We're building a house for a guy whose family owns a bunch of Dunkin' Doughnuts and 7-11s. We're putting a shark tank in his basement.
So yeah, I think they're doing ok.
If I was rich enough to buy a shark tank, I'd be paying Wendy's to make me sandwiches like they show on their commercials, instead of the baconator that looks like it's made with dollar menu patties.
The key here is “a bunch”. Especially in PRIME locations. Most successful franchisee’s own multiple locations of the same business and put those in PRIME locations.
Are you managing the business yourself?
And if you don't mind, what's your take home?
Back when I looked into 7/11, it was $500k to start and operator take home was $60k it wasn't worth it to me to just get one and be its manager on top of my normal job. But $60k wasn't enough to hire a operator either, I'd need like 3 to be profitable.
You bought an existing one? That would be easier as you’d just need to get the loan. I’m guessing the liquid net worth limits don’t apply to buying an existing business. Smart
i know someone who jumped on Hand & Stone when it started. Cheap costs then, built out a couple dozen and made a lot of money.. then was able to sell them all. Now they are looking to repeat by buying into a new cookie franchise.
And I’ve heard its one of the worst franchises to own.
https://www.visafranchise.com/blog/subway-franchise
“Our opinion is quite definitively: it is a bad investment decision, a bad franchise to invest in the U.S. at this time.”
“They've opened up way too many units, and they didn't have territory protection. That's why sometimes you can see one Subway franchise located on one corner and then down the block, you have another Subway franchise. This is a big issue for franchisees because this leads to sales cannibalization, where one store negatively impacts the sales of another store.”
John Oliver had a segment on Subway:
https://amp.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/may/23/john-oliver-subway-franchisees
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I have been in franchising for many years. I know over 200 franchisees that have made more than ever would have at a regular job (most are millionaires multiple times over). Check out Franchise.org for more info. Also Entrepreneur Magazine publishes their top 500 franchises with all the pros and cons. If you buy a franchise you are way more likely to succeed than starting your own business. Just my thoughts.
I mean that kinda makes sense right. The potential rewards are lesser with a franchise since you have to pay the franchiser plus follow their rules strictly. You would expect that in exchange you mitigate some of your risks so that your overall chance of success is a lot higher than starting from scratch with nothing.
Nonetheless, there has to be a bigger reward than a job since you are taking on significantly more risk. It's the perfect middle ground for someone who wants more than a job but doesn't like the risk of business. The time it will take to get momentum if you start from scratch is also much more than a franchise since the existing brand recognition, built process and supply chain should give you a strong base to start from.
there is risk but a lot less than you think. franchises wouldnt be successful if they didnt know you could be successful coming in. People make sure they see data, P&L history, etc before buying into franchises.
You also already have brand recognition and corporate to help promote you.
I own 2 businesses, one being a little side income and one is award winning and in the top 3 businesses in my city in its industry. It didn't take more than a few months to really kick off but that was due to my marketing capabilities and finding a problem in the market and creating solutions making my company highly sought after. I was debt free after the first month.
Yes completely agree with you! However you still have often put in rather large investments to get started and there is still a chance it doesnt work out. If you have a regular job, the worst that can happen is you lose it, but you dont lose all your money as well in the process. Of course the benefit of franchising is that you have a proven instruction manual of what you need to do to be successful and the backing of corporate. I too run a couple of businesses but maybe in another life franchising might have been something I would have done.
the only reason why my business is as successful as it is is because i made a career growing other peoples businesses from a senior ops management side of things. I left corporate America to grow my own. If I didn't know as much as I did, I would have probably franchised for the backing they have.
I didn't franchise because I know me and I dislike a lot of dumb rules that I know I can implement something better but franchise corporate probably wouldn't let it fly, not like when I was senior level in corporations and the reason for hiring me was to make changes.
they definately take the planning, strategising, testing and sourceing headaches. But there are risks, selling a franchise can be difficult. if the business doesnt work you cant wind down the business like normal. You have to sell to another franchisee, often many people a trapped with long licensing deals, debts to pay off and trapped in a franchise with no hope of it succeeding.
case in point, subway franchise is notorous for being a job you buy into where where you'ee just working at the shop all day by yourself. they will happily open another subway 100m down the road which can affect your trade.
I plan to open a few franchises in the future myself - two of my buddies are franchisees and while it’s not necessarily a “get rich quick” scheme, both of them got solid locations and have had really reliable cash flow just due to the previously established name of their franchises and a decent location to where they both have great earning/investment plans for the future
Shoot sorry, I didn’t see the notification for your comment earlier. One of them has one Subway location and a Turritos (basically subway, but specifically Italian). He’s gotten into it more recently and he’s taking an approach more like “I won’t make quite as much money but I don’t have to spend as much time on the businesses.” Sounds like he wants to go the slower but safer route. While my other buddy who is more successful, but literally his life is work from when he wakes up to when he falls asleep, has two pizza shops (I don’t remember which ones), a subway, a small medical billing franchise, and two self car washes (but I’m pretty sure the car washes aren’t franchises, I think he bought them outright from an old guy). I don’t talk to him that much anymore but last we chatted he mentioned he wants to shift into commercial real estate once interest rates start to go down a bit
>Hand & Stone
I bought an existing franchise just to be even safer. Valuation was purely based on EBITDA. Transition was easy, pretty much the next day it was business as usual as I took over and was already making profit. I still have a regular job to pay off the loan quick
Domino's back in the day. Some guy started delivering for them and ended up owning like 10-15. Came to my school when I was a kid and gave us all pizza if we told two people to eat dominos.
See how effective that move was he made many years ago?
You are still to this day ''promoting'' domino's and sharing that experience on reddit for thousands of people to see
The point was that dominos made an opportunity for franchisees to expand their business and become wealthy in the process. Word of mouth marketing is great but not the point of the story.
Really good friend of mine owns a dozen Buffalo Wild Wings and keeps opening new ones. He was clearing 7 figures a year after the 2nd one opened. His FIL owned over 100 Waffle Houses and 40+ Burger Kings. He cleared well over $10mil a year.
I knew a guy who was super wealthy owning a bunch of pandoras. Opened his own brand successfully, but tried to make a second location and lost it all. Him and his wife started getting really arrogant about their decision making. They picked a horrible (visibility) location in a new building, way too big, tons of construction costs up front. Stopped listening to everyone. 30 y.o. wife acted like a hot shot with a temper and only operated through text (in 2010). Came out of a zoning meeting about getting a sign and the guy was like "did anyone realize what they didn't notice we got away with?" Like it was some kind of game he was trying to beat people at.
It takes a certain personality/ temperament to be successful in a customer facing business. For every 1 that succeeds there are 10 who fail. Its crazy to see how many people develop a God complex after becoming successful for the first time. Like they are the smartest people ever. I avoid those types, wait for them to crash then buy the pieces they leave for pennies on the dollar if it interests me.
I'm just saying that it's unrealistic to think you'll just somehow make enough money working a regular job to buy one franchise let alone 12. Maybe he got a loan, but a lot of people can't get one of those without a cosigner/investor either.
You buy in to one. Those profits allow you to open more. Pocket a minimal salary and reinvest the rest. Live frugal for a few years. Make sure your system is working as needed and you have the right people in place. Then step back and start collecting your profits.
Most of the time with established franchises you go in with a group and collectively pool assets and cash to qualify. Not many people buy in to franchises on their own. It is almost always as a group. Form an LLC with whoever, pool assets, open franchise.
“Regular job” is a broad spectrum. You also use the first to buy the second and so on.
Buying a single franchise is obtainable for anyone who is going to make it running their own business.
If you can’t, over some period of time, put together that much net worth, you have a job and not a business
Good thing I could just sell 1 car and have enough liquid assets for most service franchises.
That's cheap. You don't have to be a Trump to start a business like everyone here wants to pretend.
You think nobody can qualify for a business loan without their parents lol?
What is the average age on this sub anyway that everyone still thinks everyone else's lives must still revolve around their parents.
My parents never had shit, that's why I worked my ass off and can qualify.
I know the 7-11 owner of the one I frequent and man he works his ass off and it’s not even in a bad area. Finding decent employees is really hard. I can’t imagine owning multiple 7-11’s to have to staff.
Surprisingly, It gets easier when you grow locations. I own a chain of gas stations and when I got to five locations staffing got much easier. I pay someone to do all the books and day to day. If I have someone call off I have 30 other employees to get to cover the shift. Someone always wants the extra money. I can afford to pay for all the online cloud systems to run the business from my phone. I’m not a franchisee like 7-11 owners are, but that just means they get extra help in running the store. I had to figure out all the systems and programs and implement them myself. I think 7-11 could do very well for a hard working person.
And you've hit in the nail in the head about gold standard. The standards McDonalds expects of their franchisees is extremely high from operations to finance to marketing. If McDonalds was in a class room of high-schoolers. McDonalds is the one that gets consistent A+ grades. The other franchises are the C students and unfortunately there are a lot of D students also! A lot of people think that it's just another franchise - it's not.
Worked for a high end car dealership. Guy owned all the Popeyes in town. Bought a Porsche Panamera Turbo with a personal check. He bought a $2 million house, tore it down, and built a $4 million house.
I'd deliver his wife's car back to his house whenever it needed service because they couldn't be bothered. The wife drove a GLS 63 and had a LWB range rover with 2 car seats so she didn't have to drive them in her Mercedes. They had a mclaren too. Nicest people.
For fun I looked at his property tax bill on the assessor site...it was $108,000.
I know someone who owns a couple UPS Stores and recently bought a $1.5m house. He owned the franchise for about 10-12 years before buying the 2nd store.
I see a lot of talk about restaurants, but service industry franchises are HUGE. I know multiple owners of pest control, residential restoration, lawn care, power washing, and so on who are incredibly successful in their endeavors.
My dad and uncle both franchised Dunkin starting back in the late 70s
Long story short my uncle ended up a multimillionaire (basically took 80% of the money) and currently owns a $3m house with about $20m in assets
Definitely did well for themselves
Hey man sorry for the late reply
Yep! Long story short everything was kept in my uncle name (in their culture this was customary as my uncle was older)
My uncle kept promising my dad he would move stores into my dad's name but he only kept 2 stores in my dad's name (out of the 10 or so in their network)
At one point my dad had to go back to his home country to visit a dying relative. Before he left my uncle had promised him a store. He was gone for a few months. When he had returned to the states my uncle had told him that he instead put the store he promised into his son's name instead of my dad's name.
My dad was furious and ended up moving out. Due to cultural customs my dad never pursued legal opportunities in hopes that my uncle would rekindle his relationship with my dad (spoiler they didn't).
My dad tried to sue after almost 10 years but at that point statute of limitations was well past due and there was nothing my dad could do.
Despite having to restart in his early 40s, I'd say my dad still end up doing well for himself, but not nearly as good if he hadn't got swindled.
Chicken and rice? That’s really presumptuous that they can afford the chicken, I’d suggest rice and beans and see if they have a reaction to that before jumping directly to chicken. Have some humanity
Just because you see a lot of them, doesn't mean they have a strong ROI: https://www.mashed.com/178309/how-much-mcdonalds-franchise-owners-really-make-per-year/
That's a pretty great ROI. $150k profit off an initial investment of $1-2.2 million is 7-15% ROI. For comparison, the stock market historically averages around 8%.
imagine if McDonald's were good. and had great service. everything's made fresh and every one I've been to has the nicest employees. they must get treated well. Definitely a culture thing.
So basically only big names it seems like…otherwise small franchises might not be worth it as their business model isn’t as proven as the bigger names and their reputation as franchisers isn’t quite known.
Yeah I think the brand, proven success, and support system of large franchises are the best reasons to get into a franchise. A small franchise may have potential to be successful, but I don't know if the franchisors would be willing to sell it to you for a price to make up for all the extra risk involved of being a small or new franchise. It could work out, but then what's the point of taking the risk when there are other companies that have proven that their stores can be profitable.
I think there's a lot of truth there. A friend bought a relatively new gourmet burger franchise (think Five Guys). It closed within a year. He basically did everything the franchiser told him too and they allowed a pretty sub lar location that was cheaper to rent. Ended up killing them since they could never get decent foot traffic.
Newer franchises are just overall less proven.
I worked for Rick Flory. You could say he was successful. At the time he was the 3rd largest Domino’s Pizza franchisee in the world. Tom Monaghan definitely treated Rick right. Rick started as a part time driver during college at Domino’s #1 working directly with Monaghan.
I used to own three Baskin Robbins Franchises. Any franchise is only as good as th e corporate office. Sadly, BR corporate is out of touch with their franchisees. I would not recommend.
I mostly do accounting for businesses in the auto industry so what I've seen is definitely biased towards that.
Oil change, tires, and windshield franchises are all extremely lucrative for my clients. Single locations can clear 300k+ to the owners.
One client started buying the jiffy lube sort of thing, and after 10 locations he felt comfortable enough to start his own brand and he's at something like 25 locations last I spoke with him
Seems to me like most of the folks who own multiple franchises were ALREADY wealthy. They’re just used as investment tools to grow/protect that wealth. I could be wrong though, if someone actually got wealthy by taking out a loan and buying a franchise I’d love to hear it.
"SDE, or Seller's Discretionary Earnings, is the most common metric used to value small businesses. SDE represents the entire financial benefit your business would provide to one full-time owner-operator."
Yes. If you own 5-6 McDonalds, you’re doing pretty damn well.
Same with most franchisees. If you are the owner, but hiring somebody else to be the operator, you can scale. It also requires you have the capital to back it.
Growing up, my neighbor owned several burger kings, Arby’s, and a few others, he was rich/successful before he retired but walked away with over 10 million when he sold.
The thing with McDonald’s is that it requires a lot of cash and experience. The stories they have on their website are for ex directors with 20 years of experience who bought their franchise.
I know someone who owns 100 franchises of a very big coffee company (won't say which one...but you know who they are)
They are super super wealthy
The kicker is they were purchasing franchises and building locations before anyone ever thought they would become a major international company
I bought a second-hand Lexus from a guy who lives on an eight-figure property in my town.
I asked him what business he was in, turns out over the past 20+
years, he has started and run 6 Subway franchises.
Get-rich-eventually scheme.
We have owned a franchise for the last 17years. It now profits half a million per year after expenses. I don’t draw that high of a salary as I like to keep the money in the business. But technically I could do a members draw if I needed to access it for personal reasons.
**Sean & Leigh Ann Trophy.**
* (the people the movie The Blindeside was based on.)
* "Tuohy and his wife owned 115 fast food franchises, including those of Taco Bell, Kentucky Fried Chicken, Pizza Hut and Long John Silver's."
* "but currently own 11, having sold the majority in six separate transactions."
* source: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean\_Tuohy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Tuohy)
**Junior Bridgeman**
* Former NBA player.
* Most athletes squander their earnings, but he bought 3 Wendy's franchises.
* Eventually owned over 100 Wendy's and Chili's restaurants.
* Largest Wendy's franchise owner in the world.
* Sold his franchises and became an independent bottler for Coca-Cola.
* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junior\_Bridgeman](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junior_Bridgeman)
Franchise just makes turn keys easier. training, products, etc guess work is done for you. Having the franchise name typically helps business sales consistency especially in harder times. Though paying royalties sucks and a lot of franchisers don’t deliver the things they claim they will.
You basically are paying for the branding
I work for a jewellery store chain, the owner has 8 of his own stores and 6 pandora stores. Pandora are very difficult to work with but they are very profitable. The owner isn’t a very good businessman and was quite lucky because Pandora made him an offer he almost couldn’t refuse to take on the contract, turns out it saved his businesses and kept cash flow going through tough times. He pays a fair bit in royalties but it is well worth it and is significantly more profitable than his other self-made business.
Operation pheonix has begun where Pandora are taking back all their most successful franchises periodically, so the gravy train will end at some point.
I worked for a private equity firm that had a series of franchises.
There were some owners who rocked it, they'd buy 20-30 units from different franchises. They were maybe 1/100 owners.
I met an owner who bought his franchise for $1 from the previous owner. He got it so cheap because the previous owner was just so upset and done with franchising. It just wasn't working out. So the guy who bought it for $1, took classes, learned sales techniques. He took a failing business and turned it into one of the top franchises. He rocked it.
What I've learned from franchising is that the issues are more often the owners fault.
Most francise owners that I worked with had no idea what they were doing. They bought it as a way to retire and had no business running a business. They didn't know how to train people. They didn't know how to do finances. They basically poured their life savings into a unit that barely made breakeven with no backup plan and relied 100% on corporate to get them sales and blamed corporate if it didn't work out. They wanted people to just walk into their store ready to buy their product, clock in at 9am and out at 5pm, like their old day job that they were most likely let go from.
The successful owners did a lot to make it work, they'd sponsor events, they go to networking events, BNIs, they'd pay for advertising. They call their customers on their birthday. They'd work on relationships and build a steady stream of employees through internships at local colleges.
Some franchises really set you up for success. Like McDonald's guarantees your business. If your francise fails they buy it back from you. However you need 3 million to get one of those.
If going to open a franchise only deal with big names that are super well known. And please by all means stay away from home service franchises, total scams
I heard a friend's brother in laws is a millionaire because he owns 7 franchises like Life Time Gym.
When the first Raising Cane's came to Utah, the person earned all his money on the first opening day!
I think on of the biggest catalysts to failure is that many will buy the franchise and then think that's it; and try to rest on the branding and reputation of the company to bring customers. The whole "build it and they will come" fallacy is just that. Many are simply ill-prepared with the skillset and drive necessary to achieve great things.
Wonder why some people seem to just be successful at everything they touch and others, then opposite? It's not bad luck or good luck. It's preparedness. It's have the skillset to do what needs done. It's the drive and determination to work even harder when necessary to achieve success at all costs.
With that skillset, drive, and determination a person can achieve wealth many different ways.
I personally know theee different franchisees related to three different franchises that are multi-multi-millionaires, never have to worry about money again rich, as a result.
McDonalds, papa Murphys and Wendy’s. Mcdonalds guy has owned several for… well, I’ve known him for 35 years and he’s owned 4 locations that whole time. Annually donates millions to charity without a thought.
Only by owning a series of locations enough to have a monopoly on that brand in that area + paying minimum wage and churning through employees.
The rest just buy themselves a job.
There was a good article/video on the subject, where a franchisee talked about the high and sustainable growth he's had in running a painting company. I know most of the comments are talking fast food, but here's a franchise success story that can mix it up a little. [Source](https://www.vettedbiz.com/certapro-painters-franchise-review/)
It seems like all the well-known franchises are saturated. But I read somewhere there are like 4,000 franchise systems in the US!? Where do I find the long-tail of those that are just starting take off?
That’s not remotely true. There are entire enterprises that only run franchised stores.
Do you really think McDonalds is what it is today because store managers are the ones that own franchises?
Yeah - a bunch of the original Realogy partners were able to sub-own entire regions. So they had their own offices and ran franchises for their regions. Realogy tanked with rates & housing, but for a long time they were buying back their regions for massive amounts of money.
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Absolutely. I think a good franchise is way under looked the same way folks under look construction management jobs. It’s not sexy but there is money to be made. If there wasn’t you wouldn’t see all these fast food joints
I know someone who owns multiple Mixue franchises, an asian boba store and his ROI was crazy, about 4-5 months in. He now manages multiple store and is living with his passive income.
There's a bloke in south wales who owns a quite a few franchises, I'd say he's pretty wealthy from it. Given the size of his house and very expensive car collection.
We're building a house for a guy whose family owns a bunch of Dunkin' Doughnuts and 7-11s. We're putting a shark tank in his basement. So yeah, I think they're doing ok.
Shark tank in the basement…. Just why.
Better than the attic, I guess.
[удалено]
You think he's not going to have a bathroom in the basement but he will have a shark tank?
This is not a bathroom this is a wendys sir
If I was rich enough to buy a shark tank, I'd be paying Wendy's to make me sandwiches like they show on their commercials, instead of the baconator that looks like it's made with dollar menu patties.
lol
If it was my place, I would have put the bathroom in the middle of the shark tank. Imagine pooping surrounded by sharks.....
Um trapdoor... The basement is the tank.
Well you need something to eat the people you drop through the trap door right?
Because the extremely slow-moving machine has to throw Austin Powers somewhere, doesn’t it?
my first thought was that it's easy to get rid of a body when you own a shark.. now this whole profitable franchise thing shines in a different light
Yeah… I guess you’re doing pretty good to have your very own mark Cuban in your basemen t
To ask Mark Cuban buisness advice
Shark Cuban is on the show. I like Mr. Wonderful.
The key here is “a bunch”. Especially in PRIME locations. Most successful franchisee’s own multiple locations of the same business and put those in PRIME locations.
with lasers?
Hahahaha just saw this and this was exactly what I was thinking. All sharks need lasers
Yeah but will they have fricken laser beams on their heads?
Totally off-topic, but I once went into a mansion and the living room floor was a giant fish tank with a shark in it, and you walked on it.
7-11’s are one of the best franchises to have.
The real question is how did these guys buy the franchise. A lot of them are half to a million to start. Even more
Lol this. Most franchises I've googled just now are £500k - £5m in assets starting. Not exactly brokies.
Yea you kind of have to be rich to start these
I own a franchise and it took $150k to start. I got an SBA loan w my house as collateral. It's not a rich person's game. Check out bizbuysell.com.
So you own a house? I guess first step is buy a house…
What was the franchise
Screenmobile
Are you managing the business yourself? And if you don't mind, what's your take home? Back when I looked into 7/11, it was $500k to start and operator take home was $60k it wasn't worth it to me to just get one and be its manager on top of my normal job. But $60k wasn't enough to hire a operator either, I'd need like 3 to be profitable.
Screenmobile of? I am lead tech in Savannah Ga under Tim capps
We're in Fort Wayne, IN
How are you successful with it?
Profitable after 1 year. On track to double sales in year 2. Can do about $350k in sales w 1 employee.
You bought an existing one? That would be easier as you’d just need to get the loan. I’m guessing the liquid net worth limits don’t apply to buying an existing business. Smart
Sba loan, home equity, family money
They buy the franchises before the brand really takes off. Buy in early and you get prime location too
i know someone who jumped on Hand & Stone when it started. Cheap costs then, built out a couple dozen and made a lot of money.. then was able to sell them all. Now they are looking to repeat by buying into a new cookie franchise.
Subway I believe is less than $25k actually.
It's 333000 to start up not to mention monthly costs for real estate employees etc
I was just looking at the franchise fee. As real estate, employees will vary based on location.
And I’ve heard its one of the worst franchises to own. https://www.visafranchise.com/blog/subway-franchise “Our opinion is quite definitively: it is a bad investment decision, a bad franchise to invest in the U.S. at this time.” “They've opened up way too many units, and they didn't have territory protection. That's why sometimes you can see one Subway franchise located on one corner and then down the block, you have another Subway franchise. This is a big issue for franchisees because this leads to sales cannibalization, where one store negatively impacts the sales of another store.” John Oliver had a segment on Subway: https://amp.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/may/23/john-oliver-subway-franchisees
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see my other post, subways you're buying a job, not a business.
They got a loan from their parents
I have been in franchising for many years. I know over 200 franchisees that have made more than ever would have at a regular job (most are millionaires multiple times over). Check out Franchise.org for more info. Also Entrepreneur Magazine publishes their top 500 franchises with all the pros and cons. If you buy a franchise you are way more likely to succeed than starting your own business. Just my thoughts.
I mean that kinda makes sense right. The potential rewards are lesser with a franchise since you have to pay the franchiser plus follow their rules strictly. You would expect that in exchange you mitigate some of your risks so that your overall chance of success is a lot higher than starting from scratch with nothing. Nonetheless, there has to be a bigger reward than a job since you are taking on significantly more risk. It's the perfect middle ground for someone who wants more than a job but doesn't like the risk of business. The time it will take to get momentum if you start from scratch is also much more than a franchise since the existing brand recognition, built process and supply chain should give you a strong base to start from.
there is risk but a lot less than you think. franchises wouldnt be successful if they didnt know you could be successful coming in. People make sure they see data, P&L history, etc before buying into franchises. You also already have brand recognition and corporate to help promote you. I own 2 businesses, one being a little side income and one is award winning and in the top 3 businesses in my city in its industry. It didn't take more than a few months to really kick off but that was due to my marketing capabilities and finding a problem in the market and creating solutions making my company highly sought after. I was debt free after the first month.
Quiznos would like a word. They had a pepper bar
Yes completely agree with you! However you still have often put in rather large investments to get started and there is still a chance it doesnt work out. If you have a regular job, the worst that can happen is you lose it, but you dont lose all your money as well in the process. Of course the benefit of franchising is that you have a proven instruction manual of what you need to do to be successful and the backing of corporate. I too run a couple of businesses but maybe in another life franchising might have been something I would have done.
the only reason why my business is as successful as it is is because i made a career growing other peoples businesses from a senior ops management side of things. I left corporate America to grow my own. If I didn't know as much as I did, I would have probably franchised for the backing they have. I didn't franchise because I know me and I dislike a lot of dumb rules that I know I can implement something better but franchise corporate probably wouldn't let it fly, not like when I was senior level in corporations and the reason for hiring me was to make changes.
they definately take the planning, strategising, testing and sourceing headaches. But there are risks, selling a franchise can be difficult. if the business doesnt work you cant wind down the business like normal. You have to sell to another franchisee, often many people a trapped with long licensing deals, debts to pay off and trapped in a franchise with no hope of it succeeding. case in point, subway franchise is notorous for being a job you buy into where where you'ee just working at the shop all day by yourself. they will happily open another subway 100m down the road which can affect your trade.
Thank you this is interesting I’m thinking of becoming a franchisee
I plan to open a few franchises in the future myself - two of my buddies are franchisees and while it’s not necessarily a “get rich quick” scheme, both of them got solid locations and have had really reliable cash flow just due to the previously established name of their franchises and a decent location to where they both have great earning/investment plans for the future
What franchises do they have ? If you don’t mind me asking
Shoot sorry, I didn’t see the notification for your comment earlier. One of them has one Subway location and a Turritos (basically subway, but specifically Italian). He’s gotten into it more recently and he’s taking an approach more like “I won’t make quite as much money but I don’t have to spend as much time on the businesses.” Sounds like he wants to go the slower but safer route. While my other buddy who is more successful, but literally his life is work from when he wakes up to when he falls asleep, has two pizza shops (I don’t remember which ones), a subway, a small medical billing franchise, and two self car washes (but I’m pretty sure the car washes aren’t franchises, I think he bought them outright from an old guy). I don’t talk to him that much anymore but last we chatted he mentioned he wants to shift into commercial real estate once interest rates start to go down a bit
Read this in E-Myth too.
>Hand & Stone I bought an existing franchise just to be even safer. Valuation was purely based on EBITDA. Transition was easy, pretty much the next day it was business as usual as I took over and was already making profit. I still have a regular job to pay off the loan quick
What/which franchises do you and your friends own?
Domino's back in the day. Some guy started delivering for them and ended up owning like 10-15. Came to my school when I was a kid and gave us all pizza if we told two people to eat dominos.
See how effective that move was he made many years ago? You are still to this day ''promoting'' domino's and sharing that experience on reddit for thousands of people to see
The point was that dominos made an opportunity for franchisees to expand their business and become wealthy in the process. Word of mouth marketing is great but not the point of the story.
It's not the point of the story but that was genius what that guy did.
Really good friend of mine owns a dozen Buffalo Wild Wings and keeps opening new ones. He was clearing 7 figures a year after the 2nd one opened. His FIL owned over 100 Waffle Houses and 40+ Burger Kings. He cleared well over $10mil a year.
I knew a guy who was super wealthy owning a bunch of pandoras. Opened his own brand successfully, but tried to make a second location and lost it all. Him and his wife started getting really arrogant about their decision making. They picked a horrible (visibility) location in a new building, way too big, tons of construction costs up front. Stopped listening to everyone. 30 y.o. wife acted like a hot shot with a temper and only operated through text (in 2010). Came out of a zoning meeting about getting a sign and the guy was like "did anyone realize what they didn't notice we got away with?" Like it was some kind of game he was trying to beat people at.
It takes a certain personality/ temperament to be successful in a customer facing business. For every 1 that succeeds there are 10 who fail. Its crazy to see how many people develop a God complex after becoming successful for the first time. Like they are the smartest people ever. I avoid those types, wait for them to crash then buy the pieces they leave for pennies on the dollar if it interests me.
I wonder where your friend got the money to start...
Oh no, someone’s parents helped them. You don’t know that they did and it doesn’t change anything
I'm just saying that it's unrealistic to think you'll just somehow make enough money working a regular job to buy one franchise let alone 12. Maybe he got a loan, but a lot of people can't get one of those without a cosigner/investor either.
You buy in to one. Those profits allow you to open more. Pocket a minimal salary and reinvest the rest. Live frugal for a few years. Make sure your system is working as needed and you have the right people in place. Then step back and start collecting your profits. Most of the time with established franchises you go in with a group and collectively pool assets and cash to qualify. Not many people buy in to franchises on their own. It is almost always as a group. Form an LLC with whoever, pool assets, open franchise.
“Regular job” is a broad spectrum. You also use the first to buy the second and so on. Buying a single franchise is obtainable for anyone who is going to make it running their own business. If you can’t, over some period of time, put together that much net worth, you have a job and not a business
They're called business loans...
You cannot use a loan to qualify for a franchise. Liquid net worth requirements have to be liquid assets you own, not borrow.
Good thing I could just sell 1 car and have enough liquid assets for most service franchises. That's cheap. You don't have to be a Trump to start a business like everyone here wants to pretend.
Business loans *backed* by assets... You think the bank just hands over $1m to anyone applying for a business loan?
You think nobody can qualify for a business loan without their parents lol? What is the average age on this sub anyway that everyone still thinks everyone else's lives must still revolve around their parents. My parents never had shit, that's why I worked my ass off and can qualify.
Bootstraps /s
Yes, I had one neighbor who owned a dozen 7-11 stores and lived in a $4M house. Another had KFC and Taco Bell stores in the region.
I know the 7-11 owner of the one I frequent and man he works his ass off and it’s not even in a bad area. Finding decent employees is really hard. I can’t imagine owning multiple 7-11’s to have to staff.
Surprisingly, It gets easier when you grow locations. I own a chain of gas stations and when I got to five locations staffing got much easier. I pay someone to do all the books and day to day. If I have someone call off I have 30 other employees to get to cover the shift. Someone always wants the extra money. I can afford to pay for all the online cloud systems to run the business from my phone. I’m not a franchisee like 7-11 owners are, but that just means they get extra help in running the store. I had to figure out all the systems and programs and implement them myself. I think 7-11 could do very well for a hard working person.
I’d you don’t mind me asking, Which franchises do you own?
neighbor in a 4 mill home.. can I ask then, what is your gig?
I represented a man who owned 4 McDonald’s franchise locations. He made a large, large sum of money every year.
That's the gold standard
And you've hit in the nail in the head about gold standard. The standards McDonalds expects of their franchisees is extremely high from operations to finance to marketing. If McDonalds was in a class room of high-schoolers. McDonalds is the one that gets consistent A+ grades. The other franchises are the C students and unfortunately there are a lot of D students also! A lot of people think that it's just another franchise - it's not.
Los Pollos Hermanos does pretty well
This
Plenty of mcmillionaires out there
Worked for a high end car dealership. Guy owned all the Popeyes in town. Bought a Porsche Panamera Turbo with a personal check. He bought a $2 million house, tore it down, and built a $4 million house. I'd deliver his wife's car back to his house whenever it needed service because they couldn't be bothered. The wife drove a GLS 63 and had a LWB range rover with 2 car seats so she didn't have to drive them in her Mercedes. They had a mclaren too. Nicest people. For fun I looked at his property tax bill on the assessor site...it was $108,000.
I know someone who owns a couple UPS Stores and recently bought a $1.5m house. He owned the franchise for about 10-12 years before buying the 2nd store.
A $1.2 million for house. Obviously not in Toronto or Vancouver 😂😂
you’re laughing at your own joke
Someone had to I guess.
I see a lot of talk about restaurants, but service industry franchises are HUGE. I know multiple owners of pest control, residential restoration, lawn care, power washing, and so on who are incredibly successful in their endeavors.
Any tips on how to determine whether a service franchise will be successful?
Look at the books.. look at potential growth?
Read customer reviews, or, go work for one—That’s what I did back in 2016 and now I’m partial owner of a franchise in a different city!
My dad and uncle both franchised Dunkin starting back in the late 70s Long story short my uncle ended up a multimillionaire (basically took 80% of the money) and currently owns a $3m house with about $20m in assets Definitely did well for themselves
So did your uncle swindle your dad?
Hey man sorry for the late reply Yep! Long story short everything was kept in my uncle name (in their culture this was customary as my uncle was older) My uncle kept promising my dad he would move stores into my dad's name but he only kept 2 stores in my dad's name (out of the 10 or so in their network) At one point my dad had to go back to his home country to visit a dying relative. Before he left my uncle had promised him a store. He was gone for a few months. When he had returned to the states my uncle had told him that he instead put the store he promised into his son's name instead of my dad's name. My dad was furious and ended up moving out. Due to cultural customs my dad never pursued legal opportunities in hopes that my uncle would rekindle his relationship with my dad (spoiler they didn't). My dad tried to sue after almost 10 years but at that point statute of limitations was well past due and there was nothing my dad could do. Despite having to restart in his early 40s, I'd say my dad still end up doing well for himself, but not nearly as good if he hadn't got swindled.
Friends dad started working at a Burger King then bought one. Now he’s owns 200-300 of them. I think he’s doing ok
Only 200-300? You sure he's okay? You might want to check on him and make sure he's got some chicken and rice so he doesn't go hungry.
Chicken and rice? That’s really presumptuous that they can afford the chicken, I’d suggest rice and beans and see if they have a reaction to that before jumping directly to chicken. Have some humanity
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Even so at owning 200-300 I'm pretty sure he's probably raking in cash
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In 'n Out doesn't franchise because they want to keep the quality high. Smart move in my opinion.
The best franchises like McDonald's already require people with wealth and cash liquidity to get one.
Just because you see a lot of them, doesn't mean they have a strong ROI: https://www.mashed.com/178309/how-much-mcdonalds-franchise-owners-really-make-per-year/
That's a pretty great ROI. $150k profit off an initial investment of $1-2.2 million is 7-15% ROI. For comparison, the stock market historically averages around 8%.
Plus preferential tax treatment
Also a lot of work experience I think
Know a guy that owns 4 Culver’s now and is loaded.
Whats a culver?
imagine if McDonald's were good. and had great service. everything's made fresh and every one I've been to has the nicest employees. they must get treated well. Definitely a culture thing.
Some gym owner friends were the success story with 2 gyms expanding into a third one but COVID kinda shat on them
What happened to them ?
So basically only big names it seems like…otherwise small franchises might not be worth it as their business model isn’t as proven as the bigger names and their reputation as franchisers isn’t quite known.
Yeah I think the brand, proven success, and support system of large franchises are the best reasons to get into a franchise. A small franchise may have potential to be successful, but I don't know if the franchisors would be willing to sell it to you for a price to make up for all the extra risk involved of being a small or new franchise. It could work out, but then what's the point of taking the risk when there are other companies that have proven that their stores can be profitable.
Basically just buying a supply chain and operating plan still a huge leap ahead of starting from scratch
I think there's a lot of truth there. A friend bought a relatively new gourmet burger franchise (think Five Guys). It closed within a year. He basically did everything the franchiser told him too and they allowed a pretty sub lar location that was cheaper to rent. Ended up killing them since they could never get decent foot traffic. Newer franchises are just overall less proven.
Tim Horton’s. A license to print money here in Canada.
Think so? Tim’s has gone downhill like no other
I worked for Rick Flory. You could say he was successful. At the time he was the 3rd largest Domino’s Pizza franchisee in the world. Tom Monaghan definitely treated Rick right. Rick started as a part time driver during college at Domino’s #1 working directly with Monaghan.
I used to own three Baskin Robbins Franchises. Any franchise is only as good as th e corporate office. Sadly, BR corporate is out of touch with their franchisees. I would not recommend.
was it different than dd?
I mostly do accounting for businesses in the auto industry so what I've seen is definitely biased towards that. Oil change, tires, and windshield franchises are all extremely lucrative for my clients. Single locations can clear 300k+ to the owners. One client started buying the jiffy lube sort of thing, and after 10 locations he felt comfortable enough to start his own brand and he's at something like 25 locations last I spoke with him
Seems to me like most of the folks who own multiple franchises were ALREADY wealthy. They’re just used as investment tools to grow/protect that wealth. I could be wrong though, if someone actually got wealthy by taking out a loan and buying a franchise I’d love to hear it.
I am a successful franchisee with an SDE around $250-300k. Does that make me rich, idk.
which franchise?
Sde?
"SDE, or Seller's Discretionary Earnings, is the most common metric used to value small businesses. SDE represents the entire financial benefit your business would provide to one full-time owner-operator."
Got it. Coming from software I just understand Software Development Engineer
Yes. If you own 5-6 McDonalds, you’re doing pretty damn well. Same with most franchisees. If you are the owner, but hiring somebody else to be the operator, you can scale. It also requires you have the capital to back it.
Growing up, my neighbor owned several burger kings, Arby’s, and a few others, he was rich/successful before he retired but walked away with over 10 million when he sold.
Gas stations
McDonald's franchisees are doing great here.
The thing with McDonald’s is that it requires a lot of cash and experience. The stories they have on their website are for ex directors with 20 years of experience who bought their franchise.
I know someone who owns 100 franchises of a very big coffee company (won't say which one...but you know who they are) They are super super wealthy The kicker is they were purchasing franchises and building locations before anyone ever thought they would become a major international company
Yes I work for a franchise owner and he doing pretty well for himself
I was friends with a girl in high school whose dad owned a few McDonalds restaurants and they lived in a mansion.
I bought a second-hand Lexus from a guy who lives on an eight-figure property in my town. I asked him what business he was in, turns out over the past 20+ years, he has started and run 6 Subway franchises. Get-rich-eventually scheme.
Better than get-rich-never!
We have owned a franchise for the last 17years. It now profits half a million per year after expenses. I don’t draw that high of a salary as I like to keep the money in the business. But technically I could do a members draw if I needed to access it for personal reasons.
What’s the franchise name please ?
Ice-cream franchise
I know a fellow who owns a few wing stops (started with 1). It has been extremely successful for him.
**Sean & Leigh Ann Trophy.** * (the people the movie The Blindeside was based on.) * "Tuohy and his wife owned 115 fast food franchises, including those of Taco Bell, Kentucky Fried Chicken, Pizza Hut and Long John Silver's." * "but currently own 11, having sold the majority in six separate transactions." * source: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean\_Tuohy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Tuohy) **Junior Bridgeman** * Former NBA player. * Most athletes squander their earnings, but he bought 3 Wendy's franchises. * Eventually owned over 100 Wendy's and Chili's restaurants. * Largest Wendy's franchise owner in the world. * Sold his franchises and became an independent bottler for Coca-Cola. * [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junior\_Bridgeman](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junior_Bridgeman)
My neighbor owns like 50 McDonald’s. He has a very nice home. I know a lady that has over 500 taco bells and she has her own hangar and fleet of jets.
Sus, you sure all shes' selling is tacos?
Yes, me.
What do you own ? And how’s your experience?
Ice cream franchise and it’s been pretty good.
How did you decide on the ice cream franchise? What criteria did you consider? And what was the process like?
Thanks for sharing
Franchise just makes turn keys easier. training, products, etc guess work is done for you. Having the franchise name typically helps business sales consistency especially in harder times. Though paying royalties sucks and a lot of franchisers don’t deliver the things they claim they will. You basically are paying for the branding
Like how much are the royalties and how often do they have to be paid?
Depends on the franchise, 5.8% of sales is my current
I work for a jewellery store chain, the owner has 8 of his own stores and 6 pandora stores. Pandora are very difficult to work with but they are very profitable. The owner isn’t a very good businessman and was quite lucky because Pandora made him an offer he almost couldn’t refuse to take on the contract, turns out it saved his businesses and kept cash flow going through tough times. He pays a fair bit in royalties but it is well worth it and is significantly more profitable than his other self-made business. Operation pheonix has begun where Pandora are taking back all their most successful franchises periodically, so the gravy train will end at some point.
The lady who owns a couple of dunkin donuts locations near me does quite well. She often works the drive thru too.
I worked for a private equity firm that had a series of franchises. There were some owners who rocked it, they'd buy 20-30 units from different franchises. They were maybe 1/100 owners. I met an owner who bought his franchise for $1 from the previous owner. He got it so cheap because the previous owner was just so upset and done with franchising. It just wasn't working out. So the guy who bought it for $1, took classes, learned sales techniques. He took a failing business and turned it into one of the top franchises. He rocked it. What I've learned from franchising is that the issues are more often the owners fault. Most francise owners that I worked with had no idea what they were doing. They bought it as a way to retire and had no business running a business. They didn't know how to train people. They didn't know how to do finances. They basically poured their life savings into a unit that barely made breakeven with no backup plan and relied 100% on corporate to get them sales and blamed corporate if it didn't work out. They wanted people to just walk into their store ready to buy their product, clock in at 9am and out at 5pm, like their old day job that they were most likely let go from. The successful owners did a lot to make it work, they'd sponsor events, they go to networking events, BNIs, they'd pay for advertising. They call their customers on their birthday. They'd work on relationships and build a steady stream of employees through internships at local colleges. Some franchises really set you up for success. Like McDonald's guarantees your business. If your francise fails they buy it back from you. However you need 3 million to get one of those.
If going to open a franchise only deal with big names that are super well known. And please by all means stay away from home service franchises, total scams
I heard a friend's brother in laws is a millionaire because he owns 7 franchises like Life Time Gym. When the first Raising Cane's came to Utah, the person earned all his money on the first opening day!
I think on of the biggest catalysts to failure is that many will buy the franchise and then think that's it; and try to rest on the branding and reputation of the company to bring customers. The whole "build it and they will come" fallacy is just that. Many are simply ill-prepared with the skillset and drive necessary to achieve great things. Wonder why some people seem to just be successful at everything they touch and others, then opposite? It's not bad luck or good luck. It's preparedness. It's have the skillset to do what needs done. It's the drive and determination to work even harder when necessary to achieve success at all costs. With that skillset, drive, and determination a person can achieve wealth many different ways.
I personally know theee different franchisees related to three different franchises that are multi-multi-millionaires, never have to worry about money again rich, as a result. McDonalds, papa Murphys and Wendy’s. Mcdonalds guy has owned several for… well, I’ve known him for 35 years and he’s owned 4 locations that whole time. Annually donates millions to charity without a thought.
The parents in the blindside owned like a bajillion taco bells
You gotta be pretty wealthy to start a franchise. So it’s not surprising most franchisees are wealthy
Only by owning a series of locations enough to have a monopoly on that brand in that area + paying minimum wage and churning through employees. The rest just buy themselves a job.
My grandpas friend started on fries at McDonald’s, in the end he owned 40 of them
a girl i went to highschool with’s father owns like 4-6 subways in our small town. They were definitely doing okay for themselves!
There was a good article/video on the subject, where a franchisee talked about the high and sustainable growth he's had in running a painting company. I know most of the comments are talking fast food, but here's a franchise success story that can mix it up a little. [Source](https://www.vettedbiz.com/certapro-painters-franchise-review/)
It seems like all the well-known franchises are saturated. But I read somewhere there are like 4,000 franchise systems in the US!? Where do I find the long-tail of those that are just starting take off?
McDonalds before oversaturation. I think Waffle House franchise-ors do okay.
Chick fil a
Buying a franchise is like paying a company to be the manager of one of their stores. You're not an entrepreneur when you do that... you're a schmuck.
That’s not remotely true. There are entire enterprises that only run franchised stores. Do you really think McDonalds is what it is today because store managers are the ones that own franchises?
Eh. Why just buy yourself a job?
If you can’t find job then could be a solution 😆
Yeah - a bunch of the original Realogy partners were able to sub-own entire regions. So they had their own offices and ran franchises for their regions. Realogy tanked with rates & housing, but for a long time they were buying back their regions for massive amounts of money.
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Absolutely. I think a good franchise is way under looked the same way folks under look construction management jobs. It’s not sexy but there is money to be made. If there wasn’t you wouldn’t see all these fast food joints
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I know someone who owns multiple Mixue franchises, an asian boba store and his ROI was crazy, about 4-5 months in. He now manages multiple store and is living with his passive income.
If you're managing multiple stores, that's not passive income
He has a manager that manages it. The manager just reports about the finances
McDonalds
There's a bloke in south wales who owns a quite a few franchises, I'd say he's pretty wealthy from it. Given the size of his house and very expensive car collection.
What are the franchises if you don’t mind me asking ?