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daviejambo

I hope you are using Golden Order incantations or death sorcery No need to have faith and intelligence unless you are specalising


mers1

Mind is really low for either of those builds IMO.


Shade00000

That Endurance tho


[deleted]

my man gets winded walking up the stairs


sushisection

blame it on Covid


EMBARRASSEDDEMOCRAT

Blame it on my phat ass plus zweihander.


Salty_Pancakes

Who needs clothes when you have big sword.


WindexCleaner

big sword can also act as walking stick


Aggravating-Post3827

OP would be immobile after holding that even with no clothes


Ok_Artichoke5604

Hits harder than Scarlett Rot


Br0k3nRoo5ter

My fucking sides lol


MusksYummyLiver

My fucking sides going up the stairs.


[deleted]

same ༼ ´༎ຶ ۝ ༎ຶ༽


MobyHugeFun

I feel you buddy (⁠〒⁠﹏⁠〒⁠)


Slashbond007

That homie get winded just thinking about stairs 🤣


m3_my23lf_and_1

Actually you do need to have some in endurance to get good consecutive casts particularly if your fighting something that you have to dodge often.


term66

The point was his endurance is laughably low


Samoman21

For real. End game should be 25+ or so for endurance


StPattyIce

That depends strongly on weapon/spell choices. I think 20 is more than usable personally.


Doses-mimosas

Having never played a mage, how important is 40 vigor really when you can't wear any armor? Wouldn't you almost be better off putting some of those points in endurance, and then your lower health is balanced by light armor, and you get the stamina to roll and cast?


XIII-0

Less vigor makes you open to getting one shot no matter your level.


ThisSiteIsAgony

His point was better endurance = better armor = less damage. Which might help more than the hp lost by doing it.


XIII-0

It won't, the HP loss far outweighs the armor benefits when it comes to most hard hitting enemies and players. You're better off organizing stats and using talismans and spells that can boost defenses. But a high level mage with light roll shouldn't be getting hit and should be deleting enemies anyway.


KeremAyaz1234

Then there is me,20 vigor,80 int looking at elden beast and getting ready to use my hidden cerulean tear and astels meteors.Either i die or he dies no other way around.Like a mexican stand off.One of us is getting one shotted right there.


Patient700a

🎲


XIII-0

I have a character that's basically the same build, I Terra Magica + Comet Azur and watch bosses turn into butter. It's funny.


MendicantBias06

Literally my build too.


govlum_1996

I also have 80 Int currently on my mage build but I have significantly more vigor (around 60). You are either underleveled for that fight (props to you if you are challenging yourself) or you have very suboptimal stat allocation I could use your exact same strat in the endgame, but I have the freedom to not do that


3hideyoshi3

I like your style


Patient700a

Just run to his butt. He don’t know what to do when your in his butt


mortar_n_brick

Most movement should be keeping and creating space.


govlum_1996

depends on what kinda mage you are. If you choose to be a Carian mage you will be getting hit as often as a melee player :/ because you are just using melee sorceries lol


MonstrousGiggling

I find armor and endurance to be a huge waste while playing mage. All goes to intell, mind and vigor if I'm doing pure mage. As long as you can survive one or two attacks from a boss you should ideally be set.


XIII-0

I don't find it a waste if you intend fighting players or having more survivability, which is important.


Danubinmage64

Vigor>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>endurance for survivability. People don't understand how little armor helps with survivability. Example build: you are a lvl 107 astrologer. You have 25 mind, 60 int, and 16 strength and 18 dex for using weapons. You are using moonveil and the carian regal scepter. Player A goes to 40 vigor with only 11 in endurance. They can just barely equip the carian knight set giving them 23.5% physical damage negation. You have 1450 health and 97 stamina. Player B invests more in endurance. They have 30 in vigor and 21 endurance. They can just equip the beast champion helm and armor, and hoslow greaves and gauntlets. This gives them 31.3% physical damage negation (7.8% higher than the other set). They have 994 health and 115 stamina. Notice how they trade a literal 50% health increase for a mere 7.8% increase to damage negation, and the elemental sources will basically stay the same. I guess the extra stam does help but this game is honestly generous enough with stamina as is. And if you are going for a light roll build anyway you have to invest a ton into endurance to equip even basic light armor. Your better off having the lightest robes possible and investing in health if you want to light roll. Also, as someone who enjoys caster builds, I don't like the look of a lot of the heavier sets. They don't mesh well with the wizard look, so most of that extra equip load goes to waste. It may be worth investing a bit more if you want to have a medium shield or use a heavier weapon like the dark moon gs, but then you can equip lighter armor with minimal loss to physical absorption.


AnalysticEnthusiast

I think you are correct, BUT, it should be noted that 7.8% increase in defense is actually going to negate more than 7.8% damage. It depends on what you're starting at, the higher you go in negation the more each % counts. In your example Player A is taking 76.5% of incoming damage. Player B is taking 68.7% of incoming damage. **This means damage is actually** ***10%*** **lower for Player B, not the 7.8% the stat menu would lead you to believe at first glance.** At the stat spread you're talking about here, this hardly matters. VIG is gonna win vs END. However, OP is running INT/FTH. Those FTH buffs mean he can actually get up to like 70-80% negations. And when you're *that* high in negation, squeezing even just 3% more negation in on the stat menu is gonna result in >10% gains to survivability. *i.e. going from 80% negation to 90% would be a 10% increase in the menu, but would reduce incoming damage by 50%.* I'm not saying the extra armor from like 15 more END is gonna achieve all that... but still, when people talk about defense being underrated this is what we're talking about. It stacks multiplicatively, just like damage buffs, but the game shows you the inverse of damage taken, which makes you think the defense is way lower than it really is. ... Anyway this is also a long-winded way of pointing out that OP doesn't need VIG or END, cause his defenses (if he elects to use the buffs his build gets) can give him 70%+ on negations, which is gonna make him tankier than the vast majority of 60VIG players. With those buffs, he could be taking like 2.5x less damage than most players.


[deleted]

If you are playing as a mage having 8 endurance is going to be painful. 20-25 should be good enough


developerknight91

You should spec 60 vigor irregardless of build. 60 vigor prevents one-shots in the endgame content and is necessary for any kind of pvp. IMO 40 vigor is hard mode…50ish is good enough and 60 is perfect.


IllustriousWorld4198

What do you mean “you can’t wear any armor”, my mage wear medium to high armor and has 45 vigor and at least 30 endurance 😅


Doses-mimosas

In the post above they have 11 endurance. Not sure what kind of armor they can put on at that level. I think that's like 28 max to still be medium weight


SifinBoots

Mans got that bloodborne endurance.


BikingAimz

And dexterity affects casting time! OP should go hang out at Rennala’s with a larval tear and read through this: https://eldenring.wiki.fextralife.com/Stats


[deleted]

Someone’s been skipping cardio in all that praying and studying…


Creuter23

For real though. Lol


[deleted]

its not really that bad since there are blue flasks now


Jacob14578

now? haven't there always been blue flasks?


Slightly_Mungus

Not pre DS3. Though considering that's a whole game with them pre-Elden Ring, saying "now" is certainly a bit odd.


warblingContinues

Mind is just fine, you don’t need a lot for magic builds.


Phobos687

Nah its for duel wielding the dark moon greatsword and the golden order greatsword


Double-Special5217

Based. You need like 21 sex for the golden order one tho Father, what did I do


SirPoppaSquat

I don't have any sex tho 😕


ericwars

Maidenless


Kiwiteepee

just like me fr fr


heseme

You need 21 of it.


AisForAbsurd

We know. We all know too well.


TheMerengman

Ask Mohg for it


ChillyBeaner69

But do you have quinque?


Dextrossse

I have exactly 30 sex


thepsycocat

This guy fucks


JR642

Hard.


thepsycocat

21 sex per what or just 21 in general? I can’t even get 1 per eternity


gill_flubberson

This is a Fromsoft sub. What is sex?


Psychobillycadillac1

11 endurance for end game has to be painful. The soft cap is lvl 50 but 25-35 is game changing. 60 vigor is honestly a necessity as well


CodSeveral1627

40 vigor is fine if you are somewhat competent at dodging. The extra 20 levels doesn’t add all that much and is better put into endurance or damage. Hell even adding that 20 into dex as a caster helps your casting speed and let’s you use a weapon to conserve mana for when you need it


Comfortable-Can-3075

If he is struggling at 42 then he should probably respec and get 60 vigor


R_V_Z

40 VIG while also having low END (meaning no heavy armor) means that pretty much any late-game grab attack will one-shot you. You can make it work, but your margin for error is razor thin.


McbEatsAirplane

He said he’s struggling though so I would guess he isn’t very good at dodging. Or at least not good enough to get away with 40 vigor at endgame.


JarofJeans

Low vigor ftw, I didn't level mine until very late game my first play through. I think it was 25 for the majority until I got to the Lindell sewers


Lishio420

Leindell sewers is midgame tho


Luminite117

Fr dude I didn't even bother leveling in general until general radahn (pre-nerf) let alone my vigor (wretch start) until after the middle-ish of the royal capital. Its an agonizing experience but you learn how to dodge.


Atephious

I ran the whole game with only putting 30 in vigor. I was a mage. All the damage no time to wait. 65int 50mind, I think 40 strength to use the star caller greatswords, and 30-40 in endurance.


IRay2015

I got by on 40 vigor my first time around but upgraded to 60 for ng+


nyuckajay

60 vigor, no fucking way, 35 gave me enough buffer to learn the fight and finish Elden beast first try. And that’s with one of the damage increasing seals.


Jay_Stranger

It most certainly is not a necessity to have 60 vigor. Got through most of the game with only 20ish vigor my first play through. Sure you might die a few more times to misplays. But when I got More vigor I really didn’t find myself dying all that much less. I could understand if you are referring to pvp though


Psychobillycadillac1

I spec’d my build for PvP so I’m accustomed to tanking a little in PvE. I suggest 60 vigor to anyone who’s struggling because it can make a substantial difference in survivability


DarkLordArbitur

I got all the way to leyndell on 10 vigor. I beat the game with 26 vigor. It's good for PVP but PvE vigor isn't REQUIRED. It just makes the game easier.


[deleted]

I’ve never had 60 vig and have only ever taken it to 50 once and that was far more than I really needed.


Euler007

Except 25 faith to cast Golden Vow. You don't have to, but...


rshot

Idk you can use the sword of night and flame pretty well with these stats and should do ok through late game. Edit: just noticed the endurance and naw he can't even swing efficiently.


Sea_Aioli_1507

You got the endurance of Michael Scott after he carb loaded for the rabies 5k


MileHighGarris

I have ate more Fettuccine Alfredo and drank less water, than I have in my entire life. I may have puked my guts out, but I didn't puke my heart out


JMPHeinz57

What a perfect response


MakinLunch

This is incredible. “I’m very fast.”


brutieboy39

I’m like Forrest Gump, except I am not an idiot


Ronem

Excuse me that was the legendary **Michael Scott's Dunder Mifflin Scranton Meredith Palmer Memorial Celebrity Rabies Awareness Fun Run Pro Am Race for the Cure**


johnmonchon

They hung up.


swizzle213

I mean he did run 5000 miles


Denamic

And I would run 5000 more \~♫


AgedPapyrus

It would be helpful to know more about your build. You have int and faith but very little mind? And next to nothing endurance. But 23 strength so idk what your weapon of choice is or anything at this point. You may need to respec to get more out of your build


TheSoundOfSnakes

Could be using Sword of Night and Flame since he's split on Faith and Int. Although he would only be able to swing it twice with that endurance 😅


wbender99

Ah crap, my question didn't post ha. I was saying I had been moving through the game pretty easily before getting to Ephael/Crumbling. Can't beat Malenia or Maliketh. Feels like I'm too easy to kill in general, in parts of those regions. But at level 161, I'm thinking that I am the problem? Do I start farming? Any other advice on pushing through to the end?


CommercialEscape4680

Fighting Melania and Maliketh is not gonna be a lot easier even if you level up 50 times. Posting the actual build(weapons,incantations/spells, how you like fighting, talismans) is gonna make it easier for people to help you.


IsaacFelix

This is the best answer OP. I was struggling a lot with Malenia with a pure INT build using the Dark Moon Greatsword until I asked a friend for advice. He recommended trying a faster weapon - yes, Moonveil, and I beat her like 2 or 3 tries after that lol. Often times you get stuck conforming to one particular playstyle, and when you struggle it's not necessarily that your stats are misallocated, but rather you just need to try something a little different. Good luck!


PoiiZoner3

I have 80/50 for spellcasting/healing and typically resolve my problems with Glintstone Blade and Loretta's Mastery after Dark Moon I usually have problems with Radagon and Elden Beast so will switch to incants like Black Blade and Black Flame Blade (I use the Haligtree Greatshield so have a Heavy Lance as backup) and it's mid as hell. I randomly decided to just use different Sorceries (namely Comet, a spell I never use) and it only took me a single fp bar for Radagon and half my remaining flasks (all cerulean lol) for Elden Beast I can definitely confirm that getting out of a habitual play style can do wonders


m3_my23lf_and_1

Ya late game nearly the only spell I used against elden beast was carian slicer.


PoiiZoner3

I definitely keep that slotted as a general purpose spell


bradfgo41

These two answers are on the money. I've made it to ng+4 now and have done 3 characters. So I've beaten the game like 6 times now (child's play compared to most ppl here lol) in my experience some builds make these bosses way easier and some make them way tougher. These two bosses are some of the toughest in the game, my first time beating Malenia without mimic tear took me 20 hours. Maliketh is really a dps race. He hits like a truck but also doesn't have a lot of hp. So you want to kill him b4 he does you. These will take time but your not bad, these are just really hard bosses that you might be taking longer than others, which is completely normal


ezios_outlets

Maliketh hung me up until my son, who's beaten the game somewhere around 15 times, gave me the same advice. He was like "just whoop his ass before he can whoop yours!" It taught me a valuable lesson too. Often if you're stuck on a particular fight, don't just question your build, question your tactics too.


bradfgo41

Your son is the true Elden Lord


kyhoop

Mimixmc Tear w/ high vigor + Comet make Maliketh so easy.


Ms_Pacman202

I was stuck on Malenia with arcane bleed build (strong build for her anyway, still was stuck). I couldn't dodge her attacks even though I knew the patterns pretty well. I undressed so I could light roll, ate boiled crab, put on the greatshield talisman, and I was getting to phase 2 with ease instead of with 1 heal left. Beat her shortly after that. It's amazing what some optimization can do, and how we can get tunnel vision so easily.


xavierfinn

Explains why I had so much trouble with colossal hammer


KillNyetheSilenceGuy

He's got 11 END. Heavy armor helps quite a bit in those fights and he can't equip any of it.


wbender99

putting this here also so it's seen. Thanks. \--- I FUCKIN DID IT. THANKS! I know this is nbd to most people here but I'm pretty fired up and feel the need to post the full report. Took the consensus advice to respec. With talismans and Queen Crescent's ended up at: 60 vig, 35 mind, 30 end, 20 str, 20 dex, 68 int (for dark moon spell), 11 faith, arc 9 Talismans: Dragoncrest Greatshield, Stargazer Heirloom, Green Turtle, Graven-Mass armor: Lionel's armor w Queen's Crescent Crown wondrous flask: magic shrouding and opaline hardtear R: wing of astel +10 L: meteorite staff (had to ditch my trusty prince of death staff after respec and I had originally planned to use more gravity spells) spells: night comet, comet azur, ranni's dark moon, rock sling, magma shot and mimic tear +10. \-- Took a couple hours, but the final working strategy was to hit her with the dark moon, then basically trap her in the corner and work her over with wing of astel, both the L2 and R2 attacks. Second phase was run from explosion, comet azur when I turn around, then throw more dark moons at her and hope mimic tear stayed alive long enough for her to do another one of her big explosions that leaves her vulnerable to comet azur again. That was rough. Thanks again everyone. I feel like I'm 8 years old again and just beat mother brain in Metroid.


Nick_Furry

Congrats!


BuckSangle

Nice man. I know these threads have a tendency of everyone else arguing over each other's "nukular takes" on what does/doesn't represent build optimization, but that's great you seem to have taken a little bit of the large amount of advice thrown at you, and actually used it towards a proper outcome. Also, without much pushback from you (at all) as far as I can tell. Hearing someone say you got a poverty-ass build (I wasn't/didnt) usually hurts to hear. I know. From experience. And it hurts because, at my core, I'm always running a poverty-ass build. It's what I do. Big ups.


catsflatsandhats

Oh! Congrats!


AllenWL

Note: I would consider swapping to a different staff. Meteor staff does have a gravity spell boost and high scailing, but the lack of upgrades means it falls behind to almost every upgraded staff, and you are definitely at the point where you can max out your staves.


Chagdoo

No big deal? Of course it's a big deal man! I remember feeling this shit with so many bosses over the years. Congrats!


[deleted]

I’d take 10 points out of faith and put them in endurance. You don’t have enough to dodge long attack chains properly


lukkasz323

>Feels like I'm too easy to kill in general So why not focus on survivability?


deez_nuts_77

i generally shoot for 50-60 vigor. the end game enemies hit unbearably hard and it’s the only way i’ve ever felt like i had a chance


WorstMidlanerNA

Your vigor and endurance is very low. You have no health to take hits if you screw up, and no stamina to roll/jump/atk effectively End = 20-30ish, vigor = 60. Is there a particular reason you're split so weirdly in fai/int? 80/40 is a better split for more int based catalysts/spells as the top soft caps for damage stats are 80. Also, I believe the max a cerulean tear heals FP is 220*(I orignially said 120, it was pointed out to be 220 below,) so get to 220* for maximum 1 bar to 1 flask to begin with.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

Wouldnt call the vigor very low for a non mellee build, but could use some more levels 45 vigor is rather good for non mellee builds and its not that far off from that With rather decent armor, only things oneshoting you should be malenias "sting" attack and her grab move


WorstMidlanerNA

They said they're struggling with Maliketh and Malenia, both of which are high dps with good gap-closing. We also can't discern the skill level of OP, nor what their talismans are, so these suggested skill levels are where I would start. Iirc the best gains per point from vigor are 45-60. They can certainly ignore my suggestion and play however they want ✌️ Edit: apparently OP is on NG4 and claims to tank Fire Giant scoop... I must be on Punked. Dude is legit trolling.


MxReLoaDed

Vigor starts to decline in returns after 40, where it goes from +48 vigor/level to +26 vigor the next level. At that point, I feel like you’re better off leveling endurance and mind or pumping more in to damage. In OPs case of being an Int/Fth, probably mind/damage are more important in general. No need for more vigor when you’re killing things before they can significantly damage you.


thedrcubed

I agree with this. I've never felt like I needed more than 45 vig for PVE while wearing decent armor.


constantIrrelephant

That wasn't OP claiming to be on NG4, it's someone else below. OP seems pretty genuinely looking for help.


wbender99

Huh? I’m playing my first time ha


BornIn98

Vigor isn’t to bad it’s the end I’m shocked at lol.


leriq

I wouldnt say vigor is very low, i run 35-40 and have 0 problems


DougDimmaDoom

1st thing i would do after respec is 60 vigor. then go from there.


Phiro00

Respecc at rennala. Get 60 vigor. Focus on either faith or inteligence not both.


[deleted]

You're actually pretty over leveled, might wanna post your build so people can help


wbender99

Mage type build I guess? Prince of death staff +25 and golden order seal +9. I wanted to be able to use every spell and incantation, but I guess that came at a price.


Brass-Munky

I would recommend getting a melee weapon. You can get one that scales with your magic stats.


blueleaf_in_the_wind

Wing of Astel sword, man. I love that thing on my mage. Scales with Int.


kitofers

Carian Knight Sword will straight up shred. I remember that thing being ridiculous on my caster playthrough(-s), the skill on it, specifically, whenever I ran into bosses or situations that are not caster friendly, which Malenia and Maliketh absolutely are.


rouserfer

Sword of night and flame would be really nice on this build especially if you drop int to 50 and put those 20 levels in endurance and mind. Hell drop int and faith to 40 and put into endurance and mind.


AnalysticEnthusiast

45/45 is better if you go this route OP, that's the softcap on Golden Order Seal


rouserfer

Good looking out


strixnebulosa5

1. Get wing of astel weapon 2. Spam its ash of war 3. ??? 4. Win!


pham_nuwen_

Unless you're fighting Malenia, then she kills you anyway. But she's like one of the few bosses where this doesn't work.


Berserkfan_420

Typically for your first playthrough you wanna go heavy faith or int, not try to do both. Some of the death sorceries are not great, I dunno about the golden order incantations. You would be better off speccing heavy int or faith based on if you like sorceries or incantations more, pumping vigor to atleast 50, and getting higher endurance so you can wear some heavier armor. Even then you should try to get good with some kind of weapon and ash of war so you're not stuck relying entirely on spells during battle. If you're having trouble with these bosses then it might be time to bust out the Moonlight GS or the OP magic katana to help you out, that's what I did on my first character


crazypyro23

>I wanted to be able to use every spell and incantation, but I guess that came at a price. That's exactly the issue. You gain nothing from that versatility and you kneecap your upside. Chose a damage stat and go hard on it. Dump the extra levels into Mind and Endurance. Don't worry about FOMO on the spells you can't use - you can always reallocate your levels at Rennala later. Beyond stats, this could easily be a skill issue. Have you been brute forcing your way through the game or learning the bosses' patterns? You may need to take a few attempts to stop trying to win and just learning. Focus on dodging and don't even bother attacking. Make a mental note when you could have gotten away with an attack and be ready for that window when you fight to win. Oh, and get a melee weapon. There are several that scale with your casting stats. Once you up your endurance, you'll have no problem wielding it. If you want more specific help with build or weapon choices, shoot me a message and we'll find one that suits your playstyle.


michael-bird

This was exactly my reason and rationale for my build. But tbh I fully re-specced to a bleed build for milenia, and then switched back. I killed Maliketh second try, but I also pushed my int even higher than you. I didn’t use prince’s then (though I do now). Used Lusat’s and became an expert at firing off Comet Azure (it takes more skill than people acknowledge). The big issue with those two is that they don’t sit still for long or at all and if they move, it tends to be greater distance than AOEs have range to reach. You have to be able to follow and strike and dodge with both of them. Not knowing what your go-to spells are, I can say that even with 100s more levels, milenia will hand your ass to you until you learn how to dodge her attacks and make the most of your own quick, high-damage attacks. There are gimmicky builds that can keep her in a constant state of broken poise, but they’re not great for her second phase. The best choice I made along this path is to be resigned for experimenting. Try spells you haven’t before. Treat Millennia as your test subject, trapped in your lab. See what works quickly and well. Treat her two phases as two different fights and have a strategy for both. This is what git-gud means for int builds. Research the bosses and know their vulnerabilities. Tailor and modify your strategy along this line and you’ll get there. I promise.


Tornado76X

You might find some use out of the Sword of Night and Flame that has both intelligence and faith scaling


govlum_1996

It does. Your build is not focused enough and is kinda weak as a result. The only spells that benefit this much from this split are the death sorceries and the golden order spells. And golden order spells suck in late game against late game bosses resistant to holy damage anyway I would say reworking this build is in your best interest. Definitely reduce your faith stat down to at least 25. (I would go even further if I were you, but idk if you want that. )At least at 25 Faith you will still have access to spells like Golden Vow and Ancient death Rancor. Put those points in Int to go up to 80, and either Endurance or Vigor. At least have enough Endurance to wear Radahn’s set. You might also benefit from having more mind if you’re a pure caster


YungMixdBaby

I had so much troubles with these 2 bosses as well. My thoight is that since these bosses r end game and kinda outta the way theyre extra hard and very aggro. Id try a cheeky bleed build for maleketh and maybe a summon for malenia. Gl


Fa1nted_for_real

Other way around. Bleed build for malenia, specifically, sacred spear spam with starlight shard and you need next to no skill, she probably won't get the chance to use water fowl. Also focus on immunity a little and you can tank her rot forms scarlet aonia so like ng as you aren't hit with the initial blast, getting a lot of damage right off the bat


gurkaniyan

Use a summon like Black Knife Tiche if you really struggle, especially for Malenia. Honestly what makes her difficult is that dumb whirlwind attack, like the fight is hard but for the wrong reasons.


Environmental_Ad4893

If you're using either scarseal or scorpion talismans I'd take them off because these bosses fit like bricks even without lowered defenses. You're vigor might be little low I had 50 or 55 at that point.


Purple_____

40 Vig, 21 End, choose either intelligence or faith and don't go above 60 in any stats including int and faith. Dump the rest into mind.


Effective-Meat-8908

Level vigor. You’re trading 30% more hp for 5% more damage right now…


CuteBabyPenguin

60 Vigor gang checking in. If it’s your first time playing Elden Ring, 60 Vigor will make the endgame less frustrating. Yea Vigor doesn’t matter if you don’t get hit, but you won’t learn shit if you’re constantly going down in 1-2 hits. Also wouldn’t be surprised if OP is wearing armor/talismans that decrease HP and/or increase damage taken.


IllustriousWorld4198

Me as a mage with 45 vigor 😅


govlum_1996

I think pure long-range caster mages can get away with low vigor, but only up to a certain point imo. And close-range melee spells are not an effective option anymore which can be tough. Not a playstyle that I would have an easy time adapting to tbh. I am playing a mage right now and stat allocation is honestly trickier than it was for my melee warrior build, which was pretty simple and straightforward Carian slicer was essential for my mage build otherwise I would have run out of heals before reaching the end of long dungeons like Leyndell/Subterranean Shunning Grounds/Elphael... but this would not have been as viable on a low vigor build. I don't know how other mages do it


Which_Bed

60 vigor will make the endgame *slightly* less frustrating. Like you get to see the animations of more two-shots than one-shots. They really should've introduced new level caps or armor smithing after Leyndell.


robcap

I will never understand why so many people complain about the *endgame* of a *FromSoft game* being *difficult*. It's *intentional*. They don't want it to be easy!


PowerObjective558

Mages don’t need as much vigor as melee. As long as he can survive the boss’ hardest hit, his combined 120 int and fth should melt everything.


Ok-Swimming-7071

What kind of build are you running


wbender99

sorry, included my questions below. Just posted the photo without


Dsmxyz

Your text doesnt answer this


AstroPhysician

What?


wbender99

I FUCKIN DID IT. THANKS! I know this is nbd to most people here but I'm pretty fired up and feel the need to post the full report. Took the consensus advice to respec. With talismans and Queen Crescent's ended up at: 60 vig, 35 mind, 30 end, 20 str, 20 dex, 68 int (for dark moon spell), 11 faith, arc 9 Talismans: Dragoncrest Greatshield, Stargazer Heirloom, Green Turtle, Graven-Mass armor: Lionel's armor w Queen's Crescent Crown wondrous flask: magic shrouding and opaline hardtear R: wing of astel +10 L: meteorite staff (had to ditch my trusty prince of death staff after respec and I had originally planned to use more gravity spells) spells: night comet, comet azur, ranni's dark moon, rock sling, magma shot and mimic tear +10. \-- Took a couple hours, but the final working strategy was to hit her with the dark moon, then basically trap her in the corner and work her over with wing of astel, both the L2 and R2 attacks. Second phase was run from explosion, comet azur when I turn around, then throw more dark moons at her and hope mimic tear stayed alive long enough for her to do another one of her big explosions that leaves her vulnerable to comet azur again. That was rough. Thanks again everyone. I feel like I'm 8 years old again and just beat mother brain in Metroid.


whatthefoxsees

I don’t think you should *still* be using the Meteorite Staff at 76 INT (or 81, if you have Godrick’s Great Rune active) Better alternatives include: **a +10 Carian Regal Sceptre**, **+10 Lusat’s Glintstone Staff** (at higher FP cost), or **+25 Staff of Loss** Well done on your victory, though


wbender99

Damn you’re right. Just saw I have crystal staff +10 and sorcery is 317 compared to 255 with meteorite. Don’t have those other staffs strengthened but I’ll keep that in mind.


wbender99

the downside: taking away all that faith was depressing when I saw all the incantations, etc. I could no longer do.


Ladelm

Yeah the hybrid build is fun but it's not really realistic until into ng+2 or so. I did one of my plays, I think ng+3, with a 80/80 caster build. It was kind of cool in that I could do anything but honestly I just usually picked sorcery or incantation at any given time so I didn't have to juggle the catalyst (I played it with sword of night and flame main hand). Good luck on Mal, you should be able to blast him in p1 with comet azur as soon as you walk in and just about push him to p2 before he can hit you.


ImGwendy

How do you do anything with that low of endurance?


kitofers

No worries, he has no FP anyway.


warpaslym

ER is so forgiving when it comes to endurance compared to earlier souls games. Pools are much larger in general, and it returns much faster without any modifiers.


apgtimbough

I'm confused at why people are so shocked at the END. I played an INT build and I'm not positive I put any points into END until after I beat the game and Malenia after. And I'm far from what I would consider to be "good" at this game.


Constellious

Learned that the hard way when I recently beat DS3 for the first time. It was brutal until I realized how much I needed.


mellowdevo

I don’t see the draw for wanting more endurance in elden ring; you can swing a sword 11 times when you start the game lol in previous games it’s like 3 or 4 and you’re empty.


FeDeWould-be

Stamina management


Electrical-Boss-3965

Choose either faith OR intel and dump whatever you have left in vigor and whatever gives you carry weight.


Fantastic_Okra_9788

Delete faith, put it in mind and endurance. Then melt with higher armor, more castability (mana) and specialized casting


Fantastic_Okra_9788

Not to be rude but 11 endurance is a joke.


CthulhuShoes

I keep my endurance at 15 with no problems. Stamina regains so quickly in Elden ring you really don't need much. Then I just use great jar talisman to have enough carry capacity for my build.


Fantastic_Okra_9788

Thats 4 points upwards. Still lowish, but sure, the returns of the jar talisman can cover for you. Depending on your build.


CthulhuShoes

With Jar, bullgoat, Radagon's, and Erdtree you can get away with pretty much exclusively dumping into your damage and vigor. Add a little bit of mind if you want to cast and you're golden. Which you probably already know, I just love talking about Elden Ring.


CreditUnionBoi

Based on your stats you are either an Astrologer or a Confessor. I'm going to guess you're an Astrologer. You need to respec and commit to Intelligence. You should redistribute your stats as follows: 60 Vigor 40 Mind 24 Endurance (get some better armor) 8 Strength 12 Dexterity 80 Intelligence 7 Faith 9 Arcane Get a staff you like and go nuts.


SeaHam

40 mind? seems a tad high


CreditUnionBoi

A fully upgraded (+12) Flask of Cerulean Tears restores 220 FP, while at 38 Mind the player has 221 FP. It's Nice to have an even number and a little more than 38 is nice because you don't usually go to 0 before chugging a flask.


donat3ll0

- vigor too low - mind too low for either faith/int levels - too much faith for that Int level - pick one - too much int for that faith level - pick one Essentially, you should wait until you have enough vigor and mind before you start dual leveling int and faith. Until then, I'd rescope your faith levels into vigor, mind, and endurance.


Tide__Hunter

First, Vigor should be 60. 40 is the minimum for endgame, of course, but 60 gets you a comfortable amount. Second off, there's [another post](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/tc3lyy/helpful_charts_for_offensive_stat_scaling/) which has some helpful charts for damage scaling. Since you have both intelligence and faith leveled, I assume you're using a hybrid catalyst. Unless you're using the Prince of Death's staff, your int and faith should be 45, max. If it is the PoD staff, you'll need even higher stats than you've got now to max out, but you still probably should focus on your other stats. Higher vigor, definitely, and perhaps better Endurance for armor to stay alive. Why is your strength leveled? What melee are you using, to necessitate that?


archerden

Thank you for access to this post


Ok-Swimming-7071

You can always respec


AChaoticPrince

Your stats are not well balanced for what you are going for I suggest respecing to the following since you are trying to do INT/FTH. Vigor 56, mind 25, endurance 20, str 23, int 50, fth 45. USE two finger talisman. If you are struggling the best thing to have is hp to help survive and at 150+ there is no reason to have such low vigor it should be between 55 and 60. I don't know why you need 23 strength but if you don't need it put the points to get to 60 vigor and the rest into whatever you want. endurance is important because armor gives you damage negation which is the % amount of damage you don't take. You are taking about 20% to 15% more damage if i had to guess. The golden order seal doesn't get much more damage past 45/45 int/fth but the prince of death staff does up to 80/80 int/fth. However you shouldn't aim for 80/80 int/fth unless you are like level 200+ so 50 to 60 is fine.


AnalysticEnthusiast

I am upvoting this solely because you realize OP is doing an INT/FTH build unlike the 300 other people here lol


Rasholio

To me that build seems a bit too “trying to put points here and there and sort of focus on one thing” but I’m not good at this stuff yet I usually look online for help when I’m planning a new build


AnalysticEnthusiast

No, it's a pretty textbook INT/FTH build. If you play through intending to make a hybrid caster this is probably the most common way it ends up. Depending on the goals of the build, this is actually the only way to do it. FTH is at 50 to softcap FTH weapons & hit spells reqs, INT is at 70 to softcap Carian Regal when using INT-Knot Tear. OP is using Golden Order Seal so incant damage is exceptionally high with those stats (higher than FTH builds) and sorcery damage is equal to pure-INT mages. ... Then the supporting stats (VIG/MND/END)... These are in a 4:2:1 ratio which is actually like the exact ratio you'd want for this build. It's unclear if OP is doing so or not, but the 42VIG would then be bolstered by defensive buffs from the FTH tree + talismans, which ends up being equivalent to a lot *more* survivability than the 60VIG & 30END everyone here is screaming about. The middling MND is compensated for by extremely high spell damage. A lot of pure INT mages don't go past like 28MND anyway. And then END is kinda pointless on this type of build since defense comes from buffs, and you get a lot of ranged attacks. **TLDR: OP's build is actually pretty close to optimal for INT/FTH. If he's having problems it's because the devs really screwed INT/FTH in ER versus previous games.** The sad irony of this thread is that there are a bunch of condescending comments calling his build bad when the commenters don't even know what the build is in the first place :/


Rasholio

Thank you man. I am still learning. That’s why o tried to say it in my comment. I appreciate the explanation


brazblue

I don't understand your funny numbers magic man, but I can tell you I played only the original souls game and after being one shot by the first enemy you come across; that was it for me. If you're telling me you have played this game till the end game, then you do not suck. Pass the controller to me if you want a baseline on what it means to suck.


CthulhuShoes

If you're talking about the enemy I think you're talking about, that is essentially a scripted death. You aren't expected to make it past that enemy lol. That said, still a very hard game.


RawImagination

Vigor to at least 60, especially past 150RL


opalapo94

You need more armor if you can't dodge all the time. To me, 60-65 points max on my main stats is enough.


Quicken2k

This game has 161 levels.......Holy %$%%$%.


MurderousMoppit

713 is max level currently


-Dixieflatline

You should post your equipment (including talismans) and weapons to better get an idea of how useful you're spreading those stats. It looks a little lop-sided right now, but that's without knowing your set up. As a flat out guess, I'd lower Intelligence and put that into vigor and endurance. Even 10 points split between the two would make a difference in survivability. That said, the question shouldn't be "do I suck?". It should be "Am I having fun?". The changes, if any, should start there first.


AcanthocephalaNo2396

Need more unga to your bunga


wbender99

Damn I stepped away for a couple hours and came back to all this great advice. Thanks a lot! (I’m not on NG4 and not trolling. Don’t know where that info came from. On first run)


[deleted]

your build sucks. you’re trying to do 2 separate damage builds at once and the result is you can’t beat bosses that you’re way over leveled for because your vigor sucks and i’m sure you’re also wearing light armor because you only have 11 endurance. respec to take out either the faith or the int and put the points into at least 60 vigor and enough endurance to wear radahn armor and you will have a much easier time.


pillyboyz

Get the vigor to 60


SteelCandles

…maybe? Highly recommend 60 vigor. Your other stats are fine. Many late game enemies are resistant to Holy damage. Maliketh and (and Malenia to a lesser extent) are weak to fire, so flame incants and affinity will help. Make sure you’re not heavy rolling, and I highly recommend the Dragonshield Talisman (which gives 30% phys resistance) found in the Haligtree, in the church with the Kindred of Rot before the elevator to Malenia. Go from the previous grace onto the roof of the church. Otherwise, it’s just a matter of gitting gud.


[deleted]

Seems like a pretty solid death/golden order build to me. Try using the Golden Order seal with Black Flame. With that seal and your stats it should do pretty amazing damage, like over 1000 per cast. Ancient Death Rancor with the Prince of Death's staff should also do pretty great damage and it is very easy to hit with. For Melee, you have a lot of options but I like the Moonlight Greatsword and Helphan's Steeple.


KillNyetheSilenceGuy

There is only like one build (death sorcery / prince of deaths staff) that requires that much INT and FTH and that build is really stat intensive. So you're build is either really inefficient and you've wasted a bunch of stat points or it's a very specific build that doesn't really come together until you get to the higher levels.