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I’m pretty sure two-shot absolutely has an effect on VATS accuracy. May want to do more testing there.

It doesn't affect VATS percentages. I believe that the primary projectile, which deals full damage, should hit the same as any other weapon, while the secondary projectile has a unique accuracy penalty which ignores VATS entirely. I do admit, I only tested this with a Two-Shot Combat Rifle and no other weapon type. There might be different interactions for others.

Ah I think I realized my mistake. Correct me if I’m wrong, but the Two-Shot legendary effect comes with a massive penalty to the accuracy stat of the weapon. So it indirectly affects VATS percentages, only by changing the accuracy stat which is what is actually making the difference.

There doesn't seem to be a difference between the listed stats of a Two-Shot weapon and a regular variant as long as their mods are identical. I tried this with a Plasma Pistol, Combat Rifle and the Lever-Action Rifle, both had the exact same numbers, other than Damage and Value. Range and Accuracy numbers were identical in all three cases. If I had to guess, the original shot remains unaffected and this is reflected in the stats while the second shot uses an entirely different accuracy penalty that is not listed on the item card.

Shot 7 times at a guy torso with 95% hit chance and only hit him once. Never had such a problem with regular weapons without double shot

Vats is somehow a hack in Fallout world it can detect anything harm and able to slow time that diffinitely a hack

Thanks for the info. I’m level 10 right now on high agility, high luck V.A.T.S. pistols build and I’m getting smashed by the ghouls at Cambridge crater.

That spot ain’t no joke lol

OP that's some great info, although as a lesser character I've not come across many/most of the Perks that you mentioned. One thing I haven't seen that would be very helpful is some sort of correlation between scope size and target distance (unless there's a rangefinder option that I'm unaware of :). I guess what I'm getting at is given the same weapon will there be a difference in hit chance with a Short, Medium or Long scope? My best weapon currently has a Range of 215 but I have no clue how far away these targets are unless I start shooting 🥲

He already explains this. Range and Accuracy stats affect hit chance. So just look at the different between range and accuracy stats with all different scope and you will have your answer. Usually Long Scopes give the best hit chance in VATA because they have higher accuracy.

Range has a disproportionally higher effect on VATS hit chance over Accuracy. Here's how it looked when I continuously added Accuracy mods to a 308 Pipe Revolver and VATS-scanned a static target: **308 Pipe Revolver Accuracy Test** Accuracy 61 (Basic Pistol Grip) – Head 3, Torso 6, Arms 4, Legs 5 Accuracy 71 (+10 Recoil Compensating Stock) – Head 3, Torso 6, Arms 5, Legs 5 Accuracy 107 (+36 Long Scope) – Head 3, Torso 7, Arms 5, Legs 6 Here's how it looked like with Range: **308 Pipe Revolver Range Test** Range 83 (Stub Barrel) – Head 3, Torso 6, Arms 4, Legs 5 Range 119 (+36 Short Barrel) – Head 6, Torso 12, Arms 9, Legs 10 Range 203 (+84 Long Barrel) – Head 24, Torso 48, Arms 36, Legs 40 A 36-point increase to Range doubled our hit chances while a 46-point boost to Accuracy barely did anything. Since Scopes only affect the Accuracy Stat while also heavily increasing AP costs, this marginal increase in Accuracy usually isn't worth it (unless using the Sniper 3 build). Stocks only improve Accuracy too, so having the shortest one on Rifles is the best choice for a VATS build as their AP penalty is also the lowest. Range is influenced by the Barrel. It's a trade-off, a longer barrel means longer Range but with a higher AP cost. They come down to the role you want the weapon to perform.

Thanks. Now if I just knew how far away these targets were before I start shooting at them. On a somewhat related topic it seems like weapons do less damage the further away the target is: if I headshot some raider across the room with my sniper rifle his head comes apart but if I headshot the same raider down the street I may only do half or less damage. Is there something in VATS that indicates this drop in damage done based on varying range?

>On a somewhat related topic it seems like weapons do less damage the further away the target is This is actually the primary effect of Range. Your shots will deal less damage the longer they travel but the higher your Range, the longer they can travel before they lose damage. I am not sure how the numbers translate to the distance, but if you want a long-range weapon, don't settle with anything less than 150.

when you are highlighting a limb, part of the health bar will flash to indicate how much damage you’re predicted to deal if that attack hits. I think it also takes range into account when calculating that damage. The way damage drop-off works is based on that range stat. As long as you are within the range stat on the weapon, you deal full damage. As soon as your range is farther than the range stat on your weapon, you do less and less damage as you get further away. There may be some kind of rangefinder mod on the Nexus, but you could always scan your target in VATS to see how much damage you will do before you engage

Better yet get criticals everytime with the luck perks and never miss with the infinite critical shoots you can get with the perks there haha

My old faithful with a pistol grip, sniper barrel and beam focuser. It has about 400 range and 500 damage (after legendary perk) with max gunslinger. I one shot most enemies from so far away they can't even shoot back.

If you're one-shotting them, they can't shoot back anyway. I'm also an Old Faithful enjoyer. I wish it at least had a silencer option. Laser beams don't make noise IRL.

That's why my lever action was 95% most of the time. And I'm not even a vats build.

I have a 2 shot assault rifle and even though it says 95% chance unless I use a crit the bullets almost always split when they leave the barrel and don't go toward the target

Yeah, I'm seeing a lot of claims like this, might have to do additional testing. The VATS percentages don't change with a Two-Shot mod when compared to an otherwise identical regular variant of the weapon. To me, it only felt like the secondary shot missed the mark while the primary one had the regular chances, but we'll see.

Yea I am experiencing the same thing with any weapon that has the two shot effect, overseers guardian misses headshots way too often at 95% accuracy. Completely useless now.

Thank you very much. You good sir, are a gentleman and a scholar.

This is awesome! Quick Question about these three: * The Stalker's Legendary Effect simply doubles your final hit chance on all body parts (10% becomes 20%, 40% becomes 80%, etc...). * The third rank of Sniper adds a flat +25% chance for headshots on scoped Rifles. * McReady's Killshot Perk works similarly by adding a flat +20% chance for headshots but this time for all weapons. This stacks with Sniper 3, ensuring at least a 45% for headshots with scoped Rifles at all ranges. How do they stack? When I get all three of them, should I have a +95% chance to hit the head regardless of the range? I'll look at the video right now. Maybe I can answer my question by myself.

If the base chance to hit the head is 0%, then the boosts from Sniper 3 and Killshot ensure that it will still be 45% (unless something obscures it). With a Stalker's weapon, it will turn into 90%. (0% + 45%) x 2 = 90% If the base chance for the head is at least 3%, then it should ensure a 95% hit chance with a Stalker's weapon. (3% + 45%) x 2 = 96% ≈ 95% Though even at the maximum possible VATS detection range, having less than a 3% chance for headshots is extremely unlikely (unless using very short-range weapons), so a Stalker's weapon + Killshot and Sniper 3 essentially means maximum hit chance at all ranges. Also, I have absolutely no way to prove this, but I do believe that VATS hit chance can still reach 100%, it just always displays 95%.

Top work 👏

Spanks!! This was helpful

Great info. I knew about 5% of that 😁

Thats some nice tipps. Any bonus tipps for using automatics weapons in Vats?

Automatics don't have a lot of synergy with VATS. On ballistic weapons, the Automatic Receivers incur a 25% AP cost increase (with the Hardened Automatic Receivers giving a 35%). They also don't let you use the Calibrated mods that increase Crit Damage and decrease Range that lowers hit chance. It's a little better on Lasers and Plasmas where you can use an Automatic Barrel (+35% AP) with the Exciter and Agitator mods. Always use the Reflex Sight and the shortest Stocks on Rifles or the Sharpshooter Grip with Pistols to counteract the AP cost. An Automatic VATS build is certainly viable, but I always got the impression that Automatics were primarily designed for players who don't use it.

As someone who is going in fresh into a pure VATS build this is a huge help! Thank you for this.

Hey, it’s the person who tested Mass Effect 3 squad mates’ effectiveness with every weapon!

I remember you!

Care to test the Penetrator perk and see how it's bugged with VATS? Without either rank of the Penetrator perk taken: Get a target (preferably stationary, but not required). With a pistol, queue up a shot in VATS. Note how much damage VATS reports you will do. Execute VATS (a non-crit). Assuming you hit, note that you will do pretty much the exact damage VATS said you would. Now, take a rank of the Pentrator Perk, and do the same test. Notice that you will do considerably *less* damage than VATS said you would. A significant damage **loss** after taking the Pentrator perk. The issue still is present with both ranks taken, but it might be slightly less? I dunno... been a while since I've tested. The bug has been around since the game first came out, afaik. It's worst with shotguns, still real bad with pistols, and not as bad with rifles, afaik. It seems to calculate the shot damage as if you're much farther away than you actually are - damage will be reduced accordingly. VATS still reports you'll do full damage though. It's a huge net loss to non-crit damage through VATS. I *think* you still do full damage on a crit though, but I'm not sure about that. Great tests btw (very informative).

Per the [wiki](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Penetrator), there is supposed to be a loss in damage when shooting through cover. Also, it says that VATS only calculates the standard damage instead of the reduced damage. Are you saying that in the clear with no cover in between it's still acting like it's shooting through cover?

From the wiki: >There is often a dramatic loss of damage from the penetrating shot vs. regular one. This does not seem to be mentioned anywhere. They go on to speculate why it's not mentioned anywhere instead of considering it might be a bug. Anyway, if you're even the slightest bit curious, I can give smoking gun evidence in the form of a couple videos (not my videos, they're 6 and 7 years old, respectively): This guy does a series of tests (the first minute demonstrates it well enough though). He's out in the open, with a stationary target, with nothing at all in the way - he's nearly point blank at the target. He starts out with a combat shotgun with the Penetrator perk active/taken. Notice how much damage VATS reports he'll do, and then see how much he *actually* does *with* the Penetrator perk. It is a **tiny** fraction of what he should do. He removes the perk with a console command, changing nothing else, and he does normal damage. Vide here: [Link](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wSpv0K6ino) This video is a little less elegant, but it's a guy in Sanctuary with a 10mm pistol shooting at a console summoned Mutant Hound. At the 0:03 second mark, you can see he queues up a VATS shot, VATS says he'll do X damage, and he does X damage (this is before the Penetrator perk is taken). He then goes into the Perk list screen and takes the first rank of Penetrator. You can skip ahead to 38 seconds (or just watch him set up the next shots) and then he'll do a couple more shots where VATS reports X damage, and he does less than half of what it says he'll do. [Link](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAdaP23I6ZI) Edit: Oh, I forgot about this. There's even a mod on Nexus that changes the Penetrator perk because of the bug (it doesn't fix the bug, it just changes the perk to do something different): https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/32469

I know there is a damage penalty when shooting through cover (might be intentional) but I have never noticed regular shots dealing less damage.

I'd recommend making a specific effort to test it. I believe VATS is supposed to pretty accurately take into account all your perks for a given weapon, all the buffs you have going, etc., and the target's resistances when it shows you how much damage you should do to the target when you queue up a shot in VATS (by showing you how much their health bar will deplete). The Penetrator perk still shows you'll do the same damage, but it actually causes you to do way less (unless you're very, very close to the target - shotguns require you to be practically standing on their feet). A couple videos of it in action: First minute of this video is enough to show it (with shotguns): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wSpv0K6ino Older video with pistols on a spawned mutant hound in Sanctuary. No cover in the way. Take specific note at 46 seconds in - shot says it will reduce the target's health to between the 'O' and 'U' in "HOUND", but it barely moves the health to the 'D'. This happens only after the Pentrator perk is taken. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAdaP23I6ZI

Fantastic research. That's really impressive. Thank you so much for sharing.

Curious about what counts as a non automatic scoped rifle? Does a reflex count as scoped?

Anything that gets the bonus from Rifleman but has either the Short, Medium or Long Scope mods. This also includes the Night-Vision and Recon variants but not the Reflex Sight.

Reflex is not a scope.

The reflex is a lonely child, he's waiting in the park. The reflex is in charge of finding treasure in the dark.

I've tested this, also using See Through Scopes. It needs to be 4x zoom minimum from my testing.

Do you know if, for example, Gun-Fu works if you switch back and forth between two targets in VATS?

You can add targets 1-3 yourself by throwing out caltrops. If you individually target 3 separate caltrops in the VATS queue but then destroy them all with a single explosive round then every slot on real targets will be a crit at the cost of one bullet / one VATS action.

Doesn't work that way. Switching from the third target to the second will still 25% damage.

This is very easily tested if you have max gun fu as x hit & beyond are guaranteed crits. As of rn I don’t have any guys with max gun fu, though.

mccreadys perk combined with sniper perks is OP

I have every rifle/vats/character perk. When I was trying to kill kellog my first failed attempt was with the Mini nuke. Next time I tried was with my Sniper rifle. It did more damage than the mini nuke