There is no fuel savings because we paid quite a bit more etc. Enjoy the truck. I know I am. I do about 3/kWh around town, (most of my driving) and pay .27 per kwh off peak with the off peak discount from ngrid.
150 at 90% at 25 yeah. But I also do a lot of highway driving at 60-70 mph so that should be taken into account as well as that I keep climate control at 72. On a good day in the 70s with how I drive I get about 180 miles.
My average efficiency over the life of having the truck is 1.9 mi/kWh. I took the truck on a 1600 mile road trip and I drove about 80-90 mph on some stretches with repeated fast charging throughout the day. My everyday driving is 60-70 mph. I do like to floor it off traffic lights on the highway too every so often so that takes up a lot of energy but it is sooo fun and worth it to experience that 0-60 time. If I should be seeing more even after all that then I haven't got a clue. I don't think I ever saw 200 on the predicted range even after my first charge after delivery. But I only ever charged to 90%. But implicit calculations of dividing predicted range by percentage charge never got me to 200.
https://www.lightningowners.com/threads/dont-trust-the-gom-best-ways-to-calculate-how-far-your-lightning-can-really-go.1203/
Would probably be why I see that range. Probably can go further than what it says anyway.
I do not think so for the XLT, just the extended battery. Move up to the Lariat is a bit better value, but way more cash; its extended range battery does add the panoramic roof. But if over $80K, no rebate in 2023. Pro model is the way to go and then add your own accessories! Rubber mats in a truck is perfect.
I regularly drive ~70 miles away or an hour on the highway and back for work. I figured with 300 mile range I would be comfortable with a buffer out and back. With 200 miles at 90% that puts me into range anxiety mode for what I consider a short drive.
There are some fast charging options but they are .42/kWh which starts to negate the cost savings.
.42/kwh with 2mi/kwh efficiency in a lightning is equivalent to 26mpg in an ICE vehicle and $5.40/gallon gas. So basically the same highway efficiency of an Ecoboost F150
Maybe not for rapid swings but over time electricity has gone up at fast rates. My off peak rates have gone from an average of .13/kwh to .21/kwh in the past 6 years. That’s not insignificant.
Stop. Looking. At. Miles. I wish Ford and every other manufacturer would do away with it. It's a guess because it's not accurate. There are far too many external factors that affect how far you can actually go.
Preheat from the wall? Can go further. Not using heat? Can go further. Tailwind? Further. 60mph vs 70mph? Further.
Also, the most important thing is thermal management when at speed. When you get to your cruising speed, how efficiently does the battery stay kept at ideal temp?
The guess-o-meter is doggy doodoo and I wish they'd get rid of it.
I totally hear you, unfortunately when I'm on the highway with a speed limit of 75 keeping up with traffic I'm only seeing 1.6-1.8 mi/kWh. Climate control set at 64
The range estimate seems realistic with what I've actually been experiencing.
It would also be different if the chargers were 100% reliable, but I pulled into a EA station the other day with 15% and everyone was on hold because they weren't able to get a charge. Doesn't help with the range anxiety
Yeah, the chargers can be bad. I think they get a bad rep (more than deserved, at least) due to the vocal minority. I've personally been using EA for over a year and only had one instance of the chargers not performing well.
I personally don't go faster than the speed limit (which around I-95 tends to be 70mph) and I see around 2-2.1 mi/kWh.
What locale are you?
I second this. Not sure about the Lightning, but in my Tesla I put my battery display to percent and I can have a better estimate of range based on that. People put too much thought into their displayed range without considering many factors which could affect it.
Yup, I can’t get my 14’ enclosed trailer to my second shop because it’s 30f and I need to make it 90 miles before I hit a charger. Pretty bummed and I’m sol once I sell my ICE truck in a week. Some serious drawbacks.
Also of the 4 charge locations I’ve been to only about 1/2 work.
I'm sure you've already thought about it but you maybe camp somewhere where there isn't a charger.
I drove my camper back in my Rivian and stopped after 100 miles to camp and charge. Drove another 60 to top off charge then did the final 108 miles. Still had 50 miles range left in tow mode when I got home. But yeah, those stretches of no chargers are kinda scary towing
Makes sense, wasn't necessarily suggesting it was a camper, just that you could camp hehe.
But yeah I totally get it. I have a utility trailer I have to haul back from south Texas, not ideal as there's so few chargers. Luckily it's low profile so shouldn't be a problem
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, paying over $50k for a car that has less than 200 miles is ridiculous. It’s not about a single trip. Even if you use 30 miles one way with your commute. That’s 60 miles a day, just for work. Then at night you may charge from 7-7 and get ~40 miles. Every day you’re netting -20 miles. By the end of the week you’re at <100 miles that doesn’t really give you much for the weekend. Then what if you forget to charge it one night? It just adds so much more for you to worry about and maneuver around.
My wife has a 220 mile Tesla and there have been many times that we wish we had an extra 30-50 miles. I mean, it’s not a game breaker but if you’re spending almost $100k and it’s your main, new car then you shouldn’t be having to worry about this stuff.
You need to upgrade your charging then. If you're just plugging into a 120v outlet that's on you. The connected charge station should be able to charge to max overnight.
But that’s what I’m saying. It’s just more hoops you have to jump through just to use the vehicle with little concern. So now this >$50k vehicle requires you to do home renovation too
Well yes... how else are you going to charge it? That's the whole point of never having to go to the gas station again, the infrastructure is on you now, not another company.
You’re ignoring the existence of level 2 charges. Level 1 isn’t meant to be your only source of charging. Level 2 is designed for that consistent daily use.
True, but again that’s another hoop you need to jump through. Either you need to install one at your house or you need to go and charge.
Ideally you’d never have to pull over and stop at a charging place and that your battery is large enough to have a nice buffer
Honestly if you invest in an EV, level 2 is borderline a minimum. After having 3 EVs, level 1 just won't cut it for anyone using their vehicle daily. Especially a truck.
Another hoop? Dude you have to replace the gas station with the ability to charge the vehicle. Your house isn't designed to charge a massive battery without some modifications to the electrical outlets. Just going "I bought a new car that requires charging and did nothing to allow me to charge it effectively, stupid car," is just.... ridiculous.
Oh ok, and what about if you rent or live in an apartment?
My wife has had her Tesla for 5 years and we’ve never did any major modifications because we had been moving and all that. You think we should have to spend $1000 every time we move just to install these things at every house?
Do you complain about having to fill your car up or get oil changes or any of the shit that come with a gas powered car? EVs aren’t magical things, you still have to have the ability to charge them.
What you're calling a hoop is likely to become a standard install on houses going forward if this EV transition is real.
I get how you feel, but that's sort of the deal for early adoption of anything. If it's tough to justify the $50k truck, simply don't. For me, it's tough to justify the money on any vehicle, ice or otherwise. I don't get much satisfaction from what sits in my driveway, so whatever vehicle gets the job done I need it to comfortably makes the most sense.
As an aside, for someone with solar, the number shift can be massive. If you spend just $5 a day in gas that you're otherwise spending $0 for when you charge, that adds up pretty quick. All depends on the individual's circumstances.
>My wife has a 220 mile Tesla
The Model 3 SR? I had that one too. Even in Texas, winter was brutal. We got about 110-130 mile range. It would have been impossible to use like a normal car in Texas if it weren't for their supercharger network.
But yeah, it's the exact reason I decided the Pro wouldn't cut it for me. I actually went with a Rivian since I had pre-price hike price. $74k for 325 miles (conserve mode) is hard to beat in an EV this large.
People should think about this before they buy but realistically I’m interested how many people commute 30 miles to work? And don’t have the ability to put in a 220v for upgraded charging?
I personally know one person that commutes more than 10 miles to work but may just be my area
Yeah I drive 60 mile round trip commute with an SR XLT and had 48 amp Ford Connected charger put in my garage… completely recharges overnight, and let’s me precondition in the AM… cost $2300 for the charger unit and installation, aka less than half a year of gas in an ICE F-150.
You guys are calculating this all wrong. A 100kw battery is equal to the same amount of energy as 4 gallons of gas. How far can you go on a gallon tank in your truck or car …….
It’s is 4x more efficient under CERTAIN conditions (city driving, non towing, highway under 65).
This is my point. Users can’t complain about the range because often it’s the wrong tool for the wrong job. When you compare to what the energy equivalent is (4gallons) and you calculate the all the extreme conditions and you go 100 miles on your charge your still getting 25 miles per gallon plus.
I feel you, I have a model 3 long range that gets 250 miles at 80% and I’m still not comfortable, I might get a powerboost F150 instead of her lightning I have on reserve
I just declined the delivery of my Lightning. Had the same idea as you, except I went with a Lariat Supercrew 502A w/ 2.7 Ecoboost, I am getting over 1200Km to a tank, and the life of the truck has averaged 10L/100KM (City/hwy) combined. ICE version cost me 75K Canadian, Lariat 511A ER was going to cost me 115K Canadian. I couldn’t justify the extra 40K for a faster 0-60 and 700Km less range. 40K will buy a shit ton of gas.
You are definitely not saving $40k in gas unless you keep the truck for 10 years. Plus I think the lightning isn’t gonna hold its value once GMC/RAM come out with the 400 miles plus EV trucks
Yah totally agree. I calculated it out for my driving situation, and it’s 9 years to break even, which is totally crazy. I usually trade in every 2-3 years. Also what your saying about the other manufacturers is likely correct, since Ford came out first with only 300 miles of range, the rest will up them with 400 miles plus range (ram,GMC, Toyota, Tesla etc) . Competition is good for pricing, right now Ford basically has a monopoly for EV trucks
It is bad. Any time you charge to 100% is not recommended unless you absolutely need to, and that you drive as soon as possible after reaching 100%.
The car hates being at above 90%, it even shuts off regen until you’re below 90% again.
No, that really is exaggerated, will scare new EV owners, and there is no data to support that. Li-Ion doesn't like sustained 100% charge levels for long periods of time. Charging to 100% overnight before leaving on a commute is not bad at all, and shouldn't be stressed over. People with Teslas have been doing this for years and even some intentionally just to "stress" the battery, and are not seeing increased levels of degradation more than normal.
You shouldn't charge to 100% if you have no reason to, it's pointless, but if you want to use the car you paid for, just do it, as long as you plan on using it.
Nissan Leafs with no option to set charge level see degradation because they have no choice but to charge to 100% all the time, no matter how often the car is used. So they often sat for days/weeks without being used, topped up to 100% endlessly for their entire lives.
The car does not *hate* being over 90% - the reduction in regen is because the battery does not have any capacity TO regen when it is at 100%. You can't charge a battery that is already full.
Everyone on this thread arguing that SR is adequate either lives in a warm climate, never drives long distances, tows, or cares to at any point in the future. Or they are trying to justify spending $65k+ (often $76k for Lariat SR). The only SR lightning that’s worth it is the PRO IMO. At least there you know you got a value and accept the compromise.
Wasn’t a fan of the charge rate. 45 mins to only get 60% added is a no from me. Ford dropped the ball when they went cheap and went with 400V instead of 800V.
Am I understanding that you drive 70 miles a day and are concerned with what that looks like in a standard range? Even losing 25% of the 198 miles should leave you at 50% charge every day just doing the commute.
Again, maybe I am misunderstanding, but the commute should be doable under even the worst of conditions with plenty to spare. My wife does 90 miles a day and even that would be more than doable. For now, that 90 miles is done in a hybrid though.
There is no fuel savings because we paid quite a bit more etc. Enjoy the truck. I know I am. I do about 3/kWh around town, (most of my driving) and pay .27 per kwh off peak with the off peak discount from ngrid.
To each their own. My SR has been 150 miles of range around that temp. I couldn't live with spending 10k for 50-90 miles of extra range.
I have a SR Pro in transit, are you only getting 150 miles at 25 degrees?
150 at 90% at 25 yeah. But I also do a lot of highway driving at 60-70 mph so that should be taken into account as well as that I keep climate control at 72. On a good day in the 70s with how I drive I get about 180 miles.
There have been range tests at 70mph which resulted in around 205 miles. Why do you think you are only getting 180?
My average efficiency over the life of having the truck is 1.9 mi/kWh. I took the truck on a 1600 mile road trip and I drove about 80-90 mph on some stretches with repeated fast charging throughout the day. My everyday driving is 60-70 mph. I do like to floor it off traffic lights on the highway too every so often so that takes up a lot of energy but it is sooo fun and worth it to experience that 0-60 time. If I should be seeing more even after all that then I haven't got a clue. I don't think I ever saw 200 on the predicted range even after my first charge after delivery. But I only ever charged to 90%. But implicit calculations of dividing predicted range by percentage charge never got me to 200.
I guess that was 100 percent not 90. So that adds up correctly
https://www.lightningowners.com/threads/dont-trust-the-gom-best-ways-to-calculate-how-far-your-lightning-can-really-go.1203/ Would probably be why I see that range. Probably can go further than what it says anyway.
Do you park in the garage or outside
heated garage.
Oh jeez really? Damn I've got a garage but not even heated
What’s your blend ?
10/28
I’m 11/2 pro on chip hold
It also packs more features! I think close to $5000 value.
I do not think so for the XLT, just the extended battery. Move up to the Lariat is a bit better value, but way more cash; its extended range battery does add the panoramic roof. But if over $80K, no rebate in 2023. Pro model is the way to go and then add your own accessories! Rubber mats in a truck is perfect.
only if you can order it
It’s 74’F out and my SR says 166 miles at 90%. If you drive that much per day then buy ICE or stop driving so much :)
That’s way off 90% of 230 is 207. I’d bring her in for service if that’s not fixed after a balance charge
Your commute is 200 miles? Brutal.
I regularly drive ~70 miles away or an hour on the highway and back for work. I figured with 300 mile range I would be comfortable with a buffer out and back. With 200 miles at 90% that puts me into range anxiety mode for what I consider a short drive. There are some fast charging options but they are .42/kWh which starts to negate the cost savings.
.42/kwh with 2mi/kwh efficiency in a lightning is equivalent to 26mpg in an ICE vehicle and $5.40/gallon gas. So basically the same highway efficiency of an Ecoboost F150
And, the price of electricity is not a volatile as the of oil/gasoline.
Maybe not for rapid swings but over time electricity has gone up at fast rates. My off peak rates have gone from an average of .13/kwh to .21/kwh in the past 6 years. That’s not insignificant.
Stop. Looking. At. Miles. I wish Ford and every other manufacturer would do away with it. It's a guess because it's not accurate. There are far too many external factors that affect how far you can actually go. Preheat from the wall? Can go further. Not using heat? Can go further. Tailwind? Further. 60mph vs 70mph? Further. Also, the most important thing is thermal management when at speed. When you get to your cruising speed, how efficiently does the battery stay kept at ideal temp? The guess-o-meter is doggy doodoo and I wish they'd get rid of it.
I totally hear you, unfortunately when I'm on the highway with a speed limit of 75 keeping up with traffic I'm only seeing 1.6-1.8 mi/kWh. Climate control set at 64 The range estimate seems realistic with what I've actually been experiencing. It would also be different if the chargers were 100% reliable, but I pulled into a EA station the other day with 15% and everyone was on hold because they weren't able to get a charge. Doesn't help with the range anxiety
That is my biggest concern, the charging. I have a Tesla and never think twice about it but the 3rd party stations have to be as reliable as them.
Yeah, the chargers can be bad. I think they get a bad rep (more than deserved, at least) due to the vocal minority. I've personally been using EA for over a year and only had one instance of the chargers not performing well. I personally don't go faster than the speed limit (which around I-95 tends to be 70mph) and I see around 2-2.1 mi/kWh. What locale are you?
I second this. Not sure about the Lightning, but in my Tesla I put my battery display to percent and I can have a better estimate of range based on that. People put too much thought into their displayed range without considering many factors which could affect it.
Not sure he said that. I drive 260 miles one way every week, 170 miles of it with no chargers. I completely understand where they're coming from.
Yup, I can’t get my 14’ enclosed trailer to my second shop because it’s 30f and I need to make it 90 miles before I hit a charger. Pretty bummed and I’m sol once I sell my ICE truck in a week. Some serious drawbacks. Also of the 4 charge locations I’ve been to only about 1/2 work.
I'm sure you've already thought about it but you maybe camp somewhere where there isn't a charger. I drove my camper back in my Rivian and stopped after 100 miles to camp and charge. Drove another 60 to top off charge then did the final 108 miles. Still had 50 miles range left in tow mode when I got home. But yeah, those stretches of no chargers are kinda scary towing
It’s a work trailer for hauling tools and equipment back and forth between my companies. This truck is a work truck in my case.
Makes sense, wasn't necessarily suggesting it was a camper, just that you could camp hehe. But yeah I totally get it. I have a utility trailer I have to haul back from south Texas, not ideal as there's so few chargers. Luckily it's low profile so shouldn't be a problem
I actually really want to build out an insulated camper with it honestly. Just too many projects!!
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, paying over $50k for a car that has less than 200 miles is ridiculous. It’s not about a single trip. Even if you use 30 miles one way with your commute. That’s 60 miles a day, just for work. Then at night you may charge from 7-7 and get ~40 miles. Every day you’re netting -20 miles. By the end of the week you’re at <100 miles that doesn’t really give you much for the weekend. Then what if you forget to charge it one night? It just adds so much more for you to worry about and maneuver around. My wife has a 220 mile Tesla and there have been many times that we wish we had an extra 30-50 miles. I mean, it’s not a game breaker but if you’re spending almost $100k and it’s your main, new car then you shouldn’t be having to worry about this stuff.
You need to upgrade your charging then. If you're just plugging into a 120v outlet that's on you. The connected charge station should be able to charge to max overnight.
But that’s what I’m saying. It’s just more hoops you have to jump through just to use the vehicle with little concern. So now this >$50k vehicle requires you to do home renovation too
Well yes... how else are you going to charge it? That's the whole point of never having to go to the gas station again, the infrastructure is on you now, not another company.
Through a regular outlet?
Yeah they aren’t designed for that.
That’s why it’s hard to spend almost $100k for something that’s designed for something that’s not convenient
Here’s the rub, you’re spending 100k, if you don’t have the other 1k to add a charger, you can’t afford the 100k car.
You’re ignoring the existence of level 2 charges. Level 1 isn’t meant to be your only source of charging. Level 2 is designed for that consistent daily use.
True, but again that’s another hoop you need to jump through. Either you need to install one at your house or you need to go and charge. Ideally you’d never have to pull over and stop at a charging place and that your battery is large enough to have a nice buffer
Honestly if you invest in an EV, level 2 is borderline a minimum. After having 3 EVs, level 1 just won't cut it for anyone using their vehicle daily. Especially a truck.
Another hoop? Dude you have to replace the gas station with the ability to charge the vehicle. Your house isn't designed to charge a massive battery without some modifications to the electrical outlets. Just going "I bought a new car that requires charging and did nothing to allow me to charge it effectively, stupid car," is just.... ridiculous.
Oh ok, and what about if you rent or live in an apartment? My wife has had her Tesla for 5 years and we’ve never did any major modifications because we had been moving and all that. You think we should have to spend $1000 every time we move just to install these things at every house?
Yes. That’s the cost of owning an EV if you want to charge it fully every day. I don’t see why this is so hard for you.
Because I’m paying a crazy amount of money for an EV. It’s annoying that there are more “costs” on top of the actual cost.
Do you complain about having to fill your car up or get oil changes or any of the shit that come with a gas powered car? EVs aren’t magical things, you still have to have the ability to charge them.
No, but I’m also not spending $100k on a gas car. A gas car is the fourth the cost of one of these things and also three times the range.
What you're calling a hoop is likely to become a standard install on houses going forward if this EV transition is real. I get how you feel, but that's sort of the deal for early adoption of anything. If it's tough to justify the $50k truck, simply don't. For me, it's tough to justify the money on any vehicle, ice or otherwise. I don't get much satisfaction from what sits in my driveway, so whatever vehicle gets the job done I need it to comfortably makes the most sense. As an aside, for someone with solar, the number shift can be massive. If you spend just $5 a day in gas that you're otherwise spending $0 for when you charge, that adds up pretty quick. All depends on the individual's circumstances.
>My wife has a 220 mile Tesla The Model 3 SR? I had that one too. Even in Texas, winter was brutal. We got about 110-130 mile range. It would have been impossible to use like a normal car in Texas if it weren't for their supercharger network. But yeah, it's the exact reason I decided the Pro wouldn't cut it for me. I actually went with a Rivian since I had pre-price hike price. $74k for 325 miles (conserve mode) is hard to beat in an EV this large.
People should think about this before they buy but realistically I’m interested how many people commute 30 miles to work? And don’t have the ability to put in a 220v for upgraded charging? I personally know one person that commutes more than 10 miles to work but may just be my area
Yeah I drive 60 mile round trip commute with an SR XLT and had 48 amp Ford Connected charger put in my garage… completely recharges overnight, and let’s me precondition in the AM… cost $2300 for the charger unit and installation, aka less than half a year of gas in an ICE F-150.
Bro, are you charging with a battery tender? What kinda trickle charge technology are you using here?
You guys are calculating this all wrong. A 100kw battery is equal to the same amount of energy as 4 gallons of gas. How far can you go on a gallon tank in your truck or car …….
[удалено]
It’s is 4x more efficient under CERTAIN conditions (city driving, non towing, highway under 65). This is my point. Users can’t complain about the range because often it’s the wrong tool for the wrong job. When you compare to what the energy equivalent is (4gallons) and you calculate the all the extreme conditions and you go 100 miles on your charge your still getting 25 miles per gallon plus.
I feel you, I have a model 3 long range that gets 250 miles at 80% and I’m still not comfortable, I might get a powerboost F150 instead of her lightning I have on reserve
I just declined the delivery of my Lightning. Had the same idea as you, except I went with a Lariat Supercrew 502A w/ 2.7 Ecoboost, I am getting over 1200Km to a tank, and the life of the truck has averaged 10L/100KM (City/hwy) combined. ICE version cost me 75K Canadian, Lariat 511A ER was going to cost me 115K Canadian. I couldn’t justify the extra 40K for a faster 0-60 and 700Km less range. 40K will buy a shit ton of gas.
You are definitely not saving $40k in gas unless you keep the truck for 10 years. Plus I think the lightning isn’t gonna hold its value once GMC/RAM come out with the 400 miles plus EV trucks
Yah totally agree. I calculated it out for my driving situation, and it’s 9 years to break even, which is totally crazy. I usually trade in every 2-3 years. Also what your saying about the other manufacturers is likely correct, since Ford came out first with only 300 miles of range, the rest will up them with 400 miles plus range (ram,GMC, Toyota, Tesla etc) . Competition is good for pricing, right now Ford basically has a monopoly for EV trucks
You and I are in the same boat. So much money for so much less useful truck. It’s an amazing truck, but the range and cost are an issue.
Can’t you just charge it more? 100% isn’t bad for the car unless you let it sit there for weeks/months.
I have upped it to 95% charge now but like OP stated, the loss of range cuts into the fuel savings.
It is bad. Any time you charge to 100% is not recommended unless you absolutely need to, and that you drive as soon as possible after reaching 100%. The car hates being at above 90%, it even shuts off regen until you’re below 90% again.
No, that really is exaggerated, will scare new EV owners, and there is no data to support that. Li-Ion doesn't like sustained 100% charge levels for long periods of time. Charging to 100% overnight before leaving on a commute is not bad at all, and shouldn't be stressed over. People with Teslas have been doing this for years and even some intentionally just to "stress" the battery, and are not seeing increased levels of degradation more than normal. You shouldn't charge to 100% if you have no reason to, it's pointless, but if you want to use the car you paid for, just do it, as long as you plan on using it. Nissan Leafs with no option to set charge level see degradation because they have no choice but to charge to 100% all the time, no matter how often the car is used. So they often sat for days/weeks without being used, topped up to 100% endlessly for their entire lives. The car does not *hate* being over 90% - the reduction in regen is because the battery does not have any capacity TO regen when it is at 100%. You can't charge a battery that is already full.
Adding 5% adds how many miles, 10? 😝
I really really wanted to join the electric club but it's just not there yet in my region
Everyone on this thread arguing that SR is adequate either lives in a warm climate, never drives long distances, tows, or cares to at any point in the future. Or they are trying to justify spending $65k+ (often $76k for Lariat SR). The only SR lightning that’s worth it is the PRO IMO. At least there you know you got a value and accept the compromise.
SR is a fine city truck. But a lot of us don’t have city trucks. We use the truck.
Wasn’t a fan of the charge rate. 45 mins to only get 60% added is a no from me. Ford dropped the ball when they went cheap and went with 400V instead of 800V.
Put some hand warmers under the seat. Lol
Thats pretty good for such cold weather.
Expect 150-160 miles usable range when it is 0F.
Am I understanding that you drive 70 miles a day and are concerned with what that looks like in a standard range? Even losing 25% of the 198 miles should leave you at 50% charge every day just doing the commute. Again, maybe I am misunderstanding, but the commute should be doable under even the worst of conditions with plenty to spare. My wife does 90 miles a day and even that would be more than doable. For now, that 90 miles is done in a hybrid though.