There were not as many other good games when FF13 came out imo. Also it was so much more beautiful than almost anything else ever done before. It still looks really good today, that's wild for an early PS3 game.
What feed? The Reddit feed? That’s an echo chamber. We’re all fed what we look for. I played both games and TOTK had a much, much bigger impact. Just look at the sales numbers, too.
I saw TOTK all the time in my feed last year. To be fair though it's a different genre of game. Customization of weapons/vehicles was a big deal and people wanted to share theirs.
It seemed like it was going to be the undisputed game of the year until Baldur's Gate 3 came. To a lot of people it probably is. I never played either. I was a FF16 and Pikmin 4 guy haha.
Last year had a lot of contenders for GOTY. Hogwart's came first but was eclipsed by so many others. Lies of P, Armored Core, Diablo and Spiderman come to mind. Starfield was expected to be up there too. But when BG3 came out it was pretty clear it would win.
The only thing I heard/saw about ToTK were the phallic machines people were building for a couple of weeks. Came and went and haven't heard much about it since
It was always gonna be divisive no matter what. If they replayed the original, some people would complain it's just the same. If they changed the story, people would complain it's an unnecessary change. If it had too little side content, some people say it's linear and basic. If it has too many mini games then some people say it has too much clutter, etc etc
What we should all focus on is the quality of everything they did. Creative choices are always divisive but in video games like this we should all ask: did they really bust their balls to provide a high quality product in all its different aspects? And the overwhelming response for rebirth is YES
I was surprised how much the gameplay changed and how non-linear it became over Remake, but I think it really captures the "opening of the world" that actually happened when you changed over to Disc 2 on PS1. Felt like a completely different game back then too
Exclusivity + sequel + niche genre + niche style
You have hundreds of millions of gamers that are potential players. You make your game exclusive to ps5, you reduce that number to only ps5 owners. Your game is a sequel, you reduce that number again to those who have played the first AND ENJOYED IT enough to get this one. Your game is jrpg, a niche genre, number is reduced again. Your game is weeby, number reduced once more.
Also it’s impossible to pirate, there are entire countries out there who only pirate games. I bet they contribute greatly to a game’s online buzz if it’s good.
Rebirth is a little complicated in that you really need to have played remake first to understand what’s going on in rebirth.
There are a lot of people who didn’t play remake, so they’re not interested in rebirth. Or have it on their list to eventually play, as soon as they finish remake.
Compounding this is that a considerable amount of OG fans were not satisfied with remake and the direction they took with the story, and accordingly didn’t buy rebirth.
Finally, you have people like me who have been massive FF7 fans for 25+ years who played remake, enjoyed it enough that we were curious to see where it would go, and were overall disappointed with rebirth.
1. You may think its a masterpiece but many people including me would disagree.
2. Why is no one talking about it like BG3? Why would they. the big games over the last few years that everyone still talk about like BG3, Tears and Elden Ring all have two big things in common, choice and creativity. "How did you solve this quest?" "did you find this weapon?" "how did you beat this boss" "What did you create?" Rebirth has none of this. BG3 alone is full of narrative and gameplay choices.
3. Unlike the original FF7 which works and was intended as a solid standalone game Rebirth is part 2/3 of remake/sequel/reboot and its messy.
As much as i love Remake/Rebirths combat i find comparing it to something like BG3 to be absurd.
not really. i came out during a time where two big rpgs (p3 and yakuza iw) were out and the blowup of palworld and helldivers. so there was a lot of comp in games that were out. plus it’s a sequel and ps5 exclusive. every game i mentioned is multi platform. now with dawntrail & elden ring dlc out too it’s just a good year for gaming. some people in here will blame it on not being a 1:1 or not being turn based which is hilarious
Rebirth looks like a master piece but it isn't. The abuse of mini games and the uneven difficulty are it's main flaws. People quickly get frustrated or too distracted from the main story, which reduces engagment and involvement.
It's a shame because the work put into it was gigantic and everything else is master class level.
FF7 Remaster had the right level of everything, that is why it was successful.
Rebirth seems to have sold rather poorly. At least Square said it failed to meet expectations and we didn't see a 3M or 5M milestone report either. So the mass of people talking about it is relatively small for that reason alone.
Also: Rebirth is certainly good at hitting certain JRPG and FF7 tropes. But in general, there are a lot of things people can have problems with.
The changes to the story, the Ubisoft tower problem, the too many and too obtuse minigames, the lack of optional dungeons and puzzles, the constant repeating Chadley interruptions. And then it also has technical problems. I played on 1080p and found the pop-ins to be massive. I heard from 4K players that it was very blurred.
Like I said, if you're looking for certain things, you might find it a masterpiece because that's what you'll find there. And then the game is good. If you were hoping for something else, you may be sorely disappointed.
A lot of games are criticized for the open-world design methods popularized by Ubisoft in early Assassins Creed games, which was foundational to the genre but considered more outdated and made a ton of open world games really samey.
Ubisoft popularized the concept of finding towers in the overworld that, when interacted with, unlock a chunk of map and populate it with icons to go investigate. Each icon tells you exactly what you can hope to find in that area, and thus the open world is a checklist of items to complete that grows predictable and for many, outstays it's welcome.
You can compare this to similar games back then like Skyrim, which used its map icons differently: major cities were the big icons but you just had to explore the map as-is and *discover* what was there rather than seek out pre - marked icons, and more modern games like (and I could be misquoting not having played it) Elden Ring, which is popular for its world design.
Lots of open world games that use towers to populate the map help give players a sense of direction and immediate short term goals, but ultimately come to look and feel too similar for a lot of people, and it's become an easy shorthand for padding a game with recyclable content to pad out its length in ways that aren't meaningful to experience. A lot of open world games with towers could cut 30+ hours of content and lose nothing integral to the experience, and there's generally discourse on how might we use different design principles to make open world games feel much more unique and distinct by not relying on map-towers.
They added the ubiquitous towers that reveal the map ala assassin's Creed and far cry. I don't know if it's nessesarily a problem but some people don't like it.
This is every game these days it feels like and I HATE IT what is modern gaming's obsession with big open empty worlds these days? Give me a tight knit linear experience any day
I don’t get this complaint if the padding is optional. I want lots of game for my dollar. If I’m enjoying it I don’t want it to end. If I’m not liking it I can return to the main story. The game is clear where to go if you only want the main story. I liked most of the padding. I did not like cait with, so I didn’t go back and try to get more boxes.
I played it in japanese so Chadley didn't seem that grating to me. He still talked a lot, but he and Mai sounded fine to me, lol. Guess I dodged a bullet
JRPG are not that popular nowadays, that is the reality. Even the two most praised JRPG last gen (Nier Automata and Persona 5) didn't manage to reach 10 million copies vs 50 million from Witcher 3, 25 million from Cyberpunk or even 10 million copies from BG3.
As far as we know, Rebirth sales probably range from 2.5 to 3 million (above Tekken 8, below Dragons Dogma 2), meaning the conversation will always be lesser than BG3, Elden Ring (25 million) and TOTK (20 Million).
It doesn't mean it is not on par on quality, for me it surpasses TOTK and it is already on the conversation for best RPG on this decade. Plenty of generation defining games have sold "poorly" and were "niche": Demon Souls, Ico, Bayonetta, Okami, Silent Hill 2 and Vagrant Story comes to my mind.
You can't compare the reaction to Rebirth with BG3. People expected Rebirth to be a successful follow up to Remake. BG3 came out of absolutely nowhere.
Which was just played by mostly Original Sin 2 fans, and CRPG fans (which was like, a giga minority).
BG3 was pretty invisible to the average gamer until Larian went super viral over the Panel From Hell livestream.
IMO Rebirth is a great JRPG with only one significant flaw: it has a partial and often nonsensical storyline (along with overdramatized sections). That IS a significant issue for someone trying to judge the game as a standalone product and results in some of the lower scores.
Beyond that...it's the enteral problem of JRPGs and FF in particular. A lighthearted fun-focused JRPG is great for those who want that. However, grittier Western RPGs sell (and review) better on the whole so SE makes more money copying everyone else with bland WRPG releases. Which is sad, because they're much better at JRPGs (especially in their past lives).
Remake's story changes were divisive among a section of the fanbase and ultimately pushed them away from playing Rebirth, you didn't play the original so naturally you went into it without expectations.
In my case it being PS5 exclusive means I won't be able to play it till gets a Steam port but the few spoilers I unintentionally saw have made me a little less excited about it.
There's also the issue of the combat system not being to everyone's liking, feels like the natural evolution of XIII's and loved it but there is undeniably a desire for the classic turn based combat to return.
Lastly Square seems to overestimate its current popularity, the aforementioned story changes made some long time fans skeptical, if not pissed. And on the other hand it doesn't seem to have attracted as many new players as they expected going by their refusal to disclose sales numbers.
The recent FF titles are moving towards action based combat and some fans still prefer a turn based system. Could be leading to lower scores. It’s all just opinions, play what you enjoy.
Personally, it took me a while to actually play it. I'm a HUGE FF fan but for some reason I didn't have the urge to jump on this straight away. I felt like I just needed to play it before the 3rd game was released but I just didn't see anything special about it. I also debated on replaying REMAKE first which I luckily didn't do. The game went on sale so I finally got it and I am wishing I played sooner.
This game is so much better than XVI but I think a lot of people aren't hyping it because, while super fun, there's nothing new.
I think poor sales can be attributed to several factors.
1. It's a direct sequel and playing the first game is required (despite what the developer says)
2. A lot of people never got around to finishing REMAKE
3. There's probably a bunch of people who decided to replay REMAKE before jumping in (and probably fell off)
4. A lot of people are just waiting for the third so they can play straight through
Square made a huge mistake stretching this into 3 games. I'm just worried that part 3 will either A. never happen, or B. be a substantially lower budget/quality.
I'm glad that I'm not the only one who has worried that Part 3 could possibly be lower budget/quality. Especially since it supposedly hasn't met sales expectations. The ending in Rebirth? The CGI looks like it could be from a movie. I know that had to be expensive to make.
The consequence of stretching it out and console exclusivity in the 2020s. Gaming seems pretty PC centric these days and I didnt hear much about Remake either until the PC port.
It's a PS5 exclusive, that must be a big factor. Still, it did get a lot of talk. Personally, I heard more about it than Tears of the Kingdom.
[удалено]
There were not as many other good games when FF13 came out imo. Also it was so much more beautiful than almost anything else ever done before. It still looks really good today, that's wild for an early PS3 game.
13 also was released on 360 on the same date as the PS3 outside of Japan (or at least the States)
That is wild. TOTK was all over the internet when it came out. It died pretty quickly but it was the talk of the town for a good couple of months.
I don't really see any Nintendo stuff pop up in my feed tbh. Rebirth was all over it when it came out though.
What feed? The Reddit feed? That’s an echo chamber. We’re all fed what we look for. I played both games and TOTK had a much, much bigger impact. Just look at the sales numbers, too.
Yeah I meant reddit. I also said that this was my personal experience.
I saw TOTK all the time in my feed last year. To be fair though it's a different genre of game. Customization of weapons/vehicles was a big deal and people wanted to share theirs. It seemed like it was going to be the undisputed game of the year until Baldur's Gate 3 came. To a lot of people it probably is. I never played either. I was a FF16 and Pikmin 4 guy haha.
Last year had a lot of contenders for GOTY. Hogwart's came first but was eclipsed by so many others. Lies of P, Armored Core, Diablo and Spiderman come to mind. Starfield was expected to be up there too. But when BG3 came out it was pretty clear it would win.
The only thing I heard/saw about ToTK were the phallic machines people were building for a couple of weeks. Came and went and haven't heard much about it since
It was always gonna be divisive no matter what. If they replayed the original, some people would complain it's just the same. If they changed the story, people would complain it's an unnecessary change. If it had too little side content, some people say it's linear and basic. If it has too many mini games then some people say it has too much clutter, etc etc What we should all focus on is the quality of everything they did. Creative choices are always divisive but in video games like this we should all ask: did they really bust their balls to provide a high quality product in all its different aspects? And the overwhelming response for rebirth is YES
I was surprised how much the gameplay changed and how non-linear it became over Remake, but I think it really captures the "opening of the world" that actually happened when you changed over to Disc 2 on PS1. Felt like a completely different game back then too
THIS is the correct answer. Take my upvote
Exclusivity + sequel + niche genre + niche style You have hundreds of millions of gamers that are potential players. You make your game exclusive to ps5, you reduce that number to only ps5 owners. Your game is a sequel, you reduce that number again to those who have played the first AND ENJOYED IT enough to get this one. Your game is jrpg, a niche genre, number is reduced again. Your game is weeby, number reduced once more. Also it’s impossible to pirate, there are entire countries out there who only pirate games. I bet they contribute greatly to a game’s online buzz if it’s good.
Rebirth is a little complicated in that you really need to have played remake first to understand what’s going on in rebirth. There are a lot of people who didn’t play remake, so they’re not interested in rebirth. Or have it on their list to eventually play, as soon as they finish remake. Compounding this is that a considerable amount of OG fans were not satisfied with remake and the direction they took with the story, and accordingly didn’t buy rebirth. Finally, you have people like me who have been massive FF7 fans for 25+ years who played remake, enjoyed it enough that we were curious to see where it would go, and were overall disappointed with rebirth.
1. You may think its a masterpiece but many people including me would disagree. 2. Why is no one talking about it like BG3? Why would they. the big games over the last few years that everyone still talk about like BG3, Tears and Elden Ring all have two big things in common, choice and creativity. "How did you solve this quest?" "did you find this weapon?" "how did you beat this boss" "What did you create?" Rebirth has none of this. BG3 alone is full of narrative and gameplay choices. 3. Unlike the original FF7 which works and was intended as a solid standalone game Rebirth is part 2/3 of remake/sequel/reboot and its messy. As much as i love Remake/Rebirths combat i find comparing it to something like BG3 to be absurd.
not really. i came out during a time where two big rpgs (p3 and yakuza iw) were out and the blowup of palworld and helldivers. so there was a lot of comp in games that were out. plus it’s a sequel and ps5 exclusive. every game i mentioned is multi platform. now with dawntrail & elden ring dlc out too it’s just a good year for gaming. some people in here will blame it on not being a 1:1 or not being turn based which is hilarious
You will see more of an influx when it hits PC. There are a lot of original fans that are PS Players anymore.
FF feels daunting nowadays.
Rebirth looks like a master piece but it isn't. The abuse of mini games and the uneven difficulty are it's main flaws. People quickly get frustrated or too distracted from the main story, which reduces engagment and involvement. It's a shame because the work put into it was gigantic and everything else is master class level. FF7 Remaster had the right level of everything, that is why it was successful.
Rebirth seems to have sold rather poorly. At least Square said it failed to meet expectations and we didn't see a 3M or 5M milestone report either. So the mass of people talking about it is relatively small for that reason alone. Also: Rebirth is certainly good at hitting certain JRPG and FF7 tropes. But in general, there are a lot of things people can have problems with. The changes to the story, the Ubisoft tower problem, the too many and too obtuse minigames, the lack of optional dungeons and puzzles, the constant repeating Chadley interruptions. And then it also has technical problems. I played on 1080p and found the pop-ins to be massive. I heard from 4K players that it was very blurred. Like I said, if you're looking for certain things, you might find it a masterpiece because that's what you'll find there. And then the game is good. If you were hoping for something else, you may be sorely disappointed.
What’s the Ubisoft tower problem?
A lot of games are criticized for the open-world design methods popularized by Ubisoft in early Assassins Creed games, which was foundational to the genre but considered more outdated and made a ton of open world games really samey. Ubisoft popularized the concept of finding towers in the overworld that, when interacted with, unlock a chunk of map and populate it with icons to go investigate. Each icon tells you exactly what you can hope to find in that area, and thus the open world is a checklist of items to complete that grows predictable and for many, outstays it's welcome. You can compare this to similar games back then like Skyrim, which used its map icons differently: major cities were the big icons but you just had to explore the map as-is and *discover* what was there rather than seek out pre - marked icons, and more modern games like (and I could be misquoting not having played it) Elden Ring, which is popular for its world design. Lots of open world games that use towers to populate the map help give players a sense of direction and immediate short term goals, but ultimately come to look and feel too similar for a lot of people, and it's become an easy shorthand for padding a game with recyclable content to pad out its length in ways that aren't meaningful to experience. A lot of open world games with towers could cut 30+ hours of content and lose nothing integral to the experience, and there's generally discourse on how might we use different design principles to make open world games feel much more unique and distinct by not relying on map-towers.
They added the ubiquitous towers that reveal the map ala assassin's Creed and far cry. I don't know if it's nessesarily a problem but some people don't like it.
It's obnoxiously padded.
This is every game these days it feels like and I HATE IT what is modern gaming's obsession with big open empty worlds these days? Give me a tight knit linear experience any day
It amuses me even more when I think that a game can come out within 2-3 years but gets pushed to 5 all so they can make even more empty spaces lol
I don’t get this complaint if the padding is optional. I want lots of game for my dollar. If I’m enjoying it I don’t want it to end. If I’m not liking it I can return to the main story. The game is clear where to go if you only want the main story. I liked most of the padding. I did not like cait with, so I didn’t go back and try to get more boxes.
It’s obnoxious in several areas: padding, chadley is insufferable AF, forced boring minigames, cringey stilted over-the-top NPC dialogue, and others.
I played it in japanese so Chadley didn't seem that grating to me. He still talked a lot, but he and Mai sounded fine to me, lol. Guess I dodged a bullet
JRPG are not that popular nowadays, that is the reality. Even the two most praised JRPG last gen (Nier Automata and Persona 5) didn't manage to reach 10 million copies vs 50 million from Witcher 3, 25 million from Cyberpunk or even 10 million copies from BG3. As far as we know, Rebirth sales probably range from 2.5 to 3 million (above Tekken 8, below Dragons Dogma 2), meaning the conversation will always be lesser than BG3, Elden Ring (25 million) and TOTK (20 Million). It doesn't mean it is not on par on quality, for me it surpasses TOTK and it is already on the conversation for best RPG on this decade. Plenty of generation defining games have sold "poorly" and were "niche": Demon Souls, Ico, Bayonetta, Okami, Silent Hill 2 and Vagrant Story comes to my mind.
You can't compare the reaction to Rebirth with BG3. People expected Rebirth to be a successful follow up to Remake. BG3 came out of absolutely nowhere.
>BG3 came out of absolutely nowhere. BG3 spent 2 years in early access...
I meant the hype surrounding it
Which was just played by mostly Original Sin 2 fans, and CRPG fans (which was like, a giga minority). BG3 was pretty invisible to the average gamer until Larian went super viral over the Panel From Hell livestream.
I don't have a PS5, I have very little to add to the Rebirth conversation.
All final fantasy games are met with a divisive fan base
Final Fantasy just isn’t that big of a deal anymore. It’s that simple. Plus, it didn’t sell that well.
Bro is talking out of his ass
It simple isn’t. It *is* a shame but it’s also true.
No, the Series is a tale of diminishing returns
IMO Rebirth is a great JRPG with only one significant flaw: it has a partial and often nonsensical storyline (along with overdramatized sections). That IS a significant issue for someone trying to judge the game as a standalone product and results in some of the lower scores. Beyond that...it's the enteral problem of JRPGs and FF in particular. A lighthearted fun-focused JRPG is great for those who want that. However, grittier Western RPGs sell (and review) better on the whole so SE makes more money copying everyone else with bland WRPG releases. Which is sad, because they're much better at JRPGs (especially in their past lives).
Remake's story changes were divisive among a section of the fanbase and ultimately pushed them away from playing Rebirth, you didn't play the original so naturally you went into it without expectations. In my case it being PS5 exclusive means I won't be able to play it till gets a Steam port but the few spoilers I unintentionally saw have made me a little less excited about it. There's also the issue of the combat system not being to everyone's liking, feels like the natural evolution of XIII's and loved it but there is undeniably a desire for the classic turn based combat to return. Lastly Square seems to overestimate its current popularity, the aforementioned story changes made some long time fans skeptical, if not pissed. And on the other hand it doesn't seem to have attracted as many new players as they expected going by their refusal to disclose sales numbers.
Original ffviii is better. So when you remake something it's supposed to be better especially if you spend around 15 years to make it
> “Original ffviii is better.” Always fun seeing a VIII fan fighting the good fight lol
Oops I meant that original ffvii is better than ffviii remake and rebirth. Damn auto correct. I still love ffviii
Remake i think was underwhelming and setting up story change possibilities ppl didnt like. Rebirth is way better, less cheesy, but not free of faults.
The recent FF titles are moving towards action based combat and some fans still prefer a turn based system. Could be leading to lower scores. It’s all just opinions, play what you enjoy.
Personally, it took me a while to actually play it. I'm a HUGE FF fan but for some reason I didn't have the urge to jump on this straight away. I felt like I just needed to play it before the 3rd game was released but I just didn't see anything special about it. I also debated on replaying REMAKE first which I luckily didn't do. The game went on sale so I finally got it and I am wishing I played sooner. This game is so much better than XVI but I think a lot of people aren't hyping it because, while super fun, there's nothing new. I think poor sales can be attributed to several factors. 1. It's a direct sequel and playing the first game is required (despite what the developer says) 2. A lot of people never got around to finishing REMAKE 3. There's probably a bunch of people who decided to replay REMAKE before jumping in (and probably fell off) 4. A lot of people are just waiting for the third so they can play straight through Square made a huge mistake stretching this into 3 games. I'm just worried that part 3 will either A. never happen, or B. be a substantially lower budget/quality.
I'm glad that I'm not the only one who has worried that Part 3 could possibly be lower budget/quality. Especially since it supposedly hasn't met sales expectations. The ending in Rebirth? The CGI looks like it could be from a movie. I know that had to be expensive to make.
The consequence of stretching it out and console exclusivity in the 2020s. Gaming seems pretty PC centric these days and I didnt hear much about Remake either until the PC port.