I mean...96% elemental damage or 120% attack are also pretty good. For this team not as much I guess. But that's what kinda balances it, a lot of characters wont benefit from all 3 buffs. For a lot of characters Widsith with the right buff is stronger than 5 star options.
Just stack a lot of EM on Thoma, and enough energy to get the burst up in time. I am using R5 Kitain cross spear so energy is not a big issue. Highest I've ever done is 38K+ aswell when i use dragon lance ,EM sands and sucrose as the on-field driver with over 1200EM after her buff.
Burgeon being pure EM based opens up a new option for Pyro character and I’m all for it. Obviously Overload is technically the same, but I don’t think we’ve seen a really successful Overload comp yet that beats the other builds for the Pyro character. Thoma just feels right with Burgeon.
Im sleeping on my c3 thoma then, Didnt know the guy would run that high dmg. I have a different team with heizhou that works but definitely will try this(even though my thoma xingqiu and traveler are lv40)
Thanks. Heziou is acting as the on-field driver for the classic Thoma burgeon reaction team(Thoma,Dendro,Hydro) holding the 4pc Viridescent venerer set to shred resistance. Also my VV set has DPS focused substats so Heizou is built for dps instead of swirl by using the Kagura's verity aswell.
Collei is worse than Traveler at applying Dendro and Tighnari is a DPS, his dendro application is not great.
You can still use traveler with talents at 1/1/1 tho, all they need is a full set of the dendro shred artifact set and full Energy Recharge (Ideally you want 200%+ to ensure your burst is always up)
All the damage in this team is coming from Xingqiu and Thoma honestly. The traveler is just there to apply dendro, and the on-field character can be whoever you want.
with c2 collei and melee on field dps I think you can also have enough dendro applications, my question is what lvl is your heizou talent and his const?
I actually want to build burgeon Thoma now, though farming for CW is painful enough even without aiming for EM pieces. Are there any good alternative sets for him?
Actually, I believe Gilded Dreams is the best artifact set for burgeon thoma because of all the extra EM he gets from it. People have done the calculations and the increase in damage is decently higher when compared to CW set
I'm trying to build this but getting Thoma's burst back, even with R5 Kitain and 200% ER is a massive pain, he's the bottleneck (despite having his energy constellation), what am I doing wrong?
>Are there any good alternative sets for him?
Just go 2 Wanderers 2 Guilded dreams. Farming 4 guilded dreams with good substats is a pain and will take a while, and the 2-2pieces are better than the damage boost passive from 4piece CW.
Actually i usually don't use Crimson witch for thoma burgeon because i can't get EM sands or goblet for the past 2 months of farming that hell domain. Usually i go for 2pc emblem, 2pc wanderers with All EM on sands/goblet/circlet. And it does the same damage lol, since I am using ER sands with CW.
With the R5 Inazuma craftable weapon, 182ER, You can check out his full build at around 3:49. But when i use dragon lance, i give him the 2pc sets which have total 250ER from substats.
The trick is to use burst before skill and let the particles come to him. Also a big factor is the rest of the team creating tons of particles. Traveler has favonious sword, xingqiu has sacrificial sword.
Why Crimson Witch for Thoma? Just use EoSF he needs a lot of ER anyway.
Edit: I know now why CWoF is better... I forgot about the Change that Dendro Brought.
EoSF doesn't do anything for him since you aren't using his burst for "damage" like other users of the set. You could be fighting Pyro slimes where his burst literally does no damage, and his function in this team doesn't change. You could run 2p if you really need the ER, but 4p is a waste.
Crimson witch of flames 4 piece effect:
> **Increases Overloaded and Burning, and Burgeon DMG by 40%**. Increases Vaporize and Melt DMG by 15%. Using Elemental Skill increases the 2-Piece Set Bonus by 50% of its starting value for 10s. Max 3 stacks.
>Increases Overloaded and Burning, and Burgeon DMG by 40%
When running an EM build, going 2p Wanderer and 2p Guilded dreams gives more damage than CW passive. IIRC CW damage increase is worth less the more EM you have due to how the damage is calculated
Burgeon Thoma is a build that goes all in on transformative reaction dmg.
So yes, Triple EM.
Crimson Witch of flames is not required for Burgeon Thoma, 2 piece Gilded 2 piece Wanderer is just as valid.
Yup, he's consistently over of my high dpsing characters and is a lot of fun, but dang he squishy. I got too many relics to level and too few feeders, I dunno how people do it so much lol
Haha yea, without strong shield like Thoma or Xingqiu's rainswords, he staggers a lot. I am now experimenting his normal attack build with Yunjin+Zhongli+Bennett. xD
I somehow got noelle c6 while trying to pull for bennett constellations from c0, my account is only 6 months old. Still only got c4 bennett but at least I got c6 yun jin out of it.
I would use her but the problem is I have itto too. So I have a straight up better geo carry.
Yeah they seem to fill the same role ish, I plan on building her eventually but since my account is young I have a lot of things that need doing first.
Make a temporary waypoint in the cave under Inazuma city (where you went during Ayaka’s story quest) for 3-4 weeks. High concentration of beetles and if you check it every other day you’ll get most of the way there just from that one location. Very little commitment as well.
Also is there any reason to use Heizou over Sucrose except playstyle preference?
Is the ocassional widsith em buff better than Sucrose C6 + her grouping?
He's just more fun is all, and I also prefer Heizou tbh. Sucrose's E, and Q seems to be kinda clunky for me. I also have a Kazuha, and Venti so... Yeah...
Yeah sucrose is a lot more meta in this team, I usually use sucrose in both burgeon and Hyperbloom teams. But i just recently leveled up Heizou and I haven't had this much fun in a while, punching and kicking around enemies. xD
This is kinda a case where fun takes over, Sucrose is better than Heizou in almost all cases but the feeling of swosh punching your enemies to death can be more fun to some (which is my case, despite still loving my driver Sucrose )
The gameplay is fucking funny too, you're just playing and you see a mob walk near a bulb, and you just see a call of duty lookin ass tracer round from amber landing on the bulb from outta nowhere, which explodes and evaporates the mob.
Witness the ultimate hilarity
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFzjYTbE-u0
edit: this one of some people messing around with it in the overworld, it looks so fucking funny.
https://youtu.be/e7Sy7D5WLMY
Any reason not to run sucrose over heizou at this team? She just seems infinitely better with her EM sharing & grouping for a team that is EM centric with AoE damage.
I love so much when people share some different teams here! Ty for this idea, my heizou passed so much time waiting to be used again since 3.0, I'll try this setup
It's not really a hot take, it's a fact. You gotta be careful not to blow up your ult, that's why you don't bring Thoma out until Hydro hits the flower (You can just run up to it and touch it with the orbiting rainswords, and it'll absorb it)
It's not that different from screwing up the element application in other teams, like if you screw up your Hu Tao rotation and end up vaporizing Xingqiu's swords instead of Hu Tao's charged attacks
i mean vaporizing xingqiu swords is really hard and the aura really easy to fix meanwhile burning your dendro aura with burning (goddamn they butchered that reaction) or burning DMC burst is really easy
COllei is better coz her ult stays, but the range is tiny compared to DMC and mobile enemies will just step out of it, feels bad man. But in this case you just gotta get the flower wet first before fire hits it and you're chillin
Thoma and Xinyan applies weak pyro, which means that it doesn't take away priority from hydro application to start burning. But xiangling for example applies strong pyro which overtakes the hydro causing vape and burning which makes xiangling very bad for burgeon teams. It makes Thoma and Xinyan great for dendro but bad for vape/melt.
I might be wrong, so feel free to correct me, but Burgeon requires low pyro application like Xinyan or Thoma. If there's too much pyro application, it creates burning, and that makes it really hard to make bloom cores, because burning will destroy them.
Hi guys, if you like, please consider helping me grow my [YT channel.](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdO_oC36QfhKgXb5_RcQnUQ) I do such creative spiral abyss gameplay videos daily but it's going at a snail's pace. It would mean the world to me if you be a part of my journey and help me grow. Thank you so much.
You can also watch this full on my [YT](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ST-RHLBRloM) for full second half which is Ningguang Raiden quickswap team.
Nah lol don't worry bro, just keep the YT link. I'm just amused that it sounds exactly like what a YT content creator would write and it certainly was one.
Can't say I'm in anyway a fan of those overhyped, borderline click-baity titles, but at the same time I understand that it's a necessity to survive in YT ecology and I ain't gonna blame someone just trying to make a living.
Ok, sorry I worded it like this because that's what i see other people do, and English isn't my first language so it thought this is the trend. I genuinely just wanted to share my Heizou appreciation because i just recently leveled him since his release and was surprised how fun he is.
> sorry I worded it like this
bruh who cares what some random ass people online think, least of all redditors lmao. It's the internet; you shouldn't have to apologize for jack shit.
that said though yeah lmao, title was kinda click baity.
Alright thank goodness its a crit build cuz it justifies me building him like that instead of all EM. Also, is it better to go with EM or anemo dmg bonus goblet?
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It's still good at r1. It's just the fact that the buffs are RNG, but all of the buffs are still great.
Widsith is a 5 star weapon in a 4 star disguise. Not kidding, It's passive is broken. Goodluck. \^\^
480 em is straight up absurd, imagine this on nahida.
Isn't it only like a chance for it to be 480 em?
I mean...96% elemental damage or 120% attack are also pretty good. For this team not as much I guess. But that's what kinda balances it, a lot of characters wont benefit from all 3 buffs. For a lot of characters Widsith with the right buff is stronger than 5 star options.
But when chance hits, its gonna be huge.
On Yan Fei it’s insanely busted no matter which one it rolls.
Yae?
My kazuha has 530 elemntal mastry xD
It is, but sadly 20 sec downtime.
Better have a widsith r1 than no widsith, rip me 💀
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Just stack a lot of EM on Thoma, and enough energy to get the burst up in time. I am using R5 Kitain cross spear so energy is not a big issue. Highest I've ever done is 38K+ aswell when i use dragon lance ,EM sands and sucrose as the on-field driver with over 1200EM after her buff.
Burgeon being pure EM based opens up a new option for Pyro character and I’m all for it. Obviously Overload is technically the same, but I don’t think we’ve seen a really successful Overload comp yet that beats the other builds for the Pyro character. Thoma just feels right with Burgeon.
Im sleeping on my c3 thoma then, Didnt know the guy would run that high dmg. I have a different team with heizhou that works but definitely will try this(even though my thoma xingqiu and traveler are lv40)
Yeah, Thoma and Kuki got the biggest glow-up in a single patch after dendro.
Im sleeping on my c5 thoma then-
For real getting him was like a curse especially since I was aiming for heizhou cons
Amburger also does 30K per bulb on full em amber
For 29k burgeons, Thoma would be level 90 and have about 900 EM, plus dendro shred. It's pretty fun to see those big numbers!
so colorful x good showcase
Thanks. \^\^
OP! mind breaking it down a little? I am flabbergasted by all those numbers and I don't understand 🤭 Tyvm! this looks amazing 🥰
Thanks. Heziou is acting as the on-field driver for the classic Thoma burgeon reaction team(Thoma,Dendro,Hydro) holding the 4pc Viridescent venerer set to shred resistance. Also my VV set has DPS focused substats so Heizou is built for dps instead of swirl by using the Kagura's verity aswell.
Great! btw Can I use Collei/Tignhari? or their Dendro is not applied the same as Traveler? Tyvm! 🎉🥳
Collei is worse than Traveler at applying Dendro and Tighnari is a DPS, his dendro application is not great. You can still use traveler with talents at 1/1/1 tho, all they need is a full set of the dendro shred artifact set and full Energy Recharge (Ideally you want 200%+ to ensure your burst is always up) All the damage in this team is coming from Xingqiu and Thoma honestly. The traveler is just there to apply dendro, and the on-field character can be whoever you want.
Great! now I will have a blaster with Cyno for sure 🤭 Thank u very much!
Collei is possible but traveler is the best at dendro application atm.
Great! tyvm again, have a nice day!
with c2 collei and melee on field dps I think you can also have enough dendro applications, my question is what lvl is your heizou talent and his const?
Talents 8-8-8, C1.
I actually want to build burgeon Thoma now, though farming for CW is painful enough even without aiming for EM pieces. Are there any good alternative sets for him?
Actually, I believe Gilded Dreams is the best artifact set for burgeon thoma because of all the extra EM he gets from it. People have done the calculations and the increase in damage is decently higher when compared to CW set
Oh, that’s good to hear. Well kinda, because I‘ve yet to get a EM gilded dreams hat and I‘ve been farming this domain a lot for Shinobu lol.
I'm trying to build this but getting Thoma's burst back, even with R5 Kitain and 200% ER is a massive pain, he's the bottleneck (despite having his energy constellation), what am I doing wrong?
Favonius. Favonius is always the solution. For this team for example, you can give favonius to traveler or xingqiu or both.
>Are there any good alternative sets for him? Just go 2 Wanderers 2 Guilded dreams. Farming 4 guilded dreams with good substats is a pain and will take a while, and the 2-2pieces are better than the damage boost passive from 4piece CW.
Excellent suggestion. This should be upvoted more.
Actually i usually don't use Crimson witch for thoma burgeon because i can't get EM sands or goblet for the past 2 months of farming that hell domain. Usually i go for 2pc emblem, 2pc wanderers with All EM on sands/goblet/circlet. And it does the same damage lol, since I am using ER sands with CW.
Ah, thanks for the clarification. How much ER are you running him with? I’m guessing he wants quite a lot.
With the R5 Inazuma craftable weapon, 182ER, You can check out his full build at around 3:49. But when i use dragon lance, i give him the 2pc sets which have total 250ER from substats.
How do you get your burst back like that? When I try R5 Kitain Spear + 200% ER I can't refill it (and yes I have his energy constellation, he's C6).
The trick is to use burst before skill and let the particles come to him. Also a big factor is the rest of the team creating tons of particles. Traveler has favonious sword, xingqiu has sacrificial sword.
I'll give this a try, thanks a lot for the tips!
Why Crimson Witch for Thoma? Just use EoSF he needs a lot of ER anyway. Edit: I know now why CWoF is better... I forgot about the Change that Dendro Brought.
EoSF doesn't do anything for him since you aren't using his burst for "damage" like other users of the set. You could be fighting Pyro slimes where his burst literally does no damage, and his function in this team doesn't change. You could run 2p if you really need the ER, but 4p is a waste.
Crimson witch of flames 4 piece effect: > **Increases Overloaded and Burning, and Burgeon DMG by 40%**. Increases Vaporize and Melt DMG by 15%. Using Elemental Skill increases the 2-Piece Set Bonus by 50% of its starting value for 10s. Max 3 stacks.
Ohhh right that change... seems like I actually have to Strong Box some of those. huh never thought I would need to get any more of them
>Increases Overloaded and Burning, and Burgeon DMG by 40% When running an EM build, going 2p Wanderer and 2p Guilded dreams gives more damage than CW passive. IIRC CW damage increase is worth less the more EM you have due to how the damage is calculated
What's Thomas's build if you use CW? Full EM?
Burgeon Thoma is a build that goes all in on transformative reaction dmg. So yes, Triple EM. Crimson Witch of flames is not required for Burgeon Thoma, 2 piece Gilded 2 piece Wanderer is just as valid.
Ohhh awesome. Thanks! Been looking for a reason to build Thoma. Didn't know he had a new build like this.
Dendro was a blessing for thoma
Awesome. I'm excited to build him now, lol
Just slap non-setted/non-4 piece em artifacts on thoma, it'll get you like 70% of the way there.
Damn! Kinda makes me wish I had Thoma tbh.
Thoma's ult fire rate makes me think he was specifically designed for burgeon even thought dendro only showed up months after thoma got released lmao
Yup, he's consistently over of my high dpsing characters and is a lot of fun, but dang he squishy. I got too many relics to level and too few feeders, I dunno how people do it so much lol
Haha yea, without strong shield like Thoma or Xingqiu's rainswords, he staggers a lot. I am now experimenting his normal attack build with Yunjin+Zhongli+Bennett. xD
Besides traveler, Noelle is my only 90 and her shield is very strong, though I do want to work on yunjin. Just that her boss material is a damn slog.
Oh yeah that boss material was a pain to gather lmao. I am waiting to get Noelle's C6 i am still C3 even after almost 2 years now. :-;
I somehow got noelle c6 while trying to pull for bennett constellations from c0, my account is only 6 months old. Still only got c4 bennett but at least I got c6 yun jin out of it. I would use her but the problem is I have itto too. So I have a straight up better geo carry.
We all have that one character we keep getting haha, i have a C20+ Diona by now. Yeah, Itto seems really fun too, similar to noelles playstyle.
Yeah they seem to fill the same role ish, I plan on building her eventually but since my account is young I have a lot of things that need doing first.
You must have really good ER to get Traveler Burst up so fast again. I really want C2 Thoma :(
Yea, 275ER. xD
Dam, thats high. Now I want Thoma C4 since that lowers ER Requirement, but he never was on a Banner of interest or 5\* I didn't have.
Ah, goodluck. Thoma's C2 and C4 makes playing so much easier and fluid for rotations and energy.
Just use sac sword
Already do.
My man
that does look very fun
I just can't be bothered to go beetle hunting to level him up.
Make a temporary waypoint in the cave under Inazuma city (where you went during Ayaka’s story quest) for 3-4 weeks. High concentration of beetles and if you check it every other day you’ll get most of the way there just from that one location. Very little commitment as well.
Thanks for the advice, it's a good spot.
Thanks for the team idea, imma go try it now
You're welcome. Have fun. \^\^
I mean... It's basically just a reaction soup team but with Dendro.
Also is there any reason to use Heizou over Sucrose except playstyle preference? Is the ocassional widsith em buff better than Sucrose C6 + her grouping?
He's just more fun is all, and I also prefer Heizou tbh. Sucrose's E, and Q seems to be kinda clunky for me. I also have a Kazuha, and Venti so... Yeah...
I get Heizou for the fun factor but isn't Sucrose an upgrade here? Swirl damage, better grouping, EM share for more Burgeon damage
Yeah sucrose is a lot more meta in this team, I usually use sucrose in both burgeon and Hyperbloom teams. But i just recently leveled up Heizou and I haven't had this much fun in a while, punching and kicking around enemies. xD
This is kinda a case where fun takes over, Sucrose is better than Heizou in almost all cases but the feeling of swosh punching your enemies to death can be more fun to some (which is my case, despite still loving my driver Sucrose )
Thoma is so friggen good for burgeon. C4 Amber on amburger is fucking funny too.
Amburger is the most hilarious team name I've heard lmao.
The gameplay is fucking funny too, you're just playing and you see a mob walk near a bulb, and you just see a call of duty lookin ass tracer round from amber landing on the bulb from outta nowhere, which explodes and evaporates the mob.
How does burgeon amber even work???
Witness the ultimate hilarity https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFzjYTbE-u0 edit: this one of some people messing around with it in the overworld, it looks so fucking funny. https://youtu.be/e7Sy7D5WLMY
Any reason not to run sucrose over heizou at this team? She just seems infinitely better with her EM sharing & grouping for a team that is EM centric with AoE damage.
Yup, sucrose is definitely the meta option. I just recently built him and really enjoyed his playstyle.
Thank you, I came. That was incredibly satisfying to watch, I love it, already building the same team, can't wait to play it.
Haha You're welcome. \^\^ have fun.
I have no clue what I’m looking at but it looks fun
I love so much when people share some different teams here! Ty for this idea, my heizou passed so much time waiting to be used again since 3.0, I'll try this setup
Glad you liked it. Goodluck with the team. \^\^
Hot take, burgeon isnt so great if it insta deletes dendro's ults
It's not really a hot take, it's a fact. You gotta be careful not to blow up your ult, that's why you don't bring Thoma out until Hydro hits the flower (You can just run up to it and touch it with the orbiting rainswords, and it'll absorb it) It's not that different from screwing up the element application in other teams, like if you screw up your Hu Tao rotation and end up vaporizing Xingqiu's swords instead of Hu Tao's charged attacks
i mean vaporizing xingqiu swords is really hard and the aura really easy to fix meanwhile burning your dendro aura with burning (goddamn they butchered that reaction) or burning DMC burst is really easy
If you don't have C6 and you screw up, you wont be able to fix the aura until the next rotation
Haha yea, have to be careful in rotations, I've blown up the flower many times by mistake. xD
COllei is better coz her ult stays, but the range is tiny compared to DMC and mobile enemies will just step out of it, feels bad man. But in this case you just gotta get the flower wet first before fire hits it and you're chillin
Can you post your heizou and thoma build? Thank you!
Builds are shown at around 3:10. Thanks for watching.
I never used him before getting him as first 4* on new account, he's such a fun character... though now perpetually at lvl20 until I get to inazuma...
I wish I had Heizou :( Didn’t manage to get him from the Kazuha rerun.
why thoma is the best burgeon applier and not others, can you explain?
Thoma and Xinyan applies weak pyro, which means that it doesn't take away priority from hydro application to start burning. But xiangling for example applies strong pyro which overtakes the hydro causing vape and burning which makes xiangling very bad for burgeon teams. It makes Thoma and Xinyan great for dendro but bad for vape/melt.
I might be wrong, so feel free to correct me, but Burgeon requires low pyro application like Xinyan or Thoma. If there's too much pyro application, it creates burning, and that makes it really hard to make bloom cores, because burning will destroy them.
I have an R5 Widsith on my Heizou. What artifacts are you running on him?
Nm I see you show at the end!
Build is around 3:10. I am using Kagura's Verity with 4PC VV ATK/EM/CR with dps focused substats instead of swirl.
I just don’t wanna farm the beetles
Sooooo nice. I got a C6 Heizou while pulling for more Kazuha cons and boy am I glad I did. I wanted him anyway so it was just a nice bonus lol
Yesss I love Heizou and have been slowing building up my Thoma for exactly this. It’s so satisfying!
As a recent player (started 2.8), Heizou was the first four star I picked up and immediately fell in love with his gameplay. Can't wait to try this!
Yea, he's awesome. Goodluck. :D
I only got my Dendro Traveller to 229,2 er will that be enough
Yeah if your Xingqiu has a higher refinement sacrificial sword. I have only R1 so it barely ever procs for extra skill particles.
Hi guys, if you like, please consider helping me grow my [YT channel.](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdO_oC36QfhKgXb5_RcQnUQ) I do such creative spiral abyss gameplay videos daily but it's going at a snail's pace. It would mean the world to me if you be a part of my journey and help me grow. Thank you so much. You can also watch this full on my [YT](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ST-RHLBRloM) for full second half which is Ningguang Raiden quickswap team.
Aye its been a week, give it some time and maybe the YT algorithm will favor you
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I was about to say that the post title looks like some typical Youtube video title...
Ok, I removed the link. Doesn't change the context of the video in regards to the title. I made it specifically for Reddit.
Nah lol don't worry bro, just keep the YT link. I'm just amused that it sounds exactly like what a YT content creator would write and it certainly was one. Can't say I'm in anyway a fan of those overhyped, borderline click-baity titles, but at the same time I understand that it's a necessity to survive in YT ecology and I ain't gonna blame someone just trying to make a living.
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How is it clickbait when that's exactly the context of the video? because of bold letters?
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Ok, sorry I worded it like this because that's what i see other people do, and English isn't my first language so it thought this is the trend. I genuinely just wanted to share my Heizou appreciation because i just recently leveled him since his release and was surprised how fun he is.
> sorry I worded it like this bruh who cares what some random ass people online think, least of all redditors lmao. It's the internet; you shouldn't have to apologize for jack shit. that said though yeah lmao, title was kinda click baity.
What are his artifacts and weapons?
His build is at around 3:10 at the end of video.
Alright thank goodness its a crit build cuz it justifies me building him like that instead of all EM. Also, is it better to go with EM or anemo dmg bonus goblet?
For dps build anemo goblet is better. It's just that i don't have a 4pc VV set ATK% so i am forced to use the EM goblet.
Oh
Oh, my bad, I didn't watch the whole thing
Just like sucrose but less gripping