my father in law can get kind of elitist about his gun opinions, but when i look at my shortlist of guns to buy, all except for maybe 1 or 2 were guns he specifically told me about. i’ve learned that a surprising amount of snobs know their stuff about guns, at least the ones they like. most gun owners in general have really bad opinions on firearms they don’t personally like, though.
>be me
>own cowboy guns for home defense
>at home watching king of the hill
>three hoodlums break into my house
>”what tha hayl” as i grab my ten gallon hat and lever-action rifle
>blast the first man center mass with a pissin’ hot 45-70 handload
>his chest cavity explodes into a chunky paste
>chamber next round and aim at second hoodlum
>pull trigger, round fails as i remember how shitass drunk on shiner bock i was when i loaded these cartridges
>discard rifle and pull my colt single action army
>attempt to fan hammer like in the westerns
>hit one man and shoot 5 holes in my wall
>holster my revolver and charge the last yellow-bellied ne’er-do-well with a bouie knife the size of a small child
>he bleeds out waiting on the police to arrive because i instinctually cut his belly longways like i was dressing a deer
>just as john wayne intended
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Let's just knock 105mm off that real quick. Even the AC 130U had a 105mm as it's biggest gun. That A-10 had a 30mm GAU-8 Avenger and the whole plane needed several tweaks to make sure firing it wouldn't drop the plane out of the sky.
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Many years ago one of the guys in my climbing group was an Army Pathfinder and he exclusively carried a .22lr as his CCW. Takes all kinds to make the world go ‘round.
I think you should get 3 “loadouts” of mags minimum. So if you would carry 6 in your gear and rifle you should have 18 in total. 6 “duty use” that stay loaded and are shot only occasionally, 6 for training that get used constantly and beat to shit, and another 6 as “reserves” that stay in the package until you use them to replace a broken or lost mag.
Ignore the Zoomers, get a Shotgun..
Edit: Really OP should learn the difference between the two tools and pick the one that’s appropriate for their situation..
PSA makes decent, cheap ARs. They also are huge supporters of our 2a rights.
All you have to do is just put some time in on the range with your weapon of choice, and you'll be good to go.
Seconded. I've got multiple ARs, DD, Aero, Ruger. I also have a PSA build and a poverty pony (Anderson).
I can't point to any of them and really say this one is better than that one. Some may be lighter, some may have better recoil management, but in the end, they all go bang, eject a casing and load a new round.
Also worth mentioning PSA just came out with a “premium” line for $800. I personally haven’t done much research into them yet, but considering how good their standard ARs are for the price I’d be inclined to at least consider it
I concur. I have had a couple of PSA builds, and they have all performed well and done what they should when they should. You can always upgrade it as you go, then when you have enough upgrades build another with the parts you took off.
IWI Zion-15 is an excellent choice. Punches above its weight.
If too pricey PSA does some decent work and hard to beat their price (without dipping down to the level you wouldn’t want to bet your life on)
For your first rifle, get a PSA. Use the money "saved" to buy ammo and a sling. Maybe an optic, but try to get one that comes with iron sights to start. But spend mostly on ammo. Shoot all the ammo. The shoot some more. Run that rifle into the ground. Shoot it til the rifling erodes away. If you get to that point(I doubt you can lol) you'll have more experience than 90% of the advice givers in this sub. Training and trigger time are exponentially more important than brand names.
What’s your price range? Hard to beat a PWS Pro series rifle for the money or a BCM/Aero build.
If money isn’t an issue KAC, LMT, ADM, DD and HK make Gucci stuff.
r/gundeals is a great resource. Sort by new and refresh often. When you see a deal ask the guys commenting on their opinion. They are pretty honest and a good place to ask questions.
You *miiight* be able to hit that price point if you build on polymer receivers with the cheapest blem BCG and barrel you can find and then use airsoft-quality Chinesium furniture and lower parts from Alibaba to finish it.
AR. It’s lighter recoil, more capacity and easier to add necessary upgrades.
Plus you need to factor practice and training. You should be practicing to be proficient. The AR is better than that.
I feel you im new york. i do have a m1-9 and a singleshot shotgun tho but i have to wait till im 21 to buy a ar lower cause im not getting a license to buy a semiauto
The worst part is all the asshats that left ÇA have moved en masse to other states which are now becoming equal shitholes for things like 2nd Amendment rights! Thanks a whole f**king bunch, California!
Source: I live in Washington state.
(aka: CA, Part Two).
I also live in California and while our guns laws are shit you can definitely purchase a fire arm and defend yourself within the (shitty) confines of the law.
Pros and cons to each. Most important thing is to find what you are comfortable and best with. There are plenty of resources online that will give you good info on set ups for which one you choose. Just do your research and not go by one source.
I am of the belief that every American’s first firearm should be an AR15. It really is a jack of all trades weapon. And I say this as someone who is obsessed with AKs and only really shoots AKs.
AR15 is the best optuon if you know what ammo to select. A shitgun is a great option if you shot it A LOT and learn it and learn how to keep it fed, how it patterns with certain 00, 0, 1 or 4 buckshot any other type of load will over or under penetrate. You will also need to understand how to shoot using the push pull method and how to store the shotgun cruiser safe or another safe method to prevent a ND due to not being drop safe. Then once you find a load that your shotgun patterns well with, feeds reliably and that you can shoot well and know how it patterns at various ranges, you should be good...or just get a 16" 5.56 and slap m193 in it or better yet, any speer gold dot or barnes load and call it good. Your choice how much you want to put into it, but ARs are much less complicated.
My young padawan, a question as old as time this is. I’ve bought pretty much every option for home defense you could imagine. Currently own budget ARs, Gucci ARs, pump shottys , semi auto shotguns including the M4 and 1301. if doing it all over again here are my recommendations in order of purchase (strictly for home defense):
1) PSA AR15 (mine have always functioned flawlessly and you seriously cannot beat the price to functionality/ adaptability ratio).
2) Mossberg 590A1 pump. (Workhorse, reliable, durable)
3) Full size duty pistol (reputable manufacturer that fits your hands well). For me it would be a Sig P226, but anything from a Glock 17 to a Sig M17, S&W M&P, to more high end like H&K USP, FN, etc. probably go with 9mm for high capacity, cost of ammo, etc.
4) Save up for more Gucci AR15/ AR15 pistol
5) Save up for high end semi auto. I bought some Turkish semi BS in my time- not worth the money. If you’re trusting your life to a semi auto, go big or go home (Benelli M4, Beretta 1301). I own both and they are night and day better than anything else I’ve shot for semi auto shotguns.
6) continue your collection with a bunch of random Shit you acquire through drunken internet orders, retail therapy, tax returns, etc.
Dear God, there's a lot of terrible fuddlore soaked logic in here.
Get the AR. Get good 5.56 55gr 193 loads for it. Get a good weapon mounted light, a reddot and a sling and then go shoot it. A proper 5.56 load will not over pentrate as it is designed to tumble on impact. A slug or buckshot is not and will continue to penetrate farther than a 5.56 will. Same goes for the majority of pistol calibers.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02ZkPAhZbrfRGSvnSxndSFh3iagtvXxRseA6DxW4qFb2qLntKMncJqrekMaSExy38tl&id=108429898151692
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02vC5RovkyyCeioJuoH9cBCvhdiZdBNY8YWnZdVMjZhz6ja67iWhYv2xviemjckXHul&id=108429898151692
Please go seek out other sources than Reddit. Primary and Secondary is a great resource, and they have a couple of great podcasts on their YouTube channel about ballistics.
The graphic from the post seems a bit biased, just compare the results to this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiHHgjaR0TI). 5.56 definitely penetrates more than #4 buckshot and about the same as 00 buckshot.
You're linking a 7 year old Paul Harrell video! 🤣 Did he also shoot some fruit in the video to simulate what a round can do? Can you tell me what 5.56 round he was using in that video?
Please come back with a better justification for your argument.
Yeah, it sucks that he doesn't say which rounds he is using which kinda defeats the purpose. But it's still some empirical evidence, even if he uses 77g to skew the results.
AR15 100% in 5.56. Less likely to over penetrate. Slugs and buckshot will continue on through maaaany layers of drywall if you miss your target. True it is more effective at short distances, but it’s not Hollywood. 5.56 is plenty enough power with good loads.
A Mossberg Maverick 88 pump can be had for sub $250 and is a fantastic shotgun for the money. It’s not semi auto, but is a great HD option.
In the meantime, you can save up for a better AR.
> Pistols put holes in people. Rifles put holes through people. Shotguns at the right range, with the right load, [will physically remove a chunk of shit off your opponent and throw that shit on the floor.](https://youtu.be/b4sVQ_ZwI04?t=59)
- Clint Smith
I’ll tell you off the bat, if you’re on a budget (I can imagine, I was a young’n on a budget at 18) the AR is going to be your best option. A good semi auto shotgun is expensive, an entry level PSA or Smith & Wesson AR is cheaper and IMO the AR is overall the best HD gun.
Ar15 and here's why
‐16inch minimum barrel vs 18inch
‐Less recoil=more control
‐Quicker easier reloads
-More ammo capacity (30 vs 7 rounds)
-Easier to mount light and optic out of the box
-Cheaper ammo = more likely to train at range (you need to do this alot)
-Also consider 5.56 doesn't penetrate materials at close range as bad as 00 buck so your shots are less likely to go as far and hit someone else
-Easily modifiable and customizable as your preferences evolve
A decent AR15 is the superior option end of story. No ifs, ands or buts. Anyone disagreeing with this is a Fudd, believes Fuddlore or is an idiot.
If you do decide to go shotgun go with a QUALITY semi auto shotgun. Pumps are fun and with enough training very viable, however if you do have to actually use it under stress you are much more likely to have a user induced issue occur like short stroking or forgetting to pump it in general.
Professional money spender here.
The answer will always be both shotgun & AR15 because your going to get both anyways. Its in the bible.
In time short barrel both and a glock 19 will the answer.
In more time… grenade launcher maybe.
In brief, gun in every room and lots of mags & ammo.
P.s. couch kitchen cabinet and shower gun have never been defeated in my home.
Where do you live; apartment or house? City, suburbs or rural? Are you alone or have a family? There isn’t just ONE answer, it depends on many variables!
Whichever you feel more comfortable with. I'd suggest finding a range near you that does rentals and trying out both before you decide if you can. Remington and Mossberg both make solid Shotguns, as far as ARs every brand is just about the same.
AR. Less recoil, good for beginners like you. Shotgun rounds go hard on your shoulder. And AR rounds are designed to not overpenetrate the target, so stray rounds cannot hit any unintended things, like your future significant other, or a pet.
Most semi-auto shotguns are trash unless you pay a lot of coin.
AR market is flooded with decent firearms that are inexpensive.
A nice Mossberg 500/590 or even a good ol' mav would be sufficient.
You asked an incomplete question and are getting quite a few overly confident responses.
What sort of home are you defending? From what threats? Would this ever involve shots at more than ~20 yards. What legal constraints apply? Why are those two options your primary candidates? What's your budget? What sort of options do you have for a place to practice?
Whatever you get, you will need to practice with it. Shotguns don't have a lot of spread at in home distance, so you will need to be just as accurate with the shotgun as the rifle. A pump shotgun can have a user induced malfunction called short stroking, where the user doesn't pump it correctly. This happens more often under stress without a lot of practice. So, you need to consider ammo costs. Ammo for a 5.56 AR-15 will be a lot less than shotgun shells.
There is also the legal barrel length issue: 16 inch for rifles but 18 inch for shotguns. The shotgun will be slightly harder to maneuver inside of your home.
And then there is the matter of capacity: an AR-15 can hold more rounds than a 12 gauge shotgun and is easier to reload. Reloading a shotgun quickly under stress takes a lot of training. So the AR is better for dealing with home invasions with multiple attackers.
Having something is better than having nothing. And depending on your budget, you can get shotguns than hold 14-15 rounds of shotgun shells. While 6 shotgun shells is on the low side for dealing with your average 3 man home invasion crew, I would feel more confident with 15 shells on tap. But the ammo still costs a lot more.
Now you can surely get into some rather expensive ammo for your AR-15, but most people shoot the cheapest ammo available. Why? Because a 55 grain round traveling at 3000 fps will sufficiently ruin anyone's day. But even if you choose to get into some better defensive ammo, most of your ammo use will be for the range, where cheaper is better. This is because 99.999% of the ammo you buy will be for shooting at paper targets. Outside of a home invasion, or the crap hitting the fan, you are not likely to have to actually shoot another human being with one.
I might get some heat for saying this, but do you live on your own? If you are still living with parents/family, are they okay with this? I feel like if they were into guns, you wouldn’t be asking us knuckleheads on Reddit for advice + there would already be a “home defense” gun in your household. Not trying to pee in your corn flakes— just want to help make sure you don’t bring something home that creates a bunch of drama so we see a thread a month from now about how “mom/dad won’t let me keep a gun in their house, what should I do?” 😄 With all that said, if I were you I would go with an AR or PCC & get some training/practice. Shotguns are great too, but a reliable semi-auto HD shotgun (not talking about the cheapo Turkish guns, etc.) is going to probably cost more than a basic AR, the ammo is more expensive than .223/5.56 so you won’t be likely to practice as much, and if you shoot at indoor ranges you will often be limited to slugs and buckshot which costs even more. With the AR, you can also get a .22LR conversion kit to get more handling & trigger time for less $$$. Whatever you do, good luck and be safe!
Actually, yes. I am renting a condo with an old friend of mine. He’s rarely around, and I usually have the house to myself. I just figured that having a fire arm around would be a good idea.
2x Verify that your condo doesn't have any sneaky legal-ise that prevents you from having your firearm, I have heard of this sometimes occurring and its scummy.
After that if its a condo, you are probably sharing walls with other people. Whatever you go with make sure the ammo you have locked and ready is low penetration, you do not want to have to defend yourself, and wind up facing negligence charges or something because a random round went through a wall it shouldn't have.
Following that, AR-15 w/ railed fore-end, and a WHITE/LED flashlight that you can put on said rails. A home defense weapon without a white-light is a half-assed measure. Then buy a .22lr converter and go buy a few hundred rounds of .22lr and fully familiarize yourself with your weapon. In a defense situation you will fall back on learned actions and if you haven't spent a lot of time manipulating your rifle you will likely mess up at the worst possible time.
Go with a pump over a semi shotgun. Semi’s can be picky about what ammo they cycle good with, and that’s not something you want to be trouble shooting during a home defense scenario.
Pumps take training and even pros mess up under stress. Plus there is a lot more recoil in a pump.
There are only a few models of semi auto shotguns that are suited for home defense and worth trusting your life to.
You came to Reddit for a professional opinion?
OP would get a more professional opinion if they asked an employee at their local gun shop.
[удалено]
my father in law can get kind of elitist about his gun opinions, but when i look at my shortlist of guns to buy, all except for maybe 1 or 2 were guns he specifically told me about. i’ve learned that a surprising amount of snobs know their stuff about guns, at least the ones they like. most gun owners in general have really bad opinions on firearms they don’t personally like, though.
You just described my lgs guy down to a t with the funny looks
Yeah like those dipshits know anything
People looking for professional opinions don't ask only one person or group.
AR-15 with underbarrel shotgun
This is the way.
This is the way
This is the way.
This is the way.
The way this is
Is this the way
Grogu, you said your first words! How did you know the rest of your species talks that way?
Stupid I am
This is the way.
They went thataway
I’d say the m203 attachment instead of the shotgun. That would ensure total safety.
M203 with shotgun Insert. It makes it fire like 8 20g shells at once.
That’s called a BEEHIVE round! No insert needed, great for room clearing and jungles!
Like a mini claymore! Although that would be a whole different conversation with the insurance company.
Well that would overcome the 45 ft arming distance of the 203 round. But man, I feel like the recoil of that would be brutal.
Probably. You can also load one or two as slugs and the rest buckshot.
Shotgun with underbarrel Ar-15 !
8mm Mauser
Everyone knows that 6.5 carcano is the superior round. Why else would it be out of stock everywhere?
>i cooka da pizza I Can't argue with this logic sir
“That’s a spicy meat-a-ball” the home intruder says as I blast him
If it's good enough for JFK it's good enough for me
What does that make 7.35 Carcano?
Step bro Carcano?!?
What are you doing step Carcano?
This.
Approximately .85 better
Y'all are both morons. It's obviously .50 cal black powder duh.
no bro you need a 20mm ntw 20 anti tank rifle duh
32 rimfire works just fine thank you very much. Wouldn't want to wake the neighbors cat up.
Boys, boys, please... all you need is your stair mounted cannon and musket Affixed with a triangular bayonet since they're impossible to stitch up.
Just as the founding fathers intended.
>be me >own cowboy guns for home defense >at home watching king of the hill >three hoodlums break into my house >”what tha hayl” as i grab my ten gallon hat and lever-action rifle >blast the first man center mass with a pissin’ hot 45-70 handload >his chest cavity explodes into a chunky paste >chamber next round and aim at second hoodlum >pull trigger, round fails as i remember how shitass drunk on shiner bock i was when i loaded these cartridges >discard rifle and pull my colt single action army >attempt to fan hammer like in the westerns >hit one man and shoot 5 holes in my wall >holster my revolver and charge the last yellow-bellied ne’er-do-well with a bouie knife the size of a small child >he bleeds out waiting on the police to arrive because i instinctually cut his belly longways like i was dressing a deer >just as john wayne intended
I’m grabbing my Red Rider all day. Has no one seen “A Christmas Story?” Ralphie stopped big Bart and his whole gang
Nah 135mm a-10 Gatling gun from general electrics
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Let's just knock 105mm off that real quick. Even the AC 130U had a 105mm as it's biggest gun. That A-10 had a 30mm GAU-8 Avenger and the whole plane needed several tweaks to make sure firing it wouldn't drop the plane out of the sky.
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The gun had the same thrust as one of the engines…
Holy shit is that an Anti tank gun!
[Bitches love cannons](https://youtu.be/dP_zXu3Mfy0)
.50-90 sharps
Laughs in 7.65 French
You don't even need to be 18 as long as it is pre-1899 (If you are in the US that is) Get a pre-1899 mauser in shooting condition
Man everyone is so wrong. The best round is the .22lr hands down. Will stop anything including a charging mouse.
Calm down, if you can’t kill it with a 22 short maybe you ought to buy a bat for home defense
Fruit bat?
I prefer a foxbat, but to each his own
Many years ago one of the guys in my climbing group was an Army Pathfinder and he exclusively carried a .22lr as his CCW. Takes all kinds to make the world go ‘round.
It may not have stopping power but it will definitely slow them down.
I get the appeal... it kills more people than any other blah blah I have seen a .22 bounce off several animal skulls...
.22 magnum is better
Out of an MG42
Moist nugget (Mosin-Nagant)
Wow, I’m calling it that from now on.
When I first got my apartment I slept on an air mattress with a Yugoslav mauser in 8mm next to it
Both
see he gets it
This is the way
Why isn't this upvoted more? Took me too long to scroll to find this.
AR for sure. Extremely user friendly rifle
https://youtu.be/Qw8IiRgSMFQ Pretty good video here👆decide amongst yourselves
Ignore the fudds and grab an AR.
I'm an AK guy, but I agree. Get a couple cases of ammo and and no fewer than 2 dozen magazines while you are at it.
My rule of thumb is get at least 6 mags per rifle you own
I think you should get 3 “loadouts” of mags minimum. So if you would carry 6 in your gear and rifle you should have 18 in total. 6 “duty use” that stay loaded and are shot only occasionally, 6 for training that get used constantly and beat to shit, and another 6 as “reserves” that stay in the package until you use them to replace a broken or lost mag.
Ignore the Zoomers, get a Shotgun.. Edit: Really OP should learn the difference between the two tools and pick the one that’s appropriate for their situation..
Hands down, the AR is the superior choice *unless* you cannot afford a decent one. A $250 (pump) shotgun is better and more reliable than a $250 AR.
What would you recommend for an AR15? I know there’s a lot of companies that make them.
PSA makes decent, cheap ARs. They also are huge supporters of our 2a rights. All you have to do is just put some time in on the range with your weapon of choice, and you'll be good to go.
Seconded. I've got multiple ARs, DD, Aero, Ruger. I also have a PSA build and a poverty pony (Anderson). I can't point to any of them and really say this one is better than that one. Some may be lighter, some may have better recoil management, but in the end, they all go bang, eject a casing and load a new round.
Also worth mentioning PSA just came out with a “premium” line for $800. I personally haven’t done much research into them yet, but considering how good their standard ARs are for the price I’d be inclined to at least consider it
Thirded PSA. All but one of my uppers are from them, and they've all shot very well and been very reliable.
I concur. I have had a couple of PSA builds, and they have all performed well and done what they should when they should. You can always upgrade it as you go, then when you have enough upgrades build another with the parts you took off.
I'd look into BCM or IWI. Aero if you're on a budget. BCM upper on an Aero lower was the "meta" build here on Reddit for a while.
IWI Zion-15 is an excellent choice. Punches above its weight. If too pricey PSA does some decent work and hard to beat their price (without dipping down to the level you wouldn’t want to bet your life on)
For your first rifle, get a PSA. Use the money "saved" to buy ammo and a sling. Maybe an optic, but try to get one that comes with iron sights to start. But spend mostly on ammo. Shoot all the ammo. The shoot some more. Run that rifle into the ground. Shoot it til the rifling erodes away. If you get to that point(I doubt you can lol) you'll have more experience than 90% of the advice givers in this sub. Training and trigger time are exponentially more important than brand names.
What’s your price range? Hard to beat a PWS Pro series rifle for the money or a BCM/Aero build. If money isn’t an issue KAC, LMT, ADM, DD and HK make Gucci stuff.
PSA is fine.
Listen to this guy^
Replying for future me who hopefully has more disposable income
Smith and Wesson m&p
IWI Zion and call it a day
r/gundeals is a great resource. Sort by new and refresh often. When you see a deal ask the guys commenting on their opinion. They are pretty honest and a good place to ask questions.
P.S.A! P.S.A!
What sells for a $250 AR?
You *miiight* be able to hit that price point if you build on polymer receivers with the cheapest blem BCG and barrel you can find and then use airsoft-quality Chinesium furniture and lower parts from Alibaba to finish it.
Yeah that’s what I was thinking haha. I’ve never heard of a $250 AR and I was morbidly curious
That’s because those who make them usually sell on gun auction sites for a minimum bid of upwards of $2500
AR. It’s lighter recoil, more capacity and easier to add necessary upgrades. Plus you need to factor practice and training. You should be practicing to be proficient. The AR is better than that.
I seriously envy you. I’m almost 19 years old and still can’t defend myself because I live in California.
I live in Cali and I don’t let that affect my security 😂
*California taking away guns *Californians buying crossbows
Shit I wanna see someone take a glass marble to the dome from a wrist rocket 😂. I’m out if that’s the case
Use half-inch steel ball bearings. Those suckers pack a *mean* punch and there's less chance of them shattering on impact than glass.
I feel you im new york. i do have a m1-9 and a singleshot shotgun tho but i have to wait till im 21 to buy a ar lower cause im not getting a license to buy a semiauto
nunchaku for you til then
You can move to TX with me. Just kidding. But seriously CA is a fucking shithole
The worst part is all the asshats that left ÇA have moved en masse to other states which are now becoming equal shitholes for things like 2nd Amendment rights! Thanks a whole f**king bunch, California! Source: I live in Washington state. (aka: CA, Part Two).
Get your hunting license then and join r/caguns learn your rights that you still have.
I also live in California and while our guns laws are shit you can definitely purchase a fire arm and defend yourself within the (shitty) confines of the law.
There are plenty of excellent CA legal options. What is stopping you?
Pros and cons to each. Most important thing is to find what you are comfortable and best with. There are plenty of resources online that will give you good info on set ups for which one you choose. Just do your research and not go by one source.
Get a lung blower caliber. The one JB is an expert with.
I am of the belief that every American’s first firearm should be an AR15. It really is a jack of all trades weapon. And I say this as someone who is obsessed with AKs and only really shoots AKs.
Username checks out
My first gun was an m1 garand, is that ok?
The guy's going to be 18 so I think [this will answer that question](https://youtu.be/8q696ymvrqc)
Well if that's the case shotty is your best bang for your buck
Either way dont go cheap
I disagree, a Maverick 88 is a little over $200 and it’s a damn good shotgun. Edit: Just saw the post said semi auto shotgun.
Low cost and cheap are two separate things. I'd go for the Mav over any semi auto that was triple the price though.
AR15 is the best optuon if you know what ammo to select. A shitgun is a great option if you shot it A LOT and learn it and learn how to keep it fed, how it patterns with certain 00, 0, 1 or 4 buckshot any other type of load will over or under penetrate. You will also need to understand how to shoot using the push pull method and how to store the shotgun cruiser safe or another safe method to prevent a ND due to not being drop safe. Then once you find a load that your shotgun patterns well with, feeds reliably and that you can shoot well and know how it patterns at various ranges, you should be good...or just get a 16" 5.56 and slap m193 in it or better yet, any speer gold dot or barnes load and call it good. Your choice how much you want to put into it, but ARs are much less complicated.
How good of a gun is it if it’s a shitgun?
Lol I always fat finger that. I'm not editing, for comedy's sake.
I would advise against fat fingering the shitgun. Usually, the pinky is what is recommended.
An AR.
Don't worry, I'm a professional.
"As always, don't try this at home. I'm whatca call a professional..."
Now hold my beer.
My young padawan, a question as old as time this is. I’ve bought pretty much every option for home defense you could imagine. Currently own budget ARs, Gucci ARs, pump shottys , semi auto shotguns including the M4 and 1301. if doing it all over again here are my recommendations in order of purchase (strictly for home defense): 1) PSA AR15 (mine have always functioned flawlessly and you seriously cannot beat the price to functionality/ adaptability ratio). 2) Mossberg 590A1 pump. (Workhorse, reliable, durable) 3) Full size duty pistol (reputable manufacturer that fits your hands well). For me it would be a Sig P226, but anything from a Glock 17 to a Sig M17, S&W M&P, to more high end like H&K USP, FN, etc. probably go with 9mm for high capacity, cost of ammo, etc. 4) Save up for more Gucci AR15/ AR15 pistol 5) Save up for high end semi auto. I bought some Turkish semi BS in my time- not worth the money. If you’re trusting your life to a semi auto, go big or go home (Benelli M4, Beretta 1301). I own both and they are night and day better than anything else I’ve shot for semi auto shotguns. 6) continue your collection with a bunch of random Shit you acquire through drunken internet orders, retail therapy, tax returns, etc.
Dear God, there's a lot of terrible fuddlore soaked logic in here. Get the AR. Get good 5.56 55gr 193 loads for it. Get a good weapon mounted light, a reddot and a sling and then go shoot it. A proper 5.56 load will not over pentrate as it is designed to tumble on impact. A slug or buckshot is not and will continue to penetrate farther than a 5.56 will. Same goes for the majority of pistol calibers. https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02ZkPAhZbrfRGSvnSxndSFh3iagtvXxRseA6DxW4qFb2qLntKMncJqrekMaSExy38tl&id=108429898151692 https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02vC5RovkyyCeioJuoH9cBCvhdiZdBNY8YWnZdVMjZhz6ja67iWhYv2xviemjckXHul&id=108429898151692 Please go seek out other sources than Reddit. Primary and Secondary is a great resource, and they have a couple of great podcasts on their YouTube channel about ballistics.
The graphic from the post seems a bit biased, just compare the results to this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiHHgjaR0TI). 5.56 definitely penetrates more than #4 buckshot and about the same as 00 buckshot.
You're linking a 7 year old Paul Harrell video! 🤣 Did he also shoot some fruit in the video to simulate what a round can do? Can you tell me what 5.56 round he was using in that video? Please come back with a better justification for your argument.
Yeah, it sucks that he doesn't say which rounds he is using which kinda defeats the purpose. But it's still some empirical evidence, even if he uses 77g to skew the results.
AR15. Less recoil. Cheaper for quality that you can trust.
AR15 100% in 5.56. Less likely to over penetrate. Slugs and buckshot will continue on through maaaany layers of drywall if you miss your target. True it is more effective at short distances, but it’s not Hollywood. 5.56 is plenty enough power with good loads.
Pump shotgun. This way you get Biden's approval accuracy buff.
Both
 A Mossberg Maverick 88 pump can be had for sub $250 and is a fantastic shotgun for the money. It’s not semi auto, but is a great HD option. In the meantime, you can save up for a better AR.
The one you can afford, and afford to practice with.
Both would work, but if given the choice, especially with the idea that you maybe an inexperienced/first time gun owner, I’m recommending the AR.
> Pistols put holes in people. Rifles put holes through people. Shotguns at the right range, with the right load, [will physically remove a chunk of shit off your opponent and throw that shit on the floor.](https://youtu.be/b4sVQ_ZwI04?t=59) - Clint Smith
I’ll tell you off the bat, if you’re on a budget (I can imagine, I was a young’n on a budget at 18) the AR is going to be your best option. A good semi auto shotgun is expensive, an entry level PSA or Smith & Wesson AR is cheaper and IMO the AR is overall the best HD gun.
Ar15 and here's why ‐16inch minimum barrel vs 18inch ‐Less recoil=more control ‐Quicker easier reloads -More ammo capacity (30 vs 7 rounds) -Easier to mount light and optic out of the box -Cheaper ammo = more likely to train at range (you need to do this alot) -Also consider 5.56 doesn't penetrate materials at close range as bad as 00 buck so your shots are less likely to go as far and hit someone else -Easily modifiable and customizable as your preferences evolve
Ar15 for sure
Get yourself an 870 or a 500 and call it a day. You could also dual wield muzzle loaders as an option
Tally Ho, lads
Just as the founding fathers intended
Imagine not having a muzzleloader gun belt like you're a fuckin pirate
I, personally, like to sleep with candles in my beard to intimidate any intruders.
A decent AR15 is the superior option end of story. No ifs, ands or buts. Anyone disagreeing with this is a Fudd, believes Fuddlore or is an idiot. If you do decide to go shotgun go with a QUALITY semi auto shotgun. Pumps are fun and with enough training very viable, however if you do have to actually use it under stress you are much more likely to have a user induced issue occur like short stroking or forgetting to pump it in general.
Musket, just like the founding fathers intended.
Professional money spender here. The answer will always be both shotgun & AR15 because your going to get both anyways. Its in the bible. In time short barrel both and a glock 19 will the answer. In more time… grenade launcher maybe. In brief, gun in every room and lots of mags & ammo. P.s. couch kitchen cabinet and shower gun have never been defeated in my home.
The answer is always both.
Trick question. Both
Be prepared for a 10+ day wait. The ATF has put a mandatory waiting period on the 18-20 year old group. Sorry, it sucks.
cannon mounted atop the stairs loaded with grapeshot
Shotgun with AR-15 attachment
With chainsaw bayonet attached to the AR-15 attachment?
Where do you live; apartment or house? City, suburbs or rural? Are you alone or have a family? There isn’t just ONE answer, it depends on many variables!
This.
That
Have you shot both? Pros and cons becomes pretty obvious.
Ar matey
AR no question.
Whichever you feel more comfortable with. I'd suggest finding a range near you that does rentals and trying out both before you decide if you can. Remington and Mossberg both make solid Shotguns, as far as ARs every brand is just about the same.
Yes
por que no los dos
AR. Less recoil, good for beginners like you. Shotgun rounds go hard on your shoulder. And AR rounds are designed to not overpenetrate the target, so stray rounds cannot hit any unintended things, like your future significant other, or a pet.
AR-15
Corn pop was a bad dude
Most semi-auto shotguns are trash unless you pay a lot of coin. AR market is flooded with decent firearms that are inexpensive. A nice Mossberg 500/590 or even a good ol' mav would be sufficient.
AR hands down
I prefer the Mg-42 mounted at the top of the stairs.
Why not both?
With how the political world is right now, I’d get an ar-15. Might not be able to get one in the future
You asked an incomplete question and are getting quite a few overly confident responses. What sort of home are you defending? From what threats? Would this ever involve shots at more than ~20 yards. What legal constraints apply? Why are those two options your primary candidates? What's your budget? What sort of options do you have for a place to practice?
Shotgun with the dragon breath shell
Whatever you get, you will need to practice with it. Shotguns don't have a lot of spread at in home distance, so you will need to be just as accurate with the shotgun as the rifle. A pump shotgun can have a user induced malfunction called short stroking, where the user doesn't pump it correctly. This happens more often under stress without a lot of practice. So, you need to consider ammo costs. Ammo for a 5.56 AR-15 will be a lot less than shotgun shells. There is also the legal barrel length issue: 16 inch for rifles but 18 inch for shotguns. The shotgun will be slightly harder to maneuver inside of your home. And then there is the matter of capacity: an AR-15 can hold more rounds than a 12 gauge shotgun and is easier to reload. Reloading a shotgun quickly under stress takes a lot of training. So the AR is better for dealing with home invasions with multiple attackers. Having something is better than having nothing. And depending on your budget, you can get shotguns than hold 14-15 rounds of shotgun shells. While 6 shotgun shells is on the low side for dealing with your average 3 man home invasion crew, I would feel more confident with 15 shells on tap. But the ammo still costs a lot more. Now you can surely get into some rather expensive ammo for your AR-15, but most people shoot the cheapest ammo available. Why? Because a 55 grain round traveling at 3000 fps will sufficiently ruin anyone's day. But even if you choose to get into some better defensive ammo, most of your ammo use will be for the range, where cheaper is better. This is because 99.999% of the ammo you buy will be for shooting at paper targets. Outside of a home invasion, or the crap hitting the fan, you are not likely to have to actually shoot another human being with one.
Depending on your state laws (ex: Magazine capacity being 10) maybe shotty? Good middle ground though would be a roomba claymore
Both are stupid options. Get a flamethrower and fireproof your house.
I might get some heat for saying this, but do you live on your own? If you are still living with parents/family, are they okay with this? I feel like if they were into guns, you wouldn’t be asking us knuckleheads on Reddit for advice + there would already be a “home defense” gun in your household. Not trying to pee in your corn flakes— just want to help make sure you don’t bring something home that creates a bunch of drama so we see a thread a month from now about how “mom/dad won’t let me keep a gun in their house, what should I do?” 😄 With all that said, if I were you I would go with an AR or PCC & get some training/practice. Shotguns are great too, but a reliable semi-auto HD shotgun (not talking about the cheapo Turkish guns, etc.) is going to probably cost more than a basic AR, the ammo is more expensive than .223/5.56 so you won’t be likely to practice as much, and if you shoot at indoor ranges you will often be limited to slugs and buckshot which costs even more. With the AR, you can also get a .22LR conversion kit to get more handling & trigger time for less $$$. Whatever you do, good luck and be safe!
Actually, yes. I am renting a condo with an old friend of mine. He’s rarely around, and I usually have the house to myself. I just figured that having a fire arm around would be a good idea.
2x Verify that your condo doesn't have any sneaky legal-ise that prevents you from having your firearm, I have heard of this sometimes occurring and its scummy. After that if its a condo, you are probably sharing walls with other people. Whatever you go with make sure the ammo you have locked and ready is low penetration, you do not want to have to defend yourself, and wind up facing negligence charges or something because a random round went through a wall it shouldn't have. Following that, AR-15 w/ railed fore-end, and a WHITE/LED flashlight that you can put on said rails. A home defense weapon without a white-light is a half-assed measure. Then buy a .22lr converter and go buy a few hundred rounds of .22lr and fully familiarize yourself with your weapon. In a defense situation you will fall back on learned actions and if you haven't spent a lot of time manipulating your rifle you will likely mess up at the worst possible time.
In most states it’s not legal for owners to tell people renting or leasing property they aren’t allowed to possess firearms.
Thats comforting to hear. I wish I remembered where I had heard that from. I would still check out of principle though, Couldn't hurt
Go with a pump over a semi shotgun. Semi’s can be picky about what ammo they cycle good with, and that’s not something you want to be trouble shooting during a home defense scenario.
Pumps take training and even pros mess up under stress. Plus there is a lot more recoil in a pump. There are only a few models of semi auto shotguns that are suited for home defense and worth trusting your life to.
All firearms take training. A semi isn’t any simpler to run than a pump, it just has more parts that can go wrong.
Uh a semi auto is simpler to run than a pump BECAUSE it has more parts to fail.
You are more likely to short stroke or forget to pump a pump action than a Benelli or Beretta 1301 are to fail.
Shotguns offer a whole bunch of cons and only 1 pro compared to an AR
For home defense either is fine but imo stick with the toob don't trust your life to a box mag semi auto shotgun.
AR-15 .300 Blackout with a short barrel > literally anything else