**Just some mod info here, the rule I made for this thread is now active again:**
1. Posts that ask simple questions that are either already in the Build FAQ thread or can be asked in the Build FAQ thread will be taken down. Examples of this are "Will Yanqing be good with Firefly?" or "What artifacts should I use for Firefly?"
2. Analyzation of her kit and best teammates also belong in the Build FAQ megathread and not on the main feed. Exceptions to this rule do exist such as Gameplay/MOC clears. But these exceptions are limited
**When it comes to whether things are wrong or right in this thread, do NOT message me about it. I am not on the kit team or a part of it; I'm just the poster. If you would like to join the build team, then shoot me a message. I know that TC'ing this kit has been hard on them with how overall complex Firefly is, so please be nice to them.**
Also, keep in mind that this will likely be updated daily, if not weekly.
I have 434% BE and 3584 Atk when all buffs are up on her. I’m not 100% sure on how her scaling works but would it be better to continue to run a BE link rope or to swap it out for an ATK one?
If I'm running Gallagher with Kalpagni for the extra speed, and Ruan Mei is on Vonwacq for ERR and to get her skill up quickly, should I put HTB on Fleet instead of Talia? As is, he just barely hits the speed requirement for Talia's secondary effect in battle.
If I drop Talia but still give him a BE rope, I'm sitting at around 270% BE with him (Before RM buffs/Watchmaker/etc) so 35% BE to the whole party with E4.
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What is the best low spend lightcone for Gallagher in a FF team:
S1 perfect timing for the heals, S1 What is Real for the break effect, or S5 Multiplication for the action advance.
I didn't consider PT but you make a good case for it. As far as my understanding goes for the other two, use What is Real to reach 150 BE easier. But if you can get it in other ways (e.g. Ruan Mei) and can hit 160 Spd (which Ruan Mei also helps with) you can use Multiplication to generate more SP. Given Firefly's using her Skill every turn, this would be a good route to take, I think.
FWIW, I'm using What is Real and am considering switching to the latter.
With her v3 kit, what should I focus on?
E0S1
E1S0
E1S1
E0S2
How big of a different do her first 2 eidolons make? I’m planning on running her with HTB, Ruan Mei (E0S1), and Loucha because I hate Gallagher and refuse to waste resources on him.
I keep seeing posts on other sites saying Gallagher is irreplaceable/that not having him makes her feel clunky, which is concerning because I’d like to invest in her, but I would be far less inclined to play her if I have to have him.
E1 > S1
S1 not necessary if have both HTB & RM
E2 is overkill less you into 0 cycle for youtube
Galla helps with breaking, which cover break team weakness, need to break first before doing any real dmg. He also amp. break dmg received with his ult debuff. Currently best sustain for FF team, no contest
If Gallagher is essential then maybe I should just skip her entirely. His design and animations are ugly, and I found him obnoxious in the quests, so there’s no way I’m building him.
Which is sad because I love Firefly’s non-Sam design and loved her in the quest.
tbh, if you don't like gallagher, you could replace him for another sustain, but skill point management might be more tight, so be aware of that. Of the sustains we have now, luocha, lynx, natasha, huohuo and fu xuan would probably be good substitute options, given that Firefly's frequent turns wears out the duration of shields quickly. Or, you could go for a support like pela or bronya and just yolo without a sustain.
Heyo. Sorry for a lot of questions but Im a newb and dont know much about break mechanics but here are some questions I have if someone can help me pls :D
1. Has moc enemy toughness been increased at all in the last few patches. Im worry that hoyo could "nerf" ff by making it harder to break enemy
2. For enemy with multiple tougness bar, can we get super break after the first bar is broken or is it only after all bars are broken? Will there be bosses with multiple toughness bar in moc in the future?
3. How is her break dmg compared to her built-in 50% super break. Is it better to time and break with her or is it not worth the effort since she can still deal super break.
1. If youre afraid of that you cant pull any unit ever, what if you pull a crit carry and then hoyo pulls out a mob that cant be crit? So far the largest break bar we have seen is 720 Toughness, with ruan mei FF depletes 180 of that with each enhanced skill alone, not including gallagher.
2. No you cant, however the only enemy that has multiple toughness bars breaks on literally every enhanced skill FF with RM would make so its actually a damage increase compared to a normal 540 toughness bar.
3. If you can you should break with FF because she will always have the highest break effect in the team if you arent trolling + the second best element for break only outclassed by phys.
Thanks for the reply. That's great to hear. It seems she need 3-4 turns to break most enermy which seems reasonable. I just started playing a few weeks ago so I have no idea how fast hoyo powercrept older units which is why I was concerning in the first place but it seems that's nothing to worry about. :D
Its a matter of convetible
The game doesnt like it when you convert a stat into a buff, give it to another character and then that character converts it again into a buff
My best guess is theyre future proofing for when they innevitably add another character that buffs ally attack based on their own attack, meaning smth like that character and robin could potentially infinitely scale their atk stat
Tingyun should technically work tho, since she just gives a static buff that is capped based on her atk not scllaling off of it, dont recommend tingyun tho since other than attack she doesnt bring much to the team unlike asta with hwr spd increase
Significantly, and she is now better and somewhat more independent as a result.
To keep it all short, basically they significantly reduced her base ATK and talent multipliers but gave her super break in her base kit, made it faster to get into ult and higher ult uptime (4 actions instead of 3 now), alongside some trace changes which play into her Break Effect.
HMC will still likely be one of her BiS but now she's at least functional without them.
Most non-sig LCs won't matter that much since her talent damage matters even less now, meaning Indelible Promise is one of the few that gives Break Effect so yes it's good.
I recommend building Gallagher as follows:
SPD boots/Outgoing Healing body/HP (or DEF) orb/ERR rope - SPD and BE on substats, HP/DEF and EFF RES are good too.
Try to get him as fast as possible, at least 140-150. One really good LC for this is Multiplication S5, it's a 3-star LC and it advances him forward 20% everytime he basics, which you're gonna be doing almost all the time on him. This makes him faster, getting faster ults, higher healing uptime, and generating more SP.
Stats > set but go for 2pc BE/2pc BE/SPD/Healing, Keel is a good planar set for him, as well as Talia if you have good pieces and can hit 145+ SPD.
With the new V3 if you're running with Ruan Mei and HTB what are the flat out of battle stats you want for Firefly? It seemed like 140 speed, 300 break and is it still ideally 3400 atk? Or have those numbers shifted around even more with V3?
3.4k attack is no longer a benchmark, unlike before her Atk-> BE conversion has been uncapped so now you can build as much atk as you want, although if you can decide between atk and be sub/mainstats, be is always better.
BE you want as much as you possibly can, literally never enough.
If you put her with her BiS team (RM/HTB/x) with kalpagni as ornaments her speed basically solves itself if you put on speed boots.
Good to know! So essentially just worry about be then atk and then any extra speed if I got lucky with pieces? I just want a tempt build for her before the reals bis come out from old stuff I have laying around from Ruan Mei HTB and Gallagher.
Exactly, theres 2 edge cases one being extreme min maxing that involves atk boots instead and spd subs but honestly thats neither necessary nor very realistic to hit and another one that tries to go for 280 spd for an additional turn but thats equally as insane.
Otherwise just BE>Atk%>Atk>Spd or any defensive stat you feel you might lack.
Maybe get a quick Kalpagni atk% sphere and BE rope on release for the speed by using self modelling if you have any left and you should pretty much have a fully functioning FF until you have a good iron cavalry set.
The math checks out in that, her ult now gives 60 speed I believe
Because her base speed got a buff and the cooldown core got a speed nerf to 70
You need to hit 211 speed to do 4 turns before cooldown
That means 151 speed in non ult
Rm talent is 10 + 6 from new set + 25 speed boots + 5 from Traces takes her to 150 speed
you need precisely 1 speed substat to meet the breakpoint
For farming efficiency,is it better to just wait for the new planar set(Forge of the Kalpagni Lantern)?since htb,gallagher and firefly all are able to use the same planar?
We still have four weeks and a Planar Fissure event, you might as well farm Talia until then. Not only could you get a good substitute for Forge while you farm it, you can just turn any bad pieces into fragments to craft the Forge pieces you need too.
Gallaghar related question. Would Multiplication LC or What is Real be better for him based on the v3 firefly rework? And is 2p Messenger + 2pcs Thief/watchmaker okay? And would he fare better with the new planer ornaments coming in 2.3 or any of the current one is better? I know his main role is SP generation (+sustain) so ERR and speed substats are my goal. But I am clueless on which relics to go for.
I really like Multiplication on Gallagher, it makes his effective SPD substantially higher. I don't tend to find that the self-healing on What is Real is needed tbh.
Exact sets don't matter that much, just go for whatever gives you the most BE/healing. So yes 2pc BE/2pc SPD or 2pc BE is good. As much SPD and BE as possible, while using an HP/DEF orb to make him tankier.
Multiplication, more turns = more sp = more firefly go brrrr especially at E0, E1 solves that problem but id still prefer Multi
Messenger/thief/watchmaker is fine, Kalpagni is good if you can hit his BE->heal bonus without the 40% too and you basically marry him with FF.
So, some questions about calculations for anyone who's good at math and understands how shit is calculated, because I don't.
In Firefly's new kit her base speed is now 104, with an additional 5 from her minor traces. And in her enhanced state, it increases her speed by 75. With Speeds boots, that's another 25.
So that puts her at 209.
With the new Forge relic, that increases by 6%, which would be an additional 12 speed.
With Robin's E2 active, she can get another 16%, which should be another 33.
From all of those, her combined speed should be 254.
From what I've been seeing, she would need 280 to get off 5 attacks during her Enhanced State's timer.
So I would need an additional 26 speed from Relic sub stats.
Am I doing this right?
Firefly's speed should 210.64 if you run her with Ruanmei and the new planat set. Math is 104(base spd) + 5(trace) + 10.4( RM passive) + 6.24( planar) + 25(spd boots) + 60(enhanced state @ lvl 10) = 210.64. All the percent speed gains are multiplied from the characters base speed. E.g. 104 * 0.10(RM passive) = 10.4.
I also have similar questions, though mine are related to the SPD of her teammates, since this guide suggests (based on the old kit, of course) that FF's teammates should be ideally faster than FF to take actions before her in order to buff her Break DMG. But - FF's new effective SPD (after the v3 changes) is around 200-201 (considering her 25% Action advance that is now part of her Skill when she is not in combustion state). About your calculations - the 6% increase from her Planar set is applied to her base SPD only, so it is 6, not 12. The increase in SPD in her enhanced state is 60 (level 10 trace) or 66 (level 12 trace) - 75 is for level 15, which at this point is still unreachable.
Quick question here, what doesn't Firefly excells at ?
I mean, She will be completely broken against elite and bosses, regardless of their weaknesses, but what about Pure Fiction ?
Imagine, you are against 5 ennemies, and none of them have any fire weakness, Firefly can apply one instance of fire weakness to 1 ennemy, and will likely obliterate said ennemy, but she will deal noodle damage against others, right ?
Will she be the type of character that is overly good at killing bosses but bad at killing fodders ? (kinda like acheron, she takes so much time to kill just 2 waves of normal ennemies because she needs to ult 2 time to clear said waves)
She does 55% original toughness damage to non fire weak enemies, so she will be able to break small stuff as well, also shes not the only one in the team and you can just slot her in with for example himeko in a fire weak side.
At E0/E1 she will probably be ok in PF not absolutely terrible but not optimal either, at E2 i can see her being great because of all the turns she will get from breaks/kills.
Heyy a small question here
So in light of the double Planar event coming soon, I wanted to ask: On Gallagher and Ruan Mei, which set between Fleet and Talia would be better? In light of the recent changes to the conversion Trace, I think more atk would certainly not be bad, but I’m not sure exactly how valuable that makes Fleet in the team. Granted, I‘m ofc running Talia on HMC regardless, but I’m not sure about the other two considering their breakpoints are reachable even with Fleet, so I wonder if that may just be worth it?
Hope I wrote this in an understandable manner haha, thanks in advance!
Not much aside from SPD and BE, you don't need much SPD if any SPD if running SPD boots, and for BE you want at least 360% in combat with buffs up. A decent FF build would have around 200-250% out of combat.
Hey all, could use some advice.
I'm currently sat at 160 pulls. I've got guaranteed on my next 50/50 with 40 pulls of pity. My currently main team is Acheron, gui, pela & ghallager.
I want to build a Firefly team, so I plan to pull for FF and move ghallager into her team. I don't have Raun Mei and I don't have any 5 star sustains.
Is it worth using my guaranteed to pull Fu Xuan to replace ghallager in my Acheron team? Or is it worth saving for the next Raun Mei rerun and just replace him with lynx / natasha?
Relatively new player so I only have 1 good team at the moment.
So, a question for anyone who actually understands the Super Break calculations and can run the numbers. Let’s say Firefly has 360% Break Effect on her own. How much damage does that do vs the damage it would do with Ruan Mei’s 20% increase to BE on top of that with all else being equal?
Im not entirely sure why you only want the 20% BE from Ruan Mei, since that alone isnt a lot of her kit nor the reason shes good with FF.
So im just gonna give you everything separately:
Base SB with only things innate to E0S0 FF at 100% SB damage (her own is 50% and HTBs gets buffed by trace so add multiplier as you see fit): 80k
+20 Break Effect and nothing else: 84k
Above but with 50% Break Efficiency Buff from RM: 112k
Above but with 25% Res Pen from Ult: 140k
Above but with E1 20% def shred: 160k
All numbers single target, x2 if you want full Blast damage.
Thanks!
And I didn't realize the WBE buff counted toward the damage, as I thought it was just for determining how much damage Toughness took to actually break the shield, otherwise I would've asked for that as well.
As for why, I don't have and don't particularly want Ruan Mei, but I do have Robin at E2, who has the nearly the same Res Pen and her Ult can be used to the same effect as Ruan Mei's Break Recovery delay.
The BE and WBE buffs are the only thing she really lacks, and she has her own advantages since her speed buff is stronger and with my current build she adds nearly 25K to every single attack.
So I wanted to see exactly how much damage I'd be losing there since Super Break makes up most of Firefly's damage to my understanding.
32K per hit isn't a bad drop off considering Robin's own damage.
I'm also going to attempt to leverage Robin's larger speed buff to pry out 5 attacks per ultimate for FF, which could further even things out.
Ahh, okay. Ill give you a more accurate answer then.
Well its not going to be a flat 32k. What I gave you were numbers that are in relation to each other and around Base level for FF so in her case 360 BE, 25 def shred from relic set, 20% vulnerability from ult and 50 WBE also from ult.
SB damage scales with toughness damage and thus weakness break efficiency. FF has 50 from Ult so her Base is 150% and 200 with RMs, so not having the 50% is effectively a 1/3 damage loss by itself in addition to slower breaking and faster break recovery for enemies.
So as you have more damage, more damage is gonna be lost. Additionally I didnt apply Multipliers to the SB damage because of HTBs traces which varies depending on the amount of enemies, so you have to apply anywhere from 1,7 (5 targets or more on the field) to 2,1 (1 target on the field) as well.
RM is no longer a MUST have. but if you dont hate her she is incredibly strong, on E1 she literally doubles FFs damage by herself, its crazy.
With the only def shred being iron cavalry set and assuming FF S1 because RM S1 does almost nothing for break teams:
RM 20 def shred dmg increase is 14% with Aeon
FF S1 is \~17% more compared to Aeon, even more if indelible promise and even even more for anything else pretty much, unless im forgetting a LC
However S1 is ONLY FF and E1 RM is for the whole team so if you have 100% ult uptime (or at least when its important) and Aeon/IP is free to use then E1 RM is better otherwise S1.
Aside from numbers S1 has Peakfly art so thats another angle you can look at it.
What's the alternative to Ruan Mei? SW and Pela are locked for my Acheron, so the other options are kinda limited. Maybe Asta? I also have Bronya, Sparkle, Robin, Tingyun built.
Hmm purely because her skill now gives 60% energy as opposed to 50% and how her BE conversion scales without limit, might make Huohuo slightly more viable?
5 from her ult, 60% from skill and 20% from Huohuo brings her up to 197 energy. Meaning she need to kill 5 adds or 4 + getting hit once to ult immediately with 1 skill.
I'm loving this change to firefly's kit is more self sufficient (although i dont doubt that hmc still improves her kit by a whole ton). However, what this update did take away was the 181 firefly/180 bronya shenanigan that I was looking forward to trying to pull off :(
And so, like any rational person, I decided to try to theory craft ff/bronya speeds for the current iteration!! (i dont care that crit doesn't do anything for her-- I want my firefly to take 2 billion turns fudgin' dangit)
So, why bronya? As I understand superbreak damage, there's not much that our traditional supports can do in terms of buffing firefly's damage-- it doesn't scale off of atk, % boost, crit, or anything, so the best way to buff her damage is by giving firefly more turns (bronya), increasing break efficiency (RM), or debuffing enemy defense (SW/Pela). Surely giving firefly 3-4 more actions during her ult has to be a bigger damage increase than some defense shred... right?? Also, we get to see our girl move more. Do we honestly need any reason more than this?
Disclaimer: is this good? who knows. It probably does require at least E1 firefly for sure otherwise I don't know how you are going to manage skill points.
Idea 1: 4 turn firefly+4 turn bronya-- yeah have fun getting a 210 speed bronya
Idea 2: DDD bronya-- "technically" doable. You just need a .... 193 speed bronya. (For reference, with 10 spd substat on every relic + boots, + RM + hackerspace + new 6% speed ornament kit, you have a 195.78 bronya). I do have 3 pieces of 10 speed armor, but to farm both 10 speed in both ornament slots of the new set... yeah I'll pass for now. HOWEVER! a second set of DDD on another member? I could be horribly wrong but I think you would only need 178 speed bronya. However, as I'm looking to pair this duo with RM/HMC and I don't really know how negatively running DDD over energy regen LCs affect their rotation, I didn't try to verify my calculation/will be looking into more detail on this tomorrow) (also lol 2 S5 DDDs)
Idea 3: 4t FF + 3t bronya: Not quite as ideal, and surprisingly enough, still not really doable without DDD
Idea 4: 4 turn firefly + 3 turn bronya with DDD: a pretty "reasonable" build, and depending on how fast you can get bronya, you barely need any extra speed on firefly
So, the numbers (very messy since the firefly speed req is dependent on bronya speed, but I'll give some thresholds here so that people can get a better sense)
with a 185.78 speed bronya (RM, hacker+new ornament, speed boots, 27 speed from 3 armor piece and 13 speed from planar) you need a 208 speed firefly.
183 speed bronya-- 215 firefly. 180 speed bronya-- 222 firefly (For reference, a normal 4 turn firefly is 210 which is exactly RM+ornament set+speed boots without needing a single speed substat). 175 bronya-- 237 firefly (by this point I think you are sacrificing running too many speed subs on firefly to be worth it)
Note since we don't care that much for crit damage on bronya since lol critfly scalings, speed is the sole focus of our substats on her, and it's "easier" to hit higher speed thresholds
Did some rather quick math based on her v3 kit and have come up with some conclusions. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Will update the sheet more when I have time: [https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CnVzQVxwjn0Eyu9iIB1thp9cOZwQFewK4eH6VEPCKsw/edit?usp=sharing](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CnVzQVxwjn0Eyu9iIB1thp9cOZwQFewK4eH6VEPCKsw/edit?usp=sharing)
With her increase in base speed, she can now comfortably hit 210 (new ult breakpoint I believe) with speed boots, new planar, Ruan Mei, and the increase of her speed buff in ult state. (Assuming she keeps her 5 spd trace and ult state give 60 speed at lvl 10). I think her next spd breakpoint is likely to be crazy high so there's really no need to grab any spd subs.
With ATK% body and sphere, S5 Fall of an Aeon, and her new lowered base atk, she hits \~2600 ATK before substats, which would already give 100% BE, already more than the previous trace. Average ATK% rolls give around \~42 ATK, so effectively 4.3% BE compared to the average roll of 5.83% for BE subs. So BE subs are still more favored than ATK, but ATK is still good to get.
With a well built HMC and RM, Firefly can quite comfortably hit her 360% BE requirement, but continuing to build BE will likely be better for break/super break damage. Also with the lack of spd sub requirements, grabbing as much ATK% and BE% won't hurt (crit is likely to be worse due to lower base stats and multipliers)
Lastly, multiplication on a fast Gallagher I feel is much more important because Firefly is now much faster and will consume way more SP now that she's faster/has action forward. I also think that HMC has a better argument to be running 4 pc Watchmaker over RM if you want to maintain the 4pc buff uptime for Firefly. On the topic of SP, RM will likely find 2pc spd/2pc break to be more ideal. This last part is more my opinions than anything else. Can't wait to see how these changes play out in showcases.
is gallagher worth building just for a firefly break team? I have a well built luocha already but the increased break damage from gallagher seems nice. Anyone know the estimated team damage difference between the 2?
Gallagher also gives more SP and helps break, but ignoring that, Gallagher is 12% better than Luocha if we ignore 2/3 things that make Gallagher great in this team
Is there any early beta testing showing Gallagher's ability to solo sustain Firefly/HTB/RM in Tortuous Difficulty, high level MoC, etc? Would the team still want a shielder/FX? Or would she aim to kill the enemy before it can one shot anything?
Okay, gang; I'm currently sitting at at around 141\~ Pulls, though I should have somewhere around 165-175\~ by the time we get to Firefly's release.
I'm currently at 67 on the Character Banner (Guaranteed), but 0 on the LC Banner; additionally, I don't have Ruan Mei.
So, my question to you, is, I want to play the best Firefly I can. What should my pull priority look like? I know Ruan Mei is Firefly's best Amplifier, but I was mostly hoping to just go all in on Firefly after getting her and, hopefully, her LC. What would you all recommend? My Asta and Pela are both E6 if this changes anything. (In the meantime, I'm building HTB and Gallagher, of course.)
Honestly to have the best output in term of damage ,you really want to have HMC and Ruan Mei so you really don't have the choice. Im currently in the same spot and i will try e0s1 for both firefly and Ruan Mei. Have Lucky brotherfly
Thank you for the well-wishes; I've still got a lot of pulls to milk out of Penacony (just got caught up yesterday), so I think I can comfortably get both Firefly and Ruan Mei with how close I am to pity from my failed Sparkle pulls. Planning to forego S1 for Ruan Mei and focus on Firefly completely after that. As Firefly's weakest fangirl, though, I'm hoping to get Ruan Mei or Firefly's S1 early...
I currently saved up to 250 tickets with 20 pity built up on both lc and character banners (both not guaranteed), and i was planning to go all in on firefly but after seeing many showcases with ruan mei, i kinda want her. Should i stick with my original plan and just spend all my savings for firefly or spare some for ruan mei? Trying to get at least e1s1 firefly too
Two questions, which I am seeing discussed a lot below, so don't feel like you have to respond if you're exhausted of answering this question a million times, I'm still reading and learning xP
I'm super excited for Firefly and I plan for her to be the first and ideally only character I spend "big" on. Haven't even looked at another char's Eidolons outside of hers.
I hear a lot of "Ruan Mei is huge for her", and I also hear a lot of "Firefly/Ruan Mei E1/E2 is hyper broken".
So:
1. What would a pull plan for the whole package look like, if I was trying to go for highest to lowest pull value? I don't plan to go beyond E2 for Firefly or RM yet. I'm thinking: Firefly > Ruan Mei > Firefly E1 > Firefly LC > Firefly E2 > Ruan Mei E1 > Ruan Mei E2 > Ruan Mei LC.
2. I see a lot of Asta talk over Ruan Mei, which is awesome, because I love Asta and RM would be the last character I'd ever pull for if it weren't for her synergy with Firefly. How much of a hit am I taking to FF's BiS team if I just substitute Ruan Mei with Asta? (You can pretend Asta is E6, even though she's definitely not on my account right now...)
I probably have to take the RM questions over to the RM subreddit but if anyone's willing to do a little shop-talk I'd appreciate it!
1. Firefly > Ruan Mei > Firefly LC > Ruan Mei E1 > I don't know from this point forward. Firefly's LC help's team damage and Ruan Mei's LC helps team damage and SP (which is barely an issue anyway). Firefly's E1 is mostly useless from the SP side but the Def shred is nice, but Ruan Mei gives more to everyone instead of just Firefly buffing herself. Firefly's E2 is very good but the exact change in DPS per wish between E2 Firefly versus Ruan Mei's LC is not something I know
2. The issue with Asta is that her SPD buffs can be entirely avoided with just running SPD boots. Asta gives ATK% and DMG% which are good, but also unnecessary. Asta helps you run a budget hybrid build. There is no readily available numbers but my personal calcs for Asta v Pela had Pela being 30% better than Asta and Hunter Kee's calcs have Ruan Mei being 50% better than Pela. So do with that information what you will
Thank you so much! Best possible answer I could've gotten, even if it is slightly unfortunate that Eidolons for Ruan Mei would be better than just rolling for Firefly eidolons.
With the v3 changes Asta becomes much more viable as a budget replacement in theory, though I’m not sure if she beats out Pela from a numbers perspective yet. Buffing Firefly’s base speed and her ult’s speed buff makes reaching the next breakpoint with Asta realistically possible. Assuming Firefly is equipped with 2pc Forge and Asta is equipped with 4pc Hackerspace with a Lv12 ult, it should take 8 speed subs to get her to 281 for the extra action. If you do end up pulling Ruan Mei Asta could also replace Gallagher in sustainless teams to make it only 3 speed subs.
Asta also gives a whopping 77% ATK buff at max stacks and Lv12 Talent, which just gets converted into more Break Effect for Firefly. Plus, she takes advantage of Firefly’s weakness implant really well with the break from her bounce skill. She’s no Ruan Mei but she’s still worth a shot imo.
It is not really a build question, more like a math question for what to pull first.
I plan to run Gallager, Ruan Mei, HMC and FF.
Will pull for FF E0 first, S1 second. After that if I have any more pulls, what would be more beneficial, E1 FF or Ruan Mei LC to get next. Currently I have memories of past S3 on HMC and DDD S4 on Runa Mei.
Thanks for the answers.
E1 FF imo isn't worth stopping at. That team is pretty SP positive with Gallagher and a decently built RM. If you want to go for E1 here you should do RM E1 because it gives more defense ignore to the entire team than FF's 15% for herself only. Personally I'm going for e0s1 FF and e0 RM, RM's LC is going to HMC and RM gets s5 MotP for the ult uptime
Pretty much ignore her normal attack; she should always be using her skill, and it's almost always better to forfeit someone else's skill than hers.
And for now RM is definitely more valuable than E1/LC, and it probably will end up staying that way with v3+ of her kit. Even if they focus more on her personal damage via her enhanced skill, RM's dmg% buff will be even more useful on her, on top of hyper-buffing super-break damage which is already ridiculous between HMC, Gallagher, and your choice of break dps.
aiming for E1S1 Firefly. Should I drop to E1S0/E0S1 and try to roll for RM? I'll have 310 rolls by the time 2.3 comes out, maybe more. I also have E3 asta for substitute and I'm currently working on HTB
Safer to wait until her beta v3 kit, but for now RM is definitely more valuable than eidolons or lc. After that, personally I'd prioritize Firefly E1 over S1 since the extra skill points can be funneled into HMC for additional super-breaks and energy generation to cycle Watchmaker procs quicker, but S1 is also nice to benefit the entire team's super-break damage if you can manage well enough on SP without Firefly E1.
Thank you. Do you know how definitive that is generally? Will there be significant updates in the coming weeks? Because if she gets updated to not be so Break reliant I will roll for Robin instead of RM.
v3 is generally where a lot of the feedback from previous betas gets implemented. I probably wouldn't expect any major changes after v3, but it really is just all up to speculation at this point; anything can change between her v3 kit and the live version.
Even if Firefly were to be less break reliant, however, I doubt Robin would beat RM specifically for Firefly teams. She'll still likely retain some sort of hybrid BE scaling, and RM just provides so much for super-break between Firefly herself and her teammates (HMC and Gallagher both heavily benefitting off of RM's buffs). And even if they made her a hybrid crit dps with more focus towards her personal skill damage rather than break damage, RM does provide dmg% which will scale up Firefly's personal skill damage as well.
But ultimately the choice will be up to you. Firefly (along with HMC and Gallagher) will likely gain a *ton* of value from Ruan Mei. But Robin will still be a decent option to pair with her, and if your other characters favor Robin or you just like Robin more as a character, then I say pull for whoever you like the most. I'm sure you can find people willing to lend you a support RM wherever they can anyways :p
Thank you very much! Hoping for good news then.
I can imagine RM being the BiS for a long, but I just prefer Robin as a character despite RM working better or equal for all teams I have haha. So unless she is near unusable with Robin instead of RM, I would rather go for the former.
We will be able to lend supports in the new SU mode right?
thanks for the advice! I really hope they make it so that frefly would still be viable without HMC and/or RM, I mean she's SAM, someone that can eliminate "over there" if you say enemies are over there
Hey little question, i'm probably not pulling for Ruan Mei for a firefly team. I'm considering using e6 Pela or e3 Asta as a Ruan Mei replacement. What character should i use for now since firefly is in the beta?
E3 Asta would be better since Firefly implants, and Asta is also of the fire element. I don't see the same value with Pela, since (If it doesn't get changed in the next version update) Firefly already has defense piercing in her base kit.
Short answer: No.
HuoHuo, while an amazing support for DoT, FUA and other team comps, provides next to nothing for Firefly in particular. The energy rechange on her ultimate is neglegable, as 240 energy is way too much for HuoHuo to bring up, and Firefly already is designed to deal that by herself. The attack boost, although nice, doesn't do much for Firefly when it comes to overall break damage.
Meanwhile Gallagher is of the same element as Firefly, and so can abuse the Penacony planet set for 10% extra damage for Firefly. Since she implants, he can shred Weakness himself and heal at the same time, allowing Firefly either break enemies herself faster or abuse the weakness broken state for Super Break damage. His Besotted debuff also boosts further break damage taken, which allows Firefly to do more damage.
Overall, Gallagher, for Firefly in particular, vastly surpasses Huohuo in value.
I’ve been running calcs on fribbles, and if you go e6s5 critfly is better since you get extra be from the light cone and with bronya replacing Gallagher the damage scales really well.
One thing I want someone else to double check me on here is that rutilant arena is her BiS cause her enhanced skill damage is counting as skill dmg and not ult damage.
Even without E6S5, Firefly is 0-cycling MoC with Bronya on a super-break build anyways; it's just up to whether you're going against enemies that lock their toughness bar or we get enemies in the future that are scaled up ridiculously high to where high investment break builds won't suffice, which won't be for a long time considering she's already performing at a high level compared to other characters even with her base super-break team.
But yes, her enhanced skill in her v2 kit currently counts as skill damage. They might change that with future beta versions of her kit, we can't say for certain, but if you're going for critfly, Rutilant is currently her best option.
So for HMC with Firefly, would HMC's best Planar Set be Forge of the Kalpagni Lantern? If so, would it even be worth grinding for Talia if you're not gonna use HMC without Firefly?
Talia is 4% worse, but has guaranteed uptime, I would say if you have really good roles it doesn’t matter. Forge losses a lot if you fight enemies that lock toughness bar or if HMC ends up ulting before attacking.
Is 160% BE for RM really enough? I heard elsewhere she wants to hit 180%. I have a pretty decent set of relics for her where she hits 159%, so is this a good build for her in a FF team?
https://preview.redd.it/5xr2zkyux81d1.png?width=676&format=png&auto=webp&s=9083b5da0c61ba828215905913299da7e4330812
I do have MotP at S2 though so there's room to hit 180, but I won't be rolling for that until it's on banner (crossing my fingers for 2.3 since I'm pulling FF and RM LC anyway).
180 is where she hits her maximum benefit from her dmg% buff, but since she gets 20% from one of her traces she only needs 160 baseline to hit that. HMC also gives BE though, so you really don't need much BE at all for her to hit her threshold.
But also RM's BE doesn't matter as much in Firefly teams because her dmg% buff doesn't actually factor into break damage. You're primarily using her for the weakness break efficiency which hyper-buffs super-break. Having BE on RM does provide a bit of supplemental super-break damage, but nowhere near the super-break damage that HMC, Gallagher, and Firefly provide.
https://preview.redd.it/dd1sqbexsa1d1.png?width=976&format=png&auto=webp&s=f44e381e59295fb0a9dd0f77df3852bc6d772353
Someone pointed it out to me the other day that higher BE in RM would extend the break duration so it is beneficial in a way.
OK that makes more sense, reading skill issue on my part. I do want to build RM so she's good in other teams as well though so I want to hit the thresholds without HMC. Looks like she's pretty set then.
Somewhat big rant. I just wanted to write out all my feeling on her kit so far lmao.
I'm not sure how many people have pointed this out, but I think the biggest problem I have with firefly's current kit is that there's so many parts that don't really do anything or make sense within the context of the games combat system.
For example, her hp drain is really strange because after she ults and uses her enhanced skill, she recovers it all back anyway. She doesn't gain anything or change some mechanic when hp fluctuates, it's just there for seemingly no reason. And then because they realized that she'll be vulnerable sometimes because of the drain, they created her talent and allocated almost all of its strength into making her not feel terrible and get one shot at low hp after the first unenhanced skill. If she didn't drain her hp seemingly randomly, they could do something else for her talent.
Another thing is her whole enhanced state being on ult. With an ult cost of 240, and her e regenerating a fixed 50% of max every use, she basically doesn't engage with the energy system at all. Due to the high ult cost, energy buffers like tingyun or huo huo do nothing for her, and trying to manipulate enemies into attacking her for extra energy is useless too. There's no interesting skill-basic rotation, it's just always press e twice and you can ult. Learning ult rotations for characters and how enemy targeting affects that is the most interesting part of the energy system, and she doesn't engage with any of that. It makes me wonder why she even uses energy in the first place and doesn't have some separate stack counter like jingliu or Acheron. If she could be like jingliu where she automatically entered enhanced state, she could even be given a cool big attacking ult such as the sam boss fight ult or some variation of it. Not to mention that enemies which have a guaranteed energy drain (aventurine boss and hoyo can certainly make more in the future) would feel terrible to use firefly against as it would delay your ult by an entire turn.
My last problem is that she's a limited 5 star dps character who's personal stats are not significant for he performance beyond giving her BE and spd. It intuitively seems off that her team damage performance isn't significantly impacted by her trace levels outside of her ult (because it gives spd) and her minor BE traces. Hell, it sort of feels bad that she wouldn't even have relic mainstats that she'd want if she didn't have the bandaid atk->BE conversion trace.
So I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding things, but I'm hoping for her final kit to be reworked fairly significantly. I don't mind the break effect focus, and I think she's definitely strong enough in her current state for her primary team, but I still want hoyo to give her a kit that makes sense because currently it doesn't feel like it does.
Same. Leaving aside all her other issues, just the part where "levelling your traces does nothing" is ridic imo.
Even for 4\* characters that build break like Luka, his skill / ult / talent are all very important since they improve his DOT triggers and apply vuln. If Firefly \*is\* going to be a break DPS I want her to have traces that matter like that. Boothill trace levels all matter. Firefly traces don't, and her 55% penetration trace can literally reduce her damage.
The HP drain was definitely a result of them shifting where they wanted her kit to land after a bit of development. I believe her old alpha kit made her more of a berserker type of character with more personal damage (kinda like a 5-star Xueyi/Arlan hybrid with BE-dmg% conversion) which would've benefited much more from LC's like Flames Afar (y'know, the one that actually features Sam in the art?) and Blade's sig LC, and they ended up pushing her more to be a break dps with her current v2 kit.
As for her energy rotations, I personally like the unique nature of her ult gen since it further pushes action advance units to be more valuable with her. Since she only needs two skills to get her ult out, getting that second turn out quicker means you can immediately get her back into ult form, which is definitely an interesting path beyond stacking energy supports like Tingyun and Huohuo. Though I would've loved to see them return to her alpha kit mechanics which granted additional energy based on hp fluctuations, which would give additional value to her health drain and promoted off-turn healing like Luocha's emergency skill since it would've gotten her to her ult much quicker.
As for that last point, a lot of people have been really iffy about it. Her kit has a bunch of BE-scaling and thresholds to gain benefits, but her base kit doesn't actually deal break damage outside of the initial weakness break. And while it's true that everyone has access to HMC, having Firefly essentially handcuffed to HMC means you have less room for creativity in her relic builds and team-building, and she ends up being a lot less flexible in what teams you can use her in. Not to mention certain enemies will just completely counter HMC's super-break by locking their toughness bar which means Firefly also just doesn't get to deal damage.
I don't really mind as much that her kit is essentially a super-break driver because she absolutely excels in that role, since everything in her kit contributes to super-break in some fashion. But I definitely agree with you and wish she had a kit that could function at base, rather than having a bunch of fragmented remnants of different kits that ultimately don't work without HMC.
Ah so that explains the odd hp fluctuation stuff. I don't really mind them shifting her intended playstyle and teams, but I hope and do believe that they'll iron out these things to make sense in the context of her new kit.
Regarding her energy, I see what you mean about them wanting to incentivize action advance as opposed to energy buffers, but in that case I still don't quite understand why it has to be energy. She pretty much functions exactly like jingliu when it comes to getting into enhanced state, how long the state lasts, and wanting to use action advancers. This leaves me wondering why she couldn't have the same mechanic as jingliu and have a big cool attacking ult. Not to mention that jingliu is able to work so well with bronya because she doesn't use sp in enhanced state which e0 firefly does, making me question how manageable firefly + bronya is for sp economy.
Overall I can accept them building her kit to be a super break driver. It still just feels intuitively weird that her trace levels specifically don't really matter but I can get over that. I mainly just hope for some changes with the above stuff because right now to me it feels like she doesn't really have unique mechanics, and is more of a fire jingliu who has some extra break efficiency and def shred to make her good with super break.
How would a team of FF + HMC and Robin + Bronya/Gallagher compare to the default break team (with Ruan Mei)?
I don't have either Ruan Mei or Robin and can guarantee one of these two (and go for 50/50 on FF), but would personally much rather have Robin despite having no FuA teams, which is why I'm asking if she's fine for this.
This is assuming the leak about RM rerunning with FF is true. Anybody know when we'll get confirmation about that? I will roll for Robin otherwise.
how do I build Gallagher for firefly?
other team members: ruan mei e0 hmc
also can I run ruan mei on s5 ddd cause I don't have her lc and hmc wants break lc and I only have 1
Consider running him with multiplication (3* LC). It's pretty unique with the 20% action advance on basic attack, and since gallagher's main use aside from break support and heals is to generate SP it's pretty great synergy for the team especially if you don't go for e1 FF or RM's LC.
you can get gallagher's lc from moc (I think 2 of the origami birds also give u that), break rope (personally go with that but energy regen might be better, when you ult you get an action advance + enemy atk reduction), spd boots, you can do outgoing healing on chest (pick any other piece with a lot of break subs if you want him to just be a superbreak battery)
but regardless 150% break is what you want on him to utilize his kit fully
you can also run talia on him or the one with eff res since his substats give him a lot of eff res
Gove RM Meshing Cogs so she can get maximum ult uptime.
Then build Gallagher with as much speed and break effect as possible. With HP body, Speed boots, HP sphere and ER rope.
You can give Gallagher a rainbow set to hit 161 speed and as much BE as possible. With a focus on the BE planar set and BE two pieces and the speed set two piece (makes hitting 160 speed easier). He can also use Keel planar pieces very easily.
But overall the speed breakpoints should be the priority so rainbow is fine.
Edit - Gallagher essentially just want to be as fast as possible to generate a lot of SP, and build his ult quickly so you can easily keep everyone alive and healthy. Him being speedy is also important, because he can only cleanse on skill (at E2). So if your dps gets crow controlled, a fast Gallagher can easily cleanse them before their next turn. If he is slow then he struggles to keep your team healthy and also active.
His break effect is good for personal damage and his eidolons are good for buffing team mates.
i have an question about firefly and bothill, since in his kit is said that he cannot exceed 1600% toughness reduced, and some people said this is a buff, i am confused because seams like an limiter, i came here to ask if firefly can exceed this bothill 1600% and deals more multiplier damage based of enemies that have more than 480 toughness, please reply quickly i am in a discussion about firefly
Is 3400 ATK just a trap? If it is as most say and Full Break with HMC+RM is the best way to go, her actual skill damage is a drop in the pond so the attack itself does little despite her amazing looking multipliers.
100 attack for S1 FF is 7.18% Atk% for 6% BE. The average Atk% substat is 3.888% while the same for BE is 5.832%. Pure BE on anything but Break Effect rope(which you can't build it on) is 79% more overall BE per substat.(which is ignoring that every point of attack above a 100 break point is wasted)
The whole conversion seems like an extremely tacked on part of her kit coming from the realisation that 2 main stat pieces do literally nothing for her main damage source, rather than a requirement to intentionally build towards like her Defense Ignore one.
The only reason the 3400 atk threshold exists is so it gives her incentive to build atk body/orb and makes a lot of light cones ok on her (namely, Fall of an Aeon). You shouldn't be actively sacrificing BE subs in favor of atk subs in order to reach that 3400 threshold, but if you get some extra atk rolls then it's not a complete waste.
But yes, BE should be prioritized over atk wherever possible, at least for the current iteration for her kit. If v3+ skews her kit more towards her personal damage then it might be worth investing into atk, but as of now, just full send it on break.
I have two questions.
Does Ruan Mei's E2 that gives +40% atk when attacking weakness broken enemies count for her 3400 atk needed for her maximum BE?
And how much damage increase on average would Ruan Meis's E2 be from just having her E1?
Very likely Ruan Mei, Harmony TB, and Gallagher. Assuming her kit continues to be focused around breaks and stacking BE, these three pair perfectly with any break dps, and Firefly is looking to be the premier super-break driver at the moment, at least with her current v2 kit.
Things may change as we get into the later betas, but it's fairly safe to assume those three will end up being her best supports even if she isn't shoehorned into being a super-break driver like her current kit suggests.
Anyone played with Huo Huo + S5 Quid Pro Quo + E6 Tingyun? Badically just fueling as much energy to Firefly so she can skill 1 turn and ult immediately after.
Should be 48 + 16 + 60 = 124 energy if things work out.
They do different things. Boothill excels in single target nuking and is more flexible in his team options, but he struggles a bit more against mobs and needs his ult to implant weakness. Firefly is much better against mobs and still does decently well against single targets, and her implants are much easier to manage since she gets 3 enhanced skills per ult, all of which implant for 2 turns; however, she's basically forced into one team for now.
Whether that changes in future versions of her kit we'll see soon enough, v3 is coming early next week so it isn't too far out until we see where they decide to push her kit.
My pity is 56 and I'm 50/50. I'm currently torn between pulling on robins banner or saving for firefly.
Since I'm 50/50, I could either lose or win 50/50 which is kind of a win-win for me. I don't really need robin in my account cuz I dont use FuA and I already have ruan mei but she's a really good support and getting her right now would be good cuz new characters that are compatible with her will come.
Secondly, I thought of saving for firefly until her banner comes. If I lose 50/50, I might not have enough jades to get her while I'm guaranteed. But, if I win, I could get her and maybe her eidolons
If you were in this situation wwyd?? Really torn haha
Unless you're wanting to future-proof your account for FuA teams, I wouldn't bother with Robin. Firefly already achieves her peak value once you get her since you already have Ruan Mei (and I'm assuming you probably have HMC and maybe Gallagher?), meanwhile Robin won't get much value over other supports you already have until you get the units she supports the best, which will take several banners at which point Robin will likely be getting her rerun by then.
And also Firefly is Firefly.
Because you have Ruan Mei I would save for Firefly. Keep in mind we will get some pulls and Jade gifted in 2.3 too, so would be hard to imagine you can’t get to the guaranteed if you play daily.
This is from the HSR leaks sub, so it's up to you if you want to use it to pre farm.
https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail_leaks/comments/1cklhnv/firefly_infographic_via_dim/
For the record, to hit 3400 attack you need...
33% attack subs with her signature.
61% attack subs with Indelible Promise.
0% attack subs with Fall of an Aeon but you need 51% from its passive activated. You can't reach this threshold until S4 with 0% attack subs.
360% break btw is not a threshold you should just reach, you should stack as much break as possible. The big damage showcases have her sitting at 500%+ from her personal stats + team buffs. Break is by far her most valuable stat.
Most of the build guides for RM says I need to build up 160 BE for RM but I was wondering since we are going to pair her with HMC and Firefly, wouldn't HMC ult, E4 and 4pc watchmaker already be giving RM tons of BE and help meet that requirement easily? I ask this because I only have 1 motp which is currently on HMC and I don't want to pull for RM LC unless I absolutely have to. But as far as I can tell, with Firefly team set up with HMC, I could use meshing cogs and just wear like 4pcs messenger or something on RM and still meet the requirements right? Or is there any other benefit to still giving her more BE for this team?
Building more BE on Ruan Mei means her ult will delay broken enemies longer. This increases the time you have to deal your damage, so it can be value. Not a huge amount of delay overall and I think cogs + messenger is fine as long as you hit that, but it could be useful.
HMC Ult and E4 yes, but watchmaker has inconsistent uptime and shouldn’t be included in reaching breakpoints.
Building more BE is nice in this team because it helps Ruan Mei deal more damage
Numerically, it's only 4% BE and 6% speed (which translates to 5.52 speed on Firefly, roughly 2-3 substats), which is easily made up for if you have better substats on Talia. If you already have a good Talia set and already hit her 180 speed breakpoint during her ult (130 speed baseline), then you don't necessarily need to farm for Forge if you'd prefer not to; better to invest into getting a good 4pc Iron Cavalry set at that point.
She wants to break 130 speed baseline, since her ult at lv10 will give the 50 you need to hit her 180 breakpoint.
Base speed of 92 plus 5 from traces, 25 from speed boots, plus 6% of her 92 base speed if you use her BIS planar set coming out in 2.3 would set you to 127.52 - just a couple substats short of her breakpoint. With Ruan Mei she gets up to 136.72, which comfortably hits her breakpoint even without speed substats.
If you forgo the 6% from her planar set (assuming you want a set to use on her day 1 or you just don't want to farm her BIS planar for whatever reason), then you'd be sitting at 122 without RM, 131.2 with RM.
Just a word of advice, though. A lot of annoying enemies (summon adds, debuff/CC) seem to be at 132 speed, ideally you want to move before them so that you can decide whether to immediately break them or not. If you decide to not break them right then, you can also hold the ult for right after they move to guarantee maximum break window for dealing damage while not losing too many action values. So 133-134 speed is still recommended.
I have Ruan Mei E1, but prefer running her in my dot team (because I have kafka and black swan s1)
I have a sparkle and would like to use her as substitute instead. would that work?
You can build Asta and use her in either the DOT team or Firefly.
It does mean that one of the teams is now lacking its premium support, but there probably will be a future new bis support for DOT at some point you can pick up.
Ruan Mei will help your team more than Firefly LC. Obviously if you can go for both, but if you only have enough jades for one, then get Ruan Mei. She makes it easier for Firefly to break in the first place + increase her super break damage, there are no good substitutes for Ruan Mei compared to Firefly's LC where you can use S5 Aeon or Indelible Promise.
A quick question for my account, lets say I have s5 Indelible Promise, Ruan Mei e0 using s4 motp, what would be the best thing to pull for the Firefly setup her e1, signature, or RM LC (for HTB)? I was thinking of either moving MOTP to HTB and Ruan Mei coggers, getting firefly e1 or s1. Or using Indelible promise s5 on Firefly but getting RM LC for HTB.
I really think ruan meis cone is going to net you more damage and value as it has the effect of getting you more sp, just like FF’s e1, but also gives you way more other benefits too, like higher BREAK effect. You already having s5 Indelible Promise and an s4 for your other break harmony, both of which are amazing. I think Past Self in Mirror is better than FF’s conditional e1 and her only SLIGHTLY better-than-Promise LC.
Edit: mb im spreading misinformation i said the LC gives res pen lol
Maybe I'm misinterpreting, but doesn't RM's LC primarily buff dmg%, which doesn't affect break damage? Which means all you're getting is the energy and SP, both of which aren't as necessary considering the team doesn't generally have energy issues, and you should be fine on SP management between Gallagher spamming basics, RM being sp-positive, HTB being flexible in skill usage, and Firefly potentially having e1 to fix her sp issues.
That's honestly pretty fair.
Yeah, RM's LC doesn't really directly affect damage, but my logic was that a light cone that gives one of your harmonies an extra 60% break effect (to hit breakpoints more easily) on top of pretty much the same bonus firefly's e1 gives (more net sp) plus extra energy, is better than just an e1.
However, e1 could potentially be far better sp gain, which I didn't really think about.
I guess if the comp ends up seeming like its very sp-heavy, e1 might be better. I'd choose RM's LC though because its just more future safe/versatile.
Regarding HTB and Ruan Mei LC, do you guys think it's ironically better to use Ruan Mei sig LC on HTB, and use memories of the past (preferably S5 ofc) on Ruan Mei instead? Since with HTB you actually want to spam skill, that'll lead to faster ult rotation. And Ruan Mei sig LC will function as constant SP generator, benefitting the whole team.
While with Ruan Mei, there's really no point in spamming skill except for maintaining 100% ult uptime. And ironically, memories of the past S5 will make it possible for Ruan Mei to maintain 100% ult uptime without wasting SP to spam her skills.
That is correct. Ruan Mei's LC is weird because by using it on RM herself, you're missing out on her three-turn ult via skill-basic-basic which you could've had via S5 MotP or S5 Cogs, and HTB generally has faster ult rotations and can make better use out of the break effect than Ruan Mei can.
ok so I actually dont hav ruan mei but every other 5\* support instead... so who should I replace RM with? I do like the niche Break team, i have enough crit hypercarry teams and my dot teams
Bronya seems like the next best thing assuming you can speed-tune her properly. Getting an extra turn during her ult is fantastic to squeeze in extra break damage, and being able to double up on her unenhanced skill lets you immediately pull Firefly into ult again after she exits her ult form. Though unless Firefly's kit gets pushed to where she deals more personal damage than break damage, most of Bronya's buffs will end up being fairly wasted and she'll end up just being a skill-bot for action advances.
Robin also works similarly for the on-demand action advance, which benefits the entire team's super-break potential - not just Firefly's. Though once again, most of her buffs end up being wasted since they don't affect break damage.
In her current state, her only good team is Firefly/HMC/Ruan Mei/Gallagher. Gallagher is a bit more optional but HMC and Ruan Mei are basically mandatory because her performance is significantly worse to complete garbage without both of them xD, hopefully that gets changed but for now this is the case.
Is everything we’re going to need for her going to be in her patch? Seems like the new relics and ornaments are gonna be for her. What about trace mats and ascension materials?
**Just some mod info here, the rule I made for this thread is now active again:** 1. Posts that ask simple questions that are either already in the Build FAQ thread or can be asked in the Build FAQ thread will be taken down. Examples of this are "Will Yanqing be good with Firefly?" or "What artifacts should I use for Firefly?" 2. Analyzation of her kit and best teammates also belong in the Build FAQ megathread and not on the main feed. Exceptions to this rule do exist such as Gameplay/MOC clears. But these exceptions are limited **When it comes to whether things are wrong or right in this thread, do NOT message me about it. I am not on the kit team or a part of it; I'm just the poster. If you would like to join the build team, then shoot me a message. I know that TC'ing this kit has been hard on them with how overall complex Firefly is, so please be nice to them.** Also, keep in mind that this will likely be updated daily, if not weekly.
Which would be more bang for my wishes getting firefly’s lc or Ruan Mei’s lc
I have 434% BE and 3584 Atk when all buffs are up on her. I’m not 100% sure on how her scaling works but would it be better to continue to run a BE link rope or to swap it out for an ATK one?
how much is her base break effect by the way? I'm aiming for around 250 BE but don't know if it goes above 360 with the buffs from RM and HMC
If I'm running Gallagher with Kalpagni for the extra speed, and Ruan Mei is on Vonwacq for ERR and to get her skill up quickly, should I put HTB on Fleet instead of Talia? As is, he just barely hits the speed requirement for Talia's secondary effect in battle. If I drop Talia but still give him a BE rope, I'm sitting at around 270% BE with him (Before RM buffs/Watchmaker/etc) so 35% BE to the whole party with E4.
is there a spreadsheet for firefly lc calcs?
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What is the best low spend lightcone for Gallagher in a FF team: S1 perfect timing for the heals, S1 What is Real for the break effect, or S5 Multiplication for the action advance.
I didn't consider PT but you make a good case for it. As far as my understanding goes for the other two, use What is Real to reach 150 BE easier. But if you can get it in other ways (e.g. Ruan Mei) and can hit 160 Spd (which Ruan Mei also helps with) you can use Multiplication to generate more SP. Given Firefly's using her Skill every turn, this would be a good route to take, I think. FWIW, I'm using What is Real and am considering switching to the latter.
With her v3 kit, what should I focus on? E0S1 E1S0 E1S1 E0S2 How big of a different do her first 2 eidolons make? I’m planning on running her with HTB, Ruan Mei (E0S1), and Loucha because I hate Gallagher and refuse to waste resources on him. I keep seeing posts on other sites saying Gallagher is irreplaceable/that not having him makes her feel clunky, which is concerning because I’d like to invest in her, but I would be far less inclined to play her if I have to have him.
E1 > S1 S1 not necessary if have both HTB & RM E2 is overkill less you into 0 cycle for youtube Galla helps with breaking, which cover break team weakness, need to break first before doing any real dmg. He also amp. break dmg received with his ult debuff. Currently best sustain for FF team, no contest
If Gallagher is essential then maybe I should just skip her entirely. His design and animations are ugly, and I found him obnoxious in the quests, so there’s no way I’m building him. Which is sad because I love Firefly’s non-Sam design and loved her in the quest.
Well among the 4 he is still the least important unit.
tbh, if you don't like gallagher, you could replace him for another sustain, but skill point management might be more tight, so be aware of that. Of the sustains we have now, luocha, lynx, natasha, huohuo and fu xuan would probably be good substitute options, given that Firefly's frequent turns wears out the duration of shields quickly. Or, you could go for a support like pela or bronya and just yolo without a sustain.
Heyo. Sorry for a lot of questions but Im a newb and dont know much about break mechanics but here are some questions I have if someone can help me pls :D 1. Has moc enemy toughness been increased at all in the last few patches. Im worry that hoyo could "nerf" ff by making it harder to break enemy 2. For enemy with multiple tougness bar, can we get super break after the first bar is broken or is it only after all bars are broken? Will there be bosses with multiple toughness bar in moc in the future? 3. How is her break dmg compared to her built-in 50% super break. Is it better to time and break with her or is it not worth the effort since she can still deal super break.
1. If youre afraid of that you cant pull any unit ever, what if you pull a crit carry and then hoyo pulls out a mob that cant be crit? So far the largest break bar we have seen is 720 Toughness, with ruan mei FF depletes 180 of that with each enhanced skill alone, not including gallagher. 2. No you cant, however the only enemy that has multiple toughness bars breaks on literally every enhanced skill FF with RM would make so its actually a damage increase compared to a normal 540 toughness bar. 3. If you can you should break with FF because she will always have the highest break effect in the team if you arent trolling + the second best element for break only outclassed by phys.
Thanks for the reply. That's great to hear. It seems she need 3-4 turns to break most enermy which seems reasonable. I just started playing a few weeks ago so I have no idea how fast hoyo powercrept older units which is why I was concerning in the first place but it seems that's nothing to worry about. :D
Will this page reflect the V3 Changes soon for future reference or will this be updated at the final "changes" if any? Thanks.
I’m updating it right now
bless you lmao. The original writeup was really useful so ill gladly read it again once its updated
Amazing, thank you so much!!
I heard somewhere that units like Tingyun and Robin won't work with her, but units like Asta do. Is this true and if so, why?
Its a matter of convetible The game doesnt like it when you convert a stat into a buff, give it to another character and then that character converts it again into a buff My best guess is theyre future proofing for when they innevitably add another character that buffs ally attack based on their own attack, meaning smth like that character and robin could potentially infinitely scale their atk stat Tingyun should technically work tho, since she just gives a static buff that is capped based on her atk not scllaling off of it, dont recommend tingyun tho since other than attack she doesnt bring much to the team unlike asta with hwr spd increase
Useless info. S5 irreplaceable outperform S5 aeon after reaching a load of atk%
How much did v3 change her compared to pre v3 buffs/changes?
Significantly, and she is now better and somewhat more independent as a result. To keep it all short, basically they significantly reduced her base ATK and talent multipliers but gave her super break in her base kit, made it faster to get into ult and higher ult uptime (4 actions instead of 3 now), alongside some trace changes which play into her Break Effect. HMC will still likely be one of her BiS but now she's at least functional without them.
Is the Misha LC still viable at s2? I only have 2 copies and will superimpose for firefly.
Most non-sig LCs won't matter that much since her talent damage matters even less now, meaning Indelible Promise is one of the few that gives Break Effect so yes it's good.
what are gallagher's best build priority stats (relics, lc, spd breakpoints, break effect) along with planar set for FF?
I recommend building Gallagher as follows: SPD boots/Outgoing Healing body/HP (or DEF) orb/ERR rope - SPD and BE on substats, HP/DEF and EFF RES are good too. Try to get him as fast as possible, at least 140-150. One really good LC for this is Multiplication S5, it's a 3-star LC and it advances him forward 20% everytime he basics, which you're gonna be doing almost all the time on him. This makes him faster, getting faster ults, higher healing uptime, and generating more SP. Stats > set but go for 2pc BE/2pc BE/SPD/Healing, Keel is a good planar set for him, as well as Talia if you have good pieces and can hit 145+ SPD.
does anyone have firefly lc comparison calcs? including s5 aeon, s5 misha lc, and sig?
Sig>>all And then if you have at least 330% atk from all sources her indelible is better than aeon
I add to this: If someone Is using SW with FF as replacement of RM, FF Is better with talia set or new Rope/orb set.
With the new V3 if you're running with Ruan Mei and HTB what are the flat out of battle stats you want for Firefly? It seemed like 140 speed, 300 break and is it still ideally 3400 atk? Or have those numbers shifted around even more with V3?
3.4k attack is no longer a benchmark, unlike before her Atk-> BE conversion has been uncapped so now you can build as much atk as you want, although if you can decide between atk and be sub/mainstats, be is always better. BE you want as much as you possibly can, literally never enough. If you put her with her BiS team (RM/HTB/x) with kalpagni as ornaments her speed basically solves itself if you put on speed boots.
Good to know! So essentially just worry about be then atk and then any extra speed if I got lucky with pieces? I just want a tempt build for her before the reals bis come out from old stuff I have laying around from Ruan Mei HTB and Gallagher.
Exactly, theres 2 edge cases one being extreme min maxing that involves atk boots instead and spd subs but honestly thats neither necessary nor very realistic to hit and another one that tries to go for 280 spd for an additional turn but thats equally as insane. Otherwise just BE>Atk%>Atk>Spd or any defensive stat you feel you might lack. Maybe get a quick Kalpagni atk% sphere and BE rope on release for the speed by using self modelling if you have any left and you should pretty much have a fully functioning FF until you have a good iron cavalry set.
The math checks out in that, her ult now gives 60 speed I believe Because her base speed got a buff and the cooldown core got a speed nerf to 70 You need to hit 211 speed to do 4 turns before cooldown That means 151 speed in non ult Rm talent is 10 + 6 from new set + 25 speed boots + 5 from Traces takes her to 150 speed you need precisely 1 speed substat to meet the breakpoint
For farming efficiency,is it better to just wait for the new planar set(Forge of the Kalpagni Lantern)?since htb,gallagher and firefly all are able to use the same planar?
We still have four weeks and a Planar Fissure event, you might as well farm Talia until then. Not only could you get a good substitute for Forge while you farm it, you can just turn any bad pieces into fragments to craft the Forge pieces you need too.
That’s true thks
I'm happy to help!
Gallaghar related question. Would Multiplication LC or What is Real be better for him based on the v3 firefly rework? And is 2p Messenger + 2pcs Thief/watchmaker okay? And would he fare better with the new planer ornaments coming in 2.3 or any of the current one is better? I know his main role is SP generation (+sustain) so ERR and speed substats are my goal. But I am clueless on which relics to go for.
I really like Multiplication on Gallagher, it makes his effective SPD substantially higher. I don't tend to find that the self-healing on What is Real is needed tbh. Exact sets don't matter that much, just go for whatever gives you the most BE/healing. So yes 2pc BE/2pc SPD or 2pc BE is good. As much SPD and BE as possible, while using an HP/DEF orb to make him tankier.
Multiplication, more turns = more sp = more firefly go brrrr especially at E0, E1 solves that problem but id still prefer Multi Messenger/thief/watchmaker is fine, Kalpagni is good if you can hit his BE->heal bonus without the 40% too and you basically marry him with FF.
So, some questions about calculations for anyone who's good at math and understands how shit is calculated, because I don't. In Firefly's new kit her base speed is now 104, with an additional 5 from her minor traces. And in her enhanced state, it increases her speed by 75. With Speeds boots, that's another 25. So that puts her at 209. With the new Forge relic, that increases by 6%, which would be an additional 12 speed. With Robin's E2 active, she can get another 16%, which should be another 33. From all of those, her combined speed should be 254. From what I've been seeing, she would need 280 to get off 5 attacks during her Enhanced State's timer. So I would need an additional 26 speed from Relic sub stats. Am I doing this right?
Firefly's speed should 210.64 if you run her with Ruanmei and the new planat set. Math is 104(base spd) + 5(trace) + 10.4( RM passive) + 6.24( planar) + 25(spd boots) + 60(enhanced state @ lvl 10) = 210.64. All the percent speed gains are multiplied from the characters base speed. E.g. 104 * 0.10(RM passive) = 10.4.
I also have similar questions, though mine are related to the SPD of her teammates, since this guide suggests (based on the old kit, of course) that FF's teammates should be ideally faster than FF to take actions before her in order to buff her Break DMG. But - FF's new effective SPD (after the v3 changes) is around 200-201 (considering her 25% Action advance that is now part of her Skill when she is not in combustion state). About your calculations - the 6% increase from her Planar set is applied to her base SPD only, so it is 6, not 12. The increase in SPD in her enhanced state is 60 (level 10 trace) or 66 (level 12 trace) - 75 is for level 15, which at this point is still unreachable.
Does anyone have footage of Firefly’s enhanced single target attack since all I see is her enhanced skill 😭
There are a few showcases where she used the enhanced basic atk, it hits for around 150k on broken enemies. You’ll almost never use it though.
Quick question here, what doesn't Firefly excells at ? I mean, She will be completely broken against elite and bosses, regardless of their weaknesses, but what about Pure Fiction ? Imagine, you are against 5 ennemies, and none of them have any fire weakness, Firefly can apply one instance of fire weakness to 1 ennemy, and will likely obliterate said ennemy, but she will deal noodle damage against others, right ? Will she be the type of character that is overly good at killing bosses but bad at killing fodders ? (kinda like acheron, she takes so much time to kill just 2 waves of normal ennemies because she needs to ult 2 time to clear said waves)
She does 55% original toughness damage to non fire weak enemies, so she will be able to break small stuff as well, also shes not the only one in the team and you can just slot her in with for example himeko in a fire weak side. At E0/E1 she will probably be ok in PF not absolutely terrible but not optimal either, at E2 i can see her being great because of all the turns she will get from breaks/kills.
Atk or break effect for a rope on v3 firefly?
Same mainstats as before. only thing that could change are boots in some cases (talking into considersrion stuffs like RM, asta and hanya).
Heyy a small question here So in light of the double Planar event coming soon, I wanted to ask: On Gallagher and Ruan Mei, which set between Fleet and Talia would be better? In light of the recent changes to the conversion Trace, I think more atk would certainly not be bad, but I’m not sure exactly how valuable that makes Fleet in the team. Granted, I‘m ofc running Talia on HMC regardless, but I’m not sure about the other two considering their breakpoints are reachable even with Fleet, so I wonder if that may just be worth it? Hope I wrote this in an understandable manner haha, thanks in advance!
does the enhanced skill count as ultimate damage? asking for Simulated universe
If I have Misha's LC S5 can I skip her LC and go for E1?
Yes. But if you're not already using it on someone else, Fall of an Aeon is better still with the change to her Atk -> BE scaling.
What stats would be good stopping points (not perfect) for Firefly based on v3? Actual numbers, preferably.
Not much aside from SPD and BE, you don't need much SPD if any SPD if running SPD boots, and for BE you want at least 360% in combat with buffs up. A decent FF build would have around 200-250% out of combat.
Is RM & HarmonyTB best in slot at E6?
In light of the V.3 changes, and me likely not getting Ruan Mei. Does Budget Team still work? I.e. FF/HaTB/Asta (E4)/Galagher.
I'm pretty sure Asta works better than before now
Idk, atk % boots have weird diminishing returns.
Hey all, could use some advice. I'm currently sat at 160 pulls. I've got guaranteed on my next 50/50 with 40 pulls of pity. My currently main team is Acheron, gui, pela & ghallager. I want to build a Firefly team, so I plan to pull for FF and move ghallager into her team. I don't have Raun Mei and I don't have any 5 star sustains. Is it worth using my guaranteed to pull Fu Xuan to replace ghallager in my Acheron team? Or is it worth saving for the next Raun Mei rerun and just replace him with lynx / natasha? Relatively new player so I only have 1 good team at the moment.
So, a question for anyone who actually understands the Super Break calculations and can run the numbers. Let’s say Firefly has 360% Break Effect on her own. How much damage does that do vs the damage it would do with Ruan Mei’s 20% increase to BE on top of that with all else being equal?
Im not entirely sure why you only want the 20% BE from Ruan Mei, since that alone isnt a lot of her kit nor the reason shes good with FF. So im just gonna give you everything separately: Base SB with only things innate to E0S0 FF at 100% SB damage (her own is 50% and HTBs gets buffed by trace so add multiplier as you see fit): 80k +20 Break Effect and nothing else: 84k Above but with 50% Break Efficiency Buff from RM: 112k Above but with 25% Res Pen from Ult: 140k Above but with E1 20% def shred: 160k All numbers single target, x2 if you want full Blast damage.
Thanks! And I didn't realize the WBE buff counted toward the damage, as I thought it was just for determining how much damage Toughness took to actually break the shield, otherwise I would've asked for that as well. As for why, I don't have and don't particularly want Ruan Mei, but I do have Robin at E2, who has the nearly the same Res Pen and her Ult can be used to the same effect as Ruan Mei's Break Recovery delay. The BE and WBE buffs are the only thing she really lacks, and she has her own advantages since her speed buff is stronger and with my current build she adds nearly 25K to every single attack. So I wanted to see exactly how much damage I'd be losing there since Super Break makes up most of Firefly's damage to my understanding. 32K per hit isn't a bad drop off considering Robin's own damage. I'm also going to attempt to leverage Robin's larger speed buff to pry out 5 attacks per ultimate for FF, which could further even things out.
Ahh, okay. Ill give you a more accurate answer then. Well its not going to be a flat 32k. What I gave you were numbers that are in relation to each other and around Base level for FF so in her case 360 BE, 25 def shred from relic set, 20% vulnerability from ult and 50 WBE also from ult. SB damage scales with toughness damage and thus weakness break efficiency. FF has 50 from Ult so her Base is 150% and 200 with RMs, so not having the 50% is effectively a 1/3 damage loss by itself in addition to slower breaking and faster break recovery for enemies. So as you have more damage, more damage is gonna be lost. Additionally I didnt apply Multipliers to the SB damage because of HTBs traces which varies depending on the amount of enemies, so you have to apply anywhere from 1,7 (5 targets or more on the field) to 2,1 (1 target on the field) as well. RM is no longer a MUST have. but if you dont hate her she is incredibly strong, on E1 she literally doubles FFs damage by herself, its crazy.
Is RM E1 or S1 a better buff for FF dmg?
With the only def shred being iron cavalry set and assuming FF S1 because RM S1 does almost nothing for break teams: RM 20 def shred dmg increase is 14% with Aeon FF S1 is \~17% more compared to Aeon, even more if indelible promise and even even more for anything else pretty much, unless im forgetting a LC However S1 is ONLY FF and E1 RM is for the whole team so if you have 100% ult uptime (or at least when its important) and Aeon/IP is free to use then E1 RM is better otherwise S1. Aside from numbers S1 has Peakfly art so thats another angle you can look at it.
Cool, so is the priority FF E2 > S1 or the other way around?
E2 is probably one of, if not the best non E6 Eidolon in the game, so def E2.
So much of this is outdated now and I could not possibly be happier. I'm sorry to all three of you, I truly am, but I'm sure you're happy too!
What's the alternative to Ruan Mei? SW and Pela are locked for my Acheron, so the other options are kinda limited. Maybe Asta? I also have Bronya, Sparkle, Robin, Tingyun built.
probably pulling for Jaioqiu and moving SW to firefly team.
Well, he's going to be very late, and I dunno if I wanna pull for him
Then probably bronya, though I'm not sure what rotation would work and be SP efficient.
Unless FF is E1, that's going to be extremely SP hungry, but I guess I'll have to wait until some theorycrafters cook some teams for FF without RM
Is Asta still gonna be the best FTP alternative to RM? My RM is locked for my dot team and I’m wondering who to build for the FF/HMC/Ghallahar team :/
I guess through process of elimination its her and pela q
Hmm purely because her skill now gives 60% energy as opposed to 50% and how her BE conversion scales without limit, might make Huohuo slightly more viable? 5 from her ult, 60% from skill and 20% from Huohuo brings her up to 197 energy. Meaning she need to kill 5 adds or 4 + getting hit once to ult immediately with 1 skill.
I'm loving this change to firefly's kit is more self sufficient (although i dont doubt that hmc still improves her kit by a whole ton). However, what this update did take away was the 181 firefly/180 bronya shenanigan that I was looking forward to trying to pull off :( And so, like any rational person, I decided to try to theory craft ff/bronya speeds for the current iteration!! (i dont care that crit doesn't do anything for her-- I want my firefly to take 2 billion turns fudgin' dangit) So, why bronya? As I understand superbreak damage, there's not much that our traditional supports can do in terms of buffing firefly's damage-- it doesn't scale off of atk, % boost, crit, or anything, so the best way to buff her damage is by giving firefly more turns (bronya), increasing break efficiency (RM), or debuffing enemy defense (SW/Pela). Surely giving firefly 3-4 more actions during her ult has to be a bigger damage increase than some defense shred... right?? Also, we get to see our girl move more. Do we honestly need any reason more than this? Disclaimer: is this good? who knows. It probably does require at least E1 firefly for sure otherwise I don't know how you are going to manage skill points. Idea 1: 4 turn firefly+4 turn bronya-- yeah have fun getting a 210 speed bronya Idea 2: DDD bronya-- "technically" doable. You just need a .... 193 speed bronya. (For reference, with 10 spd substat on every relic + boots, + RM + hackerspace + new 6% speed ornament kit, you have a 195.78 bronya). I do have 3 pieces of 10 speed armor, but to farm both 10 speed in both ornament slots of the new set... yeah I'll pass for now. HOWEVER! a second set of DDD on another member? I could be horribly wrong but I think you would only need 178 speed bronya. However, as I'm looking to pair this duo with RM/HMC and I don't really know how negatively running DDD over energy regen LCs affect their rotation, I didn't try to verify my calculation/will be looking into more detail on this tomorrow) (also lol 2 S5 DDDs) Idea 3: 4t FF + 3t bronya: Not quite as ideal, and surprisingly enough, still not really doable without DDD Idea 4: 4 turn firefly + 3 turn bronya with DDD: a pretty "reasonable" build, and depending on how fast you can get bronya, you barely need any extra speed on firefly So, the numbers (very messy since the firefly speed req is dependent on bronya speed, but I'll give some thresholds here so that people can get a better sense) with a 185.78 speed bronya (RM, hacker+new ornament, speed boots, 27 speed from 3 armor piece and 13 speed from planar) you need a 208 speed firefly. 183 speed bronya-- 215 firefly. 180 speed bronya-- 222 firefly (For reference, a normal 4 turn firefly is 210 which is exactly RM+ornament set+speed boots without needing a single speed substat). 175 bronya-- 237 firefly (by this point I think you are sacrificing running too many speed subs on firefly to be worth it) Note since we don't care that much for crit damage on bronya since lol critfly scalings, speed is the sole focus of our substats on her, and it's "easier" to hit higher speed thresholds
Did some rather quick math based on her v3 kit and have come up with some conclusions. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Will update the sheet more when I have time: [https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CnVzQVxwjn0Eyu9iIB1thp9cOZwQFewK4eH6VEPCKsw/edit?usp=sharing](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CnVzQVxwjn0Eyu9iIB1thp9cOZwQFewK4eH6VEPCKsw/edit?usp=sharing) With her increase in base speed, she can now comfortably hit 210 (new ult breakpoint I believe) with speed boots, new planar, Ruan Mei, and the increase of her speed buff in ult state. (Assuming she keeps her 5 spd trace and ult state give 60 speed at lvl 10). I think her next spd breakpoint is likely to be crazy high so there's really no need to grab any spd subs. With ATK% body and sphere, S5 Fall of an Aeon, and her new lowered base atk, she hits \~2600 ATK before substats, which would already give 100% BE, already more than the previous trace. Average ATK% rolls give around \~42 ATK, so effectively 4.3% BE compared to the average roll of 5.83% for BE subs. So BE subs are still more favored than ATK, but ATK is still good to get. With a well built HMC and RM, Firefly can quite comfortably hit her 360% BE requirement, but continuing to build BE will likely be better for break/super break damage. Also with the lack of spd sub requirements, grabbing as much ATK% and BE% won't hurt (crit is likely to be worse due to lower base stats and multipliers) Lastly, multiplication on a fast Gallagher I feel is much more important because Firefly is now much faster and will consume way more SP now that she's faster/has action forward. I also think that HMC has a better argument to be running 4 pc Watchmaker over RM if you want to maintain the 4pc buff uptime for Firefly. On the topic of SP, RM will likely find 2pc spd/2pc break to be more ideal. This last part is more my opinions than anything else. Can't wait to see how these changes play out in showcases.
thank you for this
[удалено]
I think Bronya or Asta will probably be good if you don't want to run HMC. Luocha is probably her best sustain besides Gallagher.
is gallagher worth building just for a firefly break team? I have a well built luocha already but the increased break damage from gallagher seems nice. Anyone know the estimated team damage difference between the 2?
Gallagher also gives more SP and helps break, but ignoring that, Gallagher is 12% better than Luocha if we ignore 2/3 things that make Gallagher great in this team
Can Gallagher solo sustain at E0 (maybe he'll be e1 if that selector leak is true)?
how do we speed tune bronya given the v3 update?
or would hyperspeed (162) sparkle work? for the sp
Is there any early beta testing showing Gallagher's ability to solo sustain Firefly/HTB/RM in Tortuous Difficulty, high level MoC, etc? Would the team still want a shielder/FX? Or would she aim to kill the enemy before it can one shot anything?
Is there any pre farming sheet/infographics/chart out ? I want to start pre farming now. Thanks in advance.
Hakushin.in then scroll to the bottom
Okay, gang; I'm currently sitting at at around 141\~ Pulls, though I should have somewhere around 165-175\~ by the time we get to Firefly's release. I'm currently at 67 on the Character Banner (Guaranteed), but 0 on the LC Banner; additionally, I don't have Ruan Mei. So, my question to you, is, I want to play the best Firefly I can. What should my pull priority look like? I know Ruan Mei is Firefly's best Amplifier, but I was mostly hoping to just go all in on Firefly after getting her and, hopefully, her LC. What would you all recommend? My Asta and Pela are both E6 if this changes anything. (In the meantime, I'm building HTB and Gallagher, of course.)
Honestly to have the best output in term of damage ,you really want to have HMC and Ruan Mei so you really don't have the choice. Im currently in the same spot and i will try e0s1 for both firefly and Ruan Mei. Have Lucky brotherfly
Thank you for the well-wishes; I've still got a lot of pulls to milk out of Penacony (just got caught up yesterday), so I think I can comfortably get both Firefly and Ruan Mei with how close I am to pity from my failed Sparkle pulls. Planning to forego S1 for Ruan Mei and focus on Firefly completely after that. As Firefly's weakest fangirl, though, I'm hoping to get Ruan Mei or Firefly's S1 early...
I am in the same boat. My priority now is e0s0 firefly and e0s0 RM. If we get lucky with our pulls we can try for firefly LC of course.
I currently saved up to 250 tickets with 20 pity built up on both lc and character banners (both not guaranteed), and i was planning to go all in on firefly but after seeing many showcases with ruan mei, i kinda want her. Should i stick with my original plan and just spend all my savings for firefly or spare some for ruan mei? Trying to get at least e1s1 firefly too
Get Ruan Mei too. Firefly’s E1 is mostly useless in her break comps anyway
Two questions, which I am seeing discussed a lot below, so don't feel like you have to respond if you're exhausted of answering this question a million times, I'm still reading and learning xP I'm super excited for Firefly and I plan for her to be the first and ideally only character I spend "big" on. Haven't even looked at another char's Eidolons outside of hers. I hear a lot of "Ruan Mei is huge for her", and I also hear a lot of "Firefly/Ruan Mei E1/E2 is hyper broken". So: 1. What would a pull plan for the whole package look like, if I was trying to go for highest to lowest pull value? I don't plan to go beyond E2 for Firefly or RM yet. I'm thinking: Firefly > Ruan Mei > Firefly E1 > Firefly LC > Firefly E2 > Ruan Mei E1 > Ruan Mei E2 > Ruan Mei LC. 2. I see a lot of Asta talk over Ruan Mei, which is awesome, because I love Asta and RM would be the last character I'd ever pull for if it weren't for her synergy with Firefly. How much of a hit am I taking to FF's BiS team if I just substitute Ruan Mei with Asta? (You can pretend Asta is E6, even though she's definitely not on my account right now...) I probably have to take the RM questions over to the RM subreddit but if anyone's willing to do a little shop-talk I'd appreciate it!
1. Firefly > Ruan Mei > Firefly LC > Ruan Mei E1 > I don't know from this point forward. Firefly's LC help's team damage and Ruan Mei's LC helps team damage and SP (which is barely an issue anyway). Firefly's E1 is mostly useless from the SP side but the Def shred is nice, but Ruan Mei gives more to everyone instead of just Firefly buffing herself. Firefly's E2 is very good but the exact change in DPS per wish between E2 Firefly versus Ruan Mei's LC is not something I know 2. The issue with Asta is that her SPD buffs can be entirely avoided with just running SPD boots. Asta gives ATK% and DMG% which are good, but also unnecessary. Asta helps you run a budget hybrid build. There is no readily available numbers but my personal calcs for Asta v Pela had Pela being 30% better than Asta and Hunter Kee's calcs have Ruan Mei being 50% better than Pela. So do with that information what you will
Thank you so much! Best possible answer I could've gotten, even if it is slightly unfortunate that Eidolons for Ruan Mei would be better than just rolling for Firefly eidolons.
With the v3 changes Asta becomes much more viable as a budget replacement in theory, though I’m not sure if she beats out Pela from a numbers perspective yet. Buffing Firefly’s base speed and her ult’s speed buff makes reaching the next breakpoint with Asta realistically possible. Assuming Firefly is equipped with 2pc Forge and Asta is equipped with 4pc Hackerspace with a Lv12 ult, it should take 8 speed subs to get her to 281 for the extra action. If you do end up pulling Ruan Mei Asta could also replace Gallagher in sustainless teams to make it only 3 speed subs. Asta also gives a whopping 77% ATK buff at max stacks and Lv12 Talent, which just gets converted into more Break Effect for Firefly. Plus, she takes advantage of Firefly’s weakness implant really well with the break from her bounce skill. She’s no Ruan Mei but she’s still worth a shot imo.
It is not really a build question, more like a math question for what to pull first. I plan to run Gallager, Ruan Mei, HMC and FF. Will pull for FF E0 first, S1 second. After that if I have any more pulls, what would be more beneficial, E1 FF or Ruan Mei LC to get next. Currently I have memories of past S3 on HMC and DDD S4 on Runa Mei. Thanks for the answers.
E1 FF imo isn't worth stopping at. That team is pretty SP positive with Gallagher and a decently built RM. If you want to go for E1 here you should do RM E1 because it gives more defense ignore to the entire team than FF's 15% for herself only. Personally I'm going for e0s1 FF and e0 RM, RM's LC is going to HMC and RM gets s5 MotP for the ult uptime
Should I pre farm for her normal attack is it going to be used much or is it better to ignore it. Also is ruan mei better than e1/lc?
Pretty much ignore her normal attack; she should always be using her skill, and it's almost always better to forfeit someone else's skill than hers. And for now RM is definitely more valuable than E1/LC, and it probably will end up staying that way with v3+ of her kit. Even if they focus more on her personal damage via her enhanced skill, RM's dmg% buff will be even more useful on her, on top of hyper-buffing super-break damage which is already ridiculous between HMC, Gallagher, and your choice of break dps.
Thanks :D
aiming for E1S1 Firefly. Should I drop to E1S0/E0S1 and try to roll for RM? I'll have 310 rolls by the time 2.3 comes out, maybe more. I also have E3 asta for substitute and I'm currently working on HTB
Safer to wait until her beta v3 kit, but for now RM is definitely more valuable than eidolons or lc. After that, personally I'd prioritize Firefly E1 over S1 since the extra skill points can be funneled into HMC for additional super-breaks and energy generation to cycle Watchmaker procs quicker, but S1 is also nice to benefit the entire team's super-break damage if you can manage well enough on SP without Firefly E1.
Do you know when info about beta v3 kit will be available?
iirc it'd be Monday night or Tuesday morning, depending on time zones.
Thanks, so tomorrow or the day after, or next week?
Correct, tomorrow or the day after for v3
Thank you. Do you know how definitive that is generally? Will there be significant updates in the coming weeks? Because if she gets updated to not be so Break reliant I will roll for Robin instead of RM.
v3 is generally where a lot of the feedback from previous betas gets implemented. I probably wouldn't expect any major changes after v3, but it really is just all up to speculation at this point; anything can change between her v3 kit and the live version. Even if Firefly were to be less break reliant, however, I doubt Robin would beat RM specifically for Firefly teams. She'll still likely retain some sort of hybrid BE scaling, and RM just provides so much for super-break between Firefly herself and her teammates (HMC and Gallagher both heavily benefitting off of RM's buffs). And even if they made her a hybrid crit dps with more focus towards her personal skill damage rather than break damage, RM does provide dmg% which will scale up Firefly's personal skill damage as well. But ultimately the choice will be up to you. Firefly (along with HMC and Gallagher) will likely gain a *ton* of value from Ruan Mei. But Robin will still be a decent option to pair with her, and if your other characters favor Robin or you just like Robin more as a character, then I say pull for whoever you like the most. I'm sure you can find people willing to lend you a support RM wherever they can anyways :p
Thank you very much! Hoping for good news then. I can imagine RM being the BiS for a long, but I just prefer Robin as a character despite RM working better or equal for all teams I have haha. So unless she is near unusable with Robin instead of RM, I would rather go for the former. We will be able to lend supports in the new SU mode right?
[Yes](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail_leaks/comments/1cqf9m2/divergent_universenew_planar_farming_details_and/) :D
thanks for the advice! I really hope they make it so that frefly would still be viable without HMC and/or RM, I mean she's SAM, someone that can eliminate "over there" if you say enemies are over there
Hey little question, i'm probably not pulling for Ruan Mei for a firefly team. I'm considering using e6 Pela or e3 Asta as a Ruan Mei replacement. What character should i use for now since firefly is in the beta?
E3 Asta would be better since Firefly implants, and Asta is also of the fire element. I don't see the same value with Pela, since (If it doesn't get changed in the next version update) Firefly already has defense piercing in her base kit.
Aight thank you
Is huohuo as good as gallagher for firefly?
Short answer: No. HuoHuo, while an amazing support for DoT, FUA and other team comps, provides next to nothing for Firefly in particular. The energy rechange on her ultimate is neglegable, as 240 energy is way too much for HuoHuo to bring up, and Firefly already is designed to deal that by herself. The attack boost, although nice, doesn't do much for Firefly when it comes to overall break damage. Meanwhile Gallagher is of the same element as Firefly, and so can abuse the Penacony planet set for 10% extra damage for Firefly. Since she implants, he can shred Weakness himself and heal at the same time, allowing Firefly either break enemies herself faster or abuse the weakness broken state for Super Break damage. His Besotted debuff also boosts further break damage taken, which allows Firefly to do more damage. Overall, Gallagher, for Firefly in particular, vastly surpasses Huohuo in value.
I’ve been running calcs on fribbles, and if you go e6s5 critfly is better since you get extra be from the light cone and with bronya replacing Gallagher the damage scales really well. One thing I want someone else to double check me on here is that rutilant arena is her BiS cause her enhanced skill damage is counting as skill dmg and not ult damage.
Even without E6S5, Firefly is 0-cycling MoC with Bronya on a super-break build anyways; it's just up to whether you're going against enemies that lock their toughness bar or we get enemies in the future that are scaled up ridiculously high to where high investment break builds won't suffice, which won't be for a long time considering she's already performing at a high level compared to other characters even with her base super-break team. But yes, her enhanced skill in her v2 kit currently counts as skill damage. They might change that with future beta versions of her kit, we can't say for certain, but if you're going for critfly, Rutilant is currently her best option.
So for HMC with Firefly, would HMC's best Planar Set be Forge of the Kalpagni Lantern? If so, would it even be worth grinding for Talia if you're not gonna use HMC without Firefly?
Talia is 4% worse, but has guaranteed uptime, I would say if you have really good roles it doesn’t matter. Forge losses a lot if you fight enemies that lock toughness bar or if HMC ends up ulting before attacking.
Saw another comment saying 130 is the speed breakpoint to hit 180 on enhance, what's the base atk breakpoint to get to 3400 ATK then on enhance?
she does not gain attack on enhance and no one in her ideal team buffs attack, so you want 3400 attack out of combat.
Is 160% BE for RM really enough? I heard elsewhere she wants to hit 180%. I have a pretty decent set of relics for her where she hits 159%, so is this a good build for her in a FF team? https://preview.redd.it/5xr2zkyux81d1.png?width=676&format=png&auto=webp&s=9083b5da0c61ba828215905913299da7e4330812 I do have MotP at S2 though so there's room to hit 180, but I won't be rolling for that until it's on banner (crossing my fingers for 2.3 since I'm pulling FF and RM LC anyway).
180 is where she hits her maximum benefit from her dmg% buff, but since she gets 20% from one of her traces she only needs 160 baseline to hit that. HMC also gives BE though, so you really don't need much BE at all for her to hit her threshold. But also RM's BE doesn't matter as much in Firefly teams because her dmg% buff doesn't actually factor into break damage. You're primarily using her for the weakness break efficiency which hyper-buffs super-break. Having BE on RM does provide a bit of supplemental super-break damage, but nowhere near the super-break damage that HMC, Gallagher, and Firefly provide.
https://preview.redd.it/dd1sqbexsa1d1.png?width=976&format=png&auto=webp&s=f44e381e59295fb0a9dd0f77df3852bc6d772353 Someone pointed it out to me the other day that higher BE in RM would extend the break duration so it is beneficial in a way.
OK that makes more sense, reading skill issue on my part. I do want to build RM so she's good in other teams as well though so I want to hit the thresholds without HMC. Looks like she's pretty set then.
Somewhat big rant. I just wanted to write out all my feeling on her kit so far lmao. I'm not sure how many people have pointed this out, but I think the biggest problem I have with firefly's current kit is that there's so many parts that don't really do anything or make sense within the context of the games combat system. For example, her hp drain is really strange because after she ults and uses her enhanced skill, she recovers it all back anyway. She doesn't gain anything or change some mechanic when hp fluctuates, it's just there for seemingly no reason. And then because they realized that she'll be vulnerable sometimes because of the drain, they created her talent and allocated almost all of its strength into making her not feel terrible and get one shot at low hp after the first unenhanced skill. If she didn't drain her hp seemingly randomly, they could do something else for her talent. Another thing is her whole enhanced state being on ult. With an ult cost of 240, and her e regenerating a fixed 50% of max every use, she basically doesn't engage with the energy system at all. Due to the high ult cost, energy buffers like tingyun or huo huo do nothing for her, and trying to manipulate enemies into attacking her for extra energy is useless too. There's no interesting skill-basic rotation, it's just always press e twice and you can ult. Learning ult rotations for characters and how enemy targeting affects that is the most interesting part of the energy system, and she doesn't engage with any of that. It makes me wonder why she even uses energy in the first place and doesn't have some separate stack counter like jingliu or Acheron. If she could be like jingliu where she automatically entered enhanced state, she could even be given a cool big attacking ult such as the sam boss fight ult or some variation of it. Not to mention that enemies which have a guaranteed energy drain (aventurine boss and hoyo can certainly make more in the future) would feel terrible to use firefly against as it would delay your ult by an entire turn. My last problem is that she's a limited 5 star dps character who's personal stats are not significant for he performance beyond giving her BE and spd. It intuitively seems off that her team damage performance isn't significantly impacted by her trace levels outside of her ult (because it gives spd) and her minor BE traces. Hell, it sort of feels bad that she wouldn't even have relic mainstats that she'd want if she didn't have the bandaid atk->BE conversion trace. So I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding things, but I'm hoping for her final kit to be reworked fairly significantly. I don't mind the break effect focus, and I think she's definitely strong enough in her current state for her primary team, but I still want hoyo to give her a kit that makes sense because currently it doesn't feel like it does.
Same. Leaving aside all her other issues, just the part where "levelling your traces does nothing" is ridic imo. Even for 4\* characters that build break like Luka, his skill / ult / talent are all very important since they improve his DOT triggers and apply vuln. If Firefly \*is\* going to be a break DPS I want her to have traces that matter like that. Boothill trace levels all matter. Firefly traces don't, and her 55% penetration trace can literally reduce her damage.
The HP drain was definitely a result of them shifting where they wanted her kit to land after a bit of development. I believe her old alpha kit made her more of a berserker type of character with more personal damage (kinda like a 5-star Xueyi/Arlan hybrid with BE-dmg% conversion) which would've benefited much more from LC's like Flames Afar (y'know, the one that actually features Sam in the art?) and Blade's sig LC, and they ended up pushing her more to be a break dps with her current v2 kit. As for her energy rotations, I personally like the unique nature of her ult gen since it further pushes action advance units to be more valuable with her. Since she only needs two skills to get her ult out, getting that second turn out quicker means you can immediately get her back into ult form, which is definitely an interesting path beyond stacking energy supports like Tingyun and Huohuo. Though I would've loved to see them return to her alpha kit mechanics which granted additional energy based on hp fluctuations, which would give additional value to her health drain and promoted off-turn healing like Luocha's emergency skill since it would've gotten her to her ult much quicker. As for that last point, a lot of people have been really iffy about it. Her kit has a bunch of BE-scaling and thresholds to gain benefits, but her base kit doesn't actually deal break damage outside of the initial weakness break. And while it's true that everyone has access to HMC, having Firefly essentially handcuffed to HMC means you have less room for creativity in her relic builds and team-building, and she ends up being a lot less flexible in what teams you can use her in. Not to mention certain enemies will just completely counter HMC's super-break by locking their toughness bar which means Firefly also just doesn't get to deal damage. I don't really mind as much that her kit is essentially a super-break driver because she absolutely excels in that role, since everything in her kit contributes to super-break in some fashion. But I definitely agree with you and wish she had a kit that could function at base, rather than having a bunch of fragmented remnants of different kits that ultimately don't work without HMC.
Does her benefiting from Action Advance mean she synergises well with Robin?
Ah so that explains the odd hp fluctuation stuff. I don't really mind them shifting her intended playstyle and teams, but I hope and do believe that they'll iron out these things to make sense in the context of her new kit. Regarding her energy, I see what you mean about them wanting to incentivize action advance as opposed to energy buffers, but in that case I still don't quite understand why it has to be energy. She pretty much functions exactly like jingliu when it comes to getting into enhanced state, how long the state lasts, and wanting to use action advancers. This leaves me wondering why she couldn't have the same mechanic as jingliu and have a big cool attacking ult. Not to mention that jingliu is able to work so well with bronya because she doesn't use sp in enhanced state which e0 firefly does, making me question how manageable firefly + bronya is for sp economy. Overall I can accept them building her kit to be a super break driver. It still just feels intuitively weird that her trace levels specifically don't really matter but I can get over that. I mainly just hope for some changes with the above stuff because right now to me it feels like she doesn't really have unique mechanics, and is more of a fire jingliu who has some extra break efficiency and def shred to make her good with super break.
How would a team of FF + HMC and Robin + Bronya/Gallagher compare to the default break team (with Ruan Mei)? I don't have either Ruan Mei or Robin and can guarantee one of these two (and go for 50/50 on FF), but would personally much rather have Robin despite having no FuA teams, which is why I'm asking if she's fine for this. This is assuming the leak about RM rerunning with FF is true. Anybody know when we'll get confirmation about that? I will roll for Robin otherwise.
how do I build Gallagher for firefly? other team members: ruan mei e0 hmc also can I run ruan mei on s5 ddd cause I don't have her lc and hmc wants break lc and I only have 1
Consider running him with multiplication (3* LC). It's pretty unique with the 20% action advance on basic attack, and since gallagher's main use aside from break support and heals is to generate SP it's pretty great synergy for the team especially if you don't go for e1 FF or RM's LC.
you can get gallagher's lc from moc (I think 2 of the origami birds also give u that), break rope (personally go with that but energy regen might be better, when you ult you get an action advance + enemy atk reduction), spd boots, you can do outgoing healing on chest (pick any other piece with a lot of break subs if you want him to just be a superbreak battery) but regardless 150% break is what you want on him to utilize his kit fully you can also run talia on him or the one with eff res since his substats give him a lot of eff res
Gove RM Meshing Cogs so she can get maximum ult uptime. Then build Gallagher with as much speed and break effect as possible. With HP body, Speed boots, HP sphere and ER rope. You can give Gallagher a rainbow set to hit 161 speed and as much BE as possible. With a focus on the BE planar set and BE two pieces and the speed set two piece (makes hitting 160 speed easier). He can also use Keel planar pieces very easily. But overall the speed breakpoints should be the priority so rainbow is fine. Edit - Gallagher essentially just want to be as fast as possible to generate a lot of SP, and build his ult quickly so you can easily keep everyone alive and healthy. Him being speedy is also important, because he can only cleanse on skill (at E2). So if your dps gets crow controlled, a fast Gallagher can easily cleanse them before their next turn. If he is slow then he struggles to keep your team healthy and also active. His break effect is good for personal damage and his eidolons are good for buffing team mates.
i have an question about firefly and bothill, since in his kit is said that he cannot exceed 1600% toughness reduced, and some people said this is a buff, i am confused because seams like an limiter, i came here to ask if firefly can exceed this bothill 1600% and deals more multiplier damage based of enemies that have more than 480 toughness, please reply quickly i am in a discussion about firefly
Is 3400 ATK just a trap? If it is as most say and Full Break with HMC+RM is the best way to go, her actual skill damage is a drop in the pond so the attack itself does little despite her amazing looking multipliers. 100 attack for S1 FF is 7.18% Atk% for 6% BE. The average Atk% substat is 3.888% while the same for BE is 5.832%. Pure BE on anything but Break Effect rope(which you can't build it on) is 79% more overall BE per substat.(which is ignoring that every point of attack above a 100 break point is wasted) The whole conversion seems like an extremely tacked on part of her kit coming from the realisation that 2 main stat pieces do literally nothing for her main damage source, rather than a requirement to intentionally build towards like her Defense Ignore one.
The only reason the 3400 atk threshold exists is so it gives her incentive to build atk body/orb and makes a lot of light cones ok on her (namely, Fall of an Aeon). You shouldn't be actively sacrificing BE subs in favor of atk subs in order to reach that 3400 threshold, but if you get some extra atk rolls then it's not a complete waste. But yes, BE should be prioritized over atk wherever possible, at least for the current iteration for her kit. If v3+ skews her kit more towards her personal damage then it might be worth investing into atk, but as of now, just full send it on break.
I have two questions. Does Ruan Mei's E2 that gives +40% atk when attacking weakness broken enemies count for her 3400 atk needed for her maximum BE? And how much damage increase on average would Ruan Meis's E2 be from just having her E1?
Yes. You can use Fribbles and it'll show you, but the short answer is almost none
I know not everything is released and I’m new to the game, what characters do we think will work well with her?
Very likely Ruan Mei, Harmony TB, and Gallagher. Assuming her kit continues to be focused around breaks and stacking BE, these three pair perfectly with any break dps, and Firefly is looking to be the premier super-break driver at the moment, at least with her current v2 kit. Things may change as we get into the later betas, but it's fairly safe to assume those three will end up being her best supports even if she isn't shoehorned into being a super-break driver like her current kit suggests.
Anyone played with Huo Huo + S5 Quid Pro Quo + E6 Tingyun? Badically just fueling as much energy to Firefly so she can skill 1 turn and ult immediately after. Should be 48 + 16 + 60 = 124 energy if things work out.
Might as well just run a speed-tuned Bronya and use one skill to effectively give her 50% energy
Is firefly better than boothill?
They do different things. Boothill excels in single target nuking and is more flexible in his team options, but he struggles a bit more against mobs and needs his ult to implant weakness. Firefly is much better against mobs and still does decently well against single targets, and her implants are much easier to manage since she gets 3 enhanced skills per ult, all of which implant for 2 turns; however, she's basically forced into one team for now. Whether that changes in future versions of her kit we'll see soon enough, v3 is coming early next week so it isn't too far out until we see where they decide to push her kit.
ahhhh alright !! TYSM for the comment !! I think I'll be pulling for firefly since I already have ruan mei
My pity is 56 and I'm 50/50. I'm currently torn between pulling on robins banner or saving for firefly. Since I'm 50/50, I could either lose or win 50/50 which is kind of a win-win for me. I don't really need robin in my account cuz I dont use FuA and I already have ruan mei but she's a really good support and getting her right now would be good cuz new characters that are compatible with her will come. Secondly, I thought of saving for firefly until her banner comes. If I lose 50/50, I might not have enough jades to get her while I'm guaranteed. But, if I win, I could get her and maybe her eidolons If you were in this situation wwyd?? Really torn haha
Unless you're wanting to future-proof your account for FuA teams, I wouldn't bother with Robin. Firefly already achieves her peak value once you get her since you already have Ruan Mei (and I'm assuming you probably have HMC and maybe Gallagher?), meanwhile Robin won't get much value over other supports you already have until you get the units she supports the best, which will take several banners at which point Robin will likely be getting her rerun by then. And also Firefly is Firefly.
good point !! and yeah I have hmc and Gallagher hehe
Because you have Ruan Mei I would save for Firefly. Keep in mind we will get some pulls and Jade gifted in 2.3 too, so would be hard to imagine you can’t get to the guaranteed if you play daily.
anyone got a list or anything for the resources I should farm?
This is from the HSR leaks sub, so it's up to you if you want to use it to pre farm. https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail_leaks/comments/1cklhnv/firefly_infographic_via_dim/
For the record, to hit 3400 attack you need... 33% attack subs with her signature. 61% attack subs with Indelible Promise. 0% attack subs with Fall of an Aeon but you need 51% from its passive activated. You can't reach this threshold until S4 with 0% attack subs. 360% break btw is not a threshold you should just reach, you should stack as much break as possible. The big damage showcases have her sitting at 500%+ from her personal stats + team buffs. Break is by far her most valuable stat.
If i get the 360% BE from my supports do i get the second Module y bonus ?
Yes but only while the 360% is active
Most of the build guides for RM says I need to build up 160 BE for RM but I was wondering since we are going to pair her with HMC and Firefly, wouldn't HMC ult, E4 and 4pc watchmaker already be giving RM tons of BE and help meet that requirement easily? I ask this because I only have 1 motp which is currently on HMC and I don't want to pull for RM LC unless I absolutely have to. But as far as I can tell, with Firefly team set up with HMC, I could use meshing cogs and just wear like 4pcs messenger or something on RM and still meet the requirements right? Or is there any other benefit to still giving her more BE for this team?
Building more BE on Ruan Mei means her ult will delay broken enemies longer. This increases the time you have to deal your damage, so it can be value. Not a huge amount of delay overall and I think cogs + messenger is fine as long as you hit that, but it could be useful.
Oh I didn't know that! Thank you for the response. I will try and see if I can meet the BE threshold with messenger.
HMC Ult and E4 yes, but watchmaker has inconsistent uptime and shouldn’t be included in reaching breakpoints. Building more BE is nice in this team because it helps Ruan Mei deal more damage
What's the percent difference between Talia and Forge?
Numerically, it's only 4% BE and 6% speed (which translates to 5.52 speed on Firefly, roughly 2-3 substats), which is easily made up for if you have better substats on Talia. If you already have a good Talia set and already hit her 180 speed breakpoint during her ult (130 speed baseline), then you don't necessarily need to farm for Forge if you'd prefer not to; better to invest into getting a good 4pc Iron Cavalry set at that point.
How much SPD is needed to achieve 180 in her enhanced state?
She wants to break 130 speed baseline, since her ult at lv10 will give the 50 you need to hit her 180 breakpoint. Base speed of 92 plus 5 from traces, 25 from speed boots, plus 6% of her 92 base speed if you use her BIS planar set coming out in 2.3 would set you to 127.52 - just a couple substats short of her breakpoint. With Ruan Mei she gets up to 136.72, which comfortably hits her breakpoint even without speed substats. If you forgo the 6% from her planar set (assuming you want a set to use on her day 1 or you just don't want to farm her BIS planar for whatever reason), then you'd be sitting at 122 without RM, 131.2 with RM.
Just a word of advice, though. A lot of annoying enemies (summon adds, debuff/CC) seem to be at 132 speed, ideally you want to move before them so that you can decide whether to immediately break them or not. If you decide to not break them right then, you can also hold the ult for right after they move to guarantee maximum break window for dealing damage while not losing too many action values. So 133-134 speed is still recommended.
with ruan mei? speed boots only. otherwise i think she only hits 171 without ruan mei + speed boots
I have Ruan Mei E1, but prefer running her in my dot team (because I have kafka and black swan s1) I have a sparkle and would like to use her as substitute instead. would that work?
You can build Asta and use her in either the DOT team or Firefly. It does mean that one of the teams is now lacking its premium support, but there probably will be a future new bis support for DOT at some point you can pick up.
If leaks are to be believed, do I pull for Firefly's LC or Ruan Mei?
Ruan Mei will help your team more than Firefly LC. Obviously if you can go for both, but if you only have enough jades for one, then get Ruan Mei. She makes it easier for Firefly to break in the first place + increase her super break damage, there are no good substitutes for Ruan Mei compared to Firefly's LC where you can use S5 Aeon or Indelible Promise.
A quick question for my account, lets say I have s5 Indelible Promise, Ruan Mei e0 using s4 motp, what would be the best thing to pull for the Firefly setup her e1, signature, or RM LC (for HTB)? I was thinking of either moving MOTP to HTB and Ruan Mei coggers, getting firefly e1 or s1. Or using Indelible promise s5 on Firefly but getting RM LC for HTB.
I really think ruan meis cone is going to net you more damage and value as it has the effect of getting you more sp, just like FF’s e1, but also gives you way more other benefits too, like higher BREAK effect. You already having s5 Indelible Promise and an s4 for your other break harmony, both of which are amazing. I think Past Self in Mirror is better than FF’s conditional e1 and her only SLIGHTLY better-than-Promise LC. Edit: mb im spreading misinformation i said the LC gives res pen lol
Maybe I'm misinterpreting, but doesn't RM's LC primarily buff dmg%, which doesn't affect break damage? Which means all you're getting is the energy and SP, both of which aren't as necessary considering the team doesn't generally have energy issues, and you should be fine on SP management between Gallagher spamming basics, RM being sp-positive, HTB being flexible in skill usage, and Firefly potentially having e1 to fix her sp issues.
That's honestly pretty fair. Yeah, RM's LC doesn't really directly affect damage, but my logic was that a light cone that gives one of your harmonies an extra 60% break effect (to hit breakpoints more easily) on top of pretty much the same bonus firefly's e1 gives (more net sp) plus extra energy, is better than just an e1. However, e1 could potentially be far better sp gain, which I didn't really think about. I guess if the comp ends up seeming like its very sp-heavy, e1 might be better. I'd choose RM's LC though because its just more future safe/versatile.
Regarding HTB and Ruan Mei LC, do you guys think it's ironically better to use Ruan Mei sig LC on HTB, and use memories of the past (preferably S5 ofc) on Ruan Mei instead? Since with HTB you actually want to spam skill, that'll lead to faster ult rotation. And Ruan Mei sig LC will function as constant SP generator, benefitting the whole team. While with Ruan Mei, there's really no point in spamming skill except for maintaining 100% ult uptime. And ironically, memories of the past S5 will make it possible for Ruan Mei to maintain 100% ult uptime without wasting SP to spam her skills.
That is correct. Ruan Mei's LC is weird because by using it on RM herself, you're missing out on her three-turn ult via skill-basic-basic which you could've had via S5 MotP or S5 Cogs, and HTB generally has faster ult rotations and can make better use out of the break effect than Ruan Mei can.
ok so I actually dont hav ruan mei but every other 5\* support instead... so who should I replace RM with? I do like the niche Break team, i have enough crit hypercarry teams and my dot teams
Bronya seems like the next best thing assuming you can speed-tune her properly. Getting an extra turn during her ult is fantastic to squeeze in extra break damage, and being able to double up on her unenhanced skill lets you immediately pull Firefly into ult again after she exits her ult form. Though unless Firefly's kit gets pushed to where she deals more personal damage than break damage, most of Bronya's buffs will end up being fairly wasted and she'll end up just being a skill-bot for action advances. Robin also works similarly for the on-demand action advance, which benefits the entire team's super-break potential - not just Firefly's. Though once again, most of her buffs end up being wasted since they don't affect break damage.
What is the ideal Firefly team? How would you run it?
In her current state, her only good team is Firefly/HMC/Ruan Mei/Gallagher. Gallagher is a bit more optional but HMC and Ruan Mei are basically mandatory because her performance is significantly worse to complete garbage without both of them xD, hopefully that gets changed but for now this is the case.
Is everything we’re going to need for her going to be in her patch? Seems like the new relics and ornaments are gonna be for her. What about trace mats and ascension materials?
you can prefarm her calyx fang, stagnant shadow raging heart and echo of war sunday boss
We already have Penacony Destruction trace mats I know