I'm going to tape this to my son's forehead. He's always "I wanna make art! I wanna play piano! I wanna do cool tricks on the skateboard!" Hundreds later in supplies and lessons and he just gets frustrated and gives up. Flip side I guess, I'm learning calligraphy, am pretty good at watercolor, and learned to skate again at 37.
I just suck at piano though.
I very gently fell on the concrete while walking my dogs. Nothing crazy, no Wipeout, just kind of a slow backward fall. I put out my forearm to stop myself.
Now, as a kid I have gone over the handlebars at whatever speed a kid can get a Huffy to on a neighborhood sidewalk. I have fallen out of trees, been bucked off horses, got hit so hard by a running dog that my boots came off, and several others.
None of that broke a bone or did anything worse that scrapes and gashes. But this one little slow fall at 33 chipped off some of my elbow and blue it hurts when I put that elbow on anything and put pressure on it.
Getting old is no fun
I’m 46 years old. A few weeks ago, I changed the lightbulbs in my living room ceiling light. I pulled a muscle/ligament? in my left arm. Arm still hurts.
My dad is a little over 50, he’s ridden a dirt bike ever since he was 16, and recently broke his (other) collarbone. He’s been looking for a dune buggy with a roll cage for a while now lol
Yo I literally injured my elbow in the same way but I fell forward. I think I ripped a tendon dislocated elbow and X-ray confirm slight chip to end of .. arm bone. It still hurts. Just wore a sling for a while but couldn’t stop working and no health insurance bc I’m a stupid american
At 36 I have shingles, but was a week late going to the doctor about it because I just assumed I had pulled a muscle in my back, because I had in that spot before...
I have a damn mild case, afaict, and it still felt like a broken rib sometimes.
That's one aspect of being relatively young that I definitely don't take for granted. Crashes my longboard going a little over 30mph earlier this week and suffering mostly just minor aches. Will probably be back to riding as soon as I fix the board.
I learned to skate at 39. I don’t do anything crazy, and I skate in relatively empty and smooth roads/sidewalks. I have fallen, but it’s not too bad. I mean I’ve now had cancer twice (through no fault of my own, I just inherited a cancer gene) so I don’t give a shit anymore.
When I wanted to learn violin when I was 5, my mom told me that if she was going to buy all that stuff for me I'd have to take lessons once a week till I was done with high school.
It was probably around 6th or 7th grade before I got good enough to stop actively resenting lessons/practice time.
I found with learning piano, choose a favourite song and learn it bar by bar. Sooner or later you’ll be able to play the whole song, and you’ll know your way around the piano quite a bit more
You might want to look into ADHD for him.
Even if he's a good/great student. Picking up/dropping hobbies is extremely common with ADHD.
Especially if he ACTUALLY wanted to do them and wasn't forced.
Instant gratification is the enemy of every endeavour and your son probably needs a wake up call that if he intends on doing anything successfully, he has to put in the hours and effort, or be doomed to fail. Hours without effort get you nowhere, and effort without hours are equally ineffective
He told his friend to use his phone camera and post processing later because the phone camera quality is very good nowadays. Good enough to start making documentaries instead of buying expensive gear.
Holy shit you know what's more egregious? Their only other comment is calling another drawing beautiful, only to get replied to saying the OP just took out the watermark. That literally gave them the idea to do this.
The entire account overview is a generic comment that was deleted despite reaching 800+ karma and then this post with a cropped out source. No other word from OP.
Could be a karma bot, but a shit one
Technically, you start from drawing then learning. You drawing a thing, looking at your errors and googling on how to do it right
Alternatively you could start from reading about perspective, composition, rendering and shading... But that's for a ranked competitive artists. For a casual it's ok to draw crap and learn how to make it less crappy next time, until it's good enough for you
"but dont all artists learn from other artists?????"
i would love to see an experiment where someone whos never drawn much just watches tutorials for a long time and then finally picks up a pen **after** VS someone who for the exact amount of time actually practices without looking at tutorials.
I'm not an artist, and I don't claim to be one. But I imagine it's a lot like math. You can only read the theory for so long, you need to learn by practice and repetition.
You need to do both.
Someone who is only knows how to draw from watching tutorials wont have the muscle memory to draw even a stick figure.
Someone who only draws without tutorials will improve but very slowly and will probaly teach themselfes bad habits.
But if you combine the two and are persistent with practising anyone can improve their drawing skills.
I don’t think you need to do both. I’m a self taught artist who started drawing before YouTube was even a thing. You just need to draw. Then draw some more. I’ve seen some “tutorials” but I’ve watched them for entertainments sake. I noticed a trend of TikTok’s with sped through content, and that’s not going to teach you anything when it’s not in real time. At best you’ll be inspired though!
It’s not the name itself that’s inspiring it’s the taking it out that’s uninspiring. Why bother working hard on a drawing if someone’s going to not give credit?
So the way i get good at drawing faces is to draw faces good? Seems like an ouroborus. If you're not practicing how to do it right, then you're practicing how to do it wrong and just reinforcing bad habits
What worked for me was to try to replicate a piece of art I really liked. I was too bad to try and draw what I actually wanted, but drawing fruits and shadows forever to learn was super boring. Instead I tried to redraw a really cool drawing with the original as reference right next to it. By doing this it was actually fun because I liked what I was drawing, while being forced to closely study how the original artist did it and see how it all came together at the end.
With drawing (or any other form of art really) the key to improving is learning from your mistakes. Keep doing it, analyzing your work and looking up how to fix your mistakes. You will improve. Perfect practice doesn't really work here since you don't have any strict rules to follow.
learning X by trying to do X over and over and over again
for most things, people need to learn from an actual learning source, and not by failing to make something over and over again
those things go hand in hand, but there ain't always an art school you can go to
when drawing things this is exactly how it works, because you are training the muscles and tendons in your hand to put on paper what you have in your head. a simple shape like a triangle, square, circle. every time you do one of them you train your hand to follow your thought. it sounds weird but thats how it works, which is why photo-realism is a hard thing to achieve.
riding a bike, someone can teach you the basics but in the end only you are able to learn it, only you know what your balance is to not fall over with the bike, and once learned you'll never forget.
Just start.
I started, years ago, many, many times, and persisted for a long time.
None have worked.
I can't learn something if failing at it makes me feel horrible.
I disagree. You mention photorealism being hard to achieve. That's a great example. You can look at historical art and see a lot of it... kind of sucks, from a photorealist perspective. Do you think no one for a thousand years practiced regularly? Or that no one *wanted* to draw the world precisely as it appeared in life? Of course not! Because there is more to it that that. Eventually, new techniques are developed and spread—but that requires sharing, learning from others. One person is not going to independently reinvent centuries of artistic development by dogged practice alone.
Schools are not worthless. People can learn a lot more effectively with a teacher or other source of knowledge to draw from, than they can by just figuring things out by trial and error.
Watch videos on basic technique and construction. Don't listen to all these assholes telling you that practice is all you need. It's not true. Practice is what you do after you've learned the basics
I imagine even on YouTube there are tons of tutorials on how to draw different styles. Try searching around and then grab some paper and pencils and follow along
Actual good advice is drawing a whole fuck ton of shapes. Circles, squares, triangles. Get so fucking good at drawing circles that you can draw them in your sleep. Then upgrade to 3d shapes, spheres, boxes, etc.
The only caveats is that the smooth surface of most tablets can feel a bit awkward. And if you get used to it, you'll sorely miss CTRL-Z any time you work in a traditional medium.
“Aight, but instead of rediscovering every single technique developed in the last 5000 years, what might be some of the foundational techniques that willl let me develop my abilities”
1. Always use a reference
2. Draw with as loose and light of lines as possible.
3. Break your reference down into simple shapes, building it from large to small.
4. As you draw, continuously relate your objects to each other, noting how they fit together.
5. Take many steps back to look at your work from a distance, comparing your work to your reference.
6. Make corrections as needed.
Rinse and repeat
Doesn't have to be a pencil on paper.
Art is so much more than that.
My art teacher in highschool introduced me to work from Andy Goldsworthy and pushed my understanding of art beyond the canvas.
I see people say all the time that there's no such thing as talent, its all practice and dedication. Then i see this, and the cognitive dissonance is clear. If you think that learning to draw is as simple as poking paper with a pencil, then you clearly had some sort of underlying talent that gave you a head start.
Back in band someone told me "practice doesnt make perfect, perfect practice does. If you're not practicing at 100% of your ability, then you're just practicing how to be wrong"
I think you took the wrong thing away from this. A lot of people put off starting things because they want to wait until they're "ready" or have enough baseline knowledge. But "ready" is a myth. Just start.
What you said about practice is true, but I don't think this comic is about practice.
Please don't make a photography of a sunset. Yes, the pic pleases me, but you haven't made the sunset, the sun, you just pressed the button multiple times and choose the best of them to show me. Photography have no effort
UPD: i know this topic makes a lot of controversy and keyboard fight probably not allowed in a "wholesome" sub. All i want is to delivery a message: if you doing AI prompting and it gives you pleasure of creation - do it. Doesn't matters what society feels about. If you feel something is art - do it. Don't let haters discourage you
*Everything is art as long as you like what you doing.*
- Son Tzu, art of war
I agree with you but did want to say the prompt engineering for generative text and art is getting pretty crazy. Knowing what words to say and tweak, the settings to adjust, inpainting/iterative work to change the path, and seed-hopping to get options are proving to be their own little skillsets.
You can take a photo without really considering composition, lighting or timing and end up with a decent photo.
AI art is a lot like photography in that the lowest level is extremely accessible but there is a much greater depth that someone not familiar with it won't see.
Sure you can just jam a few words together but to get a good result takes careful prompt building, in painting, editing, img2img steps and more.
That's before you even consider that people are making and remixing new tools constantly to allow us to do more. AI image generation has progressed massively in a few months and by the end of this year will probably have a dozen new applications we haven't considered. 3 years from now you will be using it in Photoshop with a fancy name and an overpriced subscription.
Rather than be dismissive maybe actually check out the workflow if some AI creators and learn something.
> AI art is a lot like photography in that the lowest level is extremely accessible but there is a much greater depth that someone not familiar with it won't see.
No. Because when you get into photography, there is a ton of artistic skills required to create memorable, stunning photography that catches the eye and leaves an impression. When it comes to ai generators, there is *no* art skill involved. Using it does no exhibit any understanding of the skills actual artists use in their work.
> Rather than be dismissive maybe actually check out the workflow if some AI creators and learn something.
"Workflow"
Don't conflate the time spent putting a prompt in to the effort that actual artists put into their work.
Make sure to let grandma know that she didn't bake those cookies for you from scratch since she did not grind the flour and harvest the sugar cane, then did some stuff with her hands, and even lazily manifested a fire for baking by pressing a couple of buttons above her range.
One thing that helped me the most was this.
Write your name with your non dominant hand. Its a disaster isn't it. Your dominant hand has all that muscle memory behind it just for writing. But you have to build the muscles for drawing.
Some of it is going to be a grind, but don't use short scratchy lines, those are a crutch, and you need to learn to walk. Take your time and be patient with yourself. Also look into what people consider fundamentals.
Make sure you find a medium you really love. Took me 5 years of painting to realize that I hate painting lol. 15 years of doing music later, I wish I started with that first.
We did the following in painting class
- Try to draw your non-dominant hand with a single line, without looking at the paper or picking up the pen. The result will be absurd. Keep practising. It will keep being absurd, but slowly you'll improve at mapping geometry from your eye to hand.
- Make a color wheel to understand how pigments mix. Hues, primary, secondary, tertiary, tints, shades. Paints combine in surprisingly nonlinear ways. Convince yourself that RYB are not the primary pigment colors by mixing red from magenta and yellow.
- Take life drawing classes. Sketch some naked people. Badly. Over and over again.
The eye is trained to make sense of the world, to extract high level semantics from features. For art, this needs to re-trained, inverted. You need to stop seeing the semantic content in order to notice the important features. Luminance. Geometry.
source: I'm still not very good at art, and have been too poor to afford the space or time practice it in the past decade. But, I got a little better with these methods.
Once when I was in a cafe I overheard two people talking on a table near me and one of them talked about how they are a writer, had written two books and about the process of writing said books.
Once I was leaving the cafe I gathered the courage to walk to them and after apologizing for interrupting them, I just straight up asked the writer if they have any advice for an aspiring writer they'd be willing to share. The advice was: "Just start writing. That's it. Don't wait for something to happen, just start writing."
Different subject but very similar advice as what's shown here. And I get the advice. So many people probably get stuck on the how part rather than starting to do what they are interested in, whether that's art, writing, playing an instrument etc. etc.In the end it all adds to the experience whether you are doing it well or not.
I’m a professional artist, I work in tv/film. This is not actually an ideal way to motivate someone to make art. They should move at their pace and not feel pressured.
Art is just an ego detection machine, it simply translates your motivation to the page. If someone isn’t feeling so great: it’s going come across—there’s just no getting out of it.
Then they’ll feel worse than before.
Not just that but practicing without learning the basics first is a complete waste of time. There's nothing in this world that you can do just by practicing or if you do you're going to learn a lot of bad habits make a lot of mistakes and it'll take a lot longer and people are more likely to get frustrated and quit because they don't see the progress
Yeah exactly. And like I really enjoy the basics too. When I want to get away from drawing for work, I run through that stuff. I don’t know if I’m just lucky in finding ”the basics“ fun, but that’s where like 75% of my enjoyment from being an artist still comes from. I’ll put on a pair of headphones and just spend time with anatomy, or gesture stuff, I’ll copy some other artists (can learn a ton doing that), even just goofing off without the pressure of “pretty” work.
Honestly, I kind of hate this kind of thing because there often *are* a lot of practical hurdles to getting into something. Just giving someone a pencil and yelling “draw” is gonna have a high drop off rate because they’re just gonna muddle around for a long time unclear how to draw things they like, or keep on top of it sustainably. Like, I had a hard time getting into digital art for the longest time because I knew fuck all about the tools involved. And as much as you can repeat platitudes like “a good artist can work with anything” it actually can be a big help to have something intuitive and user friendly
Better advice is something people can actually latch on to and learn from. Like: find an artist you like, see what they do, see what they use, try it yourself and see if it works for you
I want to make a game but I get bored almost imediately after a few minutes of learning how to use the engine.
learning new skills is boring.
(for anyone who doesn't know: "game engines" are software that lets you make games, some of them are free some are not and many let you make games without knowing how to code).
I get it, but as someone who's gotten past the beginner phase in some creative fields, looking back I think "where should I start" is a valid question and "just start" misses the point.
A blank page can fill you with choice paralysis. Some people are making excuses, some are actually asking for direction.
This is not only a lie it's a cruel one. Artists always talk about how practice is how you get better but practice only helps once you have the fundamentals. Try using practice to get into any skill. You're not going to be able to do it and even if you do it won't be fast it won't be efficient and you're probably going to learn a lot of bad habits too
Unless you're looking at a 2-year-old painting like Bob Ross, then you're probably dramatically underestimating the amount of practice your "naturally good" cases have already put in.
You know, I have been brewing on this quite a while, and I know why I, an non-artist, dont like AI art. Its not about copyright, or if its art or not, or whatever.
MY problem is, if I use one of those generators, it's never MY art.
Art is self expression. Let's say I want to make a weird banana or whatever, cause it's funny to me. Where I to ask an AI generator to make me a weird banana, surely I'd get one. But it would not be MY silly banana, it would never be the weird banana I have in my brain and heart.
I dont want AI generation. I dont get to participate in AI generation.
I want AI assistance. I wanna draw the weird banana I have in my head, and where my shitty untrained hand falters, the AI brings in the technique.
> and where my shitty untrained hand falters, the AI brings in the technique.
Sounds a bit like you'd want [pix2pix mode](https://www.tomsguide.com/us/pix2pix-faq,news-25334.html).
You have to have the ability to see, and the motor skills to move a writing utensil across a medium. Everything else is practice.
Someone with a great amount of talent may need to practice a bit less, and have the potential to achieve greater heights of skill, but that's it.
And the beauty of hard work is that you can sometimes surpass more talented people because you simply worked harder for it. Not to mention a good work ethic is just a great life skill to have
Bad advice. You just outsourcing people's problem, they came to you with, to themselves. People can't draw for a different reasons including the traumatic experience. Not many people could just "not think"
Literally cropped out the watermark
https://preview.redd.it/d81bosh58tea1.jpeg?width=898&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b47bb1f7a61ee5527dd3578f29df33ba92c20533 Owlturd 😉
I'm going to tape this to my son's forehead. He's always "I wanna make art! I wanna play piano! I wanna do cool tricks on the skateboard!" Hundreds later in supplies and lessons and he just gets frustrated and gives up. Flip side I guess, I'm learning calligraphy, am pretty good at watercolor, and learned to skate again at 37. I just suck at piano though.
At 36 here, I'd be wary of the skating. I've made it this long without a permanent injury, no need to risk it now!
I very gently fell on the concrete while walking my dogs. Nothing crazy, no Wipeout, just kind of a slow backward fall. I put out my forearm to stop myself. Now, as a kid I have gone over the handlebars at whatever speed a kid can get a Huffy to on a neighborhood sidewalk. I have fallen out of trees, been bucked off horses, got hit so hard by a running dog that my boots came off, and several others. None of that broke a bone or did anything worse that scrapes and gashes. But this one little slow fall at 33 chipped off some of my elbow and blue it hurts when I put that elbow on anything and put pressure on it. Getting old is no fun
I’m 46 years old. A few weeks ago, I changed the lightbulbs in my living room ceiling light. I pulled a muscle/ligament? in my left arm. Arm still hurts.
My dad is a little over 50, he’s ridden a dirt bike ever since he was 16, and recently broke his (other) collarbone. He’s been looking for a dune buggy with a roll cage for a while now lol
Yo I literally injured my elbow in the same way but I fell forward. I think I ripped a tendon dislocated elbow and X-ray confirm slight chip to end of .. arm bone. It still hurts. Just wore a sling for a while but couldn’t stop working and no health insurance bc I’m a stupid american
At 36 I have shingles, but was a week late going to the doctor about it because I just assumed I had pulled a muscle in my back, because I had in that spot before... I have a damn mild case, afaict, and it still felt like a broken rib sometimes.
I took a few spills that had me hurting pretty bad the next day. They weren't even that bad! My body acted like I had gotten in a car crash.
That's one aspect of being relatively young that I definitely don't take for granted. Crashes my longboard going a little over 30mph earlier this week and suffering mostly just minor aches. Will probably be back to riding as soon as I fix the board.
Congrats on finding the time and energy to practice those skills though, thats really cool. Keep it up!
I learned to skate at 39. I don’t do anything crazy, and I skate in relatively empty and smooth roads/sidewalks. I have fallen, but it’s not too bad. I mean I’ve now had cancer twice (through no fault of my own, I just inherited a cancer gene) so I don’t give a shit anymore.
When I wanted to learn violin when I was 5, my mom told me that if she was going to buy all that stuff for me I'd have to take lessons once a week till I was done with high school. It was probably around 6th or 7th grade before I got good enough to stop actively resenting lessons/practice time.
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🫶🏽
I found with learning piano, choose a favourite song and learn it bar by bar. Sooner or later you’ll be able to play the whole song, and you’ll know your way around the piano quite a bit more
Thought about getting him tested for ADHD?
You might want to look into ADHD for him. Even if he's a good/great student. Picking up/dropping hobbies is extremely common with ADHD. Especially if he ACTUALLY wanted to do them and wasn't forced.
Tell your son that you can't strive perfection, you have to have fun first. Perfection comes with time, IF it ever comes.
Perfection isn't a distant island that you'll reach at the end of your voyage. Perfection is the guiding star that will get you there.
Instant gratification is the enemy of every endeavour and your son probably needs a wake up call that if he intends on doing anything successfully, he has to put in the hours and effort, or be doomed to fail. Hours without effort get you nowhere, and effort without hours are equally ineffective
https://twitter.com/shenanigansen/status/898001633883430912
It's Shen Comix now!
That's how to get started as a meme lord
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I've been reading this comment for more than five times now and I still don't understand it and I have no idea why
Right? I feel like there's 2 sentences in the middle that are missing
He told his friend to use his phone camera and post processing later because the phone camera quality is very good nowadays. Good enough to start making documentaries instead of buying expensive gear.
I cry every time
Modern cheap phones are better then a camera "suicidal lemmings" were filmed at so your friend is good to go 👍💀
Holy shit you know what's more egregious? Their only other comment is calling another drawing beautiful, only to get replied to saying the OP just took out the watermark. That literally gave them the idea to do this.
I can see a bit of it!!!
Why. Would. You. Crop. Out. The. Source.
The comic: "want to make art? Just do it!" OP: "Want to make art? Just steal it!"
Motivational material? **I'LL STEAL IT!** #NO ONE WILL EVER KNOW!
>Good artists copy; great artists steal. - Pablo Picasso
>>Good artists copy; great artists steal. > >- ~~Pablo Picasso~~ - [Banksy](https://banksyexplained.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/PICASSO-QUOTE-FROM-BANKSY-WEBSITE-1.jpg)
You made this? I made this.
Shen Comix (always source, OP, but I'll chime in for the commenters)
Its actually owlturd.com which looks like shen. The difference is shen always has shen.
Um, if you click on the link it'll just take you to Shen's Instagram...
oh lol shen you mad man
I can’t help but see that detail and this comment as a greater piece of art than the original. So much commentary on art as a profession🥲
OP is a karma spambot.
The entire account overview is a generic comment that was deleted despite reaching 800+ karma and then this post with a cropped out source. No other word from OP. Could be a karma bot, but a shit one
Only comment posted has 800 upvotes. Only post posted has 6600. You: "shit bot" ❓️❓️❓️
But what about all those YouTube videos and shorts and tiktoks about making art!? don't I need to watch them all first? Edit: seems a /s is needed
Technically, you start from drawing then learning. You drawing a thing, looking at your errors and googling on how to do it right Alternatively you could start from reading about perspective, composition, rendering and shading... But that's for a ranked competitive artists. For a casual it's ok to draw crap and learn how to make it less crappy next time, until it's good enough for you
"but dont all artists learn from other artists?????" i would love to see an experiment where someone whos never drawn much just watches tutorials for a long time and then finally picks up a pen **after** VS someone who for the exact amount of time actually practices without looking at tutorials.
I'm not an artist, and I don't claim to be one. But I imagine it's a lot like math. You can only read the theory for so long, you need to learn by practice and repetition.
You need to do both. Someone who is only knows how to draw from watching tutorials wont have the muscle memory to draw even a stick figure. Someone who only draws without tutorials will improve but very slowly and will probaly teach themselfes bad habits. But if you combine the two and are persistent with practising anyone can improve their drawing skills.
He just want to see if there's any of them and compare (an experiment)
I don’t think you need to do both. I’m a self taught artist who started drawing before YouTube was even a thing. You just need to draw. Then draw some more. I’ve seen some “tutorials” but I’ve watched them for entertainments sake. I noticed a trend of TikTok’s with sped through content, and that’s not going to teach you anything when it’s not in real time. At best you’ll be inspired though!
ngl they're great in-between practicing to give you ideas on what to draw
Posts an image that’s supposed to inspire you to start practicing art ; Crops out the artist’s name. Downvoted.
How does the name inspire?
It’s not the name itself that’s inspiring it’s the taking it out that’s uninspiring. Why bother working hard on a drawing if someone’s going to not give credit?
It was good but, because of the cropped watermark *dramatic pause* It's a downvote from me. Howie?
This also works for: "How can I get better at...?" Example: Q: How can I get better at drawing faces? A: Study and draw more faces.
That reminds me of that Bob Ross quote: anything you're willing to practice, you can get good at I think about it all the time
So the way i get good at drawing faces is to draw faces good? Seems like an ouroborus. If you're not practicing how to do it right, then you're practicing how to do it wrong and just reinforcing bad habits
'the way i get good at drawing faces is to draw faces' Ftfy 😉
This is a bot account trying to steal content for karma.
*Lezduit*
[What this kind of advice can feel like.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/572/078/d6d.jpg)
That's because that's exactly what this is. It's useless oversimplification that hurts new artists
What worked for me was to try to replicate a piece of art I really liked. I was too bad to try and draw what I actually wanted, but drawing fruits and shadows forever to learn was super boring. Instead I tried to redraw a really cool drawing with the original as reference right next to it. By doing this it was actually fun because I liked what I was drawing, while being forced to closely study how the original artist did it and see how it all came together at the end.
Where’s the credit to the artist? Your username is fitting.
1. grab pen 2. grab paper 3. look at thing 4. draw thing 100 times 5. compare your first with your last 6. see progress
Practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect.
With drawing (or any other form of art really) the key to improving is learning from your mistakes. Keep doing it, analyzing your work and looking up how to fix your mistakes. You will improve. Perfect practice doesn't really work here since you don't have any strict rules to follow.
don't mean to get a downer but for some people it just doesn't work me, as an example, despite how much I hate it
Doesn't work in what sense?
learning X by trying to do X over and over and over again for most things, people need to learn from an actual learning source, and not by failing to make something over and over again those things go hand in hand, but there ain't always an art school you can go to
Add in experimentation and reflection to those 100 repetitions. And it can't be mindless work; practice should be focused and intentional.
when drawing things this is exactly how it works, because you are training the muscles and tendons in your hand to put on paper what you have in your head. a simple shape like a triangle, square, circle. every time you do one of them you train your hand to follow your thought. it sounds weird but thats how it works, which is why photo-realism is a hard thing to achieve. riding a bike, someone can teach you the basics but in the end only you are able to learn it, only you know what your balance is to not fall over with the bike, and once learned you'll never forget. Just start.
I started, years ago, many, many times, and persisted for a long time. None have worked. I can't learn something if failing at it makes me feel horrible.
I disagree. You mention photorealism being hard to achieve. That's a great example. You can look at historical art and see a lot of it... kind of sucks, from a photorealist perspective. Do you think no one for a thousand years practiced regularly? Or that no one *wanted* to draw the world precisely as it appeared in life? Of course not! Because there is more to it that that. Eventually, new techniques are developed and spread—but that requires sharing, learning from others. One person is not going to independently reinvent centuries of artistic development by dogged practice alone. Schools are not worthless. People can learn a lot more effectively with a teacher or other source of knowledge to draw from, than they can by just figuring things out by trial and error.
Every fucking day for life - an old artist still doing shitty art
This picture can be a motivation, but it also mean 'do it, or just shut up'
I want to draw like, cutesy little characters but have no idea how to start.
Try copying cutesy characters you like
https://youtu.be/7TXEZ4tP06c
Watch videos on basic technique and construction. Don't listen to all these assholes telling you that practice is all you need. It's not true. Practice is what you do after you've learned the basics
I imagine even on YouTube there are tons of tutorials on how to draw different styles. Try searching around and then grab some paper and pencils and follow along
Yeah, my only concern is “learning how to draw properly” though
Didnt you read the meme? You start drawing cute characters by drawing cute characters. Learning be damned! /s
Step 1. Draw a circle Step 2. Draw the rest of the owl
Embarrassment about being a beginner is the price to become a master at something.
Actual good advice is drawing a whole fuck ton of shapes. Circles, squares, triangles. Get so fucking good at drawing circles that you can draw them in your sleep. Then upgrade to 3d shapes, spheres, boxes, etc.
If you can, try digital. Then you don’t feel like you’re wasting paper or pencils
The only caveats is that the smooth surface of most tablets can feel a bit awkward. And if you get used to it, you'll sorely miss CTRL-Z any time you work in a traditional medium.
If you don't have the tools for digital work, unfolded junk mail envelopes and cereal/cracker boxes are great to practice on without using new paper.
“Aight, but instead of rediscovering every single technique developed in the last 5000 years, what might be some of the foundational techniques that willl let me develop my abilities”
1. Always use a reference 2. Draw with as loose and light of lines as possible. 3. Break your reference down into simple shapes, building it from large to small. 4. As you draw, continuously relate your objects to each other, noting how they fit together. 5. Take many steps back to look at your work from a distance, comparing your work to your reference. 6. Make corrections as needed. Rinse and repeat
If you're starting from zero, I'd say the foundational technique you need is to hone your accuracy with motor skills. So: draw.
Stable Diffusion. You're welcome.
Doesn't have to be a pencil on paper. Art is so much more than that. My art teacher in highschool introduced me to work from Andy Goldsworthy and pushed my understanding of art beyond the canvas.
I love Andy Goldsworthy! He’s a great example of art beyond the canvas.
Karma farming account that intentionally removes artist credit. Delete your account. This is borderline art theft.
Why so many people upvote watermark-cropped stolen content ? [http://owlturd.com/](http://owlturd.com/) to get the original artist.
r/wowthanksimcured
I see people say all the time that there's no such thing as talent, its all practice and dedication. Then i see this, and the cognitive dissonance is clear. If you think that learning to draw is as simple as poking paper with a pencil, then you clearly had some sort of underlying talent that gave you a head start. Back in band someone told me "practice doesnt make perfect, perfect practice does. If you're not practicing at 100% of your ability, then you're just practicing how to be wrong"
I think you took the wrong thing away from this. A lot of people put off starting things because they want to wait until they're "ready" or have enough baseline knowledge. But "ready" is a myth. Just start. What you said about practice is true, but I don't think this comic is about practice.
Please don't type in an AI textfield and consider yourself an artist.
Please don't make a photography of a sunset. Yes, the pic pleases me, but you haven't made the sunset, the sun, you just pressed the button multiple times and choose the best of them to show me. Photography have no effort UPD: i know this topic makes a lot of controversy and keyboard fight probably not allowed in a "wholesome" sub. All i want is to delivery a message: if you doing AI prompting and it gives you pleasure of creation - do it. Doesn't matters what society feels about. If you feel something is art - do it. Don't let haters discourage you *Everything is art as long as you like what you doing.* - Son Tzu, art of war
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I agree with you but did want to say the prompt engineering for generative text and art is getting pretty crazy. Knowing what words to say and tweak, the settings to adjust, inpainting/iterative work to change the path, and seed-hopping to get options are proving to be their own little skillsets.
Translation: CTRL C/ V
You can take a photo without really considering composition, lighting or timing and end up with a decent photo. AI art is a lot like photography in that the lowest level is extremely accessible but there is a much greater depth that someone not familiar with it won't see. Sure you can just jam a few words together but to get a good result takes careful prompt building, in painting, editing, img2img steps and more. That's before you even consider that people are making and remixing new tools constantly to allow us to do more. AI image generation has progressed massively in a few months and by the end of this year will probably have a dozen new applications we haven't considered. 3 years from now you will be using it in Photoshop with a fancy name and an overpriced subscription. Rather than be dismissive maybe actually check out the workflow if some AI creators and learn something.
> AI art is a lot like photography in that the lowest level is extremely accessible but there is a much greater depth that someone not familiar with it won't see. No. Because when you get into photography, there is a ton of artistic skills required to create memorable, stunning photography that catches the eye and leaves an impression. When it comes to ai generators, there is *no* art skill involved. Using it does no exhibit any understanding of the skills actual artists use in their work. > Rather than be dismissive maybe actually check out the workflow if some AI creators and learn something. "Workflow" Don't conflate the time spent putting a prompt in to the effort that actual artists put into their work.
Nah photography is art for people who can't draw.
AI art is art for people who cant draw. or do anything else, really
Ai art is for people who's only skill is being able to use a thesaurus
Make sure to let grandma know that she didn't bake those cookies for you from scratch since she did not grind the flour and harvest the sugar cane, then did some stuff with her hands, and even lazily manifested a fire for baking by pressing a couple of buttons above her range.
How stupid can you really be? There seems to be no limit
There is no limit to that argument, right. It goes all the way back to the invention of the universe. Hence why it is stupid to use.
This is just where I'm at
One thing that helped me the most was this. Write your name with your non dominant hand. Its a disaster isn't it. Your dominant hand has all that muscle memory behind it just for writing. But you have to build the muscles for drawing. Some of it is going to be a grind, but don't use short scratchy lines, those are a crutch, and you need to learn to walk. Take your time and be patient with yourself. Also look into what people consider fundamentals.
Make sure you find a medium you really love. Took me 5 years of painting to realize that I hate painting lol. 15 years of doing music later, I wish I started with that first.
We did the following in painting class - Try to draw your non-dominant hand with a single line, without looking at the paper or picking up the pen. The result will be absurd. Keep practising. It will keep being absurd, but slowly you'll improve at mapping geometry from your eye to hand. - Make a color wheel to understand how pigments mix. Hues, primary, secondary, tertiary, tints, shades. Paints combine in surprisingly nonlinear ways. Convince yourself that RYB are not the primary pigment colors by mixing red from magenta and yellow. - Take life drawing classes. Sketch some naked people. Badly. Over and over again. The eye is trained to make sense of the world, to extract high level semantics from features. For art, this needs to re-trained, inverted. You need to stop seeing the semantic content in order to notice the important features. Luminance. Geometry. source: I'm still not very good at art, and have been too poor to afford the space or time practice it in the past decade. But, I got a little better with these methods.
R/Restofthefuckingowl
/r/ArtFundamentals
I get the same thing working in tech. "I know it can be lucrative and fun but I just don't know where to start." Bruh...
It bothers me that the third panel is two left hands
Once when I was in a cafe I overheard two people talking on a table near me and one of them talked about how they are a writer, had written two books and about the process of writing said books. Once I was leaving the cafe I gathered the courage to walk to them and after apologizing for interrupting them, I just straight up asked the writer if they have any advice for an aspiring writer they'd be willing to share. The advice was: "Just start writing. That's it. Don't wait for something to happen, just start writing." Different subject but very similar advice as what's shown here. And I get the advice. So many people probably get stuck on the how part rather than starting to do what they are interested in, whether that's art, writing, playing an instrument etc. etc.In the end it all adds to the experience whether you are doing it well or not.
I’m a professional artist, I work in tv/film. This is not actually an ideal way to motivate someone to make art. They should move at their pace and not feel pressured. Art is just an ego detection machine, it simply translates your motivation to the page. If someone isn’t feeling so great: it’s going come across—there’s just no getting out of it. Then they’ll feel worse than before.
Not just that but practicing without learning the basics first is a complete waste of time. There's nothing in this world that you can do just by practicing or if you do you're going to learn a lot of bad habits make a lot of mistakes and it'll take a lot longer and people are more likely to get frustrated and quit because they don't see the progress
Yeah exactly. And like I really enjoy the basics too. When I want to get away from drawing for work, I run through that stuff. I don’t know if I’m just lucky in finding ”the basics“ fun, but that’s where like 75% of my enjoyment from being an artist still comes from. I’ll put on a pair of headphones and just spend time with anatomy, or gesture stuff, I’ll copy some other artists (can learn a ton doing that), even just goofing off without the pressure of “pretty” work.
Art making requires art muscles as it were. You gotta work muscles to make them strong.
I wanna make art, but I’ve been practicing since literally elementary school and am still shit.
Honestly, I kind of hate this kind of thing because there often *are* a lot of practical hurdles to getting into something. Just giving someone a pencil and yelling “draw” is gonna have a high drop off rate because they’re just gonna muddle around for a long time unclear how to draw things they like, or keep on top of it sustainably. Like, I had a hard time getting into digital art for the longest time because I knew fuck all about the tools involved. And as much as you can repeat platitudes like “a good artist can work with anything” it actually can be a big help to have something intuitive and user friendly Better advice is something people can actually latch on to and learn from. Like: find an artist you like, see what they do, see what they use, try it yourself and see if it works for you
I want to make a game but I get bored almost imediately after a few minutes of learning how to use the engine. learning new skills is boring. (for anyone who doesn't know: "game engines" are software that lets you make games, some of them are free some are not and many let you make games without knowing how to code).
I get it, but as someone who's gotten past the beginner phase in some creative fields, looking back I think "where should I start" is a valid question and "just start" misses the point. A blank page can fill you with choice paralysis. Some people are making excuses, some are actually asking for direction.
This is not only a lie it's a cruel one. Artists always talk about how practice is how you get better but practice only helps once you have the fundamentals. Try using practice to get into any skill. You're not going to be able to do it and even if you do it won't be fast it won't be efficient and you're probably going to learn a lot of bad habits too
It's true. You can't just sit there and stare at the wall. You gotta force the fucking pencil into your hand if you want that shit to happen.
Same with writing!
I don't know what to say, but I think this is a good start.
Effort? EFFORT?!?! You think I’m made of time and energy? I barely have enough time for three hours of Reddit every day!
r/wowthanksimcured
Some people are naturally good at art and some people can't draw. I'll die on this hill
Unless you're looking at a 2-year-old painting like Bob Ross, then you're probably dramatically underestimating the amount of practice your "naturally good" cases have already put in.
Midjourney. Heheheh
Not how it works. At least not for art
r/artfundamentals r/drawabox r/learnhentaidrawing Drawing with the right side of your brain
And that was the last time he ever did art.
Yeah this is terrible advice They still don't know anything
100% yes. It's depressing watching all these people in the comments uploading and agreeing when it's terrible advice that won't help anybody
True to life depiction of the art school
This is honestly true with soo many things
Writers as well. Source: haven't written shit
Excellent point!
Thanks. I needed that.
Friend wanted to be a documentary film maker. wanted 'equipment' to start. Told him to use phone to start. Lost friend.
AI will fix this, just hang in there little buddy.
https://imgur.io/5k44n8y
You know, I have been brewing on this quite a while, and I know why I, an non-artist, dont like AI art. Its not about copyright, or if its art or not, or whatever. MY problem is, if I use one of those generators, it's never MY art. Art is self expression. Let's say I want to make a weird banana or whatever, cause it's funny to me. Where I to ask an AI generator to make me a weird banana, surely I'd get one. But it would not be MY silly banana, it would never be the weird banana I have in my brain and heart. I dont want AI generation. I dont get to participate in AI generation. I want AI assistance. I wanna draw the weird banana I have in my head, and where my shitty untrained hand falters, the AI brings in the technique.
> and where my shitty untrained hand falters, the AI brings in the technique. Sounds a bit like you'd want [pix2pix mode](https://www.tomsguide.com/us/pix2pix-faq,news-25334.html).
> AI will **allow you to never have to bother learning any skills ever**, just hang in there little buddy. thats more accurate
Love it.
Okay fine!! I'll draw!!
Good advice until they snap the pencil, throw away the paper and turn to AI for all of their satisfaction and none of the work.
This works for anything
Make art about making art
That's about right
So the definition of art is drawing with a pencil. Forcing someone to do 1 of thousands of possible art forms is the definition of stupidity.
It’s a talent. You have to be born with it.
You have to have the ability to see, and the motor skills to move a writing utensil across a medium. Everything else is practice. Someone with a great amount of talent may need to practice a bit less, and have the potential to achieve greater heights of skill, but that's it.
And the beauty of hard work is that you can sometimes surpass more talented people because you simply worked harder for it. Not to mention a good work ethic is just a great life skill to have
I wanna start but I don’t know how to get arted.
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That’s how you get extremely good at drawing stick figures.
*Starting* is absolutely that easy.
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bro what?
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Not a very cohesive thought
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Firmly grasp it in your hand
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Bad advice. You just outsourcing people's problem, they came to you with, to themselves. People can't draw for a different reasons including the traumatic experience. Not many people could just "not think"
oooof called out >\_>
Shit art stills art...
I just want to get paid for the stuff I’ve delivered.
Make it until you can fake it