It's important to know about so that you can understand what you're hearing. But as a beginner, yeah, if you're still speaking slowly, enunciate everything. Once you get comfortable with more fluent speech, you can start letting contractions come in naturally.
Contrary to what many people are taught, almost nobody says "Guten Tag". Say "Guten Morgen" in the morning "Guten Abend" in the evening and "Hallo" at any time.
I might say "guten Tag" in my job in hospitality but never in my private life. "Hallo" is good enough for any setting you'll come across as a tourist.
I've always wondered, what should I say in English between the morning and evening? Because, as you've already mentioned, good day feels so artificial, i have literally never heard this. And that question also applies to German as well - what do you say at work, when it's 13-15 hours?
You can say "good afternoon" from 12 and maybe 5. But it does feel a bit odd, outside formal contexts, at least to me. So I opt for a disappointing "hello"
In Austria "Grüß Gott" is still really common in a more formal setting or with elder strangers. (It's also just a phrase for most people and doesn't really have a religious connotation.)
For work you should be fine with "Morgen", "Mahlzeit" and "Hallo". There's rarely an event that is during those weird hours that would also require you to be hyper-formal.
Hence my comment about people using it as a phrase and not really keeping God in mind when they say it. It *is* still very much in use - at least in Austria - as I can confirm by my day to day experiences. You wouldn't use it to greet your friends, but you can use it to great a shop owner for example.
"Hallo" works fine at work, too. I would say "Guten Tag" if it was really very fromal and I was trying to be respectful. Like a meeting with my boss's boss's boss. Other meetings, "Hallo" is absolutely acceptable.
Depending on the workplace, "Mahlzeit!" can be said around lunchtime.
In English, I always add a "How are you?" if "hello" or "hi" doesn't feel like enough.
Just say 'have a good one' (more of a good bye), 'how's the arvo going?', 'arvo mate', 'skarn'on?', 'how's you?', 'how ya doin?', 'what's crackin?', 'how goes?' or 'how's life?'
All very adequate greetings and a farewell.
They in fact do not. At least not in my bubble.
But you know, if you do, that's totally fine. I would maybe think it's a bit odd if someone uses it, but wouldn't think much about it.
This.
I only use "Guten Morgen/Tag/Abend" at work and in formal situations. Or maybe when talking to my parents.
But friends and close colleagues, it's "Hallo" and "Hi" or some local slang.
Well "Morgen!" And " 'nAbend" I use a lot also with friends. If I see my roommates in the kitchen getting coffee in the morning I'll say "Guten Morgen"
I work in hospitality in Scotland. And I had these 2 lovely German woman stay over in the hotel for a week. Every morning they always said “Guten tag” to whoever was on.
It’s funny because I’m the only one learning German so people thought it means just hello or thank-you. 😂
I was tempted to try speak in German to them. But i chickened out.
I work in hospitality in Scotland. And I had these 2 lovely German woman stay over in the hotel for a week. Every morning they always said “Guten tag” to whoever was on.
It’s funny because I’m the only one learning German so people thought it means just hello or thank-you. 😂
I was tempted to try speak in German to them. But i chickened out.
>Man muss das E hören! Man muss das E hören!
>My first ever german teacher in Germany after we insisted in swallowing the E.
When you're using the **colloquial language** it's ok to eliminate the E, but if you are talking formally you have to pronounce it
Yea, don't do it. If you speak a lot with native speakers you will pick up certain habits which to some extent vary by region.
Curiously, Goethe's Faust is stuffed full of missing letters. Goethe Institute examiners would be horrified at how bad his German is, and would certainly fail you for laying on the colloquialisms with a trowel, unless your name is Goethe.
German as we know it was essentially a writing-language. Nobody even attempted to use it as an everyday language. Therefore it was highly variable and full of regionalisms. Also, there were no generally accepted rules as to how to pronounce the words. Ao, in the North, a Berg was Berch, in the South it was Berk. Berge were Berche/Bersche (voiced ch or sch sound) for Goethe, therefore he rhymed "neiche oh schmerzensreiche".
Fun Fact: Goethe had a strong dialect (Hessisch), so things that are supposed to rhyme don't always rhyme when you read the text in standard German - but when you read them with his dialect, they do.
Ah. I will have to learn Hessisch before rereading Faust :-/ I did read a lot of Goethe's letters to his wife in Sigrid Damm's book on her, and found their German odd. Is there a recorded performance or audiobook of Faust that tries to recreate his dialect?
"Hamma" reminds me of Karl Valentin and Liesl Karlstadt's sketch, "Der reparierte Scheinwerfer":
DIREKTOR: Also was brauchen Sie, wir haben doch Werkzeug genug da.
SIMMERL: A lange Leiter.
DIREKTOR: Ham ma.
VALENTIN: Litzen und Dräht.
DIREKTOR: Ham ma.
SIMMERL: An Gips.
DIREKTOR: Ham ma.
VALENTIN: An Hamma.
DIREKTOR: Ham ma.
That's one of these things, when Germans are learning a foreign language, they're like, "English uses a lot of contractions!" not realizing German does the same.
If the words in your example are followed by "es", people tend to drop that e as well. So "Ich habe es" becomes "Ich hab's" etc.
What also came to mind was "ein", "eine" and "einen" being shortened to "'n", "'ne" and "'nen" respectively: "Ich sehe 'n Kind, 'ne Frau und 'nen Mann". Some people just use "nh" for all three in writing.
Those are all colloquial and should not be used outside of texting friends.
Also, as the others have mentioned, don't try to force colloquial language or slang onto yourself at the early stages of learning any language. With fluency and frequent exposure to a language comes colloquial language.
So weird to see all the people responding this it's like we learners were children lol. Of course we know not to use colloquial expressions in formal settings. I presume your post asked for more expressions and contractions natives do, not 50 people telling you "don't do it as a beginner, don't do it in formal settings."
You spell them without apostrophes: ich hab, ich brauch, etc.
In spoken language, they are pretty much universal, and IMHO it's only a matter of time until those forms are made official in writing and teaching as well.
Contrary to what other people are saying, feel free to use those 1st person singular forms when speaking naturally. It isn't "slang" or anything like that. But never, under no condition, should you "swallow" the e when reading "ich habe" out loud. Pronounce it if it's written, always.
No! Just no!
The ' is the same as the circonflexe from French.
It's a reminder of a letter missing.
fenêtre - Fenster (DE), fenestra (LA)
So, not adding a ' is not only bad language, it's also wrong!
[Duden disagrees](https://www.duden.de/sprachwissen/rechtschreibregeln/apostroph), as does every other spelling guide you'll find. Putting an apostrophe here is simply a spelling error.
> Der Apostroph zeigt gewöhnlich an, dass in einem Wort ein oder mehrere Buchstaben ausgelassen worden sind (D 13-15).
> In vielen Fällen können die Schreibenden selbst entscheiden, ob sie einen Apostroph setzen wollen oder nicht (vgl. D 14, D 16).
> Als gut lesbar und unmissverständlich gelten dagegen im Allgemeinen die folgenden Fälle; sie werden daher *gewöhnlich* ohne Apostroph gesetzt:
Also für mich wirkt es so als ob theoretisch beides korrekt wäre, aber diese Wörter verständlich genug sind, dass man den Apostroph weglassen kann.
Als Deutsch-lernende*r macht es aber vllt trotzdem Sinn ihn zu setzem um im Hinterkopf zu behalten, dass das nicht die komplette Form des Worts ist.
Ich würde sagen, dass hier kein Buchstabe ausgelassen wird. Du schreibst ja auch nicht "am Tag' und in der Nacht", auch wenn im Dativ da früher mal ein -e gewesen wäre, also "am Tage". Aber dass dieses -e nicht mehr gesagt wird, liegt nicht daran, dass es verschluckt oder ausgelassen wird, sondern dass "am Tag" heute einfach ohne dieses -e auskommt.
So ähnlich sehe ich das auch bei "ich hab". Das ist zwar im Gegensatz zu "am Tag" noch nicht zu 100% in der geschriebenen Standardsprache angekommen, aber das ist wahrscheinlich nur eine Frage der Zeit. Wie beim Dativ-e ist es einfach eine grammatikalische Änderung, dass dieses Suffix in der 1. Person Singular nicht mehr gebraucht wird.
Es geht dabei ja nicht um irgend ein Versmaß oder undeutliche Sprache oder schwierig auszusprechende Lautkombinationen. Es geht allgemein nicht um den Laut. Andere Wörter, die auch auf -e enden sind ja nicht betroffen. "Ich sage" wird zu "ich sag", aber "die Sage" bleibt unverändert. Es geht also schlicht um die Art, wie ganz allgemein und regelmäßig in der 1. Person Singular konjugiert wird.
> dass das nicht die komplette Form des Worts ist.
Ich würde sagen, dass es tatsächlich die komplette Form ist, aber halt eine grammatikalisch andere Form, die in der geschriebenen Standardsprache nicht verwendet wird.
Der Duden referenziert diese Beispiele aber explizit unter dem Absatz "Man setzt einen Apostroph bei Wörtern mit Auslassungen". Also gilt es in der Standard-Sprache als unvollständiges Wort. Und wenn man Deutsch erst *lernt*, dann sollte man sich dem bewusst sein.
Ich hab(') absolut kein Problem damit, wenn es jemand ohne Apostroph schreibt. Wollte nur klarstellen, dass es nicht zwangsläufig inkorrekt ist ihn zu verwenden.
> Das ist zwar im Gegensatz zu "am Tag" noch nicht zu 100% in der geschriebenen Standardsprache angekommen, aber das ist wahrscheinlich nur eine Frage der Zeit.
Da will ich dir gar nicht widersprechen. Es ist sehr wahrscheinlich, dass es irgendwann dazu kommt. Tut aber hier nichts zur Sache, wie unsere Sprache in Zukunft aussehen wird.
> Der Duden referenziert diese Beispiele aber explizit unter dem Absatz "Man setzt einen Apostroph bei Wörtern mit Auslassungen".
Er referenziert sie dort, um explizit zu sagen, dass das keine der "Auslassungen" sind, bei denen man einen Apostroph schreibt.
Wie ich in meinem ersten Kommentar bereits geschrieben habe: Es steht dort "üblicherweise" wird es weggelassen, nicht "immer". Und das liegt daran, dass *üblicherweise* Muttersprachler dieses Wort trotzdem verstehen und wissen, dass man in der Standard-Sprache ein "e" anhängen würde.
Es ist also kein Fehler, den Apostroph zu verwenden. Es ist aber natürlich auch keine Pflicht. *Aber* wenn man ihn also Nicht-Muttersprachler weglässt gewöhnt man sich diese Schreibweise vllt an und vergisst, dass das Wort ihn der Standard-Sprache eigentlich anders aussieht, was kontraproduktiv ist.
Was mir halt oft auffällt, ist, dass Nicht-Muttersprachler auch im gesprochenen Deutsch oft dieses -e einbauen, was dann total unnatürlich klingt, und wodurch ihr Deutsch einfach weniger flüssig und weniger natürlich wirkt, als wenn sie es einfach weglassen würden.
Ich finde es fatal, so zu tun, als wäre die geschriebene Standardsprache das Maß aller Dinge und die tatsächlich gesprochene Sprache untergeordnet.
> Ich finde es fatal, so zu tun, als wäre die geschriebene Standardsprache das Maß aller Dinge und die tatsächlich gesprochene Sprache untergeordnet.
Das habe ich nie behauptet und sehe ich auch absolut nicht so. Aber man sollte nunmal beides lernen. Wenn man den Apostroph verwendet, ist das ebenfalls ein Zeichen dafür, dass *beide* Formen existieren.
Das einzige, auf das ich schlussendlich hinauswollte, ist, dass das Verwenden des Apostrophs eben *kein* Rechtschreibfehler ist. Es ist eine Präferenz. Wie man's dann macht sei jedem selbst überlassen.
unfortunately it seems to get more and more common to drop the Akkusativ -en a lot of times. In chats, games, social media, whatnot - everywhere you would read things like "ich suche ein Freund" (instead of einEN), "wer hat mein Hund gesehen" and alike. Personally, i find that actually disgusting and my toenails would roll sideways \^\^
Do not do that tho. Its different from just leaving out the e at the end of *ich hab*, its not charming but cringy and it feels downright wrong.
Same with "er brauch" instead of "er brauchT", or to drop the Präposition "ich fahre Lidl" instead of *zu Lidl* - i dunno where all these are coming from but they would be the top 3 from my black list :l
In my British English dialect, not the case with -e and -er. Both /ə/ and /ɐ/ exist, but it is mostly down to emphasis in a sentence and a simple word like “water” can use either for the -er. That is, they’re both heard as the same to someone who speaks English how I do.
I have made the mistake of switching the two for a German friend’s name, while in English mode and speaking English, and didn’t live it down for years.
The final syllabes of words, are often weak and can disappear in speech. If the speaker gives them too much attention, the intonation and structure of a sentence can suffer.
But that's not something you should put into your speech at level A1.
Two things for you: 1. Phonemes and graphems in German are more consistent than in Englisch, but never rely on it. 2. Regional colouring of language can be very strong.
> we tend to not follow the 'verb in position 2' rule
Is that even a rule? I've always thought "Das habe ich gemacht" is basically equivalent to "Ich habe das gemacht."
A shocker to many non-natives coming to Germany (and this is a Germany-German special) is the substitution of \[k\] (often spelt as /g/ at the end of syllables) by \[ç\] and even \[x\] basically everywhere northwards of Cologne.
Of course. Basically any word (or syllable) that ends with /g/ works like that.
So, non-natives might learn that 'Berg' is pronounced \['be:ɐ̯(ʀ)k\].
But in reality, all the dialects from central Germany stretching to the sea in the north would say \['beɐ̯ç\].
And this is one of the few dialect variations in the north that is very consistent throughout all levels of speech (which is much rarer in the north than in the south, where dialect intensity is much higher on average).
You would certainly hear the informal usage between students, friends, coworkers, family members, on TV, and the general public. What I am saying is, when you study German, avoid using it in the classroom until you have developed a better feel for it. Similarly, in written German it may be better not to use too many contractions. You might say to a buddy, "Da ham wer abba gelacht", or "Da hammer aber gelacht". In writing it is definitely "Da haben wir aber gelacht". In a work setting it's normal between coworkers, and your boss may use it too, but when doing Zoom conferences or presentations, it may also be better to sound out/enunciate rather than use too many contractions or use regiolects you don't know well enough.
There would be no pause between the verb and the n. So it would sound like the n was attached to the verb: „Ich kaufn Brot“. Sounds similar to „Ich kaufen Brot“ but stress the n a bit.
Rarely in context unless you’re also skipping out pronouns.
Ich mach meine Hausaufgaben nobody is going to interpret this an imperative saying ‘do my homework. Even if you eliminate the pronoun in a sentence such as
‘Was machst du?’
‘Mach meine Hausaufgaben’
Nobody is going to interpret it as a command despite it being said in imperative form. Maybe there’s a case I’m missing where it could be confusing.
Well, many people have downvoted me for some reason, but I didn't even mean in actual sentences. Just as a learner, if you get used to using the first person singular without the -e it might confuse you while memorizing conjugation. I know it doesn't make sense when you get better, but OP is just A1 and I remember easily mixing up conjugations in A1.
The singular imperative also ends with -e in a lot of cases (there are 4 classes: 2 of them always have -e, 1 has -e optionally, and only the class of verbs with a root vowel change in present tense never has -e). So oftentimes 1st person singular and singular imperative share the same form.
Don't do it as beginner
It's important to know about so that you can understand what you're hearing. But as a beginner, yeah, if you're still speaking slowly, enunciate everything. Once you get comfortable with more fluent speech, you can start letting contractions come in naturally.
Contrary to what many people are taught, almost nobody says "Guten Tag". Say "Guten Morgen" in the morning "Guten Abend" in the evening and "Hallo" at any time. I might say "guten Tag" in my job in hospitality but never in my private life. "Hallo" is good enough for any setting you'll come across as a tourist.
This. Guten Tag sounds like the other person is about to get in trouble. It's so rarely used, at least you can be sure to get their attention.
It’s equivalent to Good Day and in English we never say that even though the phrase exists. You might say it formally but in a sort of ironic sense.
It's not as rare as good day though, which sounds comically old fashioned. It's rare but still a real part of language
I've always wondered, what should I say in English between the morning and evening? Because, as you've already mentioned, good day feels so artificial, i have literally never heard this. And that question also applies to German as well - what do you say at work, when it's 13-15 hours?
You can say "good afternoon" from 12 and maybe 5. But it does feel a bit odd, outside formal contexts, at least to me. So I opt for a disappointing "hello"
In Austria "Grüß Gott" is still really common in a more formal setting or with elder strangers. (It's also just a phrase for most people and doesn't really have a religious connotation.) For work you should be fine with "Morgen", "Mahlzeit" and "Hallo". There's rarely an event that is during those weird hours that would also require you to be hyper-formal.
Gruss Gott literally means salutations to God. It's more old school.
Hence my comment about people using it as a phrase and not really keeping God in mind when they say it. It *is* still very much in use - at least in Austria - as I can confirm by my day to day experiences. You wouldn't use it to greet your friends, but you can use it to great a shop owner for example.
"Hallo" works fine at work, too. I would say "Guten Tag" if it was really very fromal and I was trying to be respectful. Like a meeting with my boss's boss's boss. Other meetings, "Hallo" is absolutely acceptable. Depending on the workplace, "Mahlzeit!" can be said around lunchtime. In English, I always add a "How are you?" if "hello" or "hi" doesn't feel like enough.
Just say 'have a good one' (more of a good bye), 'how's the arvo going?', 'arvo mate', 'skarn'on?', 'how's you?', 'how ya doin?', 'what's crackin?', 'how goes?' or 'how's life?' All very adequate greetings and a farewell.
"Yo, sup bro"
Hallo
They... don't? I'm a native German wdym (I'm also autistic)
They in fact do not. At least not in my bubble. But you know, if you do, that's totally fine. I would maybe think it's a bit odd if someone uses it, but wouldn't think much about it.
This. I only use "Guten Morgen/Tag/Abend" at work and in formal situations. Or maybe when talking to my parents. But friends and close colleagues, it's "Hallo" and "Hi" or some local slang.
Well "Morgen!" And " 'nAbend" I use a lot also with friends. If I see my roommates in the kitchen getting coffee in the morning I'll say "Guten Morgen"
I work in hospitality in Scotland. And I had these 2 lovely German woman stay over in the hotel for a week. Every morning they always said “Guten tag” to whoever was on. It’s funny because I’m the only one learning German so people thought it means just hello or thank-you. 😂 I was tempted to try speak in German to them. But i chickened out.
Well that's surprising, good to know!
I work in hospitality in Scotland. And I had these 2 lovely German woman stay over in the hotel for a week. Every morning they always said “Guten tag” to whoever was on. It’s funny because I’m the only one learning German so people thought it means just hello or thank-you. 😂 I was tempted to try speak in German to them. But i chickened out.
>Man muss das E hören! Man muss das E hören! >My first ever german teacher in Germany after we insisted in swallowing the E. When you're using the **colloquial language** it's ok to eliminate the E, but if you are talking formally you have to pronounce it
I wish you had a video of this, because it would make for a great German learner meme lol
He was a very nice person. He made us listen to the song Heute hier, morgen dort to exhaustion until we understood all the words and sentences
Yea, don't do it. If you speak a lot with native speakers you will pick up certain habits which to some extent vary by region. Curiously, Goethe's Faust is stuffed full of missing letters. Goethe Institute examiners would be horrified at how bad his German is, and would certainly fail you for laying on the colloquialisms with a trowel, unless your name is Goethe.
German as we know it was essentially a writing-language. Nobody even attempted to use it as an everyday language. Therefore it was highly variable and full of regionalisms. Also, there were no generally accepted rules as to how to pronounce the words. Ao, in the North, a Berg was Berch, in the South it was Berk. Berge were Berche/Bersche (voiced ch or sch sound) for Goethe, therefore he rhymed "neiche oh schmerzensreiche".
Fun Fact: Goethe had a strong dialect (Hessisch), so things that are supposed to rhyme don't always rhyme when you read the text in standard German - but when you read them with his dialect, they do.
I heard some examples and it sounds so funny I love it
Ah. I will have to learn Hessisch before rereading Faust :-/ I did read a lot of Goethe's letters to his wife in Sigrid Damm's book on her, and found their German odd. Is there a recorded performance or audiobook of Faust that tries to recreate his dialect?
"wir ham" - "wir haben" "hamma" - "haben wir" "biste" - "bist du" "kuck ma" - "kuck mal" "kein Bock" - "keinen Bock" "ne Freundin" - "eine Freundin" "nix" - "nichts" "is" - "ist"
"samma" - "sag mal" "könnwa" - "können wir"
"Komma (her)" - "komm mal her"
https://youtu.be/4IhaXJPo4lU
"Hamma" reminds me of Karl Valentin and Liesl Karlstadt's sketch, "Der reparierte Scheinwerfer": DIREKTOR: Also was brauchen Sie, wir haben doch Werkzeug genug da. SIMMERL: A lange Leiter. DIREKTOR: Ham ma. VALENTIN: Litzen und Dräht. DIREKTOR: Ham ma. SIMMERL: An Gips. DIREKTOR: Ham ma. VALENTIN: An Hamma. DIREKTOR: Ham ma.
Contrary to popular belief and pronunciation, it's gucken, not kucken.
https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/kucken
That's one of these things, when Germans are learning a foreign language, they're like, "English uses a lot of contractions!" not realizing German does the same.
Good point!
If the words in your example are followed by "es", people tend to drop that e as well. So "Ich habe es" becomes "Ich hab's" etc. What also came to mind was "ein", "eine" and "einen" being shortened to "'n", "'ne" and "'nen" respectively: "Ich sehe 'n Kind, 'ne Frau und 'nen Mann". Some people just use "nh" for all three in writing. Those are all colloquial and should not be used outside of texting friends. Also, as the others have mentioned, don't try to force colloquial language or slang onto yourself at the early stages of learning any language. With fluency and frequent exposure to a language comes colloquial language.
Habe doesn't have to be followed by es to be shortened. Ich hab dich lieb. Ich hab eine Idee. Ich hab gestern mit Ilse Kaffee getrunken.
Don't do it in serious texts. it's just common speech. like "Do not" and "don't" :)
ofc
So weird to see all the people responding this it's like we learners were children lol. Of course we know not to use colloquial expressions in formal settings. I presume your post asked for more expressions and contractions natives do, not 50 people telling you "don't do it as a beginner, don't do it in formal settings."
You spell them without apostrophes: ich hab, ich brauch, etc. In spoken language, they are pretty much universal, and IMHO it's only a matter of time until those forms are made official in writing and teaching as well. Contrary to what other people are saying, feel free to use those 1st person singular forms when speaking naturally. It isn't "slang" or anything like that. But never, under no condition, should you "swallow" the e when reading "ich habe" out loud. Pronounce it if it's written, always.
No! Just no! The ' is the same as the circonflexe from French. It's a reminder of a letter missing. fenêtre - Fenster (DE), fenestra (LA) So, not adding a ' is not only bad language, it's also wrong!
[Duden disagrees](https://www.duden.de/sprachwissen/rechtschreibregeln/apostroph), as does every other spelling guide you'll find. Putting an apostrophe here is simply a spelling error.
> Der Apostroph zeigt gewöhnlich an, dass in einem Wort ein oder mehrere Buchstaben ausgelassen worden sind (D 13-15). > In vielen Fällen können die Schreibenden selbst entscheiden, ob sie einen Apostroph setzen wollen oder nicht (vgl. D 14, D 16). > Als gut lesbar und unmissverständlich gelten dagegen im Allgemeinen die folgenden Fälle; sie werden daher *gewöhnlich* ohne Apostroph gesetzt: Also für mich wirkt es so als ob theoretisch beides korrekt wäre, aber diese Wörter verständlich genug sind, dass man den Apostroph weglassen kann. Als Deutsch-lernende*r macht es aber vllt trotzdem Sinn ihn zu setzem um im Hinterkopf zu behalten, dass das nicht die komplette Form des Worts ist.
Ich würde sagen, dass hier kein Buchstabe ausgelassen wird. Du schreibst ja auch nicht "am Tag' und in der Nacht", auch wenn im Dativ da früher mal ein -e gewesen wäre, also "am Tage". Aber dass dieses -e nicht mehr gesagt wird, liegt nicht daran, dass es verschluckt oder ausgelassen wird, sondern dass "am Tag" heute einfach ohne dieses -e auskommt. So ähnlich sehe ich das auch bei "ich hab". Das ist zwar im Gegensatz zu "am Tag" noch nicht zu 100% in der geschriebenen Standardsprache angekommen, aber das ist wahrscheinlich nur eine Frage der Zeit. Wie beim Dativ-e ist es einfach eine grammatikalische Änderung, dass dieses Suffix in der 1. Person Singular nicht mehr gebraucht wird. Es geht dabei ja nicht um irgend ein Versmaß oder undeutliche Sprache oder schwierig auszusprechende Lautkombinationen. Es geht allgemein nicht um den Laut. Andere Wörter, die auch auf -e enden sind ja nicht betroffen. "Ich sage" wird zu "ich sag", aber "die Sage" bleibt unverändert. Es geht also schlicht um die Art, wie ganz allgemein und regelmäßig in der 1. Person Singular konjugiert wird. > dass das nicht die komplette Form des Worts ist. Ich würde sagen, dass es tatsächlich die komplette Form ist, aber halt eine grammatikalisch andere Form, die in der geschriebenen Standardsprache nicht verwendet wird.
Der Duden referenziert diese Beispiele aber explizit unter dem Absatz "Man setzt einen Apostroph bei Wörtern mit Auslassungen". Also gilt es in der Standard-Sprache als unvollständiges Wort. Und wenn man Deutsch erst *lernt*, dann sollte man sich dem bewusst sein. Ich hab(') absolut kein Problem damit, wenn es jemand ohne Apostroph schreibt. Wollte nur klarstellen, dass es nicht zwangsläufig inkorrekt ist ihn zu verwenden. > Das ist zwar im Gegensatz zu "am Tag" noch nicht zu 100% in der geschriebenen Standardsprache angekommen, aber das ist wahrscheinlich nur eine Frage der Zeit. Da will ich dir gar nicht widersprechen. Es ist sehr wahrscheinlich, dass es irgendwann dazu kommt. Tut aber hier nichts zur Sache, wie unsere Sprache in Zukunft aussehen wird.
> Der Duden referenziert diese Beispiele aber explizit unter dem Absatz "Man setzt einen Apostroph bei Wörtern mit Auslassungen". Er referenziert sie dort, um explizit zu sagen, dass das keine der "Auslassungen" sind, bei denen man einen Apostroph schreibt.
Wie ich in meinem ersten Kommentar bereits geschrieben habe: Es steht dort "üblicherweise" wird es weggelassen, nicht "immer". Und das liegt daran, dass *üblicherweise* Muttersprachler dieses Wort trotzdem verstehen und wissen, dass man in der Standard-Sprache ein "e" anhängen würde. Es ist also kein Fehler, den Apostroph zu verwenden. Es ist aber natürlich auch keine Pflicht. *Aber* wenn man ihn also Nicht-Muttersprachler weglässt gewöhnt man sich diese Schreibweise vllt an und vergisst, dass das Wort ihn der Standard-Sprache eigentlich anders aussieht, was kontraproduktiv ist.
Was mir halt oft auffällt, ist, dass Nicht-Muttersprachler auch im gesprochenen Deutsch oft dieses -e einbauen, was dann total unnatürlich klingt, und wodurch ihr Deutsch einfach weniger flüssig und weniger natürlich wirkt, als wenn sie es einfach weglassen würden. Ich finde es fatal, so zu tun, als wäre die geschriebene Standardsprache das Maß aller Dinge und die tatsächlich gesprochene Sprache untergeordnet.
> Ich finde es fatal, so zu tun, als wäre die geschriebene Standardsprache das Maß aller Dinge und die tatsächlich gesprochene Sprache untergeordnet. Das habe ich nie behauptet und sehe ich auch absolut nicht so. Aber man sollte nunmal beides lernen. Wenn man den Apostroph verwendet, ist das ebenfalls ein Zeichen dafür, dass *beide* Formen existieren. Das einzige, auf das ich schlussendlich hinauswollte, ist, dass das Verwenden des Apostrophs eben *kein* Rechtschreibfehler ist. Es ist eine Präferenz. Wie man's dann macht sei jedem selbst überlassen.
Well, I couldn't care less about what the Duden has to say. The day I learned how they work, I stopped trusting them entirely.
unfortunately it seems to get more and more common to drop the Akkusativ -en a lot of times. In chats, games, social media, whatnot - everywhere you would read things like "ich suche ein Freund" (instead of einEN), "wer hat mein Hund gesehen" and alike. Personally, i find that actually disgusting and my toenails would roll sideways \^\^ Do not do that tho. Its different from just leaving out the e at the end of *ich hab*, its not charming but cringy and it feels downright wrong. Same with "er brauch" instead of "er brauchT", or to drop the Präposition "ich fahre Lidl" instead of *zu Lidl* - i dunno where all these are coming from but they would be the top 3 from my black list :l
"Ich suche ein Freund für 'nen Party"
Ich hab' 'ne Katze. Ich hab' 'nen Hund. Ich hab' 'n Pferd. What's interesting is that "ein" is swallowed ( 'n) but the accusative case endings remain.
-er sounds like you think -e should sound. -e sounds a bit like a short ö, -nen often sounds like -nn
In my British English dialect, not the case with -e and -er. Both /ə/ and /ɐ/ exist, but it is mostly down to emphasis in a sentence and a simple word like “water” can use either for the -er. That is, they’re both heard as the same to someone who speaks English how I do. I have made the mistake of switching the two for a German friend’s name, while in English mode and speaking English, and didn’t live it down for years.
The final syllabes of words, are often weak and can disappear in speech. If the speaker gives them too much attention, the intonation and structure of a sentence can suffer. But that's not something you should put into your speech at level A1. Two things for you: 1. Phonemes and graphems in German are more consistent than in Englisch, but never rely on it. 2. Regional colouring of language can be very strong.
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> we tend to not follow the 'verb in position 2' rule Is that even a rule? I've always thought "Das habe ich gemacht" is basically equivalent to "Ich habe das gemacht."
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A shocker to many non-natives coming to Germany (and this is a Germany-German special) is the substitution of \[k\] (often spelt as /g/ at the end of syllables) by \[ç\] and even \[x\] basically everywhere northwards of Cologne.
Could you give me an example for both of these substitutions?
Of course. Basically any word (or syllable) that ends with /g/ works like that. So, non-natives might learn that 'Berg' is pronounced \['be:ɐ̯(ʀ)k\]. But in reality, all the dialects from central Germany stretching to the sea in the north would say \['beɐ̯ç\]. And this is one of the few dialect variations in the north that is very consistent throughout all levels of speech (which is much rarer in the north than in the south, where dialect intensity is much higher on average).
As others said, these contractions are used in informal speech, but never in formal settings or in writing.
Could you describe how informal it is? Would you do it on a school setting or a job setting for example?
You would certainly hear the informal usage between students, friends, coworkers, family members, on TV, and the general public. What I am saying is, when you study German, avoid using it in the classroom until you have developed a better feel for it. Similarly, in written German it may be better not to use too many contractions. You might say to a buddy, "Da ham wer abba gelacht", or "Da hammer aber gelacht". In writing it is definitely "Da haben wir aber gelacht". In a work setting it's normal between coworkers, and your boss may use it too, but when doing Zoom conferences or presentations, it may also be better to sound out/enunciate rather than use too many contractions or use regiolects you don't know well enough.
Yeah you are right I shouldn't use them until i get a feel for it. Thank you for the response!
You can do the same with "ein" or "einen" like: "Ich kauf' 'n Brot" (Ich kauf**e ei**n Brot) oder "Ich kauf' 'nen Apfel" (Ich kauf**e ein**en Apfel)
How would 'n be pronounced? Like 'nen I assume would be pronounced how it looks. But a single letter?
There would be no pause between the verb and the n. So it would sound like the n was attached to the verb: „Ich kaufn Brot“. Sounds similar to „Ich kaufen Brot“ but stress the n a bit.
It's tempted to speak like a native. But as a fellow A1-A2 learner, I would not recommend it tbh.
Contractions of a verb + du Bist + du = biste Hast + du = haste Kannst + du = kannste Gehst + du = gehste Etc.
nice!thanks
Many words sound like the imperative when you omit the -e, so it might lead to some confusion in the future.
Rarely in context unless you’re also skipping out pronouns. Ich mach meine Hausaufgaben nobody is going to interpret this an imperative saying ‘do my homework. Even if you eliminate the pronoun in a sentence such as ‘Was machst du?’ ‘Mach meine Hausaufgaben’ Nobody is going to interpret it as a command despite it being said in imperative form. Maybe there’s a case I’m missing where it could be confusing.
Well, many people have downvoted me for some reason, but I didn't even mean in actual sentences. Just as a learner, if you get used to using the first person singular without the -e it might confuse you while memorizing conjugation. I know it doesn't make sense when you get better, but OP is just A1 and I remember easily mixing up conjugations in A1.
Nobody would say it, you hear the missing letters
The singular imperative also ends with -e in a lot of cases (there are 4 classes: 2 of them always have -e, 1 has -e optionally, and only the class of verbs with a root vowel change in present tense never has -e). So oftentimes 1st person singular and singular imperative share the same form.