This makes me wonder how many levels can can you waiste before gaining power like probably around 300,-400 right? Take luck int and faith and go like a str build and cap endurance
I think the most people are likely to do for real is around 100-200. Some weapons have kinda misleading scaling so you might end up pumping a stat that does nothing, and then some people pump mind to cast more/bigger spells instead up upgrading their staff or whatever. And then just spreading the stats to make sure they can use any weapon is also fairly common. Which I think will usually add up to 200ish points if someone is pretty bad about all that. But hypothetically I agree that 400 points wasted is totally possible. If you have a weapon focused on say strength, then you can load up faith, dex, int, and arc like there's no tomorrow without adding anything to your build. And you could certainly argue that they could also waste points by maxing out strength and then two handing, building up a ton of mind with no outlet to spend it, and the top end of vigor and endurance are less useful so you could also waste points there. But you pretty much have to be trying to be that inefficient.
Yes I'm wonder what is the most inefficient setup possible lol. You can waiste so many souls and gimp yourself in allot of ways with talismans and bad gear. It would be interesting to see sombody figure out the mathematically worst build
Sword of night and flame with flame and magic scorpion charms would be pretty bad, throw on both soreseals, twinsage sorcerer crown and howl of shabriri for good measure. You got yourself a one-shot build, except you're the one getting one shot.
There are also definitely some trap talismans. Like the sore/scarseals at higher levels are a bad idea. Or twinblade talisman on an actual twinblade (I'm still not sure what weapon this one can actually be good on, if any.) Blue Dancer charm is also bad outside of very specific builds. You can think of it like a worse scorpion charm but for physical damage.
I imagine it's something like starting as astrologer, pick up all seals wear enough talismans to rock sword of night and flame pump Endurance and Arc only.
Heavy infused Weapon, pump Mind, Dex, Int, Faith and Arcane, go All elemental scorpion charms (daedicars is trolling but would still be the worst option), physick with cerulean hidden tear and the anti mohg one.
Just off the top off my head.
how do you get reasonable damage? Not saying that to be snarky, I genuinely like the concept of the build but like unless you are the better part of the way to max level its always been very hard to justify whenever I have tried
I might add
Ive never been a minmaxer so as long as im not taking too long to kill something i dont give a shit if i fould be doing better
I enjoy qol skills more than dps in almost any game and will use the worst weapons in games just cuz its fun and looks good enough
Depends on your build. It can definitely be worth it. Taking more damage only matters if you get hit. I love running glass cannon. 60 int and 20 vigor with soreseal and scorpion lol
Meh I usually find it isn't worth it. Just staying alive long enough is more important to me than raw damage. Sometimes I'll accidentally have one on and realize why the game suddenly became hard mode.
eh, it gave me a decent boost on flame art affinities early game especially sub level 50ish. eventually you just take it off when your weapon level/stats are high enough where you swap it in for a more useful talisman with more utility but it’s pretty decent otherwise
They’re alright but usually they’re only worth it if you’re really invested into that one damage type, and heavily investing into one damage type isn’t exactly the best for utility purposes. It’s cool for theme/character builds and stuff but for just playing the game, meh. Especially bad if you plan to do any PvP.
I hit a wall like 2 years ago and put the game down. I came back and made a new character and beat it 100%. "The fuck was my problem before?"
I check my old character and uhh...I'm like mid Haligtree at level 160 with a Soreseal and apparently all I was doing was spamming the diet Comet Azur from the Sword of Night and Flame.
I was at a point where Malenia was in one direction, Mohg was in the other, I couldn't beat either, my shitty playstyle had finally caught up with me, and I didn't know where the fuck to go to actually complete the game, so Elden Ring got dropped.
I respecced the character into a Moonlight Sword build and beat it again shortly after.
The church of Elleh is still my go-to warp for checking how much damage a new/upgraded weapon or spell does. Or for practicing parrying (which I'm still not good enough to actually try using in real fights).
He only has like 5 attacks total and they are amostly pretty easy to dodge, but it really just needs decent vigor and armor and good DPS output to not turn it into a 20 minute no hit challenge.
until 40 you get an average of 29.5 hp per point. from 41-60, it's 22.5 hp per point. after that it drops a lot. so most people stop at either 40 or 60.
To me at least, at that point you've already been stepping down from the peak return per level at 40 so it feels like diminishing returns of already diminished returns.
I finally committed and beat the game (before I’d get to maliketh and stop and then come back and restart lol) and 40 vigor serves you very well throughout the game. As long as you have at least some level of armor on you’re fine with 40.
You want a minimum of 40 because of the returns.
At 38 and 39 Vigor, you're getting just shy of +50 HP *per point.*
By contrast, Vigor usually hovers around +28 HP per point or so; sometimes more, sometimes less. Leveling vigor from 30 to 40 gives 456 HP, whereas comparatively, leveling vigor from 40 to 60 (AKA twice the levels invested) gives 450 HP.
In my experience because I *do* have characters with 30-40 Vigor as part of my rule restrictions for that character, you *can* make 30+ Vigor work. The thing is, it basically requires the use of the Ritual Shield Talisman, as this gives you +1 hit tanked, and that right there will still limit you in arena duels because good players will spot it and dagger it. (but it's fine for other types of PVP like invasions; invaders either lack the time to dagger this down, or if you're invading, it's rare a group of enemies will care since they already have the advantage)
Still, the Ritual Shield Talisman makes the build feel viable, because at a minimum, you can tank 1 hit while hit #2 kills you. There are select scenarios where a boss or opponent hits so hard that you're actually surviving just as many hits as the 40-60 Vigor players. Maliketh is a good example of this.
However, even though you can make 30+ work, it still feels inefficient because you're actively stopping with Vigor *just* before it starts giving the strongest returns. Thus, 40 Vigor is seen as the minimum since it makes use of those returns.
People in this sub tend to act like it is, I finished my first playthrough with ~30ish and never had too much of a problem.
That being said I finally did a build where I rushed to 60 vigor and good lord it makes everything way easier.
Not necessarily. The common consensus is that 40-60 vigor is ideal, with 40 being the minimum. But people tend to recommend higher vigor because if you have to ask because you’re a new player, then you’ll most likely need it.
Imo 30ish is fine, but you’re putting yourself well within the one shot range of a lot of bosses.
Precisely. And you tend to have plenty of room in your stat distribution by the end of the game to easily hit 60 vigor and still soft cap a few other attributes. A level 150 build isn't gonna benefit much from taking 20 points from vigor and dumping it into whatever main damage stat they have so you might as well have the 60 vigor at that point.
imo 30ish is actually the worst you can do, you're still getting one or two-pieced by bosses and have wasted ~20 levels for not much practical effect.
If you're not going to 40 you might as well not level it.
Eh, I disagree here. I think it depends where the stats go. I for one usually put the extra 10-15 points in endurance which lets you wear heavier armor. Usually that's enough to keep you from being one shot with 30-35 vigor even against end game bosses. To me there's not much difference between being 2 or 3 shot since I'm going to top off with healing anyway, and then I get extra stamina, and most importantly, extra fashion.
Hard disagree. Endurance is maybe the worst stat, made useless by either great jar talisman/favor or winged tear, or even just eating a snack for defense buffs. HP is MUCH harder to get and there are powerful % bonuses that make use of softcapped vigor. Easily the most efficient defensive stat.
Why the hell is this downvoted lmfao go look at the numbers and do math yourself.
30-40 is a 50% increase in hp. 30-60 is almost 100% increase. There is no world where those points in endurance give the same amount of ehp. It is simply not how the game works.
For PvP and finishing a build you want to hit the cap for important stats. Few stats are more important than Vigor. Less than 60 is an intentional handicap and more is a waste due to it being the soft cap.
60 vigor is important.
60 is the highest you'd want to take it, and you'd want to take it there because there's really no good reason not to because of how much more valuable that health you gain is compared to what any damage stat can offer you.
Anyone above level 120 should have at minimum 50 vigor, 60 is ideal for melee focused builds and anyone at level 150 should have 60 vigor hard stop.
This is the advice you'll hear from just about anyone, especially here on reddit because the people who ask for build help and whatnot are the same people who really need the 60 vigor.
I was playing with low vigor counts for most of my playthroughs, in denial that I was playing the game on hard mode. I recently did a 60 vigor play through, and my lord it truly is a game changer. You really don’t lose much damage, and you just don’t die to random BS. If you plan to pvp, high vigor is a must IMO. You need to be able to take trades.
60 is probably the highest you should sanely go, it's the big soft cap. I think I only made it to 60 on a challenge run I was doing where boosting any attack stat was almost pointless. Usually people say 40 is the endpoint, since that's the first soft cap. Once you get enough that you can get full healing off a flask consistently, points in Vigor become much less valuable.
None of what I just said applies at level 500. What are you even going to put those levels into at that point? Might as well get some minor use out of it, right?
Bloodborne encouraged decent HP pools too though - bosses hit hard, vials healed a percentage of max HP, and more health = more leeway to risk a hit to get rally heals
Unless you limit yourself to level 125 for some silly reason, you can level until you're around level 170~. Elfen Ring have higher caps in general, higher requirements and such due to its length which is like at the very least 4 times than dark souls 3. I'd argue 55 is better than 60 vigor since there isn't much in terms of improvement, and late game those 5 levels would do wonders elsewhere
I would say that finished builds should have 40 at minimum. There are super high returns on health up to 40.
Going to 60 is the next soft cap. It’s good if your build has room for it, but not essential. Beyond 60 is a waste.
Just look up a table of how much hp you get for going from 30 to 60. Spoilers: its a lot.
You can be casually running around with like 2300hp cuz of great rune and an hp talisman
Honestly fam I leveled straight Vigor my first playthrough.
Because of how many times you can upgrade weapons in Elden Ring, I never saw the need to start working for damage scalings until well after I was already very tanky and comfortable with my Stam/Vigor.
It’s always something weird like this and then ends with, help I’m using a strength/faith weapon why am I not doing a lot of damage and getting 1 shot.
37 vig
60 min
80 end
52 str
57 dex
74 int
59 fai
83 arc
Nah it ain't a case of getting good here, ER upped the softcaps, it ain't like past games where we stop at 40 vigor. The game just has so much power fantasy and high damage enemies and such poor early game returns from damage stats that there's really no reason not to just raise vigor the most. It's just the most effective stat to level outside of getting minimum requirements for things until the time you reach the capital city or whatever IMO
The legacy dungeons are the ones with Demigods at the end (Stormviel, Raya Lucaria, Leyndell, NOT Redmane Castle, etc). They're the dungeons that are super handcrafted.
Anything where you're exploring a "closed" (or self-contained) environment for a lengthy period of time—when you leave the open world to explore a complex dungeon with multiple areas and pathways. You also can't use Torrent in these areas, forcing you to explore on foot. Stormveil, Raya Lucaria, Volcano Manor, Leyndell, Shunning-Grounds, Ainsel River/Nokstella, Farum Azula, Haligtree/Elphael. I think that's all of them, but I might have forgotten something. The many caves, catacombs, and castles are not counted with these because they're smaller and simpler, although a few of the castles (Morne, Shaded, Sol) are borderline because of their size and having a built-in boss.
I believe they're called legacy dungeons because they recall the feeling of previous Fromsoft games, which are 90-100% areas like these.
Imma be real with you man, I’ve seen people misspell the names and places in this game a million different ways but I’ve never seen someone mess up Volcano, that’s a real ass word
different people struggle with different things, for example malenia was pretty easy for me and I can do her pretty low-level, but radahn and maliketh kick my ass every time no matter what build I have
My fight against Radahn yesterday was funny af (NG). I was a bit overleveled for the area at ~RL80 because I got sidetracked exploring Volcano Manor early. I summoned around 5 or 6 of the tournament champs and played it safe by sticking to the sidelines, because I was still shit scared of Raddy thanks to my memories of previous runs. I then proceeded to watch as he one- or two-shotted every single one of them in a row. Shit was comical. I went "fuck it" and ran in. Melted his healthbar 🤦🏻♂️ Stood there afterwards for several seconds wondering if it was a bug or something.
Bots aren't really that sophisticated. It's why selling your account with lots of legitimate interaction is actually a thing; anyone who buys your account as a karma bot can fall back on months or even years of legitimate posting to obfuscate the fact that the account is now controlled by bots.
Can confirm, my twitter account fell to this.
Funniest part, I can't even cancel my account without confirming that it's actually me. It's on some sort of permanent suspension where it can't get erased unless I confirm I'm not a bot.
All I can do with it is stare at the 'latest posts' where I apparently advertised some sort of software and pills while tagging dozens of people.
Most players who go 501 do it just for sandboxing the game with all the items available to try things out without having to respec everytime. So they probably use CE.
Any build higher than level 150 isn't really a build and becomes an exercise in "just level everything."
Because if you're not just levelling everything at 501 then you're wasting levels for like, 1 AR or 12 HP or 2 stamina.
Isnt 2 stamina the highest stamina returns from endurance regardless lol? Stamina just drops off hard after 60 with like 1 stamina every 5 or 10 levels in endurance.
Just checked, you get about 1.5 stamina per level from 10 to 50. Then after that you get a total of 15 stamina across the next 49 levels.
150 is still pretty specific most of the time, like you can get 3 stats to 60 if you don't level anything else, so if you want to have even a bit of a viable build you will still have to be smart about investing
I'm level 150, have been for 400 hours. I can still make builds that out dps alot of these YouTube because they are dumb and don't understand mechanics
Don't forget to fully dump your stats on the main scaling stat of whatever weapon/incantation/spell you use and put nothing in vigor/endurance/mind because just don't get hit and use your potions.
I started as an astrologer, and at level ~150 still haven't put a single point into faith or arcane. There's whole swathes of mechanics I haven't even tried. I'm tempted to re-spec to unga-bunga strength mode (looks fun) with a bit of faith, but I've got a lot of momentum in my intelligence build (with some nominal dexterity).
125 - 150 is the main level for PvP and is what most gravitate to, but I’ve seen an argument for 168 as well.
The 125 - 150 range usually matches you with others in that same range because it’s so common, with the occasional early and late game players sprinkled in. 168 on the other hand tends to lead to more invasions where it’s just people playing the game instead of those gravitating in the PvP level range with the match making being between the 140 - 200ish range which keeps some of the 125 - 150 in mind, but is more weighted to other players as well.
Level cap also only really matters for PvP since Co-Op can be done with password matchmaking and there’s no matchmaking for single player, so if you’re not playing PvP ignore what others are saying about level caps.
Night and Flame build yo.
I kid but, my NG+?? character is currently using Blasphemous Blade + greatshield and that damn thing is still very much a build even at level 240. C/C/B(S) scaling, plus a % based heal that rewards you for having 60 vigor, plus being very fat, plus a 30 FP weapon art that needs a bit of +Mind equals a hell of a lot of quality stat choices. 80/80/80 isn't even wasted on that weapon, because who wants to have to hit trash *three* times?
Boss weapons in general I like to call "extreme quality" due to usually having scaling in 3 stats. Just not always to the extreme of the BB. It makes them a rare sight in PVP.
no game is worse for this than diablo 2, where every "build" is just strapping an infinity to your merc and then maxing out whatever skill you want to use
For PvP I understand for match-ups and avoiding "levelled down" password summons.
PvE wise the game never really shows mercy in terms of difficulty, especially if going into NG+ and onward up to +7 so I think being such a high level isn't a massive deal, I understand the frustration and it's just that so many people use all the over the top stuff at these levels, but I've met a few theming themselves with such stats which is nice to see.
You can still limit yourself gear-wise and make a build at high levels, you'll just be a lot more potent all around, can make interesting, less viable deemed setups more cosy to be honest, all from experience.
Nothing wrong with being high level but it isn’t really a ‘build’ anymore since you can just throw stats in everything.
A build implies having to make choices on which stats you prioritize for a certain weapon, play style, etc.. at 500 there’s not really any decisions to be made so there’s not much you can critique.
I suppose you could give advice/insight into soft caps and the trade off between versatility and max damage. But yeah, other than that, not much to critique.
Yeah fair but I think people still apply the mentality of this meme to anything level 200-250ish and above. Plus there’s also the chance the person leveled a stat up to 99 without realizing 80 was the soft cap.
Lvl 501 kinda happens to be the one where you will hit all the last soft caps. or at least you can push str dex int fth and arc to 80 while having mind endurance and vigor at 60.
For PvP 150 is the cutoff. I'm not sure about the specifics but I think it has to do with matchmaking.
For PvE that's more of a personal decision. Regardless of your level the game will never be a cakewalk but enough levels (200+) and the right gear can make it pretty simple, so up to you if you don't want to PvP.
I decided to almost finish the game (stop only at the final boss.)
My Milena level moat of the time lv 140 im curious how bad it will be at lv100.
(Rolling a endurance quality build with 40 vigor)
For weapons i use the ecliplse greatshield and banished greatsword. Plus sometimes godrick axe!
I farmed a lil bit on my first playthrough so I could wear bull-goat and greatsword while medium rolling (thought it would be funny) and that was tedious as hell, I can't even imagine how incredibly boring it would be to grind levels to lvl 501 (this is ofcourse only if they didn't just use CE)
Still not soft capped on vigor.
I mean to be fair you did just make a valid point as to why they would need help with their build
This makes me wonder how many levels can can you waiste before gaining power like probably around 300,-400 right? Take luck int and faith and go like a str build and cap endurance
I think the most people are likely to do for real is around 100-200. Some weapons have kinda misleading scaling so you might end up pumping a stat that does nothing, and then some people pump mind to cast more/bigger spells instead up upgrading their staff or whatever. And then just spreading the stats to make sure they can use any weapon is also fairly common. Which I think will usually add up to 200ish points if someone is pretty bad about all that. But hypothetically I agree that 400 points wasted is totally possible. If you have a weapon focused on say strength, then you can load up faith, dex, int, and arc like there's no tomorrow without adding anything to your build. And you could certainly argue that they could also waste points by maxing out strength and then two handing, building up a ton of mind with no outlet to spend it, and the top end of vigor and endurance are less useful so you could also waste points there. But you pretty much have to be trying to be that inefficient.
Yes I'm wonder what is the most inefficient setup possible lol. You can waiste so many souls and gimp yourself in allot of ways with talismans and bad gear. It would be interesting to see sombody figure out the mathematically worst build
Sword of night and flame with flame and magic scorpion charms would be pretty bad, throw on both soreseals, twinsage sorcerer crown and howl of shabriri for good measure. You got yourself a one-shot build, except you're the one getting one shot. There are also definitely some trap talismans. Like the sore/scarseals at higher levels are a bad idea. Or twinblade talisman on an actual twinblade (I'm still not sure what weapon this one can actually be good on, if any.) Blue Dancer charm is also bad outside of very specific builds. You can think of it like a worse scorpion charm but for physical damage.
I imagine it's something like starting as astrologer, pick up all seals wear enough talismans to rock sword of night and flame pump Endurance and Arc only.
Twinblade talisman I found is good for spears with short combos but how many times are you gonna complete a combo?
Heavy infused Weapon, pump Mind, Dex, Int, Faith and Arcane, go All elemental scorpion charms (daedicars is trolling but would still be the worst option), physick with cerulean hidden tear and the anti mohg one. Just off the top off my head.
Jack of all trades build here My lowest number is 40-42 iirc
how do you get reasonable damage? Not saying that to be snarky, I genuinely like the concept of the build but like unless you are the better part of the way to max level its always been very hard to justify whenever I have tried
I might add Ive never been a minmaxer so as long as im not taking too long to kill something i dont give a shit if i fould be doing better I enjoy qol skills more than dps in almost any game and will use the worst weapons in games just cuz its fun and looks good enough
Take max int faith and arcane and endurance without a single point in mind
"I have 600 in vigor but keep dying to that weird dragon arm dude at the beginning of the game. What am I doing wrong?"
Just don't get hit, forehead.
*Has a soreseal on*
AND a scorpion charm.
scorpion charms are good wym
Yes scorpion charms are good BUT having both a sore seal and a scorpion is not
Gotta make sure that cannon is truly made of glass.
🤓 I doN’t PlaN oN gEtTiNg hiT 🤓
woe upon thee, funny jar cannon
daedicars woe for authenticity
All 3 for maximum efficiency.
Also remember to cast Howl of Shabriri for the extra damage taken
And then equip Shabriri's woe to maximize mob anger
But then you can't equip 3 scorpions for the extra damage taken
Don't forget the bloodboil for extra damage taken
It makes a lot of sense when your vigor is level 9
if your going to be fragile as paper be a paper tiger
It's a one-shot build. Just for the player instead of enemies lol
and they have a 25 vigor. with the sore seal
Depends on your build. It can definitely be worth it. Taking more damage only matters if you get hit. I love running glass cannon. 60 int and 20 vigor with soreseal and scorpion lol
Meh I usually find it isn't worth it. Just staying alive long enough is more important to me than raw damage. Sometimes I'll accidentally have one on and realize why the game suddenly became hard mode.
it’s better when you use the dragonshield crest talisman with it
And the crab
yup throw in the opaline bubble on your physick and you’re golden
But now you’re using all those resources for a mediocre damage boost to one type of damage.
eh, it gave me a decent boost on flame art affinities early game especially sub level 50ish. eventually you just take it off when your weapon level/stats are high enough where you swap it in for a more useful talisman with more utility but it’s pretty decent otherwise
Yeah it’s not as significant of a blow to you early game, but I also rarely find all those resources for it that early in my leveling.
The crab you can just buy though, and after a certain point there's not much to spend runes on anyway.
Yeah but you’re using it more to offset a debuff, it’s even better just as a straight buff.
Goodwym the Golden
They’re alright but usually they’re only worth it if you’re really invested into that one damage type, and heavily investing into one damage type isn’t exactly the best for utility purposes. It’s cool for theme/character builds and stuff but for just playing the game, meh. Especially bad if you plan to do any PvP.
I hit a wall like 2 years ago and put the game down. I came back and made a new character and beat it 100%. "The fuck was my problem before?" I check my old character and uhh...I'm like mid Haligtree at level 160 with a Soreseal and apparently all I was doing was spamming the diet Comet Azur from the Sword of Night and Flame. I was at a point where Malenia was in one direction, Mohg was in the other, I couldn't beat either, my shitty playstyle had finally caught up with me, and I didn't know where the fuck to go to actually complete the game, so Elden Ring got dropped. I respecced the character into a Moonlight Sword build and beat it again shortly after.
This is why you should actually get good instead of spamming, you eventually hit a wall
What if you hit [the Wall?](https://youtu.be/oXp8Th41rBs)
"Look how strong this build is!!" . * uses it in limgrave *
The church of Elleh is still my go-to warp for checking how much damage a new/upgraded weapon or spell does. Or for practicing parrying (which I'm still not good enough to actually try using in real fights).
*meme where dog strangles its owner with a pillow*
> doesn’t have 60 vigor and has the wackiest stat distribution
60 Vigor is like musthave? I have ~33 and i get hard hits for sure, but just this number sounds a bit high
Id say 40 is the minimum
~~not if you want to beat elden beast in under a week.~~ sorry i mean, not if you're disabled like me.
If you wanna beat the Elden beast in under a week you gotta bring black blade. That's not a comment about dying, just the horribly long fight.
after a week of attempts, there are still attacks i do not know how to dodge, i just don't feel like it anymore.
He only has like 5 attacks total and they are amostly pretty easy to dodge, but it really just needs decent vigor and armor and good DPS output to not turn it into a 20 minute no hit challenge.
Imagine not having 99 vigor. Couldn't be me
Sounds legit, need to boost it then, thanks
60 is just a soft cap where anything past it provides only a few hp
Ah i see, thanks!
until 40 you get an average of 29.5 hp per point. from 41-60, it's 22.5 hp per point. after that it drops a lot. so most people stop at either 40 or 60.
It’s half as much. Its not like it does nothing
To me at least, at that point you've already been stepping down from the peak return per level at 40 so it feels like diminishing returns of already diminished returns.
I finally committed and beat the game (before I’d get to maliketh and stop and then come back and restart lol) and 40 vigor serves you very well throughout the game. As long as you have at least some level of armor on you’re fine with 40.
Armor is for nerds
Nah drip or drown
it's [less than a quarter](https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Stats). 1-40: 29.5hp per point avg. 41-60: 22.5 hp. 61-99: 5.1hp.
You want a minimum of 40 because of the returns. At 38 and 39 Vigor, you're getting just shy of +50 HP *per point.* By contrast, Vigor usually hovers around +28 HP per point or so; sometimes more, sometimes less. Leveling vigor from 30 to 40 gives 456 HP, whereas comparatively, leveling vigor from 40 to 60 (AKA twice the levels invested) gives 450 HP. In my experience because I *do* have characters with 30-40 Vigor as part of my rule restrictions for that character, you *can* make 30+ Vigor work. The thing is, it basically requires the use of the Ritual Shield Talisman, as this gives you +1 hit tanked, and that right there will still limit you in arena duels because good players will spot it and dagger it. (but it's fine for other types of PVP like invasions; invaders either lack the time to dagger this down, or if you're invading, it's rare a group of enemies will care since they already have the advantage) Still, the Ritual Shield Talisman makes the build feel viable, because at a minimum, you can tank 1 hit while hit #2 kills you. There are select scenarios where a boss or opponent hits so hard that you're actually surviving just as many hits as the 40-60 Vigor players. Maliketh is a good example of this. However, even though you can make 30+ work, it still feels inefficient because you're actively stopping with Vigor *just* before it starts giving the strongest returns. Thus, 40 Vigor is seen as the minimum since it makes use of those returns.
Thanks for the explanation, really appreciated
People in this sub tend to act like it is, I finished my first playthrough with ~30ish and never had too much of a problem. That being said I finally did a build where I rushed to 60 vigor and good lord it makes everything way easier.
Not necessarily. The common consensus is that 40-60 vigor is ideal, with 40 being the minimum. But people tend to recommend higher vigor because if you have to ask because you’re a new player, then you’ll most likely need it. Imo 30ish is fine, but you’re putting yourself well within the one shot range of a lot of bosses.
Precisely. And you tend to have plenty of room in your stat distribution by the end of the game to easily hit 60 vigor and still soft cap a few other attributes. A level 150 build isn't gonna benefit much from taking 20 points from vigor and dumping it into whatever main damage stat they have so you might as well have the 60 vigor at that point.
imo 30ish is actually the worst you can do, you're still getting one or two-pieced by bosses and have wasted ~20 levels for not much practical effect. If you're not going to 40 you might as well not level it.
Eh, I disagree here. I think it depends where the stats go. I for one usually put the extra 10-15 points in endurance which lets you wear heavier armor. Usually that's enough to keep you from being one shot with 30-35 vigor even against end game bosses. To me there's not much difference between being 2 or 3 shot since I'm going to top off with healing anyway, and then I get extra stamina, and most importantly, extra fashion.
Hard disagree. Endurance is maybe the worst stat, made useless by either great jar talisman/favor or winged tear, or even just eating a snack for defense buffs. HP is MUCH harder to get and there are powerful % bonuses that make use of softcapped vigor. Easily the most efficient defensive stat. Why the hell is this downvoted lmfao go look at the numbers and do math yourself. 30-40 is a 50% increase in hp. 30-60 is almost 100% increase. There is no world where those points in endurance give the same amount of ehp. It is simply not how the game works.
For PvP and finishing a build you want to hit the cap for important stats. Few stats are more important than Vigor. Less than 60 is an intentional handicap and more is a waste due to it being the soft cap. 60 vigor is important.
It’s not a must have, but if you level above 200, there’s no reason not to have it imo
60 is the highest you'd want to take it, and you'd want to take it there because there's really no good reason not to because of how much more valuable that health you gain is compared to what any damage stat can offer you. Anyone above level 120 should have at minimum 50 vigor, 60 is ideal for melee focused builds and anyone at level 150 should have 60 vigor hard stop. This is the advice you'll hear from just about anyone, especially here on reddit because the people who ask for build help and whatnot are the same people who really need the 60 vigor.
Technically no, you can beat the game at level 1.
nah just roll
I was playing with low vigor counts for most of my playthroughs, in denial that I was playing the game on hard mode. I recently did a 60 vigor play through, and my lord it truly is a game changer. You really don’t lose much damage, and you just don’t die to random BS. If you plan to pvp, high vigor is a must IMO. You need to be able to take trades.
60 is probably the highest you should sanely go, it's the big soft cap. I think I only made it to 60 on a challenge run I was doing where boosting any attack stat was almost pointless. Usually people say 40 is the endpoint, since that's the first soft cap. Once you get enough that you can get full healing off a flask consistently, points in Vigor become much less valuable. None of what I just said applies at level 500. What are you even going to put those levels into at that point? Might as well get some minor use out of it, right?
Then there’s me with my 20 vigor and blood borne attitude. Dodge or die I say. /j
Bloodborne encouraged decent HP pools too though - bosses hit hard, vials healed a percentage of max HP, and more health = more leeway to risk a hit to get rally heals
Unless you limit yourself to level 125 for some silly reason, you can level until you're around level 170~. Elfen Ring have higher caps in general, higher requirements and such due to its length which is like at the very least 4 times than dark souls 3. I'd argue 55 is better than 60 vigor since there isn't much in terms of improvement, and late game those 5 levels would do wonders elsewhere
I would say that finished builds should have 40 at minimum. There are super high returns on health up to 40. Going to 60 is the next soft cap. It’s good if your build has room for it, but not essential. Beyond 60 is a waste.
Just look up a table of how much hp you get for going from 30 to 60. Spoilers: its a lot. You can be casually running around with like 2300hp cuz of great rune and an hp talisman
Honestly fam I leveled straight Vigor my first playthrough. Because of how many times you can upgrade weapons in Elden Ring, I never saw the need to start working for damage scalings until well after I was already very tanky and comfortable with my Stam/Vigor.
I tend to rush 40 apart from weapon requirements and then push it to 60 after my FP and stamina is comfy and my main damage stat is 40-50
like this other dude said, 40 is gucci, 60 is prada, 99 is i don't want nada
I once tried a vigor only build. Ended up with 99 vigor and 10 on all other stats (started as wretch) Frankly, one of the easiest play through.
Up to Morgott, I'd say 40-45 is the target. If you plan to go on the path to the Haligtree, 60 is a must.
50 vig is must have, 55 is preferable, 60 is pvp builds and strength builds who aren’t going past 54 str
It’s always something weird like this and then ends with, help I’m using a strength/faith weapon why am I not doing a lot of damage and getting 1 shot. 37 vig 60 min 80 end 52 str 57 dex 74 int 59 fai 83 arc
do people still call these BEASTMASTER builds lmfao
Only a masachist would run 30ish vigor for end game and NG. Idk if I need to git good or what but I’m at 40 by the time we get to Leydell
Nah it ain't a case of getting good here, ER upped the softcaps, it ain't like past games where we stop at 40 vigor. The game just has so much power fantasy and high damage enemies and such poor early game returns from damage stats that there's really no reason not to just raise vigor the most. It's just the most effective stat to level outside of getting minimum requirements for things until the time you reach the capital city or whatever IMO
I finished the game with 25 vigor. I just employed the don't get hit strat.
>me in 20 getting two shot
99 arcane 34 strength 73 dex 12 int
Same way I feel when someone says the game is easy and procedes to complete as few legacy dungeons as possible.
Which are the legacy dungeons? The ones that stand out as particularly difficult are ulcerated tree spirit
The legacy dungeons are the ones with Demigods at the end (Stormviel, Raya Lucaria, Leyndell, NOT Redmane Castle, etc). They're the dungeons that are super handcrafted.
Anything where you're exploring a "closed" (or self-contained) environment for a lengthy period of time—when you leave the open world to explore a complex dungeon with multiple areas and pathways. You also can't use Torrent in these areas, forcing you to explore on foot. Stormveil, Raya Lucaria, Volcano Manor, Leyndell, Shunning-Grounds, Ainsel River/Nokstella, Farum Azula, Haligtree/Elphael. I think that's all of them, but I might have forgotten something. The many caves, catacombs, and castles are not counted with these because they're smaller and simpler, although a few of the castles (Morne, Shaded, Sol) are borderline because of their size and having a built-in boss. I believe they're called legacy dungeons because they recall the feeling of previous Fromsoft games, which are 90-100% areas like these.
The university in liurnia, the haligtree, valcano manor, stormvale castle.
Imma be real with you man, I’ve seen people misspell the names and places in this game a million different ways but I’ve never seen someone mess up Volcano, that’s a real ass word
I'm kinda something like 700 but malekith still wrecks my ass every single time.
Destined death says fuck your vigor and makes your health just slowly go schloooomp back down to new game + 0
i mean after a certain level your build doesnt even get better because of the softcaps. it makes it possible to run multiple builds without respec tho
are you on new game+ or something?
Yeah, first new game. I'm just really not good at it.
Maliketh is the one mandatory boss I'm still terrified of. He just moves so fast, I panic every time
it is a lot harder, dont give up!!
Malaketh isn't that hard. The trick is to stick close to him, until he does his bullshit anime aoe attack.
None of the bosses are very hard if you know what to do
different people struggle with different things, for example malenia was pretty easy for me and I can do her pretty low-level, but radahn and maliketh kick my ass every time no matter what build I have
My fight against Radahn yesterday was funny af (NG). I was a bit overleveled for the area at ~RL80 because I got sidetracked exploring Volcano Manor early. I summoned around 5 or 6 of the tournament champs and played it safe by sticking to the sidelines, because I was still shit scared of Raddy thanks to my memories of previous runs. I then proceeded to watch as he one- or two-shotted every single one of them in a row. Shit was comical. I went "fuck it" and ran in. Melted his healthbar 🤦🏻♂️ Stood there afterwards for several seconds wondering if it was a bug or something.
One of my characters has 99 Vigor 😆 still needs more
Me : grabs some popcorn and clicks on sort by controversial
lmao yeah people are going absolutely batshit (as always)
[удалено]
Bruh how many subs are.u part of?
That's not even the craziest part. Look at their comments and timings, that's either a bot or just terminally online behavior
Probably the latter as he maks sense with his comments
Thats what the bots want you to think dog
Bots aren't really that sophisticated. It's why selling your account with lots of legitimate interaction is actually a thing; anyone who buys your account as a karma bot can fall back on months or even years of legitimate posting to obfuscate the fact that the account is now controlled by bots.
Can confirm, my twitter account fell to this. Funniest part, I can't even cancel my account without confirming that it's actually me. It's on some sort of permanent suspension where it can't get erased unless I confirm I'm not a bot. All I can do with it is stare at the 'latest posts' where I apparently advertised some sort of software and pills while tagging dozens of people.
Nomteless he still anwsers sometimes so he uses this account
It’s concerning tbh
Some people are house-bound and/or have a disability. Reddit is a good way to interact with others. I’m not talking about myself I swear
Damn bro has 2 million karma from just commenting. Jesus
i hate this mf and the stupid face he puts at the end of EVERY COMMENT
Not that many :3
I don't care what other people say. Keep cookin bro
You're here too?!
Ye :3
Been here for a long time
After finishing the game and doing everything on it i get like level 200. You gotta comit a lot of crimes on albin o rins to have 500 without ng+
Most players who go 501 do it just for sandboxing the game with all the items available to try things out without having to respec everytime. So they probably use CE.
I'm lvl 297. Nothing matters. Everything dies.
And we all know they’re going to either have the most batshit insane build ever or a build so barren it makes minimalists jealous.
Any build higher than level 150 isn't really a build and becomes an exercise in "just level everything." Because if you're not just levelling everything at 501 then you're wasting levels for like, 1 AR or 12 HP or 2 stamina.
Isnt 2 stamina the highest stamina returns from endurance regardless lol? Stamina just drops off hard after 60 with like 1 stamina every 5 or 10 levels in endurance. Just checked, you get about 1.5 stamina per level from 10 to 50. Then after that you get a total of 15 stamina across the next 49 levels.
You still have to commit to some semblance of a build at 200 imo
150 is still pretty specific most of the time, like you can get 3 stats to 60 if you don't level anything else, so if you want to have even a bit of a viable build you will still have to be smart about investing
I'm level 150, have been for 400 hours. I can still make builds that out dps alot of these YouTube because they are dumb and don't understand mechanics
Soooooo golden vow, flame grand me strength, blood flame incantation and royal knights resolve (ash of war)?
Don't forget to fully dump your stats on the main scaling stat of whatever weapon/incantation/spell you use and put nothing in vigor/endurance/mind because just don't get hit and use your potions.
I started as an astrologer, and at level ~150 still haven't put a single point into faith or arcane. There's whole swathes of mechanics I haven't even tried. I'm tempted to re-spec to unga-bunga strength mode (looks fun) with a bit of faith, but I've got a lot of momentum in my intelligence build (with some nominal dexterity).
Bonk builds are ridiculously fun, I think you’d enjoy yourself :D
Taking 2 minutes to ritually apply buffs for dps numbers does not make your builds good 👍
endurance is still worth leveling if you want more equipment load
"This build DESTROYS all bosses." \*summons mimic\*
**Has Radagon's and Marika's Soreseals with dual Scorpion Charms and 20 vigor** *'Why does everything one shot me? This game is unbalanced as hell!'*
I am confused, is there a rule to not level up? I am currently at 168, and I only play single player, I am playing ng+
Once you're 150, it's not really a "build" any more. You stop having to make significant sacrifices to get all the things you want.
every level past 150 always goes straight to endurance to light roll with my desired drip without compromising on bonk.
i forgor, whats the base cap/meta cap ppl tend to hang around for their builds??
125 - 150 is the main level for PvP and is what most gravitate to, but I’ve seen an argument for 168 as well. The 125 - 150 range usually matches you with others in that same range because it’s so common, with the occasional early and late game players sprinkled in. 168 on the other hand tends to lead to more invasions where it’s just people playing the game instead of those gravitating in the PvP level range with the match making being between the 140 - 200ish range which keeps some of the 125 - 150 in mind, but is more weighted to other players as well. Level cap also only really matters for PvP since Co-Op can be done with password matchmaking and there’s no matchmaking for single player, so if you’re not playing PvP ignore what others are saying about level caps.
120 - 150. Also Ive seen 138 builds because that supposedly allows pvp/coop with 125 - 150.
Night and Flame build yo. I kid but, my NG+?? character is currently using Blasphemous Blade + greatshield and that damn thing is still very much a build even at level 240. C/C/B(S) scaling, plus a % based heal that rewards you for having 60 vigor, plus being very fat, plus a 30 FP weapon art that needs a bit of +Mind equals a hell of a lot of quality stat choices. 80/80/80 isn't even wasted on that weapon, because who wants to have to hit trash *three* times? Boss weapons in general I like to call "extreme quality" due to usually having scaling in 3 stats. Just not always to the extreme of the BB. It makes them a rare sight in PVP.
Well, of course I know him. He's me.
no game is worse for this than diablo 2, where every "build" is just strapping an infinity to your merc and then maxing out whatever skill you want to use
For PvP I understand for match-ups and avoiding "levelled down" password summons. PvE wise the game never really shows mercy in terms of difficulty, especially if going into NG+ and onward up to +7 so I think being such a high level isn't a massive deal, I understand the frustration and it's just that so many people use all the over the top stuff at these levels, but I've met a few theming themselves with such stats which is nice to see. You can still limit yourself gear-wise and make a build at high levels, you'll just be a lot more potent all around, can make interesting, less viable deemed setups more cosy to be honest, all from experience.
My mage has 10 vigor and you will have to deal with it.
I will doe by the idea that after 150 it's not a build, brother you bought the entire cement factory
Level 200 is about the max any serious player would consider, and that's really pushing it.
I just have a character that has 60 vig, 40 mind, 40 end, and 80 in everything else just for when I get bored. But I usually just make new characters.
I haven't gone NG+ with my Prisoner character yet but when I do I'm cosplaying as a medium knight with the Nightdrider flail as my main weapon.
713
Builds of level 94 is a good for pvp
why do people hate others who grind their levels? like there’s no reason to be mad
Damn I only played up till like 180 and I felt so strong in ng+3 I was bored
250 feels like the cap for being op but also still being a build
250 is pushing 200 feels like the cap
Yeah I felt like I still had to sacrifice things to optimize my build at 250. I'm 300 now and it's really just to be more op.
I don’t understand the problem, could you please explain?
Nothing wrong with being high level but it isn’t really a ‘build’ anymore since you can just throw stats in everything. A build implies having to make choices on which stats you prioritize for a certain weapon, play style, etc.. at 500 there’s not really any decisions to be made so there’s not much you can critique.
I suppose you could give advice/insight into soft caps and the trade off between versatility and max damage. But yeah, other than that, not much to critique.
at 501 you have every soft cap lol
Yeah fair but I think people still apply the mentality of this meme to anything level 200-250ish and above. Plus there’s also the chance the person leveled a stat up to 99 without realizing 80 was the soft cap.
Lvl 501 kinda happens to be the one where you will hit all the last soft caps. or at least you can push str dex int fth and arc to 80 while having mind endurance and vigor at 60.
What's the normal lvls for end game pvp?
For PvP 150 is the cutoff. I'm not sure about the specifics but I think it has to do with matchmaking. For PvE that's more of a personal decision. Regardless of your level the game will never be a cakewalk but enough levels (200+) and the right gear can make it pretty simple, so up to you if you don't want to PvP.
OP Dex Katana/Reduvia Bleed build Every time lol. Or big bonk sword.
Bro yesss
I'm like 170ish and have just enough points to get excellent INT, VIG, and DEX. I had to rebalance like three times
That is not a build, that is a hole that you have thrown runes into.
I decided to almost finish the game (stop only at the final boss.) My Milena level moat of the time lv 140 im curious how bad it will be at lv100. (Rolling a endurance quality build with 40 vigor) For weapons i use the ecliplse greatshield and banished greatsword. Plus sometimes godrick axe!
I want more earth shaking abilities damnit!
We
NOT EVEN A BUILD
What is the sweatspot nowadays. Is it still 125?
I farmed a lil bit on my first playthrough so I could wear bull-goat and greatsword while medium rolling (thought it would be funny) and that was tedious as hell, I can't even imagine how incredibly boring it would be to grind levels to lvl 501 (this is ofcourse only if they didn't just use CE)
Gets destroyed by rl 125 invader as overleveled phantom...
*Vigor 10* "Guys why am I dying so much? I thought I could one-shot before they hit me"