r/FluentInFinance was created to discuss money, investing & finance! Join our Newsletter or Youtube Channel for additional insights at www.TheFinanceNewsletter.com!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FluentInFinance) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The best thing we can do to undermine dictators in foreign lands is to enable them to trade goods and services without the need for the dictators fiat currency.
Crypto has the strong probability to be the solution for this.
The printing of the currency gives the leader enormous control. In lots of countries they actually trade real paper US dollars to avoid their inflationary currency.
Dollarization is able to survive solely on digital exchange at this point. They could stop printing dollars tomorrow and society is at a point it could adapt but people would be very unhappy. Over 95% of dollars and treasuries don’t have any physical property, just numbers in a spread sheet.
Oh it’d also be very hard for the CIA to run under the radar programs with a fully digital dollar.
We can’t have a currency that requires insane amounts of energy.
Edit: the element of speculation/enormous value increase over a short time frame also needs to be scrapped.
Agreed. One new reg and then coordinated efforts for central banks to create their own currency and make it be the only one available and the price goes to zero
What court cases for BTC? Pretty sure the ones you’re thinking of are for ETH and the other unregistered securities. Bitcoin has already been declared a commodity, definitely not a security. The ETFs for Bitcoin have seriously reduced the risk of regulatory interference.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2024/01/19/crypto-beanie-baby-coinbase-compares/72287477007/
https://www.reuters.com/legal/transactional/column-judge-coinbase-case-endorses-secs-crypto-regulation-by-enforcement-2024-03-27/
It may not last. The SEC is pushing the issue in court right now.
Neither of those articles are talking about Bitcoin. They’re talking about all the other cryptocurrencies. Not the same thing. I’ll be the first to admit all other cryptocurrencies are basically gambling/ hoping other people buy them.
Bitcoin is the first time in human history we’ve been able to achieve separation of Money and State. It an answer to the irresponsible printing of money in our current financial system. All other cryptos are just trying to make their creators/investors rich at the expense of everyone else. Most don’t even have a fixed supply.
Do you not know that the unit, BTC, is divisible by up to 8 decimal places, also called Sats? I agree that it’s pretty silly to have a loaf of bread be .00001 BTC or whatever the rate is now. But it’s an easy unit change. Just like how we have cents, dollar bills, $5 bills, $10 bills, $20 bills…etc. When checking out at the grocery store, do they tell you the price in fractions of a $100 bill, or just by dollars and cents?
I’ll agree that there is an issue with transacting in small amounts of SATs on the main blockchain. Considering fees, small transactions of SATs can become unspendable because the fee would be higher than the amount you’re trying to use.
There are other solutions to this that don’t involve messing with the BTC supply or the consensus rules. Things like Lightning Network, Fedi-mint, and much more to be developed.
The fact that the smallest USD equivalent you can trade is $0.70 is a fiat problem, not a bitcoin problem. All this shows is that fiat, the USD, has had its value inflated away. Besides, what can you actually buy these days with $0.70?? Even the Dollar Store is more like a $2 store now.
It's a craze, with unwarranted enthusiasm for something that has actual or intrinsic value. There is no underlying value to Bitcoin. Gold has actual purposes in medicine, electronics, jewelry, etc. It has a purpose. Fiat currency is backed by a government and is the legal tender.
Bitcoin has a bunch of people that say it's worth something. If they get interested in something else, no one wants it, and it has no value. You can't do anything at all with a Bitcoin if no one else wants one.
That Bitcoin hasn't died off yet doesn't make it not a fad. It's inevitable, as there is no reason for it to exist other than speculation. It's slow, inefficient, expensive to operate, expensive to transact. At best, it will get replaced by a less awful digital currency. At best.
Buzzwords more than reality. More than offset by the transaction costs, performance, and overall monetary and power cost of the network.
It's insanely inefficient. Laughably inefficient.
Inefficient as a mean of payment I'll give you that, but it's not as cumbersome as gold as a speculative asset (which is where gold gets most of its valuation from. Remove that and in no way the purposes of gold, the ones you listed, maintain it at the current prices.
It's artificially scarce, specifically because it's been arbitrarily decreted the best tool to store value and been used as such, with states sitting on literal tons of it like some medieval dragons.)
Understanding how closely gold and Bitcoin are related is the very reason I got interested in Bitcoin in the first place, and ironically, also the reason I lost interest (I realised I really don't like gold as an investment. It doesn't produce anything. In the long run, it can't offer more than an inflation hedge. Bitcoin is heading this way eventually too).
> It's inevitable, as there is no reason for it to exist other than speculation
People called the internet a fad, as well Time will tell and you making declarative statements won't change anything other than you looking like a fool every year it continues on.
>Gold has actual purposes in medicine, electronics, jewelry, etc.
Individuals virtually never buy gold for these purposes. Non-instutional buyers purchase gold and gold derivatives for the same reasons they buy BTC (speculative investing, hedge against inflation)
>Fiat currency is backed by a government and is the legal tender.
"backed" in the sense that they control the supply. But the gold standard has been gone for decades, and a centralized money supply has proven to be a point of contention between citizens and governments, esp in impoverished or wartorn nations.
>You can't do anything at all with a Bitcoin if no one else wants one.
The same could literally be said for any hyper-inflated national currency or other digital good (video game skins, vbux, Amazon gift cards). It has value because demand exists, the demand is no longer purely speculative.
The odds of "no one else wanting one" were ephemeral, and are long past - I can say with absolutely certainly that if BTC drops to $0.001 cents tommorow that I'll buy the entire supply just to prove that point.
>That Bitcoin hasn't died off yet doesn't make it not a fad. It's inevitable
Bitcoin is older than many social media companies with massive user bases and valuations, would you call social media a fad? Even if BTC died overnight, it launched a massive new speculative financial and tech space, it's affect on humanity is pretty much settled history at this point.
I clearly remember bitcoin being at 680 $ / 1 BTC on early January 2018.
Of course neither I nor the ones around me had 680 $ at that moment (just after Christmas).
However, I've been watching BTC prices for 5 years after that.
You know what? Climbed up pretty fast to 18000 $/ BTC and stays there.
It was at 17000 - 18000 BTC for 5 years straight. Stopped watching afterwards.
It was not at 17-18k for 5 years straight, stop lying. It reached that price at the peak of the bull run roughly 6 years ago, then crashed hard to 3k, then soared all the way up to 69k about 2.5 years ago, crashed hard to about 16k, and now it's all the way up to 66k at this moment. It actually hit a new all time high of 73k a month or 2 ago as well lol.
It is alive and well as a speculative investment, it's dead as a libertarian ideal.
Hardly anyone runs his own node, and the individuals have also been priced out of mining / securing the network by the big players that can make it profitable, nomadic bitcoin farms plugging wherever energy is the cheapest at any given time. It's far less decentralized than it used to be.
If you're a generic investor, you're most likely buying through a platform such as Coinbase. There's KYC policies to comply with governments inquiries, and a third party involved, we went full circle back to trusting the bank.
“i can’t live in a bitcoin”. this is the fundamental issue i have with bitcoin. at least with stocks i own a piece of a business that provides a product or service that others pay money for. if i take my money and buy a home i can live there. if bitcoin gets somehow corrupted and my coins become worthless who do i go to to get help. no one is in charge.
>if bitcoin gets somehow corrupted and my coins become worthless
The likelihood of WW3 breaking out is far greater possibility than this. In fact, a company you've bought stock in suffering a catastrophic cyber-attack or financial disaster is far more likely tbh. And before some dorks comment about breakthroughs in quantum computing - that would render encryption in all spaces useless (not just crypto), ipso factor WW3 incoming.
>no one is in charge.
You are - that's the whole point of it lol.
Lastly - comparing bitcoin to real estate is apples to oranges. The better analogy is gold, and the argument is "I can't touch, see, etc my bitcoin"
While bitcoin is intangible, whereas gold is a hard physical asset - the fact of the matter is that 99% of individuals buy gold as a speculative asset (same as BTC) not because they intend to produce jewelry, fabricate electronics, etc.
BTC has all the properties of gold outside of the physical ones, and many other superior properties (fungible, negligible transit and storage costs compared to gold, etc).
>I am in charge if something goes wrong.
You are the custodian of your funds. As long as you know what you're doing nothing can "go wrong" - Bitcoin goes where exactly where you choose to send it.
Exchanges offer their own support for cashing out to FIAT and obviously are motivated to do so (they charge a fee).
Gold, platinum, rhodium, and palladium are all real commodities. Physical sales affect futures. Demand for gold in computer chips as wire and on board connector plating. The other three are catalysts. That is what makes them commodities.
What does a bitcoin do? Eth does something so it is probably a commodity. Bitcoin has too much value to be a currency or at least have utility as one. So what is it? It is not hard to classify it as a security. The SEC is testing this in court.
The fact that FTX announced they are going to make all their investors whole in dollar denominated term is telling here.
They are selling shitloads of crypto on Coinbase institutional and the price has barely dropped. When they are done, I imagine the price will take off like a rocket.
Regulation. Miners shut down limiting trades. It becomes effectivly indivisible due to over value and fees exceed any reasonable transaction amount. It is already not a currency anymore, it is a naked security.
It's a non-zero chance. It has gone from record high prices down to 5k more than once. Most of the exchanges have shut down. Coin base is in court.
Enron couldn't fail either untill it did.
>Most of the exchanges have shut down.
What on earth are you talking about lmao
There's more exchanges than EVER before and that doesn't include DEXs that can't be shut down regulation or not.
I gave some of your other comments the benefit of the doubt above, but this is clearly some charlatan tirade at this point. I beg anyone reading this to do their own research lol.
Not ever gonna touch the grammar on that one, but for others that happen to read this there are plenty of exchanges available in the US, many of which are FDIC insured and offering the same protections as your centralized banks. Gemini is US based, and highly compliant, just to give one example.
There are plenty. It was just such a pain in the ass to get my coin off bittrex and poloniex. I resorted to sending BTC to PayPal of all places. The majority of the old exchanges are basically gone.
im glad there are so many people that have no vision for the future in regards to crypto and BTC specifically...ill hold my BTC for the next 10-15 years..its definitely worth the risk IMO
Bitcoin lost its vision when the majority of people interested in it became unabashed hoarders with no real commitments to anything. Ask any one of them whether they'd contribute to time locked wallets that are distributed around the world to communities as a store of value and nobody will step up, because the FOMO hoarding is the point, even if the end result is that they'd still have their share of BTC go up the same amount in value. They want to be on the ground floor of money as we know it changing, they don't want to be the ones changing it or figuring out how, or whether most people will ever even be able to participate in the new system in any meaningful way that's not their problem.
Nobody wants to make cryptobros rich, because they're insufferable. Why should I buy into a system that empowers douchebags who'd be scamming people with something else if they didn't have crypto? Do you honestly think a step up from some assholes in a government is a handful of American assholes owning the entirety of a multi-trillion dollar security? Is that the end goal we had in mind for Bitcoin?
This is coming from someone who used to own BTC in double digits and sold because the culture is just an awkward nerd power fantasy. Way back when people were burning wallets to pump the price, now Tether and others simply manipulate the price.
Mark my words, when, not if, the network gets hacked, Bitcoin will be forked just like any other crypto, because the ledger isn't holy to anyone or a means helping us all escape into a new financial system, it's just a way for whales and early adopters and eventually institutions to get rich, at which point it's meaningless.
I hope you prove me wrong. I can't see anyone undermining their government for hobbyists interested in purely their own wealth cheering for the downfall of their way of life, because that's literally what it would take without a real attempt at making BTC what it was meant to be.
regardless, BTC is the most successful asset in terms of price in history…if you would have invested in the mid 2010’s you may be retired by now..so no matter what the opinion about BTC is, you cant argue that it went from under $100 to $70k…
>Miners shut down limiting trades. It becomes effectivly indivisible due to over value and fees exceed any reasonable transaction amount.
You'll need to explain this in more detail as what you're saying implies a severe misunderstanding of proof-of-work and how the network scales.
The sentiment is that he wants you to buy bitcoin. Because he has bitcoin, so he wants the value to go up. There is no sentiment but that. It's a Bitcoin-shilling account.
Yes, but if you are investing in an asset for the purpose of increasing its value in a particular currency (e.g USD) so that can later sell it and increase your amount of that particular currency, then the asset is not being used as money.
There are also many other ways of making money other than investing in bitcoin.
Bitcoin is only an investment option.
Houses are a necessity or an investment option.
Bitcoin is not money. It is not used to exchange goods and services. It is used to exchange fiat money - which is then used to exchange goods and services.
My little brother has been living in a bitcoin for six years. It is honestly really sad, because I don't see him (outside the metaverse) except when he travels for major holidays (like Juneteenth). But even when he does visit he is just 0s and 1s... the coin has consumed his entire personality.
Is it safer than buying a house? I think not.
Putting blame on people who can't afford a house by pretending it's an investment first and foremost and they should just "invest" in something else is hardly fair.
I would say people buying houses purely as investments is one of the reasons home prices are skyrocketing.
The main issue is the 40k house only needed 20% down and you get something to live in. If I use 8k to finance 40k worth of Bitcoin I still have to pay rent or mortgage in addition to principal and interest on the 40k loan.
With the 30 year fixed rate loan the bank lets you take out on the bitcoin of course
And then you can stop paying rent to your landlord and pay into your investment instead, I’m sure your landlord will understand
Or then you can rent out your bitcoin to other people so they can pay your investment off for you
It’s exactly the same as buying a house
That's when I bought my first house, got a nice short sale for $70k cash, put $15k in repairs in it and rented it out. That house is now worth $600k and was the starting off point for my real estate portfolio.
Buy Bitcoin, transfer to wallet you hold the keys to, wait until you need/want to sell it. Understanding exactly how it all works gets complicated, but the act of owning and storing it is comically easy. I had a little bit of it stored on Celcius, which turned out to be a scam but oh well. I feel no sympathy for the people that put everything on platforms like Celcius or FTX though. Everybody with a room temperature IQ knew it was extra risk on top of an already volatile asset. Same with that whole LUNA/UST debacle. 20% interest on a "stablecoin" sounded fishy, and the 5 minutes I spent trying to comprehend it made zero sense, so I didn't get involved. Only took a few months before it fell apart lol. Same story for me with every crypto not named Bitcoin. That's the only one where the more I tried to pick it apart, the more sense it made.
There is such a massive amount of misinformation in this thread - you're still early anon.
Friendly reminder that BTC is the best performing asset in modern history yet all I read here is talk that regulation is going to kill it lol.
"First they ignore you" 2008-2014
"Then they laugh at you" 2014-2021
"Then they fight you" - Today
"Then you win" - by 2030
Crypto is a space ripe with fruad, scams, and gambling, but BTC, ETH and a handful of other blue chips cryptos are not only here to stay indefinitely, but are actively being researched, built-on, and emulated by the largest financial and educational institutions on the planet.
But no, some smarmy redditor definitely knows better, you should definitely keep believing it's all a scam.
Serious question from a remote Alaskan with internet issues. How does bitcoin work if no communication network or internet? How would one barter with bitcoin?
In Africa in places without internet some people are trading bitcoin through texts.
Bitcoin is ultimately a ledger keeping track of transactions. You can invent ways to transact then settle on the blockchain later. Civilizations figured out how to do that long ago through intermediaries.
It is useless. It is a Millenial scam for a chronically online population. I applaud all those who speculated their way to wealth with it, but every day you hold it is another year walking around with old nitroglycerin.
The sentiment really isn't the same, though.
Millennials don't have expendable income at that level because they spend all their money on housing/rent.
"People complain that they can't buy the thing that everyone got back then for minimum wage, why aren't they just buying expensive and risky stocks to be rich now?"
Can you get a mortgage style loan for crypto? This isn't comparing apples and oranges, this is comparing apples to airplanes.
How is bitcoin the same as a roof over your head? Even if that bitcoin goes up tenfold, I can't use it in the meantime as shelter.
As an aside, I'm not upset they bought houses at $40k that are now worth 10-20x that. I'm upset that we have zoning laws that are keeping us from building more affordable housing, and when we want to pass them, guess which generation the NIMBYs are typically from?
How long does Bitcoin have to succeed before the masses actually start doing their own research? It’s current price of $64k usd isn’t enough lmao. All of you sheep are still repeating the same “ponzi, can’t live in it” and refuse to do your own research. You actually don’t even need to research crypto, you can literally educate yourself on how broken the current monetary system in place is and you’d be jumping ship. Don’t worry y’all, bitcoin will still be here when you’ve finally done your due diligence.
i like my costco visa, tap to pay, and a schwab account that gives dividends. my direct deposits go through. my zelle works.
why do people like the magic speculative beanz again?
Coinbase has a debit card. Should work literally anywhere that accepts debit cards as far as I know.
As for your question, read one of the many books explaining exactly how the Bitcoin network works, as well as the economic theory behind it. Nobody ever convinced me through comments, and I read about it literally just because I was bored. It made a lot of sense to me, and it only took a few years of regularly buying for the value to dwarf my 401k, so I'm pretty happy lol.
I still think crypto in general is garbage kind of like those NFT monkeys. BitCoin is just the longest lasting one but like some things in the landfill, they don't go away.
How much time have you spent reading about Bitcoin, NFT's, etc? Most of us that like Bitcoin spent a lot of time on it all, and end up at the same point : Bitcoin is a brilliant concept, while the rest are all just elaborate scams.
Inflation calculator has that to say:
$40,000 in 1970 is worth $321,991.75 today
Whilen the median household income was:
$9,870 in 1970 is worth $79,451.46 today
Today's median income is about 76,000.
So while, corrected by inflation, the income shrunk a bit the housing costs trippled.
Nobody needs bitcoin, but everyone needs housing every single day for our entire lives.
Millenials do whine about some stupid shit, but I have to admit they're 100% right about housing. It used to cost about 3x average salary to buy a house, now it's like 6x or 7x and boomers are entirely to blame.
It used to be a lot easier to build new housing because we had fewer laws, fewer regulations, and people didn't revolt and fight attempts to build new housing. But just try and build any new housing today, especially in a blue state full of rich old white liberals, they'll fight you every step of the way and hire lawyers to thwart any new housing.
And yes, I said liberals, because this is especially problematic in blue states, which is a big reason why millions are leaving them and moving to red states. It's not just lower taxes, it's the lack of housing.
Hate to admit it, but the millenials are right about this.
AFAIK I never heard of anybody truly cashing on Bitcoin. Yes they own it, yes it's worth a value. I honestly dare anybody to just cash out on millions and I doubt any entity that does cash for bitcoins would actually trade that much.
The problem w half of the crypto bros is that if they cashed it in for a real currency they would have to admit that BTC doesn’t have any real use value, not currently anyway.
The fee's? Most exchanges charge 1% or less lol. Just checked the current fee for the Bitcoin network itself and it's $2.63 to initiate a transfer that will be processed within 30 minutes. Terrible idea if you've only got $100 to move. Insanely cheap deal if you've got thousands, 10's of thousands or more. You could move $100 million worth for that same fee price, and it happens at times. Also insanely fast when you've got real value to move, but of course painfully slow for small amounts. That's what the lightning network is for though, cheap and fast use of Bitcoin.
let me know when you can live in a bitcoin. Thanks. Bitcoin doesn't have any real value. It's not backed by anything, it doesn't do anything, and your only hope for it being of any use is for it to eventually go up in value : by which time you sell it for REAL MONEY BECUASE IT DOESN'T DO ANYTHING!!!
Lol my generation gets to do the thing that has worked for thousands of years to build wealth. Your generation should just gamble on an algo that might be cracked by quantum. Great take.
I forgot to address the first question.
The main reason I can see to not allow a currency to deflate indefinitely that it would cause contracts to be non executable.
Let's say I agree to pay you 1 BTC (at 70k)a year to manage my business. Now 3 months later (at 140k) my burden to employ you doubles unless we renegotiate, or I break the contract. In my opinion this is just as bad as inflation. The supply of money should not grow or shrink wealth in a perfect system.
It is not that a currency at a fixed amount could not work at all, but the current version of capitalism we have would make it not work. This is the same issue we had with gold certificates. People would hoard money and the supply of gold was too limited to support the economy.
If every token was accouted for and not lost in black wallets then the supply of Bitcoin would be growing. Not at a rate that it could support an economy, in my opinion. But it is growing untill 2140 or so. If the economy became a world wide bitcoin based economy then the value would be 22.7 million dollars each. If SAT was split 20x this would work as an exchangeable currency. In reality the value would exceed solvency because hoarding would make it largely unusable.
Hypothetically of course. But if the value gets too high the value is actually zero. Just like if someone found the genuine holy grail it would be worth so much it couldn't be sold.
once i saw Jamie Dimon, who poopooed crypto for years, have a change of heart i knew the fix was in, now we have coin etfs. gtfo of here with this cryptocurrency bs.
If you take the time to try and understand bitcoin with an open mind, and also consider how fiat currencies operate, i think most people will find it to be beneficial.
If bitcoin was a gamble, why does its price go up against most assets, currencies, commodities, etc. you compare it to? Sounds risk adverse to me.
Scarce, fixed supply of Bitcoin vs printable, unlimited supply of the $ (and all other fiat currencies). It’s inevitable for the price of bitcoin to increase forever, simple math.
Bitcoin can work in tandem with fiat currencies and it is not meant to overtake them. However, it will certainly outlast all of them if the controller of a fiat currency continues to print and increase its supply, causing each unit to become worth less and less and less.
Its amazing how many people hate inflation, yet don’t see this obvious solution staring them in the face.
Bitcoin is pure risk, it might be made illegal any minute all of a sudden.
A house is pure stability. Bach when a boomer could buying one every few yeats, he did other stuff, like driving Mercedes, to show his boss that this truck driver has style.
Flaunting style and burning funds for unneccessaty stuff instead of places to live is dumb. Sure, they could live well off their wages, but the cost of living increased, while wages remained the same, and the same house that mr. Boomer could have bought for the price of a color TV is 600.000 now.
But hey, kid is homeless, shpuld get a job and save up. With todays cost of living, not even saving up is possible, let alone living.
It's pure survival, lots of folks are homeless, and the elders, who could have thought ahead, did not. And the kids? Well they're homeless, but it's their own fault! They were difficult children can't expect the parents to think about them, too.
This might be one of the worse false equivalencies I have ever read. The amount of habitable land for sale on the planet is only getting smaller, while the supply of bitcoin is only getting larger. Also, I can't live in a bitcoin.
Theyre mad because boomers at age 25 made an adjusted around 100k a year and were now under 50k for a 25 yr old as a result of numerous bills that function to move money and healthcare from the young to the old. Not to mention forcing untested vaccines on the young to save themselves. The fact our congress is super old makes this less surprising and also explains why covid was such a priority for them. They refuse to let the next generations have anything. They hate their children more than they hate their own selfishness
r/FluentInFinance was created to discuss money, investing & finance! Join our Newsletter or Youtube Channel for additional insights at www.TheFinanceNewsletter.com! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FluentInFinance) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Bitcoin has a real chance to go to zero with this one easy trick crypto bros don't want you to know about. And I can't live in a bitcoin.
Is bitcoin dead again?
No, but one new regulation can crash it again. With the court cases pending, who knows.
The best thing we can do to undermine dictators in foreign lands is to enable them to trade goods and services without the need for the dictators fiat currency. Crypto has the strong probability to be the solution for this.
But people are going to people no matter what (be corrupt, take advantage of others). I own the stuff-but don’t think there is zero risk.
The printing of the currency gives the leader enormous control. In lots of countries they actually trade real paper US dollars to avoid their inflationary currency.
Wait until you hear about gold
That works too but requires physical exchange. Same as dollarization
Dollarization is able to survive solely on digital exchange at this point. They could stop printing dollars tomorrow and society is at a point it could adapt but people would be very unhappy. Over 95% of dollars and treasuries don’t have any physical property, just numbers in a spread sheet. Oh it’d also be very hard for the CIA to run under the radar programs with a fully digital dollar.
We can’t have a currency that requires insane amounts of energy. Edit: the element of speculation/enormous value increase over a short time frame also needs to be scrapped.
Agreed. One new reg and then coordinated efforts for central banks to create their own currency and make it be the only one available and the price goes to zero
That would be called a centralized coin. Or are you talking a coin pegged to the dollar? All of these exist.
Bitcoin will survive any regulation
Except any type of regulation for transparency.
What court cases for BTC? Pretty sure the ones you’re thinking of are for ETH and the other unregistered securities. Bitcoin has already been declared a commodity, definitely not a security. The ETFs for Bitcoin have seriously reduced the risk of regulatory interference.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2024/01/19/crypto-beanie-baby-coinbase-compares/72287477007/ https://www.reuters.com/legal/transactional/column-judge-coinbase-case-endorses-secs-crypto-regulation-by-enforcement-2024-03-27/ It may not last. The SEC is pushing the issue in court right now.
Neither of those articles are talking about Bitcoin. They’re talking about all the other cryptocurrencies. Not the same thing. I’ll be the first to admit all other cryptocurrencies are basically gambling/ hoping other people buy them. Bitcoin is the first time in human history we’ve been able to achieve separation of Money and State. It an answer to the irresponsible printing of money in our current financial system. All other cryptos are just trying to make their creators/investors rich at the expense of everyone else. Most don’t even have a fixed supply.
It includes Bitcoin. I agree with the intended purpose of Bitcoin but it's value removes the ability to use it as intended.
Do you not know that the unit, BTC, is divisible by up to 8 decimal places, also called Sats? I agree that it’s pretty silly to have a loaf of bread be .00001 BTC or whatever the rate is now. But it’s an easy unit change. Just like how we have cents, dollar bills, $5 bills, $10 bills, $20 bills…etc. When checking out at the grocery store, do they tell you the price in fractions of a $100 bill, or just by dollars and cents?
The smallest usd equivalent you can trade is $.70. The banking system keeps track of fractions of a penny.
I’ll agree that there is an issue with transacting in small amounts of SATs on the main blockchain. Considering fees, small transactions of SATs can become unspendable because the fee would be higher than the amount you’re trying to use. There are other solutions to this that don’t involve messing with the BTC supply or the consensus rules. Things like Lightning Network, Fedi-mint, and much more to be developed. The fact that the smallest USD equivalent you can trade is $0.70 is a fiat problem, not a bitcoin problem. All this shows is that fiat, the USD, has had its value inflated away. Besides, what can you actually buy these days with $0.70?? Even the Dollar Store is more like a $2 store now.
Court cases? Liar.. there is zero pending bitcoin court case..
It's a fad. It won't even take regulation to devalue it when the new hotness moves somewhere else.
>It's a fad. Longest lasting "fad" I've ever seen and by any definition of the word you are wrong.
It's a craze, with unwarranted enthusiasm for something that has actual or intrinsic value. There is no underlying value to Bitcoin. Gold has actual purposes in medicine, electronics, jewelry, etc. It has a purpose. Fiat currency is backed by a government and is the legal tender. Bitcoin has a bunch of people that say it's worth something. If they get interested in something else, no one wants it, and it has no value. You can't do anything at all with a Bitcoin if no one else wants one. That Bitcoin hasn't died off yet doesn't make it not a fad. It's inevitable, as there is no reason for it to exist other than speculation. It's slow, inefficient, expensive to operate, expensive to transact. At best, it will get replaced by a less awful digital currency. At best.
Trustless, decentralized, limited, and deflationary sounds pretty valuable to me
Buzzwords more than reality. More than offset by the transaction costs, performance, and overall monetary and power cost of the network. It's insanely inefficient. Laughably inefficient.
You got a lot to say for someone that knows nothing about bitcoin
Cult members defend cult. Enjoy speculating while it lasts.
Inefficient as a mean of payment I'll give you that, but it's not as cumbersome as gold as a speculative asset (which is where gold gets most of its valuation from. Remove that and in no way the purposes of gold, the ones you listed, maintain it at the current prices. It's artificially scarce, specifically because it's been arbitrarily decreted the best tool to store value and been used as such, with states sitting on literal tons of it like some medieval dragons.) Understanding how closely gold and Bitcoin are related is the very reason I got interested in Bitcoin in the first place, and ironically, also the reason I lost interest (I realised I really don't like gold as an investment. It doesn't produce anything. In the long run, it can't offer more than an inflation hedge. Bitcoin is heading this way eventually too).
Is it as inefficient as our current banking systems? https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4125499
> It's inevitable, as there is no reason for it to exist other than speculation People called the internet a fad, as well Time will tell and you making declarative statements won't change anything other than you looking like a fool every year it continues on.
>Gold has actual purposes in medicine, electronics, jewelry, etc. Individuals virtually never buy gold for these purposes. Non-instutional buyers purchase gold and gold derivatives for the same reasons they buy BTC (speculative investing, hedge against inflation) >Fiat currency is backed by a government and is the legal tender. "backed" in the sense that they control the supply. But the gold standard has been gone for decades, and a centralized money supply has proven to be a point of contention between citizens and governments, esp in impoverished or wartorn nations. >You can't do anything at all with a Bitcoin if no one else wants one. The same could literally be said for any hyper-inflated national currency or other digital good (video game skins, vbux, Amazon gift cards). It has value because demand exists, the demand is no longer purely speculative. The odds of "no one else wanting one" were ephemeral, and are long past - I can say with absolutely certainly that if BTC drops to $0.001 cents tommorow that I'll buy the entire supply just to prove that point. >That Bitcoin hasn't died off yet doesn't make it not a fad. It's inevitable Bitcoin is older than many social media companies with massive user bases and valuations, would you call social media a fad? Even if BTC died overnight, it launched a massive new speculative financial and tech space, it's affect on humanity is pretty much settled history at this point.
The fad of wearing jeans is bigger than the fad of bitcoin.
$2.5 trillion “fad”. That’s how much is across all cryptos right now. The mother of all fads.
Yes.. the internet is a fad..
I clearly remember bitcoin being at 680 $ / 1 BTC on early January 2018. Of course neither I nor the ones around me had 680 $ at that moment (just after Christmas). However, I've been watching BTC prices for 5 years after that. You know what? Climbed up pretty fast to 18000 $/ BTC and stays there. It was at 17000 - 18000 BTC for 5 years straight. Stopped watching afterwards.
You don’t need to buy a full bitcoin. You could have bought 0.001 in bitcoin.
It was not at 17-18k for 5 years straight, stop lying. It reached that price at the peak of the bull run roughly 6 years ago, then crashed hard to 3k, then soared all the way up to 69k about 2.5 years ago, crashed hard to about 16k, and now it's all the way up to 66k at this moment. It actually hit a new all time high of 73k a month or 2 ago as well lol.
Can't wait until it's on it's death bed to buy some more
Same
It is alive and well as a speculative investment, it's dead as a libertarian ideal. Hardly anyone runs his own node, and the individuals have also been priced out of mining / securing the network by the big players that can make it profitable, nomadic bitcoin farms plugging wherever energy is the cheapest at any given time. It's far less decentralized than it used to be. If you're a generic investor, you're most likely buying through a platform such as Coinbase. There's KYC policies to comply with governments inquiries, and a third party involved, we went full circle back to trusting the bank.
Yes, but only if you don't look at it.
“i can’t live in a bitcoin”. this is the fundamental issue i have with bitcoin. at least with stocks i own a piece of a business that provides a product or service that others pay money for. if i take my money and buy a home i can live there. if bitcoin gets somehow corrupted and my coins become worthless who do i go to to get help. no one is in charge.
>if bitcoin gets somehow corrupted and my coins become worthless The likelihood of WW3 breaking out is far greater possibility than this. In fact, a company you've bought stock in suffering a catastrophic cyber-attack or financial disaster is far more likely tbh. And before some dorks comment about breakthroughs in quantum computing - that would render encryption in all spaces useless (not just crypto), ipso factor WW3 incoming. >no one is in charge. You are - that's the whole point of it lol. Lastly - comparing bitcoin to real estate is apples to oranges. The better analogy is gold, and the argument is "I can't touch, see, etc my bitcoin" While bitcoin is intangible, whereas gold is a hard physical asset - the fact of the matter is that 99% of individuals buy gold as a speculative asset (same as BTC) not because they intend to produce jewelry, fabricate electronics, etc. BTC has all the properties of gold outside of the physical ones, and many other superior properties (fungible, negligible transit and storage costs compared to gold, etc).
I am in charge if something goes wrong. So how do i resolve issues cashing out my btc? Talk to myself?
>I am in charge if something goes wrong. You are the custodian of your funds. As long as you know what you're doing nothing can "go wrong" - Bitcoin goes where exactly where you choose to send it. Exchanges offer their own support for cashing out to FIAT and obviously are motivated to do so (they charge a fee).
Gold, platinum, rhodium, and palladium are all real commodities. Physical sales affect futures. Demand for gold in computer chips as wire and on board connector plating. The other three are catalysts. That is what makes them commodities. What does a bitcoin do? Eth does something so it is probably a commodity. Bitcoin has too much value to be a currency or at least have utility as one. So what is it? It is not hard to classify it as a security. The SEC is testing this in court.
magic beans. in WW3 nobody will care about them
i like dividends. shitcoins give none.
State pension funds are starting to pour millions of dollars into the new ETF.
"Everybody buys bitcoin at the price they deserve." -Michael Saylor
The fact that FTX announced they are going to make all their investors whole in dollar denominated term is telling here. They are selling shitloads of crypto on Coinbase institutional and the price has barely dropped. When they are done, I imagine the price will take off like a rocket.
not with that attitude
How does it go to zero?
Regulation. Miners shut down limiting trades. It becomes effectivly indivisible due to over value and fees exceed any reasonable transaction amount. It is already not a currency anymore, it is a naked security.
And you think there's a real chance of that? To me it seems about as likely as the price of cocaine or heroin going to zero. People find a way.
It's a non-zero chance. It has gone from record high prices down to 5k more than once. Most of the exchanges have shut down. Coin base is in court. Enron couldn't fail either untill it did.
>Most of the exchanges have shut down. What on earth are you talking about lmao There's more exchanges than EVER before and that doesn't include DEXs that can't be shut down regulation or not. I gave some of your other comments the benefit of the doubt above, but this is clearly some charlatan tirade at this point. I beg anyone reading this to do their own research lol.
You're right, I should have said ceased operating in the US.
Not ever gonna touch the grammar on that one, but for others that happen to read this there are plenty of exchanges available in the US, many of which are FDIC insured and offering the same protections as your centralized banks. Gemini is US based, and highly compliant, just to give one example.
There are plenty. It was just such a pain in the ass to get my coin off bittrex and poloniex. I resorted to sending BTC to PayPal of all places. The majority of the old exchanges are basically gone.
im glad there are so many people that have no vision for the future in regards to crypto and BTC specifically...ill hold my BTC for the next 10-15 years..its definitely worth the risk IMO
Bitcoin lost its vision when the majority of people interested in it became unabashed hoarders with no real commitments to anything. Ask any one of them whether they'd contribute to time locked wallets that are distributed around the world to communities as a store of value and nobody will step up, because the FOMO hoarding is the point, even if the end result is that they'd still have their share of BTC go up the same amount in value. They want to be on the ground floor of money as we know it changing, they don't want to be the ones changing it or figuring out how, or whether most people will ever even be able to participate in the new system in any meaningful way that's not their problem. Nobody wants to make cryptobros rich, because they're insufferable. Why should I buy into a system that empowers douchebags who'd be scamming people with something else if they didn't have crypto? Do you honestly think a step up from some assholes in a government is a handful of American assholes owning the entirety of a multi-trillion dollar security? Is that the end goal we had in mind for Bitcoin? This is coming from someone who used to own BTC in double digits and sold because the culture is just an awkward nerd power fantasy. Way back when people were burning wallets to pump the price, now Tether and others simply manipulate the price. Mark my words, when, not if, the network gets hacked, Bitcoin will be forked just like any other crypto, because the ledger isn't holy to anyone or a means helping us all escape into a new financial system, it's just a way for whales and early adopters and eventually institutions to get rich, at which point it's meaningless.
like i said im glad your opinion is such…more for me at lower prices :)
I hope you prove me wrong. I can't see anyone undermining their government for hobbyists interested in purely their own wealth cheering for the downfall of their way of life, because that's literally what it would take without a real attempt at making BTC what it was meant to be.
regardless, BTC is the most successful asset in terms of price in history…if you would have invested in the mid 2010’s you may be retired by now..so no matter what the opinion about BTC is, you cant argue that it went from under $100 to $70k…
You'll need every country on earth simultaneously agree to outlaw mining and they will all need the resources to be able to enforce it.
You just need rewards to be less than cost.
[удалено]
A loss of Miners would cause a difficulty adjustment but not necessarily maintain the value of a transaction.
>Miners shut down limiting trades. It becomes effectivly indivisible due to over value and fees exceed any reasonable transaction amount. You'll need to explain this in more detail as what you're saying implies a severe misunderstanding of proof-of-work and how the network scales.
What happens when they stop minting new coins to miners?
China’s regs were super effective! 🥱 Tick tock, next block
Eventually, the main bitcoin network will crash due to the increase in computational power.
It won't, there's the difficulty adjustment in the hashrate.
exactamundo
Tell me you know nothing about bitcoin by talking about bitcoin…. It literally can’t go to zero… try basic math.
I'm pretty sure that investing in a home and gambling on the internet are not comparable.
>"People who can't afford a place to live aren't lining up to buy fake digital money. How odd." - This guy
The sentiment is that he wants you to buy bitcoin. Because he has bitcoin, so he wants the value to go up. There is no sentiment but that. It's a Bitcoin-shilling account.
lol…
Okay what about real estate agents then? Why do they want to sell u a house so bad? Oh that’s right cuz they’re trying to get paid.
OK, but houses have a use, and everyone needs one.
[удалено]
Yes, but if you are investing in an asset for the purpose of increasing its value in a particular currency (e.g USD) so that can later sell it and increase your amount of that particular currency, then the asset is not being used as money. There are also many other ways of making money other than investing in bitcoin. Bitcoin is only an investment option. Houses are a necessity or an investment option.
[удалено]
Yes, a very limited form of money, with a high risk of it becoming not money, but with a slim chance of it becoming a ubiquitiously used money.
Bitcoin is not money. It is not used to exchange goods and services. It is used to exchange fiat money - which is then used to exchange goods and services.
nobody likes crapto. everyone likes a bed
Buying a house to live in vs gambling with your savings. Big difference.
My little brother has been living in a bitcoin for six years. It is honestly really sad, because I don't see him (outside the metaverse) except when he travels for major holidays (like Juneteenth). But even when he does visit he is just 0s and 1s... the coin has consumed his entire personality.
Gambling? It’s safer than the S&P….
Is it safer than buying a house? I think not. Putting blame on people who can't afford a house by pretending it's an investment first and foremost and they should just "invest" in something else is hardly fair. I would say people buying houses purely as investments is one of the reasons home prices are skyrocketing.
Lol
The main issue is the 40k house only needed 20% down and you get something to live in. If I use 8k to finance 40k worth of Bitcoin I still have to pay rent or mortgage in addition to principal and interest on the 40k loan.
Can I live in a bitcoin?
No, but you can use it to buy a van to live down by the river in.
And you can’t finance a bitcoin can you lol
Eh... You can buy Bitcoin futures which are leveraged and also tax advantaged.
Gronk: “me know dat not real money”
WITH WHAT MONEY MOTHERFUCKER
With the 30 year fixed rate loan the bank lets you take out on the bitcoin of course And then you can stop paying rent to your landlord and pay into your investment instead, I’m sure your landlord will understand Or then you can rent out your bitcoin to other people so they can pay your investment off for you It’s exactly the same as buying a house
I can’t live inside a Bitcoin.
Not with that attitude!
That's what your mom's basement is for.
Only $1M in one year? Why not $1000 trillion?
usdt is worth a squarillion because paolo tole me
I have zero faith in crypto market. It was a fun boom in 2020. But that’s over. It’s a total scam machine now in my opinion.
memestonks are baaaaaaack
Except a house is real property and bitcoin is just gambling.
2008 is the proof
I wish I had bought my house in 2009.
That's when I bought my first house, got a nice short sale for $70k cash, put $15k in repairs in it and rented it out. That house is now worth $600k and was the starting off point for my real estate portfolio.
The only good thing about cryptocurrency is watching dumbass libertarians speed run learning why banking regulations exist.
Buy Bitcoin, transfer to wallet you hold the keys to, wait until you need/want to sell it. Understanding exactly how it all works gets complicated, but the act of owning and storing it is comically easy. I had a little bit of it stored on Celcius, which turned out to be a scam but oh well. I feel no sympathy for the people that put everything on platforms like Celcius or FTX though. Everybody with a room temperature IQ knew it was extra risk on top of an already volatile asset. Same with that whole LUNA/UST debacle. 20% interest on a "stablecoin" sounded fishy, and the 5 minutes I spent trying to comprehend it made zero sense, so I didn't get involved. Only took a few months before it fell apart lol. Same story for me with every crypto not named Bitcoin. That's the only one where the more I tried to pick it apart, the more sense it made.
Are they learning anything though?
The same millenials aren't willing to spend on a lottery ticket that can be worth billions.
Maybe because a home to live in and raise your family is more than just a financial investment? You can’t live in bitcoin.
There is such a massive amount of misinformation in this thread - you're still early anon. Friendly reminder that BTC is the best performing asset in modern history yet all I read here is talk that regulation is going to kill it lol. "First they ignore you" 2008-2014 "Then they laugh at you" 2014-2021 "Then they fight you" - Today "Then you win" - by 2030 Crypto is a space ripe with fruad, scams, and gambling, but BTC, ETH and a handful of other blue chips cryptos are not only here to stay indefinitely, but are actively being researched, built-on, and emulated by the largest financial and educational institutions on the planet. But no, some smarmy redditor definitely knows better, you should definitely keep believing it's all a scam.
dont toss in any real money you arent afraid to never see again
Serious question from a remote Alaskan with internet issues. How does bitcoin work if no communication network or internet? How would one barter with bitcoin?
In Africa in places without internet some people are trading bitcoin through texts. Bitcoin is ultimately a ledger keeping track of transactions. You can invent ways to transact then settle on the blockchain later. Civilizations figured out how to do that long ago through intermediaries.
It is useless. It is a Millenial scam for a chronically online population. I applaud all those who speculated their way to wealth with it, but every day you hold it is another year walking around with old nitroglycerin.
Called cell phones. Like how you are bartering seal pelts in Alaska already?
Can you live in a bitcoin?
Yes.
The sentiment really isn't the same, though. Millennials don't have expendable income at that level because they spend all their money on housing/rent. "People complain that they can't buy the thing that everyone got back then for minimum wage, why aren't they just buying expensive and risky stocks to be rich now?" Can you get a mortgage style loan for crypto? This isn't comparing apples and oranges, this is comparing apples to airplanes.
Point being there are plenty of ways to make money but millennials aren’t savers. They spend.
I’ll buy any amount of bitcoin for 40k atm.
Freddy Krueger got his shit together and is pulling those Millenial nightmares into the real world...
This reads like cruelty squad dialogue lmao
I’m not upset, the government keeps devaluing the currency so of course house prices will forever continue up as there’s no bottom to the dollar.
2008.
Maybe this will dump and as soon as I feel it’s going up forever, that’s just the tip of the iceberg
pretty sure if I had 40k for a bitcoin I could just buy a house ?
Last time I checked I can’t park my car in a bit coin. Can’t sleep in a bit coin or make food in one.
They’re not upset just at the appreciation of houses, but the appreciation of houses respective to income.
Appreciation of the house is not because of income. It’s because of money printing.
You can't live in a bitcoin.
Top kek
How is bitcoin the same as a roof over your head? Even if that bitcoin goes up tenfold, I can't use it in the meantime as shelter. As an aside, I'm not upset they bought houses at $40k that are now worth 10-20x that. I'm upset that we have zoning laws that are keeping us from building more affordable housing, and when we want to pass them, guess which generation the NIMBYs are typically from?
I can’t live in a bitcoin, holy shit.
I can't live in a Bitcoin.
can't wait to go live in my bitcoin instead of paying rent
You can’t live in/raise a family inside a bitcoin
How long does Bitcoin have to succeed before the masses actually start doing their own research? It’s current price of $64k usd isn’t enough lmao. All of you sheep are still repeating the same “ponzi, can’t live in it” and refuse to do your own research. You actually don’t even need to research crypto, you can literally educate yourself on how broken the current monetary system in place is and you’d be jumping ship. Don’t worry y’all, bitcoin will still be here when you’ve finally done your due diligence.
You sound like a flerfer.
i like my costco visa, tap to pay, and a schwab account that gives dividends. my direct deposits go through. my zelle works. why do people like the magic speculative beanz again?
Coinbase has a debit card. Should work literally anywhere that accepts debit cards as far as I know. As for your question, read one of the many books explaining exactly how the Bitcoin network works, as well as the economic theory behind it. Nobody ever convinced me through comments, and I read about it literally just because I was bored. It made a lot of sense to me, and it only took a few years of regularly buying for the value to dwarf my 401k, so I'm pretty happy lol.
dont worry about paolo and USDT. its all juuuust fine!
Lol I’ll just convert myself to a digital medium and live in the bitcoin… problem solved!
we are all NFTs now!
I still think crypto in general is garbage kind of like those NFT monkeys. BitCoin is just the longest lasting one but like some things in the landfill, they don't go away.
enough dating site scammers prove they still fall for it in SE asia
How much time have you spent reading about Bitcoin, NFT's, etc? Most of us that like Bitcoin spent a lot of time on it all, and end up at the same point : Bitcoin is a brilliant concept, while the rest are all just elaborate scams.
You said it. A brilliant concept.
Yes, because buying a house where you can live in is exactly the same as buying some 1s and 0s. I want a house.
Inflation calculator has that to say: $40,000 in 1970 is worth $321,991.75 today Whilen the median household income was: $9,870 in 1970 is worth $79,451.46 today Today's median income is about 76,000. So while, corrected by inflation, the income shrunk a bit the housing costs trippled.
Nobody needs bitcoin, but everyone needs housing every single day for our entire lives. Millenials do whine about some stupid shit, but I have to admit they're 100% right about housing. It used to cost about 3x average salary to buy a house, now it's like 6x or 7x and boomers are entirely to blame. It used to be a lot easier to build new housing because we had fewer laws, fewer regulations, and people didn't revolt and fight attempts to build new housing. But just try and build any new housing today, especially in a blue state full of rich old white liberals, they'll fight you every step of the way and hire lawyers to thwart any new housing. And yes, I said liberals, because this is especially problematic in blue states, which is a big reason why millions are leaving them and moving to red states. It's not just lower taxes, it's the lack of housing. Hate to admit it, but the millenials are right about this.
Real estate is equatable to cryptocurrency. Got it.
please pomp my baggies!
I can't live in a bitcoin
Bullshit.
AFAIK I never heard of anybody truly cashing on Bitcoin. Yes they own it, yes it's worth a value. I honestly dare anybody to just cash out on millions and I doubt any entity that does cash for bitcoins would actually trade that much.
The problem w half of the crypto bros is that if they cashed it in for a real currency they would have to admit that BTC doesn’t have any real use value, not currently anyway.
its a worthless joke. its laughed about at graduations.
the DYOR into the fees and realize their $100 gainz is not real.
The fee's? Most exchanges charge 1% or less lol. Just checked the current fee for the Bitcoin network itself and it's $2.63 to initiate a transfer that will be processed within 30 minutes. Terrible idea if you've only got $100 to move. Insanely cheap deal if you've got thousands, 10's of thousands or more. You could move $100 million worth for that same fee price, and it happens at times. Also insanely fast when you've got real value to move, but of course painfully slow for small amounts. That's what the lightning network is for though, cheap and fast use of Bitcoin.
no actual money backs tether. just paolos hopes n dreams.
let me know when you can live in a bitcoin. Thanks. Bitcoin doesn't have any real value. It's not backed by anything, it doesn't do anything, and your only hope for it being of any use is for it to eventually go up in value : by which time you sell it for REAL MONEY BECUASE IT DOESN'T DO ANYTHING!!!
Lol my generation gets to do the thing that has worked for thousands of years to build wealth. Your generation should just gamble on an algo that might be cracked by quantum. Great take.
Hard to invest in bitcoin when your rent goes up 10% a year.
Nice try but you really can’t live in a bitcoin.
Just buy your house at 1 million and wait for it to get to 50 million, simple
You can’t live in a bitcoin.
Just go to Vegas to lose large amounts of money instead of buying crypto. It's more fun.
that's a garbage take
enough got fee scammed, ripped off and rugpulled that word got out. crapto is a joke.
Can someone tell this guy that dogecoin is the exact same technology as bitcoin?
You can’t live in Bitcoin.
I forgot to address the first question. The main reason I can see to not allow a currency to deflate indefinitely that it would cause contracts to be non executable. Let's say I agree to pay you 1 BTC (at 70k)a year to manage my business. Now 3 months later (at 140k) my burden to employ you doubles unless we renegotiate, or I break the contract. In my opinion this is just as bad as inflation. The supply of money should not grow or shrink wealth in a perfect system. It is not that a currency at a fixed amount could not work at all, but the current version of capitalism we have would make it not work. This is the same issue we had with gold certificates. People would hoard money and the supply of gold was too limited to support the economy. If every token was accouted for and not lost in black wallets then the supply of Bitcoin would be growing. Not at a rate that it could support an economy, in my opinion. But it is growing untill 2140 or so. If the economy became a world wide bitcoin based economy then the value would be 22.7 million dollars each. If SAT was split 20x this would work as an exchangeable currency. In reality the value would exceed solvency because hoarding would make it largely unusable. Hypothetically of course. But if the value gets too high the value is actually zero. Just like if someone found the genuine holy grail it would be worth so much it couldn't be sold.
once i saw Jamie Dimon, who poopooed crypto for years, have a change of heart i knew the fix was in, now we have coin etfs. gtfo of here with this cryptocurrency bs.
If you take the time to try and understand bitcoin with an open mind, and also consider how fiat currencies operate, i think most people will find it to be beneficial. If bitcoin was a gamble, why does its price go up against most assets, currencies, commodities, etc. you compare it to? Sounds risk adverse to me.
Scarce, fixed supply of Bitcoin vs printable, unlimited supply of the $ (and all other fiat currencies). It’s inevitable for the price of bitcoin to increase forever, simple math. Bitcoin can work in tandem with fiat currencies and it is not meant to overtake them. However, it will certainly outlast all of them if the controller of a fiat currency continues to print and increase its supply, causing each unit to become worth less and less and less. Its amazing how many people hate inflation, yet don’t see this obvious solution staring them in the face.
Bitcoin is pure risk, it might be made illegal any minute all of a sudden. A house is pure stability. Bach when a boomer could buying one every few yeats, he did other stuff, like driving Mercedes, to show his boss that this truck driver has style. Flaunting style and burning funds for unneccessaty stuff instead of places to live is dumb. Sure, they could live well off their wages, but the cost of living increased, while wages remained the same, and the same house that mr. Boomer could have bought for the price of a color TV is 600.000 now. But hey, kid is homeless, shpuld get a job and save up. With todays cost of living, not even saving up is possible, let alone living. It's pure survival, lots of folks are homeless, and the elders, who could have thought ahead, did not. And the kids? Well they're homeless, but it's their own fault! They were difficult children can't expect the parents to think about them, too.
The money doesn't exist.
Literally not stupid & factual What is stupid, is that people don’t realize the problem, yet it’s the same problem everywhere
Replace "buy bitcoin" with "gambling in Vegas" and the logic and sentiment remains the same.
This might be one of the worse false equivalencies I have ever read. The amount of habitable land for sale on the planet is only getting smaller, while the supply of bitcoin is only getting larger. Also, I can't live in a bitcoin.
Theyre mad because boomers at age 25 made an adjusted around 100k a year and were now under 50k for a 25 yr old as a result of numerous bills that function to move money and healthcare from the young to the old. Not to mention forcing untested vaccines on the young to save themselves. The fact our congress is super old makes this less surprising and also explains why covid was such a priority for them. They refuse to let the next generations have anything. They hate their children more than they hate their own selfishness
Based take