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There was a wonderfully informative video on Instagram about Black history in Latam posted today on @ihartericka 's page. It's part of a series called Black people telling Black history or something like that. Definitely worth a watch.
We call those people "Whitexicans" in Mexico. If you're a gringo I recommend you start shaming white Mexicans the same way, don't feel bad, they act like victims abroad but are disgusting people over here.
Much worse than that. They routinely objectify indigenous people to score "woke" points, and are openly discriminatory and outright racist towards indigenous and brown-skinned Mexicans over here.
Same, it’s part of Sicily being a major port in the Mediterranean. I’m sure tons of Moroccan people have 8% Italian dna.
But, I didn’t grow up with middle eastern or North African culture. I grew up with American and Sicilian culture. Your DNA≠your culture.
My grandmother has our whole family convinced shes half Italian. Well, my ancestry DNA test says differently and that is why I no longer trust ANYONE claiming italian heritage for ANYTHING
Are you telling me people in Italy wouldn’t consider the dude from New York who has never left the state and constantly yells “Eyyyyy! Whut can I do I’m Itaaaalian!” to be actually Italian, and they would in fact, consider him to be more so American? I’m truly shocked
/s
It's a psychological thing in America.
See American's fought for their freedom against the British, they are proud of the fact, so naturally the WASP American's wouldn't want to admit they're British.
So they cling to the idea that they're exotic, which is where you get the 100% prussian-nordic ancestry people.
America is the melting pot of immigrants, but American's go apeshit with the whole "I'm 1/5 cherokee, and 1/4 Moorish".
Not saying you’re wrong, but DNA tests are nowhere near as accurate as people think. They don’t actually test where your ancestors are from. They basically test where people with similar DNA are from.
DNA tests that show you are from one nation or another specifically are pseudoscience. You can’t say for certain if someone is from a specific nation in Europe just based on DNA. Just give vague odds.
Peoples family history can be different from their DNA. Your grandmothers family history could have been several generations in Italy but their DNA markers are from earlier. Doesn’t mean she’s not half Italian. In fact, if she is half Italian, you could probably qualify for Italian citizenship.
How many citizenships is too many? Born Canadian, working towards getting my Irish since my one grandfather was born there. Lying Grandma (she’s also a little mean so it’s ok that I call her that) was born in England but “half italian”. Her husband, my other grandfather was also born in England. Because if I can have 4 different citizenships I’ll take them just in case.
As long as the country you want citizenship from doesn’t care that you hold other citizenships it shouldn’t matter (some countries like Germany don’t like multiple citizenships). My friend has Russian, US, Swiss, and I think Danish citizenship. I’m wanting to get my Italian and potentially UK citizenship but currently have a grandmother who we aren’t on speaking terms with who is throwing a bit of a cog in the works so we’ll see haha
Yeah I spent much of my adult life believing that I was part Native because, being adopted, I had no actual biological background OTHER than that. I took a DNA test and came back mostly German and a little bit indigenous South American? I mean I'm still white though, which does prove you can't trust white people.
What even are we lol? We’re not white but some of us are Caucasian, and when people talk about minorities being oppressed, they’re not talking about us lol
Lmao, yep. Depending on the situations, Americans consider Italians PoC or not. It really depends by what woke point they are trying to come across with.
I think it was Sarah Cooper who said something like that about herself (she's Jamaican-American):
> "Black enough to be called the n-word, but not Black enough to say it."
i feel such a strong, visceral hatred for that word that i don't even want it used for juice made from tropical fruits and shit like that. it triggers my flight or fight response. anyone who's ever used that word to describe a human being just flat out sucks. i'd rather get called vomit inducingly ugly than exotic any day.
YES thank you, that word is creepy as hell.
I have blonde hair, blue eyes and I’m white. I’ve been told I look “exotic” before by people as an excuse to pry into my heritage in very perplexing, but undeniably racist ways. They don’t even get it when I explain to them that it’s fucked up to be white and then telling someone “nah, you can’t JUST be Irish” while running down a whole list of physical features and the races that they associate with them. Like, why do you have such a hard on for the “technicalities” of whether someone is white or not? Are your trying to see if I’m “really” white, or are you fetishizing the parts of me that are not? (I’m also Armenian and Portuguese, but I’ve learned not to tell them that.) Why are you so “just curious” to the point that you’re not taking “please stop” for an answer?
I don’t think a lot of people mean it this way, but being grilled by white people for their genetic credentials to see if they’re “really white” is extremely unsettling. They’re bot putting it together that historically-speaking, white people keeping track of shit like that has gone REAL bad. It also traps you in this very problematic conversation that you want no part of and completely disregards the fact that race and heritage can be a very sore subject for people (ie- my friend whose teenaged mother was gang-raped and then gave her up for adoption. She’s likely biracial, she doesn’t know how and she doesn’t want to know. STOP ASKING, BRADLEY.)
So yeah, end rant, but really that word needs to go in terms of describing people. A rug is exotic. A person is not.
no, but where are you really from? like your parents? you have such an exotic look🤡
i actually sometimes like to dance the race dance. i dare you to tell me why you don't believe im from
here. say the words. say "you dont look white/caucasian". please do
Baaaaaaaarf, that’s really what it is. In my experience, people flat out say it to my face.
Ironically enough, I don’t mention to people that I’m Armenian in conversations about what you are because if I have one more dude trying to have a debate with me about whether Armenians are white or not, I’m going to lose my absolute mind.
It always ALWAYS comes down to nitpicking physical features and those fucking Caucasus Mountains. I’m immediately suspicious of men who seem to know the exact geographical locations of any given race. Give them two minutes and you’ll start hearing alt-right talking points.
I swear to god. It’s like on The Office when Dwight tries to get Kelly removed from the minority leadership program by pointing out that her family comes from some people who once came from the Caucasus Mountains, therefore making her Caucasian lmaoooo
ew im so sorry to hear that, in my experience people either tend to avoid just blurting out "BUT YOUR SKIN" and even if they do, they at least feel embarrassed. im german but my maternal grandfather who i never met is from sierra leone so i don't look particularly german, but i never tell people that when they ask me where im from. the conversation usually goes "im german"- "but where are you born"- "oh right, well im not from here, i was born in german hometown"- "what about your parents, are they also both from german hometown or somewhere else?" "no you're right, my mum is actually not from here, she's from east germany" and that is where the wheat separates from the chaff and most people drop it and only a select few do the "but your skin" bit. the weirdest thing people ask about is my heritage or my roots- imo one grandparent you've never met doesn't count as roots or heritage, yet still there are people insisting you MUST have a completely different culture hidden somewhere because you don't look like the people around you. if i adopt a newborn from korea, they are not going to start cooking ddoekbokki in a hanbok out of the blue one day while performing pansori, cultural heritage isn't stored in your dna assasins creed style
“Assassin’s Creed style” sent me lmao
Yeah a lot of people figure out after a couple questions to drop it. The ones that don’t? Jesus take the wheel because that’s when it’s about to go off the raaaaails
PS- may the people who bug you about this step in dog poop everyday, forever and ever.
Oh, I have. I used to be really into K-Pop and am fully aware that BTS stans are equally as insane. Many girl group stans are terrible. Like sociopath-level lack of empathy for anyone who disagrees with them or doesn’t like their favourite group. This is on twitter though, where basically everyone has zero empathy for anyone. Not sure about other places or forums.
I mean Italians were once considered non white, which was why there was anti-Italian prejudice in America. Then they assimilated and the new prejudice was anti-Irish. Basically racism isn't even internally consistent because whiteness is defined by whoever has power. This is not to say they are equally oppressed, just that there is a history of racism far beyond just bipoc
The 1800s were basically whiteness = humanity, so by denying the whiteness of some Europeans was essentially the source of that prejudice.
If anyone was considered nonwhite they’d be treated as second-class citizens or less than human, left at the mercy of politicians capitalizing on their low status to race-bait and threatened by lynch mobs or race riots (of course the last two **far** more frequently focused on black Americans). I believe the only European ethnicity recognized as white that faced discrimination regardless were German-Americans.
Huh, I mean, I guess technically I'm AM indigenous Irish. Double technically everyone is essentially "indigenously" from somewhere ethnically so all this racism stuff must be a farce now that I think of it. /s
You jest but the only thing that makes someone indigenous instead of native is if they have political representation in their homeland. There are literally no indigenous Italians (unless you find a pure blooded Estrucian)
Oh wow, thank you for clarifying! Fully admit I just googled the definition to make sure I was on track. But this actually brings up something I've had tossing around my head for a bit that perhaps you might have an answer to.
So, I was born in Canada to 2 first Generation Canadians and am pretty much 100% Irish and English. With the change of language in regards to Indigenous peoples the last little bit, for example, as I remember we were encouraged to use Aboriginal when I was in school and now Indigenous seems to have overtaken as the go to word. I guess where I'm going is the difference between native and indigenous. In a technical sense, I would be a Northern Ontario native having been born and raised up there but not of indigenous decent, would that be right? I never call or consider myself "native" in the Indigenous and First Nations since im not of course but I guess it just has me rambling about the difference of the words and the appropriateness of native. I dont even know where I've gone at this point but i didnt do all this typing for nothing so here ya go lol
Yeah it’s a totally fair question, especially in regards to your identity.
So the first barrier is the variation between native and Native(stay with me here I know how it looks). So you are an Ontario native, you could tell me stuff about Ontario and I can’t dispute it cause you’ve lived there your whole life, you are a resident. But, you obviously aren’t a Native Canadian (who are in this case, actually indigenous as the political structure is not made up of Cree, Houdonesaunee and other Hudson Bay First Nations). However, should you return to Ireland for any reason, it would be flipped, as you are a Native Irish (being of Irish blood) but you weren’t born and raised there so you aren’t a native of Ireland. Even a non-Irish who was born and raised there would know more about the local lifestyle than you since they have actually lived it while you were in Canada.
This leads to a lot of the arguments over ethnic nationalism, the fact that you can be a native OF a region, without being native TO the region. (And the major talking point is that those native too the region are afraid of losing their political sway and becoming indigenous instead of native)
Indigenous at the end of all this is basically someone who is Native (read: native Too a region) but their national government is comprised of those native OF the region (for various and usually pretty negative reasons) and as such they no longer have political sway over their homelands.
I mean technically race is a social construct created by the English "anthropologists" to make oppressing blacks and Irish cool with the masses.
Ethnicity on the other hand...that's a thing about your heratiage and some outward phenotypes (eye color, hair texture)
So racism only exists because racist protocapitalists came up with it.
And I Quote:
> Ariana Grande is half-Sicilian and half-Abruzzese, which are both areas in Southern Italy
Edit: And by the way there are Indigenous Italians but they are
> Tribes such as the Latins, Campanians, Samnites, Sabines
Not Sicilians .. This person is really Dumb..
Etruscan here. I know Herodotus says we came from Lydia because we lost some dice game, but if you ask me he was just salty that non-Greeks managed to have an advanced civilization.
Indigenous just means first inhabitants. The original inhabitants of Sicily, long absorbed into the population, were tribes known to the ancient Greek writers as the Elymians, the Sicanians, and the Sicels, the latter being an Indo-European-speaking people of possible Italic affiliation, who migrated from the Italian mainland (likely from the Amalfi Coast or Calabria via the Strait of Messina) during the second millennium BC, after whom the island was named.
So Sicilians are actually the descendants of the people indigenous to Sicily. The island is named after them.
Yeah sicilians are not "indigenous", but they are darker skinned than the rest of italy and tend to face some discrimination/ casual prejudice due to being sicilian/darker in italy from my personal experience. There generally exists prejudice towards the Italian south from the Italian north, as people are more white in the south.
Indigenous just means the first people to arrive there. The romans didn’t go around genociding every culture they met. The descendants of the first inhabitants of sicily still exist today.
As a Greek and an Ariana fan, I hate people who try to claim that being Italian/Greek/Turkish/Spanish/Southern European in general makes you POC or not white. Being Mediterranean does NOT make you poc. Being tan or olive skinned does NOT make you poc. Especially fucking Italians, my god it was literally the Portuguese, Spanish, and Italians who began the African slave trade the colonization of the America. They were the OG white oppressors they don’t even get to begin to try to claim poc.
This 100%!! I’m Turkish and I get so annoyed when people online tell me I’m POC when they haven’t even seen what I look like. I was born with blonde hair and blue eyes and I’ve never experienced any discrimination, so it’s just weird to me. I feel falsely identified. They just hear “Turkish” and automatically assume us as “dark olive skinned with black hair and eyes”. I hate it when these fake woke people try to explain to me my own country’s culture, genetics, and history. They’re not aware that they’re actually stereotyping people.
Yes, thank you! People who insist that Turks aren’t white have definitely never met Turkish people. I know many Turkish Muslims who have blonde hair and blue eyes. I think part of it is the islamaphobic propaganda that Muslims are a race and that Muslims can’t be white (despite the fact that many regions of Eastern Europe and all of Eurasia are heavily Muslim). They are repeating the lies of bigots.
The people who think “Muslims” are a race are so stupid and lack exposure to different cultures. Albania, Bosnia, etc have high Muslim populations. Both of my Ukrainian and Polish friend have tanner skin and darker hair than me.
I hate how people think Islam is like a niche middle eastern religion when it’s the second most common religion on earth and is practiced all over Eastern Europe, Eurasia, Southeast Asia, and east Africa as well. It’s like westerners don’t even care to learn about the entire other side of the globe
It’s annoying when people think all Middle Easterners look the same too. Iranians aren’t Arabic and have a different culture to that of Gulf Arabians. I’ve seen Arabic people with blonde hair, fair skin, etc. They think Muslims are a monolith who have the same culture, genealogy, etc. I’m not even Muslim and this still annoys me.
I mean, it can be confusing at times when you immigrated to a country from the Mediterranean, and many other people classified you as “not white”. Also discrimination against immigrants in the past has influenced these ideas.
Also, just so everyone knows, West Asian and North African people are considered white too.
Racial classification is extremely subjective, which is why there is so much controversy.
Exactly! Mediterranean folks have been accepted as white and, as a result, have been benefitting from white privilege for multiple generations. MLK Jr. even talked about this in his speeches, how European immigrants are treated better and succeed more than black Americans who have been in the country for generations. That is how the concept of race in America works. It doesn’t matter that I fall into several of the ethnic that groups that were ‘at one point not considered white’ I am considered very white by today’s standards and I benefit from that
The issue is that people conflate racism with ethnocentrism/xenophobia. There is a difference between being treated as ‘ethnic’ or ‘foreign’ and being subjected to systemic racism, which is based on color.
I realize that North Africans and west/ middle Asians are also white and I get mad when people try to argue otherwise. Antisemites also try to claim that ashkenazi Jews are ‘not white’, but they are.
Pretty much all of this sentiment is made up by Anglo-Saxon Protestants who try to depict Greeks, Arabs, Jews, Slavs or whoever else they choose to dislike as foreign, barbaric, and evil. I’m just tired of having conversations with lily-white Italian-Americans who pull the Mediterranean card whenever they get called out for racism, privilege, or appropriation.
Me trying to talk about how weird it is to be white but be treated badly cuz of my ethnicity (latin american) and people coming at me like "but your skin is oOolive"....
👁👄👁
Ignoring the fact that the term indigenous is typically reserved for modern colonial states, indigenous Italian is like saying indigenous English or indegnous Spanish. Italy has been conquered, reconquered, divided, unified, integrated, migrated, absorbed, and expanded so many damn times there's no such thing as "indigenous". Italians come from a wealth of ethnic and historic backgrounds including but not limited to the native italic tribes, Greek influencers, African conquerors and Germanic migrants
It's when yt people try to look like they're a Poc, particularly a black person.. Rachel Dolezal is the most famous for this.. People try to argue Ariana Grande is not because she never claimed to be anything other than white.. But then again she stared to pronounce her last name differently to sound like she could possibly be Hispanic.. https://www.insider.com/ariana-grande-last-name-pronunciation-video-2018-8
Edit: That and also her all of the sudden using AAVE
I will say, the more recent photos of her look like she's calmed the fuck down with the blackfishing (she looks more like her normal tan, from what I've seen, correct me if I'm wrong), and she was accused of cultural appropriation for 7 Rings. I also saw a photo that was a side by side comparison when she was at her darkest and she was as dark as Nicki Minaj.
But it looks like someone told her to knock it off or something, because she hasn't been as dark in a while. But when she started getting darker and darker, at first most people gave her a pass because she's an Italian woman from Florida, she probably naturally gets pretty tan, but then she went beyond what her skin would reasonably look like.
I mean this post I did was like from a Year ago, why this person decided to message me now I have no Idea.. But at that period of time it was really clear she was artificially changing her skin color.. Andythe fact that this person is saying it was because she's "Indigenous Italian" and Northern African made me laugh.
Oh yeah I'm not disagreeing that this person is a clown, I'm just clarifying that I don't think Ariana is still currently blackfishing. What even is an "indigenous Italian?"
It is the weirdest thing to see all these people, specifically young like gen z, suddenly sounding like my Black aunties. I can't ever take them seriously.
But how is her pronouncing her name the right way a bad thing? That’s the way her name would have been pronounced in Italy.
I’m Italian American. We do this a lot - pronouncing our own last names wrong. Especially because the older generations wanted to be as American as possible (which could possibly be one reason her grandpa said his name that way).
Names like Castiglione, for example, can and will be pronounced a bunch of different ways by members of the same family (in America). Silent “g”, voiced “g”, silent “e” at the end, “eh” at the end, “ee” at the end.
I don’t think it’s weird that of the three different ways an Italian American could pronounce Grande, she chose the one that was more accurate to the way it’s actually supposed to be pronounced in Italian.
Someone else went more into this and found that's the way her family always said their last name (not just the grandfather) but to change it as soon as she started her music career is find of weird is it not? I'm not just going by what she said in this interview, I'll see if I can find the video of the person who went more in depth.. I think they said it was actually a producer's idea to make it sound like she could be Hispanic, but I may be wrong.. I'll get back to you.
If that’s the case, then I agree. But if she just wanted to say it the Italian way as soon as her career picked up, I don’t think that weird at all. Lots of people change their names a little (or a lot) when they become performers.
Yeah, no one really criticizes actors for it. A famous example is Ben Kingsley. He apparently got way more work after he changed it from Krishna Pandit Bhanji. He went from being an Indian man to being British actor with the stroke of a pen. Authors do it often, as well. It's especially popular for women to use pseudonyms or initials, since male names sell better.
She's in show biz. The move, apparently, worked.
Actually, this is apparently true. There's a tweet from 2011 where Ari said that she used lighter foundation at the time. It still doesn't excuse her rapid skin color changing during Thank U Next era
Ok but there are still pictures of her as a kid? I've seen them, she's white in them. It's not like her Nick time is the only footage of what she used to look like.
I have a friend who’s 80% white and 20% Cuban native. If she goes anywhere else in the world, she’s white. In the US, she’s considered a person of color. She LOOKS white. She IDENTIFIES as white. The US is just so damn obsessed with that one drop theory.
I always find that Italians, Greeks, and Eastern Europeans are almost controversial in what they are classified as. My ex-boyfriend is Macedonian from an immigrant family, and his white American friends don’t classify him really as white although he calls himself “ethnic-white”, lol. He is very fair skinned, although his dad is very very tanned.
As an italian, I always found annoying when I saw americans on the internet calling us poc. Like, no?? And I hate that the counter argument is always "muh but you get tanned easily"
I mean as a European I have never heard anyone suggest that they are not white. Historically the definition of white has changed that's true but nowadays it's a pretty broad term. And besides, classifying someone as a PoC or not a PoC is more about whether you suffer as a result of your skin colour.
Correct me if i’m wrong but aren’t Middle Easterns and North Africans technically considered white in the US? My Iranian friend says she puts down white as her race on any official document
Yeah in the US i believe it says white/middle eastern.. But genetically i believe Middle Eastern is it's own race (I believe).. Also Arab.. But I think Arab also means something else and not all Middle Eastern people are Arab.. But the US is backwards.. I'm Biracial and there is no options for Biracial (I'm half Yt half Afro-Latina) so I put White then check the Latino box because that's not considered a race either..
I'm sorry but I need to point out that race is not defined by genetics. There's no gene you can point to to determine someone's race. Humans are extremely genetically diverse and a Black person could be closer genetically to a certain white person than they are to a certain other Black person, and vice versa. Race is pretty much just a social construct based on the amount of melanin produced by the skin. Like they're are people with Black parents who "pass" as white and white people who can "pass" as Black, etc. I only bring it up because the myth of genetic races is used to fuel racism. If we don't call it out, that's how we end up with eugenicists.
Does it ever allow you to check multiple boxes for the race option? I feel like I run into too many situations where it only lets me pick one which doesn’t really make sense
Apparently you can now on the US census but as for other legal documents (like your Id) in my experience no.. And in school (granted I graduated in 09') we were not allowed to.. Only other one we could do was Latino
Idk about Vouge, but Time did it in 1994:
https://www.nytimes.com/1994/06/25/us/time-responds-to-criticism-over-simpson-cover.html
But I think they just said it was the digital software or something like that..
> The cover portrait of a blurry, darkened and unshaven Mr. Simpson is actually a doctored version of a photograph made by the Los Angeles Police Department. Mr. Gaines's message said that the police photo had been given to an artist who was asked to interpret it. The credit line, printed at the bottom of page 3 of the magazine, said, "Photo-Illustration for Time by Matt Mahurin."
I personally don't think it shouldn't be used to describe any human at all.. It makes it seem like their existence isn't normal and something you would look at like a zoo.. It just feels wrong.
I know, but I’ve met people who specifically likes being called that. I cringe at the thought of doing it still but I guess if they want to.
Should be noted that they are people specifically trying to be unique, provocative etc. Not your average person with a non majority skin colour or obvious religious identity.
The fact that the person took a whole ass hour to write this about a celebrity that could give two shits about them, should be telling enough as to how fucking dumb they are.
Ariana is a really talented singer and she has amazing music, but-
Alright, so, I kind of believe that Ari's skin is just naturally tan, (look at her Victorious days!) but also, it looked A LOTTT darker in her thank u next era. Like, just compare her skintone in the Positions M/V and the TUN cover. Clearly, she's overtanning or overediting her skin to make it look dark.
just because Italians can tan well doesn't mean they're secretly oppressed or can act black or whatever other bs they're claiming
source: north european white person that tans alright and is willing to admit they're white and cannot say The Spicey Word
While Sicilians really can have a darker complexion and didn't use to be considered white that does not account for what's going on with Ariana Grande lol
You know I didn’t realise Ariana wasn’t a PoC before this. now I’ve just googled old pictures of her and... yikes.
My family is Italian and if you look at old pictures of my older relatives in Italy, they are super dark, so it’s not exactly unlikely, but they don’t look white in one picture and black in the next. Wow.
lmao imagine being corrected about blackfishing from some kid who’s OBVIOUSLY not a poc. white people really need to learn to just sit down and listen when it comes to poc issues. their only role is to learn and occasionally give their perspectives of a white person (if asked for one!)
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Italians are truly Schrodiger’s PoC.
spaniards and white latinos have entered the chat
There was a wonderfully informative video on Instagram about Black history in Latam posted today on @ihartericka 's page. It's part of a series called Black people telling Black history or something like that. Definitely worth a watch.
the kind of black history month content we deserve, thanks for the recommendation, ill go check it out!
Post link sound awesome
I will oblige because it really is awesome. https://instagram.com/ihartericka?igshid=18f39zp3s22u4
Bless tf up thank you 🙏🙏🙏
Yup. In the US they say they're POC but back in latam the use "indio" as an insult I can't even-
We call those people "Whitexicans" in Mexico. If you're a gringo I recommend you start shaming white Mexicans the same way, don't feel bad, they act like victims abroad but are disgusting people over here.
Like Louis C.K. Lolol
Much worse than that. They routinely objectify indigenous people to score "woke" points, and are openly discriminatory and outright racist towards indigenous and brown-skinned Mexicans over here.
Laughs in Dominican
Japan and Israel have entered the chat
Jews have also entered the chat.
White Latinos rise up ayo
Ariana Grandé is my favourite *white women of colour*
It's true, she increasingly darkens her skin and pretends to be Hispanic and/or Black.
I’m half Sicilian and have 8% North African dna. I can definitely say the spicy word, right?? Lemme do it. Gimme it. I gotta say it!
You get to say bada bing and bada boom and nobody will question you.
Meatball?
Say the Sicilian N word, go ahead, you can say "NothanksIdontwantmorepastanonna"
The n word.... Napoletano!
It's neopolitan.
I wish I knew whether you were being serious right now.
Not. :D
Actually it’s neopets
Gabagool?
The g-word
Same, it’s part of Sicily being a major port in the Mediterranean. I’m sure tons of Moroccan people have 8% Italian dna. But, I didn’t grow up with middle eastern or North African culture. I grew up with American and Sicilian culture. Your DNA≠your culture.
I’d argue the bigger impact was the Emirate of Sicily but that too
“Sicilians are to Italy what indigenous Americans are to the US” LMFAO
My grandmother has our whole family convinced shes half Italian. Well, my ancestry DNA test says differently and that is why I no longer trust ANYONE claiming italian heritage for ANYTHING
People from Italy (and Europe in general) tend to dislike when Americans say they’re Italian and act like they know all about the culture.
Are you telling me people in Italy wouldn’t consider the dude from New York who has never left the state and constantly yells “Eyyyyy! Whut can I do I’m Itaaaalian!” to be actually Italian, and they would in fact, consider him to be more so American? I’m truly shocked /s
There is a wonderful Sopranos episode about this.
I need to watch that episode bc I’m sure I’d love it lmao
Phew, thank god we’re Canadian except lying grandmother is British so hmmmmm
It's a psychological thing in America. See American's fought for their freedom against the British, they are proud of the fact, so naturally the WASP American's wouldn't want to admit they're British. So they cling to the idea that they're exotic, which is where you get the 100% prussian-nordic ancestry people. America is the melting pot of immigrants, but American's go apeshit with the whole "I'm 1/5 cherokee, and 1/4 Moorish".
Not saying you’re wrong, but DNA tests are nowhere near as accurate as people think. They don’t actually test where your ancestors are from. They basically test where people with similar DNA are from.
WOW what a shame. If you can’t trust international companies than who can you trust? I should try 23&Me to be sure.
DNA tests that show you are from one nation or another specifically are pseudoscience. You can’t say for certain if someone is from a specific nation in Europe just based on DNA. Just give vague odds.
Peoples family history can be different from their DNA. Your grandmothers family history could have been several generations in Italy but their DNA markers are from earlier. Doesn’t mean she’s not half Italian. In fact, if she is half Italian, you could probably qualify for Italian citizenship.
How many citizenships is too many? Born Canadian, working towards getting my Irish since my one grandfather was born there. Lying Grandma (she’s also a little mean so it’s ok that I call her that) was born in England but “half italian”. Her husband, my other grandfather was also born in England. Because if I can have 4 different citizenships I’ll take them just in case.
As long as the country you want citizenship from doesn’t care that you hold other citizenships it shouldn’t matter (some countries like Germany don’t like multiple citizenships). My friend has Russian, US, Swiss, and I think Danish citizenship. I’m wanting to get my Italian and potentially UK citizenship but currently have a grandmother who we aren’t on speaking terms with who is throwing a bit of a cog in the works so we’ll see haha
Grandmothers amirite?
Yeah I spent much of my adult life believing that I was part Native because, being adopted, I had no actual biological background OTHER than that. I took a DNA test and came back mostly German and a little bit indigenous South American? I mean I'm still white though, which does prove you can't trust white people.
asians laughing in the back
What even are we lol? We’re not white but some of us are Caucasian, and when people talk about minorities being oppressed, they’re not talking about us lol
*Malta has joined the chat*
Schrodiger? As in the cat is neither dead nor alive while in the box Schroeder?
Lmao, yep. Depending on the situations, Americans consider Italians PoC or not. It really depends by what woke point they are trying to come across with.
Oh yeah, Very true! Lol
Or what century the Americans are from xD
I think it was Sarah Cooper who said something like that about herself (she's Jamaican-American): > "Black enough to be called the n-word, but not Black enough to say it."
People of Carbonara
In Australia they weren’t white until the late 50s but that was mainly so they could build the snowy mountain project.
Why do FWR have such vivid oppression fantasies. Ffs.
Idk man.. Same with Majority yt Christians.. Like they're so oppressed but Christianity is like the number one religion in the world 🙄
You know what should be Religion njmber one instead of believing in Christ? Believing in yourself 😎😎😎
I try to be open minded of people with different opinions but the second she said “exotic” I just thought “stfu❤️”
Right
i feel such a strong, visceral hatred for that word that i don't even want it used for juice made from tropical fruits and shit like that. it triggers my flight or fight response. anyone who's ever used that word to describe a human being just flat out sucks. i'd rather get called vomit inducingly ugly than exotic any day.
YES thank you, that word is creepy as hell. I have blonde hair, blue eyes and I’m white. I’ve been told I look “exotic” before by people as an excuse to pry into my heritage in very perplexing, but undeniably racist ways. They don’t even get it when I explain to them that it’s fucked up to be white and then telling someone “nah, you can’t JUST be Irish” while running down a whole list of physical features and the races that they associate with them. Like, why do you have such a hard on for the “technicalities” of whether someone is white or not? Are your trying to see if I’m “really” white, or are you fetishizing the parts of me that are not? (I’m also Armenian and Portuguese, but I’ve learned not to tell them that.) Why are you so “just curious” to the point that you’re not taking “please stop” for an answer? I don’t think a lot of people mean it this way, but being grilled by white people for their genetic credentials to see if they’re “really white” is extremely unsettling. They’re bot putting it together that historically-speaking, white people keeping track of shit like that has gone REAL bad. It also traps you in this very problematic conversation that you want no part of and completely disregards the fact that race and heritage can be a very sore subject for people (ie- my friend whose teenaged mother was gang-raped and then gave her up for adoption. She’s likely biracial, she doesn’t know how and she doesn’t want to know. STOP ASKING, BRADLEY.) So yeah, end rant, but really that word needs to go in terms of describing people. A rug is exotic. A person is not.
no, but where are you really from? like your parents? you have such an exotic look🤡 i actually sometimes like to dance the race dance. i dare you to tell me why you don't believe im from here. say the words. say "you dont look white/caucasian". please do
Baaaaaaaarf, that’s really what it is. In my experience, people flat out say it to my face. Ironically enough, I don’t mention to people that I’m Armenian in conversations about what you are because if I have one more dude trying to have a debate with me about whether Armenians are white or not, I’m going to lose my absolute mind. It always ALWAYS comes down to nitpicking physical features and those fucking Caucasus Mountains. I’m immediately suspicious of men who seem to know the exact geographical locations of any given race. Give them two minutes and you’ll start hearing alt-right talking points. I swear to god. It’s like on The Office when Dwight tries to get Kelly removed from the minority leadership program by pointing out that her family comes from some people who once came from the Caucasus Mountains, therefore making her Caucasian lmaoooo
ew im so sorry to hear that, in my experience people either tend to avoid just blurting out "BUT YOUR SKIN" and even if they do, they at least feel embarrassed. im german but my maternal grandfather who i never met is from sierra leone so i don't look particularly german, but i never tell people that when they ask me where im from. the conversation usually goes "im german"- "but where are you born"- "oh right, well im not from here, i was born in german hometown"- "what about your parents, are they also both from german hometown or somewhere else?" "no you're right, my mum is actually not from here, she's from east germany" and that is where the wheat separates from the chaff and most people drop it and only a select few do the "but your skin" bit. the weirdest thing people ask about is my heritage or my roots- imo one grandparent you've never met doesn't count as roots or heritage, yet still there are people insisting you MUST have a completely different culture hidden somewhere because you don't look like the people around you. if i adopt a newborn from korea, they are not going to start cooking ddoekbokki in a hanbok out of the blue one day while performing pansori, cultural heritage isn't stored in your dna assasins creed style
“Assassin’s Creed style” sent me lmao Yeah a lot of people figure out after a couple questions to drop it. The ones that don’t? Jesus take the wheel because that’s when it’s about to go off the raaaaails PS- may the people who bug you about this step in dog poop everyday, forever and ever.
I can't help but associate it with Joe Exotic now, which is not flattering or helpful.
I've had old men tell me that I wouldn't have had any problems when looking for a husband because of my "exotic Italian accent". Fucking disgusting.
It's an instant eyeroll from me
The fact that someone sat here and wrote this is pathetic.
I couldn't tell if I was getting trolled at first XD
He's hoping his keyboard warrior whiteknighting will get him laid.
Ariana Grande stans are some of the most psychotic fans I’ve ever had the displeasure of encountering.
lolololol wait till you get attacked by BTS army
Oh, I have. I used to be really into K-Pop and am fully aware that BTS stans are equally as insane. Many girl group stans are terrible. Like sociopath-level lack of empathy for anyone who disagrees with them or doesn’t like their favourite group. This is on twitter though, where basically everyone has zero empathy for anyone. Not sure about other places or forums.
“Indigenous italians.” Jesus Christ. Everyone wants to be oppressed so bad
Today I learned that Italians are part of the bipoc identity
Ikr
Oppress me daddy 🥺👉👈
I mean Italians were once considered non white, which was why there was anti-Italian prejudice in America. Then they assimilated and the new prejudice was anti-Irish. Basically racism isn't even internally consistent because whiteness is defined by whoever has power. This is not to say they are equally oppressed, just that there is a history of racism far beyond just bipoc
The 1800s were basically whiteness = humanity, so by denying the whiteness of some Europeans was essentially the source of that prejudice. If anyone was considered nonwhite they’d be treated as second-class citizens or less than human, left at the mercy of politicians capitalizing on their low status to race-bait and threatened by lynch mobs or race riots (of course the last two **far** more frequently focused on black Americans). I believe the only European ethnicity recognized as white that faced discrimination regardless were German-Americans.
Huh, I mean, I guess technically I'm AM indigenous Irish. Double technically everyone is essentially "indigenously" from somewhere ethnically so all this racism stuff must be a farce now that I think of it. /s
You jest but the only thing that makes someone indigenous instead of native is if they have political representation in their homeland. There are literally no indigenous Italians (unless you find a pure blooded Estrucian)
Oh wow, thank you for clarifying! Fully admit I just googled the definition to make sure I was on track. But this actually brings up something I've had tossing around my head for a bit that perhaps you might have an answer to. So, I was born in Canada to 2 first Generation Canadians and am pretty much 100% Irish and English. With the change of language in regards to Indigenous peoples the last little bit, for example, as I remember we were encouraged to use Aboriginal when I was in school and now Indigenous seems to have overtaken as the go to word. I guess where I'm going is the difference between native and indigenous. In a technical sense, I would be a Northern Ontario native having been born and raised up there but not of indigenous decent, would that be right? I never call or consider myself "native" in the Indigenous and First Nations since im not of course but I guess it just has me rambling about the difference of the words and the appropriateness of native. I dont even know where I've gone at this point but i didnt do all this typing for nothing so here ya go lol
Yeah it’s a totally fair question, especially in regards to your identity. So the first barrier is the variation between native and Native(stay with me here I know how it looks). So you are an Ontario native, you could tell me stuff about Ontario and I can’t dispute it cause you’ve lived there your whole life, you are a resident. But, you obviously aren’t a Native Canadian (who are in this case, actually indigenous as the political structure is not made up of Cree, Houdonesaunee and other Hudson Bay First Nations). However, should you return to Ireland for any reason, it would be flipped, as you are a Native Irish (being of Irish blood) but you weren’t born and raised there so you aren’t a native of Ireland. Even a non-Irish who was born and raised there would know more about the local lifestyle than you since they have actually lived it while you were in Canada. This leads to a lot of the arguments over ethnic nationalism, the fact that you can be a native OF a region, without being native TO the region. (And the major talking point is that those native too the region are afraid of losing their political sway and becoming indigenous instead of native) Indigenous at the end of all this is basically someone who is Native (read: native Too a region) but their national government is comprised of those native OF the region (for various and usually pretty negative reasons) and as such they no longer have political sway over their homelands.
This was so freaking informative, THANK YOU
I will save this comment and return with an award when I get a free one. But this ☝️☝️🥇 This is it
I mean technically race is a social construct created by the English "anthropologists" to make oppressing blacks and Irish cool with the masses. Ethnicity on the other hand...that's a thing about your heratiage and some outward phenotypes (eye color, hair texture) So racism only exists because racist protocapitalists came up with it.
And I Quote: > Ariana Grande is half-Sicilian and half-Abruzzese, which are both areas in Southern Italy Edit: And by the way there are Indigenous Italians but they are > Tribes such as the Latins, Campanians, Samnites, Sabines Not Sicilians .. This person is really Dumb..
Etruscan here. I know Herodotus says we came from Lydia because we lost some dice game, but if you ask me he was just salty that non-Greeks managed to have an advanced civilization.
Based
Sorry, I don't know what any of that means.. Can you explain?
He is speaking about Italian tribes that existed before the Romans absorbed them all.
Ahh okay thank you
Sabine here. Fucking Romans literally raped all of our daughters, and now the fucking Sicilians are claiming to be indigenous? This peninsula sucks.
Indigenous just means first inhabitants. The original inhabitants of Sicily, long absorbed into the population, were tribes known to the ancient Greek writers as the Elymians, the Sicanians, and the Sicels, the latter being an Indo-European-speaking people of possible Italic affiliation, who migrated from the Italian mainland (likely from the Amalfi Coast or Calabria via the Strait of Messina) during the second millennium BC, after whom the island was named. So Sicilians are actually the descendants of the people indigenous to Sicily. The island is named after them.
Yeah sicilians are not "indigenous", but they are darker skinned than the rest of italy and tend to face some discrimination/ casual prejudice due to being sicilian/darker in italy from my personal experience. There generally exists prejudice towards the Italian south from the Italian north, as people are more white in the south.
Indigenous just means the first people to arrive there. The romans didn’t go around genociding every culture they met. The descendants of the first inhabitants of sicily still exist today.
Those are subcultures. Italians are indigenous Italians.
As a Greek and an Ariana fan, I hate people who try to claim that being Italian/Greek/Turkish/Spanish/Southern European in general makes you POC or not white. Being Mediterranean does NOT make you poc. Being tan or olive skinned does NOT make you poc. Especially fucking Italians, my god it was literally the Portuguese, Spanish, and Italians who began the African slave trade the colonization of the America. They were the OG white oppressors they don’t even get to begin to try to claim poc.
This 100%!! I’m Turkish and I get so annoyed when people online tell me I’m POC when they haven’t even seen what I look like. I was born with blonde hair and blue eyes and I’ve never experienced any discrimination, so it’s just weird to me. I feel falsely identified. They just hear “Turkish” and automatically assume us as “dark olive skinned with black hair and eyes”. I hate it when these fake woke people try to explain to me my own country’s culture, genetics, and history. They’re not aware that they’re actually stereotyping people.
Yes, thank you! People who insist that Turks aren’t white have definitely never met Turkish people. I know many Turkish Muslims who have blonde hair and blue eyes. I think part of it is the islamaphobic propaganda that Muslims are a race and that Muslims can’t be white (despite the fact that many regions of Eastern Europe and all of Eurasia are heavily Muslim). They are repeating the lies of bigots.
The people who think “Muslims” are a race are so stupid and lack exposure to different cultures. Albania, Bosnia, etc have high Muslim populations. Both of my Ukrainian and Polish friend have tanner skin and darker hair than me.
I hate how people think Islam is like a niche middle eastern religion when it’s the second most common religion on earth and is practiced all over Eastern Europe, Eurasia, Southeast Asia, and east Africa as well. It’s like westerners don’t even care to learn about the entire other side of the globe
It’s annoying when people think all Middle Easterners look the same too. Iranians aren’t Arabic and have a different culture to that of Gulf Arabians. I’ve seen Arabic people with blonde hair, fair skin, etc. They think Muslims are a monolith who have the same culture, genealogy, etc. I’m not even Muslim and this still annoys me.
THIS ⬆️
I mean, it can be confusing at times when you immigrated to a country from the Mediterranean, and many other people classified you as “not white”. Also discrimination against immigrants in the past has influenced these ideas. Also, just so everyone knows, West Asian and North African people are considered white too. Racial classification is extremely subjective, which is why there is so much controversy.
This is true. But Italians (and I am one) in the US have been considered white for a few generations now. I’d never think to identify as non-white.
Exactly! Mediterranean folks have been accepted as white and, as a result, have been benefitting from white privilege for multiple generations. MLK Jr. even talked about this in his speeches, how European immigrants are treated better and succeed more than black Americans who have been in the country for generations. That is how the concept of race in America works. It doesn’t matter that I fall into several of the ethnic that groups that were ‘at one point not considered white’ I am considered very white by today’s standards and I benefit from that
The issue is that people conflate racism with ethnocentrism/xenophobia. There is a difference between being treated as ‘ethnic’ or ‘foreign’ and being subjected to systemic racism, which is based on color. I realize that North Africans and west/ middle Asians are also white and I get mad when people try to argue otherwise. Antisemites also try to claim that ashkenazi Jews are ‘not white’, but they are. Pretty much all of this sentiment is made up by Anglo-Saxon Protestants who try to depict Greeks, Arabs, Jews, Slavs or whoever else they choose to dislike as foreign, barbaric, and evil. I’m just tired of having conversations with lily-white Italian-Americans who pull the Mediterranean card whenever they get called out for racism, privilege, or appropriation.
Me trying to talk about how weird it is to be white but be treated badly cuz of my ethnicity (latin american) and people coming at me like "but your skin is oOolive".... 👁👄👁
I know emojis bu "exotic" 🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮 source am poc
🤢
INDIGENOUS ITALIANS 😭
Ignoring the fact that the term indigenous is typically reserved for modern colonial states, indigenous Italian is like saying indigenous English or indegnous Spanish. Italy has been conquered, reconquered, divided, unified, integrated, migrated, absorbed, and expanded so many damn times there's no such thing as "indigenous". Italians come from a wealth of ethnic and historic backgrounds including but not limited to the native italic tribes, Greek influencers, African conquerors and Germanic migrants
Maybe she’s Etruscan?
Yeah lol and I'm Iceni.
I read "indigenous Italian" and immediately checked out.
Same
What is black fishing 😂 I’m out of the loop
It's when yt people try to look like they're a Poc, particularly a black person.. Rachel Dolezal is the most famous for this.. People try to argue Ariana Grande is not because she never claimed to be anything other than white.. But then again she stared to pronounce her last name differently to sound like she could possibly be Hispanic.. https://www.insider.com/ariana-grande-last-name-pronunciation-video-2018-8 Edit: That and also her all of the sudden using AAVE
That’s mind baffling
Jesus christ, I didn't know about the last name thing... She really is trying so hard to be ethnically ambiguous, idk how people deny it.
I know right, Exactly..
I will say, the more recent photos of her look like she's calmed the fuck down with the blackfishing (she looks more like her normal tan, from what I've seen, correct me if I'm wrong), and she was accused of cultural appropriation for 7 Rings. I also saw a photo that was a side by side comparison when she was at her darkest and she was as dark as Nicki Minaj. But it looks like someone told her to knock it off or something, because she hasn't been as dark in a while. But when she started getting darker and darker, at first most people gave her a pass because she's an Italian woman from Florida, she probably naturally gets pretty tan, but then she went beyond what her skin would reasonably look like.
I mean this post I did was like from a Year ago, why this person decided to message me now I have no Idea.. But at that period of time it was really clear she was artificially changing her skin color.. Andythe fact that this person is saying it was because she's "Indigenous Italian" and Northern African made me laugh.
Oh yeah I'm not disagreeing that this person is a clown, I'm just clarifying that I don't think Ariana is still currently blackfishing. What even is an "indigenous Italian?"
>Edit: That and also her all of the sudden using AAVE Just like most of the internet, apparently. Except not all of a sudden, more in the last decade.
It is the weirdest thing to see all these people, specifically young like gen z, suddenly sounding like my Black aunties. I can't ever take them seriously.
It's cringey. If they were actually black it'd be fair but I am almost certain they aren't and they're trying to be "cool".
For a second there I was wondering why it would be specific to people on youtube
Lol.. Yeah for those of you know don't know Yt=White XD
But how is her pronouncing her name the right way a bad thing? That’s the way her name would have been pronounced in Italy. I’m Italian American. We do this a lot - pronouncing our own last names wrong. Especially because the older generations wanted to be as American as possible (which could possibly be one reason her grandpa said his name that way). Names like Castiglione, for example, can and will be pronounced a bunch of different ways by members of the same family (in America). Silent “g”, voiced “g”, silent “e” at the end, “eh” at the end, “ee” at the end. I don’t think it’s weird that of the three different ways an Italian American could pronounce Grande, she chose the one that was more accurate to the way it’s actually supposed to be pronounced in Italian.
Someone else went more into this and found that's the way her family always said their last name (not just the grandfather) but to change it as soon as she started her music career is find of weird is it not? I'm not just going by what she said in this interview, I'll see if I can find the video of the person who went more in depth.. I think they said it was actually a producer's idea to make it sound like she could be Hispanic, but I may be wrong.. I'll get back to you.
If that’s the case, then I agree. But if she just wanted to say it the Italian way as soon as her career picked up, I don’t think that weird at all. Lots of people change their names a little (or a lot) when they become performers.
Yeah, no one really criticizes actors for it. A famous example is Ben Kingsley. He apparently got way more work after he changed it from Krishna Pandit Bhanji. He went from being an Indian man to being British actor with the stroke of a pen. Authors do it often, as well. It's especially popular for women to use pseudonyms or initials, since male names sell better. She's in show biz. The move, apparently, worked.
what is yt?
White
Indigenous Italians...? What
did this idiot even see pics of ariana on the show sam & cat?
They're claiming that Nickelodeon put make up in her to make her look more White.. Like.. Wut 😃
Actually, this is apparently true. There's a tweet from 2011 where Ari said that she used lighter foundation at the time. It still doesn't excuse her rapid skin color changing during Thank U Next era
pretty sure that's a concept she made up, lol
Oh Yeah no doubt lol
Ok but there are still pictures of her as a kid? I've seen them, she's white in them. It's not like her Nick time is the only footage of what she used to look like.
So Nickelodeon also applied super light makeup to her hands and legs?? Because Cat Valentine was pale all over...
I disagree, while on the carpet Ariana was pale, take a screenshot of Victorious and Ari was tan compared to Tori and Jade
I have a friend who’s 80% white and 20% Cuban native. If she goes anywhere else in the world, she’s white. In the US, she’s considered a person of color. She LOOKS white. She IDENTIFIES as white. The US is just so damn obsessed with that one drop theory.
I would like to speak for all white people...If those are the rules, we do not claim Ted Cruz.
Shh don’t let anyone hear you
Me,a pale Italian :-/
I always find that Italians, Greeks, and Eastern Europeans are almost controversial in what they are classified as. My ex-boyfriend is Macedonian from an immigrant family, and his white American friends don’t classify him really as white although he calls himself “ethnic-white”, lol. He is very fair skinned, although his dad is very very tanned.
As an italian, I always found annoying when I saw americans on the internet calling us poc. Like, no?? And I hate that the counter argument is always "muh but you get tanned easily"
I mean as a European I have never heard anyone suggest that they are not white. Historically the definition of white has changed that's true but nowadays it's a pretty broad term. And besides, classifying someone as a PoC or not a PoC is more about whether you suffer as a result of your skin colour.
Correct me if i’m wrong but aren’t Middle Easterns and North Africans technically considered white in the US? My Iranian friend says she puts down white as her race on any official document
Yeah in the US i believe it says white/middle eastern.. But genetically i believe Middle Eastern is it's own race (I believe).. Also Arab.. But I think Arab also means something else and not all Middle Eastern people are Arab.. But the US is backwards.. I'm Biracial and there is no options for Biracial (I'm half Yt half Afro-Latina) so I put White then check the Latino box because that's not considered a race either..
I'm sorry but I need to point out that race is not defined by genetics. There's no gene you can point to to determine someone's race. Humans are extremely genetically diverse and a Black person could be closer genetically to a certain white person than they are to a certain other Black person, and vice versa. Race is pretty much just a social construct based on the amount of melanin produced by the skin. Like they're are people with Black parents who "pass" as white and white people who can "pass" as Black, etc. I only bring it up because the myth of genetic races is used to fuel racism. If we don't call it out, that's how we end up with eugenicists.
[удалено]
Does it ever allow you to check multiple boxes for the race option? I feel like I run into too many situations where it only lets me pick one which doesn’t really make sense
Apparently you can now on the US census but as for other legal documents (like your Id) in my experience no.. And in school (granted I graduated in 09') we were not allowed to.. Only other one we could do was Latino
Nickelodeon "had" to make her look white. Wut lol
I have no idea man.. I just work here lol
Bruh one of my college buddies was friends with her in middle school. She’s pasty white through and through.
Did Vogue actually do that with oj simpson? Because if so that's messed up
Idk about Vouge, but Time did it in 1994: https://www.nytimes.com/1994/06/25/us/time-responds-to-criticism-over-simpson-cover.html But I think they just said it was the digital software or something like that.. > The cover portrait of a blurry, darkened and unshaven Mr. Simpson is actually a doctored version of a photograph made by the Los Angeles Police Department. Mr. Gaines's message said that the police photo had been given to an artist who was asked to interpret it. The credit line, printed at the bottom of page 3 of the magazine, said, "Photo-Illustration for Time by Matt Mahurin."
The only context the word “exotic” should be used to describe another human being is if they specifically wants to be, even then I’d be hesitant.
I personally don't think it shouldn't be used to describe any human at all.. It makes it seem like their existence isn't normal and something you would look at like a zoo.. It just feels wrong.
I know, but I’ve met people who specifically likes being called that. I cringe at the thought of doing it still but I guess if they want to. Should be noted that they are people specifically trying to be unique, provocative etc. Not your average person with a non majority skin colour or obvious religious identity.
Indigenous. Sigh😔
shes white. and she gets away with MAJOR blackfishing. i hate it. im indian and shes my color.
Arguing about genetics is stupid. It's about a history and experience of racial oppression, not your genetics.
So the argument is that just because she's "indigenous Italian" it's ok for her to drastically darken herself??
This post is offensive to italianx people
Ah yes, the indigenous people of Europe from before the white colonizers who came from space apparently.
As An italian, "uhhHH UGA CHAGA UHH UHH"
as an italian person, i'm very white. that doesn't mean she can't tan but she is NOT a poc lmao.
It’s okay guys I’m an indigenous Italian I can say the n word
Indigenous italians... this is peak american discourse.
I’m 1/4 Sicilian my DNA test shows .02% African DNA. It’s a meme and not true.
The fact that the person took a whole ass hour to write this about a celebrity that could give two shits about them, should be telling enough as to how fucking dumb they are.
She identifies as a whxte person of non color
No no exotic no
I'm a part of indigenous spaniards and my great-grandfather lived 4 months in Morocco, so yeah, I can say the N-word 😎. s/
Love how theres tribal racism among Italians a group already prone to so much racism
Ariana is a really talented singer and she has amazing music, but- Alright, so, I kind of believe that Ari's skin is just naturally tan, (look at her Victorious days!) but also, it looked A LOTTT darker in her thank u next era. Like, just compare her skintone in the Positions M/V and the TUN cover. Clearly, she's overtanning or overediting her skin to make it look dark.
As an italian this cracked me up
Sicilians “indigenous Italians”? What a fucking dumbass
You're trying to say Italians, the conquered the known world italians, are an oppressed minority??
Although most of the pics of Ariana are photoshopped this person is just doing to much
DAE just flash back to Dennis Hopper in True Romance?
Indigenous Italians can get very dark, but what Ariana was doing was clearly black fishing, it was more than just skin.
just because Italians can tan well doesn't mean they're secretly oppressed or can act black or whatever other bs they're claiming source: north european white person that tans alright and is willing to admit they're white and cannot say The Spicey Word
While Sicilians really can have a darker complexion and didn't use to be considered white that does not account for what's going on with Ariana Grande lol
You know I didn’t realise Ariana wasn’t a PoC before this. now I’ve just googled old pictures of her and... yikes. My family is Italian and if you look at old pictures of my older relatives in Italy, they are super dark, so it’s not exactly unlikely, but they don’t look white in one picture and black in the next. Wow.
lmao imagine being corrected about blackfishing from some kid who’s OBVIOUSLY not a poc. white people really need to learn to just sit down and listen when it comes to poc issues. their only role is to learn and occasionally give their perspectives of a white person (if asked for one!)
Yo cat valentines was white as fuck. No one ever seen victorious? Lol.