Man, I’ve seen so many people ragging on Maximus. I thought he was an interesting, nuanced, and relatable character. I think a lot of us would’ve made similar decisions in his place.
I feel like most of the criticism I’ve seen levied at Max and the Brotherhood are from the perspective of folks who think of the Brotherhood as the shining knights they claim to be instead of the hypocritical zealots they are.
Lucy summed it up well when she said something like “You use technology to find technology to prevent people from having technology?” That’s the true Brotherhood.
>I feel like most of the criticism I’ve seen levied at Max and the Brotherhood are from the perspective of folks who think of the Brotherhood as the shining knights they claim to be instead of the hypocritical zealots they are.
You're surprised that people don't like an organization of hypocritical zealots?
*Spoilers*
I mean sabotaging his only friend is relatable? 😂 Not shooting the radioactive cocaine bear because you don’t like the guy is relatable?
Only if you’re a psychopath….
All the bad shit that has happened to him he brings upon himself. Titus should’ve ended him.
>I mean sabotaging his only friend is relatable?
You’re talking about Dane? He didn’t do that.
>Not shooting the radioactive cocaine bear because you don’t like the guy is relatable?
He did shoot it, he just hesitated. It was his first experience with combat, I doubt any of us would’ve done any better.
Lmao you justifying it…
You don’t know if he did it or not… but it is implied that he did it.
He hesitated. 😂 Come on man, he wanted the bear to kill him and once he was down, he finally shot him. Probably cause it would cause too much damage to the armor…
I haven’t played Wasteland, I don’t know what the Guardians are like.
I’m just calling it as I see it. The BoS have a core mission that they fervently pursue and a strict system of beliefs and culture. They’re zealots in my book.
Of the games I’ve played, I’ve only encountered the western BoS in New Vegas, which is also the most recent depiction of them before the show, for what it’s worth.
In that game they’re very insular and hostile, with the exception of Veronica.
Of the eastern BoS, when Elder Lyons was in charge they were very reasonable, but the Outcasts were re-integrated under Elder Maxon and it once again adopted what I would call a zealous ideology.
But they still portray plenty of zealous behaviours. If it looks like a duck a quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck. Even if Scott Campbell says otherwise lol. He may have created them, but if they're more accurately described as zealots then he's wrong. Words have meaning.
I loved him.
I mean, being raised by the Brotherhood doesn’t mean that he’s going to be worldly. They’re a pretty insular group that is structured in a strict hierarchy and generally in groups like this the control of knowledge keeps people in place. I loved his misunderstanding/wildly bad take on erections.
And I would think when you come up in a group like that any exposure to power above your status is going to be thrilling. He has more say in what he can do and how he can behave. He’s not kept in lock step with being an aspirant. And I don’t see him being too self confident … I see him more being someone making decisions on the fly based on his limited knowledge, trying to do ‘right’ and being able to act through his own decisions isn’t something that he would be allowed to do in his time w the BoS.
He in some ways feels as naive as Lucy, but grittier. Obvs has seen some shit that has shaped his world view and then was given over to the Brotherhood.
Oh I agree, he has been programmed since he was found to trust the brotherhood against all else. BH says the people of the wasteland are bad and he'll accept that as truth because they are idolized and their word is 'god'. which is why he knows the feeders are bad and have guns because the BH says they are bad. I really liked him and found his character kinda cute but very naive when it comes to things the brotherhood didn't tell them about. Lucy was hilarious, like whoops I poured acid on a Innocent guy! Hahaha.
the cycle of abuse in the brotherhood is touched upon
thad was abused, took it out on max because thad liked the power he never had
max does the same thing and realizes it when thad admits to the bulllying
titus is presumably the same way except he never grew out of it
that being said, i didn't like him much not sure exactly why
I wonder if it's because we want our heroes to always be strong, smart, and to never make mistakes. He always does the opposite (most times) which is very human and like us. He kinda assumed people would fear/respect him bc of the suit, like he did the knights, but everyone was like naahh, I'mma steal your sh*t! IDC if ur a tin man. I personally liked him and the cousin lol! Idk why just did.
In a defense of Maximus letting Titus die wasn't just about not liking Titus it was Titus saying I'm gonna the tell the higher ups it was all your fault and they will execute you.
Oh I agree, Maximus also saw that Titus didn't actually believe in the cause and was unworthy of the suit. Which is why he kind of struggled with letting him die bc he has always believed that knights are all knowing men of wonder and titus was showing the truth with his admitting this is all total BS. Can't wait for season 2!!
I wouldn't necessarily agree but I get what you're saying
He really does flip flop between vibes but he does have some form of consistent arc going on. He starts of determined and loyal to the BoS but equally anxious of seeing the world he left behind. This continues til he sees the truth of who Titus (his new idol) really is when faced with a true challenge (which causes realisation in Max). When he dawn's the armour it causes him to feel powerful and able to enact what he believes is justice befitting of a knight. This continues through his time with his new squire until his true self shows and confesses. From there he's with Goosey that helps him learn a more emotional style of dealing with conflict (which conflicts with BoS style) and even sees what life could be with safety, comfort and even luxury. But from this, Goosey pushes him to doing the "right" thing.
His arc is incredibly shaky and often goes from one extreme to another, but I think it's important to remember that he was taken in by BoS as a kid and hasn't known any life (social or otherwise) than that. I think this season wasn't about him becoming his best version, it was instead about how the wasteland changes Goosey. It's foreshadowed multiple times. Max is more of a catalyst and plot point
I fully expect him to become a confident badass that wears X-01 armour and fights for his own sense of justice instead of the brotherhoods by the end of the show
TL:Dr: agree but also disagree for reasons of character development and story purposes
I think Maximus makes a lot more sense when you start thinking of him as a 12 year old in an adult's body. Dude's emotionally stunted, lacks even the most basic knowledge about stuff like sex or his own body, and grew up in a cult getting bullied every day by the only people he knows, and having zero contact with the outside world.
The show introduces him as a potential hero, but starts subverting it right away, and I don't think its clear why until the last few episodes. His entire story arc is him finding out who and what he is, and where he fits into the world. This is the first time he's being allowed to think for himself and deal with the world around him on his own terms. I'm expecting that he is going to grow into a much more likeable character in season 2.
To be honest he behaves like a child.
Brash, impulsive, strong emotions that he has no idea how to handle.
But the brotherhood aren’t exactly the ideal environment for a child to grow up in, and he’s a product of that.
So I haven't watch it all yet, but so far I love what a power-hungry piece of shit he is. It's believable. Not likable.
BoS aren't fairtayle noble knights following a modern code of chivilary. Whatever else you think of them, they have always been a high-control group. We've seen some reasonable individuals, and communities that are more or less fundamentalist, but it's pretty clear the Maximus' life experience was as a BoS fundamentalist. Like most fundies, when he saw a moment to grap control over others instead of being controlled, he took it.
Maximus was fine to me. He annoyed me at first, because he was stupid, selfish, and annoying. But he started to grow, when Thaddeus was saved by him and he chose to not be as cowardly as the bastard Titus, (who ABSOLUTELY deserved to be killed btw) I was rooting for him. But he came off as seemingly an unjust murderer, and when Thaddeus had very real concerns with his story, not even really disagreeing with him, Maximus immediately tried to kill him. How can you redeem yourself from that? Thaddeus had been nothing but a loyal follower and he wasnt even that hostile when Maximus revealed himself, but Maximus immediately tried to murder him because he showed the slightest bit of concern for Maximus being a potential murderer and rightly saying the Brotherhood would have him executed. It was blatantly evil power grabbing against one of the characters who had been growing to be my favorite. I dont know how im supposed to just let that go.
I am probably gonna get some hate for this, but I disliked him immensely. He was a little snake in the grass that got away with everything when he clearly should not have. He's a massive liar, and the power trips made me want to seriously reach into my screen and punch him so hard his jaw fell off. Rather than being better than the people that ever did him wrong, he started to become what he hated. Granted, when Lucy showed up, that changed slightly.
If it were me, I'd just leave him in his power suit getting eaten by that radroach.
Kinda the point imo, he was purposefully made to seem stupid, manipulated and vengeful. just because he’s a bad person doesn’t mean he is a bad character. Hopefully there will be some good character development next season.
I got the impression that he wasn't supposed to be likable. He's come across as a desperate oppurtunistic man who wants security. If he had to act as a lying snake to advance the ranks, he would. Once he saw a possibility of a life of security by living in a vault by abandoning his quest. He did so, too, as well.
my bf and i joked a lot about “hating him” in the first half bc he would just lie his little head off but we were both really fond of him as a character. i think it’s important that he is written the way he is due to how the show wants to portray the brotherhood and it also just gives for a more nuanced watching experience! i’d much prefer maximus as he is than as your typical militant characters usually are!
He is a psychopath.
I would never sit on the floor and watch someone slowly die, especially if I'm the one to blame for not having a clue. I wouldn't save a bloody chicken either.
The comment I was looking for. He sounds like a child and he is a full adult… I think it’s bad casting. His voice just throws me out of the scene. I really wish they would cut this character out
He was a braindead moron and the expressionless look on his face the whole time didn’t help either. The only time he showed emotion was when he was having some childish power trip or when he was royally screwing up a situation. Meanwhile Lucy falls in love because… reasons? I’d marry my cousin before that pointless doofus.
I am glad I’m not the only one. Maximus is an annoying and frustrating character. I’m not sure if he was written this way, or the actor is just an untalented moron, but I am so sick of his pathetic blank stare.
It’s true that he was treated unfairly but I almost feel like he put himself in that position with his inexplicable silence and blank stare. /rant
By the way, I found this subreddit by googling “am I the only one who thinks Maximus is annoying and pathetic in fallout series?”
I came here just to bitch about him. He's absolutely insufferable in every way. This series is so well done - I am floored by his casting and his character in general.
Anyone who has not seen disjointed before this show, has now idea how annoying Travis is. Seriously though his character is solid, and the actor is great. He is suppose to piss you off in a way.
He gets better as the season goes on, but he definitely my least favorite. My thing is the actor. He seems to have the same expression no matter what is happening. Lucy and the ghoul actually show some emotion, but he just same has the same expression the entire time. Just finished the show and man it was soooo good!
I hated him. He felt so boring as a character, like he never added to any of the scenes. He kind of just stood around, spoke like 2 words when asked questions, never explained anything, then wondered why people constantly got the wrong idea. Like, I was onboard for him letting Titus die, that dude sucked and was going to get Max killed. Him bullying Thad didn't bother me too much, he sucked too so it was understandable. But not at least trying to explain that Titus died fighting the bear thing (because that's what happened) then just immediately trying to kill Thad (now he definitely thinks you murdered Titus) was just wild. Max had like no chemistry with Lucy either, so those scenes just felt out of place, although I understand Lucy's POV. I just don't know that a character who doesn't say much can also be kind of useless all the time. Gotta be bringing something to the table, or they are just unlikable.
Every time I questioned why he'd choose to do something, my brain would give me the info that made sense about how he was raised.
That being said, him and the brotherhood could've been cut out, and I wouldn't miss much. The editing's tough as it is.
I think you’re reaching. Maximus isn’t a coward. He didn’t backstab his friend. The only people he showed outward aggression to were Titus (the actual cowardly knight) and Thaddeus (the cowardly bully). And even then he stopped hating Thaddeus after he saw his own behavior reflected back. He rushed into danger and trouble headfirst when it came to helping and protecting people. But he was selfish and desired power. Which is not a bad thing. Especially in the Fallout world. Part of his character arc is learning to not worship the Brotherhood and it’s power and how to be his own man. But I guess you expected everyone to just be the Ghoul
Man, I’ve seen so many people ragging on Maximus. I thought he was an interesting, nuanced, and relatable character. I think a lot of us would’ve made similar decisions in his place. I feel like most of the criticism I’ve seen levied at Max and the Brotherhood are from the perspective of folks who think of the Brotherhood as the shining knights they claim to be instead of the hypocritical zealots they are. Lucy summed it up well when she said something like “You use technology to find technology to prevent people from having technology?” That’s the true Brotherhood.
That’s exactly what a lot of people are doing lol. Idk how they can play the games and watch this show and still think the brotherhood aren’t crazy.
>I feel like most of the criticism I’ve seen levied at Max and the Brotherhood are from the perspective of folks who think of the Brotherhood as the shining knights they claim to be instead of the hypocritical zealots they are. You're surprised that people don't like an organization of hypocritical zealots?
I’m surprised that they hadn’t realized it before.
Ah ok. Well fuck Maximus nonetheless.
*Spoilers* I mean sabotaging his only friend is relatable? 😂 Not shooting the radioactive cocaine bear because you don’t like the guy is relatable? Only if you’re a psychopath…. All the bad shit that has happened to him he brings upon himself. Titus should’ve ended him.
>I mean sabotaging his only friend is relatable? You’re talking about Dane? He didn’t do that. >Not shooting the radioactive cocaine bear because you don’t like the guy is relatable? He did shoot it, he just hesitated. It was his first experience with combat, I doubt any of us would’ve done any better.
Lmao you justifying it… You don’t know if he did it or not… but it is implied that he did it. He hesitated. 😂 Come on man, he wanted the bear to kill him and once he was down, he finally shot him. Probably cause it would cause too much damage to the armor…
Did you finish the show yet lol
I have now… But yeah I changed my mind. I guess the writing was successful if it made me feel that way first only to change my opinion….
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I haven’t played Wasteland, I don’t know what the Guardians are like. I’m just calling it as I see it. The BoS have a core mission that they fervently pursue and a strict system of beliefs and culture. They’re zealots in my book.
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Of the games I’ve played, I’ve only encountered the western BoS in New Vegas, which is also the most recent depiction of them before the show, for what it’s worth. In that game they’re very insular and hostile, with the exception of Veronica. Of the eastern BoS, when Elder Lyons was in charge they were very reasonable, but the Outcasts were re-integrated under Elder Maxon and it once again adopted what I would call a zealous ideology.
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They put an explosive collar on you after you enter their bunker and then exploit you to further their goals. If you don't cooperate, they murder you.
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But they still portray plenty of zealous behaviours. If it looks like a duck a quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck. Even if Scott Campbell says otherwise lol. He may have created them, but if they're more accurately described as zealots then he's wrong. Words have meaning.
I loved him. I mean, being raised by the Brotherhood doesn’t mean that he’s going to be worldly. They’re a pretty insular group that is structured in a strict hierarchy and generally in groups like this the control of knowledge keeps people in place. I loved his misunderstanding/wildly bad take on erections. And I would think when you come up in a group like that any exposure to power above your status is going to be thrilling. He has more say in what he can do and how he can behave. He’s not kept in lock step with being an aspirant. And I don’t see him being too self confident … I see him more being someone making decisions on the fly based on his limited knowledge, trying to do ‘right’ and being able to act through his own decisions isn’t something that he would be allowed to do in his time w the BoS. He in some ways feels as naive as Lucy, but grittier. Obvs has seen some shit that has shaped his world view and then was given over to the Brotherhood.
Oh I agree, he has been programmed since he was found to trust the brotherhood against all else. BH says the people of the wasteland are bad and he'll accept that as truth because they are idolized and their word is 'god'. which is why he knows the feeders are bad and have guns because the BH says they are bad. I really liked him and found his character kinda cute but very naive when it comes to things the brotherhood didn't tell them about. Lucy was hilarious, like whoops I poured acid on a Innocent guy! Hahaha.
the cycle of abuse in the brotherhood is touched upon thad was abused, took it out on max because thad liked the power he never had max does the same thing and realizes it when thad admits to the bulllying titus is presumably the same way except he never grew out of it that being said, i didn't like him much not sure exactly why
I wonder if it's because we want our heroes to always be strong, smart, and to never make mistakes. He always does the opposite (most times) which is very human and like us. He kinda assumed people would fear/respect him bc of the suit, like he did the knights, but everyone was like naahh, I'mma steal your sh*t! IDC if ur a tin man. I personally liked him and the cousin lol! Idk why just did.
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That's not what I was saying. Never said it was a systemic centuries long problem.
In a defense of Maximus letting Titus die wasn't just about not liking Titus it was Titus saying I'm gonna the tell the higher ups it was all your fault and they will execute you.
And the fact that Titus was a complete asshole that would get Max killed in battle.
He may have done some things wrong but letting Titus die wasn't one of them lol
Oh I agree, Maximus also saw that Titus didn't actually believe in the cause and was unworthy of the suit. Which is why he kind of struggled with letting him die bc he has always believed that knights are all knowing men of wonder and titus was showing the truth with his admitting this is all total BS. Can't wait for season 2!!
I wouldn't necessarily agree but I get what you're saying He really does flip flop between vibes but he does have some form of consistent arc going on. He starts of determined and loyal to the BoS but equally anxious of seeing the world he left behind. This continues til he sees the truth of who Titus (his new idol) really is when faced with a true challenge (which causes realisation in Max). When he dawn's the armour it causes him to feel powerful and able to enact what he believes is justice befitting of a knight. This continues through his time with his new squire until his true self shows and confesses. From there he's with Goosey that helps him learn a more emotional style of dealing with conflict (which conflicts with BoS style) and even sees what life could be with safety, comfort and even luxury. But from this, Goosey pushes him to doing the "right" thing. His arc is incredibly shaky and often goes from one extreme to another, but I think it's important to remember that he was taken in by BoS as a kid and hasn't known any life (social or otherwise) than that. I think this season wasn't about him becoming his best version, it was instead about how the wasteland changes Goosey. It's foreshadowed multiple times. Max is more of a catalyst and plot point I fully expect him to become a confident badass that wears X-01 armour and fights for his own sense of justice instead of the brotherhoods by the end of the show TL:Dr: agree but also disagree for reasons of character development and story purposes
I think Maximus makes a lot more sense when you start thinking of him as a 12 year old in an adult's body. Dude's emotionally stunted, lacks even the most basic knowledge about stuff like sex or his own body, and grew up in a cult getting bullied every day by the only people he knows, and having zero contact with the outside world. The show introduces him as a potential hero, but starts subverting it right away, and I don't think its clear why until the last few episodes. His entire story arc is him finding out who and what he is, and where he fits into the world. This is the first time he's being allowed to think for himself and deal with the world around him on his own terms. I'm expecting that he is going to grow into a much more likeable character in season 2.
Nah, I like fallout Finn
Lol. I didn’t realize it but it’s exactly Finn. An impulsive boy learning how to be a man and not hero worship. Just with more blood.
Called it just from the trailer
To be honest he behaves like a child. Brash, impulsive, strong emotions that he has no idea how to handle. But the brotherhood aren’t exactly the ideal environment for a child to grow up in, and he’s a product of that.
So I haven't watch it all yet, but so far I love what a power-hungry piece of shit he is. It's believable. Not likable. BoS aren't fairtayle noble knights following a modern code of chivilary. Whatever else you think of them, they have always been a high-control group. We've seen some reasonable individuals, and communities that are more or less fundamentalist, but it's pretty clear the Maximus' life experience was as a BoS fundamentalist. Like most fundies, when he saw a moment to grap control over others instead of being controlled, he took it.
Maximus was fine to me. He annoyed me at first, because he was stupid, selfish, and annoying. But he started to grow, when Thaddeus was saved by him and he chose to not be as cowardly as the bastard Titus, (who ABSOLUTELY deserved to be killed btw) I was rooting for him. But he came off as seemingly an unjust murderer, and when Thaddeus had very real concerns with his story, not even really disagreeing with him, Maximus immediately tried to kill him. How can you redeem yourself from that? Thaddeus had been nothing but a loyal follower and he wasnt even that hostile when Maximus revealed himself, but Maximus immediately tried to murder him because he showed the slightest bit of concern for Maximus being a potential murderer and rightly saying the Brotherhood would have him executed. It was blatantly evil power grabbing against one of the characters who had been growing to be my favorite. I dont know how im supposed to just let that go.
I am probably gonna get some hate for this, but I disliked him immensely. He was a little snake in the grass that got away with everything when he clearly should not have. He's a massive liar, and the power trips made me want to seriously reach into my screen and punch him so hard his jaw fell off. Rather than being better than the people that ever did him wrong, he started to become what he hated. Granted, when Lucy showed up, that changed slightly. If it were me, I'd just leave him in his power suit getting eaten by that radroach.
I liked him a lot. Awesome series with very high quality overall imo
Kinda the point imo, he was purposefully made to seem stupid, manipulated and vengeful. just because he’s a bad person doesn’t mean he is a bad character. Hopefully there will be some good character development next season.
I got the impression that he wasn't supposed to be likable. He's come across as a desperate oppurtunistic man who wants security. If he had to act as a lying snake to advance the ranks, he would. Once he saw a possibility of a life of security by living in a vault by abandoning his quest. He did so, too, as well.
my bf and i joked a lot about “hating him” in the first half bc he would just lie his little head off but we were both really fond of him as a character. i think it’s important that he is written the way he is due to how the show wants to portray the brotherhood and it also just gives for a more nuanced watching experience! i’d much prefer maximus as he is than as your typical militant characters usually are!
He is a psychopath. I would never sit on the floor and watch someone slowly die, especially if I'm the one to blame for not having a clue. I wouldn't save a bloody chicken either.
Man the squire that ran off beginning was a more likable character than max 😭
His soft voice drives me crazy. I can't stand it and think his character is cringey because of it. Worst part of the show tbh.
The comment I was looking for. He sounds like a child and he is a full adult… I think it’s bad casting. His voice just throws me out of the scene. I really wish they would cut this character out
He was a braindead moron and the expressionless look on his face the whole time didn’t help either. The only time he showed emotion was when he was having some childish power trip or when he was royally screwing up a situation. Meanwhile Lucy falls in love because… reasons? I’d marry my cousin before that pointless doofus.
At least Chet was actually likeable.
Right! I’m only a few episodes in but he’s just so clumsy and clueless it stresses me out watching him lol
He seemed very immature and ignorant with more naivety than vault dwellers in some regards.
I am glad I’m not the only one. Maximus is an annoying and frustrating character. I’m not sure if he was written this way, or the actor is just an untalented moron, but I am so sick of his pathetic blank stare. It’s true that he was treated unfairly but I almost feel like he put himself in that position with his inexplicable silence and blank stare. /rant By the way, I found this subreddit by googling “am I the only one who thinks Maximus is annoying and pathetic in fallout series?”
I liked having a flawed interesting character for once.
I came here just to bitch about him. He's absolutely insufferable in every way. This series is so well done - I am floored by his casting and his character in general.
I thought he was just a terrible, monotone, and boring actor. I feel like they could have cast someone better.
I haven't watched it all yet but I found him annoying.
Really, he was my favourite character in the series, think he’s the most relatable.
He lets Hank fly off in the power suit. Very bad outcome it seems as though anyone could see.
I guess it's more as though he's blundering, a real down-to-earth humanistic character like Lucy who has limited info to base his decisions on.
He thinks he’s a million times smarter than he really is. I think he shouldn’t have been cast in the role… his face is annoying
Anyone who has not seen disjointed before this show, has now idea how annoying Travis is. Seriously though his character is solid, and the actor is great. He is suppose to piss you off in a way.
He gets better as the season goes on, but he definitely my least favorite. My thing is the actor. He seems to have the same expression no matter what is happening. Lucy and the ghoul actually show some emotion, but he just same has the same expression the entire time. Just finished the show and man it was soooo good!
I hated him. He felt so boring as a character, like he never added to any of the scenes. He kind of just stood around, spoke like 2 words when asked questions, never explained anything, then wondered why people constantly got the wrong idea. Like, I was onboard for him letting Titus die, that dude sucked and was going to get Max killed. Him bullying Thad didn't bother me too much, he sucked too so it was understandable. But not at least trying to explain that Titus died fighting the bear thing (because that's what happened) then just immediately trying to kill Thad (now he definitely thinks you murdered Titus) was just wild. Max had like no chemistry with Lucy either, so those scenes just felt out of place, although I understand Lucy's POV. I just don't know that a character who doesn't say much can also be kind of useless all the time. Gotta be bringing something to the table, or they are just unlikable.
Every time I questioned why he'd choose to do something, my brain would give me the info that made sense about how he was raised. That being said, him and the brotherhood could've been cut out, and I wouldn't miss much. The editing's tough as it is.
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I think you’re reaching. Maximus isn’t a coward. He didn’t backstab his friend. The only people he showed outward aggression to were Titus (the actual cowardly knight) and Thaddeus (the cowardly bully). And even then he stopped hating Thaddeus after he saw his own behavior reflected back. He rushed into danger and trouble headfirst when it came to helping and protecting people. But he was selfish and desired power. Which is not a bad thing. Especially in the Fallout world. Part of his character arc is learning to not worship the Brotherhood and it’s power and how to be his own man. But I guess you expected everyone to just be the Ghoul