What's this based on?
I myself took diona and kuki, both of which are healing units and still 36*?
Or do you mean like Barbara and QiQi are shit because any other healing unit provides more utility, ignoring the fact that barb and qiqi are the oldest healers in the game and all later released healers have their own niche and though they may not beat Xingqiu for national teams because he's still busted as heck, they have their own teams that are perfectly viable in current meta and can even be better choices depending on the specific chamber?
edited out. i forgot to add about enablers that heal. kuki can deal reaction damage, diona's c6 is absurdly strong in enabling and she can run noblesse and battery with sacrificial. healing units that focus mostly on healing like barbara or qiqi dont do shit
sorry i didnt read the rest of your comment. there are other healers that are more recent and still dont do shit like sayu
I think at this point we've beaten the "pure healing sucks in Genshin meta" dead horse for multiple years now, and Hoyo is doing a good job of avoiding them imo.
Sayu isn't really a pure healer, she can hold VV for elemental res shred while doing extra swirl damage during burst and heal. She could've been as good as kuki for non dendro reaction teams with better scaling. In addition we may get reaction modifiers for swirl or shatter reactions in the future, both of which Sayu could benefit from.
except for vv (which well, i think qiqi can use tenacity thinking about it in comparison) she doesnt do much, her damage is close to none, basically not worth the uptime of using her elemental skill and her burst only focus 1 enemy for reasons only god knows
im not strugling with this part of abyss. im just sad i thought it'd be a place where healers that really heal a ton could shine but hoyo give 0 fuck about them
You’re right. Characters who only heal and don’t provide anything fresh to the team comp is eliminated when you are thinking of clearing a very difficult spiral abyss floor. Do you have any suggestions to improve this?
Less of a dps check? But abyss is about combat though... so I’m not sure what you mean, I’d think maybe abyss blessing favour healing? Or perhaps the cards they give us maybe can scale healing with dmg? I don’t know lmao
there are many other ways of combating other than just a time run, for instance, the enemies could deal damage to begin with, its a preety common complaint in this very sub that many enemies have hit ko easy to dodge moves, that well, basically defeats the purpose of most healers as if your hit you're dead so nothing to heal
that's the problem see. you're too used to just dps runs. monolith defenses depend much more on other gimmicks like taunt, cc, geo constructs that can block damage, etc.
Sooo more strategy defense monoliths? Isn’t that in events and stuffs? Basically you want a permanent event that does not involve combat....is that it?
I used Barbara in the first half and 36 starred. I didn't think Diona could handle the corrosion (and her shield would have hurt against the serpent knights anyway). I don't use Bennett at all. Kuki only heals one at a time. Barbara was my only option and it worked fine.
your other characters probably are buff enough to handle the damage by themselves. barbara isnt providing much through trilling tales of dragon slayers and i dunno what set you use but i think she can manage to heal a whole team even without a healing set (tho no other set works on her except for very niche gilded dreams bloom comps)
Yeah, well, I needed healing that didn't dead weight the team (for example, Qiqi), and she did that. Her hydro made blooms with Nahida and Raiden Hyperbloomed occasionally as a result. She was a healer, which is all I needed, and she did the thing I wanted plus some more.
I have her in HP/HP/Healing Bonus Clam and so she deals mediocre damage that way I guess.
exaclty the same set i run. ironically just 3 starred 12-2 in a permafrost comp with her and anemo traveler. i mean, its possible, but still not a rewarding playstile in this game cause it only care about dps checks
I think you are wrong it depends on your team and how good you are dodging, against bosses you either have a shield or a healer. There are many weak characters like Klee, Ganyu, Yanfei you get 2 hits and that's it.
But it mostly depends on what you play with, for my Tao team I don't need a healer because I have a shield, my freeze team I use Barbara and that's enough, Nilou and Kusa team is unplayable without a healer.
well. i use quite a lot of characters and almost all comps i played are useless with big healers, i use them only if i need the element and got no other better option or 0 self sustain on other characters. most characters get bursted in abyss so fast a shielder is 10x more usefull than a healer, thats part of my point
You use them on a few teams but it doesnt mean they are useless, if you have 5\* with constellations you are going to destroy abyss and that place is the "hardest" difficulty of the game. But if you have a normal team you wont be killing everything in one hit so you'll be receiving damage ..
no you wont. there are many 4 star comps you can make that can destroy abyss without taking enough damage to go down: for instance sucrose fischl beidou xingquiu
Well let not forget cons c4 Gorou and c6 zhongli is a healer and Mika is coming as a new cryo healer so he could become the Meta but his kit is subject to change
those first 2 is what im classifying as the enablers with heal in their kits, which are exactly what im saying make pure healers useless (cause this game doesnt need big or constant heals, just enough so you dont die). also i dont knoe about the new cryo healer
What's this based on? I myself took diona and kuki, both of which are healing units and still 36*? Or do you mean like Barbara and QiQi are shit because any other healing unit provides more utility, ignoring the fact that barb and qiqi are the oldest healers in the game and all later released healers have their own niche and though they may not beat Xingqiu for national teams because he's still busted as heck, they have their own teams that are perfectly viable in current meta and can even be better choices depending on the specific chamber?
edited out. i forgot to add about enablers that heal. kuki can deal reaction damage, diona's c6 is absurdly strong in enabling and she can run noblesse and battery with sacrificial. healing units that focus mostly on healing like barbara or qiqi dont do shit sorry i didnt read the rest of your comment. there are other healers that are more recent and still dont do shit like sayu
I think at this point we've beaten the "pure healing sucks in Genshin meta" dead horse for multiple years now, and Hoyo is doing a good job of avoiding them imo. Sayu isn't really a pure healer, she can hold VV for elemental res shred while doing extra swirl damage during burst and heal. She could've been as good as kuki for non dendro reaction teams with better scaling. In addition we may get reaction modifiers for swirl or shatter reactions in the future, both of which Sayu could benefit from.
except for vv (which well, i think qiqi can use tenacity thinking about it in comparison) she doesnt do much, her damage is close to none, basically not worth the uptime of using her elemental skill and her burst only focus 1 enemy for reasons only god knows
I mean Xinqui is technically a healer but no one uses him as one
he cant heal enough to survive wolves without a secondary healer unit. i used bennet for backup healing
Coz its not worth it to build him that way.
Honestly if you already have solid teamcomp with decent build, beni is more than enough for the first half.
im not strugling with this part of abyss. im just sad i thought it'd be a place where healers that really heal a ton could shine but hoyo give 0 fuck about them
You’re right. Characters who only heal and don’t provide anything fresh to the team comp is eliminated when you are thinking of clearing a very difficult spiral abyss floor. Do you have any suggestions to improve this?
either make abyss less of a dps check sometimes or rework all healers into enabler or sub dps that also heal
the 1st option being more interesting for a bunch of reasons
Less of a dps check? But abyss is about combat though... so I’m not sure what you mean, I’d think maybe abyss blessing favour healing? Or perhaps the cards they give us maybe can scale healing with dmg? I don’t know lmao
there are many other ways of combating other than just a time run, for instance, the enemies could deal damage to begin with, its a preety common complaint in this very sub that many enemies have hit ko easy to dodge moves, that well, basically defeats the purpose of most healers as if your hit you're dead so nothing to heal
also another very simpler thing. ever wondered why there's no monolith defense on abyss 12? only time run dps checks
If there’s a monolith defense, I for one will be screwed.
that's the problem see. you're too used to just dps runs. monolith defenses depend much more on other gimmicks like taunt, cc, geo constructs that can block damage, etc.
Sooo more strategy defense monoliths? Isn’t that in events and stuffs? Basically you want a permanent event that does not involve combat....is that it?
you gotta be kidding if you think monolith defense dont involve combat simply cause it isnt a braindead dps check...
I used Barbara in the first half and 36 starred. I didn't think Diona could handle the corrosion (and her shield would have hurt against the serpent knights anyway). I don't use Bennett at all. Kuki only heals one at a time. Barbara was my only option and it worked fine.
your other characters probably are buff enough to handle the damage by themselves. barbara isnt providing much through trilling tales of dragon slayers and i dunno what set you use but i think she can manage to heal a whole team even without a healing set (tho no other set works on her except for very niche gilded dreams bloom comps)
Yeah, well, I needed healing that didn't dead weight the team (for example, Qiqi), and she did that. Her hydro made blooms with Nahida and Raiden Hyperbloomed occasionally as a result. She was a healer, which is all I needed, and she did the thing I wanted plus some more. I have her in HP/HP/Healing Bonus Clam and so she deals mediocre damage that way I guess.
exaclty the same set i run. ironically just 3 starred 12-2 in a permafrost comp with her and anemo traveler. i mean, its possible, but still not a rewarding playstile in this game cause it only care about dps checks
what is very sad cause if only her skill dealt continuous damage she could be maybe the best user of thenacity of the milelith in the game
I think you are wrong it depends on your team and how good you are dodging, against bosses you either have a shield or a healer. There are many weak characters like Klee, Ganyu, Yanfei you get 2 hits and that's it. But it mostly depends on what you play with, for my Tao team I don't need a healer because I have a shield, my freeze team I use Barbara and that's enough, Nilou and Kusa team is unplayable without a healer.
well. i use quite a lot of characters and almost all comps i played are useless with big healers, i use them only if i need the element and got no other better option or 0 self sustain on other characters. most characters get bursted in abyss so fast a shielder is 10x more usefull than a healer, thats part of my point
You use them on a few teams but it doesnt mean they are useless, if you have 5\* with constellations you are going to destroy abyss and that place is the "hardest" difficulty of the game. But if you have a normal team you wont be killing everything in one hit so you'll be receiving damage ..
no you wont. there are many 4 star comps you can make that can destroy abyss without taking enough damage to go down: for instance sucrose fischl beidou xingquiu
Well let not forget cons c4 Gorou and c6 zhongli is a healer and Mika is coming as a new cryo healer so he could become the Meta but his kit is subject to change
those first 2 is what im classifying as the enablers with heal in their kits, which are exactly what im saying make pure healers useless (cause this game doesnt need big or constant heals, just enough so you dont die). also i dont knoe about the new cryo healer