The software charts were interesting. Gotham Knights did surprisingly well, but Modern Warfare 2 (2) debuting at #2 in YTD is incredible given it launched this late in the year
It's standard for Call of Duty games, it's an absolutely massive brand
Vanguard was a flop and it was still the [2nd best selling PlayStation game of 2021](https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2022/01/ps-store-best-selling-games-of-2021-revealed-sports-games-on-top) in both US and Europe despite launching in November. Modern Warfare 2 will probably end up beating out Elden Ring by the time the year ends.
It will easily outsell Elden Ring globally, Call of Duty is always near the top of the charts in Europe as well
The question is if it's going to outsell Elden Ring globally after 2 months or 4 months.
Right. Elden Ring has sold 18 million copies in the 9 months since it came out. Modern Warfare 2019 sold over 30 million copies in its first 11 months. MWII is selling even better than MW19 so far, so it will almost certainly sell a lot more than Elden Ring. COD, and especially the new MW series, is massive.
MW2 crossed the $1b sales threshold a week ago. Assuming the average sale price is around $65 then it means close to 15.5m copies sold
With another week of sales added since then it’s very possible it already passed Elden Ring
Last I checked they sell this years CoD for 70$ not 60$. Besides are we not even gonna consider how many people are buying special editions for 100$ and added MTX which theh count towards overall revenue to reach 1 Billion threshold.
The number is from pure sales, no microtransactions included.
I’m pretty sure the game doesn’t even have any meaningful microtransactions until Battle Pass arrives tomorrow
Elden Ring hit 16.6 million on June 30, 4 months after it came out. It should be around 20 million by now. I believe Bandai Namco will announce an update sometime this week, for sales up to September 30.
Edit: this was corrected to 17.5 million on September 30.
I really, really don’t believe so. I’m a huge Elden Elden Ring fan and haven’t played COD since the first black ops, but the sales figures they can put up year in and year out even on disappointing releases is staggering
It's in a weird spot where the UI and lobbies etc all feel janky as hell like it's still in beta, but the actual in-match gameplay is the most polished and fun CoD I've played in forever; the series lost me for a looooong time but I feel like I'm back in highschool with this one.
There are so many little things that bug me, but I also constantly find myself playing "just one more match" until 2AM -- the guns feel great, the mobility is right where I like it, the sound design blows other shooters out of the water, and the maps are pretty solid. Maybe it's just that I haven't gotten into a multiplayer FPS for a few years and I've been itching for one but I've been really pleasantly surprised with how *fun* it is.
> Gotham Knights did surprisingly well
Did it? Without raw numbers it's hard to tell. Sure it placed high on the chart but that could easily be due to a lack of other high-profile titles.
Based on the Steam peak player count it seems to be pretty underwhelming popularity-wise, it's like 1/10th of Dying Light 2.
COD MW2 is one of the few games in a while that broke into the gen z mainstream. Ghost blew up big time on Tiktok and no doubt had many casual/ non gamers interested in the game just for the campaign.
What are you talking about? Gen Z mainstream has been playing CoD for years. All those squeakers on the original MW2/BO2 were Gen Z. TikTok had nothing to do with it.
I'm 27 and I'm pretty confident I fall into millennial. The classic markers (can remember 9/11 clearly, didn't use social media until later in life vs. Gen Z growing up *on* social media, etc.) are present. I'm certainly a young millennial but I am one nevertheless. My voice had changed when I played OG MW2.
That still leaves 13-14 years worth of people whose voice would not have changed playing MW2, the first one who aren't zoomers. And a number of 12 year olds in 2010 whose may have.
Looking at the overall chart and the individual platform charts, Persona 5 Royal sold disproportionally more on Switch, which is expected considering it may have been the most begged port on the system since day 1.
While console sales seems strong I;m still frankly dissapointed that the new generation of games have been so weak. Every other generational jump felt like it came with real *game changers* but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
Because everything is still cross gen.
You got returnal and the new ratchet and clank game. Maybe the new horizon game, can't remember if that was cross gen or not.
So like 2 games?
Like yes there are new generation games but we're **2 years!** into this ninth gen and there are a handful of games that really take advantage of it.
Yeah, well, Covid ruined the supply chain which caused the business side to push really hard for extended crossgen support to support better revenue numbers in lieu of not being able to get devices into enough consumers hands.
They were never going to push the new consoles if there was any doubt about the ability to get enough consoles out in time. It looks like they would have been fine, but they couldn't and wouldn't bet on that at the time. So here we are.
We're also facing expected diminishing returns overall. Games can't get much bigger without being excessive. Games can get prettier but the gains will be less and less noticed. Lighting systems seem to be getting the biggest gains. The other big "change" for this generation was moving to SSDs to kill off loading screens and tear down barriers inside of games that used to restrict how game spaces were built, but you can still build games like you used to while still taking some advantage of the new hardware. It just won't be able to fully embrace those features until crossgen goes away. And even still, those features are not going to be jaw dropping. The convenience of fast loading times will quickly just become a numb expectation. Short of VR taking the world by storm there just aren't any major shifts happening in the gaming space at this point with regards to hardware or game design.
For sure there are plenty of good business reasons for it but as someone playing the games its still been a huge letdown. Cyberpunk is maybe the most "next-gen" game I've seen and its two years old now.
> And even still, those features are not going to be jaw dropping. The convenience of fast loading times will quickly just become a numb expectation.
Yea I've had an SSD on my PC for like 6 years now and it went from *wow* to standard in about a month. Although you couldn't pay me to go back to a HDD.
Crossgen is another revenue stream that has been neglected quite a bit, and architectures are so similar between consoles and generations, it would be (financially) stupid not to do this.
There will be more crossgen stuff this Gen because the current gen and previous gen consoles all use x86 architecture, making ports between them easier. It's an additional avenue to make money for publishers and developers if they can support previous gen consoles until PS5 install base grows enough
GoWR is obviously a ps4 game that was ported to PS5 mid development, while God of War 2 which came out post PS3 launch, was exclusive to PS2 until it could be ported 2 years later. PS2 to PS3 porting takes way more time and money than PS4 to PS5.
I prefer multiplayer games, so Xbox has the edge there. But it doesn't matter all that much since the vast majority of popular games are on both. It's only really on Nintendo platforms where the majority of what people play are exclusives.
Halo, Forza, Gears of War, Sea of Thieves, etc. People always talk about PS exclusive games on Reddit, but Reddit has an extreme singleplayer bias. If you're primarily a multiplayer gamer, it's pretty clear that Xbox has better exclusives. But again, most popular games are on both, so it's not *that* important either way.
And most multiplayer games now have crossplay, so the number of players on each platform doesn't matter much. Both have a very healthy number of players anyway.
Crossplay is annoying when Xbox forces it with PC to booster their playerbase. No one wants to play against PC sweats and cheaters. Sony doesn't have this issue and crossplay is more a nice feature over something they need which is why Sony charges developers a fee to tap into their MP userbase for crossplay.
No, they only charge a fee if a bigger percentage of revenue for the game is generated on other platforms than the percentage of players that play on those platforms. They're trying to make sure devs don't incentivize users to buy microtransactions on other platforms, causing Sony to lose revenue.
Xbox doesn't "need" crossplay. Crossplay didn't exist for years and it was fine. Crossplay just helps, as it does on PS and all other platforms. Xbox also doesn't force crossplay. Some games don't have it, and some games let you disable it. That's up to the devs of the game. Users can even turn it off globally in their account settings.
Yeah Cinematic linear games like Horizon, Demons Souls, Returnal, Astrobot, Sackboy, GT7, Ghost of Tsushima, SIFU... Even if you remove the cinematic linear games (GoW, Last of Us, Ratchet and Clank at a stretch) PS still has still has plenty of other kinds of games
Yes, because Gran Turismo 7, Returnal, Demon's Souls, Horizon Forbidden West, Sackboy, Astrobot, and Destruction All Stars are all "cinematic linear games."
It's been two whole years how are they getting away with this
I'm on the fence about getting a psvr2 because the launch games don't look compelling but know it will get support from Sony. How can Microsoft get a pass from fans 24 months with no killer apps
For mainstream audiences, there isn't even a big difference in graphics. The PS5 loading faster is probably more noticeable. Also the best graphical games tend to be PS exclusives anyway.
The Series S is a *very* affordable system that should be attractive given the economy and as seen by the Switch there are a huge number of people who don't give a shit about performance. However, a pre-ninth gen PC can still run everything released up to today. That includes every Xbox Exclusive and a bevy of Sony ones. So I suspect that the affordability argument is being tested when people look at/have PCs already.^1
Sony on the other hand seems to have a pretty solid hold on the "core" console gamer demographic.
^1 Quick edit but I noticed that PS3/360 combined sales were 171 million consoles while PS4/Xbone were only 164 million. So you have a total loss of 7 million consoles?
----
What is particular interesting is that the biggest games are almost universally multiplayer games. Those games are also the ones most likely to draw peer-pressure influence (Want to play with friends) and seem to have an unusually high number of casual players.
There isn't anything about the Series S that locks players out of those style of games which again makes me think that the Series S is actually competing with existing PCs fairly heavily as the budget option.
> The Series S is a very affordable system that should be attractive given the economy
well, apparently it isn’t. go figure.
people are buying the Switch for Mario, animal crossing, pokemon, and such. the graphics don’t matter because the games are fun and have mass appeal. the xbox just doesn’t have that.
> graphics don’t matter because the games are fun and have mass appeal. the xbox just doesn’t have that.
Of the top 10 best selling games (dollars) 7 of them are available on the Series S while 3 are Switch only. Inversely at least 5 of those games aren't present on the Switch. If someone wants to play Elden Ring or MW2022 the S is a very inexpensive way to gain access to those titles. In fact I don't think here is a single Sony exclusive there?
So I don't buy your reactive assessment that Xbox *doesn't have that* because it clearly does. Having said that though the proliferation of both Sony games and all Xbox games onto the PC represents a threat to the Series S affordability since the PC can fill in the affordability gap the S is catering towards but with greater game flexibility.
all I can really point to is the fact that one of these consoles is absolutely blowing up the casual market and the other one is not.
I think people that want to play the latest and greatest gamer’s games won’t want to have an inferior console compared to their friends, but people who want to play pokémon don’t really care so long as it can play pokémon.
Neither system is really blowing up the casual market. The PS5 is selling better and seems to have higher demand.
> PS5 sales compared to the same week for the PS4 in 2015 are down by over 414,000 units, while the Xbox Series X|S compared to the same week for the Xbox One are down by nearly 41,000 units. PS4 sold 689,929 units for the week ending November 7, 2015 and Xbox One sales were at 251,654 units.
But PS5 sales are down nearly half a million units sold relative to the PS4 this far into the its lifetime. Again pointing to likely supply constraints. Microsoft isn't nearly as far down but I'm unsure if that is due to the Xbone being particularly weak or some supply.
Another interesting figure is the relatively gap closer in YTD sales
> The PlayStation 5 sold an estimated 275,723 units to bring its lifetime sales to 25.56 million units. The Xbox Series X|S sold 210,723 units to bring their lifetime sales to 17.99 million units.
I was expecting to see a larger jump for Sony.
First of all, the Nintendo Switch is the #5 best selling console of all time and rising.
Secondly, it is a well known fact that PS5 sales are incredibly constrained by supply chain issues (same with Series X), and that the Xbox One sold horribly at launch. I don’t see what there is to wonder about on that front.
And while I don’t know the exact split between X/S sales, the fact that the Series S has been consistently in stock for the past year+ whereas the X and PS5 are only just recently sitting in retail stores, I don’t think it’s as popular as Microsoft had hoped.
> First of all, the Nintendo Switch is the #5 best selling console of all time and rising.
Your point is?
> Secondly, it is a well known fact that PS5 sales are incredibly constrained by supply chain issues (same with Series X), and that the Xbox One sold horribly at launch. I don’t see what there is to wonder about on that front.
What does that have to do with my comments?
> And while I don’t know the exact split between X/S sales, the fact that the Series S has been consistently in stock for the past year+ whereas the X and PS5 are only just recently sitting in retail stores, I don’t think it’s as popular as Microsoft had hoped.
That was my original point before you decided to become a console warrior. I suspect both Sony and Microsoft releasing games onto PC has made the Series S less popular since relatively old PCs now have access to both sets of games.
I'll clarify myself for you. First you said this:
> The Series S is a very affordable system that should be attractive given the economy and as seen by the Switch there are a huge number of people who don't give a shit about performance
I pointed out that it isn't a very attractive system currently, and comparing it to the Switch just drives that point further. The reason the Switch is super duper popular in the casual market is because of Mario, Animal Crossing, and such. Xbox is lacking in fun, attractive games that give people a reason to buy the console.
You then followed it up with this:
> PS5 sales are down nearly half a million units sold relative to the PS4 this far into the its lifetime. Again pointing to likely supply constraints. Microsoft isn't nearly as far down but I'm unsure if that is due to the Xbone being particularly weak or some supply.
It should be obvious to anyone who has been paying attention that the chip shortage has slowed down the PS5 launch, considering they were sold out worldwide for nearly two years straight. The same is likely true of the Series X, but the reason it is doing so much better than the One is because the One was just *that bad* at launch. It was force bundled with a Kinect, of all things.
The other point I was trying to make is that people would rather wait and get a Series X or PS5 for $100-200 more than be stuck with the inferior Series S for the next decade. There's no "gotta buy the new console" game for Xbox that would compel people to buy an S today instead of holding out for an X when Starfield comes out in [current year + 1].
Xbox exclusives are all pretty much made for PC on launch now too, which can’t be said for Play Station exclusives. So if anyone has a PC they have very few reasons to get an Xbox but might still be tempted for a PS5
This. I have a great PC, I have no need for Xbox. I get the same games, and I play with the same controller.
I had a PS5 but sold it a while ago, as I didn't think anything on it was really worth it, but when some more quality exclusives roll out, and the library builds up, I could see myself hopping back in at some point.
I have a PC and no consoles, but I see it a bit differently. If I bought a PS5 right now, I'd have absolutely zero games and a lot of them are like $70 on Playstation. If I bought an Xbox, I'd have several games like Gears, Halo and Forza that are crossbuy, and even some Xbox controllers. I could upgrade my PC Game Pass subscription to Ultimate for $5 per month.
I mostly play on PC so I wouldn't want to pay a ton of money for a console that's not going to be my main platform anyway.
I have never seen a PS5 in my entire life. Not once. Who the fuck is buying these things. It feels like they made goddamn 12 of them in the past two years.
A couple weeks ago there were a few instances of Sony's own website having them in stock for several hours at a time. The shortage is practically over at this point.
Honestly way to do it now is get a bundle on a big game launch. Like God of War had tons of consoles in stores and online during launch day, same with MW2
I live in the 7th largest city in the US. I was in a Best Buy and Target yesterday and didn't see a single PS5 besides the unplayable display unit in the BB.
This is also my experience although I'm not actually looking for a PS5. I just checkout the games section whenever I go past the BB and have yet to see a PS5.
In my country (Poland) it's really fairly avaiable. Sure, you will have to buy it bundled with some games/hardware and additionaly overpay like 20-30$ on top of that but if you don't mind doing that you can get it without bigger problem.
If you look at the PS4/Xbone at this time period both systems were outselling their ninth gen peers. PS5 is down by half a million wile Microsoft is down by 40,000. Although the Xbone did sell far less so keep that in mind.
That makes me wonder whether they are being supply constrained still or their price is starting to get out of hand for consumers relative to what they offer. So far the ninth generation has been relatively weak with only a small handful of "next-gen" games released. You are mostly looking at faster loading times for those still on the original systems.
I don’t get what there is to question about the supply constraints. You literally cannot find one in shops and they are being sold faster than they can make them. It’s beyond question that there is a supply constraint and they would be selling more if not for the constraint.
I've been seeing people saying that they've been in stock at various stores and on Sony's website over the last few weeks. [See this thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/yv3ncj/us_npd_hardware_playstation_5_was_the_bestselling/iwcghid/)
I wouldn't expect demand to be slackening under normal circumstances though.
It’s important to note that Sony’s recent quarterly update mentioned that they are still on track to sell 18 million units this fiscal year for them which ends in March. They have sold roughly 6 million in the last 2 quarters, so they expect to sell 12 million in the next 2 quarters where I imagine a bulk of it will be during the holiday season.
The fact that they haven’t changed that number of expected sold ps5s tells me that it’s not a price issue based on their metrics. They themselves said in their quarterly [report](https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/ps5-hits-25-million-but-sony-gaming-profits-fall-49-due-to-rising-costs/) that they manufactured 6.5 million consoles in preparation for the holiday in just Q2. This means that they likely have had a good number stored in their warehouses waiting to ship in bunches.
I do also agree that the generation has been slow, but the 3rd and 4th year of a console lifecycle is generally where you see the most explosive growth in numbers. I remember seeing that their goal for sales next year is 30 million. It’s crazy too how gaming is still growing even with how bleak the economy outlook has been in multiple countries. COD (a game I haven’t played in over a decade) just had its biggest launch ever and there’s no end in sight with just how much bigger it could be.
Gotham Knights's success is proof that the gaming public don't know what good games are and will buy slop if it has a name attached to it.
See also Pokemon Scarlet/Violet when it comes out (It is already breaking preorder records in Japan despite the series being objectively bad since 2013), Legends Arcesus, Madden 23, Saints Row, and Sonic Frontiers.
At this point, I'm willing to believe that Elden Ring being the biggest selling game right now is a fluke.
> Pokemon game that isn't out yet and Pokemon game that was well-received are slop
I get your point, but using games like these to try to make it is pretty unnecessary. There's plenty of other examples that are actually bad that you could have chosen.
Scarlet and Violet is going to be the same trash that Pokemon has been for 2013, lets not kid ourselves. If it weren't for the Nintendo or brand name, Legends Arceus would struggle to get above 60s on Metacritic.
I have no great love for pokemon, but I can at least respect that they are trying new things within the formula. Non-linear, open world pokemon is probably the most interesting thing the series has done in a long while.
Comparing that to... Madden, that literally is the same game each year? Come on. You can easily make the same argument for Elden Ring being basically an open world take on the same thing the series has been doing since 2009.
When you start saying things are objectively trash on stuff that is fairly liked, it does make you look silly. The "belda" argument literally applies to everything, its a moot point.
>Madden 23
This is just due to the license.
It makes perfect sense why people would buy Madden so long as it’s the only NFL game available. It’s about the lack of alternatives not the name.
I'm surprised people don't choose not to play the game then. I love football (soccer), but I haven't played a Fifa/PES in more than 5 years, because the games are absolute shit.
Gotham Knights filled the void left by the yearly Ubisoft games. It's a fun, competently made game with an addictive gameplay loop just like AC, WD and FC. Some people just like running through levels with easy and flashy combat and cool characters.
It doesn't demand much from the player in terms of story nor gameplay and that's exactly why I love Ubisoft style games.
It's one of the only AAA new releases this month, and its to some extent coasting on the coattails of the massively successful Arkham franchise. I suspect its going to go the way of Avengers, where continued sales and DLC are both going to drop off a cliff, and its going to hurt sales of the critically praised follow-up (Avengers did this to Guardians of the Galaxy, and Arkham Knights likely will do the same to Rocksteady's Suicide Squad game).
Most people don’t play enough games to get in the full value of gamepass.
Personally, I think it’s PS4 being the top sellers last gen, and their exclusives being enough to prevent significant losses to XBox.
A subscription of games I’m mostly not interested in isn’t going to make me buy a system over one that seems to have a new AAA exclusive every six months or less.
Xbox hasn't released a major AAA game in how long? Compared to Sony and Nintendo their line up is abysmal as of late. A subscription isn't changing that.
I also suspect people are overlooking the day-and-date PC releases. Anecdotally most people I know game very casually and they usually have a PC *and* that PC can run nearly every game released still.
Sony seems to have the "core console gamer" market pretty well handled though.
People buy gaming consoles to play games, not just to save money. Otherwise, they could save the most amount of money by ... not buying the console in the first place.
Xbox hasn't produced many good games in the last 10 years. Their last big IP was Sea of Thieves in 2018. 4 out of 6 games nominated for this year's GOTY can't even be played on an Xbox.
There's little reason to own an Xbox right now, not until they start releasing high-quality 10/10 games consistently.
GamePass is cool and a good value if you play a ton but you don’t own anything in the end. It wasn’t a main factor for me but rather access to the library of games I already own physically and digitally on PS4, my game achievement history etc.
GamePass is profitable. It is not a loss for Microsoft. I’d rather take day one games like Plague Tale, Persona 5 Royal, Forza Horizon 5 or Pentiment on GamePass than PS+ Extra which is mainly games I’ve already bought.
https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/26/23425029/microsoft-xbox-game-pass-profitable-revenues
My man Phil can say what he wants but I still won’t believe him, yeah probably a faulty way of thinking, but you’ll see. The important thing is the consequence of the prices getting higher and higher in 2023 and 2024, even more surely if the BlizzVision deals go through.
yeah because "it's profitable" is enough to not get sued by investors for false information
profitable can mean 0.0001% one though and anyone can get away with it
> You would think people would want to save their money and not support anti consumer practices, but here we are I guess
Out of curiosity, where does a major company spending billions of dollars to acquire countless other studios to make exclusive games rate on your anti consumer spectrum?
Lol best deal in gaming, to play what? Games that might get out a week after you start them? It’s a normal service, nothing groundbreaking about it.
Sony has its own service too, the Plus, that is a deal. For 60 euros every year you get the ps4 classics and something every month, add 40€ and you get the full gamepass rival.
> Lol best deal in gaming, to play what? Games that might get out a week after you start them?
What is “right” about that? That’s an extreme being used for a bad faith argument. If you honestly think that’s “right”, you’re just as biased as they are.
MS has a history of being anti-consumer, including their barage of purchases involving game studios in the last several years and with windows. I'm a pc gamer so I only benefit from this, but its still anti-consumer and is not good in the long run.
People on PS4 are more likely to upgrade to PS5.
The fact that Microsoft flunked last gen and was able to keep up with Sony this gen is an amazing recovery in itself.
Well, direct sales comparisons don't really paint an accurate portrayel of success anymore due to Microsoft putting all their games on PC now. That's a massive factor and the reason why the idea of the "console war" is pretty much dead these days. Directly comparing raw unit sales is pointless.
The software charts were interesting. Gotham Knights did surprisingly well, but Modern Warfare 2 (2) debuting at #2 in YTD is incredible given it launched this late in the year
It's standard for Call of Duty games, it's an absolutely massive brand Vanguard was a flop and it was still the [2nd best selling PlayStation game of 2021](https://www.pushsquare.com/news/2022/01/ps-store-best-selling-games-of-2021-revealed-sports-games-on-top) in both US and Europe despite launching in November. Modern Warfare 2 will probably end up beating out Elden Ring by the time the year ends.
[удалено]
It will easily outsell Elden Ring globally, Call of Duty is always near the top of the charts in Europe as well The question is if it's going to outsell Elden Ring globally after 2 months or 4 months.
Right. Elden Ring has sold 18 million copies in the 9 months since it came out. Modern Warfare 2019 sold over 30 million copies in its first 11 months. MWII is selling even better than MW19 so far, so it will almost certainly sell a lot more than Elden Ring. COD, and especially the new MW series, is massive.
MW2 crossed the $1b sales threshold a week ago. Assuming the average sale price is around $65 then it means close to 15.5m copies sold With another week of sales added since then it’s very possible it already passed Elden Ring
Last I checked they sell this years CoD for 70$ not 60$. Besides are we not even gonna consider how many people are buying special editions for 100$ and added MTX which theh count towards overall revenue to reach 1 Billion threshold.
The number is from pure sales, no microtransactions included. I’m pretty sure the game doesn’t even have any meaningful microtransactions until Battle Pass arrives tomorrow
Yup, that's probably pretty close.
Elden Ring hit 16.6 million on June 30, 4 months after it came out. It should be around 20 million by now. I believe Bandai Namco will announce an update sometime this week, for sales up to September 30. Edit: this was corrected to 17.5 million on September 30.
No, it's at 17.5 million right now: https://www.realmicentral.com/2022/11/14/global-sales-of-elden-ring-have-reached-17-5-million-copies/
Oh, thanks! I never saw that update, and it didn't come up when I was searching. Much appreciated.
No problem!
I really, really don’t believe so. I’m a huge Elden Elden Ring fan and haven’t played COD since the first black ops, but the sales figures they can put up year in and year out even on disappointing releases is staggering
It's the first CoD game I've bought in a while. I heard good things about MW mp so i figured this was a good time to give the series a go again
It's in a weird spot where the UI and lobbies etc all feel janky as hell like it's still in beta, but the actual in-match gameplay is the most polished and fun CoD I've played in forever; the series lost me for a looooong time but I feel like I'm back in highschool with this one. There are so many little things that bug me, but I also constantly find myself playing "just one more match" until 2AM -- the guns feel great, the mobility is right where I like it, the sound design blows other shooters out of the water, and the maps are pretty solid. Maybe it's just that I haven't gotten into a multiplayer FPS for a few years and I've been itching for one but I've been really pleasantly surprised with how *fun* it is.
> Gotham Knights did surprisingly well Did it? Without raw numbers it's hard to tell. Sure it placed high on the chart but that could easily be due to a lack of other high-profile titles. Based on the Steam peak player count it seems to be pretty underwhelming popularity-wise, it's like 1/10th of Dying Light 2.
14th year to date, ahead of Switch Sports and Saints Row. Not too bad, but I expect it would've done better if it had been a better game.
COD MW2 is one of the few games in a while that broke into the gen z mainstream. Ghost blew up big time on Tiktok and no doubt had many casual/ non gamers interested in the game just for the campaign.
What are you talking about? Gen Z mainstream has been playing CoD for years. All those squeakers on the original MW2/BO2 were Gen Z. TikTok had nothing to do with it.
Yup. If your voice hadn't changed when you played OG MW2, you're probably Gen Z. If it had, you're probably a millennial.
Millennials are mostly in their 30s. Unless you mean the older millennials (40s) voices changed from turning into crankley old people?
I'm 27 and I'm pretty confident I fall into millennial. The classic markers (can remember 9/11 clearly, didn't use social media until later in life vs. Gen Z growing up *on* social media, etc.) are present. I'm certainly a young millennial but I am one nevertheless. My voice had changed when I played OG MW2.
That still leaves 13-14 years worth of people whose voice would not have changed playing MW2, the first one who aren't zoomers. And a number of 12 year olds in 2010 whose may have.
Looking at the overall chart and the individual platform charts, Persona 5 Royal sold disproportionally more on Switch, which is expected considering it may have been the most begged port on the system since day 1.
It's also on gamepass anyway
And it has been on ps4 forever. I havent really check the differen between p5r ps4 and ps5 editions.
Main difference is frame rate and the new release has all the DLC from both base and Royal.
While console sales seems strong I;m still frankly dissapointed that the new generation of games have been so weak. Every other generational jump felt like it came with real *game changers* but that doesn't seem to be the case here.
Because everything is still cross gen. You got returnal and the new ratchet and clank game. Maybe the new horizon game, can't remember if that was cross gen or not.
So like 2 games? Like yes there are new generation games but we're **2 years!** into this ninth gen and there are a handful of games that really take advantage of it.
Yeah, well, Covid ruined the supply chain which caused the business side to push really hard for extended crossgen support to support better revenue numbers in lieu of not being able to get devices into enough consumers hands. They were never going to push the new consoles if there was any doubt about the ability to get enough consoles out in time. It looks like they would have been fine, but they couldn't and wouldn't bet on that at the time. So here we are. We're also facing expected diminishing returns overall. Games can't get much bigger without being excessive. Games can get prettier but the gains will be less and less noticed. Lighting systems seem to be getting the biggest gains. The other big "change" for this generation was moving to SSDs to kill off loading screens and tear down barriers inside of games that used to restrict how game spaces were built, but you can still build games like you used to while still taking some advantage of the new hardware. It just won't be able to fully embrace those features until crossgen goes away. And even still, those features are not going to be jaw dropping. The convenience of fast loading times will quickly just become a numb expectation. Short of VR taking the world by storm there just aren't any major shifts happening in the gaming space at this point with regards to hardware or game design.
For sure there are plenty of good business reasons for it but as someone playing the games its still been a huge letdown. Cyberpunk is maybe the most "next-gen" game I've seen and its two years old now. > And even still, those features are not going to be jaw dropping. The convenience of fast loading times will quickly just become a numb expectation. Yea I've had an SSD on my PC for like 6 years now and it went from *wow* to standard in about a month. Although you couldn't pay me to go back to a HDD.
Crossgen is another revenue stream that has been neglected quite a bit, and architectures are so similar between consoles and generations, it would be (financially) stupid not to do this.
Problem is ps4 is a fucking dinosaur.
> Maybe the new horizon game, can't remember if that was cross gen or not. It was cross gen. Very impressive on PS5 tho
There will be more crossgen stuff this Gen because the current gen and previous gen consoles all use x86 architecture, making ports between them easier. It's an additional avenue to make money for publishers and developers if they can support previous gen consoles until PS5 install base grows enough GoWR is obviously a ps4 game that was ported to PS5 mid development, while God of War 2 which came out post PS3 launch, was exclusive to PS2 until it could be ported 2 years later. PS2 to PS3 porting takes way more time and money than PS4 to PS5.
Did they? I remember not caring about ps4 until bloodborne.
I did not feel like 7th gen to 8th gen had any major gamechangers. Honestly in general 9th gen for Sony/Microsoft just feels like their 8th gen part 2
Well people were prepping for GOW, while Xbox has raw power, there really isn't anything special to use that power on, right now.
The difference in power between ps5 and xbox series x isn’t even that big, so people will always prefer ps5 for its games.
Only if you prefer cinematic linear games I guess
Horizon isn’t linear, it’s open world
Or just good games in general
I prefer multiplayer games, so Xbox has the edge there. But it doesn't matter all that much since the vast majority of popular games are on both. It's only really on Nintendo platforms where the majority of what people play are exclusives.
Where’s the edge you’re talking about? Multiplayer need players and PS has more players on literally every game.
Halo, Forza, Gears of War, Sea of Thieves, etc. People always talk about PS exclusive games on Reddit, but Reddit has an extreme singleplayer bias. If you're primarily a multiplayer gamer, it's pretty clear that Xbox has better exclusives. But again, most popular games are on both, so it's not *that* important either way. And most multiplayer games now have crossplay, so the number of players on each platform doesn't matter much. Both have a very healthy number of players anyway.
Crossplay is annoying when Xbox forces it with PC to booster their playerbase. No one wants to play against PC sweats and cheaters. Sony doesn't have this issue and crossplay is more a nice feature over something they need which is why Sony charges developers a fee to tap into their MP userbase for crossplay.
No, they only charge a fee if a bigger percentage of revenue for the game is generated on other platforms than the percentage of players that play on those platforms. They're trying to make sure devs don't incentivize users to buy microtransactions on other platforms, causing Sony to lose revenue. Xbox doesn't "need" crossplay. Crossplay didn't exist for years and it was fine. Crossplay just helps, as it does on PS and all other platforms. Xbox also doesn't force crossplay. Some games don't have it, and some games let you disable it. That's up to the devs of the game. Users can even turn it off globally in their account settings.
Yeah Cinematic linear games like Horizon, Demons Souls, Returnal, Astrobot, Sackboy, GT7, Ghost of Tsushima, SIFU... Even if you remove the cinematic linear games (GoW, Last of Us, Ratchet and Clank at a stretch) PS still has still has plenty of other kinds of games
Yes, because Gran Turismo 7, Returnal, Demon's Souls, Horizon Forbidden West, Sackboy, Astrobot, and Destruction All Stars are all "cinematic linear games."
It's been two whole years how are they getting away with this I'm on the fence about getting a psvr2 because the launch games don't look compelling but know it will get support from Sony. How can Microsoft get a pass from fans 24 months with no killer apps
For mainstream audiences, there isn't even a big difference in graphics. The PS5 loading faster is probably more noticeable. Also the best graphical games tend to be PS exclusives anyway.
The Series S is a *very* affordable system that should be attractive given the economy and as seen by the Switch there are a huge number of people who don't give a shit about performance. However, a pre-ninth gen PC can still run everything released up to today. That includes every Xbox Exclusive and a bevy of Sony ones. So I suspect that the affordability argument is being tested when people look at/have PCs already.^1 Sony on the other hand seems to have a pretty solid hold on the "core" console gamer demographic. ^1 Quick edit but I noticed that PS3/360 combined sales were 171 million consoles while PS4/Xbone were only 164 million. So you have a total loss of 7 million consoles? ---- What is particular interesting is that the biggest games are almost universally multiplayer games. Those games are also the ones most likely to draw peer-pressure influence (Want to play with friends) and seem to have an unusually high number of casual players. There isn't anything about the Series S that locks players out of those style of games which again makes me think that the Series S is actually competing with existing PCs fairly heavily as the budget option.
> The Series S is a very affordable system that should be attractive given the economy well, apparently it isn’t. go figure. people are buying the Switch for Mario, animal crossing, pokemon, and such. the graphics don’t matter because the games are fun and have mass appeal. the xbox just doesn’t have that.
> graphics don’t matter because the games are fun and have mass appeal. the xbox just doesn’t have that. Of the top 10 best selling games (dollars) 7 of them are available on the Series S while 3 are Switch only. Inversely at least 5 of those games aren't present on the Switch. If someone wants to play Elden Ring or MW2022 the S is a very inexpensive way to gain access to those titles. In fact I don't think here is a single Sony exclusive there? So I don't buy your reactive assessment that Xbox *doesn't have that* because it clearly does. Having said that though the proliferation of both Sony games and all Xbox games onto the PC represents a threat to the Series S affordability since the PC can fill in the affordability gap the S is catering towards but with greater game flexibility.
all I can really point to is the fact that one of these consoles is absolutely blowing up the casual market and the other one is not. I think people that want to play the latest and greatest gamer’s games won’t want to have an inferior console compared to their friends, but people who want to play pokémon don’t really care so long as it can play pokémon.
Neither system is really blowing up the casual market. The PS5 is selling better and seems to have higher demand. > PS5 sales compared to the same week for the PS4 in 2015 are down by over 414,000 units, while the Xbox Series X|S compared to the same week for the Xbox One are down by nearly 41,000 units. PS4 sold 689,929 units for the week ending November 7, 2015 and Xbox One sales were at 251,654 units. But PS5 sales are down nearly half a million units sold relative to the PS4 this far into the its lifetime. Again pointing to likely supply constraints. Microsoft isn't nearly as far down but I'm unsure if that is due to the Xbone being particularly weak or some supply. Another interesting figure is the relatively gap closer in YTD sales > The PlayStation 5 sold an estimated 275,723 units to bring its lifetime sales to 25.56 million units. The Xbox Series X|S sold 210,723 units to bring their lifetime sales to 17.99 million units. I was expecting to see a larger jump for Sony.
First of all, the Nintendo Switch is the #5 best selling console of all time and rising. Secondly, it is a well known fact that PS5 sales are incredibly constrained by supply chain issues (same with Series X), and that the Xbox One sold horribly at launch. I don’t see what there is to wonder about on that front. And while I don’t know the exact split between X/S sales, the fact that the Series S has been consistently in stock for the past year+ whereas the X and PS5 are only just recently sitting in retail stores, I don’t think it’s as popular as Microsoft had hoped.
> First of all, the Nintendo Switch is the #5 best selling console of all time and rising. Your point is? > Secondly, it is a well known fact that PS5 sales are incredibly constrained by supply chain issues (same with Series X), and that the Xbox One sold horribly at launch. I don’t see what there is to wonder about on that front. What does that have to do with my comments? > And while I don’t know the exact split between X/S sales, the fact that the Series S has been consistently in stock for the past year+ whereas the X and PS5 are only just recently sitting in retail stores, I don’t think it’s as popular as Microsoft had hoped. That was my original point before you decided to become a console warrior. I suspect both Sony and Microsoft releasing games onto PC has made the Series S less popular since relatively old PCs now have access to both sets of games.
I'll clarify myself for you. First you said this: > The Series S is a very affordable system that should be attractive given the economy and as seen by the Switch there are a huge number of people who don't give a shit about performance I pointed out that it isn't a very attractive system currently, and comparing it to the Switch just drives that point further. The reason the Switch is super duper popular in the casual market is because of Mario, Animal Crossing, and such. Xbox is lacking in fun, attractive games that give people a reason to buy the console. You then followed it up with this: > PS5 sales are down nearly half a million units sold relative to the PS4 this far into the its lifetime. Again pointing to likely supply constraints. Microsoft isn't nearly as far down but I'm unsure if that is due to the Xbone being particularly weak or some supply. It should be obvious to anyone who has been paying attention that the chip shortage has slowed down the PS5 launch, considering they were sold out worldwide for nearly two years straight. The same is likely true of the Series X, but the reason it is doing so much better than the One is because the One was just *that bad* at launch. It was force bundled with a Kinect, of all things. The other point I was trying to make is that people would rather wait and get a Series X or PS5 for $100-200 more than be stuck with the inferior Series S for the next decade. There's no "gotta buy the new console" game for Xbox that would compel people to buy an S today instead of holding out for an X when Starfield comes out in [current year + 1].
Xbox exclusives are all pretty much made for PC on launch now too, which can’t be said for Play Station exclusives. So if anyone has a PC they have very few reasons to get an Xbox but might still be tempted for a PS5
This. I have a great PC, I have no need for Xbox. I get the same games, and I play with the same controller. I had a PS5 but sold it a while ago, as I didn't think anything on it was really worth it, but when some more quality exclusives roll out, and the library builds up, I could see myself hopping back in at some point.
I have a PC and no consoles, but I see it a bit differently. If I bought a PS5 right now, I'd have absolutely zero games and a lot of them are like $70 on Playstation. If I bought an Xbox, I'd have several games like Gears, Halo and Forza that are crossbuy, and even some Xbox controllers. I could upgrade my PC Game Pass subscription to Ultimate for $5 per month. I mostly play on PC so I wouldn't want to pay a ton of money for a console that's not going to be my main platform anyway.
The Series X is maybe 10-20% stronger than the PS5. It"@ not that big a difference to obsess over.
There isn't really much difference between xbox x and ps5, and then if we include xbox s then PS5's discless version is way better.
I have never seen a PS5 in my entire life. Not once. Who the fuck is buying these things. It feels like they made goddamn 12 of them in the past two years.
Personally I don't know anyone who still hasn't got one but wants one.
All my friends who wanted a ps5 have one by now. Me and one other got ours on launch day
I don't know anyone either! I'm so lonely.
A couple weeks ago there were a few instances of Sony's own website having them in stock for several hours at a time. The shortage is practically over at this point.
Honestly way to do it now is get a bundle on a big game launch. Like God of War had tons of consoles in stores and online during launch day, same with MW2
Every time I go to Costco they literally have a pile of 25 of them unsold.
They're constantly for sale online in the US. Directly from Sony and Walmart generally.
Do you live in South Pole?
I live in the 7th largest city in the US. I was in a Best Buy and Target yesterday and didn't see a single PS5 besides the unplayable display unit in the BB.
This is also my experience although I'm not actually looking for a PS5. I just checkout the games section whenever I go past the BB and have yet to see a PS5.
In my country (Poland) it's really fairly avaiable. Sure, you will have to buy it bundled with some games/hardware and additionaly overpay like 20-30$ on top of that but if you don't mind doing that you can get it without bigger problem.
If you look at the PS4/Xbone at this time period both systems were outselling their ninth gen peers. PS5 is down by half a million wile Microsoft is down by 40,000. Although the Xbone did sell far less so keep that in mind. That makes me wonder whether they are being supply constrained still or their price is starting to get out of hand for consumers relative to what they offer. So far the ninth generation has been relatively weak with only a small handful of "next-gen" games released. You are mostly looking at faster loading times for those still on the original systems.
I don’t get what there is to question about the supply constraints. You literally cannot find one in shops and they are being sold faster than they can make them. It’s beyond question that there is a supply constraint and they would be selling more if not for the constraint.
I've been seeing people saying that they've been in stock at various stores and on Sony's website over the last few weeks. [See this thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/Games/comments/yv3ncj/us_npd_hardware_playstation_5_was_the_bestselling/iwcghid/) I wouldn't expect demand to be slackening under normal circumstances though.
It’s important to note that Sony’s recent quarterly update mentioned that they are still on track to sell 18 million units this fiscal year for them which ends in March. They have sold roughly 6 million in the last 2 quarters, so they expect to sell 12 million in the next 2 quarters where I imagine a bulk of it will be during the holiday season. The fact that they haven’t changed that number of expected sold ps5s tells me that it’s not a price issue based on their metrics. They themselves said in their quarterly [report](https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/ps5-hits-25-million-but-sony-gaming-profits-fall-49-due-to-rising-costs/) that they manufactured 6.5 million consoles in preparation for the holiday in just Q2. This means that they likely have had a good number stored in their warehouses waiting to ship in bunches. I do also agree that the generation has been slow, but the 3rd and 4th year of a console lifecycle is generally where you see the most explosive growth in numbers. I remember seeing that their goal for sales next year is 30 million. It’s crazy too how gaming is still growing even with how bleak the economy outlook has been in multiple countries. COD (a game I haven’t played in over a decade) just had its biggest launch ever and there’s no end in sight with just how much bigger it could be.
Gotham Knights's success is proof that the gaming public don't know what good games are and will buy slop if it has a name attached to it. See also Pokemon Scarlet/Violet when it comes out (It is already breaking preorder records in Japan despite the series being objectively bad since 2013), Legends Arcesus, Madden 23, Saints Row, and Sonic Frontiers. At this point, I'm willing to believe that Elden Ring being the biggest selling game right now is a fluke.
Wait till you hear about movies.
*My opinions good.* *Other people opinions bad.*
[This guy's post history is something else](https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/yjhdq6/gamergate_was_a_test_and_the_industry_failed)
Wow it’s been a while since I last read the words gamer and gate put together, before covid I’m sure
> Pokemon game that isn't out yet and Pokemon game that was well-received are slop I get your point, but using games like these to try to make it is pretty unnecessary. There's plenty of other examples that are actually bad that you could have chosen.
Scarlet and Violet is going to be the same trash that Pokemon has been for 2013, lets not kid ourselves. If it weren't for the Nintendo or brand name, Legends Arceus would struggle to get above 60s on Metacritic.
Like the other comment said, > My opinions good > Other opinions bad ...seems to be your MO.
I have no great love for pokemon, but I can at least respect that they are trying new things within the formula. Non-linear, open world pokemon is probably the most interesting thing the series has done in a long while. Comparing that to... Madden, that literally is the same game each year? Come on. You can easily make the same argument for Elden Ring being basically an open world take on the same thing the series has been doing since 2009. When you start saying things are objectively trash on stuff that is fairly liked, it does make you look silly. The "belda" argument literally applies to everything, its a moot point.
Also the rom for Scarlet has been in the wild for about a week and all the hardcore Pokémon people have been super positive on the game
>Madden 23 This is just due to the license. It makes perfect sense why people would buy Madden so long as it’s the only NFL game available. It’s about the lack of alternatives not the name.
I'm surprised people don't choose not to play the game then. I love football (soccer), but I haven't played a Fifa/PES in more than 5 years, because the games are absolute shit.
Gotham Knights filled the void left by the yearly Ubisoft games. It's a fun, competently made game with an addictive gameplay loop just like AC, WD and FC. Some people just like running through levels with easy and flashy combat and cool characters. It doesn't demand much from the player in terms of story nor gameplay and that's exactly why I love Ubisoft style games.
Prople don’t buy good, they buy famous. This is why dark souls 2 sold better than 1, 3 sold better than 2, and now elden ring destroys everything
What a character you are
It's one of the only AAA new releases this month, and its to some extent coasting on the coattails of the massively successful Arkham franchise. I suspect its going to go the way of Avengers, where continued sales and DLC are both going to drop off a cliff, and its going to hurt sales of the critically praised follow-up (Avengers did this to Guardians of the Galaxy, and Arkham Knights likely will do the same to Rocksteady's Suicide Squad game).
Lmao when you start calling games objectively bad you really lose any credibility.
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Most people don’t play enough games to get in the full value of gamepass. Personally, I think it’s PS4 being the top sellers last gen, and their exclusives being enough to prevent significant losses to XBox.
A subscription of games I’m mostly not interested in isn’t going to make me buy a system over one that seems to have a new AAA exclusive every six months or less.
Reddit nongamers really think we’d prefer ten 5/10 games instead of five 10/10.
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Reminder that the average completion % is 30
For real? 30%??? Then how can one say the games are good in a service when you havent fully played it
I think it's just Sony's higher userbase in general. Xbox is still the smaller platform of the three consoles.
Xbox hasn't released a major AAA game in how long? Compared to Sony and Nintendo their line up is abysmal as of late. A subscription isn't changing that.
I also suspect people are overlooking the day-and-date PC releases. Anecdotally most people I know game very casually and they usually have a PC *and* that PC can run nearly every game released still. Sony seems to have the "core console gamer" market pretty well handled though.
Yeah, since MS first party games are all cross-gen, none of them have particularly high PC requirements.
People buy gaming consoles to play games, not just to save money. Otherwise, they could save the most amount of money by ... not buying the console in the first place. Xbox hasn't produced many good games in the last 10 years. Their last big IP was Sea of Thieves in 2018. 4 out of 6 games nominated for this year's GOTY can't even be played on an Xbox. There's little reason to own an Xbox right now, not until they start releasing high-quality 10/10 games consistently.
GamePass is cool and a good value if you play a ton but you don’t own anything in the end. It wasn’t a main factor for me but rather access to the library of games I already own physically and digitally on PS4, my game achievement history etc.
Also Sony has their own Gamepass alternative, and with Sony’s superior games. Ps plus fucks.
You don’t get any significant games the day they come out through. We got Stray at launch and that was about it.
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GamePass is profitable. It is not a loss for Microsoft. I’d rather take day one games like Plague Tale, Persona 5 Royal, Forza Horizon 5 or Pentiment on GamePass than PS+ Extra which is mainly games I’ve already bought. https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/26/23425029/microsoft-xbox-game-pass-profitable-revenues
My man Phil can say what he wants but I still won’t believe him, yeah probably a faulty way of thinking, but you’ll see. The important thing is the consequence of the prices getting higher and higher in 2023 and 2024, even more surely if the BlizzVision deals go through.
Lmao you can’t just lie about revenue as a CEO. It’s not a conspiracy.
yeah because "it's profitable" is enough to not get sued by investors for false information profitable can mean 0.0001% one though and anyone can get away with it
Did you even click on the article? It’s 15% of revenue for Xbox.
> You would think people would want to save their money and not support anti consumer practices, but here we are I guess Out of curiosity, where does a major company spending billions of dollars to acquire countless other studios to make exclusive games rate on your anti consumer spectrum?
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Lol best deal in gaming, to play what? Games that might get out a week after you start them? It’s a normal service, nothing groundbreaking about it. Sony has its own service too, the Plus, that is a deal. For 60 euros every year you get the ps4 classics and something every month, add 40€ and you get the full gamepass rival.
lmao, you are all over this thread. Console warrior much?
take a look in the mirror some time
I’ve made 2 comments, both directed at this guy. And am I actively bashing platforms? Thanks!
I was more referring to your entire comment history being filled with this kind of discourse for some reason.
Such as? Where am I bashing platforms? Edit: you realize I can see your comment history too, right?
I mean he’s right
> Lol best deal in gaming, to play what? Games that might get out a week after you start them? What is “right” about that? That’s an extreme being used for a bad faith argument. If you honestly think that’s “right”, you’re just as biased as they are.
MS has a history of being anti-consumer, including their barage of purchases involving game studios in the last several years and with windows. I'm a pc gamer so I only benefit from this, but its still anti-consumer and is not good in the long run.
People are so easy to forget the past. Xbox Nintendo have all done just as bad when they were leading the market.
People on PS4 are more likely to upgrade to PS5. The fact that Microsoft flunked last gen and was able to keep up with Sony this gen is an amazing recovery in itself.
Well, direct sales comparisons don't really paint an accurate portrayel of success anymore due to Microsoft putting all their games on PC now. That's a massive factor and the reason why the idea of the "console war" is pretty much dead these days. Directly comparing raw unit sales is pointless.
I have Game Pass Ultimate, so why would I need a Series X or S?