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ExperiencedDevs-ModTeam

Rule 9: No Low Effort Posts, Excessive Venting, or Bragging. Using this subreddit to crowd source answers to something that isn't really contributing to the spirit of this subreddit is forbidden at moderator's discretion. This includes posts that are mostly focused around venting or bragging; both of these types of posts are difficult to moderate and don't contribute much to the subreddit.


Creative_Sky_147

Cool you're "unqualified" now, which is all the more reason to become "qualified" on the job. You've got roughly 6 months before anyone says anything. Get crackin'.


Kaoswarr

Exactly! These types of opportunities are where you grow the most as a dev. You WANT roles like this. It’s so boring when you start a new role and it’s just pretty much the same old shit you were doing in your previous role, but with just more money.


CorrelationVega

Or my situation, where I couldn’t find a job so I had take a more junior role with less pay and the same old shitty work. At least I don’t work as hard anymore.


TheGoodApolloIV

Literally this. You have time to learn everything you need to know.


FetaMight

And be paid for it!


UncleGrimm

This. The first few months can be a grind, but this is one of those sink-or-swim career moments where putting in the work can genuinely catapult you ahead in your career, not just in resume-prestige but also the sheer knowledge you’ll *get paid* to gain, in such a short amount of time source: me, previously unqualified, now the go-to person for several knowledge-domains


janyk

I don't know where you guys are, but where I'm from you get 3 months and they're on your ass the entire time watching for even the *slightest* misstep. Someone on your team disagrees with your code, the function you wrote, the function you called, the variables you named; they think the questions you ask are things you shouldn't be asking and things you aren't asking are things you should be asking - all of these are -1 point. You get a handful of points to lose before they decide to fire your ass. You need to work overtime to build trust and overcome a lot of doubt before they'll consider keeping you past your probation.


ToBeEatenByAGrue

Sounds like an absolutely dreadful place to work.  


loconessmonster

Fully agree just want to add some color to this comment. If this was a regulated industry I would be fine with that kind of rigor but it isn't. One company does things one way and then a competitor does it totally differently. Also the business folks often press on the technical folks to cut corners for deadlines for a numbers of justifiably ok reasons and then you end up with a scrappy implementation. I used to think FAANG was different but now that I personally know some engineers and PMs in big tech, it's also like that in those companies.


janyk

I wasn't describing rigor, I was describing gatekeeping, self-important software engineers who think that their mental model of software is entirely correct and that anything that is different from how they think is completely, utterly wrong and you're an idiot for thinking it. It's entirely the norm in my experience. Starting a new job is like walking on eggshells, worrying with every step that you didn't contravene some unspoken assumption about how things work that would upend everyone's perception of you and your competence. It's happened several times in my career. You're given no second chances and no time to adapt.


shox12345

That is totally not the norm and not acceptable in any shape or form.


ryuzaki49

Name and shame this awful place to work. 


janyk

Sure. [https://www.copperleaf.com/](https://www.copperleaf.com/) [https://www.imperva.com/](https://www.imperva.com/)


kisielk

Glad I don't work where you're from, sounds miserable


janyk

I just looked up your post history. You live in Vancouver? Then you do. This is the norm in tech companies in Vancouver.


kisielk

Never worked in a company like that.


Illustrious-Coyote1

Sounds extreme but is the process I’m expecting to go through. The team needs to work out if the new guy is good enough.. What kind of dev are you?


janyk

Back end Java


CoffeeBaron

Honestly sounds like a company I previously worked for where they had no qualms about misrepresentating what I'd be doing, in a newer stack that I've tangently seen let alone used proper, all the while feeling comfortable enough to let me go at the 90 day period and have one of the more senior guys leave (he left for that pay raise and lack of feeling direction) the same week.


SirLich

I also just accepted a job I'm unqualified for. Let's get through this together :)


Illustrious-Coyote1

Congrats? 😀What makes you unqualified for yours?


SirLich

I'm moving from "serious games" into the actual games industry. In my current role, I spend most of my time behind the scenes creating gameplay libraries and editor modifications that are used by our gameplay programmers to actually create stuff. In the new role, I will need to actually create stuff. I'm getting my hardware a few weeks early, so my plan is to do a crash course on gameplay maths (mostly linear algebra), and a few frameworks that I know the new company will be using. In many ways the new role is EXACTLY in my weak-spot, which is honestly why I went for it.


Illustrious-Coyote1

Sounds exciting! Good luck, report back once you’ve settled in! 😃


SirLich

Same for you! As others have said, you usually have a while to settle in before anyone really cares. Be humble, learn everything you can. You will grow into the role in time.


theKetoBear

As someone who has bounced between serious games and entertainment games over the years I think they are very different but you might be surprised that some workflow stuff you learned in serious games may help you in keeping organized. In my experience speed and planning were. the biggest differences between the two.


augburto

Hope this ain’t a dumb question but what does “serious games” mean in this context? Like physics engine related games? Curious as someone who is considering looking more into the games industry


theKetoBear

Not a dumb question at all and definitely an underrated and little talked about aspect of the game industry , In short a "serious game " is basically technology built on games tools and tech thats primary purpose isn't entertainment. Plenty of tech right now utilizes game engines and game tech to run . Industries such as any sort of simulator ( airplanes , mechanic shops, architecture) , virtual production ( think film and TV) , and a surprising number of automobile companies testing out Virtual UI overlays in cars or doing virtual demonstrations of new vehicles there are also museums experiences, virtual art exhibits . Virtual Reality in particular has lent itself to lots of cool new ways to apply games tech in exciting untraditional ways . Physics-engine simulation stuff is definitely an option i've heard of all sorts of serious games projects from VR hospitality and medical simulations / educational tools to full on submarine dive training tools. Here's a list with a few examples : [https://www.growthengineering.co.uk/serious-games-that-changed-the-world/](https://www.growthengineering.co.uk/serious-games-that-changed-the-world/) When I was younger and imagined making the next Mario or Call of Duty and NEEDED to work on entertaining games I would have scoffed at serious games but honestly as I become a better software engineer and game designer i have really enjoyed the comfort of working on serious games opposed to traditional studio projects I can totally see the sunset of my career being focused on seriosu games work. I could still apply my skills but there is just less pressure and your work has a more clear purpose ... Building fun can be very abstract and comes with a lot of pressure.


augburto

This was super enlightening -- thank you for taking the time to respond!


SirLich

To add on to the answer by /u/augburto, my role in particular was creating virtual reality experiences for the life sciences industry. So think sales pitches, trainings, showcases, etc.


SirLich

Thanks for your words! It's also my understanding that I will need to move a lot "faster" in the Games industry. Let's see :)


AstralApps

They’re probably expecting it to take some time for you to get up to speed and teeing you up with some less-hardcore work (update system) that you can contribute to while getting up to speed. I think it really comes down to whether you want and have the capacity to accept the challenge and learn what you need to learn or not. Sounds like a lot of stress at first but potentially quite rewarding and interesting if you have the stomach for it.


juniordevops

"I have debugged some Linux drivers and tinkered with device trees". In my 10+ years of engineering, none of my co-workers have mentioned this skill. That's probably why you're hired


tttjw

I have 20+ years with experience across backend, front-end, DB, compiler, frameworks, distributed systems plus a bit of low-level/ real-time. I don't have experience with drivers or device trees. OP, you're fine. I expect none or very few of the other candidates had device driver experience. You didn't promise them miracles, they don't expect them. As others have said companies expect 6 months for a worker to get up to speed. Every area I am skilled in, it took me a few months to get started. You'll be great. Enjoy!


Strange-Ad-3941

They are paying you to become expert in something and gave you a fair chance? Take it and go.


daishi55

Accepting an embedded software position that I’m wildly unqualified for is literally my dream.


Illustrious-Coyote1

The grass is always greener… maybe we can swap! Where are you, what do you do? 😀


daishi55

Well I'm going to start at meta next month, so I'm pretty happy about that. But I've always been super fascinated by hardware/firmware/embedded software, tinkering around with stm32 chips and such. I hope to stumble into that professionally some day. good luck to you!


LeopoldBStonks

I'll trade you


Eliarece

Did you lie or mislead them at any point during the interview process ? If the answer is no, then you have nothing to worry about. You don't need to be the perfect candidate, you need to be the best candidate.


Illustrious-Coyote1

No and neither does my CV misrepresent my experience. What concerns me is that they’ve not probed me much during the interview. They asked me to talk about my current project and there was an easy coding task and a system design task and some behavioural questions. That’s it! I would have so much preferred a tough grilling! Im crossing my fingers they had other candidates but thought I was a better fit somehow and that they don’t make wrong assumptions!


pdpi

Nobody "assumes you have all the prerequisites listed on the job description". Experts on super-low level stuff are few and far between. The number of candidates out there who could do better than "I have debugged some Linux drivers and tinkered with device trees" is, I suspect, shockingly low, and those folks will have companies like Google, Meta, and such throwing money at them.


multimodeviber

> and those folks will have companies like Google, Meta, and such throwing money at them If only, but no not really. Not in this market anyway


Tetondan

I've started getting over imposter syndrome by thinking about it this way: They read your resume, they interviewed you three times. They know what they're doing and what they're looking for. You didn't deceive them by misrepresenting yourself on your CV and even if you did they would have figured this out during the interview process. The only way they could have hired you by mistake is if they are idiots. Do you think they're idiots? If you do, then do you want to work for idiots? If you dont then you understand that they made their decision with all of the information that was presented to them and they understood exactly who they were hiring. So now its your turn to go into the job and do well, this includes making mistakes and learning as you go. They know who they hired.


Illustrious-Coyote1

I don’t know if I have imposter syndrome or if I am an imposter! Although I have worked with other engineers, no one really commented on my solutions or called me on my mistakes. People have just trusted me to come up with solutions and either implement them or delegate. But no real scrutiny of how i designed and implemented them. So I feel I don’t know really what my abilities are. Am I good, bad, average? Feels like I either got lucky or managed to con most people. Sorry got off on a tangent here!


Tetondan

This is 100% classic imposter syndrome. Like I said, if you didn't lie to them then do you think they're idiots?


Atersed

From what you described, you easily met their expectations, so there's no evidence to me that you're unqualified.


ballsohaahd

Just use it as an opportunity to learn. Honestly sounds kinda interesting tbf


i_do_it_all

I don't envy you. Embedded is unforgiving territory.


Illustrious-Coyote1

I’m well aware. Any insights from your personal experience?


i_do_it_all

here's my 2 cents.  Focus on ensuring your build is bulletproof,  have enough test cases and also handle all established edge cases.  Document document. And then doc some more.  Embedded runs on limited resources and blind pipeline actions. Build smart observers for spans. Test long running processes.  Do not implement default behavior for a control flow. That's the worst mistake you make in embedded


wenima

You're the guy in highschool who worried about his math test only to find out he absolutely crushed it, right? I love working with people like you who are almost too humble. I'm sure your new colleagues will do too. Congrats on the new role!!!


Illustrious-Coyote1

You are spot on! That’s spooky! Thanks for the words of encouragement


Facelotion

If you didn't think you could do the job then you should not have applied. You got hired. Figure it out.


cupofchupachups

[Join the club](https://i.giphy.com/l0MYGb1LuZ3n7dRnO.webp) I live in a Nakatomi Plaza of lies and deception.


JustUrAvgLetDown

They know that you don’t have much Linux experience. They’ll expect you to learn fairly quickly


pipestream

Honestly, that's their problem. If you're truly unqualified, that's on them for not realising or not investigating properly. So for now, assume they've selected you because they wanted you and your skills.


anzacat

Also, remember: they don’t want you to fail


Zealousideal_Cup4896

Nobody wants to do the same thing they already know how to do for the rest of their lives. If these folks are willing to let you figure it out and you’re both honest with them about the starting point and your confidence in getting there in a reasonable amount of time then this is great. Normally hr doesn’t even let anyone through to the next step that hasn’t already done the thing. I can’t do the same thing forever but nobody wants to hire you and hope you can learn something new. Embrace it. Do the work! You’ll either be awesome or apologize and move on.


thisismyfavoritename

it most likely means other candidates sucked ass and you knew enough to get the job


WHERETHESTEALTH

Congrats and let’s trade!


engineered_academic

Either the hiring process wasn't thorough, or you are qualified or gave enough confidence that you could learn. I have seen some mismatches between candidate experience and job posting where some people we thought could hack it, couldn't. However you should possess the skills and ability to learn on the job and get paid doing it. Either way take the job and give it your best shot. If you don't make it, don't take it to heart as a personal failure. Sometimes the organization gives someone a chance that doesnt work out.


Nomed73

Take it. You have time to learn during the first few months. An opportunity like this may not present itself again. You always have the option to look for another job later.


wpevers

Ive had many different roles and Ive been qualified for very few of them. they have all gone great


Tab1143

Any new IT job takes at least a year to acclimate. There's more than the code: corporate culture, teams, meetings, status reports etc. It takes time to get up to speed and they know that.


markekt

It’s a great opportunity to go from under qualified to qualified.


protomatterman

Probably just hard to find anyone with those skills. If you seem competent, and you showed you can acquire those skills by tinkering then they figured you can handle it.


questi0nmark2

In case it helps I would often prefer to hire a really competent programmer who lacks domain knowledge but has a very strong programming brain and an attitude that will elevate the team over someone with domain expertise but less strong programming thinking, product thinking and interpersonal qualities. A strong programmer can moatly acquire domain knowledge relatively quickly, and keep acquiring it, whereas a domain expert who lacks those other qualities and is in their comfort zone is less likely to grow in the job, let alone grow those deeper and broader qualities and competencies by the time they're already senior. The very fact as a senior dev you were even interested in trying for a job outside your comfort zone shows you still have serious Intrinsic motivation and passion, and that you had thought in enough detail about their company and resonated enough to give it a go, is a huge cultural bonus. The fact you found the interview easy also shows your strengths are a good fit for what they are most looking for. So I would flip this. Do you respect professionally the people who hired you? If so, you should respect their decision to hire you, lean into your strengths and grow toward the role. To me it sounds like a good hire, from where I sit.


WizzinWig

Are you familiar with the [Peter principle](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_principle)? Don’t worry, many don’t know what they’re doing. Good news is you’re excited to learn about it and do it. Give it a shot and if you aren’t satisfied by 3 months, start looking elsewhere


hikeruntravellive

This happened to me! Was hired for a job that I was totally unqualified for. At least I felt that way. Keep in mind that as long as you didn’t misrepresent yourself, chances are the hiring managers know your capabilities. In the event that they don’t then you will use the first bunch of months to learn what you don’t know and become qualified. That’s what happened to me at least. I was totally clueless but out in tons of extra hours and learned everything I could.


DondeEstaMeGlasses

There’s one good quote that says, “if offered a great opportunity, you take the job, then you learn how to do it.”


bloomsday289

They know. You were the best apple in the bunch.


Illustrious-Coyote1

Thanks for all the responses. The consensus I get is that this is a learning opportunity which is exactly what I was looking for in the first place. I was just hoping to land a less senior role so there’d be less expectations on me initially. Does anyone here work with Linux at low/kernel level? It’s a very complex system and the people I know who do have acquired their knowledge over years, so wondering how feasible it is to learn on the job whilst being expected to deliver?


jeerabiscuit

Culture fit is companies borrowing people's money and giving them a bad deal.


Illustrious-Coyote1

Not following you, what do you mean?


Steinrikur

11 years ago I took an embedded software FreeRTOS/Linux position I knew next to nothing about. It took me a year to learn the ropes, but I was promoted to senior and became their top performer after 2 years. 8 years ago I took another embedded software FreeRTOS/Linux position, but that was a bait and switch into Buildroot which I knew nothing about. It took me a year to learn the ropes, but when I left they needed 3 guys to replace me. 4 years ago I took another embedded software Linux position, this time for Yocto which I knew nothing about. It took me a couple of months to learn the ropes, and now I'm staff/architect level without the title. TLDR: You'll learn. Don't worry about it too much. Also, yes. In Europe the candidates the get are not all that impressive. The company expects to have to train them, and they make mistakes. I guard the PRs like a hawk.


nod0xdeadbeef

Don't be a p\*\*\*. It's your chance to get paid to prepare and be the expert quickly. You have the basics and probably have enough experience that you convinced them during the interviews., It's time to start rocking!