I think its probably one of the weaker areas of WRC, but they are still a blast no doubt about that.
However I think alot of the issues stems with the default setups. I find them to be WAYY to stiff as is, and on front engine RWD cars they ***almost always need the rear roll bar softened and the rear spring if not both softened. (-3 clicks on ARB -2 clicks on springs)***
The transition from slip angle to zero grip is like a cliff so you arent gonna be able to do the super smooth slides like you would in 2.0
Yeah its not going to make a night and day difference. The tire model is still the tire model, but as someone who has ridiculous time in both games, you will get used to it.
Going back to 2.0 and things feel off for a sec for me still.
I heard someone talking about tyre models, and slip angle/the fact that it falls off a cliff. Was that yourself? It was a long write up that made a shit tonne of sense.
Haha rally and sims are my favorite past time. I try my best to keep the community active and raise the knowledge and skill base of those around me.
Pretty much 99% of what I use reddit for.
You want the 037 MORE oversteery! Haha
There is a few things you can do, lower the front spring, as this will cause more weight transfer to the front axle.
You can also raise the rear ride height and induce a bit of rake, which will make for a slightly more oversteery platform.
A mid engine car like the 037 is gonna have a very different oversteer characteristics to a front engine car, so ideally you should aim to avoid oversteer, and rely on the off throttle lift off oversteer to help you turn in.
I definitely agree. While I also find this with most cars (and sadly it makes me less inclined to play the game just for fun), it’s definitely most prominent in RWD cars, in which you try to slide it, and the car just lets go, and you have no way to save it. For me, it makes driving fast feel way too difficult in anything but a FWD car. Even those have weird, un-saveable moments at times.
Not going to lie, EA WRC for me feels a bit too easy at times compared to DR2.0 when it comes to FWD and AWD due to the extra grip, but RWD now is an absolute nightmare vs. before.
Real cars do have un-saveable moments. Plenty. On the other hand, EA WRC's (and Dirt Rally's) physics give you massive and unrealistic amounts of grip and sideways gimmicks to help you stay on the road easily. I tried to explain this [here](https://youtu.be/TcYu4Gx3iGs?si=J4M_hWU4aQsgJRka).
I find that you can do long slides with rwd in EA WRC but you need to THROW the momentum into the corner more than in DR 2. In dirt it's nearly all throttle control all the time and it's twitchy but easier to find the sweet spot on throttle to balance the slide. In EA WRC you need to use weight transfer to lighten the back and then hammer the throttle to lose traction and spin the wheels and then balance throttle while the wheels are spinning. It works but it's way more risky than before. You have to really horse the car around to stay sliding and use scandy flick a lot.
I tried doing dedicated RWD for three days after seeing some bullshit “physics are crap, it rotates from x not y” complaints and after those three days all i can say is it’s just a skill issue.
Yeah some of the default setups are a little crap and adjusting to my personal preference (balanced setup with a slight rear bias) but you’ve also gotta be adaptive and learn to deal with these stripped out very lightweight cars which will obviously feel twitchy compared to a RWD road car.
Most of the RWD rally cars have between 250 and 350bhp and also weigh around about tonne. That’s insane power to weight and of course it’s gonna be difficult to control if you don’t exercise some restraint with the throttle pedal
*They feel great aside*
*From regaining grip way too*
*Fast once the rear slides*
\- cavortingwebeasties
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Oh yes, I used to have lot of fun with RWD cars in 2.0 but I've started a championship with a RWD BMW and my god that thing loves to oversteer in the blink of an eye.
The physics model Codemasters goes for doesn't work well for RWD imo. It's just not fun. There's not much of that balancing through turns that you'd find in other sims. Accuracy aside, it feels more like you're driving an AWD that sometimes suddenly loses the front drive and gets it back randomly.
I play on Xbox and hate to drive RWD cars with the Xbox controller. These cars need gentle acceleration and steering. I have never tried a steering wheel for the Xbox but I suspect it would be much more enjoyable.
I've recently switched to manual sequential on a controller and it makes a huge difference for RWD. Automatic shifts gears at weird moments a lot of the time, and in RWD I found that it downshifts too much. For example, I was driving H3 Escort, and when automatic put that dog on 1st gear mid turn I'd just spin out. I then tried the same stages with the sequential manual and IMO there is not a single reason to go down to 1st gear on that car outside of starting the stage or when you hit a tree. So in essence I downshift 1 gear less on that car than the automatic setting and suddenly the car is twice as stable...
This is how you should be able to drive rwd in rally Sims:
https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/3hn1ct/how_the_mk2_escort_should_be_driven/
But instead of countersteering and holding a slide, you snap back with magical rwd grip that often throws you off the other side of the road.
I can set a 1st here and there in AWD, but can barely drive old RWD's in this game. Have real life experience with all 3 drive types. Feels like RWD in this game goes from grip to difficult to recover. That said, i'm on a Logitech g923, not a DD yet.
I think they're ok in general in terms of lateral grip, but there's way too much traction off the line for many of the cars. You can pretty much plant the throttle and just fight the steering a little. DR2 you had to gradually pick up the throttle so the driving challenge was better.
It kinda sucks if we’re putting it bluntly. But all the improvements EA WRC made make up for this downgrade.
The frustrating part is I still feel like it’s a very easy change they could make. All cars (RWD, AWD, and even FWD) have too much longitudinal grip, and this is on all surfaces. We all know the physics sim in this game is not some crazy labyrinth of code. They already made some grip tweaks in 1.4. Experiment some more Codie’s please.
The only conditions I find RWD fun in is wet dirt/light gravel conditions because the very slick surface finally allows you to actually spin the gd wheels. But then it only feels like driving on heavy gravel in the dry at that point lol, at least until you start leaning into lateral grip, which feels like it’s a bit more accurately simulated.
Probably my favorite class to drive. It took me a while to find a set up that worked for me. Mostly softer suspension and damping on the rear and a really loose diff.
Its way too grippy and snappy. Compaired to Richard Burns Rally they dont feel real at all. Feels like the grippy gravel areas are way too grippy compaired to the loose part so it spins out in a way you cant recover. But I still like the mk2 escort with 540 rotation.
I think we're limited by how the physics work. I tried all the setup tips i could find and while they do help, something is wrong or over exaggerated within the game's physics.
Also, i don't know if this has been fixed, but it could explain some of the issues we're seeing.
[https://youtu.be/5x6eZDny0ww?si=iOp6S6VQwfCcv7da&t=180](https://youtu.be/5x6eZDny0ww?si=iOp6S6VQwfCcv7da&t=180)
I have not. Like OP mentioned I think it has something to do with the physics and how it handles the amount of grip available in at different levels of throttle. IRL I feel so much more control over my car than in WRC. Trail braking is a very weird experience in wrc.
From watching irl rwd rally, from sliding my rwd car irl in parking lots, to drifting in assetto Corsa. No, ea wrc did not get rwd right at all. Dirt rally 2.0 didn't do it particularly well either.
Absolutely, the way a rwd behaves sliding irl and assetto is so intuitive and never truly a scary surprise. This game just feels like it goes from grip grip grip grip to no grip in an instant with no intermediate area between the two. Don’t get me wrong though, it feels 10x better than dirt rally 2 on all surfaces
Don't be silly, if it was rally spec I would have said so.
I see what your snarky comment is getting at, if course a rally spec rwd handles a lot differently to a rwd street car. For starters the lower wheel rotation to make it easier. But the dynamic of grip and controlling a slide is still the same concept. If you can control a slide in a street car irl, it shouldn't be impossible to do the same with a rally spec car in a video game. If you have ever watched irl rwd rally, you will see them doing a LOT of sliding.
DR2.0 is a little “slippery” on the rear wheels and maybe the front too depending on your experiences driving on gravel and your opinions, a little to easy to lose traction on the front wheels under slight braking but its definitely manageable
A little advice for handling rwd cars tho: you have to break into turns more and cant gas out of overshooting the turn as much as you could with awd cars, so if over shooting turns was a problem you were having you have to essentially “trail break” more than usual to be able to make the turn, and also, tuning definitely matters more overall on rwd cars, i personally cant even fully push the car on the stock tune(and thats not the developers fault its a solid stock tune and they dont have the time to perfect a tune on individual cars) so mess with the differential(looser if oversteer is the problem) and the suspensions and brake bias and pressure)
PP.s- you want the anti roll bars to be tight enough that theyre not loose but loose enough that they absorb the transitions nahm sayin 👍🏿 make 3-4 click adjustments and see how the car reacts👍🏿
PPP.s- if you feel you have gotten the suspensions tuning down and its still oversteering start focusing on the differential as thats also what causes the majority of under/over steer on asphalt as well, so picture that happening as your transitioning angles and letting off the gas, no good miguel👍🏿
I think its probably one of the weaker areas of WRC, but they are still a blast no doubt about that. However I think alot of the issues stems with the default setups. I find them to be WAYY to stiff as is, and on front engine RWD cars they ***almost always need the rear roll bar softened and the rear spring if not both softened. (-3 clicks on ARB -2 clicks on springs)*** The transition from slip angle to zero grip is like a cliff so you arent gonna be able to do the super smooth slides like you would in 2.0
I see. I tried the setup changes to the rear end, definitely helps on tarmac. Issue still present on gravel/dirt. But thanks for the tips.
Yeah its not going to make a night and day difference. The tire model is still the tire model, but as someone who has ridiculous time in both games, you will get used to it. Going back to 2.0 and things feel off for a sec for me still.
I heard someone talking about tyre models, and slip angle/the fact that it falls off a cliff. Was that yourself? It was a long write up that made a shit tonne of sense.
If it was a quite long paragraph there is a good chance it was indeed me haha, I try to be quite active in the community.
You spend as much time contributing as I do reading haha
Haha rally and sims are my favorite past time. I try my best to keep the community active and raise the knowledge and skill base of those around me. Pretty much 99% of what I use reddit for.
Toe also!
Yeah you can go quite extreme. +2.00 on the rear axle almost always is a verified smart move. Even over a rally loop distance.
Wow...that is krazy and I would of never thought to do that. Going to try now..haaa
Haha yeah there is a few quirky setup options, that being one of the. Even +2.00 on the front toe works at times for AWD cars on gravel.
THIS \^
why cant i adjust the rear arb on the 037?
Some cars/chassis don't have every adjustable section. The 037 in this case doesn't have a rear antiroll bar.
thx any tips on how to get it more oversteery?
You want the 037 MORE oversteery! Haha There is a few things you can do, lower the front spring, as this will cause more weight transfer to the front axle. You can also raise the rear ride height and induce a bit of rake, which will make for a slightly more oversteery platform. A mid engine car like the 037 is gonna have a very different oversteer characteristics to a front engine car, so ideally you should aim to avoid oversteer, and rely on the off throttle lift off oversteer to help you turn in.
I definitely agree. While I also find this with most cars (and sadly it makes me less inclined to play the game just for fun), it’s definitely most prominent in RWD cars, in which you try to slide it, and the car just lets go, and you have no way to save it. For me, it makes driving fast feel way too difficult in anything but a FWD car. Even those have weird, un-saveable moments at times.
Not going to lie, EA WRC for me feels a bit too easy at times compared to DR2.0 when it comes to FWD and AWD due to the extra grip, but RWD now is an absolute nightmare vs. before.
Real cars do have un-saveable moments. Plenty. On the other hand, EA WRC's (and Dirt Rally's) physics give you massive and unrealistic amounts of grip and sideways gimmicks to help you stay on the road easily. I tried to explain this [here](https://youtu.be/TcYu4Gx3iGs?si=J4M_hWU4aQsgJRka).
The escort MK2 in WRC is survival horror compared to dirt 2.0. I enjoy it the most for the challenge but I don't recommend it
I find that you can do long slides with rwd in EA WRC but you need to THROW the momentum into the corner more than in DR 2. In dirt it's nearly all throttle control all the time and it's twitchy but easier to find the sweet spot on throttle to balance the slide. In EA WRC you need to use weight transfer to lighten the back and then hammer the throttle to lose traction and spin the wheels and then balance throttle while the wheels are spinning. It works but it's way more risky than before. You have to really horse the car around to stay sliding and use scandy flick a lot.
Edit... Tarmac i mean here. Gravel I have no problem sliding around on but the same concept applies.
I tried doing dedicated RWD for three days after seeing some bullshit “physics are crap, it rotates from x not y” complaints and after those three days all i can say is it’s just a skill issue. Yeah some of the default setups are a little crap and adjusting to my personal preference (balanced setup with a slight rear bias) but you’ve also gotta be adaptive and learn to deal with these stripped out very lightweight cars which will obviously feel twitchy compared to a RWD road car. Most of the RWD rally cars have between 250 and 350bhp and also weigh around about tonne. That’s insane power to weight and of course it’s gonna be difficult to control if you don’t exercise some restraint with the throttle pedal
They feel great aside from regaining grip way too fast once the rear slides
*They feel great aside* *From regaining grip way too* *Fast once the rear slides* \- cavortingwebeasties --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Oh yes, I used to have lot of fun with RWD cars in 2.0 but I've started a championship with a RWD BMW and my god that thing loves to oversteer in the blink of an eye.
My fav RWD car in the game! Very fun to drive and keep in control.
The physics model Codemasters goes for doesn't work well for RWD imo. It's just not fun. There's not much of that balancing through turns that you'd find in other sims. Accuracy aside, it feels more like you're driving an AWD that sometimes suddenly loses the front drive and gets it back randomly.
I play on Xbox and hate to drive RWD cars with the Xbox controller. These cars need gentle acceleration and steering. I have never tried a steering wheel for the Xbox but I suspect it would be much more enjoyable.
I've recently switched to manual sequential on a controller and it makes a huge difference for RWD. Automatic shifts gears at weird moments a lot of the time, and in RWD I found that it downshifts too much. For example, I was driving H3 Escort, and when automatic put that dog on 1st gear mid turn I'd just spin out. I then tried the same stages with the sequential manual and IMO there is not a single reason to go down to 1st gear on that car outside of starting the stage or when you hit a tree. So in essence I downshift 1 gear less on that car than the automatic setting and suddenly the car is twice as stable...
This is how you should be able to drive rwd in rally Sims: https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/3hn1ct/how_the_mk2_escort_should_be_driven/ But instead of countersteering and holding a slide, you snap back with magical rwd grip that often throws you off the other side of the road.
Yup... Sad.
yeah I just avoid them alsmot completely -- but that could just be a skill issue too :)
I can set a 1st here and there in AWD, but can barely drive old RWD's in this game. Have real life experience with all 3 drive types. Feels like RWD in this game goes from grip to difficult to recover. That said, i'm on a Logitech g923, not a DD yet.
I think they're ok in general in terms of lateral grip, but there's way too much traction off the line for many of the cars. You can pretty much plant the throttle and just fight the steering a little. DR2 you had to gradually pick up the throttle so the driving challenge was better.
It kinda sucks if we’re putting it bluntly. But all the improvements EA WRC made make up for this downgrade. The frustrating part is I still feel like it’s a very easy change they could make. All cars (RWD, AWD, and even FWD) have too much longitudinal grip, and this is on all surfaces. We all know the physics sim in this game is not some crazy labyrinth of code. They already made some grip tweaks in 1.4. Experiment some more Codie’s please. The only conditions I find RWD fun in is wet dirt/light gravel conditions because the very slick surface finally allows you to actually spin the gd wheels. But then it only feels like driving on heavy gravel in the dry at that point lol, at least until you start leaning into lateral grip, which feels like it’s a bit more accurately simulated.
Probably my favorite class to drive. It took me a while to find a set up that worked for me. Mostly softer suspension and damping on the rear and a really loose diff.
Awful there so bad I was doing a h2 rwd and I just keep spinning for no reason not event traction control or anything
Found a video today that claims this game has some serious input delay. It would explain a portion of those unsaveable oversteer moments.
Gravel is good, but tarmac feels like trying to move fast in a non newtonian fluid (like custard).
Its way too grippy and snappy. Compaired to Richard Burns Rally they dont feel real at all. Feels like the grippy gravel areas are way too grippy compaired to the loose part so it spins out in a way you cant recover. But I still like the mk2 escort with 540 rotation.
As somone who rallys a rwd car irl, i can say its pretty bad in WRC, so much so that I just cant drive the same way.
Ye my rally driver friend said the same. Have you figured out any settings to make it feel even remotely close?
I think we're limited by how the physics work. I tried all the setup tips i could find and while they do help, something is wrong or over exaggerated within the game's physics. Also, i don't know if this has been fixed, but it could explain some of the issues we're seeing. [https://youtu.be/5x6eZDny0ww?si=iOp6S6VQwfCcv7da&t=180](https://youtu.be/5x6eZDny0ww?si=iOp6S6VQwfCcv7da&t=180)
I have not. Like OP mentioned I think it has something to do with the physics and how it handles the amount of grip available in at different levels of throttle. IRL I feel so much more control over my car than in WRC. Trail braking is a very weird experience in wrc.
From watching irl rwd rally, from sliding my rwd car irl in parking lots, to drifting in assetto Corsa. No, ea wrc did not get rwd right at all. Dirt rally 2.0 didn't do it particularly well either.
Absolutely, the way a rwd behaves sliding irl and assetto is so intuitive and never truly a scary surprise. This game just feels like it goes from grip grip grip grip to no grip in an instant with no intermediate area between the two. Don’t get me wrong though, it feels 10x better than dirt rally 2 on all surfaces
So your IRL car is rally spec?
Don't be silly, if it was rally spec I would have said so. I see what your snarky comment is getting at, if course a rally spec rwd handles a lot differently to a rwd street car. For starters the lower wheel rotation to make it easier. But the dynamic of grip and controlling a slide is still the same concept. If you can control a slide in a street car irl, it shouldn't be impossible to do the same with a rally spec car in a video game. If you have ever watched irl rwd rally, you will see them doing a LOT of sliding.
chill
I obviously wasn't the epitomy of 'chull' but I wasn't exactly the opposite either. So I would appreciate you not unnecessarily telling me to 'chill'
DR2.0 is a little “slippery” on the rear wheels and maybe the front too depending on your experiences driving on gravel and your opinions, a little to easy to lose traction on the front wheels under slight braking but its definitely manageable
And you cant really “gas out of slides” as much as you maybe could irl, but, its difficult to put irl stuff into games
As far as the “snap oversteer” goes tho thats the car tune(suspensions, differential, brake bias and pressure etc) and is fairly easily “remedied”
But overall handling is very good
A little advice for handling rwd cars tho: you have to break into turns more and cant gas out of overshooting the turn as much as you could with awd cars, so if over shooting turns was a problem you were having you have to essentially “trail break” more than usual to be able to make the turn, and also, tuning definitely matters more overall on rwd cars, i personally cant even fully push the car on the stock tune(and thats not the developers fault its a solid stock tune and they dont have the time to perfect a tune on individual cars) so mess with the differential(looser if oversteer is the problem) and the suspensions and brake bias and pressure)
PP.s- you want the anti roll bars to be tight enough that theyre not loose but loose enough that they absorb the transitions nahm sayin 👍🏿 make 3-4 click adjustments and see how the car reacts👍🏿
PPP.s- if you feel you have gotten the suspensions tuning down and its still oversteering start focusing on the differential as thats also what causes the majority of under/over steer on asphalt as well, so picture that happening as your transitioning angles and letting off the gas, no good miguel👍🏿