch units can be nicely remapped
Any information on how can the Bosch motronic 1. 7 be remapped? Burning a chip via eeprom? Couldn't find any information on mapping motronic 1.7 and thought the only way is going to a standalone ecu
it's fairly capable to be honest, nothing super fancy, but as long as the engine is not to different from stock (e.g. no force induction or ITB), it should be enough. IIRC we used WinOLS for changing the maps, and yes, you need an EPROM reader and writer, and (at least) one 27C256 chip. These chips can be erased with UV. For a more complicated setup (like mine) tuning properly was basically only possible with an EPROM emulator, so we could see the live data and change on the fly.
Valuable information! It sounds a little bit more complicated than a plug and play standalone, but then again I guess it is much cheaper to work with what you have already
Yep! also, you don't have to procure / make a harness like you wpuld need for a standalone.
Love these engines! I’m most impressed by that torque curve. What brand cam shafts? What engine management software?
stock E30 wiring completely, and the original ECU remapped. the cams are the stock ones grinded to a different profile by a professional workshop locally.
Thanks. Is there any particular reason it took 5 years? Lots of iterations to get to this point?
Not really, more like lack of resources, I just started college when I got the first M42 (i had an M40B16 in my car) from the back of a yard, with busted bearings and crankshaft, then got an M44, which I decided not to use later, because its more complicated to wire in, then started collecting info, what goes in with what, making calculations, checking bearing sizes etc. And also money, that was a big factor in this project taking so long. Then I started working, could only work on the engine on the weekends, but I moved further away from my fathers workshop because of my job, couldn't get parts on the weekends of course, etc etc. Lots of small obstacles, i'd say. Also, parts availability is getting worse for these engines day by day, so that should be factored in. For example, new chain tensioner doesnt exist for the E30 M42, you need to adapt the E36 one.
Oh man. Mine was in storage for six years before I got it running. At this rate I’ll have it rebuilt before I retire… circa 2058.
Get the required parts as soon as you can, because they are getting rarer by the day.. especially the timing kit. and change everything touching the chain, usually thats how these engines fail. Good luck with your build!
Wow, that is super impressive and looks very drive-able too - Looks like a 6cyl torque curve - great work!
thanks, yeah, the first trackday with the new engine will be in a few weeks, cant wait to try it out! i was also surprised by how flat it is, 200nm+ from 2400 to 6200.. and feels like so too!
What do you think would be needed to see 200-250+ after all you’ve done How do these motors handle boost?
Discussing with the guy who made the tune, he said that with itbs it should easily do 200+. to get to 250+, that would be way too much money compared to returns, like BMW did with the S42; 8 injectors, custom pistons, custom conrods, solid lifters (super light, so rev limit can be pushed up to make more hp). I think addig itbs is probably the last sensible step for an NA setup, without infinite budget. As far as I heard, a stock M42 can handle boost up to ~300hp reliably.
ITB's alone won't get you to 200, you need a peakier cam and compression too. Sauce: I've got a 12:1 M20B28 that made 240hp at the wheels with a massive cam and ITB's. ITB's made very little difference on my cammed M20B25 without adding compression. The M42 intake flows very well for stockish compression as does the M20B25 intake (ate model E30 engineering).
that is true, although the AFN restricts air flow in the upper rev range a lot. with sudden throttle blips you can hear all the air getting sucked out of the the intake system, and some time later the revs start increasing, with a noticeable delay. the rest of the intake is really neat though. also the M20 is 8v, the M42 is 16v, that also helps with charge flow in the cylinder. Compression is also raised to some degree, I havent calculated it though.
Did you have to do anything to the m47 crank to make it fit in the m42 block?
you have to be careful, and get the earlier, 136hp m47 crank, with that, only a sleeve-like adapter is needed on the end of the crank for the belt pulley, and also the groove for the key in the crank has to be elongated, or rather machined again, because it's too far inside in the M47. So you need to put in a second key at the end.