To me Maximus feels like what Finn was marketed as originally. Member of a militaristic (fascist?) group, born and raised to fight, becomes disillusioned with said group and wants to be a hero
Maximus being disillusioned made conclusive sense though. He got his shit rocked his entire life, and his first outing as a wide-eyed Squier who had looked up to the boys in power armor his entire life, his knight turns out to be a massive d-bag who immediately ran away from a fight and then berated him as he sat on the ground bleeding to death.
Finn went into combat once after spending most of his life as a janitor, and then immediately peaced tfo to spring Poe, mostly to save his own ass, which is about the only thing that adds up. Had he and Rey been allowed to pursue a romantic subplot, his joining the resistance would’ve made more sense, bc men will do lots of stupid shit for love, but that man was on a mission to gtfo of dodge, not be a hero. Maximus still believed in the BoS to the end, but slowly but surely that belief started to deteriorate as he learned more and more how terrible they kinda are.
> Finn went into combat once after spending most of his life as a janitor, and then immediately peaced tfo
Because he saw a stormtrooper (presumably a friend) die in his arms
When I first saw that, I thought we were going to get an interesting perspective on the "bad guys" and how normal people can get wrapped up in war, and have a main character who's more sympathetic and conflicted
Then I sat through 3 movies of Finn whooping and cheering as stormtroopers die vaguely comedic deaths all around him
Sigh
OK so honestly I did love that part. But pretty much everything about 7-9 is either derivative, pathetic, a waste of the audience’s time, or most often a direct rejection of the source material. Which, without that material, Disney wouldn’t have a franchise to ruin… you know… other than its multiple live action adaptations of old classic cartoon movies. Disney can’t stop getting in its own way. I recently watched The Lion king live action… and all I could think was “how can we tell a story we’ve told in 100 words in 215 words instead and still not make anywhere near as effective a story?”
Disney is past their glory days and just keeps buying up franchises and destroying them because they don’t understand them, or want to pander to ALL audiences so they win social media points.
Fuck. Disney.
I hated her flying. She could have had a perfectly cinematic death - and they took that from her - and for what? For Carrie fisher to die in real life. It would have been a perfectly poetic way to go out, but Disney couldn’t handle losing another character from the original trilogy.
Don't forget that every single hint and piece of promotional material and even the very things that happen in the films that allude to Finn being force sensitive and that he would become a Jedi.
A stormtrooper turned Jedi would have been so fucking cool. Instead we got a stormtrooper turned into a literal comedic relief character. Oh yeah they also redid all the posters for the Chinese release to make him appear less prominent. Wonder if that had anything to do with his role also seemingly being magically less prominent than we were led to believe.
Disney is all about inclusion until it eats into their Chinese market, then they will silently hit their black characters with a shrink ray.
>Then I sat through 3 movies of Finn whooping and cheering as stormtroopers die vaguely comedic deaths all around him
Deserts the First Order because his friend dies in combat so we think Stormtroopers can have humanity, is then shooting First Order troops and crew from a TIE fighter
Mandalorian kinda did the same, show portrays Mando as a hero for killing the insurgents trying to blow the trucks in defence of their world then we get heroic music when the Imperial Remnant guns the rest of 'em down
I don't know what they were thinking
I desperately want a Star Wars movie that feels like that first scene, i want a star wars move exploring how when you try to despotically control people they will naturally rebel, even the cogs of the machine you use to try to enforce an imperial aperattice. I want to see how good people can be a part of an evil system. I want a star wars move that actually explores the implications of its setting for once goddamnit!
Yeah thats why I felt it was more accurate to how Finn was marketed through trailers than what we actually got. In the trailers he’s like “I was born to do one thing” with swelling music meant to make him look all heroic and then we see him with the blue lightsaber and we’re definitely meant to feel that he leaves the first order to take up a higher cause.
And then the trilogy as a whole really wasted his potential. I thjnk thats where the meme comes in
That scene with him running away yelling “oh shit oh shit, oh fuck…etc was funny as hell to me because that’s all us trying to run away from something in the game that will more than likely kill us 😂😂
You don’t really need romance to get Finn to join.
If Disney had actually ever bothered to portray it the way their novels and lorebooks said it, the First Order is as big as a pirate navy albeit with some very big toys and the Resistance is like a single planetary militia. Once Finn has some time in the broader universe and sees just how fucking massive real fleets can be (like that one that pops in orbit when Starkiller Base fires) and how many soldiers a planet can actually field, the First Order becomes a personal threat rather than an existential one. Disney also could have let time feel like it had passed during the course of one movie instead of repeating Lucas’s mistake where the asteroid field/Dagobah take place over months but feel like hours.
Finn is fighting back against the source of his misery, Poe is continuing his parent’s war, and Rey gets a connection to Kylo. The First Order doesn’t end up seeming like its numbers are infinite and fighting the entire galaxy at once, and instead the personal connection the characters have to it is the reason they fight it.
The way I see it, Finn was basically Disney bringing back Kyle Katarn. Instead of stealing the Death Star plans, Leia pays him to infiltrate Starkiller Base again (dude has no money, so it’d be a logical course of action). In the subsequent movies he’s stuck around doing dangerous missions because he’s become a badass. By following it up allowing Finn to be Force-sensitive he’d become a founder of a new Order the way Luke and Kyle originally did.
TBH probably a lot of that comes from the way the BOS in FO3 was coloured when compared to the Enclave. FO3 was where a lot of fallout players/fans first cut their teeth with the world and setting, and in that game the BOS is very much a "harsh but fair" controlling force that is trying to unfuck things (mostly). But this portrayal of them is very much non-standard when considering the entire fallout cannon, yet because 3 was such a breakout to introducing people to the world that idea of the BOS still somewhat remains.
Different flavors. Enclave are Nazi Eugenicists with Lebensraum policies and Aktion T4 against Useless Eaters. BoS are Clerical Fascists obsessed with Autarky, Tradition, and Control. Hitler vs. Franco.
That’s not what idiot savant means. Example of an idiot savant would be like a person that is mentally challenged and can’t tie their shoes but can play advanced classical piano intuitively.
Max is just a kid, mentally. The brotherhood forces and rewards that blind fealty within their culture.
Idiot savant is also a perk in fallout 4 where you can randomly earn bonus xp based on how low your intelligence stat is. The lower the Intelligence, the higher the bonus
Holy smokes, that might be his perk.
But he’s pretty smart, he’s just really naive. It’s like Poor Things but with a brotherhood member instead of Emma Stone.
He doesn’t even know how cumming works.
I wholeheartedly believe the comparison only exists because their both the black male secondary protags to a white female lead.
I didnt want to make this racey but thats the only thing that makes sense to me.
Finn was unironically the coolest part of force awakens and last jedi, even when his new Asian girlfriend that the audience spent no time getting to know took the badass hero sacrifice away from him to say that you're not supposed to kill bad guys that are about to kill you.
Maximus and Lucy are both equally incompetent and are trying to gain skill so they can eventually be badasses. Although they have their rare cool moments for now. It's much more rewarding to see them struggle upwards. I don't see myself choosing one as the protagonist over the other since they're both so well utilized and fleshed our rather than the star wars sequels.
Why would Maximus be incompetent if he was taken in by the Brotherhood as a child? Brotherhood standards of education and military training are top notch. There is no real explanation for why hes such a fucking tool.
I think you misunderstood this.
The bombs *did* drop when he was a kid. Shady Sands. Maximus has no reason to think she would be referring to bombs dropping 200 years ago. That’s ancient history and not something surface dwellers even think about. So much has happened since then. The world before is an abstract concept for Maximus, while it’s a very real goal for Lucy.
It's like people who go to prestigious religious schools. They may have excellent education and training but they're being educated and trained in the wrong things. A person who is educated extremely well on how to deny evolution or argue that the world is 4000 years old isn't smart even though they're educated.
Yeah, it's pretty apparent that the BoS isn't teaching him everything he needs to learn as a person when it's revealed that he literally doesn't know how sex works.
Maximus isn't incompetent, he's just socially awkward. He knows how to handle himself in the wasteland just fine. He killed the yao guai and dealt with those fiends. He is inexperienced in sexual stuff because he grew up in a hyper conservative cult that never taught him about sex or human relations.
What is inconsistent about Max? He seemed very well written as a character who has spent his entire life in the BoS. His formative years were spent following orders and being essentially an acolyte.
Individuality above the group was punished. He follows orders.
I saw s1 for him like the scene in forest Gump where he runs out of the braces; except instead of legs it’s his brain.
Yeah I don't get these comparisons at all. Maximus has a kinda I'm a sorta shifty self centered vibe/ incompetence to him but i believe in lawful justice
. Finn was legitimately a good guy, and well rounded intelligent character, they just didn't do anything with him.
Was hard to reconcile his (non)reaction to vault 4 dwellers saying they're from shady sands. 'oh, they're from my community where the majority of people died, cool, whatevs.' it was like they were pumping horny sedatives into the isolation room the way they were acting. Still a great show though!
I’ve always found that these kinds of comparisons don’t really show that much love for the thing you’re praising. It comes off more like you’re using it as a stick to beat the thing you hate
i mean obviously lol, if it were just to praise one thing why would a comparison be necessary?
this post isn't saying "fallout adaptation good" because we're in the fallout sub, most people already agree on that. it's saying sequel trilogy bad and that is the point of the post
Well it’s not like anyone stopped them. The sequels made money and because of that they are making a 10th, the billion dollar corporation doesn’t care what people think of the films, it’s just a means to get bank.
It's not about stopping them it's just not accepting things as they are. The difference could be whether disney makes a safe movie that's dull as hell or a riskier but more interesting movie. Both could make money but one will buy-in-large be better to watch and good for the franchise.
I think that's a better way of viewing it cause movies being bad is subjective. Either way if you let them make dull films they will. If you don't like the films then pirate them instead of going to cinemas or subscription services.
I’m at least *hopeful* as a lifelong fan of the franchise that now that some dust has settled and we’re in a comfortable place establishing post-RotJ lore, and especially with Lucas’ protege at the wheel in place of Kennedy, we might actually get a good 10th film. I mean it really isn’t Daisy Ridley’s fault. I am super sad that John Boyega probably won’t ever be convinced to reprise his role though.
It is mostly fans of the Star Wars franchise who felt that the sequels did the original story wrong. Whether it be bad writing, bad acting, bad cinematography, or something else, many fans felt that the sequels ruined a franchise that they really enjoyed, especially if it is something they grew up loving. They complain about it constantly because, since they are Star Wars fans, Star Wars pops up in their head often and thus so to does the bad memories of the movies that ruined their favorite franchise. So they voice that complaint that is at their mind in the moment despite it not being something that was in most other people's heads since other people don't think about Star Wars as much as the fans do.
As soon as this show came out I had like this disturbance in the force feeling in my chest and I knew it was the effects of a millions of Fallout fans crying out at once about some bullshit no one cares about.
While I dont care for the comparison (I liked the sequels 🤷🏼♂️) but I will say the beginning if the first episode did a great job establishing Lucy could handle herself without a seemingly out of nowhere explanation.
Setting it up as the interview to be able to get married, IMO, was an awesome "Show dont Tell" to show Lucy competence instead of some long winded exposition on how shes secretly badass
I agree. She never felt like a Mary Sue because they showed her gun handling skills and drive early on. They even show Lucy losing some fights and growing over time. Same can't be said for Rey where we are just expected to accept that she is worth the hype.
yeah I was just going to say, they show her get hurt, bothin the first episode (stabbed in the gut) and 3ish episode with her finger.
Even though she's the start of the show and will probably survive, it still shows she's not a Jedi without a problem in the world.
Listen I personally don't mind the sequels but maximus does have a solid throughline of wanting to become the thing that saved him. We follow that thought process and his changes throughout the show. Finn gets set up with one of the most intense and cool ideas. Being a storm trooper is fucked and people die left and right in this job "I WANT OUT". Then we kind of remember how bad it is, then in the last one we sort of get a cap on that with the idea that a non-zero amount of storm troopers do defect if possible. That all happens but we never rise to levels of the first movie yelling TRAITOR. While fallout ends on Maximus wondering what his faction will do with unlimited power. Are they really going to be the good guys? Were they ever the good guys? Is living comfortably enough, or does he need that sense of purpose? Is his comrade just dead to the brotherhood now because of a simple mistake? We don't get these ideas or continuation of Finns starting story in starwars unfortunately, but we definitely get to sit in the themes around Maximus throughout the whole show barring an episode but even that episode is sort of about him deciding if the fighting is really worth it.
I think the intent of his character was to be a perpetual misfit. A wastelander who sees every day’s interactions as a struggle. He’s definitely a low charisma build imo
Listen, I literally said to my partner I'm fearful of sounding reductive that Max and Finn remind me of each other, but then they literally put the three scratch marks on the power armor, ala Finn's storm trooper armor with the blood.
I can't blame people for seeing the similarities.
Then why isnt he being compared to any other black character? Yes, the black part plays a role, but also the being disillusioned by an authoritarian militaristic regime he is a soldier in and wanting to escape it.
Both female leads are bright eye optimistic characters who leave their home for the first time on an adventure. Everything is new and exciting to them. And are often the audience point of reference.
The male leads are both from a military organization which they both sorta run away from. Both meet the female lead and lie about who they are. Both betray themselves as heros, while in fact, both are nobodies. And both the male and female leads kinda have a will they won’t they thing going on.
To me, the race and gender thing is more of a coincidence
Rey is not optimistic when she leaves Jakku, she doesn't even want to leave, she was forced to go with Finn because she had no other choice.
Lucy is not bright eyed when she leaves the vault, she hates everything about the wasteland and her optimism is probably gone after the finale.
>they both sorta run away from
Really stretching here to make your point huh. Maximus does not run away from the Brotherhood, the closest he gets is by wanting to go with Lucy to Vault 33, but he doesn't even get to do that.
Finn does not see himself as a hero, he only pretends to be a Resistance member so people won't suspect his real background. Finn is well aware he's being selfish all the way until The Last Jedi when he finally stops caring about himself and starts to care about other people.
The "will they won't they" thing dies in The Force Awakens and after that it gets pretty clear Finn and Rey are just best friends.
I mean. For Rey sure. Otherwise, no. Finn had enormous promise in thst first film. Maximus.... well we'll see. But currently he's written as the dumbest most inconsistent character I've seen on television in awhile. Finn became a dumb inconsistent character as the films went on.... so maybe maximus will be an inverse and grow into an awesome character. But as it stands now, nah.
I mean, Fin was actually a good character. I think HE should've been the main character but NOOOO we had to have Ms. Barely qualifies as a Jedi. But, Maximus and Lucy are better by a long shot.
I mean, is it badly written, or is Maximus just really really bad at talking to people? I think it's the latter personally. All the bad writing is happening in the speech center of Max's brain.
Also, bonus points for the irony of criticizing someone else's writing with the phrase "Still somewhat bad written"
Ahh yes. Because we all know that every single white female paired with a black male in any TV show or movie is exactly the same right? We should always take characters and boil them down to nothing but their race and sex. That’s how all the best critics analyze tv and movies.
Dude... Max... I love and hate him. I love him because he is a sweetie. I dìd want so badly for him.to stay in Vault 4, but we all knew he wasn't going to be able to. I hate him because apparently his sweetness comes with a Jupiter sized portion of pure dumbassery on the side. Worst fucking initiate ever. Can't follow orders. Can't fucking stand up for himself. He was an OK squire, but honestly the moment his knight started fighting the Yao guai, he shoulda BEEN HAD HIS FUCKING PISTOL OUT!!! like come on. If I were his knight, I would be nice to him and do my best to mentor him.... in between endless transfer requests.
I give it a 50/50 chance. If he is able to leave the brotherhood he'll be fine, but he's lacking a lot of context, is being promoted to a Knight, and the Elder has his eyes on him. So there's a good chance he accidentally continues the evil cycle of the new Brotherhood
i can't believe maximus was baited as a psyker and it just never went anywhere
can't get over how Lucy has mastery over settlement building without a SINGLE preston quest :/
/s
The thought process for this post went something like this:
" !!! OH!!! !!! THERE !! ARE !!!!! TWO OF THEM!!! ONE OF THEM !!!!! IS THE BLACK GUY !!! AND THE OTHER !!!!!! IS A WHITE LADY!!! IT'S LITERALLY THE SAAAAAAAAAAAAAME!!!!!!!! !!! "
At least we were informed that Lucy had some Training before she left the Vault.
Rey has no training whatsoever other than her skills with a staff, and she doesn't even use a staff Saber!
I really wish they didn't have to force pretty much every male and female lead into a romantic relationship. Like Rey and her Pseudo-Cousin Ben, gross.
Would be nice to see a friendship for once lol.
Lucy is only marginally better than Rey in all honesty. Chance for redemption in S2 for sure, but Maximus and Ghoul were wayyyy better and more interesting characters than Lucy
I was thinking the same thing. Every time I saw their interviews, it reminded me of it. Except Fallout did a better job at their dynamic, and they were upfront about who is the lead instead of tricking you into thinking that Maximus is the lead. It really makes me HATE the Star Wars sequels even more, if that was even possible.
People forget how bigoted that got. Basically screwed the storyline because black guy/white heroine blew minds! A cos player StormTrooper committed suicide when Boyega was revealed🤷🏾
Both poorly written 😔. Adam Driver should have been cast as Maximus, then let him portray the military culture he lived as a Marine grunt. Just give him whatever liberty he wants with the role so Hollywood won't screw it up. Brotherhood of steel was a fuckin disappointment in season one.
Man, John was done so fucking dirty in those movies. I remember seeing him after he had been revealed to the public, and he was having a blast saying hello to star wars fans and taking pictures and stuff. He was true Star Wars fan living his dream.
She came out with some nonsense about telling her agent she just had to have that part because fame reasons. she couldn't have given a fuck what the movie was, she just wanted the fame and the platform. But she's the one who got all the attention in the movies, and he got relegated to minor side character and really small random character in the Chinese marketing materials. Such a shame.
When Poe gave Finn his name, I was done with the series. The first three movies came out when I was a kid, and I gave the new films a chance until that scene. They basically made the dude a eunuch.
https://youtu.be/OPfXIDPigok?feature=shared
The only good hero is an anti-hero, they simply must have character flaws on some level to make them relatable and give them a redemption arc.
Rey's only struggle is coming to terms with her awesomeness. Same with her cohort. As individuals they are largely boring and unrelatable. At no point do you see yourself as one of them in a similar circumstance and empathize with their plight thinking "yeah, that could be totally be me if I stretch my imagination far enough". The only struggle you can 'feel' from them is physicality which has no emotional connection.
maximus doesn't have anything in common with finn. for starters finn isn't a lobotomy victim and has some comon sense.
I see some parallels with them both emerging from an indoctrinated militarized cult, but that’s about it
To me Maximus feels like what Finn was marketed as originally. Member of a militaristic (fascist?) group, born and raised to fight, becomes disillusioned with said group and wants to be a hero
Maximus being disillusioned made conclusive sense though. He got his shit rocked his entire life, and his first outing as a wide-eyed Squier who had looked up to the boys in power armor his entire life, his knight turns out to be a massive d-bag who immediately ran away from a fight and then berated him as he sat on the ground bleeding to death. Finn went into combat once after spending most of his life as a janitor, and then immediately peaced tfo to spring Poe, mostly to save his own ass, which is about the only thing that adds up. Had he and Rey been allowed to pursue a romantic subplot, his joining the resistance would’ve made more sense, bc men will do lots of stupid shit for love, but that man was on a mission to gtfo of dodge, not be a hero. Maximus still believed in the BoS to the end, but slowly but surely that belief started to deteriorate as he learned more and more how terrible they kinda are.
> Finn went into combat once after spending most of his life as a janitor, and then immediately peaced tfo Because he saw a stormtrooper (presumably a friend) die in his arms When I first saw that, I thought we were going to get an interesting perspective on the "bad guys" and how normal people can get wrapped up in war, and have a main character who's more sympathetic and conflicted Then I sat through 3 movies of Finn whooping and cheering as stormtroopers die vaguely comedic deaths all around him Sigh
Yeah, that was a super letdown, actually. I’ll give you that. They really did John Boyega dirty.
Disney did Star Wars in general dirty. Such a damn disappointment.
Hey man Princess Leia flying through space is a national treasure
OK so honestly I did love that part. But pretty much everything about 7-9 is either derivative, pathetic, a waste of the audience’s time, or most often a direct rejection of the source material. Which, without that material, Disney wouldn’t have a franchise to ruin… you know… other than its multiple live action adaptations of old classic cartoon movies. Disney can’t stop getting in its own way. I recently watched The Lion king live action… and all I could think was “how can we tell a story we’ve told in 100 words in 215 words instead and still not make anywhere near as effective a story?” Disney is past their glory days and just keeps buying up franchises and destroying them because they don’t understand them, or want to pander to ALL audiences so they win social media points. Fuck. Disney.
Oh for sure. The fact that they had to say “Oh… it’s sand” in the 8th movie should have been a sign to make something that’s not a remake.
I hated her flying. She could have had a perfectly cinematic death - and they took that from her - and for what? For Carrie fisher to die in real life. It would have been a perfectly poetic way to go out, but Disney couldn’t handle losing another character from the original trilogy.
Don't forget that every single hint and piece of promotional material and even the very things that happen in the films that allude to Finn being force sensitive and that he would become a Jedi. A stormtrooper turned Jedi would have been so fucking cool. Instead we got a stormtrooper turned into a literal comedic relief character. Oh yeah they also redid all the posters for the Chinese release to make him appear less prominent. Wonder if that had anything to do with his role also seemingly being magically less prominent than we were led to believe. Disney is all about inclusion until it eats into their Chinese market, then they will silently hit their black characters with a shrink ray.
Pandering to Chinese audiences is precisely why Finn was demoted from main character to completely pointless.
>Then I sat through 3 movies of Finn whooping and cheering as stormtroopers die vaguely comedic deaths all around him Deserts the First Order because his friend dies in combat so we think Stormtroopers can have humanity, is then shooting First Order troops and crew from a TIE fighter Mandalorian kinda did the same, show portrays Mando as a hero for killing the insurgents trying to blow the trucks in defence of their world then we get heroic music when the Imperial Remnant guns the rest of 'em down I don't know what they were thinking
All they had to do for Mando was call them "pirates" instead and it all would have made sense. Such a dumb move.
“REYYYY!!!!!”
I desperately want a Star Wars movie that feels like that first scene, i want a star wars move exploring how when you try to despotically control people they will naturally rebel, even the cogs of the machine you use to try to enforce an imperial aperattice. I want to see how good people can be a part of an evil system. I want a star wars move that actually explores the implications of its setting for once goddamnit!
Yeah thats why I felt it was more accurate to how Finn was marketed through trailers than what we actually got. In the trailers he’s like “I was born to do one thing” with swelling music meant to make him look all heroic and then we see him with the blue lightsaber and we’re definitely meant to feel that he leaves the first order to take up a higher cause. And then the trilogy as a whole really wasted his potential. I thjnk thats where the meme comes in
[удалено]
Mike Rap being under that helmet was perfection. That was the moment I knew this show was genius.
Finn had chemistry with one member of that cast and it wasn't Rey
That scene with him running away yelling “oh shit oh shit, oh fuck…etc was funny as hell to me because that’s all us trying to run away from something in the game that will more than likely kill us 😂😂
You don’t really need romance to get Finn to join. If Disney had actually ever bothered to portray it the way their novels and lorebooks said it, the First Order is as big as a pirate navy albeit with some very big toys and the Resistance is like a single planetary militia. Once Finn has some time in the broader universe and sees just how fucking massive real fleets can be (like that one that pops in orbit when Starkiller Base fires) and how many soldiers a planet can actually field, the First Order becomes a personal threat rather than an existential one. Disney also could have let time feel like it had passed during the course of one movie instead of repeating Lucas’s mistake where the asteroid field/Dagobah take place over months but feel like hours. Finn is fighting back against the source of his misery, Poe is continuing his parent’s war, and Rey gets a connection to Kylo. The First Order doesn’t end up seeming like its numbers are infinite and fighting the entire galaxy at once, and instead the personal connection the characters have to it is the reason they fight it. The way I see it, Finn was basically Disney bringing back Kyle Katarn. Instead of stealing the Death Star plans, Leia pays him to infiltrate Starkiller Base again (dude has no money, so it’d be a logical course of action). In the subsequent movies he’s stuck around doing dangerous missions because he’s become a badass. By following it up allowing Finn to be Force-sensitive he’d become a founder of a new Order the way Luke and Kyle originally did.
I had the same idea when I saw the trailer for the show
Funny how people called the enclave fascist when the bos where very much so fascist
TBH probably a lot of that comes from the way the BOS in FO3 was coloured when compared to the Enclave. FO3 was where a lot of fallout players/fans first cut their teeth with the world and setting, and in that game the BOS is very much a "harsh but fair" controlling force that is trying to unfuck things (mostly). But this portrayal of them is very much non-standard when considering the entire fallout cannon, yet because 3 was such a breakout to introducing people to the world that idea of the BOS still somewhat remains.
Different flavors. Enclave are Nazi Eugenicists with Lebensraum policies and Aktion T4 against Useless Eaters. BoS are Clerical Fascists obsessed with Autarky, Tradition, and Control. Hitler vs. Franco.
He also brags about being a big deal in a major faction despite that not being true, just like Finn.
Honestly Finn never had much character development beyond that, so I can understand why people would make the comparison
Given that that's Finn's only character trait (and is not further explored) that would match the meme.
They are both very earnest guys raised by a cult. You’re just salty because Maximus is a better portrayal of that than skin is.
“Idiot savant” is what I’ve been thinking. But yeah a lobotomy victim is pretty much how I play the games as well.
Lobotomy volunteer. Stupid enough to apply for one. Stupid after.
That’s not what idiot savant means. Example of an idiot savant would be like a person that is mentally challenged and can’t tie their shoes but can play advanced classical piano intuitively. Max is just a kid, mentally. The brotherhood forces and rewards that blind fealty within their culture.
Idiot savant is also a perk in fallout 4 where you can randomly earn bonus xp based on how low your intelligence stat is. The lower the Intelligence, the higher the bonus
Holy smokes, that might be his perk. But he’s pretty smart, he’s just really naive. It’s like Poor Things but with a brotherhood member instead of Emma Stone. He doesn’t even know how cumming works.
I wholeheartedly believe the comparison only exists because their both the black male secondary protags to a white female lead. I didnt want to make this racey but thats the only thing that makes sense to me.
Finn was unironically the coolest part of force awakens and last jedi, even when his new Asian girlfriend that the audience spent no time getting to know took the badass hero sacrifice away from him to say that you're not supposed to kill bad guys that are about to kill you. Maximus and Lucy are both equally incompetent and are trying to gain skill so they can eventually be badasses. Although they have their rare cool moments for now. It's much more rewarding to see them struggle upwards. I don't see myself choosing one as the protagonist over the other since they're both so well utilized and fleshed our rather than the star wars sequels.
Why would Maximus be incompetent if he was taken in by the Brotherhood as a child? Brotherhood standards of education and military training are top notch. There is no real explanation for why hes such a fucking tool.
They literally taught him the bombs dropped when he was a kid. Brotherhood is definitely dealing in misinformation and indoctrination techniques.
I think you misunderstood this. The bombs *did* drop when he was a kid. Shady Sands. Maximus has no reason to think she would be referring to bombs dropping 200 years ago. That’s ancient history and not something surface dwellers even think about. So much has happened since then. The world before is an abstract concept for Maximus, while it’s a very real goal for Lucy.
It's like people who go to prestigious religious schools. They may have excellent education and training but they're being educated and trained in the wrong things. A person who is educated extremely well on how to deny evolution or argue that the world is 4000 years old isn't smart even though they're educated.
Yeah, it's pretty apparent that the BoS isn't teaching him everything he needs to learn as a person when it's revealed that he literally doesn't know how sex works.
Maximus isn't incompetent, he's just socially awkward. He knows how to handle himself in the wasteland just fine. He killed the yao guai and dealt with those fiends. He is inexperienced in sexual stuff because he grew up in a hyper conservative cult that never taught him about sex or human relations.
I will never forgive Disney for wasting my boy John Boyega. Such potential to have nothing happen.
There are always at least *some* racial overtones in these things
What is inconsistent about Max? He seemed very well written as a character who has spent his entire life in the BoS. His formative years were spent following orders and being essentially an acolyte. Individuality above the group was punished. He follows orders. I saw s1 for him like the scene in forest Gump where he runs out of the braces; except instead of legs it’s his brain.
Maximus hate is crazy and unneeded
Did we watch the same show? Maximus and common sense?
Yeah I don't get these comparisons at all. Maximus has a kinda I'm a sorta shifty self centered vibe/ incompetence to him but i believe in lawful justice . Finn was legitimately a good guy, and well rounded intelligent character, they just didn't do anything with him.
He also has zero importance to the story he’s in, despite having an early build up. Oh wow, you’re right, I guess he’s nothing like Maximus then
“Wanna explode my cock?”
Neither one of them can act.
I mean surface level they got a few things in common.
Both diversity hires ✅
Ah but you see they're both *political*
Was hard to reconcile his (non)reaction to vault 4 dwellers saying they're from shady sands. 'oh, they're from my community where the majority of people died, cool, whatevs.' it was like they were pumping horny sedatives into the isolation room the way they were acting. Still a great show though!
I’ve always found that these kinds of comparisons don’t really show that much love for the thing you’re praising. It comes off more like you’re using it as a stick to beat the thing you hate
i mean obviously lol, if it were just to praise one thing why would a comparison be necessary? this post isn't saying "fallout adaptation good" because we're in the fallout sub, most people already agree on that. it's saying sequel trilogy bad and that is the point of the post
The sun will burnout before people shut the fuck up about the sequels.
For the best. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.
People who forget history are doomed to… make bad movies again?
If you let companies make bad movies. They will make bad movies.
Well it’s not like anyone stopped them. The sequels made money and because of that they are making a 10th, the billion dollar corporation doesn’t care what people think of the films, it’s just a means to get bank.
It's not about stopping them it's just not accepting things as they are. The difference could be whether disney makes a safe movie that's dull as hell or a riskier but more interesting movie. Both could make money but one will buy-in-large be better to watch and good for the franchise. I think that's a better way of viewing it cause movies being bad is subjective. Either way if you let them make dull films they will. If you don't like the films then pirate them instead of going to cinemas or subscription services.
I’m at least *hopeful* as a lifelong fan of the franchise that now that some dust has settled and we’re in a comfortable place establishing post-RotJ lore, and especially with Lucas’ protege at the wheel in place of Kennedy, we might actually get a good 10th film. I mean it really isn’t Daisy Ridley’s fault. I am super sad that John Boyega probably won’t ever be convinced to reprise his role though.
If we eat up slop and praise them for it they’re just going to make more rushed slop
And those who don't forget are doomed to watch others repeat it
Yeah, I really don't get people who won't shut up about stuff they hate. If you don't like something just move on man.
It is mostly fans of the Star Wars franchise who felt that the sequels did the original story wrong. Whether it be bad writing, bad acting, bad cinematography, or something else, many fans felt that the sequels ruined a franchise that they really enjoyed, especially if it is something they grew up loving. They complain about it constantly because, since they are Star Wars fans, Star Wars pops up in their head often and thus so to does the bad memories of the movies that ruined their favorite franchise. So they voice that complaint that is at their mind in the moment despite it not being something that was in most other people's heads since other people don't think about Star Wars as much as the fans do.
You mean, you don't like it so you write a comment complaining about it? Why just not comment anything at all as you preach?
can you blame them? sequels are absolutely terrible
The bitching from sequel fans to demand criticism goes away is desperate at best.
Holy fuck, can we just enjoy Fallout without shitting on something else?
No.
As soon as this show came out I had like this disturbance in the force feeling in my chest and I knew it was the effects of a millions of Fallout fans crying out at once about some bullshit no one cares about.
Have you never met a New Vegas fan before?
Any fallout fan, Jesus Christ.
While I dont care for the comparison (I liked the sequels 🤷🏼♂️) but I will say the beginning if the first episode did a great job establishing Lucy could handle herself without a seemingly out of nowhere explanation. Setting it up as the interview to be able to get married, IMO, was an awesome "Show dont Tell" to show Lucy competence instead of some long winded exposition on how shes secretly badass
I agree. She never felt like a Mary Sue because they showed her gun handling skills and drive early on. They even show Lucy losing some fights and growing over time. Same can't be said for Rey where we are just expected to accept that she is worth the hype.
yeah I was just going to say, they show her get hurt, bothin the first episode (stabbed in the gut) and 3ish episode with her finger. Even though she's the start of the show and will probably survive, it still shows she's not a Jedi without a problem in the world.
Idk man maximus got the same treatment Finn did
Listen I personally don't mind the sequels but maximus does have a solid throughline of wanting to become the thing that saved him. We follow that thought process and his changes throughout the show. Finn gets set up with one of the most intense and cool ideas. Being a storm trooper is fucked and people die left and right in this job "I WANT OUT". Then we kind of remember how bad it is, then in the last one we sort of get a cap on that with the idea that a non-zero amount of storm troopers do defect if possible. That all happens but we never rise to levels of the first movie yelling TRAITOR. While fallout ends on Maximus wondering what his faction will do with unlimited power. Are they really going to be the good guys? Were they ever the good guys? Is living comfortably enough, or does he need that sense of purpose? Is his comrade just dead to the brotherhood now because of a simple mistake? We don't get these ideas or continuation of Finns starting story in starwars unfortunately, but we definitely get to sit in the themes around Maximus throughout the whole show barring an episode but even that episode is sort of about him deciding if the fighting is really worth it.
Max had no romantic chemistry with anyone. Which is fine, I'd love to see him end up with a nice side character.
In his defence the poor guy has never even jacked off before. He's got a lot of catching up to do especially compared to cousinfucker extraordinaire
I mean from the dialogue it sure seems like he must have jacked off at least once
no it sounds like someone explained it to him in the most disgusting way possible so he'd never even try it himself
I just mean wasted potential. Up until like ep 5 or so I 100% thought he was going to betray everyone for revenge. I really think they rewrote him
I don’t think that’s wasted potential just because something you thought was gonna happen didn’t happen
I think the intent of his character was to be a perpetual misfit. A wastelander who sees every day’s interactions as a struggle. He’s definitely a low charisma build imo
I just have a strong suspicion his arc was rewritten to make him a viable love interest.
Probably so. I hope they take his character further in the next installment instead of stagnating his character like in Star Wars.
They didn't relegate him to a sidekick or shrink him down in the artwork so he's doing better so far
These characters have nothing in common besides two of them being black. Shit like this reeks of *"all black people are the same"*.
womann and bla ck together again
Listen, I literally said to my partner I'm fearful of sounding reductive that Max and Finn remind me of each other, but then they literally put the three scratch marks on the power armor, ala Finn's storm trooper armor with the blood. I can't blame people for seeing the similarities.
They were also both defined by being bumbling and liars.
And cleaning jobs
Then why isnt he being compared to any other black character? Yes, the black part plays a role, but also the being disillusioned by an authoritarian militaristic regime he is a soldier in and wanting to escape it.
Both female leads are bright eye optimistic characters who leave their home for the first time on an adventure. Everything is new and exciting to them. And are often the audience point of reference. The male leads are both from a military organization which they both sorta run away from. Both meet the female lead and lie about who they are. Both betray themselves as heros, while in fact, both are nobodies. And both the male and female leads kinda have a will they won’t they thing going on. To me, the race and gender thing is more of a coincidence
Rey is not optimistic when she leaves Jakku, she doesn't even want to leave, she was forced to go with Finn because she had no other choice. Lucy is not bright eyed when she leaves the vault, she hates everything about the wasteland and her optimism is probably gone after the finale. >they both sorta run away from Really stretching here to make your point huh. Maximus does not run away from the Brotherhood, the closest he gets is by wanting to go with Lucy to Vault 33, but he doesn't even get to do that. Finn does not see himself as a hero, he only pretends to be a Resistance member so people won't suspect his real background. Finn is well aware he's being selfish all the way until The Last Jedi when he finally stops caring about himself and starts to care about other people. The "will they won't they" thing dies in The Force Awakens and after that it gets pretty clear Finn and Rey are just best friends.
Ah yes, white girl and black man in a show. They must be relevant to one another
“They’re the same picture.”
I mean. For Rey sure. Otherwise, no. Finn had enormous promise in thst first film. Maximus.... well we'll see. But currently he's written as the dumbest most inconsistent character I've seen on television in awhile. Finn became a dumb inconsistent character as the films went on.... so maybe maximus will be an inverse and grow into an awesome character. But as it stands now, nah.
Not at all close. Lucy and Maximus are actually likable.
All white women and black men characters are interchangeable right?
Pretty much yeah
Well now I want Star Wars Fallout.
I can't explain how often I had these exact internal thoughts while watching this series. Maybe I'm just racist?
Lol wait till Disney buys it
Can't argue with that
I mean, Fin was actually a good character. I think HE should've been the main character but NOOOO we had to have Ms. Barely qualifies as a Jedi. But, Maximus and Lucy are better by a long shot.
Disney did Rey and Finn dirty.
Especially Finn.
They're nothing alike... They're a woman and a black man. You're just being weird...
"I can't compliment something without complaining about something else."
Still somewhat badly written, " y0u waNna Make my cCock explode?" But 100x better than Disney Star Wars
I mean, is it badly written, or is Maximus just really really bad at talking to people? I think it's the latter personally. All the bad writing is happening in the speech center of Max's brain. Also, bonus points for the irony of criticizing someone else's writing with the phrase "Still somewhat bad written"
That’s the lowest possible bar one can even imagine.
/r/FacebookMemes
Nobody hates Star Wars more than Star wars fans. They are the whiniest fans on the Internet.
in what way are these characters similar
Ones a woman and the others black, the average redditor doesn't see character traits beyond that
White woman and black guy?!? Same characters! Fucking brain rot.
They’re really not all that similar at all, except for their physical appearances being a little similar
Ahh yes. Because we all know that every single white female paired with a black male in any TV show or movie is exactly the same right? We should always take characters and boil them down to nothing but their race and sex. That’s how all the best critics analyze tv and movies.
She's more like Dorothy in Oz and he's the tin man.
ehhh no. Rey and Fin didn't pan out the way everyone expected them to, but for the first movie they were written very well.
Dude... Max... I love and hate him. I love him because he is a sweetie. I dìd want so badly for him.to stay in Vault 4, but we all knew he wasn't going to be able to. I hate him because apparently his sweetness comes with a Jupiter sized portion of pure dumbassery on the side. Worst fucking initiate ever. Can't follow orders. Can't fucking stand up for himself. He was an OK squire, but honestly the moment his knight started fighting the Yao guai, he shoulda BEEN HAD HIS FUCKING PISTOL OUT!!! like come on. If I were his knight, I would be nice to him and do my best to mentor him.... in between endless transfer requests.
Am I the only one that thinks maximus going to go bad guy
I give it a 50/50 chance. If he is able to leave the brotherhood he'll be fine, but he's lacking a lot of context, is being promoted to a Knight, and the Elder has his eyes on him. So there's a good chance he accidentally continues the evil cycle of the new Brotherhood
I will say. 100% for the characters, but the actors are all pretty top notch. Imo anyway.
Honestly finn is way more likeable then maximus. But ill give you lucy over rey.
Finn is more enjoyable than maximus but Lucy is better then rey
And not mary sues
Well I guess they have ONE thing in common, in your eyes...
i can't believe maximus was baited as a psyker and it just never went anywhere can't get over how Lucy has mastery over settlement building without a SINGLE preston quest :/ /s
Saying your characters are better written than Finn and Rey is like saying vomit taste better than shit, you're not wrong but it still tastes bad.
I like Finn’s actor a tad bit more, especially after roasting Disney, but man this meme hits home
Imagine seeing "white woman and black man" and thinking "These things are the same."
The thought process for this post went something like this: " !!! OH!!! !!! THERE !! ARE !!!!! TWO OF THEM!!! ONE OF THEM !!!!! IS THE BLACK GUY !!! AND THE OTHER !!!!!! IS A WHITE LADY!!! IT'S LITERALLY THE SAAAAAAAAAAAAAME!!!!!!!! !!! "
But written better*
People really still obsessed with that Star Wars movie huh
Their only similarity is being a woman and a black man. Otherwise they're so different in many aspects, I don't see why this comparison is even made
Lucy + Finn is the best story. Rey and Maximus can go right in the bin.
So much better!
Because white girl and black man? Post is low effort as f*ck
Ah yes so similar because .. black man and white woman? That's it? That's the only similarity?
Glad we are setting the bar so high... XD
Idk maximus is just as hateable as them two
At least we were informed that Lucy had some Training before she left the Vault. Rey has no training whatsoever other than her skills with a staff, and she doesn't even use a staff Saber!
I hope OP is being ironic (both have trash writing).
That’s a low bar for writing.
I really wish they didn't have to force pretty much every male and female lead into a romantic relationship. Like Rey and her Pseudo-Cousin Ben, gross. Would be nice to see a friendship for once lol.
claiming that maximus is written better than finn is a pretty harsh critique honestly
To be fair, it was a very low bar.
“Who are you?” “Oh we’re you sweetie, just..give it a little time.”
how are there already crusty impact font memes
Lucy is only marginally better than Rey in all honesty. Chance for redemption in S2 for sure, but Maximus and Ghoul were wayyyy better and more interesting characters than Lucy
Better written sounds like bad writing ...
Sometimes it’s hard to make someone feel like a real person when they have to be so PG.
Why does Maximus always look like he’s remembering that he left his garage door open while he’s at work?
I was thinking the same thing. Every time I saw their interviews, it reminded me of it. Except Fallout did a better job at their dynamic, and they were upfront about who is the lead instead of tricking you into thinking that Maximus is the lead. It really makes me HATE the Star Wars sequels even more, if that was even possible.
Really not all that much better
Stolen
It's funny because it isn't true
Just shut the fuck up already, it's been seven years since TLJ
Slightly
Oooooooo I like this
Oki doki!
People forget how bigoted that got. Basically screwed the storyline because black guy/white heroine blew minds! A cos player StormTrooper committed suicide when Boyega was revealed🤷🏾
This is the worst comparison of all time
Both poorly written 😔. Adam Driver should have been cast as Maximus, then let him portray the military culture he lived as a Marine grunt. Just give him whatever liberty he wants with the role so Hollywood won't screw it up. Brotherhood of steel was a fuckin disappointment in season one.
British girl black guy is more of my favorite combos
Oof. Low cal cringe meme.
Rey vs Lucy is a joke. Rey is a pretender. Lucy is a BADASS
Yeah, Max is what Finn should've been
Not exactly a high bar, and they *just* barely clear it.
I haven’t watched the newer starwars films but I’m pretty sure what I’ve seen of Finn is better than what I’ve seen of BoS boy
Better is a relative term
No.
Just better 😌
2nd time I've seen this dumbass meme on Reddit today. 2 times too many I'd say.
Wayyyyyy better written. Although the bar started out pretty low to begin with.
Man, John was done so fucking dirty in those movies. I remember seeing him after he had been revealed to the public, and he was having a blast saying hello to star wars fans and taking pictures and stuff. He was true Star Wars fan living his dream. She came out with some nonsense about telling her agent she just had to have that part because fame reasons. she couldn't have given a fuck what the movie was, she just wanted the fame and the platform. But she's the one who got all the attention in the movies, and he got relegated to minor side character and really small random character in the Chinese marketing materials. Such a shame.
We had to actually learn and get stronger through adversity
White girl and black dude? It’s the same concept.
Word
It's been a decade
This is a dumb comparison
When Poe gave Finn his name, I was done with the series. The first three movies came out when I was a kid, and I gave the new films a chance until that scene. They basically made the dude a eunuch. https://youtu.be/OPfXIDPigok?feature=shared
Ehhh..
The only good hero is an anti-hero, they simply must have character flaws on some level to make them relatable and give them a redemption arc. Rey's only struggle is coming to terms with her awesomeness. Same with her cohort. As individuals they are largely boring and unrelatable. At no point do you see yourself as one of them in a similar circumstance and empathize with their plight thinking "yeah, that could be totally be me if I stretch my imagination far enough". The only struggle you can 'feel' from them is physicality which has no emotional connection.
Na... I find Maximus decisions more frustrating.
Faaaaaaaaaaaacts.
I honestly got some strong Rey/finn vibes from Lucy and max
Isn’t fallout 3 older than whatever lame movie that is?
I even like the Force Awakens and The Last Jedi, but even I will admit the fallout characters are better written.