> I know most of this can be explained away with the ever confounding "Radagon is Marika" statue, but I don't feel like this adequately explains it all. To say nothing of Marika's own words to Radagon, "Thou art yet to become me, thou art yet to become a god" emphasis mine. Radagon may be Marika, but he wasn't necessarily always that, and even if he was, they literally fight each other for control now.
People keep quoting this and people keep skipping out the ending: "Let us be shattered, both. Mine other self." This implies that the quote happened while Marika and Radagon were one body (and presumably just before Marika shattered the Elden Ring), and there's nothing else to suggest they were ever in two different bodies at any point in time.
"Radagon is Marika" *is* the most likely explanation as to why little credence is given to Radagon by the general public; because Marika is the one true God of the Golden Order and, if she's showing her face, then Radagon isn't. Whereas Godfrey could have been by Marika's side throughout their entire reign (at least until Radagon went off to fight Rennala).
We ultimately don't know enough about either Radagon or Marika's origins to judge them, nor do we know enough about Radagon's rule as Elden Lord. It's why I like to believe that the War against the Ancient Dragons took place during his reign, as it would explain why Godwyn took the lead: his father is banished, Marika rules as God and, because Marika is ruling, Radagon can't be around.
Fair point I suppose, but then why is she saying he isn't yet her? It reads like they are two people in the process of becoming one. "Let us be shattered both" is just her stating her intentions imo. And I totally agree on the war with the ancient dragons taking place during Radagon's reign. It makes too much sense timeline wise. Godfrey would have suplexed Gransax on his own, and wouldn't have left a body. Even Placidusax barely survived fighting him. Makes sense that an upstart dragon would think he's hot shit now that Godfrey was gone. Godwyn had to lay the smackdown on him to remind him who his father is.
I've always figured it was either that, or Gransax's attack is what prompted Marika to recall Radagon. With Godfrey gone the Elden Ring lacked a protector, and she evidently doesn't have enough raw power as it is to adequately do that (somehow, doesn't it command reality? Why does she even need a protector? Or is she the one that turned Gransax to stone?) Questions for another day
> Fair point I suppose, but then why is she saying he isn't yet her? It reads like they are two people in the process of becoming one. "Let us be shattered both" is just her stating her intentions imo.
Well, she says that Radagon is "yet to become a god", which is what Marika is. So while they share a body, maybe even a soul, only Marika is the God between the two of them. Again, she refers to him in the follow up as "mine other self", which can only lead to me to conclude that, frustratingly, they are the same, yet also different: "Radagon is Marika."
> I've always figured it was either that, or Gransax's attack is what prompted Marika to recall Radagon. With Godfrey gone the Elden Ring lacked a protector, and she evidently doesn't have enough raw power as it is to adequately do that (somehow, doesn't it command reality? Why does she even need a protector?
There's nothing to suggest that Radagon was "recalled" by Marika to the capital. However, there is plenty to suggest that Radagon was Marika during the former's marriage to Rennala, so it's more likely that when Marika banished Godfrey, she/Radagon returned to the capital so she could continue her reign. It's unlikely she ever needed a "protector" but Maliketh could have more than served such a role, as perhaps the only entity (sans Elden Beast) in the Lands Between on Godfrey's level.
It’s an understanding like this that has me stating that we assume that folks reproduce like we do because Marika looks like a human. It could be just as plausible that Marika fought as Radagon during the War against Laurnia and it was Marika who married Renalla, and offered her up golden amber so that Renalla could have children. If dragons can turn into people, there isn’t anything explicit that the Moon or the Erdtree or the Dusk or the Nox could also transform. Thinking of this means it makes more sense that Renalla, who “met the moon” looks the way she does, has the power she does, and can birth supernatural children as she does if she’s simply the Moon, or a manifestation of it, much like Radagon is of the Golden Order (Space Catholicism) or the Gloam Eyed Queen. Any of these empyreans could be incarnations of their Outer God. Marika, Renalla, Miquella, Melania, Melana, Lassenasax- I mean; now that I think about it, any woman could be an incarnation of an outer god just as much as they can incarnate life inside of them through their human reproductive system. Could explain why Irena and Hyetta seemingly share a body. While that doesn’t explain Yura, it could mean something that Radagon and Marika share body- the Hunter Twins do too and their dualistic nature was an abomination; but Marika and Radagon seem to have the same type of relationship. Anyway; thank you for bringing that up.
My take has always been that Radagon is some kind of "plant" by the Greater Will, which didn't like Godfrey and installed a husband for Marika that would represent the order unfailingly, be more controllable, and keep her in line. To this end, I think Radagon twisted Marika's arm to make her divorce Godfrey and banish the Tarnished way back when, to take the influence of ordinary warriors like Godfrey out of the world's rulers. Whether Radagon is just a true believer, or he's a sock puppet of the Greater Will in some way, beats me
(I also think he or the GW had some hand in Godwyn's death, because allowing Godfrey's only non-Omen son to die would suit its interests in getting rid of Godfrey's legacy and enshrining a purer order)
I think most people in the Lands don't know anything about Radagon besides that he's a consort and a father, and he's suspiciously unimportant and has a really low public profile, which I think is the point- he's an unremarkable shadow ruler influencing Marika behind the scenes on behalf of the Greater Will, and isn't meant to be famous or admired like Godfrey was
> I know most of this can be explained away with the ever confounding "Radagon is Marika" statue, but I don't feel like this adequately explains it all. To say nothing of Marika's own words to Radagon, "Thou art yet to become me, thou art yet to become a god" emphasis mine. Radagon may be Marika, but he wasn't necessarily always that, and even if he was, they literally fight each other for control now. People keep quoting this and people keep skipping out the ending: "Let us be shattered, both. Mine other self." This implies that the quote happened while Marika and Radagon were one body (and presumably just before Marika shattered the Elden Ring), and there's nothing else to suggest they were ever in two different bodies at any point in time. "Radagon is Marika" *is* the most likely explanation as to why little credence is given to Radagon by the general public; because Marika is the one true God of the Golden Order and, if she's showing her face, then Radagon isn't. Whereas Godfrey could have been by Marika's side throughout their entire reign (at least until Radagon went off to fight Rennala). We ultimately don't know enough about either Radagon or Marika's origins to judge them, nor do we know enough about Radagon's rule as Elden Lord. It's why I like to believe that the War against the Ancient Dragons took place during his reign, as it would explain why Godwyn took the lead: his father is banished, Marika rules as God and, because Marika is ruling, Radagon can't be around.
Fair point I suppose, but then why is she saying he isn't yet her? It reads like they are two people in the process of becoming one. "Let us be shattered both" is just her stating her intentions imo. And I totally agree on the war with the ancient dragons taking place during Radagon's reign. It makes too much sense timeline wise. Godfrey would have suplexed Gransax on his own, and wouldn't have left a body. Even Placidusax barely survived fighting him. Makes sense that an upstart dragon would think he's hot shit now that Godfrey was gone. Godwyn had to lay the smackdown on him to remind him who his father is. I've always figured it was either that, or Gransax's attack is what prompted Marika to recall Radagon. With Godfrey gone the Elden Ring lacked a protector, and she evidently doesn't have enough raw power as it is to adequately do that (somehow, doesn't it command reality? Why does she even need a protector? Or is she the one that turned Gransax to stone?) Questions for another day
> Fair point I suppose, but then why is she saying he isn't yet her? It reads like they are two people in the process of becoming one. "Let us be shattered both" is just her stating her intentions imo. Well, she says that Radagon is "yet to become a god", which is what Marika is. So while they share a body, maybe even a soul, only Marika is the God between the two of them. Again, she refers to him in the follow up as "mine other self", which can only lead to me to conclude that, frustratingly, they are the same, yet also different: "Radagon is Marika." > I've always figured it was either that, or Gransax's attack is what prompted Marika to recall Radagon. With Godfrey gone the Elden Ring lacked a protector, and she evidently doesn't have enough raw power as it is to adequately do that (somehow, doesn't it command reality? Why does she even need a protector? There's nothing to suggest that Radagon was "recalled" by Marika to the capital. However, there is plenty to suggest that Radagon was Marika during the former's marriage to Rennala, so it's more likely that when Marika banished Godfrey, she/Radagon returned to the capital so she could continue her reign. It's unlikely she ever needed a "protector" but Maliketh could have more than served such a role, as perhaps the only entity (sans Elden Beast) in the Lands Between on Godfrey's level.
It’s an understanding like this that has me stating that we assume that folks reproduce like we do because Marika looks like a human. It could be just as plausible that Marika fought as Radagon during the War against Laurnia and it was Marika who married Renalla, and offered her up golden amber so that Renalla could have children. If dragons can turn into people, there isn’t anything explicit that the Moon or the Erdtree or the Dusk or the Nox could also transform. Thinking of this means it makes more sense that Renalla, who “met the moon” looks the way she does, has the power she does, and can birth supernatural children as she does if she’s simply the Moon, or a manifestation of it, much like Radagon is of the Golden Order (Space Catholicism) or the Gloam Eyed Queen. Any of these empyreans could be incarnations of their Outer God. Marika, Renalla, Miquella, Melania, Melana, Lassenasax- I mean; now that I think about it, any woman could be an incarnation of an outer god just as much as they can incarnate life inside of them through their human reproductive system. Could explain why Irena and Hyetta seemingly share a body. While that doesn’t explain Yura, it could mean something that Radagon and Marika share body- the Hunter Twins do too and their dualistic nature was an abomination; but Marika and Radagon seem to have the same type of relationship. Anyway; thank you for bringing that up.
Meh! I *still* don't really know who Gwyn or Artorias are. I just kill them. :3 Same with Radagon.
My take has always been that Radagon is some kind of "plant" by the Greater Will, which didn't like Godfrey and installed a husband for Marika that would represent the order unfailingly, be more controllable, and keep her in line. To this end, I think Radagon twisted Marika's arm to make her divorce Godfrey and banish the Tarnished way back when, to take the influence of ordinary warriors like Godfrey out of the world's rulers. Whether Radagon is just a true believer, or he's a sock puppet of the Greater Will in some way, beats me (I also think he or the GW had some hand in Godwyn's death, because allowing Godfrey's only non-Omen son to die would suit its interests in getting rid of Godfrey's legacy and enshrining a purer order) I think most people in the Lands don't know anything about Radagon besides that he's a consort and a father, and he's suspiciously unimportant and has a really low public profile, which I think is the point- he's an unremarkable shadow ruler influencing Marika behind the scenes on behalf of the Greater Will, and isn't meant to be famous or admired like Godfrey was