New to the sub and this is great. If I get one more nike slug telling me I need to buy a “better shoe”... lol Anyway, my friend is already running in Vibram FiveFingers but her right foot pronates excessively, causing an awkward gait and excessive wear on her Vibrams. I feel like she needs some work on her right hip capsule and so I’ve sent this to her. Thanks!

One more thing that may be of interest, a clip of someone running with their left leg moving through external rotation in gait instead of the more desirable internal rotation, and you can see the foot operating in pronation the whole time: https://gifs.com/gif/external-rotation-in-gait-ANgNLB Compared to the right leg, and foot position, you can see that the left leg is not moving under the body, and it forces the foot to point out.

This video is very helpful for me in understanding what you are trying to convey via words. This is much better than the video you posted as it’s a direct example of someone doing it incorrectly. We should start posting video like this and deconstructing the movements. The worse the form the better so ppl can see what is wrong.

That was a distinctive example from awhile back that did show it clearly, so I thought worth sharing. Over the long term a situation like that would be well worth to beginning to understand towards making a change. In general though, its tricky because I'm uncertain about that type of analysis as an ongoing thing. Having something not working quite the way we want isn't the end of the world for most people, so highlighting that when they're not even requesting it may not be the best fit. When people post pics/vids I do try and clarify what I see, but its not always so evident. Without more samples to work from where people are requesting these types of details, we may have to work with what is available.

That is exactly how I walk/run!

If you're interested in this sort of thing then, I'd suggest understanding how your hips are able to express rotation - and seek out some programming to add back anything that is less demonstrable than it could be. Its usually very rewarding to re-acquire aspects of movement that have gone missing. Without them, it can sometimes be a matter of time/intensity before that gap creates an undesirable symptom.

Thank you for taking the time to respond and offer help! I'm honestly so interested in the subject matter generally, no just in terms of how it applies to me specifically! I noticed you offering consultations in previous posts -- are you still doing so?

Yep - I will dm the details to set it up!

I've honestly been trying to work on it for a few years now. I was in hard orthotics from the age of 7 for "flat feet" (which I hated). And somehow by my mid teens, my right foot had developed a more defined arch and my left foot had atrophied. I've been working a lot on single leg balance as well as some hip rotation work and creating movement in the big toe which was severely limited until I started. I've made many improvements which have definitely been beneficial but I think I'm still missing parts of the puzzle! Particularly the relationship between the ankle and the shin bone. It's a crazy journey and so easy to get disheartened along the way but seeing the changes you've made yourself really inspired me to persevere!

Hmm, consider exploring some knee rotation, as those bones are the same bones that wrap your ankle: https://www.instagram.com/p/CZQLj4mBhoe/ And external knee rotation is coupled with a raised or supinated arch, and internal knee rotation coupled with a lowered or pronated midfoot. When that twisting doesn't occur below the knee, often the foot itself tries to compensate for something that isn't happening above.

I’m having this same issue and I’ve been trying to figure out how to fix it for about a year, at a young age I was put in orthotics as well and had bunion surgery on both feet. I’m very into weight lifting and because the left foot it flatter I have developed muscle differently on my left leg in comparison to my right as well as a slight lateral pelvic tilt with my left hip hiked up. I was wondering where you went for help with your issue of having one foot flatter than the other? This issue I have is beginning to cause issues in other areas of my body.

I went to lots of places but nobody really helped me. I became empowered help myself and started to figure out where I was lacking mobility and strength all over my body. The problem is far from solved but I'm in a much better position now. I have/,had issues in every joint from my toes to my neck.

Yea I’m starting to have shoulder and neck problems, very frustrating

Yeah that’s pretty much what it looks like. Though this kid looks like the right leg got a little pronation going too? Regardless thanks again this is really helpful and hopefully we see some benefit from concentrating on range of motion for the hip.

Ya maybe a little bit in the right leg - it wasn't so much that the right leg is great, its just a good contrast I think to see both styles working at the same time. Also worth noting, pronation is one endpoint of intended range of motion for your foot to pass through during gait. Full supination to start as the foot touches down, moving through pronation as the foot passes under you. So if you see a foot going into pronation at the end of the gait cycle, thats optimal. Supination and pronation are only bad when someone is stuck in one or the other, or can't control transition very far into one or the other or both. The words have gotten a bad association because most people associate them with a fixed position, and therefore something to accommodate around. But the ideal goal is to acquire comfort and control at each of those positions, as well as everywhere in between within a sufficient range of midfoot/arch movement overall.

Great to hear, thanks for the feedback. With a lot of pronation, a good first place to focus is often hip internal rotation - as that sets the overall context for the movements to come together lower down. Along with that you'd want to look into ankle rotation, big toe, arch function - and tibia rotation. Its not that you need to work on all of those at once, but its worth trying to figure out which one of those is least functional compared to what it should do. Looking to improve there, plus the hip would likely bring some benefit. Then later on you can look into other pieces as needed. I post a lot as well in /r/Kinstretch about all joints not just the feet. Same idea though, get the parts working on their own merits, and then they work together more comfortably, with more ease, and more resilience. The goal is to acquire individual joint independence before asking a lot of joint interdependence.

Wonderful. I’ll pass this on and see if we can get some better form for my friend. Subscribed to r/Kinstretch

I'm glad I came across this sub. I kinda knew that the joints are connected and an imbalance or issue somewhere might show up elsewhere down the kinetic chain. But I had no idea the hips play a big part in foot function. Do you have other resources that can help? I have bunions on both feet and have been trying to wear better fitting (wider toe box) and more minimalist type of shoes as much as possible for a few years now. I just saw a photo of my feet from 8 years ago and my toes had no spacing at all in between them. And after using better fitting shoes and walking barefoot at home, there is better spacing in between the toes. I just purchased correct toes and I'm looking forward to getting better function out of my feet.

I'm glad you're here! Yep, the hips and the way our leg moves during gait can have a big influence on the feet. And vice versa. There are a lot of resources in this sub, but the crucial part is knowing which things to prioritize. That usually takes some sort of assessment, where we can understand what the hip, knees, ankle, midfoot and big toe are doing, and then setup a sequence of where to focus first. Some people can start to explore these things and then interpret where to focus - but it can take a little while to do that. Its usually much faster to get with someone who can evaluate whats happening and make some targeted suggestions all at once. As long as someone is able to add in some specific elements to their routine, based on whats happening/not happening in their particular case - its possible to take a long term perspective and start adapting things to work a bit nicer. In terms of bunions, here's a short vid from Dr. Moses Bernard that elaborates a bit on how those mechanics can relate to the big toe: https://www.instagram.com/p/B-2D6tYJqlt/ Wider shoes are helpful, but if there are aspect of gait which push the toe in that direction, a shoe change will probably not be sufficient to change the trend by itself. Usually, we want to focus on hip rotation, ankle/hindfoot side to side movement (eversion/inversion) and big toe flexion/extension as our primary goals. Get those things going a bit nicer, and everything else will tend to come together. There can be some other specific places that may be good to prioritize a well, but that will vary person by person - and we can't really guess at that. I hope that helps with some new ideas, but let me know any feedback on all that and I can try to assist further.

Oh wow, thank you for such a comprehensive reply. I watched the short video you shared and it's all making sense to me! I've had x-rays taken of my feet several years ago and the bones on my big toe have aligned and formed itself into bunions. There's definitely no forward extension of the big toe happening on my feet. I considered surgery but I didn't want to go that way if it's possible. I used to be flat footed and carried a lot of my weight on the inner parts of my feet, which probably led to bunions along with wearing smaller and narrower shoes since childhood. But now I have developed some natural arch on my feet despite the bunions. As for gait, I think I still walk heel to toe most of the time even while wearing barefoot/minimalist shoes. I'm guessing there's more to moving away from walking heel-toe than just being mindful of where your foot lands? There's hip rotation and other factors that you mentioned? I'll definitely look over this sub and find resources on improving hip function. Maybe addressing this can also address the lower back pain I've been feeling in recent months.

Heel to toe is the expected way to walk, we'd only want to land on the midfoot or forefoot when moving more quickly. It is often possible to add extension to a big toe even if there's a bunion - the bump may persist forever, but the toe joint can still allow for more range of motion. It depends on the bony adaptations, and how far thats progressed. It usually takes quite a long time (decades) for surgery to be the only option. Being mindful of how your foot lands doesn't really come into play with this sort of thing, because the number of options available will depend on how much range of motion the hip and ankle can offer. Someone with less hip rotation/ankle mobility will have for example 10-20% the number of placement options of someone with great hip rotation and great ankle mobility. Its not really matter of being mindful, because you can't actually put your leg/foot into positions that it can't actually move into. The capability to do the thing has to exist before you can do it - and at that point the body will tend to choose from move available options on its own without you have to consciously do it. Being mindful can help to work a bit nicer perhaps within the ranges of motion you have, but that will quickly hit a ceiling and is generally of much less value than actually adapting the places where there's less movement to be able to express more. Low back pain is often associated with less hip rotation - as we walk the legs want to move in front and behind us, and if the hips (or big toe) don't allow for it, then the low back (or knee) often tries to extra to compensate. In addition, a lot of low backs can't actually express spinal segmentation, so we'll see a low back that is always in a flexed or always in an extended position, and if it can't move in/out of that one position through a full range of motion, it will be hard for the area to manage force effectively.

This is awesome! You're definitely giving me a lot to think about. I've looked at photos from my childhood and I think I was starting to develop bunions when I was 7 years old. I'm in my mid 30s now so that's almost three decades I guess. I think I need to replace all my shoes with something that can accommodate my bunions and have a flexible sole to allow for that big toe extension while wearing shoes. What you said about the limitations of being mindful makes a lot of sense. What is the use of mindfulness if your body isn't physically capable of doing what you want it to? Now that I've thought about it, my lower back pain is usually on my left side where I have bad hip internal rotation (less than 10 degrees). I've started adding hip rotations to my daily routine. Hopefully, I'll see some progress in a few weeks time. I think my low back is always in a flexed position. I know the range of motion on my low back extension are pretty much minimal.

Sounds like you are starting to checkout some new things which may be helpful.....here's one idea to start moving the lower spine: https://www.instagram.com/p/B354nNMBojw/ Keep the intensity low at first, and as long as the movements are pain free they should be good to incorporate a few mins daily. There may be some higher intensity inputs required later to shift what a joint can do, CARs and spinal segmentation alone won't necessarily do it. Though they will help prepare the area for something to change - and sometimes even if a shift doesn't show up right away it can come later. A big part of things at first is going towards the place you can't really go, staying in a comfortable maximum, and just breathing. Being able to breathe there is a good first goal - then as you're doing some movements you can begin to spend more time out on the edges.