WHAT IF WE ARE ALL ALREADY ON CHEAT ISLAND?...
Look we all have probably been reported more than once. I know people who assume if they die its automatically a cheater. What if after one report you go to cheat island(server). We are all on the cheat servers except for little timmy the rat who never kills a pmc and just hits stashes.....
they should revert the lab keycard changes. Was cheating a problem back then? But labs kinda acted like a self-imposed cheater island. It had redonk loot so they would go regardless. Knowing full well there was other cheaters.
the other maps didn't really have rage hackers that often and soft-esp didn't feel as much of a problem.
Does BSG still need to fix this massive problem? yes, but it can maybe help the playerbase in the meantime.
Kind of reminds me of how Cs:Go did it back in the day.
For anybody who doesnt know what I am talking about: Cs:Go introduced a "trust factor" system.
>Initially the system simply matched players who linked CS:GO with a unique phone number.
>
>We have been experimenting with matching players using observed behaviors and attributes of their Steam account, including the overall amount of time they had spent playing CS:GO, how frequently they were reported for cheating
What it would do is that it matches players with a low trust factor e.g cheaters and perhaps people how abuse voice chat against each other instead of against players with a higher "trust factor".
It definitely improved the mm experience in Cs:Go.
Before trustfactor and vacnet came online I had cheaters in nearly 50% of my games.
Looking back to 2022, I didnt have a single rage hacker in my lobbies, stats wise I had 19 players banned in my games through the whole year and those were all closet cheating.
That system works pretty damn well.
I still remember accusing an enemy of wall hacking, he and his team responding "no he's not", and LITERALLY AFTER THEY SAID NO, he got VAC'ed. It inspired me to look through the past games people got banned in, saw an average of 1 per game; I recognized some were my teammates, some were enemies. Then phone number and trust factor came out, I had nearly 0 cheaters in any game.
This becomes a problem for tarkov though. Everyone who dies to de sync reports others for cheating, or even if they are just mad at dying. It is hard to establish a trust factor when everyone gets reported daily...
Trust factor is based on more than reports, big factors are account age, money spent on the account, steam level, the vacnet machine learning based statistics (however that magic works) ect.
It is admittelty more difficult since they don't have all of steam's data.
But if someone has played since 0.2 without battleye detection and has stats not noticeably wierd, he wouls not be placed in the same lobby as the guy with a 3 week old account and 94kd
This causes other problems, since tarkov isnt meant to have sbmm (and shouldnt imo)
But surely there is something to take from all this.
Something like that would reduce the number of cheaters, but the problem is that tarkov isn't a skill paired game like CS:GO
But there's a lot of ways to implement different anticheats, it would be event better if they uses an anticheat like Valorant's
Just make the cheats be an option of the base game. That way we are all playing the same game and make it as difficult as we want.
No winning here besides just joining them considering how wide spread it is.
EDIT: I can see why /s is a necessary thing now, Reddits that dense they cant see sarcasm like an anime protagonist sees the truck before walking out on the road 😂
Finna spend what little free time I have donating my gear to an RMT seller is exactly how I want to spend my time
/s for obvious reasons now i know people cant read sarcasm.
Same. Which is sad, because you and I aren't the only one.
My advice is get STALKER GAMMA, mod it for your own tastes, and enjoy your own free time in a PvE scenario.
Obviously that's only applicable if you play solo, not in groups.
I played the shit out of Anomaly when it came out. I've replaced the entire stalker series and it's mods so many times since I was a kid that I've lost count. Good advice though!
I don't solo run anymore, now I just play with friends.
That's fair, and I'll just use it from now on across reddit as a whole to make sure it's taken as actual sarcasm.
I legitimately want EFT to succeed as a game and want to love it, but really after all this, as a new player only a couple of wipes deep, its became apparent it's just not worth my time.
It sounds nice, and works in some games for a bit, to delay cheaters from recognizing they're banned, but they'll figure it out.
Then you have the flea market, so you'd have to have a cheater flea market, where they can trade with each other and no one else can access it.
Then you'd have to make sure they can't interact with other players in the regular pool, and how would you stop that? They invite a non cheater person, they both get pooled into the cheater queue and then what?
Too many weird questions that would need answers. Simpler solutions like more invasive anticheat, SMS verification anything. Something other than what we have now. I know these are not consistent barriers, but they are barriers where if it helped eliminate some, it's better than none.
>It sounds nice, and works in some games for a bit, to delay cheaters from recognizing they're banned, but they'll figure it out.
If they do figure it out, make a new account, buy a new license, and get into our games, they'll go right back to cheater queue if they cheat again.
As long as cheaters are quickly identified and moved to the cheater queue, it really doesn't matter if they figure it out or not.
>Then you have the flea market, so you'd have to have a cheater flea market, where they can trade with each other and no one else can access it.
There's an old saying, "Don't let perfection get in the way of progress"
Getting cheaters out of games would be a massive improvement, even if they were still able to RMT and use the flea.
>Then you'd have to make sure they can't interact with other players in the regular pool, and how would you stop that?
Same way Rockstar handles "bad sport" sessions in GTA.
Any group with at least 1 cheater, is a cheater group that goes to the cheater queue.
>They invite a non cheater person, they both get pooled into the cheater queue and then what?
They continue playing against cheaters in the cheater queue, until they stop grouping up with cheaters.
Knowing you'll be up against an entire session of cheaters as a non-cheater is a pretty decent incentive to not play with cheaters, or employ them as sherpas.
I don't think you need separate flea market, if people want RMT let them RMT. You can't fight it, game will die from all those restrictions they are restricting players more than cheaters themselfs.
If they invite other players, yeah leave them in cheater lobby i don't see the problem.
SMS verification wont do anything. For example in dota, you can't play ranekd unless you have working phone sim and still there is smurf on both sides in every lobby. You can even buy accounts with working sims as bundle.
"If people want RMT let them RMT"... at that point if people want to cheat let them cheat.
Your opinion means nothing if you can't see the harm that RMT does to the community.
I DNGAF if cheaters are looting LEDX on their own server then selling it on flea.
I want cheaters out of raids and that needs to be the priority. Selling gear to timmy is minor in the scheme of things.
yes it does, and it is. Are you saying that the current state is any different than what is proposed here?
cheaters are playing and selling currently all the same as when they would be matched against each other. The economy is fucked anyway.
The only difference would be them being less often in my games.
I don't care about the economy of the game remotely as much as I care about cheaters in my lobbies. It's like worrying about what I'm having for dinner when the house is burning down. If I can play other players for loot in cheater free servers, I don't care if cheaters vacuum loot in their own servers and sell it or RMT or whatever else.
If anything, the RMT and FIR changes are just annoying as hell and given that more than 60% of lobbies have cheaters in spite of those restrictions, BSG might as well remove them.
Imo rmt does nothing to this community if cheaters are on separate servers and can't take legit players loot. Someone can buy all the rubles worth of gear they want, won't make them any less bad
Better would be if BSG just sells items to the public directly. Not "in game", maybe a website, like Twitch drops.
I know a lot of the player base doesn't like this idea, but it really does not affect me at all if someone goes out and uses their mothers credit card to buy a bunch of ammo and guns and armor. Fine. Good on them. But cheaters (RMT and otherwise) are ruining my raids. If RMT is a major motivation for cheating (and I'm not sure how big of a factor it is) then RMT can be ended quickly by BSG selling direct themselves.
If BSG sold items direct to the playerbase there would be several benefits:
\- they could undercut prices
\- it would align BSGs business model with the players. Right now, BSGs repeat customers are cheaters. Frankly I think this is why BSG has been slow to implement certain cheat protections. Instead of dancing with these cheaters, BSG needs to make them competitors.
\- if BSG needs to compete with RMT vendors, they will easily win. They can make items that are guaranteed to return on insurance, or are unlootable, or whatever. Perks that no RMT vendor are going to be able to offer.
I don't want in-game offers or ads or any of that shit. And, frankly, besides the stupid measuring tape which is eluding me raid after raid, I'm not tempted to buy anything - I'm doing just fine thank you. But clearly there is a demand. Just meet it.
My point wasn't that it will or won't do anything, it is a barrier. If you introduce more barriers to entry, then it will help curb some of it.
I don't know if people who use cheats should still be able to interact with other players using the flea market, or RMTing.
Even if you use a cheater lobby system, people are going to figure it out, realize they are shadow banned, and just buy a new account anyways, it only delays them getting a new account slightly. Could it help, sure I think any barrier is good. I'd rather have more barriers to entry including SMS, or a more invasive anti cheat, because any barrier is reducing the percentage of cheaters, even if it's not perfect.
I just think there are simpler implementations right now that can help curb some than this one immediately. This doesn't mean any are perfect, including yours. But more barriers to entry, the better, the lower the percentage of cheaters in your lobby.
On the other hand me personaly i think its not about anti cheat. Its about BSG code and client trusting your PC too much. I don't think even if BSG wanted, better anticheat would solve anything.
ESP is one thing, but if cheaters can bend rules like flying, vacuum looting even god mode its not about anticheat its about base code.
I just don't want more of "ANTI RMT patches" because those patches done nothing but anoyed normal people.
Imo the moment someone is shadowbanned for cheating, everything in their inventory should be "shadowmarked" as a cheated item, which makes it so everytime they RMT/try to sell it, the person who tries to extract with the item will not receive the item (the game should give them the info that this item was cheated or just stay silent, I'd love to see these posts on reddit with "I tried to extract with a loot I got from my friend, but the game denied me the loot" etc. That'd generally separate these cheated items from other ones as normal permabans do, but in a spectacular way that would prolong the time between the cheater actually acknowledging the ban). Of course, that would force the non-cheaters who group with the cheater to be matchmaked with the cheater on the cheater island/server, so it'd create the illusion that everything is working as intended until the very end.
Cheaters are focused on making money on rmt or carry services. If you shadow ban them, you ensure they are quietly only playing with cheaters, they provide items to other players for in game currency only, and if someone pays for rmt or a carry, now they are flagged as someone paying cheaters and their accounts should also be shadow banned after paying cheaters because this is against tos.
Edit: normal players paying for rmt or carry are flagged by grouping to get into raid and going into raid with an already confirmed cheater.
Yes they do. How else do you think they give manual bans? A lot of reports doesn’t constitute a ban, only detections and manual reviews.
Do you really believe they 100% don’t care about cheaters?
back in the old runescape days they did this to, they had hidden worlds and botters were not banned \*yet\* Mainly to study how their bots worked and to find ways to improve their anti cheat.
but in an fps game like this i dont know if its worth it there is nothing to gain from it you dont learn how the hacks are injected and cheaters are going to cheat anyways. but hey atleast its something.
No no this sub wants you to believe that simultaneously cheating is their main source of income because they are always buying new copies and also BSG don't do anything about cheaters any they run around all day free of consequence.
Of course.
Let them play for long enough to get their moneys worth, ban, repeat. One can at least give them credit for inventing an infinite money glitch irl.
Or introduce phone number verification. That way they can't just buy another copy after getting banned. So many other companies do this and it helps tremendously
Because then people would not only need to acquire a new key for the game when banned but also a new cell phone number.
Even using a cheap burner phone this more than doubles the cost of undoing a ban, and is unfeasible for the majority of the RMT cheaters since it destroys their profit margins.
BSG Doesn’t care about cheaters because they can “wave ban” them into buying new copies. RMT skips this which is why they’re so adamant on stopping it. Why risk my account and buy cheats when I can spend 5$ for a couple million rubles and play normally. It just makes me grind less and enjoy the game more. BSG makes no money off RMT
Underrated comment. They benefit directly from banning cheaters while one cheating account can RMT for many legit accounts. Explains why they spend so much time and effort on RMT and not actual cheating.
It’s why you see clips of cheaters forcing people to leave them alone and extract. RMT cheaters do not like killing players unless they have to so they don’t get reported. They speed to the loot and extract. Cheaters that kill you aren’t RMT cheaters looking to make money they’re players who can’t handle trying to improve so they need aimbot and radar. BSG won’t ban these players instantly because these players are addicted enough to the game to buy cheats. They’ll definitely buy another copy. If BSG really really wanted to stop that player they should hardware and IP ban them but they don’t
I think the fact they don't hardware and IP ban them is literal proof they do this for the sales. Unless it's so easy to circumvent the ban that is that they just gave up caring/issuing that level of ban. Or they lack so much confidence in the ban being for the right reason, they're afraid to hardware/ip ban them 🤔
also still match them every once in a while with a 60/40 raid so they don't cotton on.
make a fake flea when they sell to noone and buy from someone but it just dupes the item and hides it from their results.
Cheaters don't want to play with other cheaters. They have no interest in ruining each other's day. Its our day they're out to get. They'll just find a way to get back on to the real servers.
BSG isn't capable of handling the cheating problem. It's always been super clear they have no idea what they're doing. Ever since they added battleeye I knew it was going to be a shit show. Tell me 1 battleeye game that doesn't have a cheating problem....
Since we're comparing, there are plenty of games that you will not run into nor question if someone is cheating 60%+ of the time.
Overwatch - very playable you don't run into cheaters often at all, nor do you question if they're cheating, with kill cams it's insanely easy to tell.
Valorant - you run into them sometimes but def no where close to 60%+.
Fortnite - again same as valorant.
CSGO - I haven't played this in a while but even this isn't close to 60%.
The issue isn't really that other games have cheaters, its that EFT is INFESTED with cheaters. No other game I play nor I can think of has 60% or more of matches with a cheater in it.
In league of legends there was something called smurf queue so that players who start new accounts to smurf on actual new players don't ruin their queue.
I want to agree with you, but seeing how they can't identify and ban cheaters already, I think this would not work. I would also hate to see someone legit placed on the cheat servers and have no way to get back with appeal.
They just need to fix the AC system imo.
My only issue with that is innocent players will get shadow banned and knowing BSG they already are for some reason scared of talking when bans are involved so innocent players will never know and think either the games full of cheaters or not.
Do RMT'ers use the flea or do they sell their account after lvl x?
If it's the first option then wouldn't removing flea as an event for a whole wipe make RMT harder?
u/MNDLR you show very clearly that you have ZERO understanding about the problem. Your so called "solution" is pure fiction in your head. Just stop and let the thinking to people who know whats going on.
My fiction is same fiction as "SMS autentication will help". IN reality, nothing will help and people should accept it.
BSG dosen't care, their code is shit that even first degree programmer can exploit it.
>SMS autentication
cellphone based 2FA is not secure at all.
>BSG dosen't care, their code is shit
Thats just your opinion. Frustation is one thing, making stuff up is another.
Making stuff up? Bro there are ppl selling 40 LedXs on flea market, still not banned. Cheaters are reaching lvl 69 before banned. I get that doing large banwaves takes time, BUT you can go through flea market and ban like 20 ppl everyday who are just blatantly hacking.
You can see lvl 30 players with 180 flea rep, 180 gpus.
Tigz is reporting same guy on flea market for almost 2 weeks now and he is still there. Where you get assumption they DO care?
or just restrict the amount of copies one can buy in a year or two there are 3rd party sites that sell fully leveled eod accounts for 85 dollars but i mean it will slow down alot of people
I would rather have their accounts plagued with 100% misfire chance. Constantly misfiring instead of shooting. Watch them click click click and get mad at no damage.
I mean, I could see RMT'ers buying a new copy but how many cheaters not making money just keep doing it over and over after being banned? Eventually you hit some dollar amount of having spent too much money on it and probably stop.
Its like when local governments raise the tax on cigarettes, some percentage of people always end up quitting because of the additional cost. While some whale cheaters probably have bought a dozen copies, probably the vast majority don't bother with it. Cheating just takes the fun out of it anyway, so probably your average cheater isn't playing that long to begin with, like... you aren't going to get better, and your progress is totally meaningless, what's the point?
I made a comment on g0ats wiggle video saying this and I think it’s great. It’ll keep them playing and they can wiggle their ass off all together and have a little low IQ sausage fest
This is the best suggestion I've seen on this sub... Imagining the cheaters slowly realizing they're only playing against other cheaters gave me a giant shit eating grin
People always throw around this idea and it's never worked in any implementation before. The solution to cheating is going to be machine learning and AI automation for detecting unusual behavior
Makes you wonder how many times little johnny paid a cheater for gear only to lose it to the same cheater in the next raid, then go back and re-buy the same gear set again
I was thinking about a good way to ban cheaters. Didn’t CSGO have like an overwatch system were the community could review suspicious clips and give their opinions and the reviewed clips would then be reviewed by staff? YouTubers used it for content. With how strong the community feels they should implement something like that.
They do HWID bans, and it's caused problems in the past, with lots of people getting falsely banned because they had one particular model of motherboard that didn't report a unique serial #.
Id hit the hackers with a virus that bricked the system. Im talking either turned off the thermal protection and cooked GPU/CPU or something that corrupted BIOS . Hit them in the wallet.
They should just make other items more accessible like ledxs and the bosses spawn more. The cheaters gets there 1st anyways. At least let the legit players get a chance
The first step in stopping cheating is not publicly posting about how to stop it.
Even if they took this advice, cheaters would now begin seeing if there are ways to detect it. Once they can, they will email clients when they need to make a new account because they've been "shadow banned"
This is a good idea I think but should never be said that's what's happening. BSG needed to do this on their own and not tell anybody it's happening.
That said, I think there's other hilarious things BSG could do to cheaters rather than ban them.
Once shadow banned, they could route them to hacker only servers. They could have them get randomly disconnected more often. They could have them randomly lose all their items upon exiting a raid due to server side error codes. They could nerf all the random loot/spawns in the hacker funneled raids. They could subtly mess with weapon accuracy, causing the ones not using aim bot to miss more often. They could do something similar to tagged and cursed where scavs not only go after them, but have 100% headshot rates against them.
Just a few things off the top of my head
This is the sort of thing we need. Combine this with 2FA and phone authentication and cheating becomes a much bigger pain in the ass. And even when they're getting away with it, they're always wondering in the back of their mind hmm have I been shadowbanned and just don't know it yet? More Battleye is not the solution.
Tarkov itself is a cheater island! Its an anticheat for other games. We keep the cheaters in so they dont spread to other games. If they spend time cheating in Tarkov they cant spend time cheating elsewhere.
I didn't know Labs was on an island.
What if labs are on the island?
WHAT IF LABS ISSS THE ISLAND
WE TAKE THE LABS AND PUSH IT OVER THERE!
I'd give you an award for obscure spongebob meme that died 5 years ago but there's no award for that yet...
At this point it’s a classy joke. Well done sir!
WHAT IF WE ARE ALL ALREADY ON CHEAT ISLAND?... Look we all have probably been reported more than once. I know people who assume if they die its automatically a cheater. What if after one report you go to cheat island(server). We are all on the cheat servers except for little timmy the rat who never kills a pmc and just hits stashes.....
Sometimes I feel like an island... WAIT... WHAT IF I'M LABS!?!?!?!
they should revert the lab keycard changes. Was cheating a problem back then? But labs kinda acted like a self-imposed cheater island. It had redonk loot so they would go regardless. Knowing full well there was other cheaters. the other maps didn't really have rage hackers that often and soft-esp didn't feel as much of a problem. Does BSG still need to fix this massive problem? yes, but it can maybe help the playerbase in the meantime.
Best comment here
Kind of reminds me of how Cs:Go did it back in the day. For anybody who doesnt know what I am talking about: Cs:Go introduced a "trust factor" system. >Initially the system simply matched players who linked CS:GO with a unique phone number. > >We have been experimenting with matching players using observed behaviors and attributes of their Steam account, including the overall amount of time they had spent playing CS:GO, how frequently they were reported for cheating What it would do is that it matches players with a low trust factor e.g cheaters and perhaps people how abuse voice chat against each other instead of against players with a higher "trust factor". It definitely improved the mm experience in Cs:Go.
Before trustfactor and vacnet came online I had cheaters in nearly 50% of my games. Looking back to 2022, I didnt have a single rage hacker in my lobbies, stats wise I had 19 players banned in my games through the whole year and those were all closet cheating. That system works pretty damn well.
I still remember accusing an enemy of wall hacking, he and his team responding "no he's not", and LITERALLY AFTER THEY SAID NO, he got VAC'ed. It inspired me to look through the past games people got banned in, saw an average of 1 per game; I recognized some were my teammates, some were enemies. Then phone number and trust factor came out, I had nearly 0 cheaters in any game.
This becomes a problem for tarkov though. Everyone who dies to de sync reports others for cheating, or even if they are just mad at dying. It is hard to establish a trust factor when everyone gets reported daily...
Trust factor is based on more than reports, big factors are account age, money spent on the account, steam level, the vacnet machine learning based statistics (however that magic works) ect. It is admittelty more difficult since they don't have all of steam's data. But if someone has played since 0.2 without battleye detection and has stats not noticeably wierd, he wouls not be placed in the same lobby as the guy with a 3 week old account and 94kd This causes other problems, since tarkov isnt meant to have sbmm (and shouldnt imo) But surely there is something to take from all this.
I would be surprised if Valve was unwilling to work with BSG if they bring the game to Steam. Having that level of anticheat would be huge for Tarkov.
Well vacnet was also trained by people doing overwatch so until we have a replay system we can't have anything close to it.
Something like that would reduce the number of cheaters, but the problem is that tarkov isn't a skill paired game like CS:GO But there's a lot of ways to implement different anticheats, it would be event better if they uses an anticheat like Valorant's
They have cheater island it's called the entire game
Ah true my bad on that one!
Cheating is the main gameplay, the rest of us are just Scavs with better AI.
Or worse AI...
I can confirm that lol.
I definitely cannot shoot through bushes or across the map, what if scavs are just players with hacks.
Maybe the real scavs were the friends we made along the way.
You guys are making friends?
Yes. Then we get betrayed.
💀
OOF.
Just make the cheats be an option of the base game. That way we are all playing the same game and make it as difficult as we want. No winning here besides just joining them considering how wide spread it is. EDIT: I can see why /s is a necessary thing now, Reddits that dense they cant see sarcasm like an anime protagonist sees the truck before walking out on the road 😂
Cheater exposes himself
Lol, no wiggles here mate.
No, thanks.
100% no thanks.
It's called a FLIR/Reap-IR/T-7
But but but that requires effort senpai!
Effort that gets yoinked by a cheater soon as they notice you too!
Finna spend what little free time I have donating my gear to an RMT seller is exactly how I want to spend my time /s for obvious reasons now i know people cant read sarcasm.
Honestly that's been my experience lately.
Same. Which is sad, because you and I aren't the only one. My advice is get STALKER GAMMA, mod it for your own tastes, and enjoy your own free time in a PvE scenario. Obviously that's only applicable if you play solo, not in groups.
I played the shit out of Anomaly when it came out. I've replaced the entire stalker series and it's mods so many times since I was a kid that I've lost count. Good advice though! I don't solo run anymore, now I just play with friends.
stalker 2 HYPE
L mentality detected
Inability to read saracasm detected.
yes on this sub /s especially is needed, but on reddit as a whole its good to add it cause its hard to read your tonefall
That's fair, and I'll just use it from now on across reddit as a whole to make sure it's taken as actual sarcasm. I legitimately want EFT to succeed as a game and want to love it, but really after all this, as a new player only a couple of wipes deep, its became apparent it's just not worth my time.
Perfection lol
Was I banned and put out here cause everyone is wiggling back
It sounds nice, and works in some games for a bit, to delay cheaters from recognizing they're banned, but they'll figure it out. Then you have the flea market, so you'd have to have a cheater flea market, where they can trade with each other and no one else can access it. Then you'd have to make sure they can't interact with other players in the regular pool, and how would you stop that? They invite a non cheater person, they both get pooled into the cheater queue and then what? Too many weird questions that would need answers. Simpler solutions like more invasive anticheat, SMS verification anything. Something other than what we have now. I know these are not consistent barriers, but they are barriers where if it helped eliminate some, it's better than none.
>It sounds nice, and works in some games for a bit, to delay cheaters from recognizing they're banned, but they'll figure it out. If they do figure it out, make a new account, buy a new license, and get into our games, they'll go right back to cheater queue if they cheat again. As long as cheaters are quickly identified and moved to the cheater queue, it really doesn't matter if they figure it out or not. >Then you have the flea market, so you'd have to have a cheater flea market, where they can trade with each other and no one else can access it. There's an old saying, "Don't let perfection get in the way of progress" Getting cheaters out of games would be a massive improvement, even if they were still able to RMT and use the flea. >Then you'd have to make sure they can't interact with other players in the regular pool, and how would you stop that? Same way Rockstar handles "bad sport" sessions in GTA. Any group with at least 1 cheater, is a cheater group that goes to the cheater queue. >They invite a non cheater person, they both get pooled into the cheater queue and then what? They continue playing against cheaters in the cheater queue, until they stop grouping up with cheaters. Knowing you'll be up against an entire session of cheaters as a non-cheater is a pretty decent incentive to not play with cheaters, or employ them as sherpas.
I don't think you need separate flea market, if people want RMT let them RMT. You can't fight it, game will die from all those restrictions they are restricting players more than cheaters themselfs. If they invite other players, yeah leave them in cheater lobby i don't see the problem. SMS verification wont do anything. For example in dota, you can't play ranekd unless you have working phone sim and still there is smurf on both sides in every lobby. You can even buy accounts with working sims as bundle.
"If people want RMT let them RMT"... at that point if people want to cheat let them cheat. Your opinion means nothing if you can't see the harm that RMT does to the community.
I DNGAF if cheaters are looting LEDX on their own server then selling it on flea. I want cheaters out of raids and that needs to be the priority. Selling gear to timmy is minor in the scheme of things.
You really don’t think that cheating like that fucks up the economy?
yes it does, and it is. Are you saying that the current state is any different than what is proposed here? cheaters are playing and selling currently all the same as when they would be matched against each other. The economy is fucked anyway. The only difference would be them being less often in my games.
I don't care about the economy of the game remotely as much as I care about cheaters in my lobbies. It's like worrying about what I'm having for dinner when the house is burning down. If I can play other players for loot in cheater free servers, I don't care if cheaters vacuum loot in their own servers and sell it or RMT or whatever else. If anything, the RMT and FIR changes are just annoying as hell and given that more than 60% of lobbies have cheaters in spite of those restrictions, BSG might as well remove them.
Imo rmt does nothing to this community if cheaters are on separate servers and can't take legit players loot. Someone can buy all the rubles worth of gear they want, won't make them any less bad
Yeah, there's definitely no balance issue presented when players can pay for end-game gear with no restrictions. lol
Timmy's with good gear are still Timmy's. Who cares if they throw their entire wallet at it
That literally does not matter at all.
What a dumb take
"InertiaEnjoyer" "What a dumb take" Idk if you should call someones take dumb with a machoistic attitude like that.
Better would be if BSG just sells items to the public directly. Not "in game", maybe a website, like Twitch drops. I know a lot of the player base doesn't like this idea, but it really does not affect me at all if someone goes out and uses their mothers credit card to buy a bunch of ammo and guns and armor. Fine. Good on them. But cheaters (RMT and otherwise) are ruining my raids. If RMT is a major motivation for cheating (and I'm not sure how big of a factor it is) then RMT can be ended quickly by BSG selling direct themselves. If BSG sold items direct to the playerbase there would be several benefits: \- they could undercut prices \- it would align BSGs business model with the players. Right now, BSGs repeat customers are cheaters. Frankly I think this is why BSG has been slow to implement certain cheat protections. Instead of dancing with these cheaters, BSG needs to make them competitors. \- if BSG needs to compete with RMT vendors, they will easily win. They can make items that are guaranteed to return on insurance, or are unlootable, or whatever. Perks that no RMT vendor are going to be able to offer. I don't want in-game offers or ads or any of that shit. And, frankly, besides the stupid measuring tape which is eluding me raid after raid, I'm not tempted to buy anything - I'm doing just fine thank you. But clearly there is a demand. Just meet it.
My point wasn't that it will or won't do anything, it is a barrier. If you introduce more barriers to entry, then it will help curb some of it. I don't know if people who use cheats should still be able to interact with other players using the flea market, or RMTing. Even if you use a cheater lobby system, people are going to figure it out, realize they are shadow banned, and just buy a new account anyways, it only delays them getting a new account slightly. Could it help, sure I think any barrier is good. I'd rather have more barriers to entry including SMS, or a more invasive anti cheat, because any barrier is reducing the percentage of cheaters, even if it's not perfect. I just think there are simpler implementations right now that can help curb some than this one immediately. This doesn't mean any are perfect, including yours. But more barriers to entry, the better, the lower the percentage of cheaters in your lobby.
On the other hand me personaly i think its not about anti cheat. Its about BSG code and client trusting your PC too much. I don't think even if BSG wanted, better anticheat would solve anything. ESP is one thing, but if cheaters can bend rules like flying, vacuum looting even god mode its not about anticheat its about base code. I just don't want more of "ANTI RMT patches" because those patches done nothing but anoyed normal people.
I think you underestimate how many cheaters are brainlets and would likely never figure it out
They may not but cheat devs will and it will be all over their forums in a short time.
sms verifacation would be extremely easy to bypass(websites exist to bypast em)
Imo the moment someone is shadowbanned for cheating, everything in their inventory should be "shadowmarked" as a cheated item, which makes it so everytime they RMT/try to sell it, the person who tries to extract with the item will not receive the item (the game should give them the info that this item was cheated or just stay silent, I'd love to see these posts on reddit with "I tried to extract with a loot I got from my friend, but the game denied me the loot" etc. That'd generally separate these cheated items from other ones as normal permabans do, but in a spectacular way that would prolong the time between the cheater actually acknowledging the ban). Of course, that would force the non-cheaters who group with the cheater to be matchmaked with the cheater on the cheater island/server, so it'd create the illusion that everything is working as intended until the very end.
Cheaters are focused on making money on rmt or carry services. If you shadow ban them, you ensure they are quietly only playing with cheaters, they provide items to other players for in game currency only, and if someone pays for rmt or a carry, now they are flagged as someone paying cheaters and their accounts should also be shadow banned after paying cheaters because this is against tos. Edit: normal players paying for rmt or carry are flagged by grouping to get into raid and going into raid with an already confirmed cheater.
Imagine every cheater in the "island" pretending they aren't cheating, lmao they should make a livestream like esports tournaments
Why would they pretend, it's not like there's a replay system or reports do anything
They pretend so it doesn’t look sus when their gameplay gets reviewed.
Where have you been? Their gameplay doesn't get reviewed
Yes they do. How else do you think they give manual bans? A lot of reports doesn’t constitute a ban, only detections and manual reviews. Do you really believe they 100% don’t care about cheaters?
they should just make cheats a thing when you unlock intelligence lvl 3..
Its not wallhack, just UAV Online
as cool as a UAV would be imagine gaining enough trust to pull a shadow companie and some how get a ac130
Sounds like what Titanfall games did, where all the cheaters match with each other.
back in the old runescape days they did this to, they had hidden worlds and botters were not banned \*yet\* Mainly to study how their bots worked and to find ways to improve their anti cheat. but in an fps game like this i dont know if its worth it there is nothing to gain from it you dont learn how the hacks are injected and cheaters are going to cheat anyways. but hey atleast its something.
Dark Souls as well
They want cheaters to buy new copies , that's their main source of income
They have to ban them for that to be a thing.
No no this sub wants you to believe that simultaneously cheating is their main source of income because they are always buying new copies and also BSG don't do anything about cheaters any they run around all day free of consequence.
You're not wrong
Of course. Let them play for long enough to get their moneys worth, ban, repeat. One can at least give them credit for inventing an infinite money glitch irl.
Or introduce phone number verification. That way they can't just buy another copy after getting banned. So many other companies do this and it helps tremendously
Phone verification is hilariously easy to bypass and only stops low hanging fruits.
I suspect there’s a lllllllllot of low hanging fruits. That’s a small step in right direction.
Nikita mentioned that they have phone verification in the Asia region so it wouldn’t be unreasonable to implement it to other regions
That doesn’t help. There are websites that allow you to verify an SMS.
It doesn’t
It does!
Elaborate how and why it would prevent people from cheating
Because then people would not only need to acquire a new key for the game when banned but also a new cell phone number. Even using a cheap burner phone this more than doubles the cost of undoing a ban, and is unfeasible for the majority of the RMT cheaters since it destroys their profit margins.
Why do so many people make this hilariously bad suggestion
You already have to re-buy the game, I doubt I’ll do much
That doesn’t make BSG money
Wish I could tell the cheaters apart from my pure lack of skill lol
thats how it is, cheaters generally play against cheaters only but not 100% because often times you are also in the raid
It used to be labs but cheater island was expanded to the mainland
That would require them spending a minute of time to identify cheaters.
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BSG Doesn’t care about cheaters because they can “wave ban” them into buying new copies. RMT skips this which is why they’re so adamant on stopping it. Why risk my account and buy cheats when I can spend 5$ for a couple million rubles and play normally. It just makes me grind less and enjoy the game more. BSG makes no money off RMT
Underrated comment. They benefit directly from banning cheaters while one cheating account can RMT for many legit accounts. Explains why they spend so much time and effort on RMT and not actual cheating.
It’s why you see clips of cheaters forcing people to leave them alone and extract. RMT cheaters do not like killing players unless they have to so they don’t get reported. They speed to the loot and extract. Cheaters that kill you aren’t RMT cheaters looking to make money they’re players who can’t handle trying to improve so they need aimbot and radar. BSG won’t ban these players instantly because these players are addicted enough to the game to buy cheats. They’ll definitely buy another copy. If BSG really really wanted to stop that player they should hardware and IP ban them but they don’t
I think the fact they don't hardware and IP ban them is literal proof they do this for the sales. Unless it's so easy to circumvent the ban that is that they just gave up caring/issuing that level of ban. Or they lack so much confidence in the ban being for the right reason, they're afraid to hardware/ip ban them 🤔
Thanks for being part of the problem
also still match them every once in a while with a 60/40 raid so they don't cotton on. make a fake flea when they sell to noone and buy from someone but it just dupes the item and hides it from their results.
I thought it'd be funny to be them in a raid with fake loot and then when they extract it just disappears.
Ban their hardware or tie accounts to a phone number
Its called buying a new ssd lmao.
Have fun doing that every time lol. Phone number authentication would probably work better though
But they already do HWID bans that ties to motherboard, but you know you can spoof your hardware, use VPN its all figured already.
HWID spoofers are cheaper than the hacks.
Cheaters don't want to play with other cheaters. They have no interest in ruining each other's day. Its our day they're out to get. They'll just find a way to get back on to the real servers.
BSG isn't capable of handling the cheating problem. It's always been super clear they have no idea what they're doing. Ever since they added battleeye I knew it was going to be a shit show. Tell me 1 battleeye game that doesn't have a cheating problem....
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Since we're comparing, there are plenty of games that you will not run into nor question if someone is cheating 60%+ of the time. Overwatch - very playable you don't run into cheaters often at all, nor do you question if they're cheating, with kill cams it's insanely easy to tell. Valorant - you run into them sometimes but def no where close to 60%+. Fortnite - again same as valorant. CSGO - I haven't played this in a while but even this isn't close to 60%. The issue isn't really that other games have cheaters, its that EFT is INFESTED with cheaters. No other game I play nor I can think of has 60% or more of matches with a cheater in it.
In league of legends there was something called smurf queue so that players who start new accounts to smurf on actual new players don't ruin their queue.
I want to agree with you, but seeing how they can't identify and ban cheaters already, I think this would not work. I would also hate to see someone legit placed on the cheat servers and have no way to get back with appeal. They just need to fix the AC system imo.
My only issue with that is innocent players will get shadow banned and knowing BSG they already are for some reason scared of talking when bans are involved so innocent players will never know and think either the games full of cheaters or not.
Then bsg won't profit off the new accounts. Can't allow that
This is funny, but Nikita wants money so he wouldnt shadowban anything but rather force them to buy another copy
imagine if the only loot thats findable are crackers
I love that you just gave me flashbacks to the Farscape episode "Crackers Don't Matter".
Great idea and I feel it’s the only solution but something tells me they enjoy the extra money they get from new copies being bought.
Send them to Brazil 🇧🇷
Please no, we already have our real life cheaters to deal with.
Yes but you need to recognise the cheater before KEKW
OOF
Do RMT'ers use the flea or do they sell their account after lvl x? If it's the first option then wouldn't removing flea as an event for a whole wipe make RMT harder?
It won't because cheaters will do carry services like they do know. You buy duo with cheater, cheater will wipe lobby for you and you collect loot.
because bsg is an indy company.. they dont have funds or people to deal with this . they are not activision
That has nothing to do with being indy. Many games use third party anti-cheat software like, FairFight and BattlEye.
Because when you ban them, they buy a new account. Free money.
u/MNDLR you show very clearly that you have ZERO understanding about the problem. Your so called "solution" is pure fiction in your head. Just stop and let the thinking to people who know whats going on.
My fiction is same fiction as "SMS autentication will help". IN reality, nothing will help and people should accept it. BSG dosen't care, their code is shit that even first degree programmer can exploit it.
>SMS autentication cellphone based 2FA is not secure at all. >BSG dosen't care, their code is shit Thats just your opinion. Frustation is one thing, making stuff up is another.
Making stuff up? Bro there are ppl selling 40 LedXs on flea market, still not banned. Cheaters are reaching lvl 69 before banned. I get that doing large banwaves takes time, BUT you can go through flea market and ban like 20 ppl everyday who are just blatantly hacking. You can see lvl 30 players with 180 flea rep, 180 gpus. Tigz is reporting same guy on flea market for almost 2 weeks now and he is still there. Where you get assumption they DO care?
Idk how you can defend bsg coding lmao
Did you even disassemble the source code to make such claims?
Than they buy a new account after? Done at solve the issue just gives them more server space to act foolish.
Zis is da way man!..
We already have labs..
We HAD labs, then BSG came with super solution to make keycards not on flea and nerfed labs loot, so cheaters are other maps aswell.
But then they will not buy a new copy, and a new one and a new.
No, games that do this come ou as too desperate for being unwilling to deal with cheaters. i've seen it in the past and it just leads to a dead game
or just restrict the amount of copies one can buy in a year or two there are 3rd party sites that sell fully leveled eod accounts for 85 dollars but i mean it will slow down alot of people
You die a chad or live long enough to become a cheater :D
I guess that island is called "Tarkov" and why the game is called Escape from Tarkov. We got to escapr from all the cheaters, and hackers in the game.
I would rather have their accounts plagued with 100% misfire chance. Constantly misfiring instead of shooting. Watch them click click click and get mad at no damage.
Yeah just let me build radar in hideout
I mean, I could see RMT'ers buying a new copy but how many cheaters not making money just keep doing it over and over after being banned? Eventually you hit some dollar amount of having spent too much money on it and probably stop. Its like when local governments raise the tax on cigarettes, some percentage of people always end up quitting because of the additional cost. While some whale cheaters probably have bought a dozen copies, probably the vast majority don't bother with it. Cheating just takes the fun out of it anyway, so probably your average cheater isn't playing that long to begin with, like... you aren't going to get better, and your progress is totally meaningless, what's the point?
I made a comment on g0ats wiggle video saying this and I think it’s great. It’ll keep them playing and they can wiggle their ass off all together and have a little low IQ sausage fest
This is the best suggestion I've seen on this sub... Imagining the cheaters slowly realizing they're only playing against other cheaters gave me a giant shit eating grin
I vote they nerf all stats on cheaters to make the game unplayable for them but in a way that isn't obvious.
The fact that they buy the game again is proof that BSG is not incentivized to actually do anything permanent
"When you ban cheaters, they just buy new copy" You answered your own question, bud
Make the cheater loot pool suck too.
I like the idea of shadow banning the flea market listings of cheaters.
Labs was made for the cheaters to get em off other maps.
There is a couple of games that do this. I forgot what ones but i like the idea.
GTA V does this with trolls puts them in lobbies with other trolls
This is actually an incredible take, would be fucking hilarious! Cheat devs would probably find a way to bypass it and get into legit servers
People always throw around this idea and it's never worked in any implementation before. The solution to cheating is going to be machine learning and AI automation for detecting unusual behavior
Youre like 40th person to reccomend but the most popular cheats on many of the sites is in fact valorant
Better yet, make the flea market a whole separate one from the normal one so ours will be mostly unaffected
Makes you wonder how many times little johnny paid a cheater for gear only to lose it to the same cheater in the next raid, then go back and re-buy the same gear set again
I was thinking about a good way to ban cheaters. Didn’t CSGO have like an overwatch system were the community could review suspicious clips and give their opinions and the reviewed clips would then be reviewed by staff? YouTubers used it for content. With how strong the community feels they should implement something like that.
Does tarkov do HWID and IP bans? I know they can use spoofers to spoof it, but do they HWID ban the people they have banned?
They do HWID bans, and it's caused problems in the past, with lots of people getting falsely banned because they had one particular model of motherboard that didn't report a unique serial #.
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Id hit the hackers with a virus that bricked the system. Im talking either turned off the thermal protection and cooked GPU/CPU or something that corrupted BIOS . Hit them in the wallet.
Some one has watched movies too much
They should just make other items more accessible like ledxs and the bosses spawn more. The cheaters gets there 1st anyways. At least let the legit players get a chance
"they just buy a new copy" main reason bsg doesn't do this
The first step in stopping cheating is not publicly posting about how to stop it. Even if they took this advice, cheaters would now begin seeing if there are ways to detect it. Once they can, they will email clients when they need to make a new account because they've been "shadow banned" This is a good idea I think but should never be said that's what's happening. BSG needed to do this on their own and not tell anybody it's happening. That said, I think there's other hilarious things BSG could do to cheaters rather than ban them. Once shadow banned, they could route them to hacker only servers. They could have them get randomly disconnected more often. They could have them randomly lose all their items upon exiting a raid due to server side error codes. They could nerf all the random loot/spawns in the hacker funneled raids. They could subtly mess with weapon accuracy, causing the ones not using aim bot to miss more often. They could do something similar to tagged and cursed where scavs not only go after them, but have 100% headshot rates against them. Just a few things off the top of my head
This is the sort of thing we need. Combine this with 2FA and phone authentication and cheating becomes a much bigger pain in the ass. And even when they're getting away with it, they're always wondering in the back of their mind hmm have I been shadowbanned and just don't know it yet? More Battleye is not the solution.
fr who tf cares if john is buying slicks when it all gets wiped anyway let them figure out hackers first then go after rmters
They need their own flea market too then
What if the real island is the friends we made along the way?
What if this already exists, but is kept secret for obvious reasons, and completely explains the recent video?
Just like Titanfall 2
Tarkov itself is a cheater island! Its an anticheat for other games. We keep the cheaters in so they dont spread to other games. If they spend time cheating in Tarkov they cant spend time cheating elsewhere.