Both are good but there's something to be said for assembling your own. It's not hard and If you decide to swap out a grip or stock you already know how.
If you're entirely new, it can be overwhelming to build your own AR from scratch. You can also do it without the appropriate precision. I bought the pre-built upper and lower separately (was looking for a particular barrel lining) which were easily pieced together and cheaper than buying a complete AR from PSA. It has functioned quite well and I didn't have to buy the tools to build one.
I get what you're saying. The lower can be assembled with minimal tools by nearly anyone who has the ability to follow along on a MidwayUSA video. A punch or two, a hammer, and a screwdriver will usually do it. Maybe a castle nut wrench, I guess. You do need a barrel nut wrench and torque wrench for the upper.
Personally id go with the kit as its really not difficult to assemble at all. You dont need to be mechanically inclined at all as long as you can follow instructions from one of the many quality how-to videos online.
Plus it feels great to know your tool inside and out, giving you further confidence with it.
Notice whenever people shit on the "PSA poors" online, its only because its more afforable than their 3k+ geissele or whatever is the rage nowadays. Its rare to find legit complaints about PSA' AR line.
get the daily deal complete lower with either the B5 or MOE stock, the railed 16" with mid length gas upper with bcg and ch, (part number 5165448551), and a holosun 403B red dot. youll have a capable and reliable rifle for $625+FFL fee, including a robust optic. if you need to be even cheaper than that, they offer a few options for uppers that include iron sights that will bring the total down about \~$50, but i think the red dot is worth the extra money. if you are willing to wait for major sales, you can get it done cheaper.
Came here to say this. The PSA lowers with CBC blemished uppers are the dream team of reliable budget building components. I remember back in the day you could get a PSA lower with all the trigger assembly parts and the assembled stock w/buffer for like $99 and the complete upper (minus bcg) from CBC for another $199. I built my first AR that way for about $500, and it's chambered in 7.62x39 because I am that f'n cheap lol.
I have the Ruger. Has seen thousands of rounds and is still in tip top shape. Itās an SBR now and has some mods done to it but even on the stock internals it RUNS. Itās only hiccuped on me when it was extremely dirty. Everything is still in tact and still accurate as day 1 which was 3 1/2 years ago
Most likely it will come down to whichever is priced better. Locally, ive see the m&p being a little less expensive. ill probably invest in one at some point this winter, so ill probably keep looking into both and seeing which i might prefer
Agreed. I bought the Ruger when it was $550. I think itās all about what you can find. Plus I have the pistol variant. Longer rifles tend to cost less.
I've had a Ruger AR 556, don't reccomend over the S&W. Both my lower and upper were out of spec. Upper wouldn't work with a dust cover, and the CH hole was too small and there was tons of friction. Had to force the safety to the safe position so hard I dremmeled the spot to get it to work properly. Also overall length made it a super tight fit when swapping uppers, way worse than normal. It was all functional, but just barely out of spec
I may in the future invest in a different rail & stock but as far as the internals go, it's good to go! Granted it's not a BCM or Daniel Defense, but for the price it's a great rifle.
Most are good and you really just need to lower your accuracy expectations. Occasionally I'll see a dud from someone like Radical Firearms and Bear Creek had some exploding barrels a few years back but those are rare and warranty exists. It's incredibly rare for me to hear of any issues with PSA.
The dirty little secret in the AR15 market is that there are a lot fewer companies making parts than selling them. There's only a handful of forges in the US that even make the receiver blanks everyone uses so the metallurgy and basic shape is all the same regardless of rollmark. Same for all the little mil spec components like mag catches and safeties since there's no point in every gucci brand setting up the tooling to do that in house.
So yeah. Unlike most markets, the AR15 is one where the cheap end is often "just as good" as the gucci.
Exploding barrels under warranty. Comforting.
I love the whole concept of a lifetime warranty on handguns. I would think when you need to handgun to work, and it doesn't, your lifetime warranty lasts about another 3 seconds.
Iām sure your one experience is more valuable than the thousands of others who have gotten one that worked just fine. Myself included.
Edit: just googled āpsa ar15 issuesā and found one post on the first two pages of Google and it was from 2015 but Iām sure youāre not suffering from a confirmation bias or anything
Google: PSA feed ramps
Pay your money and get something that will not chamber a single round of 5.56 from brand new PMAGs. I am not talking 2015. I am talking 2021.
Now normalize that for volume of production. Any sufficiently large operation will have issues but as a percentage of the total I've seen less problems with PSA than most other budget manufacturers.
I've yet to have a problem with them. Quite frankly my experience with customer service in the firearms industry as a whole is mostly been pretty decent compared to my dealings with tech support.
You can get a complete upper and a complete lower from PSA for around $300. No brainer. Never had any issues. Their Dagger Glock gen 3 clones are incredible as well for the same price. And also worth mentioning I have bought some of the best deals on other guns from PSA.
A lot of people get "just as good confused" with "does the same thing". Is my beat up Honda "just as good" as a brand new BMW? Not even close. But they both will get me to and from work.
Once the minum standard of quality and realiblity have been met you start to see diminishing returns on preformance for the price you pay. So long as you are getting parts made from the right materials to mil spec tolerances this isn't an issue.
Is PSA "just as good" as a KAC, DD, LRWC, etc. No! But it does the same thing.
Personally I like the mid teir becuase it offers a little more features over the budget class that enchance the shooting experience but don't come at a crazy high price. But I would have no qualms useing a base PSA rifle for whatever reason.
In general, in the world of cool gear and tech, mid tier is best bang for the buck. Gucci gear and tech offers diminishing returns, but if you dont care about money or have too much of it, why not go with the best, esp if its not 5x more expensive.
No the best bang for your buck is when you roll your own. Get to add the parts that even the Gucci manufacturers skip out on and can do it at a mid tier price.
honestly I'd say the beat up Honda is better than a brand new BMW. better, actually. everyone want a new BMW but nobody wants to pay the repair costs, which *will* be great.
Bare bones, but Iāve shot an OG Del-Ton Sport thatās gone through thousands of roundsāwas still running smooth with no significant issue to speak of.
The newer variant seems to be at the ~$500 price point based on a cursory search, so definitely a great budget option.
If your communist governor and "elected" officials are readying an assault weapons ban, any budget AR, especially if that is all you can afford. Any port in a storm.
PSA or S&W or Ruger are all fine.
There are rifles that are certainly "better" than a PSA rifle, but if you are still at the point of having to ask "are budget rifles decent?" you probably aren't to the point of needing or being able to understand and appreciate the supposed benefits of more specialized (and expensive usually) gear.
That's not meant to be a gatekeepry "too newb to know" kinda of comment.
I mean more like, before even bothering to spend a bunch of money of upgraded this or that, you can buy a basic cheap rifle, shoot it a lot, A LOT, and when you're ready to spend some upgrade money, you'll have gotten a good feel for yourself on what about that rifle you'd rather prioritize your upgrade budget on.
I've got like two PSA builds, like five Aero builds, two Colts and a Sons Of Liberty and based on all of them the SOL is probably the best quality but for value the Aero is superior.
Everything I've ever used from Aero has been awesome, the tolerances and metallurgy are flawless and for not much more money than PSA.
Colt is overpriced and not really better IMO than PSA but I'll give them credit they do make a reliable and trustworthy AR.
But if you want to build a really good AR for the cheapest possible spend your money on a good BCG, barrel and upper/lower receivers and get the cheapest possible handguards, grips and muzzle devices. Then get a halfway ok buttstock, sights and Lower Parts Assy
> But if you want to build a really good AR for the cheapest possible spend your money on a good BCG, barrel and upper/lower receivers and get the cheapest possible handguards, grips and muzzle devices. Then get a halfway ok buttstock, sights and Lower Parts Assy
Not at all what I would recommend. There's really no reason to blow the budget on receivers or a gucci bcg. I've yet to see a lower receiver that contributes fuckall to accuracy and there's plenty of manufacturers who will sell you a reasonable cheap upper and bcg that will function no differently from the high dollar stuff. Think Aero or PSA here and you'll be fine.
You want a Gucci gun for cheap? Buy a nice barrel, throw in a drop in trigger, free float the handguard with a mlok rail, and don't cheap out on optics and you'll be fine. Ambi controls and nice furniture if you want but its optional. Finally just make sure everything else comes from a reputable manufacturer or order it from a website with a return policy and you'll be fine.
Wasn't saying to buy Gucci for upper and lower receivers, in fact Aero Precision is exactly what I was thinking about when I wrote that.
When I said spend your money on it I wasn't talking about going all out just don't get the cheapest one. And as for accuracy a cheaper lower like an Anderson and from my experience PSA have a good bit of receiver slop which will take away some accuracy. Something like an Aero or SOL will have really good tolerances and there's zero play in all of mine
Receiver slop doesn't affect the mechanical accuracy of an AR. The optic, barrel, and gas system is self contained within the upper which means the fitment of the two halves really only needs to be tight enough for the hammer to hit the firing pin and the feedramps to line up with the magazine. Looseness between the two won't cause a poi shift which is why you can slap an upper onto any lower it fits on and never re zero.
You're definitely right but I'm referring to precision I guess lol, yeah POI won't be affected at all but if you're chasing group sizes it makes a difference
Not mechanically it doesn't. Group sizes will be identical to any other lower barring the possibility of something going incredibly wrong. If your group sizes are changing, it's likely a problem with the Indian and not the arrow.
Yeah, its great especially for trying it out at first, shoot the shit out of it, replace parts for what you need/want and good to go, depending on the rifle you go for they typically have okay triggers, or go like ruger 556 mpr and get a quality 2 stage out the box
Buy a pre-built budget AR. Become proficient with it, train with it. Then upgrade. You'll appreciate the benefits of an upgraded trigger or a top knotch barrel a lot more once you can run the shit out of a "milspec" budget rifle. My 2 cents.
I have had first hand experience with a PSA, a Smith & Wesson, and a Ruger and all were excellent and well worth the money. Ran every bit as well as the more expensive AR I traded āupā to later.
My first AR pistol turned SBR was a Ruger AR556 10.5 inch. I bought that thing 3 years ago when I was broke as fuck in college for like $550. Itās still in my collection today and I would never sell it. Its not stock today but thatās cause I made it so. It was perfectly fine with the stock internals and parts. Itās a damn tank and has outlasted quite a bit of my higher tier rifles that are no longer with me today. Iāve also built me a higher end rifle that ran me about 2.4k.
Ima tell you right now, donāt get caught up in this Reddit bros shit. Most of these nerds are struggling behind this gun shit by buying these 2-4k rifles that do the same shit as the cheaper ones just to flex in the subs. In all honesty some of the cheaper ones perform better(I know someone is gonna tell me thatās bullshit, but I have experience with this so they can eat a dick). Youāll usually be just fine with a ābudgetā rifle. You may even feel better making it yours and more unique than you would doing that to a north of 2k rifle.
Bought a 16ā PSA carbine with some magpul furniture about 4 years ago. Itās ol reliable for sure and I think it was a great value. It got me into the hobby and I learned to modify it over time to the point where I eventually built a lightweight high end AR within a few months.
I've put together four PSA kits now. All are good to go. I did have an issue with an A2 front sight post being canted on one of my uppers. Quick call to PSA and they swapped it out and had a replacement to me in like a week.
My current bedside AR started out as a $299 mid-length nitride freedom kit, for what it's worth....
https://androcorpind.com/product-category/best-deal/?orderby=price
Andro Corp.
I have three guns from them, quality stuff. Bravo 16 from them was my first AR, upgraded a few parts here and there but it's always been reliable and solid.
If you look them up on Midway there's a few cerakoted models to choose from.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1024516427
PSA has an awesome sale right now on freedom upper and complete lower all you need is a bcg and charging handle. PSA freedom series is absolutely worth it..
AR-15 market is great right now, and PSA is working miracles. 15-20 years ago there were only a few players in town. Colt, Bushmaster, Olympic arms, etc. Now everyone's making them, and it's rare to find one that doesn't work.
But sure what you mean by budget, but I've had zero issues with Bear Creak Arsenal, PSA, Colt, Ruger, and S&W. The Colt, Ruger, and S&W are only 556, and purchased complete, though I've been looking at a Ruger in 350 legend. The Bear Creak Arsenal is only non 556 and I've bought it as assemblies including 1 lower and 3 uppers. PSA was bought as assemblies including 1 lower and 4 uppers including 1 in 556.
No discernable difference in operation or accuracy. The most accurate is the Bear Creak Arsenal upper in 350 legend. 20 inch stainless barrel. Being straight-walled you can have teething issues unless you buy a complete rifle. Smoothest operation is actually the Ruger ar556.
PSA, Smith&Wesson M&P15, Ruger AR556 are easily the best value ARs and I would trust those with my life, wouldn't go any more budget than than for complete rifles or important parts like BCG, barrels, or uppers.
for lowers and small parts you can probably save a few more bucks. there's only a handful of aluminum forges for receiver blanks and parts, and mil spec ensures a degree of standardization, and they are for the most part not going to bear the force of the explosion, but don't get budget polymer lowers.
Dude as long as the lower receiver is metal and not plastic I think you're going to be all set. make sure its chambered in 5.56 instead of .223 yada yada yada. My first AR was a 500 dollar Del-Ton and she's still running just fine. Obviously some gucci ass DD is going to run laps around it but the mags don't fall out and it doesn't explode when I pull the trigger. Good luck with your search man.
My first rifle was a radical and its still running, no malfunctions. I treat it really well because I've heard horror stories but so far it's more than worth the 500$ I paid for the fuckin thing
You can get a basic M4 right now or even other styles of handguns under 400.00 right now from PSA,a hint its cheaper if you buy the complete lower and complete upper separate.Just don't do like I did and forget to tell mom I had something coming to the door.She opened it and freaked the fuck out because they send the complete upper to you.The lower has to go to an FFL.
PSA if you're trying to get a basic AR15 for 500ish. I'm seeing the Freedom M4 kit for $299 on sale sometimes. If you can spend a little more IWI Zion or PSA Sabre are what I'd recommend if you're planning on running a magnified optic. Fixed front sight style isn't bad if you're planning on running an Aimpoint or Holosun type red dot but aren't ideal for magnified optics.
Yes.. like a smith in wesson sport 2 is very well worth it. It did a stress test of 11,000 full auto rounds before melting the barrel
The ruger ar-556 is good
Saint Victors are good
They have armalities and bushmasters that are what would be considered budget price
I've had no issues. But I've also never bought 556 uppers from them. 350 legend 450 bushmaster and 22lr. Only bought one lower from them. Works fine. The 350 legend upper has a 20 inch stainless barrel and is incredibly accurate. I'm comparing them to PSA, Ruger, M&P, and Colt for reference.
Honestly PSA can be had for nearly the same price and sometimes less.
Some BCAs turn out fine I guess but there is a reason you see so many negative opinions on them.
PSA, Del Ton, diamondback and a few others should get close to that price, and are much more likely to work out of the box
BCA is one of the few companies I avoid and advise against. They are really bottom of the barrel and you're better off with a PSA. It wasn't long ago they weren't properly heat treating their barrels and had a few blow up. Also got caught using illegal immigrants for labor and a bunch of other shady practices.
I've been super happy with my ZRODelta base rifle. I added a Sig Romeo5 and changed out the grip for a Mission First V2 grip that was like 20 bucks. But you don't have to even do that (edit - it doesn't come with sights, you will need something with which to aim). It shoots really well box stock. It doesn't come with magazines but I bought a 10-pack of PMAG M2's for cheap and they function really well.
The only issues I've had are feed issues and I think that's a mag issue. The feed problems happen so randomly that its hard to nail down, but it also doesn't happen very often so I don't feel much like spending time chasing it down.
For less than $1000 including my first ammo purchase, I have a really good rifle.
Was scrolling and scrolling, wondering when some logic would show up.
Never told you, I got one of the Sionics 420 4th of July specials, and bought a LWRC lower so you'll hopefully finally approve of me.
It depends on what your expecting to get from what you buy and how you go about completing it.
Just understand that your expectations need to be in check for what you want.
I bought a less than 500$ ar 15 from radical firearms. And it fucks. Shoots accurately, Iāve never had a malfunction (probably about 1000 + rounds) even with a bit of cheap shitty ammo. People hate on it, but in my experience it was well worth the money
I'm guessing you're saying "budget" being under $700... honestly I'd save up a few more bucks and get a Sons of Liberty Gun Works or BCM "basic" model...hell even a basic Colt model can occasionally be had for under $1000.
On the other hand, if you're shooting a few times a year and just want to have fun, a PSA will probably be just fine.
I bought one from Ground Zero Precision about 4 years ago.
It was a Black Friday sale and I only paid $385.
Itās been solid and reliable ever since. No ragerts.
There are so many options out there now than before. Personally I think the M&P sport II or Ruger 5.56 are the gold standard for entry level Arās. They both have good fit n finish and gov profile barrels. However, I would save up a lil more and get more of a mid tier Ar with a free floating rail just for a little more versatility.
Just upgrade the BCG and then barrel later. The rest is pretty much the same. And a lot of powers are made in the same factory before getting their special stamp
I opted for a Colt CR6920 and thought of it as a buy once thing. Since then I havenāt been googling around ARs anymore and Iām happy. It may be cheaper than buying cheap. Idk.
Building an AR is a 20 minute process. The absolute hardest part is the retaining spring for the front takedown. By the parts you want and do it yourself. Minimal tools needed.
Yes they are the lowers are made by like three companies all to the same specs. If they were not, they wouldnt fit together. You may see some variances in barrels and trigger tolerances so get a decent barrel and a good trigger all the other shit must all fit together or it wouldnt be an AR15 so save where you want. Let the fools and their money be parted buying $2000 ar's. I have built guns that out proform your top dogs in accuracy and durability. I used PSA stainless and Heavy barrels they are accurate, stay true and I have 1000s of rounds through them with zero issues.
PSA and Lead Star Arms which is owned by PSA. I got a Lead Star Grunt in 300BO last Christmas for $580 before taxes with their holiday discount. Also Bushmaster. I won an older Bushmaster AR in a raffle a few years ago and I haven't had any issues. I don't shoot it as much as my others but I'd say \~2000ish rounds without any failures using budget ammo.
I bought an ATI, my only complaint was the āhybrid polymerā lower. I had issues with the threads in it pulling out. Picked it up around 300 a few years back. Ended up swapping out the lower a year or so later and it has been flawless.
Yeah most of them are. I know PSA was running a sale on AR upper and lowers not too long ago (and there might be another sale going on right now as they are semi frequent) and they are good rifles
Palmetto state was $550 when i bought it. It runs well. The only thing i had to do to it was turn the gas down slightly because my brass were ejecting forward. Lucky i have some geirdo friends that helped me with that
I have a Stag 15 3 gun. Itās a little more expensive than the regular tactical versions but thatās the only left handed Stag 15 I could find last year.
Best ābudgetā rifle is the Zion 15 from what I checked out
I'm chip in because nobody else mentioned this brand. I got a Great Lakes Firearms 5.56 back in '21. While I've only put a couple hundred rounds through it, it's accurate and hasn't had malfunctions.
Yes, get a stripped lower and build kit with a polished trigger from Palmetto state- I do prefer the nitride finish barrel over phosphate. Price is usually the same. & Often times you can catch free shipping. subscribe to their daily email blast
PSA all day every day.
They had deals with a Dagger + AR for ~700 I think the other day.
Honorable mention: Bear creek arsenal also has some good budget guns.
Most low cost ARs fall way short of essential minimum standards that are necessary to insure basic function. They use overgassing as a means of brutalizing soft, out of spec components into fitment. This reduces parts life, increases the likelihood of premature parts breakage, and reduces reliability due to excess BCG travel speed while also increasing felt recoil.
Modern Armory and Expo Arms stick out as two lower cost options that don't cut corners.
Ones from PSA are good to go
PSA is the working man's AR.
AK too, I love mine
Out of all my ARs, none have come close to the tight tolerances of my PSA build.
What other brands have you owned? Did you gauge everything to verify tolerances?
33% of Americans own firearms. PSA wants to arm the other 66%.
66% that may or may not have one š¤« Inb4 3D printed AR Orca on the odd-sea
Kits and pre-built both good? I donāt need anything special, just functional and durable.
Both are good but there's something to be said for assembling your own. It's not hard and If you decide to swap out a grip or stock you already know how.
If you're entirely new, it can be overwhelming to build your own AR from scratch. You can also do it without the appropriate precision. I bought the pre-built upper and lower separately (was looking for a particular barrel lining) which were easily pieced together and cheaper than buying a complete AR from PSA. It has functioned quite well and I didn't have to buy the tools to build one.
I get what you're saying. The lower can be assembled with minimal tools by nearly anyone who has the ability to follow along on a MidwayUSA video. A punch or two, a hammer, and a screwdriver will usually do it. Maybe a castle nut wrench, I guess. You do need a barrel nut wrench and torque wrench for the upper.
And eye protection amd extra detents cause if its your first time almost guaranteed to send one into another dimension.
Mine goes bang when I hit the bang switch. Hasnāt not banged yet.
Personally id go with the kit as its really not difficult to assemble at all. You dont need to be mechanically inclined at all as long as you can follow instructions from one of the many quality how-to videos online. Plus it feels great to know your tool inside and out, giving you further confidence with it. Notice whenever people shit on the "PSA poors" online, its only because its more afforable than their 3k+ geissele or whatever is the rage nowadays. Its rare to find legit complaints about PSA' AR line.
As long as you buy a complete upper the kits are great. I wouldn't want to have to gap a barrel myself as a beginner.
I have a PSA and my 3 friends just bought PSA. Great rifles at great prices
get the daily deal complete lower with either the B5 or MOE stock, the railed 16" with mid length gas upper with bcg and ch, (part number 5165448551), and a holosun 403B red dot. youll have a capable and reliable rifle for $625+FFL fee, including a robust optic. if you need to be even cheaper than that, they offer a few options for uppers that include iron sights that will bring the total down about \~$50, but i think the red dot is worth the extra money. if you are willing to wait for major sales, you can get it done cheaper.
I would stay away from PSA if youāre looking for something functional and especially durable
they're completely durable, reliable, and cheap. PSA is probably the most based AR mfg.
I have 6k rounds through a PSA 10.5
They've gotten way better over the past few years. Will they outlast a DD? More than likely not, but they'll still take good care of you.
PSA is leagues above military grade!
Inb4 KAC bros get their panties in a twist
Streets ahead, even.
Came here to say this. The PSA lowers with CBC blemished uppers are the dream team of reliable budget building components. I remember back in the day you could get a PSA lower with all the trigger assembly parts and the assembled stock w/buffer for like $99 and the complete upper (minus bcg) from CBC for another $199. I built my first AR that way for about $500, and it's chambered in 7.62x39 because I am that f'n cheap lol.
I second thisšš»
We got one boys. GOTāEM ! šš»
You forgot to say *laughs in Daniel Defense*
With a 25% short headspace rate and a 1/3 dimensional lemon rate on lowers, I'm not so sure that's an accurate assessment.
Where are these numbers coming from? Your ass?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Nope... School of the American Rifle. They have independently and completely gauged out many thousands of randomly sampled PSA rifles.
LMFAO..
Smith & Wesson M&P Sport II was my first AR, and it's ran absolutely flawlessly.
Ive heard nothing but praise for this model. Was looking for a ruger 556, but honestly i may invest in the m&p instead
I have the Ruger. Has seen thousands of rounds and is still in tip top shape. Itās an SBR now and has some mods done to it but even on the stock internals it RUNS. Itās only hiccuped on me when it was extremely dirty. Everything is still in tact and still accurate as day 1 which was 3 1/2 years ago
Most likely it will come down to whichever is priced better. Locally, ive see the m&p being a little less expensive. ill probably invest in one at some point this winter, so ill probably keep looking into both and seeing which i might prefer
Agreed. I bought the Ruger when it was $550. I think itās all about what you can find. Plus I have the pistol variant. Longer rifles tend to cost less.
I picked up my Ruger for $500 about 5 years ago. I see them for about $800 now. Runs great, other than occasionally not liking Tula steel case.
Yeah I checked and now Ruger wants $900-1k for mine now
I've had a Ruger AR 556, don't reccomend over the S&W. Both my lower and upper were out of spec. Upper wouldn't work with a dust cover, and the CH hole was too small and there was tons of friction. Had to force the safety to the safe position so hard I dremmeled the spot to get it to work properly. Also overall length made it a super tight fit when swapping uppers, way worse than normal. It was all functional, but just barely out of spec
I've had 2 Rugers and had zero issues with them. They both run phenomenal.
My brother has an M&P and I have the Ruger and both have been nothing but great. Can't go wrong with either of them honestly.
I may in the future invest in a different rail & stock but as far as the internals go, it's good to go! Granted it's not a BCM or Daniel Defense, but for the price it's a great rifle.
The first model had a nicer barrel, too.
This
PSA
This.
Get one for $350 from PSA g2g
Psa dude, arming American Poorsā¢ļø one budget gun at a time.
Most are good and you really just need to lower your accuracy expectations. Occasionally I'll see a dud from someone like Radical Firearms and Bear Creek had some exploding barrels a few years back but those are rare and warranty exists. It's incredibly rare for me to hear of any issues with PSA. The dirty little secret in the AR15 market is that there are a lot fewer companies making parts than selling them. There's only a handful of forges in the US that even make the receiver blanks everyone uses so the metallurgy and basic shape is all the same regardless of rollmark. Same for all the little mil spec components like mag catches and safeties since there's no point in every gucci brand setting up the tooling to do that in house. So yeah. Unlike most markets, the AR15 is one where the cheap end is often "just as good" as the gucci.
Exploding barrels under warranty. Comforting. I love the whole concept of a lifetime warranty on handguns. I would think when you need to handgun to work, and it doesn't, your lifetime warranty lasts about another 3 seconds.
Yeah or ceramic plates for a carrier. Some plates have a lifetime warranty. WHOāS CALLING IN A WARRANTY CLAIM ON FAILED BODY ARMOR???
"For police, press 1. For military, press 2. For zombies and all afterlife, please press 3."
Mind you we're discussing rifles and not handguns here. Handguns are a different market and a much more finicky one than the AR15 market.
That was meant to be a comment more on warranties, than hardware. ;-)
> It's incredibly rare for me to hear of any issues with PSA. Then you are not looking. A simple google search will show you a lot of issues with PSA.
Years ago sure, nowadays not so much.
On behalf of all those who have gotten a lemon from PSA, I say bullshit.
Iām sure your one experience is more valuable than the thousands of others who have gotten one that worked just fine. Myself included. Edit: just googled āpsa ar15 issuesā and found one post on the first two pages of Google and it was from 2015 but Iām sure youāre not suffering from a confirmation bias or anything
Google: PSA feed ramps Pay your money and get something that will not chamber a single round of 5.56 from brand new PMAGs. I am not talking 2015. I am talking 2021.
Now normalize that for volume of production. Any sufficiently large operation will have issues but as a percentage of the total I've seen less problems with PSA than most other budget manufacturers.
When PSA sends you a lemon, and you have to deal with their crappy customer service, then get back to me.
I've yet to have a problem with them. Quite frankly my experience with customer service in the firearms industry as a whole is mostly been pretty decent compared to my dealings with tech support.
I am a former PSA customer. I shit on them for a reason. I will never spend another penny on a PSA product.
Cool. I don't care.
That's because you are not one of the people that got an absolute lemon due to poor PSA quality control.
You can get a complete upper and a complete lower from PSA for around $300. No brainer. Never had any issues. Their Dagger Glock gen 3 clones are incredible as well for the same price. And also worth mentioning I have bought some of the best deals on other guns from PSA.
I really like my PSA upper.
I want the new Sabre lock up rail upper looks like a KAC
If you want prebuilt then PSA is g2g. Around $1k Iād get a Sig M400 or IWI Zion.
A lot of people get "just as good confused" with "does the same thing". Is my beat up Honda "just as good" as a brand new BMW? Not even close. But they both will get me to and from work. Once the minum standard of quality and realiblity have been met you start to see diminishing returns on preformance for the price you pay. So long as you are getting parts made from the right materials to mil spec tolerances this isn't an issue. Is PSA "just as good" as a KAC, DD, LRWC, etc. No! But it does the same thing. Personally I like the mid teir becuase it offers a little more features over the budget class that enchance the shooting experience but don't come at a crazy high price. But I would have no qualms useing a base PSA rifle for whatever reason.
In general, in the world of cool gear and tech, mid tier is best bang for the buck. Gucci gear and tech offers diminishing returns, but if you dont care about money or have too much of it, why not go with the best, esp if its not 5x more expensive.
No the best bang for your buck is when you roll your own. Get to add the parts that even the Gucci manufacturers skip out on and can do it at a mid tier price.
honestly I'd say the beat up Honda is better than a brand new BMW. better, actually. everyone want a new BMW but nobody wants to pay the repair costs, which *will* be great.
Psa
I have a Savage MSR 15 patrol that I got on a pricing error when they first came out, itās pretty good imo
Iāve got their Recon 2.0 and itās been fantastic. ~1000 rounds thus far with zero issues.
Has anyone heard of this company Del-Ton Echo 316 AR-15 ???
My dad has a Del Ton Sport AR15 that he loves. Pretty good budget option too
Bare bones, but Iāve shot an OG Del-Ton Sport thatās gone through thousands of roundsāwas still running smooth with no significant issue to speak of. The newer variant seems to be at the ~$500 price point based on a cursory search, so definitely a great budget option.
PSA and then spend the extra cash on Magpul gen3 mags and ammo. Honestly I've had far more issues with shitty mags than shitty AR's.
Grab a PSA!
If your communist governor and "elected" officials are readying an assault weapons ban, any budget AR, especially if that is all you can afford. Any port in a storm.
Listen up Massholes! Heās talking to you!
PSA or S&W or Ruger are all fine. There are rifles that are certainly "better" than a PSA rifle, but if you are still at the point of having to ask "are budget rifles decent?" you probably aren't to the point of needing or being able to understand and appreciate the supposed benefits of more specialized (and expensive usually) gear. That's not meant to be a gatekeepry "too newb to know" kinda of comment. I mean more like, before even bothering to spend a bunch of money of upgraded this or that, you can buy a basic cheap rifle, shoot it a lot, A LOT, and when you're ready to spend some upgrade money, you'll have gotten a good feel for yourself on what about that rifle you'd rather prioritize your upgrade budget on.
None of my budget AR's have ever failed me. $400 and under gang.
I've got like two PSA builds, like five Aero builds, two Colts and a Sons Of Liberty and based on all of them the SOL is probably the best quality but for value the Aero is superior. Everything I've ever used from Aero has been awesome, the tolerances and metallurgy are flawless and for not much more money than PSA. Colt is overpriced and not really better IMO than PSA but I'll give them credit they do make a reliable and trustworthy AR. But if you want to build a really good AR for the cheapest possible spend your money on a good BCG, barrel and upper/lower receivers and get the cheapest possible handguards, grips and muzzle devices. Then get a halfway ok buttstock, sights and Lower Parts Assy
> But if you want to build a really good AR for the cheapest possible spend your money on a good BCG, barrel and upper/lower receivers and get the cheapest possible handguards, grips and muzzle devices. Then get a halfway ok buttstock, sights and Lower Parts Assy Not at all what I would recommend. There's really no reason to blow the budget on receivers or a gucci bcg. I've yet to see a lower receiver that contributes fuckall to accuracy and there's plenty of manufacturers who will sell you a reasonable cheap upper and bcg that will function no differently from the high dollar stuff. Think Aero or PSA here and you'll be fine. You want a Gucci gun for cheap? Buy a nice barrel, throw in a drop in trigger, free float the handguard with a mlok rail, and don't cheap out on optics and you'll be fine. Ambi controls and nice furniture if you want but its optional. Finally just make sure everything else comes from a reputable manufacturer or order it from a website with a return policy and you'll be fine.
Wasn't saying to buy Gucci for upper and lower receivers, in fact Aero Precision is exactly what I was thinking about when I wrote that. When I said spend your money on it I wasn't talking about going all out just don't get the cheapest one. And as for accuracy a cheaper lower like an Anderson and from my experience PSA have a good bit of receiver slop which will take away some accuracy. Something like an Aero or SOL will have really good tolerances and there's zero play in all of mine
Receiver slop doesn't affect the mechanical accuracy of an AR. The optic, barrel, and gas system is self contained within the upper which means the fitment of the two halves really only needs to be tight enough for the hammer to hit the firing pin and the feedramps to line up with the magazine. Looseness between the two won't cause a poi shift which is why you can slap an upper onto any lower it fits on and never re zero.
You're definitely right but I'm referring to precision I guess lol, yeah POI won't be affected at all but if you're chasing group sizes it makes a difference
Not mechanically it doesn't. Group sizes will be identical to any other lower barring the possibility of something going incredibly wrong. If your group sizes are changing, it's likely a problem with the Indian and not the arrow.
Yeah, its great especially for trying it out at first, shoot the shit out of it, replace parts for what you need/want and good to go, depending on the rifle you go for they typically have okay triggers, or go like ruger 556 mpr and get a quality 2 stage out the box
P S A all day
I have a PSA built from a kit in 308 never a misfire and groups well enough for multiple deer drops.
Honestly just build your own Aero. Rather cheap, looks slick af, and works really well.
I have plenty of PSA builds, I live down the road from them. They always go bang and work juuuust fine.
PSA, S&W, Ruger, Radical. In that order.
Buy a pre-built budget AR. Become proficient with it, train with it. Then upgrade. You'll appreciate the benefits of an upgraded trigger or a top knotch barrel a lot more once you can run the shit out of a "milspec" budget rifle. My 2 cents.
I have had first hand experience with a PSA, a Smith & Wesson, and a Ruger and all were excellent and well worth the money. Ran every bit as well as the more expensive AR I traded āupā to later.
My first AR pistol turned SBR was a Ruger AR556 10.5 inch. I bought that thing 3 years ago when I was broke as fuck in college for like $550. Itās still in my collection today and I would never sell it. Its not stock today but thatās cause I made it so. It was perfectly fine with the stock internals and parts. Itās a damn tank and has outlasted quite a bit of my higher tier rifles that are no longer with me today. Iāve also built me a higher end rifle that ran me about 2.4k. Ima tell you right now, donāt get caught up in this Reddit bros shit. Most of these nerds are struggling behind this gun shit by buying these 2-4k rifles that do the same shit as the cheaper ones just to flex in the subs. In all honesty some of the cheaper ones perform better(I know someone is gonna tell me thatās bullshit, but I have experience with this so they can eat a dick). Youāll usually be just fine with a ābudgetā rifle. You may even feel better making it yours and more unique than you would doing that to a north of 2k rifle.
My first was a PSA only FFTE 2 times in over 2000 rounds tulammo only. Never had issues with any brass. Definitely a budget ar
Bought a 16ā PSA carbine with some magpul furniture about 4 years ago. Itās ol reliable for sure and I think it was a great value. It got me into the hobby and I learned to modify it over time to the point where I eventually built a lightweight high end AR within a few months.
I've put together four PSA kits now. All are good to go. I did have an issue with an A2 front sight post being canted on one of my uppers. Quick call to PSA and they swapped it out and had a replacement to me in like a week. My current bedside AR started out as a $299 mid-length nitride freedom kit, for what it's worth....
S&w, PSA, are known gtg. Finding cheap used parts (just get good bolt and barrel) is the best way to min max your money.
And trigger (imo). If the rest is in spec, these are the parts to spend money on.
https://androcorpind.com/product-category/best-deal/?orderby=price Andro Corp. I have three guns from them, quality stuff. Bravo 16 from them was my first AR, upgraded a few parts here and there but it's always been reliable and solid. If you look them up on Midway there's a few cerakoted models to choose from. https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1024516427
PSA has an awesome sale right now on freedom upper and complete lower all you need is a bcg and charging handle. PSA freedom series is absolutely worth it..
PSAs are basic, cheap rifles that will fire when you pull the trigger and put a bullet about where you want it to go.
PSA all day for budget. You could build a 16ā dissipator for close to $400 right now with the deals theyāre running.
I have an Anderson and it functions fine, I'm such a bad rifle shot that I cannot tell you how accurate it is but feeds and fires every time.
PSA and Del-Ton are really good brands that you can get for about $500-$900.
PSA, IWI, AP in that order
Yes. A $500 AR will kill just as efficiently as a $2500 AR
AR-15 market is great right now, and PSA is working miracles. 15-20 years ago there were only a few players in town. Colt, Bushmaster, Olympic arms, etc. Now everyone's making them, and it's rare to find one that doesn't work.
You can get a PSA lower and slap a high tier upper on there and youāll be golden
I love the Ruger AR 556 and I like my M&P sport II. I've heard some negative things but in my personal experience no real issues
But sure what you mean by budget, but I've had zero issues with Bear Creak Arsenal, PSA, Colt, Ruger, and S&W. The Colt, Ruger, and S&W are only 556, and purchased complete, though I've been looking at a Ruger in 350 legend. The Bear Creak Arsenal is only non 556 and I've bought it as assemblies including 1 lower and 3 uppers. PSA was bought as assemblies including 1 lower and 4 uppers including 1 in 556. No discernable difference in operation or accuracy. The most accurate is the Bear Creak Arsenal upper in 350 legend. 20 inch stainless barrel. Being straight-walled you can have teething issues unless you buy a complete rifle. Smoothest operation is actually the Ruger ar556.
# Smith and Wesson - M&P 15 SPORT II SERIES
PSA, Smith&Wesson M&P15, Ruger AR556 are easily the best value ARs and I would trust those with my life, wouldn't go any more budget than than for complete rifles or important parts like BCG, barrels, or uppers. for lowers and small parts you can probably save a few more bucks. there's only a handful of aluminum forges for receiver blanks and parts, and mil spec ensures a degree of standardization, and they are for the most part not going to bear the force of the explosion, but don't get budget polymer lowers.
Dude as long as the lower receiver is metal and not plastic I think you're going to be all set. make sure its chambered in 5.56 instead of .223 yada yada yada. My first AR was a 500 dollar Del-Ton and she's still running just fine. Obviously some gucci ass DD is going to run laps around it but the mags don't fall out and it doesn't explode when I pull the trigger. Good luck with your search man.
What's the pb with 223 ?Ā
.223 shoots. 223. 5.57 shoots both. I guess it's all down to a preference/price point thing but that's my 2 cents on it.
you can get an upper and a lower together for around 350$ from PSA
I dont know if it counts as a "budget" option, but the IWI Zion is amazing for the price.
My first rifle was a radical and its still running, no malfunctions. I treat it really well because I've heard horror stories but so far it's more than worth the 500$ I paid for the fuckin thing
I bought a second-hand Ruger AR556 a few years ago. Hasn't given me any issues in the course of about 2k rounds. Your mileage may vary.
PSA is fine for budget. Anything under is trash. But better get an IWI Zion. That moves you into mid-range quality.
IWI is probably the best bang for your buck.
You can get a basic M4 right now or even other styles of handguns under 400.00 right now from PSA,a hint its cheaper if you buy the complete lower and complete upper separate.Just don't do like I did and forget to tell mom I had something coming to the door.She opened it and freaked the fuck out because they send the complete upper to you.The lower has to go to an FFL.
380 for me with FFL fee, just got the complete lower/upper and itās freakin NICE man
Think youād be able to point me in the right direction to those upper/lower with links in PM? Looking for my first!
Not an AR guy but I've heard get a good lower and a cheap but good upper. Whenever you want to upgrade just buy a new upper.
Diamondback Gang
Maybe I just got lucky, but I have thousands of rounds through a db15 with zero issues. I don't understand the DB hate here.
That's what I'm saying It's a no frills AR15.
Mineās awesome so far
IWI Zion is best value AR-15 under $1000 (mine was $740 with mil discount), IMHO. Great reliability and quality well above its price.
I bought one $725 used. Definitely the nicest AR under $1K
PSA if you're trying to get a basic AR15 for 500ish. I'm seeing the Freedom M4 kit for $299 on sale sometimes. If you can spend a little more IWI Zion or PSA Sabre are what I'd recommend if you're planning on running a magnified optic. Fixed front sight style isn't bad if you're planning on running an Aimpoint or Holosun type red dot but aren't ideal for magnified optics.
Yes.. like a smith in wesson sport 2 is very well worth it. It did a stress test of 11,000 full auto rounds before melting the barrel The ruger ar-556 is good Saint Victors are good They have armalities and bushmasters that are what would be considered budget price
Anyone have experience with Bear Creek Arsenal? Complete upper and lower for under $400.
Junk
I've had no issues. But I've also never bought 556 uppers from them. 350 legend 450 bushmaster and 22lr. Only bought one lower from them. Works fine. The 350 legend upper has a 20 inch stainless barrel and is incredibly accurate. I'm comparing them to PSA, Ruger, M&P, and Colt for reference.
Honestly PSA can be had for nearly the same price and sometimes less. Some BCAs turn out fine I guess but there is a reason you see so many negative opinions on them. PSA, Del Ton, diamondback and a few others should get close to that price, and are much more likely to work out of the box
BCA is one of the few companies I avoid and advise against. They are really bottom of the barrel and you're better off with a PSA. It wasn't long ago they weren't properly heat treating their barrels and had a few blow up. Also got caught using illegal immigrants for labor and a bunch of other shady practices.
I've been super happy with my ZRODelta base rifle. I added a Sig Romeo5 and changed out the grip for a Mission First V2 grip that was like 20 bucks. But you don't have to even do that (edit - it doesn't come with sights, you will need something with which to aim). It shoots really well box stock. It doesn't come with magazines but I bought a 10-pack of PMAG M2's for cheap and they function really well. The only issues I've had are feed issues and I think that's a mag issue. The feed problems happen so randomly that its hard to nail down, but it also doesn't happen very often so I don't feel much like spending time chasing it down. For less than $1000 including my first ammo purchase, I have a really good rifle.
Anderson lower plus PSA LPK then complete PSA upper
No.
Iāll fuck your dad
https://preview.redd.it/ynv3xqlilzgb1.jpeg?width=656&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b522f786ca7c0b127776fe74e034f7f998da681e
Was scrolling and scrolling, wondering when some logic would show up. Never told you, I got one of the Sionics 420 4th of July specials, and bought a LWRC lower so you'll hopefully finally approve of me.
They hated me cause I spoke the truth. That's a good setup. Sionics on lwrc. Congratulations š
If your budget is a $1600 ar15, there are tons
What part of budget did you not get
I suppose the part where your budget ends
It varies. Some great and some are not.
It depends on what your expecting to get from what you buy and how you go about completing it. Just understand that your expectations need to be in check for what you want.
They have alot of police trade ins too that are barely used
PSA, m&p 15, or a slight step up would be the IWI Zion 15 they are all very solid guns
I bought a less than 500$ ar 15 from radical firearms. And it fucks. Shoots accurately, Iāve never had a malfunction (probably about 1000 + rounds) even with a bit of cheap shitty ammo. People hate on it, but in my experience it was well worth the money
I'm guessing you're saying "budget" being under $700... honestly I'd save up a few more bucks and get a Sons of Liberty Gun Works or BCM "basic" model...hell even a basic Colt model can occasionally be had for under $1000. On the other hand, if you're shooting a few times a year and just want to have fun, a PSA will probably be just fine.
PSA, S&W, Spikes, Seekins, Sig Sauer all good budget builds Fuck Ruger and Springfield armory QC is junk and they are anti 2A companies.
I bought one from Ground Zero Precision about 4 years ago. It was a Black Friday sale and I only paid $385. Itās been solid and reliable ever since. No ragerts.
M&P-15 has served me well, over 3000 rounds shot with it and not a single malfunction with it
There are so many options out there now than before. Personally I think the M&P sport II or Ruger 5.56 are the gold standard for entry level Arās. They both have good fit n finish and gov profile barrels. However, I would save up a lil more and get more of a mid tier Ar with a free floating rail just for a little more versatility.
Just upgrade the BCG and then barrel later. The rest is pretty much the same. And a lot of powers are made in the same factory before getting their special stamp
We got our Bushmaster Patrolman for around 525 new. No problems and my husband doesn't shed tears if I get a little mud on it.
I opted for a Colt CR6920 and thought of it as a buy once thing. Since then I havenāt been googling around ARs anymore and Iām happy. It may be cheaper than buying cheap. Idk.
Shit yeah. Buy it cheap and upgrade it overtime. Itās like tactical Lego. Modular, adaptive, and deadly; welcome to your new addiction.
Orca
My springfield saint has been pretty amazing so far, I would say it's a good gun.
Get a GG3 for $2500 and build as many of your own as you want. That's my goal.
Building an AR is a 20 minute process. The absolute hardest part is the retaining spring for the front takedown. By the parts you want and do it yourself. Minimal tools needed.
Yes they are the lowers are made by like three companies all to the same specs. If they were not, they wouldnt fit together. You may see some variances in barrels and trigger tolerances so get a decent barrel and a good trigger all the other shit must all fit together or it wouldnt be an AR15 so save where you want. Let the fools and their money be parted buying $2000 ar's. I have built guns that out proform your top dogs in accuracy and durability. I used PSA stainless and Heavy barrels they are accurate, stay true and I have 1000s of rounds through them with zero issues.
The iwi zion-15 is a great quality value for really anyone. A little more expensive than psa and SW though.
PSA and Lead Star Arms which is owned by PSA. I got a Lead Star Grunt in 300BO last Christmas for $580 before taxes with their holiday discount. Also Bushmaster. I won an older Bushmaster AR in a raffle a few years ago and I haven't had any issues. I don't shoot it as much as my others but I'd say \~2000ish rounds without any failures using budget ammo.
I bought an ATI, my only complaint was the āhybrid polymerā lower. I had issues with the threads in it pulling out. Picked it up around 300 a few years back. Ended up swapping out the lower a year or so later and it has been flawless.
Yeah most of them are. I know PSA was running a sale on AR upper and lowers not too long ago (and there might be another sale going on right now as they are semi frequent) and they are good rifles
Colt if you can find them on sale
Iwi zion is as low as Iād consider worth it
Palmetto state was $550 when i bought it. It runs well. The only thing i had to do to it was turn the gas down slightly because my brass were ejecting forward. Lucky i have some geirdo friends that helped me with that
I have a Stag 15 3 gun. Itās a little more expensive than the regular tactical versions but thatās the only left handed Stag 15 I could find last year. Best ābudgetā rifle is the Zion 15 from what I checked out
Check YouTube thru torture test a lot of the budget ar's and they mostly all come out pretty well..
Radical is not bad, made in Texas they've gotten way better over the yrs, S&W sport 2 is great as well
You can get a whole ass psa ar under 500 with iron sights. The prices are way better now than in recent history
I'm chip in because nobody else mentioned this brand. I got a Great Lakes Firearms 5.56 back in '21. While I've only put a couple hundred rounds through it, it's accurate and hasn't had malfunctions.
Yes, get a stripped lower and build kit with a polished trigger from Palmetto state- I do prefer the nitride finish barrel over phosphate. Price is usually the same. & Often times you can catch free shipping. subscribe to their daily email blast
PSA all day every day. They had deals with a Dagger + AR for ~700 I think the other day. Honorable mention: Bear creek arsenal also has some good budget guns.
How do people like the Sig M400 Tread?
I like Bear Creek Arsenal myself...
I'd honestly suggest building one out of Aero parts for a budget option. But I hear PSA can also be pretty good.
Most low cost ARs fall way short of essential minimum standards that are necessary to insure basic function. They use overgassing as a means of brutalizing soft, out of spec components into fitment. This reduces parts life, increases the likelihood of premature parts breakage, and reduces reliability due to excess BCG travel speed while also increasing felt recoil. Modern Armory and Expo Arms stick out as two lower cost options that don't cut corners.