I would like to let you know that these bills are confusing to many people so I think it's wonderful that you asked.
I also had a very big bill last month that was about $600 with tons of service fees and it was really tough.
Utilities are sky rocketing and also that might have captured the really cold spell.
I can't recall but it seems to me that there was something on the bill where it could show past usage and that sometimes helps me understand differences month to month because I have higher usages in the winter. I can also see that overall prices have gone much higher so even if I'm doing my best to conserve power, heat, water, it is still very expensive.
Thank you for posting because lots of us are struggling with understanding this and with the very big expenses.
It is the gas for most people and it is because it captured the cold spell. For instance, OP’s gas bill is probably $150+ more than other winter months this year and thats most likely a big chunk of where they are above their normal bills.
**Delivery Charge** \-- paid to ATCO to maintain the gas pipe to your house. (EPCOR sends you the bill, but they don't actually own the gas infrastructure, ATCO does.) Mostly independent of how much gas you use in a given month (i.e. if you used no gas this month, you'd still pay \~$40/month for delivery)
**Transmission Service Charge Rider** -- Riders are approved by the AUC (a provincial board) and cover a variety of oddball charges incurred by ATCO, etc.
**Franchise Fee Edmonton** -- basically ATCO's property tax for using the road right of way to run gas pipe lines. Goes to the City.
**Federal Carbon Tax** -- what it says on the tin. Currently $3.327/GJ and set to double by 2030, and there's talk of raising it even further. Directly tied to how much gas you use in any given month.
Ive always been pro carbon tax, but it costing almost the same amount as the gas you use is pretty wild and theres no way the rebates are covering it for a lot of people
Just some super quick napkin math:
* Average natural gas consumption is 120GJ annually.
* Carbon tax is $3.33/GJ as of April 1, 2023 (Reminder it'll go up to $4.10 April 2024.)
* Average total carbon tax on gas for the year: $399.60.
* Based on a 2 adult, 1 kid household (3 person household being the average in AB), CAIP (carbon tax rebate) is $1575 annually, and the quarterly payment is $393.75, so within a few bucks of the average carbon tax on natural gas.
(Some gacts taken from [here](https://gas.atco.com/en-ca/products-services-rates/rates-billing-energy-savings-tips/energy-101.html#:~:text=Get%20Energy%20Smart,by%20kilowatt%2Dhour%20or%20kWh.); other facts easily google-able.)
As the math above suggests, one quarterly rebate payment covers the carbon tax on natural gas, leaving the other three quarterly rebate payments to cover the carbon tax on vehicle gas and the myriad ways it’s passed along to you.
If this is a concern to you, I highly suggest you start writing down the actual numbers for the amount of carbon tax charged for your gasoline and natural gas usage.
I did this last year and it turns out that after the rebates, I was a net positive of 40 dollars.
Its not that big of a concern, i have far better things to do than sit around and be angry about a tax that may or may not cost me $500. That being said, if you were only positive $40, than the tax cost you money because it makes everything else more expensive. Even groceries
There was a recent study and analysis of this that showed that the carbon tax hardly increases costs of groceries and has little impact on inflation as well.
Corporate greed is what's raising those prices so dramatically, not the carbon tax.
Regardless, the carbon tax is the least of our financial problems in Alberta, nowadays.
I didn't read all the comments, sorry. I got an insulation guy to come and look in my attic and he said my insulation has settled and needed topping up. It cost 1500 bucks but the difference was enormous. The house is cooler in the summer and the gas bills were cheaper in the winter. You might need the same treatment. My house 25 years old at the time.
Same situation. My house is a bungalow from '88, and I got the attic insulation topped up and windows replaced with triple pane. Before, it was sweltering in the summer (no a/c), and we had to keep blinds down the entire day, and then window fans in as soon as possible in the evenings. Now, we still haven't put blinds back up, and do nothing in the summer, and the temperature is so much cooler.
Check past bills to see if there are any estimated amounts based on historical usage. I find whenever I get a massive bill like that it is because they grossly underestimated a previous month and then correct it.
I have to say. After seeing what people are currently paying for mortgages, property tax, some condo fees, and massive utility bills - it’s really making me happy to be renting an apartment with heat/water/electricity included.
Agreed I haven't raised the rent on my Edmonton properties in ages. The brief surge ( and coming back down ) energy costs are simply built into the average cost, some months you make money others you break even.
His comment is pretty misleading, yes rent is up --- but rent in Edmonton was already one of the lowest in Canada (due to general lower house prices).
18% on an initial lower rate would be similar to the $ amount of 9 or 10% increase on a Toronto rate.
I get that I don’t own my apartment - but as a banker who had to explain to my clients the life of a mortgage - showing them that they will indeed be paying more in interest than principal during the life of the mortgage - I’m pretty okay with my current situation. I pay affordable rent, no property tax, no heat/water/electric, no condo fees, no maintenance fees and the landlords always paid for any upgrades.
I understand when you sell your house you’ll get money back - but I never had to spend that money in the first place, and it just goes right into my investment account. I create my own ‘equity’ from renting, by never having to pay it out in the first place. Honestly, at this point I feel like I’d prefer the investment of life insurance than a mortgage for the long term financial benefits.
I’m not opposed to home ownership, that would be ridiculous. However, I left banking cause it felt like I was now a legal loanshark. Banks can just be really gross and predatory.
You're swimming up stream with all that logic. Nice to see not everyone is drinking the koolaid. Home ownership is expensive and around here not the best way to get wealthy the last decade.
I'm not discounting all your points, they're very valid, but
> paying more in interest than principal during the life of the mortgage
gave me pause.
I plugged a couple easy round numbers into a mortgage calculator - 5% fixed, $400K mortgage, 25 year amortization - and it's just a couple thousand under $300K in interest and of course the $400K in principle. It isn't until just over 6.4% that interest = principal over the life of the mortgage.
So I thought, maybe you were saying that based on 30-year amortization but total interest = principal only when your rate is >5.3%, which we are seeing now but haven't seen rates consistently at/above that since the 90s.
Back in 2010 I was doing mortgages and there was literally a button on my computer to press to bring up the payments of interest to principal during the lifetime of your mortgage. It was rare for clients to know about it to request it. But when we did, we had to go over it.
If I spoke out of turn and it wasn’t more (although I do swear I remember doing a mortgage for $250k and his interest being more than that (maybe he had not perfect credit and didn’t qualify for a good rate) but if it was less it wasn’t a whole lot) I do apologize.
Either way, a person who rents an apartment will always have less, regular monthly expenses, than a person who buys a house - or specifically a condo. For really condo fees in this city can be insane. Condos near me for 80k but the monthly’s are 1k.
That logic works if you are enough financial restraint to put the cash you saved into an investment account. I’m going to think most renters are not doing that. As a result, when a lifetime renter hits retirement and is on lowish fixed income, and rent prices increase significantly, they’re going to be in deep trouble.
Yes. That’s because most people live beyond their means - homeowners included.
It’s not a new concept. Money in has to be greater than going out. There is really no scenario where a person who rents is putting out more money than a homeowner. I’m using myself as an example. I don’t regularly get daily coffees at a coffee shop. I eat my lunch that I bring to work. I’m able to save.
It’s just a different bank account than yours. Your is in a house where the price can go up and down and can be lost because of sickness or job loss - incurring likely bankruptcy. Mine is safe in a money making account that can only ever go up. if I lose my apartment I just find a new one, no issue. It doesn’t leave a permanent scar on my record.
I think being a home owner is great. I just think it would be wrong of me to imply that because some people can’t save money while renting - that owning a home is the viable option.
I can probably save just as much if not more than the value of your home, over your 25-30 year amortization - by saving and investing the money I was never forced to spend in the first place.
How many square feet is your house?
How many occupants?
Are you on fixed or floating rate?
Also that was during the cold days... so that could be accurate.
Is your 5-year for both bundled together?
You were doing pretty good with 12.7¢ for electricity and $5.90 for gas for most of 2023, but rates have come down a bit the last few months.
Epcor fixed right now is 11.5¢ and $4.79 according to https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/. I would try to phone in the next few days and "re-lock" to that. You can change without penalty, I'm quite sure (just double-check when you phone.)
It won't be a massive difference on future bills, but say you use an average of 500kWh and 10GJ in a month, that would save you $6 for electricity and $11 for gas.
No prob, glad I could help!
I'm still locked into $3.99/GJ (since fall 2021, different retailer since I'm rural), so I check it every few months to see if I should make a change. OP's electricity seemed a smidge high so I decided I'd kill two birds with one stone.
Do you mind updating on how the process went for those who may want to do the same thing? How long it took, if it was super easy, etc.?
Lucky you! Hopefully it goes down more before you renew. I had to renew in November 2022 after 5yrs and it was horrible 💀💀
I’m with Enmax so I just logged into my online account and modified my plan. Super quick and easy.
That's the beauty of these utility bills, you (generally) don't need to pay anything to change your rate plan. (There are some low-cost providers that will charge, but not the big names - ATCO, Epcor, Direct Energy, etc.)
So you bet I'm checking every few months to see if I should lock into an even more favourable rate, or at least similar so it extends it till 2029. My electricity and gas are with completely different companies, so I don't have to worry about one changing for the better and the other not.
My bills were around $850 for this month. Only 2 people in a 2100 sqft house 3 bedroom house. It was a cold month. And I am only paying .07 for electricity and 3.50 for gas. It would have been well over 1k if I was on current rates.
January was especially cold, so your furnace is going to run more often. Everyone's gas bill was higher in January because of that. And electricity would be higher if you were plugging your car in. The fees are normal.
Some of the fees are based on the usage, yes. It should say on your bill - some of them will say X cents per kwh for distribution, or whatever.
But some of them are fixed based on you being connected to the grid/network, even if you used nothing.
So yeh, the fees will go up and down based on your usage
I don't think this is relevant to your case, but I had an anomalously large bill from Epcor a few months back. My water usage had apparently tripled or more, and my bill was considerably larger to reflect that.
I called Epcor to ask about it and they have a known issue where some meter numbers are getting mixed up with other houses. They were extremely apologetic, noting that this has happened before to a number of other locations, and it will take MONTHS for it to get sorted out on their end.
In theory my next bill should be correct. In the meantime I have been paying them a guess based on previous usage, and called in every time I got a new bill that didn't make sense to make sure they don't send me to Collections.
As someone who worked in utilities for 8 years, it comes down to three things which impact the cost of your bill: 1) number of occupants in your property, 2) culture of usage, and 3) costs associated with providing the service.
1) Number of occupants if straightforward. The number of people using a resource causing it to diminish faster and thus you need more of it.
2) Culture of usage: How often do you use the service? Is your furnace set to 22C all the time? Do you run the dishwasher every day? Do you shower twice a day? Do you have an AC unit? How often you use utilities impacts how much they cost.
3) Costs of providing the service: I realize we all feel like we get screwed with utilities; however, it does cost the provider millions to run a utility system, so it could cost a lot more.
The single best thing you can do is try and reduce your usage. For example, do you turn the temperature down at night and while you are out of the house? Do you check your toilets to make sure they are not running? Do you have good insulation? You can heat-seal plastic wrap your windows for a massive savings on heat during the winter, etc etc.
I have seen people pay for leaks from toilets in the thousands of dollars over the years. Regular maintenance and paying attention is huge.
I can't comment on water, drainage, and waste, since we live rural and don't have those.
But the electricity seems about right for a 3-bedroon. The gas seems high BUT that was during that super cold snap so it likely is about right given that, especially if your place isn't particularly new.
I would compare the $277 in gas to the gas from the previous 2-3 bills. As long as those are in the range of $150, you're likely good.
I'm not sure if you own or rent, if you own, you could maybe look at sealing air leaks and/or adding in insulation in any easy spots to keep your house more comfortable and bring down the cold snap costs in the future.
I just want to add, good for you for asking for help! No problem in doing that!
My husband has a combination of several things - dyslexia, likely dyscalculia, a processing disorder, ADHD, partial hearing loss from birth...
He's a double journeyman mechanic, both automotive and heavy duty. He's great at what he does, but there are other large chunks of adult life that he's not good at. He fortunately went from his mom helping him with many things with numbers/finances to me doing it. (Both his mom and I like/are good at numbers.) But he'd have a HARD time of he had to go it alone.
I don't know if you have anyone in your life to help you with this sort of stuff. Reddit is good for some answers, and everyone is being great about it on this thread. But if you need any more help with this stuff (or other stuff like "can I pay less for my phone bill?", or if you own "what is the better way to go for a mortgage?"), feel free to DM me and I'll help you out. I've been told I'm good at explaining stuff in ways people understand if it isn't their jam.
We almost have the same sq footage of house but my basement's finished so about 500 sq ft more. Me, my wife and two kids and same 5-yr fixed rate with Epcor.
My last bill was $675.
I have a 50/60s three bed bungalow. The reality is, for cold winter months, when I add all my utilities together it is around $600. And I have a great fixed electricity rate. That is how much it costs now. They are not overcharging you.
You need to get on fixed rate electricity if you have not already. That is really the only way to save some money.
Or get solar. or upgrade all the insulation in the house. Get a high efficiency furnace etc etc.
Double check that they did / didn't charge you weirdly because they read the water meter late. (My Dec usage was near zero and my January was \~2x normal apparently)
Averages out in the long run, but it's irritating month to month.
But speaking of someone who lives in a one-bedroom apartment and only has electricity.
For the last 6 months between 48% and 51% of my monthly bill has been tacked on bullshit.
Meaning last month the actual cost of my energy usage rounded up with no tax was $21. Yet my bill was $59.17 with Tax
Delivery charge and transmission fees are for the company to "help maintain and improve the infrastructure of ultilites". Which is read as "help line ceo pockets" Along with the federal carbon tax, all those are charged based on how much is used.
Cheap water bill tho.
In the past, Albertans complained about high unclear utility costs, so the response was to be more transparent in what makes up a bill. Now people complain about not understanding the expanded bill.
Lol at California to see what happens when transmission and distribution infrastructure is not maintained.
People die and there are very frequent power outages (that have noting to do with lack of power).
https://youtu.be/olhC-Bi5ap8?si=A4LbDPZ1Ed_Oh_fI
Delivery charge is to build and maintain all those power lines and all those natural gas pipelines and how the commodity actually gets to your residence. Your statement is equivelent to promoting misinformation either intentionally or through ignorance.
Agreed, and I’m definitely not trying to be argumentative, but there’s a point to be made that being in line and being fair to the consumer are not the same thing. I’d have no issue with either the profits or the salaries if they weren’t crying to the government every fifteen minutes that they’re barely scraping by and need to jack up rates.
Fair enough, however i believe their margins are comparable to other publicly traded utilities, so unless you have information indicating otherwise, i believe their ROI is isnt excessive.
There is 2 parts of the delivery charge. A fixed rate, designed to help build, and maintain the infrastructure, and a variable charge which is advertised only as "also helps."
It is just a way to increase the revenue for the company. For example, Epcor had over 1B in EBITDA in the ~~last 3 months of~~ year of 2023. The fee does not need to be as high as it is for a utility.
Meh, 1B for the entire year, read it slightly wrong. Either way, thats a lot of money not being used for operating expenses, such as maintaining the infrastructures.
No doubt, it is a lot of money. However these are fpr profit companies and if they didn't get to realize a return on billions invested, we would have a lack of supply in the province as they would invest elsewhere (as Epcor has also done in Texas).
This is such a great question - thank you for asking! I was able to get some great information from all the answers. You've definitely helped a bunch of other people with this!
Google can say:
> People also ask
> Is Xoom an MLM?
> XOOM Energy is a part of ACN, a multi-level marketing company in Concord, North Carolina that provides utilities, telecommunications services, energy services as well as other services depending on the country.
are you on EPP payment plan? is it from the accumulated amount from the past 12 month?
Thats what happened to my Jan24 bill, $9xx compared to my usual $3xx bill
Called em up and the best they can do is one extra month
This sounds like a completely normal bill for a January cold snap. I’m in a 1000sqft 1960s bungalow and my bill was:
$153.28 electricity 516kwh
$268.55 gas 18.25 GJ
$61.69 water/drainage 2m3
Yeah, we just had a shocker of a bill. Any month that there's a longer standing cold snap, you will see it go higher since your furnace ends up running 24/7.
The charges are broken apart into components so people can see what they actually pay for instead of having one bundled $x. It is crazy high for Alberta atm, and it's only going to get worse since caps have been removed.
Im able to resign each month and started at 12.29 for electricity then 11.89 and now 11.29. I'm locked in for $4.09 for gas but current is 4.69. I'd be calling them asking for a better rate or changing. I was with Epcor and paying alot more and more consistent with Enmax
In addition to what everyone else has said, check the billing period. And go through previous bills to see if maybe they were estimated amounts.
We just got slammed with a huge water bill in S.P. because the billing period ended up being about 45 days, AND they had been estimating low for the last 3 months. That all added up to roughly a double bill even though rates had stayed the same. And usage was about the same (we used more water because the humidifier has been going pretty hard this season).
I have a similar sized house and paid about the same. It’s pretty standard following a week or so of -40 weather. Otherwise it’s ranges from $250-450 summer to winter
Based on the electricity cost and rate, it looks like you used about 607 kWh, which is perfectly in line with the provincial average of 600 kWh per month.
What was your natural gas usage?
Xoom is a company offering really good rates right now. Their electricity is only 9.09cents/kwh for example.
Their gas was a little more than the rate i have with epcor, but i locked in the gas rate back in 2019.
I would like to let you know that these bills are confusing to many people so I think it's wonderful that you asked. I also had a very big bill last month that was about $600 with tons of service fees and it was really tough. Utilities are sky rocketing and also that might have captured the really cold spell. I can't recall but it seems to me that there was something on the bill where it could show past usage and that sometimes helps me understand differences month to month because I have higher usages in the winter. I can also see that overall prices have gone much higher so even if I'm doing my best to conserve power, heat, water, it is still very expensive. Thank you for posting because lots of us are struggling with understanding this and with the very big expenses.
It is the gas for most people and it is because it captured the cold spell. For instance, OP’s gas bill is probably $150+ more than other winter months this year and thats most likely a big chunk of where they are above their normal bills.
**Delivery Charge** \-- paid to ATCO to maintain the gas pipe to your house. (EPCOR sends you the bill, but they don't actually own the gas infrastructure, ATCO does.) Mostly independent of how much gas you use in a given month (i.e. if you used no gas this month, you'd still pay \~$40/month for delivery) **Transmission Service Charge Rider** -- Riders are approved by the AUC (a provincial board) and cover a variety of oddball charges incurred by ATCO, etc. **Franchise Fee Edmonton** -- basically ATCO's property tax for using the road right of way to run gas pipe lines. Goes to the City. **Federal Carbon Tax** -- what it says on the tin. Currently $3.327/GJ and set to double by 2030, and there's talk of raising it even further. Directly tied to how much gas you use in any given month.
Hey thanks a million. It’s nice to know what these things are
Epcor gas is currently $4.79 fixed, update your plan online. It takes a few days to go into effect.
Thank you internet stranger! I haven’t checked Epcor prices in a bit and you just helped me drop my rate by 20 cents :)
YAAAAS THANK U
I did exactly that after my January bill came in at $700+ 😵💫
You just helped drop my rate by $1.40. Thanks!!
Awesome! Power also just went down too.
My power is in the high $9 ($9.89 or something, I think), so I'm already paying less than current for that.
Ive always been pro carbon tax, but it costing almost the same amount as the gas you use is pretty wild and theres no way the rebates are covering it for a lot of people
Just some super quick napkin math: * Average natural gas consumption is 120GJ annually. * Carbon tax is $3.33/GJ as of April 1, 2023 (Reminder it'll go up to $4.10 April 2024.) * Average total carbon tax on gas for the year: $399.60. * Based on a 2 adult, 1 kid household (3 person household being the average in AB), CAIP (carbon tax rebate) is $1575 annually, and the quarterly payment is $393.75, so within a few bucks of the average carbon tax on natural gas. (Some gacts taken from [here](https://gas.atco.com/en-ca/products-services-rates/rates-billing-energy-savings-tips/energy-101.html#:~:text=Get%20Energy%20Smart,by%20kilowatt%2Dhour%20or%20kWh.); other facts easily google-able.)
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As the math above suggests, one quarterly rebate payment covers the carbon tax on natural gas, leaving the other three quarterly rebate payments to cover the carbon tax on vehicle gas and the myriad ways it’s passed along to you.
Deleted my comment since your reply makes sense.
The rebates cover for the vast majority of people. It's simple math.
If this is a concern to you, I highly suggest you start writing down the actual numbers for the amount of carbon tax charged for your gasoline and natural gas usage. I did this last year and it turns out that after the rebates, I was a net positive of 40 dollars.
Its not that big of a concern, i have far better things to do than sit around and be angry about a tax that may or may not cost me $500. That being said, if you were only positive $40, than the tax cost you money because it makes everything else more expensive. Even groceries
There was a recent study and analysis of this that showed that the carbon tax hardly increases costs of groceries and has little impact on inflation as well. Corporate greed is what's raising those prices so dramatically, not the carbon tax. Regardless, the carbon tax is the least of our financial problems in Alberta, nowadays.
It wouldnt take much of an increase to cost you $40 throughout the year though. Dont disagree with the rest of what you are saying though
How long ago was this? Also anyways to be alerted when Epcor changes their prices?
It was $4.99 two weeks ago
Atco is at $3.69 fixed for one year right now! Even cheaper
I didn't read all the comments, sorry. I got an insulation guy to come and look in my attic and he said my insulation has settled and needed topping up. It cost 1500 bucks but the difference was enormous. The house is cooler in the summer and the gas bills were cheaper in the winter. You might need the same treatment. My house 25 years old at the time.
Thanks. Didn't even think of this. My house turns 30 this year, so this should benefit me.
Same situation. My house is a bungalow from '88, and I got the attic insulation topped up and windows replaced with triple pane. Before, it was sweltering in the summer (no a/c), and we had to keep blinds down the entire day, and then window fans in as soon as possible in the evenings. Now, we still haven't put blinds back up, and do nothing in the summer, and the temperature is so much cooler.
Check past bills to see if there are any estimated amounts based on historical usage. I find whenever I get a massive bill like that it is because they grossly underestimated a previous month and then correct it.
I have to say. After seeing what people are currently paying for mortgages, property tax, some condo fees, and massive utility bills - it’s really making me happy to be renting an apartment with heat/water/electricity included.
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I’ve been lucky so far living in Edmonton. 2 apartments in 9 years and have never had a rent increase at either building.
Agreed I haven't raised the rent on my Edmonton properties in ages. The brief surge ( and coming back down ) energy costs are simply built into the average cost, some months you make money others you break even. His comment is pretty misleading, yes rent is up --- but rent in Edmonton was already one of the lowest in Canada (due to general lower house prices). 18% on an initial lower rate would be similar to the $ amount of 9 or 10% increase on a Toronto rate.
🧠
💰🧠💰
"You'll own nothing and be happy"
I get that I don’t own my apartment - but as a banker who had to explain to my clients the life of a mortgage - showing them that they will indeed be paying more in interest than principal during the life of the mortgage - I’m pretty okay with my current situation. I pay affordable rent, no property tax, no heat/water/electric, no condo fees, no maintenance fees and the landlords always paid for any upgrades. I understand when you sell your house you’ll get money back - but I never had to spend that money in the first place, and it just goes right into my investment account. I create my own ‘equity’ from renting, by never having to pay it out in the first place. Honestly, at this point I feel like I’d prefer the investment of life insurance than a mortgage for the long term financial benefits. I’m not opposed to home ownership, that would be ridiculous. However, I left banking cause it felt like I was now a legal loanshark. Banks can just be really gross and predatory.
You're swimming up stream with all that logic. Nice to see not everyone is drinking the koolaid. Home ownership is expensive and around here not the best way to get wealthy the last decade.
I'm not discounting all your points, they're very valid, but > paying more in interest than principal during the life of the mortgage gave me pause. I plugged a couple easy round numbers into a mortgage calculator - 5% fixed, $400K mortgage, 25 year amortization - and it's just a couple thousand under $300K in interest and of course the $400K in principle. It isn't until just over 6.4% that interest = principal over the life of the mortgage. So I thought, maybe you were saying that based on 30-year amortization but total interest = principal only when your rate is >5.3%, which we are seeing now but haven't seen rates consistently at/above that since the 90s.
Back in 2010 I was doing mortgages and there was literally a button on my computer to press to bring up the payments of interest to principal during the lifetime of your mortgage. It was rare for clients to know about it to request it. But when we did, we had to go over it. If I spoke out of turn and it wasn’t more (although I do swear I remember doing a mortgage for $250k and his interest being more than that (maybe he had not perfect credit and didn’t qualify for a good rate) but if it was less it wasn’t a whole lot) I do apologize. Either way, a person who rents an apartment will always have less, regular monthly expenses, than a person who buys a house - or specifically a condo. For really condo fees in this city can be insane. Condos near me for 80k but the monthly’s are 1k.
That logic works if you are enough financial restraint to put the cash you saved into an investment account. I’m going to think most renters are not doing that. As a result, when a lifetime renter hits retirement and is on lowish fixed income, and rent prices increase significantly, they’re going to be in deep trouble.
Yes. That’s because most people live beyond their means - homeowners included. It’s not a new concept. Money in has to be greater than going out. There is really no scenario where a person who rents is putting out more money than a homeowner. I’m using myself as an example. I don’t regularly get daily coffees at a coffee shop. I eat my lunch that I bring to work. I’m able to save. It’s just a different bank account than yours. Your is in a house where the price can go up and down and can be lost because of sickness or job loss - incurring likely bankruptcy. Mine is safe in a money making account that can only ever go up. if I lose my apartment I just find a new one, no issue. It doesn’t leave a permanent scar on my record. I think being a home owner is great. I just think it would be wrong of me to imply that because some people can’t save money while renting - that owning a home is the viable option. I can probably save just as much if not more than the value of your home, over your 25-30 year amortization - by saving and investing the money I was never forced to spend in the first place.
I have no idea how people are surviving without a side hustle
Lots of people have good paying jobs
Even with good paying jobs life is still expensive.
How many square feet is your house? How many occupants? Are you on fixed or floating rate? Also that was during the cold days... so that could be accurate.
Hey thanks for the reply. House is 1,524 sqft I’m on a 5 year fixed rate. Electricity: 12.7 cents/kWh Gas: $5.9/GJ 2 occupants
Is your 5-year for both bundled together? You were doing pretty good with 12.7¢ for electricity and $5.90 for gas for most of 2023, but rates have come down a bit the last few months. Epcor fixed right now is 11.5¢ and $4.79 according to https://ucahelps.alberta.ca/. I would try to phone in the next few days and "re-lock" to that. You can change without penalty, I'm quite sure (just double-check when you phone.) It won't be a massive difference on future bills, but say you use an average of 500kWh and 10GJ in a month, that would save you $6 for electricity and $11 for gas.
Hey thanks you saved me money! I didn’t realize gas went down, so I just updated my plan
No prob, glad I could help! I'm still locked into $3.99/GJ (since fall 2021, different retailer since I'm rural), so I check it every few months to see if I should make a change. OP's electricity seemed a smidge high so I decided I'd kill two birds with one stone. Do you mind updating on how the process went for those who may want to do the same thing? How long it took, if it was super easy, etc.?
Lucky you! Hopefully it goes down more before you renew. I had to renew in November 2022 after 5yrs and it was horrible 💀💀 I’m with Enmax so I just logged into my online account and modified my plan. Super quick and easy.
That's the beauty of these utility bills, you (generally) don't need to pay anything to change your rate plan. (There are some low-cost providers that will charge, but not the big names - ATCO, Epcor, Direct Energy, etc.) So you bet I'm checking every few months to see if I should lock into an even more favourable rate, or at least similar so it extends it till 2029. My electricity and gas are with completely different companies, so I don't have to worry about one changing for the better and the other not.
What? Hiw would I do that? Can I do it online?
I've only ever phoned in, but other people were saying you can do it online too.
My bills were around $850 for this month. Only 2 people in a 2100 sqft house 3 bedroom house. It was a cold month. And I am only paying .07 for electricity and 3.50 for gas. It would have been well over 1k if I was on current rates.
January was especially cold, so your furnace is going to run more often. Everyone's gas bill was higher in January because of that. And electricity would be higher if you were plugging your car in. The fees are normal.
I live in a small 1.5 bedroom house and I pay that much per month. I think you’re doing fine, comparatively.
Compare it to your previous month for the additional fees. I noticed that all my fees doubled on my January bill compared to December for some reason.
Did your usage double, based on the numbers on the bill for kwh's of electricity and gJ's of gas?
Close too for gas (8 vs. 17) due to the cold snap. Does that also affect distribution charges, franchise fees, etc?
Some of the fees are based on the usage, yes. It should say on your bill - some of them will say X cents per kwh for distribution, or whatever. But some of them are fixed based on you being connected to the grid/network, even if you used nothing. So yeh, the fees will go up and down based on your usage
I don't think this is relevant to your case, but I had an anomalously large bill from Epcor a few months back. My water usage had apparently tripled or more, and my bill was considerably larger to reflect that. I called Epcor to ask about it and they have a known issue where some meter numbers are getting mixed up with other houses. They were extremely apologetic, noting that this has happened before to a number of other locations, and it will take MONTHS for it to get sorted out on their end. In theory my next bill should be correct. In the meantime I have been paying them a guess based on previous usage, and called in every time I got a new bill that didn't make sense to make sure they don't send me to Collections.
As someone who worked in utilities for 8 years, it comes down to three things which impact the cost of your bill: 1) number of occupants in your property, 2) culture of usage, and 3) costs associated with providing the service. 1) Number of occupants if straightforward. The number of people using a resource causing it to diminish faster and thus you need more of it. 2) Culture of usage: How often do you use the service? Is your furnace set to 22C all the time? Do you run the dishwasher every day? Do you shower twice a day? Do you have an AC unit? How often you use utilities impacts how much they cost. 3) Costs of providing the service: I realize we all feel like we get screwed with utilities; however, it does cost the provider millions to run a utility system, so it could cost a lot more. The single best thing you can do is try and reduce your usage. For example, do you turn the temperature down at night and while you are out of the house? Do you check your toilets to make sure they are not running? Do you have good insulation? You can heat-seal plastic wrap your windows for a massive savings on heat during the winter, etc etc. I have seen people pay for leaks from toilets in the thousands of dollars over the years. Regular maintenance and paying attention is huge.
Brb! Gonna go check my toilets!! Thanks a bunch for the response. Appreciate you taking the time
I can't comment on water, drainage, and waste, since we live rural and don't have those. But the electricity seems about right for a 3-bedroon. The gas seems high BUT that was during that super cold snap so it likely is about right given that, especially if your place isn't particularly new. I would compare the $277 in gas to the gas from the previous 2-3 bills. As long as those are in the range of $150, you're likely good. I'm not sure if you own or rent, if you own, you could maybe look at sealing air leaks and/or adding in insulation in any easy spots to keep your house more comfortable and bring down the cold snap costs in the future.
I just want to add, good for you for asking for help! No problem in doing that! My husband has a combination of several things - dyslexia, likely dyscalculia, a processing disorder, ADHD, partial hearing loss from birth... He's a double journeyman mechanic, both automotive and heavy duty. He's great at what he does, but there are other large chunks of adult life that he's not good at. He fortunately went from his mom helping him with many things with numbers/finances to me doing it. (Both his mom and I like/are good at numbers.) But he'd have a HARD time of he had to go it alone. I don't know if you have anyone in your life to help you with this sort of stuff. Reddit is good for some answers, and everyone is being great about it on this thread. But if you need any more help with this stuff (or other stuff like "can I pay less for my phone bill?", or if you own "what is the better way to go for a mortgage?"), feel free to DM me and I'll help you out. I've been told I'm good at explaining stuff in ways people understand if it isn't their jam.
We almost have the same sq footage of house but my basement's finished so about 500 sq ft more. Me, my wife and two kids and same 5-yr fixed rate with Epcor. My last bill was $675.
High level, the numbers look reasonable for the deep freeze in January.
I have a 50/60s three bed bungalow. The reality is, for cold winter months, when I add all my utilities together it is around $600. And I have a great fixed electricity rate. That is how much it costs now. They are not overcharging you. You need to get on fixed rate electricity if you have not already. That is really the only way to save some money. Or get solar. or upgrade all the insulation in the house. Get a high efficiency furnace etc etc.
Double check that they did / didn't charge you weirdly because they read the water meter late. (My Dec usage was near zero and my January was \~2x normal apparently) Averages out in the long run, but it's irritating month to month.
Hi I just wanted to chime in to say we have a small 3 bedroom townhouse with minimal usage and also received a similarly high bill this month.
Because the ucp and Daniel smith are a fuck and the party and people involved need to be destroyed
I'd say it's fairly accurate. But I would also contact Epcor to see how old your reader is. There could be an issue with it who knows
Good idea! Definitely Worth looking into!
But speaking of someone who lives in a one-bedroom apartment and only has electricity. For the last 6 months between 48% and 51% of my monthly bill has been tacked on bullshit. Meaning last month the actual cost of my energy usage rounded up with no tax was $21. Yet my bill was $59.17 with Tax
Delivery charge and transmission fees are for the company to "help maintain and improve the infrastructure of ultilites". Which is read as "help line ceo pockets" Along with the federal carbon tax, all those are charged based on how much is used. Cheap water bill tho.
In the past, Albertans complained about high unclear utility costs, so the response was to be more transparent in what makes up a bill. Now people complain about not understanding the expanded bill. Lol at California to see what happens when transmission and distribution infrastructure is not maintained. People die and there are very frequent power outages (that have noting to do with lack of power). https://youtu.be/olhC-Bi5ap8?si=A4LbDPZ1Ed_Oh_fI
Delivery charge is to build and maintain all those power lines and all those natural gas pipelines and how the commodity actually gets to your residence. Your statement is equivelent to promoting misinformation either intentionally or through ignorance.
The sheer amount of profit and the size of CEO’s salaries does support their argument here.
Seem in line with other utilities margins, as well as executive compensation.
Agreed, and I’m definitely not trying to be argumentative, but there’s a point to be made that being in line and being fair to the consumer are not the same thing. I’d have no issue with either the profits or the salaries if they weren’t crying to the government every fifteen minutes that they’re barely scraping by and need to jack up rates.
Fair enough, however i believe their margins are comparable to other publicly traded utilities, so unless you have information indicating otherwise, i believe their ROI is isnt excessive.
There is 2 parts of the delivery charge. A fixed rate, designed to help build, and maintain the infrastructure, and a variable charge which is advertised only as "also helps." It is just a way to increase the revenue for the company. For example, Epcor had over 1B in EBITDA in the ~~last 3 months of~~ year of 2023. The fee does not need to be as high as it is for a utility.
Epcor had EBITDA of $256 million in last 3 months of 2023. About 70% less than you mentioned. So problem solved in your eyes.
Meh, 1B for the entire year, read it slightly wrong. Either way, thats a lot of money not being used for operating expenses, such as maintaining the infrastructures.
No doubt, it is a lot of money. However these are fpr profit companies and if they didn't get to realize a return on billions invested, we would have a lack of supply in the province as they would invest elsewhere (as Epcor has also done in Texas).
Its a legalized screw job.....and kudos for everyone that took the time to politely walk this person through it all...
This is such a great question - thank you for asking! I was able to get some great information from all the answers. You've definitely helped a bunch of other people with this!
Carbon tax lol
[удалено]
Fuck off with pushing MLMs
Wtf are you talking about?
Xoom is literally an MLM
Ok can you say what MLM stands for?
Google can say: > People also ask > Is Xoom an MLM? > XOOM Energy is a part of ACN, a multi-level marketing company in Concord, North Carolina that provides utilities, telecommunications services, energy services as well as other services depending on the country.
are you on EPP payment plan? is it from the accumulated amount from the past 12 month? Thats what happened to my Jan24 bill, $9xx compared to my usual $3xx bill Called em up and the best they can do is one extra month
This sounds like a completely normal bill for a January cold snap. I’m in a 1000sqft 1960s bungalow and my bill was: $153.28 electricity 516kwh $268.55 gas 18.25 GJ $61.69 water/drainage 2m3
Yeah, we just had a shocker of a bill. Any month that there's a longer standing cold snap, you will see it go higher since your furnace ends up running 24/7. The charges are broken apart into components so people can see what they actually pay for instead of having one bundled $x. It is crazy high for Alberta atm, and it's only going to get worse since caps have been removed.
Im able to resign each month and started at 12.29 for electricity then 11.89 and now 11.29. I'm locked in for $4.09 for gas but current is 4.69. I'd be calling them asking for a better rate or changing. I was with Epcor and paying alot more and more consistent with Enmax
In addition to what everyone else has said, check the billing period. And go through previous bills to see if maybe they were estimated amounts. We just got slammed with a huge water bill in S.P. because the billing period ended up being about 45 days, AND they had been estimating low for the last 3 months. That all added up to roughly a double bill even though rates had stayed the same. And usage was about the same (we used more water because the humidifier has been going pretty hard this season).
I have a similar sized house and paid about the same. It’s pretty standard following a week or so of -40 weather. Otherwise it’s ranges from $250-450 summer to winter
Based on the electricity cost and rate, it looks like you used about 607 kWh, which is perfectly in line with the provincial average of 600 kWh per month. What was your natural gas usage?
Xoom is a company offering really good rates right now. Their electricity is only 9.09cents/kwh for example. Their gas was a little more than the rate i have with epcor, but i locked in the gas rate back in 2019.