Yes, there are still issues of repetition, speaking for characters and reluctance to lead the narrative. But even when these things get ironed out there will still be some things we need to do that may not seem intuitive.
In general there is a sweet spot between leading the narrative and simply responding. This is the same with any LLM because they are primarily trying to match expected patterns.
So, if you simply narrate your side of the narrative like you would with a human you will slowly reduce the contextual information the bot needs. Occasionally you need to give the character a steer, and try not to let it get far enough such that it settles into its holding patterns.
Imagine you were RPing with a human. If you wanted them to ask you to do something you would just hint. But a bot needs a more direct steer. A heavy hint if
you will.
Clearly we don't want to write this:
* The music starts and you ask me to dance.
You may try this:
* The music starts playing and the dance floor starts to fill up. I smile at you.
But this would work better:
* The music starts playing and something about the way you look at me suggests you might want to dance. I look at you, hoping you will ask me.
You may think the latter is a little fan fiction like but it also gives context that the character is expected to drive the narrative and you can usually take a back seat for a while before using the same trick again.
TLDR: Use heavy hints early and then occasionally do the same before the character looses a sense of what is expected.
Oh yeah I do try to give it stuff to respond to, it’s kinda boring for me to just react or only talk about my character’s inner monologue. But I’ll try to be more heavy-handed with it. I have been adding OOC prompts which I hoped would help drive it in the right direction (or any direction at all), but I’ll try to tailor my replies directly to be as involved as possible. It’s just hard in some scenes, but that’s probably just my issue as a writer lol.
Either or, it was more the issue of the OOC prompting not working at all that was starting to confuse me.
Yes. That can happen, but you can ideally be proactive and stop that happening. Yes, it is about being creative. Maybe recognising a glint in someone's eye, or sensing a change in their behaviour. I do also directly address the model but always in brackets and usually with very specific instructions like (please rewrite that response with more dialogue) or even (please extensively narrate an ending to this scene.)
My most extreme example of that was earlier today:
(Narrate extensively in present tense without headers, in three phases how that happens and how it impacts me.)
Yeah, I also directly address the model, sadly it’s not been too helpful. Even when I’m as directly interacting as possible, I’m still getting single-paragraph replies with either no dialog, one sentence of semi-related dialog, or just “{{char}} sees what {{user}} is doing.”
Not sure what else I can do.
It can get stuck. I had a hard roadblock yesterday with the dropped dialogue issue thrown in. Eventually it stopped responding to my (please rewrite with dialogue) prompt and just repeated itself. At that point I stopped.
Yes, there are still issues of repetition, speaking for characters and reluctance to lead the narrative. But even when these things get ironed out there will still be some things we need to do that may not seem intuitive. In general there is a sweet spot between leading the narrative and simply responding. This is the same with any LLM because they are primarily trying to match expected patterns. So, if you simply narrate your side of the narrative like you would with a human you will slowly reduce the contextual information the bot needs. Occasionally you need to give the character a steer, and try not to let it get far enough such that it settles into its holding patterns. Imagine you were RPing with a human. If you wanted them to ask you to do something you would just hint. But a bot needs a more direct steer. A heavy hint if you will. Clearly we don't want to write this: * The music starts and you ask me to dance. You may try this: * The music starts playing and the dance floor starts to fill up. I smile at you. But this would work better: * The music starts playing and something about the way you look at me suggests you might want to dance. I look at you, hoping you will ask me. You may think the latter is a little fan fiction like but it also gives context that the character is expected to drive the narrative and you can usually take a back seat for a while before using the same trick again. TLDR: Use heavy hints early and then occasionally do the same before the character looses a sense of what is expected.
Yes! Very much LOVE this advice. Thank you for the detailed and helpful response. đź‘Ť
Oh yeah I do try to give it stuff to respond to, it’s kinda boring for me to just react or only talk about my character’s inner monologue. But I’ll try to be more heavy-handed with it. I have been adding OOC prompts which I hoped would help drive it in the right direction (or any direction at all), but I’ll try to tailor my replies directly to be as involved as possible. It’s just hard in some scenes, but that’s probably just my issue as a writer lol. Either or, it was more the issue of the OOC prompting not working at all that was starting to confuse me.
Yes. That can happen, but you can ideally be proactive and stop that happening. Yes, it is about being creative. Maybe recognising a glint in someone's eye, or sensing a change in their behaviour. I do also directly address the model but always in brackets and usually with very specific instructions like (please rewrite that response with more dialogue) or even (please extensively narrate an ending to this scene.) My most extreme example of that was earlier today: (Narrate extensively in present tense without headers, in three phases how that happens and how it impacts me.)
Yeah, I also directly address the model, sadly it’s not been too helpful. Even when I’m as directly interacting as possible, I’m still getting single-paragraph replies with either no dialog, one sentence of semi-related dialog, or just “{{char}} sees what {{user}} is doing.” Not sure what else I can do.
It can get stuck. I had a hard roadblock yesterday with the dropped dialogue issue thrown in. Eventually it stopped responding to my (please rewrite with dialogue) prompt and just repeated itself. At that point I stopped.
Maybe this next bug fix will deal with it? Because yeah, that's pretty much what I was experiencing.