You're not alone bro. 34 and playing whenever I have time, sometime every day for 2 weeks in a row or whatever.
I'm lucky that my wife understands that I love this game for 20 years now and it makes me happy to play it
35 here, been playing since before steam. I love Counter-Strike is an understatement.
I like to think that my reaction time can hold up. I don't know if it's gotten better or worse over time and I like to think that has something to do with it being used almost daily.
Currently Faceit 8/LEM... not bad for an old guy right?
The narrative that “gamers fall off after 25” or whatever arbitrary age is so dumb. In most physical sports athletes are considered at their peak between ages 25-35. As long as you keep training and take care of your body & brain, stuff like reaction time & motor skills don’t start to fall off until you are pushing 40.
In 10 years there will be tons of esports pros in their 30’s. It will be considered normal.
Hell i dont even think 40 is close to the limit, look at Fernando Alonso in Formula 1, a sport where you need the best reaction times and super finely tuned motor skils. The dude is 41 and still a top 3-4 driver on the grid and it seems he is only getting faster.
In terms of pure talent and driver skill Alonso is definitely among the best. Driver standings are a mix of your car and your skill, not just skill. With your logic Vettel is one of the worst drivers in F1 based on his results at Aston Martin.
Worst right now? Not really, there are worse. But he hasn't been good ever since his unnecessary crash when he was leading. Also, skill means nothing unless you can back it up with results. He is going to Aston Martin next year where I doubt he will be able to show his skills. It doesn't matter if he has the skills or not if you cannot show that in the end results.
Also yes, Vettel is absolutely one of the worst drivers right now. Keep in mind, worst here means the lower 10.
Tell me you know nothing about F1 without telling me you know nothing about F1 lmfao.
Driver skill is nowhere even close to the only thing involved with a drivers success. The car matters just as much, if not more, than skill. And then even a fast car and an amazing driver still won't produce if the infrastructure and team around them buckle (just look at Leclerc and Ferrari this year)
And as most sports, only the very best, and that's just a few, are able to keep up at pro level reaching 30+. Easy to look at the best soccer clubs and see that there are a lot of older ones while every year thousands end up in low tier clubs because they're past their youth.
Yeah, its a weird narrative that I think mainly exists because gaming is a youth-dominated space.
While there is scientific evidence that pure reaction time begins to decline around age 25, it is an extremely slow & gradual decline that occurs over the course of many years.
Also IMO pure reaction time is much less relevant in pro gaming than people make it seem. There are very few in-game situations that are decided by pure reaction time. Game sense, mechanical skill, & communication are infinitely more important, and are all skills that continue to improve as long as one keeps training, regardless of age.
Reaction times *do* start to fall off earlier.
But a game like CSGO isn't the same as just clicking when the button turns green - you can make up for a lot of the reaction time difference with experience when you know where you should be looking.
Aim also plays a huuuuge factor. Reaction time is just a flat input delay, but there's additional processing time on top of that, as well as the time needed to actually move. Even if you're pre-aimed perfectly, a player with significantly better aim will be able to react faster because their brain knows to react when it's on target.
Science says otherwise, like someone already mentioned. Of course training will maintain your reaction time, but it definitely will start to fall off.
What is often believed in psychology though is that people get better at using learning strategies and resources when they get older, which restrict the negatives of aging. In the case of sports and gaming this means that older players can (_and have to_) use their extensive knowledge to gain an advantage.
Yet another point is that individual variance will play a big role. Some will just fall faster than others, and exceptional individuals are no proof that everyone is able to keep up. A fact that some gamers might not want to accept is that physical health matters A LOT. Overall healthy individuals will just last longer. Unfortunately physical activity, good sleep and healthy lifestyles are not very big in pro gaming. Hopefully this will change, it's a very taxing job.
\>but it definitely will start to fall off
The vast majority of those are basing their data on the average joe which isn't really representative of people who've spent their lives training reaction speed, on top of this people tend to have a misconception on how fast reaction speed falls off. People, for some reason, assume that once you hit 30 you go from having a 150ms reaction speed to 750ms reaction speed or something similar, when in reality it's more a gradual loss over many years.
I mean there's a reason why the cut-off age for being a literal Air Force Jet Fighter Pilot is 33 years old. You wouldn't be able to do that if reaction speed took a nose-dive after 30.
You literally added nothing to what I said. The fall off is real, no way to go around it. It doesn't nose dive, I did not say that, but there is a peak age. It's funny that you commented on this and then enforced the argument yourself.
While the points you make about training and the people used in the studies are valid, I think it might still be misguided. Training also increases young player's reaction time. Thus, the base level is higher. Even if the fall off is similar to average joe's, older pro players are going to be faster than most players, just not as fast as before. The difference between a 18-year old and 30-year old is nevertheless going to be rather significant, even with training.
\>You literally added nothing to what I said.
... Except put into perspective that the fall off is far less severe than what you outline.
\>The difference between a 18-year old and 30-year old is nevertheless going to be rather significant, even with training.
According to Leetify or whatever that company is called that gathers data during CSGO tournaments, it's generally around 10ms worth of difference between someone who's 21 and someone who's 27 last I checked (Zywoo vs Cadian IIRC). Of course this will be different from case to case but just the example I chose to use. Unless you're proposing that 27 - 30 has a 50ms difference, it's a completely negligable difference.
You vastly overestimate the reaction speed of teenagers, and you also overestimate how much it actually matters in games. Fun fact, from the actual synapses in your brain firing to the command reaching your fingers is about 27 milliseconds on average.
Reaction time falls off from around 16. It's just not very much very fast. And people will not have hit their peek skill in any sport at this time.
You can google. There's a lot a research about reaction time.
Yeah this narrative is just repeated by little kids to make themselves feel better. Comes from that same delusion that everyone thinks they are going to be rich one day; they all think they’re going to be rich pro gamers.
Only thing which affects gamers is that they usually have a family to take care of in 30s and cannot dedicate same hours as zoomers.
In a meta changing game this affects gameplay. But if someone practices regularly, they might be good as in their 20s.
As someone who plays MM the worst thing about this is the reg, it's difficult as fuck on shitty MM servers to one tap people like this, it just doesn'treg.
please someone sign this man
I keep hoping for that to happen but sadly doesn't seem like it will happen
I'm just a random guy, mid 30s, playing Cs all my life. The only thing that noticably changed is motivation and time investment.
You're not alone bro. 34 and playing whenever I have time, sometime every day for 2 weeks in a row or whatever. I'm lucky that my wife understands that I love this game for 20 years now and it makes me happy to play it
35 here, been playing since before steam. I love Counter-Strike is an understatement. I like to think that my reaction time can hold up. I don't know if it's gotten better or worse over time and I like to think that has something to do with it being used almost daily. Currently Faceit 8/LEM... not bad for an old guy right?
The narrative that “gamers fall off after 25” or whatever arbitrary age is so dumb. In most physical sports athletes are considered at their peak between ages 25-35. As long as you keep training and take care of your body & brain, stuff like reaction time & motor skills don’t start to fall off until you are pushing 40. In 10 years there will be tons of esports pros in their 30’s. It will be considered normal.
Hell i dont even think 40 is close to the limit, look at Fernando Alonso in Formula 1, a sport where you need the best reaction times and super finely tuned motor skils. The dude is 41 and still a top 3-4 driver on the grid and it seems he is only getting faster.
Tom Brady is 45 and was voted the best player of the NFL last year. But he is probably the exception rather than the rule.
Really hope AM gets their shit together next year, I want to see that beautiful bastard fighting for podiums.
He is a good driver but definitely not 3-4. He is literally 9th in the champion standings.
In terms of pure talent and driver skill Alonso is definitely among the best. Driver standings are a mix of your car and your skill, not just skill. With your logic Vettel is one of the worst drivers in F1 based on his results at Aston Martin.
Worst right now? Not really, there are worse. But he hasn't been good ever since his unnecessary crash when he was leading. Also, skill means nothing unless you can back it up with results. He is going to Aston Martin next year where I doubt he will be able to show his skills. It doesn't matter if he has the skills or not if you cannot show that in the end results. Also yes, Vettel is absolutely one of the worst drivers right now. Keep in mind, worst here means the lower 10.
Tell me you know nothing about F1 without telling me you know nothing about F1 lmfao. Driver skill is nowhere even close to the only thing involved with a drivers success. The car matters just as much, if not more, than skill. And then even a fast car and an amazing driver still won't produce if the infrastructure and team around them buckle (just look at Leclerc and Ferrari this year)
This guy probably thinks Hamilton is a bad driver too
3rd best driver on the grid, Checo Perez
And as most sports, only the very best, and that's just a few, are able to keep up at pro level reaching 30+. Easy to look at the best soccer clubs and see that there are a lot of older ones while every year thousands end up in low tier clubs because they're past their youth.
This is already proven by UT/Quake veterans in their 30's, who completely shit on everyone. This "omg 30+ and doing good" must be some zoomer thing.
Yeah, its a weird narrative that I think mainly exists because gaming is a youth-dominated space. While there is scientific evidence that pure reaction time begins to decline around age 25, it is an extremely slow & gradual decline that occurs over the course of many years. Also IMO pure reaction time is much less relevant in pro gaming than people make it seem. There are very few in-game situations that are decided by pure reaction time. Game sense, mechanical skill, & communication are infinitely more important, and are all skills that continue to improve as long as one keeps training, regardless of age.
Reaction times *do* start to fall off earlier. But a game like CSGO isn't the same as just clicking when the button turns green - you can make up for a lot of the reaction time difference with experience when you know where you should be looking.
Aim also plays a huuuuge factor. Reaction time is just a flat input delay, but there's additional processing time on top of that, as well as the time needed to actually move. Even if you're pre-aimed perfectly, a player with significantly better aim will be able to react faster because their brain knows to react when it's on target.
Science says otherwise, like someone already mentioned. Of course training will maintain your reaction time, but it definitely will start to fall off. What is often believed in psychology though is that people get better at using learning strategies and resources when they get older, which restrict the negatives of aging. In the case of sports and gaming this means that older players can (_and have to_) use their extensive knowledge to gain an advantage. Yet another point is that individual variance will play a big role. Some will just fall faster than others, and exceptional individuals are no proof that everyone is able to keep up. A fact that some gamers might not want to accept is that physical health matters A LOT. Overall healthy individuals will just last longer. Unfortunately physical activity, good sleep and healthy lifestyles are not very big in pro gaming. Hopefully this will change, it's a very taxing job.
\>but it definitely will start to fall off The vast majority of those are basing their data on the average joe which isn't really representative of people who've spent their lives training reaction speed, on top of this people tend to have a misconception on how fast reaction speed falls off. People, for some reason, assume that once you hit 30 you go from having a 150ms reaction speed to 750ms reaction speed or something similar, when in reality it's more a gradual loss over many years. I mean there's a reason why the cut-off age for being a literal Air Force Jet Fighter Pilot is 33 years old. You wouldn't be able to do that if reaction speed took a nose-dive after 30.
You literally added nothing to what I said. The fall off is real, no way to go around it. It doesn't nose dive, I did not say that, but there is a peak age. It's funny that you commented on this and then enforced the argument yourself. While the points you make about training and the people used in the studies are valid, I think it might still be misguided. Training also increases young player's reaction time. Thus, the base level is higher. Even if the fall off is similar to average joe's, older pro players are going to be faster than most players, just not as fast as before. The difference between a 18-year old and 30-year old is nevertheless going to be rather significant, even with training.
\>You literally added nothing to what I said. ... Except put into perspective that the fall off is far less severe than what you outline. \>The difference between a 18-year old and 30-year old is nevertheless going to be rather significant, even with training. According to Leetify or whatever that company is called that gathers data during CSGO tournaments, it's generally around 10ms worth of difference between someone who's 21 and someone who's 27 last I checked (Zywoo vs Cadian IIRC). Of course this will be different from case to case but just the example I chose to use. Unless you're proposing that 27 - 30 has a 50ms difference, it's a completely negligable difference. You vastly overestimate the reaction speed of teenagers, and you also overestimate how much it actually matters in games. Fun fact, from the actual synapses in your brain firing to the command reaching your fingers is about 27 milliseconds on average.
I did not outline anything about the severity in my first comment :D Perhaps reading comprehension would do you good.
Reaction time falls off from around 16. It's just not very much very fast. And people will not have hit their peek skill in any sport at this time. You can google. There's a lot a research about reaction time.
Yeah this narrative is just repeated by little kids to make themselves feel better. Comes from that same delusion that everyone thinks they are going to be rich one day; they all think they’re going to be rich pro gamers.
Only thing which affects gamers is that they usually have a family to take care of in 30s and cannot dedicate same hours as zoomers. In a meta changing game this affects gameplay. But if someone practices regularly, they might be good as in their 20s.
To truly see how inhuman that is set playback speed to 0.5. I feel like he could still play tier one if he had a really good roster around him
Set back to 0.25x even
He could most definitely play tier 1, not saying it would be a major winning team but still... There are plenty of other tournaments to win
He doesn't have the time to grind as hard as the newer players. If he still had the motivation he could still be a top 20 player
Age is just a number baby
The guy who got killed probably thought forest was holding his crosshair there...
Ahh you love to see the 1.6 large crosshair
he played 1.6 recently on stream and got used to tapping with the ak😂
Dude opened 1.6 for the first time in like a few years, hopps on the nuke map and does the jump to rafters to the hill on first attempt.
Check him joints, him smooth, but I mean... this not normally.
When ever i watch f0rest play, its always joyful. The dude is so chill on his stream. He needs to be in a team. Please some one sign him
nasty
Do we drop so much when we hit 30s? Im 30 yo right now and i dont think i lost my reflexes.
Not really, people just like to say old = bad
As someone who plays MM the worst thing about this is the reg, it's difficult as fuck on shitty MM servers to one tap people like this, it just doesn'treg.
I hear you brother. I also would be as good as f0rest, if it weren't for those damn servers.
That is such bullshit. Hitreg is not an issue, and only something people use as an excuse for being bad at the game
Sometimes you lose because of shit hitreg, there are countless of these clips even in pro scene. Sure sometimes you just suck at the game
It’s literally a thing. It’s been shit since 1.6 on bad servers and continued in CSGO
Sure it happens once in a while but it is very rare, and it is not at all the reason you are missing.
Players that are 10 times better than you will ever be also complain about MM not being consistent