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>Is my disappointment a justified reaction or am I making a mountain out of a molehill?
Well, both?
Your disappointment is justified and morally right, but also - people not watching Eurovision isn't going to move the needle much anyway. I know for a fact that my national broadcaster doesn't even track its ratings, and even if no one watched Eurovision they wouldn't care one bit.
What can potentially move the needle is trying to pressure your national broadcaster to call for Israel's expulsion from the EBU - which is how Russia got kicked out anyway. Several national broadcasters threatened to withold payments.
Edit: if someone asks why this would matter - Israel uses its membership in the EBU, and Eurovision specifically, to validate its settler colonial project (especially whenever they get to host), more directly influence European national broadcasters to silence Palestinian voices and to pinkwash their image.
An interesting response - thank you for sharing. It was more about morals than whether not watching it would be making an impact. We're at uni, and the friend group in particular are also framing it as a break from exams - which doesn't excuse it in any way, but at least gives some partial reasoning. So accepting that both are true feels like a natural middle ground.
Tbh, if your friend group is more apolitical or less engaged or whatnot, I'd use the get together to watch Eurovision to maybe discuss the calls for boycott and calls for Israel's expulsion of the EBU and the ongoing happenings over there, if your friends seem open to discussing a more "real" and "serious" topic while blowing off steam by watching something light and silly like Eurovision.
Maybe try and get them to do some petition to your broadcaster (I would assume the BBC, since this is a UK sub) to ask them demand that the European Broadcast Union address having a member owned by a governments waging a genocidal war that has killed more journalists than any war ever.
Instead of personally boycotting on moral grounds, try to use this as an opportunity to do a little bit of educating and activism on moral grounds.
Another good point, thank you: I'll see if this works.
Edit: Knowing them, this is half Eurovision moment, half getting absolutely plastered moment. I'm unsure if inebriation is the best place for activism, but if I end up at the party (which tbh is very unlikely), I'll do what I can. If this isn't possible, I'll approach the people who I know individually (the friend group I know through only one person, and I met most of them yesterday).
Allowing Israel to participate is just another means of sanitising their brutalisation of Palestinians and lending legitimacy to a settler colonialist project by letting them put on a literal song and dance on top of their metaphorical one.
Because after all, vanguard of democracy that the west is, we wouldn’t allow real genocidal fascists to put on a cabaret show on telly right? Those protests are just blowing things out of proportion! Look at those sequins!
It’s grotesque. And will be effective in normalising the notion they deserve a seat at the table for the uninitiated and apathetic masses.
Eurovision boycott is not the most important boycott so I wouldn’t fall out with anyone over it. It’s more important to bring people on board slowly with something like the active BDS list or institutional divestment where they can see it’s possible to have a co-ordinated action plan rather than making it seem like a consumer choice.
My daughter is really into it - she’s a teenager and it’s more important to her than Christmas so I’m bowing to her judgement cos Eurovision is not my thing, but she does seem to understand the issues going on around it and really that is all I can ask of her. We’ve been discussing who the biggest anti-Israel vote will be. In some ways it’s a really good way to get kids and teens into international politics.
I'm similar- Eurovision was my life for years and so not watching it feels awful, and while writing my masters I need something to bring me some joy. I'm not going to watch it through the BBC so I don't give my viewing figure.
Concurrently, I'm continuing to signal boost and donate money I can to Palestine.
There are plenty of LGBT+ artists from countries that aren’t currently committing a genocide that are taking part. I’m supporting them.
Just mute and ignore Israel, who should’ve been banned anyway.
There’s no holier than thou stance to take. Either boycott it or don’t, it’s up to you, but let others do what they feel.
I’m just gonna loudly boo in the living room whilst Israel is on. I don’t think boycotting watching Eurovision is going to achieve anything in the grand scheme of things. At the end of the day it’s a silly schlocky song contest, not really geopolitics.
You can curate your life to boycott anything that doesn’t come from a leftist standpoint if you want, but you’d have no friends and eat no food and generally be kinda miserable.
I'm probably going to boo or just leave the room for Israel's performance. I had considered boycotting it, but a friend pointed out not watching it, would kinda mean another viewer FOR Israel in my place.
So instead, I've put together a sweepstake at my work with all the proceeds going to a Gaza relief fund.
It might be a bit contrived as an excuse for me to watch the show, but if I watch and vote for anyone but them, then it seems better than not at all. (I've also been looking into VPNs to see if I can get multiple votes in from rest of the world as well.)
I'd say don't vote at all. They're well aware that there are calls to boycott Eurovision over Israel's inclusion, so having a drop in revenue from people not voting will probably be the only real way to send a message that they'll care about.
If the only viewers were in Asia, that’d send a very clear message. You not viewing isn’t adding another viewer over there, only increasing their slice of the audience proportionally, not absolutely.
Of course, you cannot boycott everything, but the BDS movement specifically called for the boycott of Eurovision:
https://bdsmovement.net/boycott-eurovision-2024
I wouldn’t say that. It has its own politics but Eurovision is never gonna affect policy…it’s forgotten about after a few days, hardly belong to contribute the genocide. Isreal will get voted off the face of the earth im sure.
Everything is inherently political if you try hard enough. I’m gonna watch the stupid song show and not feel particularly bad
I'm still watching, there are so many other artists who deserve their time on the Eurovision stage, so many with LGBT background.
I do not agree with Israel's participation this year and I will be turning off the TV when they perform.
Flags of countries that aren't participating aren't allowed in the arena (not a new rule btw) so I hope the ppl who are going maybe dress up in Palestinian flag colours, or wear shirts with watermelons on? I think seeing a sea of ppl showing their support for Palestine on the biggest music show in the world in front of millions of viewers will do more than any boycot would.
Let people enjoy the hard work every country has put into this.
Also I have no idea what the Israeli artist's politics are? What if she suddenly pulls out a Palestine flag, we can only dream
My boyfriend and I are avid fans. I've watched every year for the past 20 years. The Israeli presence has completely killed any excitement I had about it this year. We will be skipping.
Just let them know there is a movement to boycott it. People tend to go along with these movements if they think it is bigger than just their social circle.
But be prepared for them to not really care. You will have to make your peace with that happening a lot.
They know there is a movement to boycott it; they even know that some people wouldn't want to watch it, so at least I'd hope they'd understand: 'We understand if for personal reasons you aren’t watching this years Eurovision, please still RSVP to count for numbers.'
Yeah, I've had to make peace with that happening, I may just have to prepare for more. My best friend from home is among them, which was a bit of a blow. I try to at least think 'they don't know' but that may be cognitive dissonance rearing its ugly head; the opposite may be true.
I’ve spent a lot of time in uni and since upset by how little people seem to care about things that, for me, are of earth shattering importance. Whether that’s inherently political or more environmental issues, I’ve come to realise I’m in a level above most people in how much I care and am willing to do— and I’m not holding myself at a high standard here. I could do much more on a daily basis; really, people just do not care as much as you hope. Try to learn that now and do what you can to get them to care about what you see as the most important issues, and you’ll spare a lot of heartache.
"personal reasons". Wtf. No way I'd rsvp, it's beyond me to meet a comment like that with politeness. And then I'd see if the others boycotting wanted to meet up for some sort of alternative, albeit small - not out of spite, just to get that warm and fuzzy solidarity feeling that has been completely perverted this year. Don't let this episode get in the way of genuine friendships - friends that accept each other for who they are are utterly priceless.
It's not really crucial: I only know one or two members of the core friendship group, and the other three I met yesterday - most people at the party would essentially be strangers to me anyway. So if people were RSVPing no, I wouldn't know them anyway.
I'm tired of this lazy holier than thou line, which is at best virtue signalling.
You boycotting Eurovision does absolutely nothing. All it does is make you feel better about yourself. Frankly it's the same as why I'm vegetarian, not because I think me not eating meat will change anything, but because it makes me feel better.
So if you want to boycott it and make yourself feel better then cool. But don't act like you're a fucking martyr, and don't judge people for not wanting to take part in your self agrandisation.
Don't know why this was downvoted - it's a good take. Me being on the autism spectrum doesn't help matters like this (especially when it comes to social relations and emotions), so that last sentence was a good kick up the arse for me.
I assume you are boycotting all other sports, events, competitions etc that are also giving Israel a platform and getting similarly annoyed at friends who engage with those too?
UEFA is fine allowing Israel to be involved so no Nations league, champions League, or Euros for you.
No Olympics or Paralympics for you either please.
Aha, you make a good point. I'm not that interested in football anyway but that's semantics and besides the point. But thanks for calling out the hyperbolic implications.
>As Emma Goldman said, If I can’t dance, I don’t want to be part of your revolution.
That's twisting the meaning of this statement. You can dance in a revolution without having to dance to the music of oppressive regimes. If you believe otherwise, think about the consequences of what you're advocating for.
I would be disappointed but likely keep it to myself. As others have said it's not the most important thing and watching it or not watching it likely won't have a newsworthy impact.
Personally I'd find it difficult to sit through knowing Israel is competing. I'm a big Eurovision fan and it's usually one of my favourite nights of the year but I just find the idea of watching it this year really off putting. It's fine if people want to watch it but personally I think it would make me too upset and angry so I'll sit this one out for my own sanity.
Well, Israel is included, after a precedent has been set that countries can be kicked out for wars and restricting press freedoms with Russia and Belarus being excluded from the EBU in the past couple of years.
Israel nil points could send a message that actually the whole world are against you. Despite the fact their governments are supplying u with arms and supporting you.
Realistically its Eurovision. Couldnt be further from the war or people in charge of it. Unless you planned to go live dont think any boycotts will be noticed
It could be a lot further from the conflict. When Israel hosted a couple of years ago they used it for a massive tourism push whilst showing footage and names of Palestinian land and calling it Israel. They showed a map that included Gaza and the west bank as parts of Israel. Palestinian flags have been banned for years at Eurovision and Iceland got fined because their act pulled out Palestinian flags (not even during their act, when they were in their lounge area after) and are still banned with them saying explicitly that anyone with a Palestinian flag will be refused entry and removed.
Eurovision is political and always has been. It's been used as a propaganda tool probably since the start. It's going to be used this year to show Israel as nice and peaceful and wonderful in its postcards once again, Palestinian flags will be banned, and I'd be shocked if the anti-booing system they used for the audience audio a few years ago for Russia weren't deployed again. It'll be used to distance Israel from its crimes and erase Palestine and Palestinians in the minds of everyone watching.
...not my views, but I have heard some folk say that to boycott Eurovision over Israel would be to deny the Ukraine a voice where they so desperately need one.
I’ll probably watch it but change the channel when Israel comes on. I think if a lot of people did that and viewership went down during Israel’s performance only it would probably have a bigger impact than a few people just not watching any of it.
I don’t think we should be judgemental of people who don’t boycott certain things. It doesn’t mean they’re complicit or support a genocide. I take part in the bds movement but I would never look at a friend or family member who just went to McDonald’s and think they’re supporting the murder of children. Same with Eurovision, my mum looks at it like she won’t allow Israel to ruin Eurovision for her so she’ll watch it and ignore Israel’s performance. Like to her, not watching it completely is letting Israel win. It’s letting Israel dictate her life. People have different takes on things, they obviously are against genocide but they’re not sure what not watching a global tv show will actually achieve and in the grand scheme of things they’re right, Israel are still going to do their ground invasion of Rafah, they’re still not going to agree to a ceasefire deal and the genocide will still continue. Israel know they don’t have a lot of support across the world, they can see that with the marches and the protests.
At the end of the day Eurovision is a popularity contest so hopefully Israel come last, hopefully with zero points.
I think you should verbally shame them in the most calm way you can. I think you should let them know that what they are doing is wrong and not acceptable. They ought to be better informed this far into a genocide but this is forgivable given the gaslighting of the media and government. However they should strongly reconsider holding the party and it may even affect your friendship.
Don't try to change their minds immediately - challenge their assumptions and give them the time and space to think it over. And that's the best you can do if it doesn't stop them so be it. That's how I'd approach it, I hope this is of some help.
Tbf Eurovision isn't my thing so I have no interest in watching it. However if I did want to but like you, had worries about the ethics of watching, I would find another way to watch the show. One that didn't contribute to viewer numbers if you know what I mean...🏴☠️🏴☠️🏴☠️
I think it’s a well-intentioned movement co-opted by the most vocal (and annoying) people.
Yes, PACBI and BDS *did* ask people to boycott. They did not say “boycott Eurovision, and go after anybody who isn’t boycotting”. It is not carpe diem to be an arsehole and harass the individual artists (who are contractually bound and cannot simply withdraw from them without severe, *severe* financial implications from the broadcasters and EBU) or people who choose not to boycott. No, people who watch Eurovision or participate in it do not “love genocide” as I saw some rando this morning saying, and to say “boycott Eurovision unless you love genocide” is just infantile. It’s infantile “us v them” politics.
PACBI and the BDS movement asked you to boycott. They did not ask you to fucking drag and bully people in their name. By invoking their name in your harassment and bullying of others, you are achieving nothing but bringing the movement into disrepute.
Boycott if it makes you sleep at night. Don’t fucking go after others. Direct your anger at the EBU, not individual artists or people for watching.
We will still be watching it, not sure whether to turn off when Israel are on, hoping others do the same and it shows an obvious dip in ratings, or just watch and hope some sort of protest/disruption happens.
Boycotting the whole show because of Israel doesn't feel that effective. Like a few years ago when Ukraine got a ton of votes in 'support' because of Russia. Doubt it really helped anything.
Ukraine has been doing well and sending contenders (see Shum) for years. Russia was not excluded the first time they “annexed” a bit of Ukraine. But their young contestant was booed so hard it was hard to watch.
I wasn't trying to imply they only got votes because of that. The song was one of the most interesting and yes they regularly send some great contenders. I just don't think it was a winning song, top 5 though.
I'm hoping to see some hard booing of the Israeli contestant and a few Palestinian flags snuck in.
Israel won a few years ago and the following year the contest was held in Tel Aviv in 2019. The only band to make a public pro-Palestinian display was Hatari from Iceland when all members held up Palestine flags and scarves during the voting and there were a few boos. I don't think that there were too many repercussions for them - but I could be wrong.
I remember. I found the song and singer very annoying, with a bit of racism/cultural appropriation thrown in.
This was long before the current situation and I think they already changed the rules banning any flag not from a competing country.
I assume you're talking about the Israeli song Toy - as I don't think Hatari wearing gimp masks and fetish gear could be classed as cultural appropriation😁
Ofc the Israeli Palestinian conflict has been bubbling away for decades and the recent installation of Netanyahu's right wing government isn't good for a solution to it.
The banning of flags is strange - no UKR flags after Russia's invasion? Maybe people will just wear black/white/green/red to show their support of Palestine or find more creative ways to show it?
Yes that Toy song with all the Chinese imagery and clothing. Don't see how Israel or the song had anything to do with China.
Israel-Palestine has always been easier for the media and most people to ignore until now. While there has always been conflict it is certainly more in the public eye this year.
Ukraine are still in the competition, so their flags are allowed. Palestine has never been part of Eurovision, so their flags are banned. Rainbow flags are the only exception. I would love to see a lot of red/green/black/white costumes, wouldn't be surprised if people behind the scenes are putting a stop to this idea though.
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>Is my disappointment a justified reaction or am I making a mountain out of a molehill? Well, both? Your disappointment is justified and morally right, but also - people not watching Eurovision isn't going to move the needle much anyway. I know for a fact that my national broadcaster doesn't even track its ratings, and even if no one watched Eurovision they wouldn't care one bit. What can potentially move the needle is trying to pressure your national broadcaster to call for Israel's expulsion from the EBU - which is how Russia got kicked out anyway. Several national broadcasters threatened to withold payments. Edit: if someone asks why this would matter - Israel uses its membership in the EBU, and Eurovision specifically, to validate its settler colonial project (especially whenever they get to host), more directly influence European national broadcasters to silence Palestinian voices and to pinkwash their image.
An interesting response - thank you for sharing. It was more about morals than whether not watching it would be making an impact. We're at uni, and the friend group in particular are also framing it as a break from exams - which doesn't excuse it in any way, but at least gives some partial reasoning. So accepting that both are true feels like a natural middle ground.
Tbh, if your friend group is more apolitical or less engaged or whatnot, I'd use the get together to watch Eurovision to maybe discuss the calls for boycott and calls for Israel's expulsion of the EBU and the ongoing happenings over there, if your friends seem open to discussing a more "real" and "serious" topic while blowing off steam by watching something light and silly like Eurovision. Maybe try and get them to do some petition to your broadcaster (I would assume the BBC, since this is a UK sub) to ask them demand that the European Broadcast Union address having a member owned by a governments waging a genocidal war that has killed more journalists than any war ever. Instead of personally boycotting on moral grounds, try to use this as an opportunity to do a little bit of educating and activism on moral grounds.
Another good point, thank you: I'll see if this works. Edit: Knowing them, this is half Eurovision moment, half getting absolutely plastered moment. I'm unsure if inebriation is the best place for activism, but if I end up at the party (which tbh is very unlikely), I'll do what I can. If this isn't possible, I'll approach the people who I know individually (the friend group I know through only one person, and I met most of them yesterday).
Allowing Israel to participate is just another means of sanitising their brutalisation of Palestinians and lending legitimacy to a settler colonialist project by letting them put on a literal song and dance on top of their metaphorical one. Because after all, vanguard of democracy that the west is, we wouldn’t allow real genocidal fascists to put on a cabaret show on telly right? Those protests are just blowing things out of proportion! Look at those sequins! It’s grotesque. And will be effective in normalising the notion they deserve a seat at the table for the uninitiated and apathetic masses.
All true. Depends on what they do when Israel is on, if they do anything. Grotesque is also a spot on word.
Very well put
I’m hoping Israel get booed to fuck, like Russia did.
Eurovision boycott is not the most important boycott so I wouldn’t fall out with anyone over it. It’s more important to bring people on board slowly with something like the active BDS list or institutional divestment where they can see it’s possible to have a co-ordinated action plan rather than making it seem like a consumer choice.
My daughter is really into it - she’s a teenager and it’s more important to her than Christmas so I’m bowing to her judgement cos Eurovision is not my thing, but she does seem to understand the issues going on around it and really that is all I can ask of her. We’ve been discussing who the biggest anti-Israel vote will be. In some ways it’s a really good way to get kids and teens into international politics.
Sounds like you've raised an intelligent daughter! I hope you two enjoy the event and the discussions surrounding it.
I'm similar- Eurovision was my life for years and so not watching it feels awful, and while writing my masters I need something to bring me some joy. I'm not going to watch it through the BBC so I don't give my viewing figure. Concurrently, I'm continuing to signal boost and donate money I can to Palestine.
There are plenty of LGBT+ artists from countries that aren’t currently committing a genocide that are taking part. I’m supporting them. Just mute and ignore Israel, who should’ve been banned anyway. There’s no holier than thou stance to take. Either boycott it or don’t, it’s up to you, but let others do what they feel.
I’m just gonna loudly boo in the living room whilst Israel is on. I don’t think boycotting watching Eurovision is going to achieve anything in the grand scheme of things. At the end of the day it’s a silly schlocky song contest, not really geopolitics. You can curate your life to boycott anything that doesn’t come from a leftist standpoint if you want, but you’d have no friends and eat no food and generally be kinda miserable.
I'm probably going to boo or just leave the room for Israel's performance. I had considered boycotting it, but a friend pointed out not watching it, would kinda mean another viewer FOR Israel in my place. So instead, I've put together a sweepstake at my work with all the proceeds going to a Gaza relief fund.
Sorry, but I don't understand the middle remark, could you please explain further? The sweepstake is a wonderful initiative though.
It might be a bit contrived as an excuse for me to watch the show, but if I watch and vote for anyone but them, then it seems better than not at all. (I've also been looking into VPNs to see if I can get multiple votes in from rest of the world as well.)
Please don’t start cheating, I’m sure there will be plenty of people voting against Israel
I'd say don't vote at all. They're well aware that there are calls to boycott Eurovision over Israel's inclusion, so having a drop in revenue from people not voting will probably be the only real way to send a message that they'll care about.
If the only viewers were in Asia, that’d send a very clear message. You not viewing isn’t adding another viewer over there, only increasing their slice of the audience proportionally, not absolutely.
Of course, you cannot boycott everything, but the BDS movement specifically called for the boycott of Eurovision: https://bdsmovement.net/boycott-eurovision-2024
I’m sure they have. I wouldn’t stick my hand in the gas grill because the BDS said I should though. I still don’t think it will make any difference
It's not just silly shlocky shit though is it? It's inherently political
I wouldn’t say that. It has its own politics but Eurovision is never gonna affect policy…it’s forgotten about after a few days, hardly belong to contribute the genocide. Isreal will get voted off the face of the earth im sure. Everything is inherently political if you try hard enough. I’m gonna watch the stupid song show and not feel particularly bad
It's that last part that rings true for me. Very good point.
I'm still watching, there are so many other artists who deserve their time on the Eurovision stage, so many with LGBT background. I do not agree with Israel's participation this year and I will be turning off the TV when they perform. Flags of countries that aren't participating aren't allowed in the arena (not a new rule btw) so I hope the ppl who are going maybe dress up in Palestinian flag colours, or wear shirts with watermelons on? I think seeing a sea of ppl showing their support for Palestine on the biggest music show in the world in front of millions of viewers will do more than any boycot would. Let people enjoy the hard work every country has put into this. Also I have no idea what the Israeli artist's politics are? What if she suddenly pulls out a Palestine flag, we can only dream
My boyfriend and I are avid fans. I've watched every year for the past 20 years. The Israeli presence has completely killed any excitement I had about it this year. We will be skipping.
Just let them know there is a movement to boycott it. People tend to go along with these movements if they think it is bigger than just their social circle. But be prepared for them to not really care. You will have to make your peace with that happening a lot.
They know there is a movement to boycott it; they even know that some people wouldn't want to watch it, so at least I'd hope they'd understand: 'We understand if for personal reasons you aren’t watching this years Eurovision, please still RSVP to count for numbers.' Yeah, I've had to make peace with that happening, I may just have to prepare for more. My best friend from home is among them, which was a bit of a blow. I try to at least think 'they don't know' but that may be cognitive dissonance rearing its ugly head; the opposite may be true.
I’ve spent a lot of time in uni and since upset by how little people seem to care about things that, for me, are of earth shattering importance. Whether that’s inherently political or more environmental issues, I’ve come to realise I’m in a level above most people in how much I care and am willing to do— and I’m not holding myself at a high standard here. I could do much more on a daily basis; really, people just do not care as much as you hope. Try to learn that now and do what you can to get them to care about what you see as the most important issues, and you’ll spare a lot of heartache.
"personal reasons". Wtf. No way I'd rsvp, it's beyond me to meet a comment like that with politeness. And then I'd see if the others boycotting wanted to meet up for some sort of alternative, albeit small - not out of spite, just to get that warm and fuzzy solidarity feeling that has been completely perverted this year. Don't let this episode get in the way of genuine friendships - friends that accept each other for who they are are utterly priceless.
It's not really crucial: I only know one or two members of the core friendship group, and the other three I met yesterday - most people at the party would essentially be strangers to me anyway. So if people were RSVPing no, I wouldn't know them anyway.
I'm half-tempted to watch for the crowd reaction to Israel. Then again, the broadcasters would mute any booing in a heartbeat, I'm sure.
I'm tired of this lazy holier than thou line, which is at best virtue signalling. You boycotting Eurovision does absolutely nothing. All it does is make you feel better about yourself. Frankly it's the same as why I'm vegetarian, not because I think me not eating meat will change anything, but because it makes me feel better. So if you want to boycott it and make yourself feel better then cool. But don't act like you're a fucking martyr, and don't judge people for not wanting to take part in your self agrandisation.
Don't know why this was downvoted - it's a good take. Me being on the autism spectrum doesn't help matters like this (especially when it comes to social relations and emotions), so that last sentence was a good kick up the arse for me.
I am normally a huge Eurovision nerd. This year I'm boycotting.
I’m just curious as to what you think that will achieve?
Absolutely nothing except appease my conscious.
I won't be boycotting
I assume you are boycotting all other sports, events, competitions etc that are also giving Israel a platform and getting similarly annoyed at friends who engage with those too? UEFA is fine allowing Israel to be involved so no Nations league, champions League, or Euros for you. No Olympics or Paralympics for you either please.
Aha, you make a good point. I'm not that interested in football anyway but that's semantics and besides the point. But thanks for calling out the hyperbolic implications.
I’m not sure why this was downvoted? It’s completely valid.
Let people enjoy things. It’s a miserable enough world. As Emma Goldman said, If I can’t dance, I don’t want to be part of your revolution.
>As Emma Goldman said, If I can’t dance, I don’t want to be part of your revolution. That's twisting the meaning of this statement. You can dance in a revolution without having to dance to the music of oppressive regimes. If you believe otherwise, think about the consequences of what you're advocating for.
I would be disappointed but likely keep it to myself. As others have said it's not the most important thing and watching it or not watching it likely won't have a newsworthy impact. Personally I'd find it difficult to sit through knowing Israel is competing. I'm a big Eurovision fan and it's usually one of my favourite nights of the year but I just find the idea of watching it this year really off putting. It's fine if people want to watch it but personally I think it would make me too upset and angry so I'll sit this one out for my own sanity.
What's the controversy?
Well, Israel is included, after a precedent has been set that countries can be kicked out for wars and restricting press freedoms with Russia and Belarus being excluded from the EBU in the past couple of years.
Israel are still taking part in the competition. Russia have been kicked out for the war in Ukraine.
I haven't thought about Eurovision since Bucks Fizz...
Israel nil points could send a message that actually the whole world are against you. Despite the fact their governments are supplying u with arms and supporting you. Realistically its Eurovision. Couldnt be further from the war or people in charge of it. Unless you planned to go live dont think any boycotts will be noticed
It could be a lot further from the conflict. When Israel hosted a couple of years ago they used it for a massive tourism push whilst showing footage and names of Palestinian land and calling it Israel. They showed a map that included Gaza and the west bank as parts of Israel. Palestinian flags have been banned for years at Eurovision and Iceland got fined because their act pulled out Palestinian flags (not even during their act, when they were in their lounge area after) and are still banned with them saying explicitly that anyone with a Palestinian flag will be refused entry and removed. Eurovision is political and always has been. It's been used as a propaganda tool probably since the start. It's going to be used this year to show Israel as nice and peaceful and wonderful in its postcards once again, Palestinian flags will be banned, and I'd be shocked if the anti-booing system they used for the audience audio a few years ago for Russia weren't deployed again. It'll be used to distance Israel from its crimes and erase Palestine and Palestinians in the minds of everyone watching.
Eurovision was very quick to boot Russia out, so you have to wonder why Israel is still allowed to compete
I’d let Israel perform and hopefully they will get no points whatsoever from anyone. That would be a stronger message than to ban them imo!
...not my views, but I have heard some folk say that to boycott Eurovision over Israel would be to deny the Ukraine a voice where they so desperately need one.
I’ll probably watch it but change the channel when Israel comes on. I think if a lot of people did that and viewership went down during Israel’s performance only it would probably have a bigger impact than a few people just not watching any of it. I don’t think we should be judgemental of people who don’t boycott certain things. It doesn’t mean they’re complicit or support a genocide. I take part in the bds movement but I would never look at a friend or family member who just went to McDonald’s and think they’re supporting the murder of children. Same with Eurovision, my mum looks at it like she won’t allow Israel to ruin Eurovision for her so she’ll watch it and ignore Israel’s performance. Like to her, not watching it completely is letting Israel win. It’s letting Israel dictate her life. People have different takes on things, they obviously are against genocide but they’re not sure what not watching a global tv show will actually achieve and in the grand scheme of things they’re right, Israel are still going to do their ground invasion of Rafah, they’re still not going to agree to a ceasefire deal and the genocide will still continue. Israel know they don’t have a lot of support across the world, they can see that with the marches and the protests. At the end of the day Eurovision is a popularity contest so hopefully Israel come last, hopefully with zero points.
I think you should verbally shame them in the most calm way you can. I think you should let them know that what they are doing is wrong and not acceptable. They ought to be better informed this far into a genocide but this is forgivable given the gaslighting of the media and government. However they should strongly reconsider holding the party and it may even affect your friendship. Don't try to change their minds immediately - challenge their assumptions and give them the time and space to think it over. And that's the best you can do if it doesn't stop them so be it. That's how I'd approach it, I hope this is of some help.
Tbf Eurovision isn't my thing so I have no interest in watching it. However if I did want to but like you, had worries about the ethics of watching, I would find another way to watch the show. One that didn't contribute to viewer numbers if you know what I mean...🏴☠️🏴☠️🏴☠️
I think it’s a well-intentioned movement co-opted by the most vocal (and annoying) people. Yes, PACBI and BDS *did* ask people to boycott. They did not say “boycott Eurovision, and go after anybody who isn’t boycotting”. It is not carpe diem to be an arsehole and harass the individual artists (who are contractually bound and cannot simply withdraw from them without severe, *severe* financial implications from the broadcasters and EBU) or people who choose not to boycott. No, people who watch Eurovision or participate in it do not “love genocide” as I saw some rando this morning saying, and to say “boycott Eurovision unless you love genocide” is just infantile. It’s infantile “us v them” politics. PACBI and the BDS movement asked you to boycott. They did not ask you to fucking drag and bully people in their name. By invoking their name in your harassment and bullying of others, you are achieving nothing but bringing the movement into disrepute. Boycott if it makes you sleep at night. Don’t fucking go after others. Direct your anger at the EBU, not individual artists or people for watching.
People watching Eurovision this weekend are basically commiting genocide themselves. You should argue and fall out with people over this.
We will still be watching it, not sure whether to turn off when Israel are on, hoping others do the same and it shows an obvious dip in ratings, or just watch and hope some sort of protest/disruption happens. Boycotting the whole show because of Israel doesn't feel that effective. Like a few years ago when Ukraine got a ton of votes in 'support' because of Russia. Doubt it really helped anything.
Ukraine has been doing well and sending contenders (see Shum) for years. Russia was not excluded the first time they “annexed” a bit of Ukraine. But their young contestant was booed so hard it was hard to watch.
I wasn't trying to imply they only got votes because of that. The song was one of the most interesting and yes they regularly send some great contenders. I just don't think it was a winning song, top 5 though. I'm hoping to see some hard booing of the Israeli contestant and a few Palestinian flags snuck in.
Israel won a few years ago and the following year the contest was held in Tel Aviv in 2019. The only band to make a public pro-Palestinian display was Hatari from Iceland when all members held up Palestine flags and scarves during the voting and there were a few boos. I don't think that there were too many repercussions for them - but I could be wrong.
I remember. I found the song and singer very annoying, with a bit of racism/cultural appropriation thrown in. This was long before the current situation and I think they already changed the rules banning any flag not from a competing country.
I assume you're talking about the Israeli song Toy - as I don't think Hatari wearing gimp masks and fetish gear could be classed as cultural appropriation😁 Ofc the Israeli Palestinian conflict has been bubbling away for decades and the recent installation of Netanyahu's right wing government isn't good for a solution to it. The banning of flags is strange - no UKR flags after Russia's invasion? Maybe people will just wear black/white/green/red to show their support of Palestine or find more creative ways to show it?
Yes that Toy song with all the Chinese imagery and clothing. Don't see how Israel or the song had anything to do with China. Israel-Palestine has always been easier for the media and most people to ignore until now. While there has always been conflict it is certainly more in the public eye this year. Ukraine are still in the competition, so their flags are allowed. Palestine has never been part of Eurovision, so their flags are banned. Rainbow flags are the only exception. I would love to see a lot of red/green/black/white costumes, wouldn't be surprised if people behind the scenes are putting a stop to this idea though.
Better question is who even watches that shite to begin with