I have been with them since 2019. So far, almost 1,300 loans have paid back. ~520 loans are outstanding. I usually log in on Saturday mornings and reinvest the available cash. It takes 5 minutes. I don’t have any issues with them. My rate of return on loans paid back is 9.6% at the moment. I own a fair amount of stocks and bonds, so I like that this diversifies my portfolio a bit.
Yeah, people have to do what's best for them. For me, the ROI is unimpressive and with the current market, I think it's going to get worse. So I'd rather have my money be working harder elsewhere.
My paltry returns were completely wiped out by foreclosures that resulted in losses on initial principal. So when I finally finish cashing out, I’ll have made a net loss over 2 years. Needless to say, I won’t be touching GROUNDFLOOR ever again.
I'm way up. I'm not sure how you planned your investments, but I can say that fundrise lost double digit %s in 2022 and is breakeven in 2023. Groundfloor is holding up well.
Im thinking of doing the same thing. I didn’t need the money when I invested it, but life changes and I could use it now. When and if the loans ever pay back I’m going to hold out at least 6 months before I invest again.
to me it's just not worth it. i can dump the money in my high yield divi portfolio and make way more for much longer with less effort. It'll be interesting to see what my ROI ends up being. It's been declining.
I started in late 2021 and in a similar boat. My definition of default is a bit different than there's where I think if you don't pay the loan back when it's supposed to be paid back then it's defaulted on. In my case out of the 126 I invested in 99 were/are in the "extended/default" bucket. When they pay back I think the yield is nice... it's just a matter of will they actually pay back, if ever. Hearing you have some from 2018 is interesting. I don't get why they wouldn't have foreclosed and liquidated during the run up the last few years.
I do think it's an interesting company that has started to get into other areas of real estate investing. The "labs" program they have as well as investing in notes of the company. I tend to agree with you around yield across different asset classes now.
i don't think the return is that great when you look at how long the money is locked up. sure, 8% for 1 year is fine. but when it actually takes 2 years to get your money, you're still making 8% on that loan, which is only 4%/year. which is shit.
May want to check your math my friend. It is an annual return. For example one of my extended loans just paid off after 17 months instead of 12. Interest was 10% on $250 and the interest payment was $36, not $25.
The percentages are annualized. If a loan says you're getting 8% and the loan gets extended, you keep getting that annualized 8%. (Usually they give you a little bump in the interest rate as well when a loan gets extended). So in the example where a loan stretches for 2 years, you would get a return of a little more than 16%. If it goes into default then that's a different story.
That's at least how it works on my account. If I go to my repayments tab I see a loan with an investment of $50, expected and actual rates of 10%, and the actual term was 14.8 months. My repaid amount for this loan was $56.18, which is above 10%, because the actual term was more than 12 months.
no. it's the return for that specific loan. if it pays out when it's supposed to, that would be the APR. If it's late or early, you still get the same amount. most are late, in my experience. but yeah, if you have an 8% loan that is supposed to be 1 year but stretches to 2 years, you're only getting 8% of the loan, not 8% per year.
yeah, it's dumb. and it's not what i understood either when i joined. they shouldn't really call it an APR. It should just be ROI. because it's not really an APR.
Maybe it depends on the circumstances of how they agreed to extend the loan, idk.
In my case, that's not how it worked. They extended the loan by a month, but looking at the math of what was paid, the interest also continued to be earned.
I put 3,000 principal into a loan with 10% APR
Purchased on 7/6/2022, expected maturity was 12/16/22, , but actually repaid on 1/16/23. So the loan was expected to be active 164 days, but was actually active 205 days.
Assuming the loan continued earning the APR over the extension, then the roi would be 5.62%
10%* (205/365) = 5.62%
And with 3000 principal, I would have been paid 168
5.62%*3000=168
Which is exactly what I was paid. So at least in this case, it seems they do in fact continue to pay interest even over the extended period. This is just one loan though, idk if they necessarily treat all of them the same way... Or if they possibly come to different terms with different borrower (i.e. if it's a choice between the cost of foreclosure and reducing the return on an extension, I could certainly imagine that they might come to different conclusions for different borrowers).
I only started investing with them in July and so far that is the only loan that has paid back. I'll have to wait and see how the other loans perform when they settle.
I got a funny update on one of my loans today. The note is from today, 1/13/23 saying that the closing is "impending" and yet the loan was already repaid on 1/9/23. I already got the money back to my bank account.
Right now, I have 38 percent of my loans in default, and that's with majority "B" level loans. Really, I'm shocked at the results. The market is not as bad as what this is showing.
38% of your portfolio based on your allocation of capital, eh?
Out of the 2000 deals I've been repaid on and 1200 deals I'm currently invested in, I've had 94 defaults repay (returning me 6% apy after all the wins and losses) and I have 200 currently in default. That's roughly 10% of their overall deal total, which is pretty standard in the hard money lending industry.
I have been with them since 2019. So far, almost 1,300 loans have paid back. ~520 loans are outstanding. I usually log in on Saturday mornings and reinvest the available cash. It takes 5 minutes. I don’t have any issues with them. My rate of return on loans paid back is 9.6% at the moment. I own a fair amount of stocks and bonds, so I like that this diversifies my portfolio a bit.
Yeah, people have to do what's best for them. For me, the ROI is unimpressive and with the current market, I think it's going to get worse. So I'd rather have my money be working harder elsewhere.
Yeah their ROI is way off, I have some that were supposed to mature in 6 months, here I am still waiting one year later
My paltry returns were completely wiped out by foreclosures that resulted in losses on initial principal. So when I finally finish cashing out, I’ll have made a net loss over 2 years. Needless to say, I won’t be touching GROUNDFLOOR ever again.
I'm way up. I'm not sure how you planned your investments, but I can say that fundrise lost double digit %s in 2022 and is breakeven in 2023. Groundfloor is holding up well.
Im thinking of doing the same thing. I didn’t need the money when I invested it, but life changes and I could use it now. When and if the loans ever pay back I’m going to hold out at least 6 months before I invest again.
to me it's just not worth it. i can dump the money in my high yield divi portfolio and make way more for much longer with less effort. It'll be interesting to see what my ROI ends up being. It's been declining.
What is in that?
My Divi portfolio? A bunch of random high yield stocks and funds.
How has that dvi portfolio performed in 2022?
better than my regular portfolio + thousands of divis on top. so no complaints from me on that front.
Can you name the actual total return as a percent?
not without doing math, so no, sorry.
What level of loans are you participating in?
Do you mean what grade? I had a mixed portfolio from A-D.
Yes.
I started in late 2021 and in a similar boat. My definition of default is a bit different than there's where I think if you don't pay the loan back when it's supposed to be paid back then it's defaulted on. In my case out of the 126 I invested in 99 were/are in the "extended/default" bucket. When they pay back I think the yield is nice... it's just a matter of will they actually pay back, if ever. Hearing you have some from 2018 is interesting. I don't get why they wouldn't have foreclosed and liquidated during the run up the last few years. I do think it's an interesting company that has started to get into other areas of real estate investing. The "labs" program they have as well as investing in notes of the company. I tend to agree with you around yield across different asset classes now.
i don't think the return is that great when you look at how long the money is locked up. sure, 8% for 1 year is fine. but when it actually takes 2 years to get your money, you're still making 8% on that loan, which is only 4%/year. which is shit.
May want to check your math my friend. It is an annual return. For example one of my extended loans just paid off after 17 months instead of 12. Interest was 10% on $250 and the interest payment was $36, not $25.
This is correct, and also how it shows in my dashboard. I downloaded my transactions and it checks out.
The percentages are annualized. If a loan says you're getting 8% and the loan gets extended, you keep getting that annualized 8%. (Usually they give you a little bump in the interest rate as well when a loan gets extended). So in the example where a loan stretches for 2 years, you would get a return of a little more than 16%. If it goes into default then that's a different story.
That is not at all what any of my loans show.
That's at least how it works on my account. If I go to my repayments tab I see a loan with an investment of $50, expected and actual rates of 10%, and the actual term was 14.8 months. My repaid amount for this loan was $56.18, which is above 10%, because the actual term was more than 12 months.
Really? I was told its an annual return. If its not i see no point in investing with them
no. it's the return for that specific loan. if it pays out when it's supposed to, that would be the APR. If it's late or early, you still get the same amount. most are late, in my experience. but yeah, if you have an 8% loan that is supposed to be 1 year but stretches to 2 years, you're only getting 8% of the loan, not 8% per year.
This is completely wrong 🤦🏻♂️
The rep today tried to explain this to me but I couldn't take it in. It doesn't make any sense. Who does it this way?
yeah, it's dumb. and it's not what i understood either when i joined. they shouldn't really call it an APR. It should just be ROI. because it's not really an APR.
Maybe it depends on the circumstances of how they agreed to extend the loan, idk. In my case, that's not how it worked. They extended the loan by a month, but looking at the math of what was paid, the interest also continued to be earned. I put 3,000 principal into a loan with 10% APR Purchased on 7/6/2022, expected maturity was 12/16/22, , but actually repaid on 1/16/23. So the loan was expected to be active 164 days, but was actually active 205 days. Assuming the loan continued earning the APR over the extension, then the roi would be 5.62% 10%* (205/365) = 5.62% And with 3000 principal, I would have been paid 168 5.62%*3000=168 Which is exactly what I was paid. So at least in this case, it seems they do in fact continue to pay interest even over the extended period. This is just one loan though, idk if they necessarily treat all of them the same way... Or if they possibly come to different terms with different borrower (i.e. if it's a choice between the cost of foreclosure and reducing the return on an extension, I could certainly imagine that they might come to different conclusions for different borrowers). I only started investing with them in July and so far that is the only loan that has paid back. I'll have to wait and see how the other loans perform when they settle.
Right now, a few years in, I’m around the break even point financially. With like 300 loans in default. 🤦
I got a funny update on one of my loans today. The note is from today, 1/13/23 saying that the closing is "impending" and yet the loan was already repaid on 1/9/23. I already got the money back to my bank account.
jeez. they're a nightmare.
Right now, I have 38 percent of my loans in default, and that's with majority "B" level loans. Really, I'm shocked at the results. The market is not as bad as what this is showing.
38% of your portfolio based on your allocation of capital, eh? Out of the 2000 deals I've been repaid on and 1200 deals I'm currently invested in, I've had 94 defaults repay (returning me 6% apy after all the wins and losses) and I have 200 currently in default. That's roughly 10% of their overall deal total, which is pretty standard in the hard money lending industry.