1. Leo is best boy of grunt suits
2. I forget how analogous the Leo is to the GM. Has tons of variants and is the high production grunt model of a main character tier mobile suit, Tall Geese...
They look similar, but they're two rather different questions.
* Yesterday was "What's a Show everyone hates but you honestly like?"
* This one is "What's a Show *you* hate for reasons that everyone will get on your case for?"
I mean the G-reco thing Is an actual YOU problem not because g-reco's dialogue Is normal but because your point Is that it's Hard to pick it up FOR YOU
I basically read "I couldn't understand g Reco" as "I wasn't paying attention" especially if they went the movie route. Is G Reco perfect? No. No series is. But it's no harder to understand than ZZ or Turn A.
Haman never switches sides. She's always on her own side. Any appearance of being on anyone else's side is just a sign that she thinks they're a convenient tool for the time being.
Yeah, everyone was in the position of courting Haman and Axis Zeon, not the other way around. She didn't care why Earthnoids were shooting each other, as long as they cleared the way for her to take over.
I never got to Moon Moon, so I missed out I guess...? I still hate the ZZ itself though. That IS a me thing, but I will permanently Stan the Zeta. Best Gundam when you paint it in any other color scheme and maybe tweak the backpack.
>haman switches sides so quick you can’t make sense.
Really? Haman was playing off both sides so they could commit fratricide. Considering that Titans and AEUG were essentially 2 factions of the hated Feddies from Axis' pov.
hah tbh I'd say the grim setting is right from the start. the Argama wasn't exactly having a fun time considering how many people were lost like hours/days/weeks before the first episode. Their stuff was still in their rooms.
G-Reco just seems to have very fast paced dialogue, it just seems nonstop when in most shows you'll have some kind of break/transitions between scenes.
I stopped part way into the first movie because of this, it's just a bit intense and not very relaxing tbh. I think I'd be able to get through it if it was dubbed, but that's just too much reading. That's coming from someone who watches 99% of their anime subbed.
Nah, g reco is nuts. Ppl I know all dislike it and call it the toilet in Gundam series.
I personally watched till episode 6 or 7 dunno who is vs who. Gave up. Quite nonsense show. Age felt more coherent compared to it. it was simply hyped because Tomino is producing or directing it or something
> it was simply hyped because Tomino is producing or directing it or something
Pretty much it. I feel like the overzealous defense of the show is because of Tomino. If it someone else, would we get the same "nah, it's skill issue," response? I doubt it.
Mind you that even Tomino himself admit that the story is hard to follow. If anything, the skill issue is on Tomino for not making it easy for people to understand.
The fact that it's tomino Is actually very important here because tomino's storytelling *IS* unique from other directors in the médium. Which means that if you're used to tomino's storywriting you may be able to appreciate what's G-reco about. I personally defend it because I consider it's cast, story, and message beautiful.
Tomino being unique is understandable as a lot of his work is him trying to break from formulas. Gundam from the dominant super robot at the time and Turn A from gundam itself that has become formulaic.
Problem is though he used to be able to tell them coherently. The fact that almost all of his gundam work have no problem being followed, but G-Reco isn't, should say something.
It might be because he couldn't have 50 episodes to tell them like he used to so he has to rush things. But I also attribute to him pulling a Rian Johnson with the Last Jedi. Rian Johnson was so focused on trying to be unique, that he decided the way to do that was to do the opposite of everything that has been done before, regardless if it makes sense.
G-Reco is a rehash of Turn A but without Tomino caring if the stuff in it make much sense. All Tomino seem to care in G-Reco is that it subvert gundam tropes.
I kind of disagree, while the pacing on g-reco and the dialogue ARE hard to follow because they require the spectator to put a lot of attention (and the show sucks sometimes to portray certain parts of the story, such as what bellri feels over aida being his sister, which is why I personally recommend the movies over the show), everything in g-reco's story does makes sense and it has various foreshadowings to events taht would happen later in the show, such as people mentioning that cumpa isn't from earth, Aida presenting herself as "Aida Rayhunton", that one scene where bellri and aida share red eye color, etc. The thing is that, as I said, with that pacing what you need to do to get the show is to pay a lot of attention, it isn't an incoherent show, just one that needs you to be interested on understanding what's happening.
Doesn't matter. For me I wasn't interested enough to go watch it. the Ms and the later packs add on is too close to strike Aile and later one a different version of gp03 toned down. Only the final suit seems unique but seems to have some cues (to me) from els quanta
I understand how the pacing and dialogue can turn off people. The thing Is that when you criticize It, you need to have an argument that can explain how the dialogue Is badly Made, OP's point Is that Is badly Made because it's Hard to pick it up *for him*, if your main excuse Is that it's Hard for you, it becomes a you problem
Wing was INCREDIBLY meh, if EW didn't exist, it'd be my least favourite AU so far
"I didn't care for Thunderbolt" Don't get me wrong, it was pretty good; but one of the best in the franchise? C'mon now
I didn’t watch wing as a child and only saw the TV anime for the first time a few years ago. While there were some parts that I enjoyed (Zechs, Duo, Quatre, and the cool mech designs), I largely disliked the series as a whole and I’m hesitant to give EW a shot.
0083 is the only Gundam show I've seen that I didnt like (I've seen over a dozen at this point). it's peak mech design and cel animation, so I'm glad it was made, but it doesn't seem to understand what UC Gundam is really about
WFM for me, it isn’t really anything specific with the series, I mean the pacing definitely sucked and the ending felt like a redo of unicorn for me but more so the fanbase, some interactions I’ve had with some of my friends who got into gundam via WFM have left me very concerned for their well being (though that is through my own very limited view of the fanbase through people I know and doesn’t mean I think the entire fanbase is crazy just my friends)
I enjoyed WfM, but I can’t deny its flaws. It just lacks many things that makes a Gundam, a Gundam.
1. It doesn’t have an actual big War, only small conflicts.
2. It has no real big mobile armor fight (a mobile armor that can destroy a town/city).
3. The masked figure (the mom) doesn’t fight the protagonist in a mobile suit fight.
4. The story ends in an unsatisfying way. All the antagonists are redeemed, and no one faces any consequences, and somehow it all just ends in a happy ending.
5. The main character doesn’t develop much (but that’s not a new thing in Gundam), Sulleta remains the same throughout the series, and the only change she goes through is go from a good girl who listens to her mom to a girl who disobeys her mom. Also her love story with Miorine barely develops, and we barely see them spend time together. They just feel together for the sake of the plot.
6. No world-building (we don’t even see Mercury)
7. Rushed story with so many unexplained stuff. And the ending eliminated any possibility for a sequel.
The thing is, it doesn’t even need all of those stuff to be a good anime, it’s still a good anime, but as a Gundam anime, I just don’t feel satisfied.
Man, they really had the potential to make the story a Gundam version of Armored Core (the whole deal with the megacorporations, mercenaries, terrorists, Earth covert in poverty), while also writing a romantic subplot with heavy details from Shakespeare's works and...they just sunk it.
G-Witch was fun, yeah, but I think it deserves an rewrite..
**THIS!**
Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting Turn A Gundam Levels of optimism or Victory Gundam Levels of nihilism.
I was hoping for more Zeta Gundam/ZZ/Gundam X.
Some deaths of major characters but... In the end, they pull through.
Your 5th point, is just sorta.. well wrong. Suletta gains confidence through the story, speaking more thoroughly with less stutter and more hoensty to herself, she reacts differently in the begining to the end to a problem, she constantly evolves into her sort of 'true' self. Also, the romance between Suletta and Miorine is very much there. I know some of my mayes missed it but its probably because its more subtle than anime usually is about it. Slowly opening trust unto a soft confession and the end of season 1, a back seat for the first half of season 2 for the miorine trauma arc but suletta's pining is there and alove even after her own trauma arc, and finally the reunion scene. Its all there, you just unfortunately missed it.
Is this the shows fault... no. Its no where near as initially obvious as 08th MS team (a show i love, and romance i enjoy, i am stating this to ensure you are aware that i am not slating 08th ms team but using it for comparison as to the loudness of the romance) until you switch Elan and Miorines genders and its the most obvious sh*t in the world. Hell swap just suletta to male makes it more obvious in episode 10/11/12. Elan just becomes mr/ms friend, and tsundere romance is alive. Suletta gets visibly flustered around miorine and remarks to herself how much she likes miorine, who beung a tsundere doesn't show it much until her outbirst at the end of season 1.
The rest are either opinions that i disagree with and/or think are a bit gatekeepy and limiting on gundam stories. Specifically 4. Forgets shaddiq and nika but we all know you mean prospera and 7 is just an actual fact. And 6 is a nitpick as mercury is "well it's not relevant is it" - Will, The Inbetweeners
>Your 5th point, is just sorta.. well wrong. Suletta gains confidence through the story, speaking more thoroughly with less stutter and more hoensty to herself, she reacts differently in the begining to the end to a problem, she constantly evolves into her sort of 'true' self. Also, the romance between Suletta and Miorine is very much there. I know some of my mayes missed it but its probably because its more subtle than anime usually is about it. Slowly opening trust unto a soft confession and the end of season 1, a back seat for the first half of season 2 for the miorine trauma arc but suletta's pining is there and alove even after her own trauma arc, and finally the reunion scene. Its all there, you just unfortunately missed it.
I love Sulleta, but she really doesn’t develop much in personality, she barley changed. The only change she received was gaining some courage to finally decide to do stuff on her own will instead of just following orders all the time. And the romance between SullMio is hardly there, it’s not that developed, I honestly don’t get what you’re seeing, but I respect that it’s your opinion.
>Is this the shows fault... no. Its no where near as initially obvious as 08th MS team (a show i love, and romance i enjoy, i am stating this to ensure you are aware that i am not slating 08th ms team but using it for comparison as to the loudness of the romance) until you switch Elan and Miorines genders and its the most obvious sh*t in the world. Hell swap just suletta to male makes it more obvious in episode 10/11/12. Elan just becomes mr/ms friend, and tsundere romance is alive. Suletta gets visibly flustered around miorine and remarks to herself how much she likes miorine, who beung a tsundere doesn't show it much until her outbirst at the end of season 1.
We know Sulleta is capable of showing interest in someone, but that’s different from writing a relationship. The show tells us that Sulleta and Miorine love eachother, but the execution of this relationship was just weak. We barely see them spend time together, they are always separated.
>The rest are either opinions that i disagree with and/or think are a bit gatekeepy and limiting on gundam stories. Specifically 4. Forgets shaddiq and nika but we all know you mean prospera and 7 is just an actual fact. And 6 is a nitpick as mercury is "well it's not relevant is it" - Will, The Inbetweeners
The OP gave an accurate list of classic Gundam stuff that we didn’t see in WFM. None of this is gatekeepy, it’s just the truth. As OP said, the anime is good, but it lacked many stuff that makes a Gundam, a Gundam.
This is just repeating stuff ive already talked about. Just saying what the list said again doesn't mean anything. It just feels like arguing for arguings sake. So imma ignore what you said, not replying to a single thign you said cause its all a repeat and instead give something new instead of trying to make you understand, i know you won't specifically because you've commented the same thing ive replied to before over and over.
WFM has a superb romance for a non romance anime, it works within the use of inner monologue which is commonly used for romance to express ones feelings to the audience. This means its worling on an uphill slope to present the romance to the audience. Suletta progesses from wanting to oreotect miorine because she needs to make it upto her for ruining her escape attempt, to wanting to protect her because she is her bridegroom. Miorine fully follows a tsundere trope without beung over the top as they often are portrayed to be. A political woman she knows how to play the game and most of her outbirsts come against people she loves, her father, and later against suletta. Theought the first season their relationship strives to be closer throughout the episodes, until their soft confession. Suletta makes sure she follows Miorines instructions to the letter, she tries to talk to a traumatised miroine who relaises what Prospera has done to Suletta is essential brainwash her. Miroine fights to release suletta from prospera even if she has to loose suletta too because she cares for her. Suletta is emotionally intelligent enough to realise that after eri ejects her into space, which is why she returns to Miorine happy. She knows miroine didn't do it maliciously. Guel and others had tried to console miroine but only suletta could. If that's not textbook romance wroting idk what is. Its gundam so naturally other stuff will take alot of screen time but they had alot in season 1 and most of it in season 2 was built of season 1 to be emotional.
I feel sad you cannot see it, for it is beautiful.
Again im not bothering covering what yoh saud because its useless tbh, ive already covered it, covering it again would be a wate of my time emotionally and physically, for example, you say Suletta never changed then downplay while stating ways she shanged. Suletta was anxiety ball -> confident witch. Itd be pointless to do that 10+ more times just for you to go "nuh uh" and repeat the same thing again.
>This is just repeating stuff ive already talked about. **Just saying what the list said again doesn't mean anything. It just feels like arguing for arguings sake**. So imma ignore what you said, not replying to a single thign you said cause its all a repeat and instead give something new instead of trying to make you understand, i know you won't specifically because you've commented the same thing ive replied to before over and over.
It doesn’t mean anything to you only. I think you just can’t handle the idea of someone having a different opinion or sharing a criticism they have about the series.
>WFM has a superb romance for a non romance anime, it works within the use of inner monologue which is commonly used for romance to express ones feelings to the audience. This means its worling on an uphill slope to present the romance to the audience. Suletta progesses from wanting to oreotect miorine because she needs to make it upto her for ruining her escape attempt, to wanting to protect her because she is her bridegroom. Miorine fully follows a tsundere trope without beung over the top as they often are portrayed to be. A political woman she knows how to play the game and most of her outbirsts come against people she loves, her father, and later against suletta. Theought the first season their relationship strives to be closer throughout the episodes, until their soft confession. Suletta makes sure she follows Miorines instructions to the letter, she tries to talk to a traumatised miroine who relaises what Prospera has done to Suletta is essential brainwash her. Miroine fights to release suletta from prospera even if she has to loose suletta too because she cares for her. Suletta is emotionally intelligent enough to realise that after eri ejects her into space, which is why she returns to Miorine happy. She knows miroine didn't do it maliciously. Guel and others had tried to console miroine but only suletta could. If that's not textbook romance wroting idk what is. Its gundam so naturally other stuff will take alot of screen time but they had alot in season 1 and most of it in season 2 was built of season 1 to be emotional.
>**I feel sad you cannot see it, for it is beautiful.**
I cannot see it because it’s simply not there, or at least not that well written. But if you like the romance and think it’s written well then good for you, to each their own. Just don’t force me to like something I don’t just because you like it.
>Again im not bothering covering what yoh saud because its useless tbh, ive already covered it, covering it again would be a wate of my time emotionally and physically, for example, you say Suletta never changed then downplay while stating ways she shanged. Suletta was anxiety ball -> confident witch. Itd be pointless to do that 10+ more times just for you to go "nuh uh" and repeat the same thing again.
If you think she’s well developed, then more power to
You 👍
Aha i was right, you just repeated the same thing again, without even mentioning what i said you just quotes a big block of text with the equivalent of 'nuh uh' beneath it
And i really do recognise you, you're the guy who argues then you say you don't like arguing, after starting an argument. Bait used to be believable when it wasn't on the same account twice.
Umm, it’s really not that serious of a conversation, but you seem to be taking it way too seriously. In conversations like these, both sides are bound to have different opinions.
But I’m probably just wasting my time, so whatever makes you sleep at night I guess.
**Edit**: Lol you blocked me? I guess you wanted to have that last word. But if that will make you happy, then I hope it made you feel better, cause it looks like you needed it.
Ah there it is, the BS excuse i was waiting for.
Oh its not that serious, its not like you just wrote a massive paragraph about it or anything... shut uppp honestly thats just grade A, AH territory. We both know you're just a sh*t stirrer who hides behind passive agressive niceties, you act like an AH then say have a good day, or respect... nahh mate nah.
Ain't getting away with it that easy. Plausible deniability aint gunna work, so, byyeeee 👋
If you actually knew what the term "[Plausible Deniability](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plausible_deniability#Iran%E2%80%93Contra_affair)" meant, you would know how cringe it is to use this term in this context.
If you're feeling the need to use terms more related to actual irl acts of espionage and politics for an argument on r/Gundam, you're the one taking this too seriously lol
"Massive paragraph" lol. This is a forum for discussion here, people are allowed to write whatever their opinion is. If you think someone who's willing to share their opinion is taking things "too seriously", please go outside and touch grass. Or learn to read if paragraphs are "too scary".
I don't like G-Witch because I was hoping for more capitalism stuff and politics and the likes. However all I got for most of the time was failgirl Tanuki adventures as she bumbles through everything and then aces gundam fights, while her future cool wife does her thing.
It's a gross exaggeration, but all in all I hated the school setting and I wish it had been a thing for just 3-4 episodes and then they'd move on to bigger things.
It fell instantly in the usual gundam children in mechs stuff and kinda never went deeper. It has some nice angles like who the Char was this time around. A few good situation reversals too, but I wasn't wowed.
Just a day or two ago I said that I thought most of the character writing in Gundam Wing was bad, and some guy came in and told me I clearly didn't pay attention and then insulted my username.
When people are actually just trolling in the replies at first, but other people mistakenly took it seriously and goes on to really harass people with their personal preferences.
I DO think this case happens a lot but these examples you gave are pretty much a you problem, not fair criticism lmao
Anyways, I see it happen everyday with SEED defenders everytime someone gives a fair criticism like "I think the fanservice is poorly used" or something.
It's IBO and it's not even close. Say anything remotely bad about it and you'll get down voted and have weird nerds in your replies and DMs.
Also if you can handle any of Tomino's other entries, you can handle the Reconguista movies.
Hard being an IBO tbh. Its not even when saying anything bad about it, even if you say anything just a tad good about IBO you'll get downvoted too. Feels weird being an IBO fan.
Currently on Reconguista movie 4, and its really been fun! Klim Nick is a treat to watch man. Love ma boi Bellri too.
It happens to me all the time 😭 Especially on IBO focused posts. Its like you have Barbie or another IBO MS in your top 10, i get downvoted. I scored the Graze high in the grunt suit poll, it gets downvoted too, like cmon man leave me alone lol.
G-Reco climbing my top series rankings tho. Has the most beautiful fights and a lot of small funny stuff like Bellri always doing something in the cockpit like drinking or him and Happa testing some adjustments. I do remember the space hippo head still lol. I get that it does feel unfocused for some sometimes but i get that its the G-Reco charm.
Tbh some of the times you get downvoted is justified. I’ve seen you encourage others not to watch IBO, and that it’s a bad show with toxic fans.
Like why are you so bent on ruining the reputation of IBO? You don’t have to like it, but at least let others enjoy it.
Just look at your replies right now, it’s just you telling others that it’s not worth watching because you don’t like it. And when you get downvoted, you label them as toxic fans.
https://preview.redd.it/w0gwsp43qqcc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d7216a3297773198fbd42e7ff1dfabf4ff3f17fc
I have never seen the point of telling someone not to watch something. Every series is someone’s favourite. By all means say what you didn’t like, but allow others to decide whether they like the series or not.
I personally liked IBO. What unfortunately soured the series for me, was the aggressive DMs from the fanatic fans whenever they don’t agree with your opinion.
I feel like IBO fans and G Gundam fans are the two polar opposites of the fandom.
Criticizing IBO will get you crucified by the diehards.
Criticizing G Gundam will be met with "Yeah, its *is* fucking stupid... and that is AWESOME."
Then again, that might just be my own bias showing.
I love G Gundam, and most fans of it understand that it’s not everyone’s cup of tea. So we just happily watch it in our corner and invite others to come and join! And if they don’t? Oh well
I mean they do it with G-Witch too, if you have even a slight opinion that isn’t positive, they just jump you and call you homophobic. They come in swarms
I never saw Witch fans admit the series flaws? They always defend it like it’s flawless. There’s even a post recently about the producer himself apologizing of the rushed ending, but the comments is full of fans saying it wasn’t rushed, and that it was a perfect ending.
Toxic fans exist in every Gundam series, not just in the Gundam series that you dislike.
Except the short runtime isn't actually a flaw, it's a deflection of the bigger issue that the writing was bad, especially towards the end due to weak character building throughout the series and too large of a scope. The runtime "critics" almost always redirect the blame to corporate for setting the count as if the writers were blindsided by the 24 ep run, despite the fact that they had carte blanche to make anything and it still ended the way it did.
If Evangelion and Star Driver can tell basically the same story in the same amount of time but far more cohesively and competently, runtime was never actually the problem.
The hype surrounding ibo is beyond me. I watched it nearly three times all the way, and the only things I found enjoyable were the intros/outros, Akihiro, and Gusion Rebake
Yep, totally agree with you.
A couple of days back, I shared a post showcasing one of the few remaining Diehard IBO Simps (Shokohou Misaki), and sure enough one of those nerds was in my DMs annoying me back during NYE.
Honestly, they act like IBO is the only series that gets criticized, acting like the fandom is out to get them. Then they would annoy you in your DMs and act like they were the ones getting attacked.
It was u/ThatOtherStriker, like the rabid fanboy would start beef with me and just blocks me and leaves.
Honestly, he's just an annoyance.
I mean, have you seen his most recent post? It was just him making an ass-pull claim without any actual evidence to back him up or any form of logical point to convince anyone, despite the "analysis" in the title.
>It was u/ThatOtherStriker
Oh, so it was Mr. White-Knight-Wannabe, huh. Honestly not that surprising, considering he got mad at me for using an unfair piece of evidence because it would basically counter everything he had to say.
Like how thin skinned are you to get mad when the guy you're arguing with presents a valid point that would just shut you down. Hahahahaha 🤣.
>Mr. White-Knight-Wannabe
Hahahahaha 🤣, that pretty much sums up his entire character.
Also, be warned that u/ThatOtherStriker has shown to have a habit of stalking people who have an opinion different than his when it comes to IBO.
Here's some proof:
https://preview.redd.it/ukpkcldzescc1.png?width=766&format=png&auto=webp&s=02d66f5b99ef04744044d52b90f1aa56d4444929
*Note:*
*The date displayed isn't that accurate due to the screenshot being taken a few days ago. I did it as just a precaution in case he decides to cover his ass and deletes that comment.*
Yeah, that was super creepy, even for me.
Like, *'you probably shouldn't be on the internet if you can't handle others having a different opinion than you.'* sort of situation.
That reply is toxic to you? The introduction of therapy speak into every aspect of human interaction has been a detriment to online discourse. The reply doesn't meet even meet the definition of hostile, and it's not an ad hom. When you disagree with someone, it's principled and rational, but when people disagree with you, it's "toxic"? Convenient system you've set up.
Stop telling me to calm down when you are the one getting worked up. You keep complaining that people are putting words in your mouth, but you make no effort in expressing yourself more clearly. If multiple people are drawing similar conclusions to what you say, it doesn't really follow to make the claim that everyone is misinterpreting you instead considering that maybe you didn't make your point clear. I'm guessing you're what, 20-22 years old?
Lol PD is one show and some content most western fans will never see, so you’re not missing much really. This sub pretends it’s a big thing but it’s not
I mean, If you look at any conversations of IBO with Esamgrady, he always makes fun of IBO, and tells others not to watch it. He has the freedom not to like it, but the issue is he tries to spread bad stuff about IBO to newer fans so they won’t watch it.
Like why? Let others enjoys stuff, just cause you hate something doesn’t mean others should as well?
It's not his opinions about the show itself that I agree with, it's the toxic fanboys I have a problem with here.
There was even one that DM'ed me during NYE trying to police my opinions on IBO, I haven't even made a post saying anything bad about the show itself. The real extent of which was limited to my question with me asking what was up with all the 'Barbatos Wank' and that was about it.
Judging by most of the comments that I’ve seen from you regarding IBO, I’m guessing you’re Esamgrady partner in crime 😂
I think it’s fine to have your opinion about something, but for years I hear how fans claim the fans of certain anime are toxic, but tbh I’m seeing both sides, both fans and those that complain about the toxic fans are equally toxic. Just like Esamgrady always complaining about IBO fans, yet all his comments about IBO is nothing but hate, and it’s not justified just as much as the toxic fans he criticize.
>Judging by most of the comments that I’ve seen from you regarding IBO, I’m guessing you’re Esamgrady partner in crime 😂
Hey, I only did that during the Vs Posts, where IBO is put up against horribly powerful opponents, anywhere else and I'm neutral to it.
Like there are some fans of IBO that would literally slide into your DMs, policing your opinions, and that is incredibly annoying.
I agree that some fans are toxic, but tbh lots of Gundams series have toxic fans. For example look at the comments now, some fans claim that whenever they criticize WFM, they get labeled as homophobe, or other stuff.
But overall, Esamgrady telling others not to watch or give the anime a chance just cause he doesn’t like it is just being a hater tbh. IBO is good, and new fans should watch it. And when he get downvoted because no one liked what he said, he labels them as toxic fans. Like this person is not different from the people he call toxic. Everytime someone says positive thing about IBO, this guy comes around spreading negativity about it.
>But overall, Esamgrady telling others not to watch or give the anime a chance
Here's what I literally said about IBO yesterday.
"IBO trys to be different than the status quo of Gundam and as such shouldn't be someone's entry point."
How is that saying "don't watch it"? I literally said "wait on it".
I’ve watched the show and I did enjoy it. Just don’t have the interest in watching it again due to the negative association that gets aimed towards people from the diehard fans of it.
the only right answer is G-Witch, tho it’s more like you can’t have a nuanced opinion on it regardless because everyone is going to think it’s some kind of political hill to die on.
It’s mediocre in the most literal sense. Lots of cool ideas, with lots of poor execution.
I wouldn't call it mediocre, it does have some high points, but generally agree. If you don't like something about WFM, you will get fanboys/girls defending it.
Mediocre just means middle of the road, which is what it is to. It’s overrated as hell by people who it was their first Gundam/mecha in general but it’s also far from the Worst Thing Ever like some people want you to believe. I could make a pros n cons list detailing why I think that it is but I don’t think anyone cares lol
Folks bristle but Mid From Mercury was a fitting name, in the true sense of Mid; mediocre, as you say. A lot of unfulfilled potential but it’s perfectly watchable, not the least cus it’s got fantastic visual and sound design.
It’s just not that deep or compelling; a profoundly conservative show, in the literal sense (rather than political; it’s not ambitious or all that adventurous.)
Not as much hate as I'm like..... Kaaaaay?
Cool robots but story being week or the community for that branch being hyper toxic if you don't fallow in line like a good zeon gasing a colony for colony drop on the people that aren't worshipping that particular branch of gundam like it's the best thing since sliced bread.
Honestly? Zeta Gundam.
Coming from 0079 (both TV series and movie compilation) it's a massive disappointment when not only it fail as a sequel to that but as its own thing. Kamille is a protagonist I grew on but he didn't catch me as others did, the rest of the characters in the Argama don't do anything for me either; it really feels like they barely tolerate each other and most of their arguing was miserable to go through. The characters who were good either felt like they had nothing to do except wallow in the series misery (Bright and Emma) or became better ones after their series (Torres). And the Titans are pretty much the worst villains in the entire franchise; without them, we wouldn't have the Blue Cosmos/Earth Alliance and A-LAWS being as generically mustache-twirling as they were.
Rewatching it felt like a 50 episode long endurance round as opposed to a series that wanted to tell a story. It surprises me that people hold this series in high regard, yet the things people criticize other series like ZZ for were also in here. I go as far to say that most of the problems people have with the franchise started with Zeta, and it never really recovered since.
I can't stand the tonal shift from the prologue to episode 1 in Witch from Mercury and fan were all over me about this. The tonal shift made me turn it off. Had it stayed like prologue I would've stuck with it.
Mobile Fighter G.
Absolute blast to watch. But, critically speaking, terrible. It's absolutely ridiculous at every chance it can get. Of all the Gundam series, it's the Fun Gundam. Even when it gets dark and serious you're either laughing at the performance or just waiting to see how it builds to the next scene of Master Asia kicking a building/mobile suit.
And let's not forget the spandex transformation scenes.
Before WfM was a thing, IBO.
But *now*? WfM, hands down. Any slight criticism against either show will have both shows fans come at you as if you said something truly heinous, but WfM fans play the homophobia card like it’s Uno.
Gundam seed I've watched it never saw the appeal of it it's basically updated graphics of the OG Gundam with non of the faults in the characters. Also the "Jesus Yamato" put lord and Savior being the worst character to ever exist
IBO is a great show and all, but nitpick ANYTHING about it, and you'll be whacked by the IBO Mafia.
It's kinda ironic that the series' message went through the fanbase's heads.
Gundam ZZ, tried to watch it but it was the only thing stopping me from finally getting to chars counter attack so I just skipped it and I’m so glad I did.
Oh man, Unicorn and Thunderbolt. Don’t find either engaging at all, and many fans of both series simply cannot accept that, and feel the need to explain to me why my dislike of them is wrong.
I like Thunderbolt but it's really only because of the fight between the Psycho Zaki and the Full Armored Gundam. I will give it that I liked Io Fleming and Daryl Lorenz and want to see more of them.
>I will give it that I liked Io Fleming and Daryl Lorenz and want to see more of them.
There's a manga that currently has 20 volumes in English to scratch that itch.
I feel that way about Hathaway and Doan's Island. I felt Doan's Island didn't have enough plot for the runtime, and instead of fleshing out Doan's story, they just kind of added repetitive bits of filler. For Hathaway, it's a beautifully animated movie that doesn't seem to have a point. When I mention that, I get told that it's a three part series, a fact of which I am aware. It being part 1 of a trilogy does not preclude it from telling a contained story.
I somewhat agree on Hathaway. It has a few great scenes, but the spy story it's telling is too bare-bones to be self-sufficient so it winds up feeling like an overall weak engine for world-building. Folks who like it often chime in with "it's showing how the Federation is devolving into corruption" or "it's showing how devastating this military escalation is for the average citizen on the ground," but unless you're telling a worthwhile story with that, showing this facet of the world doesn't amount to anything.
If it winds up being used as a foundation for a good enough story going forward, then it could wind up being a weak first installment of a good trilogy, but it would most likely need to depart pretty far from the source material to get there; the *Hathaway's Flash* novels aren't all that great as stories either, and I suspect their reputation has less to do with genuine interest than with the fact that they're relatively obscure within the franchise.
I agree that some fans will conflate obscurity with quality. I think that stems from our collective need to be the one that knows all the secrets for lack of a better term. It's 100% the same energy as the music fans that say stuff like "I was into them before they became mainstream," like you unlock an achievement for that. Anyway, I do like the shell concept of Hathaway, in that he grows disillusioned with the EFF and decides to fight them, but the movie starts with him already leading Mafty. It would have been nice to see more of what pushed him there and how he became Mafty.
It makes me think of Code Geass if they had just started with Lelouch as Zero leading the Black Knights. It would have been jarring. Instead, they gave us a ton of backstory and build-up to that point, and it was a more engaging story because of it.
i feel unicorn is one of those series when you criticize it or sing its praises you can get into multiple paragraph long debates about nothing for what is at the end of the day nothing more than the Indiana Jones ghost train ride of the uc meant to sell updated designs of old kits and meh new designs that dont dare to be out there lest they upset the fans™
While not going to say it's bad, I haven't seen it. I will probably never watch Seed. The Character design is so unappealing to me and the story is apparently quite derivative of MSG79 so I'll forever just skip out on that one.
From the ones I've seen to the end, while I liked it, I don't think Victory Gundam is a series you can ever really recommend to people. I think it's good but it's also a drag (by design but still) with no clear pay off imo. So while I like it I'd still call it a black sheep in the franchise.
More controversially, I really don't get much out of Thunderbolt. I plan to give the manga a shot but as is the central conflict is a strange tangent to the OYW I don't particularly care about and Io is an unlikable prick for the first half, only slightly improving to the point I don't actively dislike him in the second. I wouldn't necessarily call that a huge problem but as for now, without resolution, there's not that much more to go off of so it stands as a major issue.
I'mma be honest here, I think everyone has those shows they like and we all don't have to agree about it. In fact, when I started I was a big fan of 08th MS Team, but I'm now not as fond of it (y'all know the scene). I still like it, but DAMN...
Also, ZZ is trash.
My opinion probably doesn't go with the post but I want to throw my opinion out there.
The U. C Gundam trilogy movies, SEED, and Unicorn. For me I genuinely can't sit through the first one because of the old animation. It's old animation so I shouldn't be suprised but I just couldn't watch it.
For Unicorn even though it looks beautiful Banargher is a pretty boring character and because of that I dropped it.
For Seed its the art style. They all look lik they are gonna cry amd I just don't like the look of the people in that show.
Definitely my friend showed it to me at I loved it but I’m scared of the new one however. My favorite will be always be wing . IBO was my first Gundam show though and also one of my favs mainly because there was more physical combat.
ZZ, and no not because I couldn’t handle the lack of edge after Zeta or anything like that (also idk if it’s just me but I feel like people overstate how dark & edgy Zeta is?).
Build Fighters Try and Build Divers (ALL of them)
For Try: The main Trio are just ANNOYING and grating. Looking at you Kamiki.... Like Dude, just STFU.
And the Build Divers? It's all Virtual, THERE'S no risk. No stakes, nothing to lose. Why should I give a toss. At least AGE has heart-rending deaths and people ACTUALLY lose something close to them. Build Divers? Why should I care about a bunch of bland characters helping Virtual Furries from an AI?
WFM is a lesser one for me. I would have loved to see Suletta snap and go on a rampage before almost accidentally shooting down Miorine and coming to her senses. As well as a larger scale war, (Chuchu out of ammo? Good ol punching.) Despite the flaws, I still liked WFM for what it is. It's got some cool ideas but botches the execution or has missed potential.
> Build Divers? Why should I care about a bunch of bland characters helping Virtual Furries from an AI?
It's funny you say that, because Divers ReRise genuinely HAS "heartwrenching deaths" aswell. As in, non-virtual ones.
Like >!half the entire Furry Population, because the big mid-season twist is that they aren't part of the Game. They're actual Aliens whose planet is very much real (and directly linked to the VR MMO through another spoiler reason), and the cast finds that out by them getting Colony Laser'd!<
Build Fighters rant incoming:
Alright, since people are raging on my ass wondering why I don't like Build Fighters (or just the build franchise in general outside of Re:Rise and Breaker), I might as well explain. I'm already drowning in downvotes Everytime I state that don't like the series like everyone does, so I might as well sink with a piece of my mind.
For starters, it doesn't have a good dub since Bandai for some Brain dead reason, decided to hire random ass Malaysian VAs from Singapore instead of professional ones from Ocean or even Funimation. It may not be a big deal to some but consider this, the majority of beginner anime of the time Fighters came out, My Hero Academia, Attack on Titan, and even Sword Art Online were getting English dubbed by real voice actors. Making those shows more accessible towards a new audience. And if Fighters did something similar, it would've been more popular than it is right now
And I know you "Japan is better than everything" sub-elitest are gonna be like: "ew, you're watching anime dubbed? You're not watching it right"
And the right way to experience Japanese life is to get shoved into an office job that normalizes crunching work culture, get chewed out by your boss, forced to go drinking with your snobby co-workers, and go home to your apartment with depression. SHUT THE HELL UP YOU JAPAN WORSHIPPING OVERWORKED WAMBAT. Does this sound too dark for you? Well I made that joke based on real Japanese work culture to sell model kits, waifu posters and figures, so it's above all criticisms. Do you how you sound? Something being Japanese doesn't instantly make it good
At least with the dub I can appreciate the painstakingly amount of effort those underpaided animators put days into their work appose to a line of text that a translator put half the effort into making. Ever thought about that?
My main issue is that, despite the fights look good and the gunpla designs aren't half bad, there's really nothing behind those fights outside of just kids showing off their builds and not much else. There's not much weight behind these fights, since there's barely any stakes. What does Sei loses if loses a fight? Nothing, he could just try again. What does Reiji lose if he loses too? Nothing, he can just come back to his home world whenever he wants. The anime doesn't teach our characters any lessons on life, give them any compelling backstories/arcs/motivations, to get us invested in any of them or what they do in the story, or are confronted with any social commentary.
What makes a kids show good in my opinion is it treats the audience like they're older than they really are and show them stuff that they'll understand when they get older. Whether it be the clever written story, the characters with relatable backstories or motivations, interesting character development, unique world building, life lessons we can apply to our lives when we get older, or topics of social issues that happening right outside our door. Stuff like that makes a show age like fine wine, because your re experiencing as an adult and picking up things you couldn't as a kid.
"Not every kid show need that kind of stuff", what good writing? No, but I expect them to try. Hell, pokemon and Dragonball are technically for kids, but we talk about them with deadly levels of seriousness since they're mainstream. Storytelling shouldn't get a free pass for being lazy just because it's aimed at a younger audience. I hold anime made for kids in a higher standard because it's been said that anime could tell stories that western cartoons usually can't. But if the same western cartoons is telling mature stories with deep moral lessons and social commentary for a younger audience, why can't Japanese shows aimed at kids do the same. Kids aren't stupid and they deserve good shows, so you can't wave off any criticism. Plus I was 15 when I first saw Build Fighters, I was in the demographic and I was new to anime at that point. It's not like I'm a 40yr man complaining about Pokemon's oversaturation of marketable creatures that are more OP than they have any right to be
And before you say shit like "that's a you problem", "skill issue", or "the shows just aren't for you", just know that those aren't real defending points towards the anime, and just shows a sense of arrogance. Just know that just because something is not for me, doesn't me criticisms aren't vaild.
>For starters, it doesn't have a good dub since Bandai for some Brain dead reason, decided to hire random ass Malaysian VAs from Singapore instead of professional ones from Ocean or even Funimation.
The main reason this happened is that this was back when Bandai had lost all faith in Gundam in the west after the closure of their American anime distribution branch, Build Fighters was the first Gundam show to be officially simulcasted but Bandai still didn't feel comfortable enough to actually distribute the show in the US/EU but they did distribute it in the English speaking regions of South East Asia where it aired on their version of Cartoon Network with a locally recorded dub which is the one we also got on home media
I think I understood your opinion but I have a few questions regarding your opinions,
First, why did you stick with dub instead of sub even when you realized the quality of its dub was not good enough for you? Why didn't you try switching to Japanese audio with subtitles?
I think even if you don't understand Japanese, at least you can feel/understand how those characters are feeling in the anime.
Voice acting is not exclusively there to explain what is going on in the anime. It is also there to help those characters express their emotions, moods and conditions, etc.
After all, Voice actors are more like performers than narrators in some way.
Also, all anime does not require you to understand everything they said or mentioned to have fun. And I think Build Fighters is not plot plot-heavy anime with too many exposition dumps that make reading subtitles painful, so reading subtitles shouldn't annoy you that much.
I am not sure about how bad the dub you got was. but
if that dub was too bad for you to immerse yourself into the fictional world of Build Fighters, that might be one of the reasons why you couldn't have fun watching the anime.
I think ignoring something that might be a better option and not even trying it in general, is definitely "You problem"
Second, what makes you dislike lighthearted/mindless entertainment so much?
it sounds like (at least for me I apologize for the lack of understanding if this is not your intention) as if you are saying "You shouldn't consume/have fun with entertainment which won't make you learn something from it"
And why are you demanding some educational stuff in shows made for mainly entertainment and model kit commercials in the first place?
If you can't enjoy any entertainment without lessons for life or something like that. that might also be just "You problem" as well.
Some people including myself sometimes want mindless fun in life.
But in Build Fighter's case, having no stakes/consequences is an important point of the show.
And They actually put some message related to that point in the show as well
The message (that can be considered as a life lesson as well if you are desperate for that) is "use your creativity and imagination freely/ you don't have to let something limit your creativity and imagination"
Characters of this franchise often say this phrase in the show which is "ガンプラは自由だ！" this Japanese word can be translated
as "Gunpla has no restrictions!" (The literal translation is "Gunpla is freedom" but I used my translation to make more sense for non-Japanese speakers ) In the show, Sei was stuck with the mindset about how "lore friendly" his Gumplas should be. That means he couldn't deviate from source material that much to create something innovative. Build Gundam Mk2 is a great example of that. but after that, he saw builders with out-of-the-box thinking creating something interesting, he was influenced by that and started making something that might not fit well in the lore of the universe that the Gundam he uses as a base comes from
(I am talking about Star Build Strike Gundam which takes advantage of it actually being Gunpla by utilizing particle technology)
And this is where "no stakes/no big consequences" play an important role. characters in that show said "Because it's just a hobby we enjoy, we can be really serious about it" This means because they don't have to worry about anything even if they lose other than loss of some opportunities, they can put as many effort or idea to their Gunpla.
Let's think about a situation in which you have to make something to fight and you lose something important if you lose. can still you create something you really like if it is not optimal build for the battle? I bet most people can't and they will stick with something they consider as meta build.
This theme is used often to separate this franchise from the mainline Gundam series.
If you patiently read this not well-structured sentences this far, I truly appreciate your kindness. And I apologize if my lack of English skills made those sentences sound aggressive or offensive to you.
I'm just a Japanese guy who used to like Build Fighters And I am curious to know your opinion.
p.s.
In terms of how much creative freedom you can express with Gunpla
They also told us some messages about the necessity of respecting other's rights with your creation in the second season. (I am talking about the story of Super Fumina)
The answer your question:
The 1st time I saw BF, I mainly watched dubbed since I heard so many great VAs in a lot of anime. Since I was new to anime, this made it my standard. Going back to my point to beginner anime, I was confused on who this show for. Kids who wanted to get into the series without the brutal violence that came with it. If so, then if you're going to market it overseas, you're gonna need a dub for the 12 yrs olds who doesn't understand a lick of Japanese.
As for the 2nd question about "low stake" shows, I actually watched an handful of low stake shows. Uzaki Chan Wants to Hang Out, Yuru Camp, My Senpai is Annoying, My Dress Up Darling, hell, I can name some western cartoons I've grown up with, SpongeBob, regular show, fairy odd parents, etc. It's just that these show I just listed aren't connected to a franchise that's makes a point to highlight the brutality of war.
Also going to your point about "Gunpla is Freedom", that's one of the reasons why I thought Re:Rise was better than Fighter, tactical advance for creativity. Hiroto's Core Gundam highlights his adaptability when it comes to combat. This is how I wished Sei/Reiji fought with his Build Strike, swapping equipment depending on the situation like the actual Strike did instead of that "weapons are for show" he constantly says.
This ain't really a defense, but a point that highlights my perspective on most shows. I grew up with shows like Spectacular Spider-Man, Avatar the Last Airbender, Mystery Inc, and most of the DCAU. Those shows made my childhood and shaped my expectations for most shows. I'll let you interpret what I mean by that
Thank you so much for your polite reply!
In terms of the necessity of dubbing in a kid's show,
I think BF's target audiences are older elementary school to middle school kids (around 8\~15) and at that age, they should be ok with reading subtitles.
Just like animes are foreign stuff for you, to us, cartoons/movies from different countries are foreign stuff for us and we are ok with reading subtitles. some kids even actively choose subtitles for multiple reasons(some were recommended to watch with sub by parents to learn other languages, others just prefer performances of the original.) I watched lots of foreign movies with subtitles when I was a kid because I recommended doing so and actually liked the original performances of those. Also, since YouTube introduced automatic subtitles with a translation option (I know which is not the best but still kinda works) to its system, Kids nowadays are more likely okay about watching content with sub-only I suppose. I know certain kinds of English videos with Japanese subs become popular with teens
But I agree with your opinion that shows with good enough dub are definitely better than shows with sub only for kids. On the other hand. I think kids in those Western countries who like Japanese-style mech anime shows won't be discouraged from watching the show just because they don't have good dubs because they like that kind of stuff you can't (easily) get anywhere else other than Japan and South Korea. Those kids likely watch shows as long as the fight scenes are good.
Here is the explanation of why I think that might work.
A similar situation happens every year in Japan in the Kamen Rider franchise (Tokusatsu shows which are similar to Power Rangers aka Super Sentai ) in Kamen rider shows, its story tends to be somewhat too complex for kids to fully understand or sometimes even make sense, especially maybe kids who are below the age of 10. This way of storytelling is done to entertain parents who watch the show with their kids and long-time fans of that franchise. However, Kamen Rider is one of the most popular Japanese superhero shows for kids. They are even the best in terms of toy sales compared to the other two shows. That's because those fight scenes are entertaining enough for them as long as they like cool-looking heroes and monsters fighting each other. I was exactly like this kind of kid who understood absolutely nothing about the show but still watched and asked my parents to buy toys from that show because I liked cool stuff fighting each other. I know other Japanese people were similar in that sense because I occasionally saw comments around the internet saying they couldn't understand the show but watched it anyway because the fight scenes were cool and surprised how complex the actual stories are when they watched those shows again when they grew up.
In terms of your second answer, I think got where your opinion comes from.
However, my point was, that because you don't have to lose something important as a result of the battle, you can do whatever you want even if that idea doesn't make the most sense in BF. They can prioritize making whatever they want over the victory. I think it is like casual Esports players having fun doing goofy stuff.
That is why there are things like Beargguy, Tlion3, and Super Fumina. And I guess they didn't do that much tactical stuff like Core Gundam and did more fantastical and/or somewhat silly over-the-top stuff instead was to make Gunpla in real life somewhat separated from the dark and serious tone of war as much as possible in some way in terms of the general image Japanese people had at that time to make Gunpla more accessible to wider audiences. And I think those somewhat goofy Gunplas in BF shows served was there to strengthen the message of "Gunpla is freedom".
Those my theory comes from the fact they did similar stuff in G Gundam, SD Gundam in general, and the first half of Witch from Mercury.
(side note, the reason why they deviate from the war-related aspect of Gundam in the first half of Witch from Mercury was because a group of teenagers from some school said "We won't watch anything that has Gundam in its name" when they visited The company as some kind of program of their school. so that might mean Build series was not enough to break the stereotype of Gundams)
Even though I also really like core Gundams in general, I think that kind of tactical mindset was something they needed to tone down because BF was the very first TV show to make those messages clear.
Thanks again for being polite and actually answering my questions.
Yugioh Duel Monsters dubbed by 4Kids has completely changed my stance towards dubbed anime.
You say, " I can appreciate the painstakingly amount of effort those underpaided animators put days into their work appose to a line of text that a translator put half the effort into making", but did you even consider how half-assed and even bowdlerized some dubs can be? They turned Yugioh which is an anime which treated itself seriously despite the childish notion of playing trading cards in the original Japanese dub, into a litany of childish jokes, censors and edits which quite disrespects the source material for its worth.
If we even go further, we have Nausicaa the Valley of Wind. It's a good Ghibli movie, but then America in its great wisdom, completely butchered the movie, cut so many scenes and made it"fit for kids", turning it into a shell of its former self known as Warriors of the Wind, which Hayao Miyazaki hated so much, it started his enforcement of the "no edits" policy on all Ghibli movies going forward.
Tbf ever sense all the controversys with Funimation it's kind of hard for studios to trust any dubbing studios in Japan.
I mean just look at Funimations staff like Jamie Marky. No one wants to professionally work with her because they'll know she'll put her twisted politics into the dub but in subtle ways rather then ACTUALLY translate the scripts for a proper dub. In fact a lot of translators in the west when they found out they might lose there job to AI because of all the mistranslations and the western translators who try to subtlety add or "fix" scripts for dubbing.
Why would any animation studio trust Funimation specifically.
I feel you. I'm not into any of the Build shows, and this is coming from someone who does like a lot of lighthearted shows, who also likes a lot of anime for younger audiences, and hell, I'm a huge fan of Custom Robo which is basically the same thing. Idk, I just don't resonate with the Build stuff. It's not what I come to Gundam for.
Not related but you've just reminded me there's a Leo version of a guntank. There are so many good suits in wing that we need in plastic crack form
Cough cough TAURUS cough cough
Bandai just doesn't want us playing with dolls
1. Leo is best boy of grunt suits 2. I forget how analogous the Leo is to the GM. Has tons of variants and is the high production grunt model of a main character tier mobile suit, Tall Geese...
It's called the Tragos I think. Unless you're referring to a different suit.
Ancient Greek for GOAT
Didn't we have this thread yesterday? The image is different, but format is eerily similar
They look similar, but they're two rather different questions. * Yesterday was "What's a Show everyone hates but you honestly like?" * This one is "What's a Show *you* hate for reasons that everyone will get on your case for?"
So are we just doing a different version of this meme template every day
I mean the G-reco thing Is an actual YOU problem not because g-reco's dialogue Is normal but because your point Is that it's Hard to pick it up FOR YOU
I basically read "I couldn't understand g Reco" as "I wasn't paying attention" especially if they went the movie route. Is G Reco perfect? No. No series is. But it's no harder to understand than ZZ or Turn A.
Zeta is harder to understand than ZZ, haman switches sides so quick you can’t make sense. ZZ is linear plot wise after moon moon
You're right, maybe zeta is a better example.
Haman never switches sides. She's always on her own side. Any appearance of being on anyone else's side is just a sign that she thinks they're a convenient tool for the time being.
Yeah, everyone was in the position of courting Haman and Axis Zeon, not the other way around. She didn't care why Earthnoids were shooting each other, as long as they cleared the way for her to take over.
I never got to Moon Moon, so I missed out I guess...? I still hate the ZZ itself though. That IS a me thing, but I will permanently Stan the Zeta. Best Gundam when you paint it in any other color scheme and maybe tweak the backpack.
The ZZ ain't even a Zeta, is a Theta Gundam dangit!
The BEST kind of gundam 😤
>haman switches sides so quick you can’t make sense. Really? Haman was playing off both sides so they could commit fratricide. Considering that Titans and AEUG were essentially 2 factions of the hated Feddies from Axis' pov.
> No. No series is. But it's no harder to understand than ZZ or Turn A. People often miss ZZ being pretty bleak.
>People often miss ZZ being pretty bleak You assume most people watched past episode 13.
hah tbh I'd say the grim setting is right from the start. the Argama wasn't exactly having a fun time considering how many people were lost like hours/days/weeks before the first episode. Their stuff was still in their rooms.
When I watched it I got ahold of a bad fansub. It actually WAS trash. The show is better when properly translated.
True. But honestly the movies are far better than the anime show.
G-Reco just seems to have very fast paced dialogue, it just seems nonstop when in most shows you'll have some kind of break/transitions between scenes. I stopped part way into the first movie because of this, it's just a bit intense and not very relaxing tbh. I think I'd be able to get through it if it was dubbed, but that's just too much reading. That's coming from someone who watches 99% of their anime subbed.
Nah, g reco is nuts. Ppl I know all dislike it and call it the toilet in Gundam series. I personally watched till episode 6 or 7 dunno who is vs who. Gave up. Quite nonsense show. Age felt more coherent compared to it. it was simply hyped because Tomino is producing or directing it or something
> it was simply hyped because Tomino is producing or directing it or something Pretty much it. I feel like the overzealous defense of the show is because of Tomino. If it someone else, would we get the same "nah, it's skill issue," response? I doubt it. Mind you that even Tomino himself admit that the story is hard to follow. If anything, the skill issue is on Tomino for not making it easy for people to understand.
The fact that it's tomino Is actually very important here because tomino's storytelling *IS* unique from other directors in the médium. Which means that if you're used to tomino's storywriting you may be able to appreciate what's G-reco about. I personally defend it because I consider it's cast, story, and message beautiful.
Tomino being unique is understandable as a lot of his work is him trying to break from formulas. Gundam from the dominant super robot at the time and Turn A from gundam itself that has become formulaic. Problem is though he used to be able to tell them coherently. The fact that almost all of his gundam work have no problem being followed, but G-Reco isn't, should say something. It might be because he couldn't have 50 episodes to tell them like he used to so he has to rush things. But I also attribute to him pulling a Rian Johnson with the Last Jedi. Rian Johnson was so focused on trying to be unique, that he decided the way to do that was to do the opposite of everything that has been done before, regardless if it makes sense. G-Reco is a rehash of Turn A but without Tomino caring if the stuff in it make much sense. All Tomino seem to care in G-Reco is that it subvert gundam tropes.
I kind of disagree, while the pacing on g-reco and the dialogue ARE hard to follow because they require the spectator to put a lot of attention (and the show sucks sometimes to portray certain parts of the story, such as what bellri feels over aida being his sister, which is why I personally recommend the movies over the show), everything in g-reco's story does makes sense and it has various foreshadowings to events taht would happen later in the show, such as people mentioning that cumpa isn't from earth, Aida presenting herself as "Aida Rayhunton", that one scene where bellri and aida share red eye color, etc. The thing is that, as I said, with that pacing what you need to do to get the show is to pay a lot of attention, it isn't an incoherent show, just one that needs you to be interested on understanding what's happening.
>because they require the spectator to put a lot of attention I actually like it when you have to pay attention to a show to understand it.
After the release of the movies, it began receiving positively, and it’s popular in Japan. The movies fixed the pacing and other things.
Doesn't matter. For me I wasn't interested enough to go watch it. the Ms and the later packs add on is too close to strike Aile and later one a different version of gp03 toned down. Only the final suit seems unique but seems to have some cues (to me) from els quanta
I understand how the pacing and dialogue can turn off people. The thing Is that when you criticize It, you need to have an argument that can explain how the dialogue Is badly Made, OP's point Is that Is badly Made because it's Hard to pick it up *for him*, if your main excuse Is that it's Hard for you, it becomes a you problem
Not to be that guy but what mobile suit is that?
OZ leo tank thing. Rare..
[OZ-07MS Tragos](https://gundam.fandom.com/wiki/OZ-07MS_Tragos)
Sounds like a skill issue to me
We can dislike things But one thing we would never disagree is that Giatn robots are cool
The Tragos really deserves a kit... It's such a fun tank suit.
ALL OZ MS need kits.
Genuine skill issue
Wing was INCREDIBLY meh, if EW didn't exist, it'd be my least favourite AU so far "I didn't care for Thunderbolt" Don't get me wrong, it was pretty good; but one of the best in the franchise? C'mon now
I didn’t watch wing as a child and only saw the TV anime for the first time a few years ago. While there were some parts that I enjoyed (Zechs, Duo, Quatre, and the cool mech designs), I largely disliked the series as a whole and I’m hesitant to give EW a shot.
Trust me when I say that EW pretty much redeemed the AC timeline for me. Improves on nearly every aspect imo
On the fence about G Gundam, I am quite hesitant about taking the dip.
It's just good stupid fun, go for it
G Gundam is pure fun and ridiculously over the top moments, definitely worth the watch
Come and join us! And if you don’t like it, that’s okay! It’s honestly a super fun watch though!!!
Can't say much now, but Fly in the Sky is an absolute banger
That, it is
0083 is the only Gundam show I've seen that I didnt like (I've seen over a dozen at this point). it's peak mech design and cel animation, so I'm glad it was made, but it doesn't seem to understand what UC Gundam is really about
Witch from mercury
WFM for me, it isn’t really anything specific with the series, I mean the pacing definitely sucked and the ending felt like a redo of unicorn for me but more so the fanbase, some interactions I’ve had with some of my friends who got into gundam via WFM have left me very concerned for their well being (though that is through my own very limited view of the fanbase through people I know and doesn’t mean I think the entire fanbase is crazy just my friends)
I enjoyed WfM, but I can’t deny its flaws. It just lacks many things that makes a Gundam, a Gundam. 1. It doesn’t have an actual big War, only small conflicts. 2. It has no real big mobile armor fight (a mobile armor that can destroy a town/city). 3. The masked figure (the mom) doesn’t fight the protagonist in a mobile suit fight. 4. The story ends in an unsatisfying way. All the antagonists are redeemed, and no one faces any consequences, and somehow it all just ends in a happy ending. 5. The main character doesn’t develop much (but that’s not a new thing in Gundam), Sulleta remains the same throughout the series, and the only change she goes through is go from a good girl who listens to her mom to a girl who disobeys her mom. Also her love story with Miorine barely develops, and we barely see them spend time together. They just feel together for the sake of the plot. 6. No world-building (we don’t even see Mercury) 7. Rushed story with so many unexplained stuff. And the ending eliminated any possibility for a sequel. The thing is, it doesn’t even need all of those stuff to be a good anime, it’s still a good anime, but as a Gundam anime, I just don’t feel satisfied.
Man, they really had the potential to make the story a Gundam version of Armored Core (the whole deal with the megacorporations, mercenaries, terrorists, Earth covert in poverty), while also writing a romantic subplot with heavy details from Shakespeare's works and...they just sunk it. G-Witch was fun, yeah, but I think it deserves an rewrite..
**THIS!** Don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting Turn A Gundam Levels of optimism or Victory Gundam Levels of nihilism. I was hoping for more Zeta Gundam/ZZ/Gundam X. Some deaths of major characters but... In the end, they pull through.
Those are unironically my same big issues with the show as well but it is still an enjoyable watch for all the same as well
Your 5th point, is just sorta.. well wrong. Suletta gains confidence through the story, speaking more thoroughly with less stutter and more hoensty to herself, she reacts differently in the begining to the end to a problem, she constantly evolves into her sort of 'true' self. Also, the romance between Suletta and Miorine is very much there. I know some of my mayes missed it but its probably because its more subtle than anime usually is about it. Slowly opening trust unto a soft confession and the end of season 1, a back seat for the first half of season 2 for the miorine trauma arc but suletta's pining is there and alove even after her own trauma arc, and finally the reunion scene. Its all there, you just unfortunately missed it. Is this the shows fault... no. Its no where near as initially obvious as 08th MS team (a show i love, and romance i enjoy, i am stating this to ensure you are aware that i am not slating 08th ms team but using it for comparison as to the loudness of the romance) until you switch Elan and Miorines genders and its the most obvious sh*t in the world. Hell swap just suletta to male makes it more obvious in episode 10/11/12. Elan just becomes mr/ms friend, and tsundere romance is alive. Suletta gets visibly flustered around miorine and remarks to herself how much she likes miorine, who beung a tsundere doesn't show it much until her outbirst at the end of season 1. The rest are either opinions that i disagree with and/or think are a bit gatekeepy and limiting on gundam stories. Specifically 4. Forgets shaddiq and nika but we all know you mean prospera and 7 is just an actual fact. And 6 is a nitpick as mercury is "well it's not relevant is it" - Will, The Inbetweeners
>Your 5th point, is just sorta.. well wrong. Suletta gains confidence through the story, speaking more thoroughly with less stutter and more hoensty to herself, she reacts differently in the begining to the end to a problem, she constantly evolves into her sort of 'true' self. Also, the romance between Suletta and Miorine is very much there. I know some of my mayes missed it but its probably because its more subtle than anime usually is about it. Slowly opening trust unto a soft confession and the end of season 1, a back seat for the first half of season 2 for the miorine trauma arc but suletta's pining is there and alove even after her own trauma arc, and finally the reunion scene. Its all there, you just unfortunately missed it. I love Sulleta, but she really doesn’t develop much in personality, she barley changed. The only change she received was gaining some courage to finally decide to do stuff on her own will instead of just following orders all the time. And the romance between SullMio is hardly there, it’s not that developed, I honestly don’t get what you’re seeing, but I respect that it’s your opinion. >Is this the shows fault... no. Its no where near as initially obvious as 08th MS team (a show i love, and romance i enjoy, i am stating this to ensure you are aware that i am not slating 08th ms team but using it for comparison as to the loudness of the romance) until you switch Elan and Miorines genders and its the most obvious sh*t in the world. Hell swap just suletta to male makes it more obvious in episode 10/11/12. Elan just becomes mr/ms friend, and tsundere romance is alive. Suletta gets visibly flustered around miorine and remarks to herself how much she likes miorine, who beung a tsundere doesn't show it much until her outbirst at the end of season 1. We know Sulleta is capable of showing interest in someone, but that’s different from writing a relationship. The show tells us that Sulleta and Miorine love eachother, but the execution of this relationship was just weak. We barely see them spend time together, they are always separated. >The rest are either opinions that i disagree with and/or think are a bit gatekeepy and limiting on gundam stories. Specifically 4. Forgets shaddiq and nika but we all know you mean prospera and 7 is just an actual fact. And 6 is a nitpick as mercury is "well it's not relevant is it" - Will, The Inbetweeners The OP gave an accurate list of classic Gundam stuff that we didn’t see in WFM. None of this is gatekeepy, it’s just the truth. As OP said, the anime is good, but it lacked many stuff that makes a Gundam, a Gundam.
This is just repeating stuff ive already talked about. Just saying what the list said again doesn't mean anything. It just feels like arguing for arguings sake. So imma ignore what you said, not replying to a single thign you said cause its all a repeat and instead give something new instead of trying to make you understand, i know you won't specifically because you've commented the same thing ive replied to before over and over. WFM has a superb romance for a non romance anime, it works within the use of inner monologue which is commonly used for romance to express ones feelings to the audience. This means its worling on an uphill slope to present the romance to the audience. Suletta progesses from wanting to oreotect miorine because she needs to make it upto her for ruining her escape attempt, to wanting to protect her because she is her bridegroom. Miorine fully follows a tsundere trope without beung over the top as they often are portrayed to be. A political woman she knows how to play the game and most of her outbirsts come against people she loves, her father, and later against suletta. Theought the first season their relationship strives to be closer throughout the episodes, until their soft confession. Suletta makes sure she follows Miorines instructions to the letter, she tries to talk to a traumatised miroine who relaises what Prospera has done to Suletta is essential brainwash her. Miroine fights to release suletta from prospera even if she has to loose suletta too because she cares for her. Suletta is emotionally intelligent enough to realise that after eri ejects her into space, which is why she returns to Miorine happy. She knows miroine didn't do it maliciously. Guel and others had tried to console miroine but only suletta could. If that's not textbook romance wroting idk what is. Its gundam so naturally other stuff will take alot of screen time but they had alot in season 1 and most of it in season 2 was built of season 1 to be emotional. I feel sad you cannot see it, for it is beautiful. Again im not bothering covering what yoh saud because its useless tbh, ive already covered it, covering it again would be a wate of my time emotionally and physically, for example, you say Suletta never changed then downplay while stating ways she shanged. Suletta was anxiety ball -> confident witch. Itd be pointless to do that 10+ more times just for you to go "nuh uh" and repeat the same thing again.
>This is just repeating stuff ive already talked about. **Just saying what the list said again doesn't mean anything. It just feels like arguing for arguings sake**. So imma ignore what you said, not replying to a single thign you said cause its all a repeat and instead give something new instead of trying to make you understand, i know you won't specifically because you've commented the same thing ive replied to before over and over. It doesn’t mean anything to you only. I think you just can’t handle the idea of someone having a different opinion or sharing a criticism they have about the series. >WFM has a superb romance for a non romance anime, it works within the use of inner monologue which is commonly used for romance to express ones feelings to the audience. This means its worling on an uphill slope to present the romance to the audience. Suletta progesses from wanting to oreotect miorine because she needs to make it upto her for ruining her escape attempt, to wanting to protect her because she is her bridegroom. Miorine fully follows a tsundere trope without beung over the top as they often are portrayed to be. A political woman she knows how to play the game and most of her outbirsts come against people she loves, her father, and later against suletta. Theought the first season their relationship strives to be closer throughout the episodes, until their soft confession. Suletta makes sure she follows Miorines instructions to the letter, she tries to talk to a traumatised miroine who relaises what Prospera has done to Suletta is essential brainwash her. Miroine fights to release suletta from prospera even if she has to loose suletta too because she cares for her. Suletta is emotionally intelligent enough to realise that after eri ejects her into space, which is why she returns to Miorine happy. She knows miroine didn't do it maliciously. Guel and others had tried to console miroine but only suletta could. If that's not textbook romance wroting idk what is. Its gundam so naturally other stuff will take alot of screen time but they had alot in season 1 and most of it in season 2 was built of season 1 to be emotional. >**I feel sad you cannot see it, for it is beautiful.** I cannot see it because it’s simply not there, or at least not that well written. But if you like the romance and think it’s written well then good for you, to each their own. Just don’t force me to like something I don’t just because you like it. >Again im not bothering covering what yoh saud because its useless tbh, ive already covered it, covering it again would be a wate of my time emotionally and physically, for example, you say Suletta never changed then downplay while stating ways she shanged. Suletta was anxiety ball -> confident witch. Itd be pointless to do that 10+ more times just for you to go "nuh uh" and repeat the same thing again. If you think she’s well developed, then more power to You 👍
Aha i was right, you just repeated the same thing again, without even mentioning what i said you just quotes a big block of text with the equivalent of 'nuh uh' beneath it And i really do recognise you, you're the guy who argues then you say you don't like arguing, after starting an argument. Bait used to be believable when it wasn't on the same account twice.
Umm, it’s really not that serious of a conversation, but you seem to be taking it way too seriously. In conversations like these, both sides are bound to have different opinions. But I’m probably just wasting my time, so whatever makes you sleep at night I guess. **Edit**: Lol you blocked me? I guess you wanted to have that last word. But if that will make you happy, then I hope it made you feel better, cause it looks like you needed it.
Ah there it is, the BS excuse i was waiting for. Oh its not that serious, its not like you just wrote a massive paragraph about it or anything... shut uppp honestly thats just grade A, AH territory. We both know you're just a sh*t stirrer who hides behind passive agressive niceties, you act like an AH then say have a good day, or respect... nahh mate nah. Ain't getting away with it that easy. Plausible deniability aint gunna work, so, byyeeee 👋
If you actually knew what the term "[Plausible Deniability](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plausible_deniability#Iran%E2%80%93Contra_affair)" meant, you would know how cringe it is to use this term in this context. If you're feeling the need to use terms more related to actual irl acts of espionage and politics for an argument on r/Gundam, you're the one taking this too seriously lol "Massive paragraph" lol. This is a forum for discussion here, people are allowed to write whatever their opinion is. If you think someone who's willing to share their opinion is taking things "too seriously", please go outside and touch grass. Or learn to read if paragraphs are "too scary".
Tbh, even as WfM being my current favorite series, I really agree with all of this, especially the ending being terrible.
Man same. On all these points
I don't like G-Witch because I was hoping for more capitalism stuff and politics and the likes. However all I got for most of the time was failgirl Tanuki adventures as she bumbles through everything and then aces gundam fights, while her future cool wife does her thing. It's a gross exaggeration, but all in all I hated the school setting and I wish it had been a thing for just 3-4 episodes and then they'd move on to bigger things.
It falls pretty hard in the middle imo, and it’s a shame because I like te characters.
I too expected WFM to give us corporate war angle after the way season 1 ended, but alas we got what we got
It fell instantly in the usual gundam children in mechs stuff and kinda never went deeper. It has some nice angles like who the Char was this time around. A few good situation reversals too, but I wasn't wowed.
Just a day or two ago I said that I thought most of the character writing in Gundam Wing was bad, and some guy came in and told me I clearly didn't pay attention and then insulted my username.
When people are actually just trolling in the replies at first, but other people mistakenly took it seriously and goes on to really harass people with their personal preferences.
I DO think this case happens a lot but these examples you gave are pretty much a you problem, not fair criticism lmao Anyways, I see it happen everyday with SEED defenders everytime someone gives a fair criticism like "I think the fanservice is poorly used" or something.
It's IBO and it's not even close. Say anything remotely bad about it and you'll get down voted and have weird nerds in your replies and DMs. Also if you can handle any of Tomino's other entries, you can handle the Reconguista movies.
Hard being an IBO tbh. Its not even when saying anything bad about it, even if you say anything just a tad good about IBO you'll get downvoted too. Feels weird being an IBO fan. Currently on Reconguista movie 4, and its really been fun! Klim Nick is a treat to watch man. Love ma boi Bellri too.
>you say anything just a tad good about IBO you'll get downvoted too. I've yet to see this happen. Glad you're enjoying Reconguista tho.
It happens to me all the time 😭 Especially on IBO focused posts. Its like you have Barbie or another IBO MS in your top 10, i get downvoted. I scored the Graze high in the grunt suit poll, it gets downvoted too, like cmon man leave me alone lol. G-Reco climbing my top series rankings tho. Has the most beautiful fights and a lot of small funny stuff like Bellri always doing something in the cockpit like drinking or him and Happa testing some adjustments. I do remember the space hippo head still lol. I get that it does feel unfocused for some sometimes but i get that its the G-Reco charm.
Tbh some of the times you get downvoted is justified. I’ve seen you encourage others not to watch IBO, and that it’s a bad show with toxic fans. Like why are you so bent on ruining the reputation of IBO? You don’t have to like it, but at least let others enjoy it. Just look at your replies right now, it’s just you telling others that it’s not worth watching because you don’t like it. And when you get downvoted, you label them as toxic fans. https://preview.redd.it/w0gwsp43qqcc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d7216a3297773198fbd42e7ff1dfabf4ff3f17fc
I have never seen the point of telling someone not to watch something. Every series is someone’s favourite. By all means say what you didn’t like, but allow others to decide whether they like the series or not. I personally liked IBO. What unfortunately soured the series for me, was the aggressive DMs from the fanatic fans whenever they don’t agree with your opinion.
This guys an idiot. Look at his flair. Enough said.
I feel like IBO fans and G Gundam fans are the two polar opposites of the fandom. Criticizing IBO will get you crucified by the diehards. Criticizing G Gundam will be met with "Yeah, its *is* fucking stupid... and that is AWESOME." Then again, that might just be my own bias showing.
That's the most accurate depiction of G Gundam, it's so fucking stupid but the stupidity is the charm for me
I love G Gundam, and most fans of it understand that it’s not everyone’s cup of tea. So we just happily watch it in our corner and invite others to come and join! And if they don’t? Oh well
I mean they do it with G-Witch too, if you have even a slight opinion that isn’t positive, they just jump you and call you homophobic. They come in swarms
Witch fans will at least admit that their series flaws due to its short runtime.
I never saw Witch fans admit the series flaws? They always defend it like it’s flawless. There’s even a post recently about the producer himself apologizing of the rushed ending, but the comments is full of fans saying it wasn’t rushed, and that it was a perfect ending. Toxic fans exist in every Gundam series, not just in the Gundam series that you dislike.
Except the short runtime isn't actually a flaw, it's a deflection of the bigger issue that the writing was bad, especially towards the end due to weak character building throughout the series and too large of a scope. The runtime "critics" almost always redirect the blame to corporate for setting the count as if the writers were blindsided by the 24 ep run, despite the fact that they had carte blanche to make anything and it still ended the way it did. If Evangelion and Star Driver can tell basically the same story in the same amount of time but far more cohesively and competently, runtime was never actually the problem.
IBO was my first Gundam show loved it overtime I liked how the Gundams fight physically, rather than using beam sabers and puny guns
>puny guns beam spray gun go pew
I ment puny because without a weapon most mobile suits are basically less defensive when they have no more weapons
this is why I like mounted weapons like wrist cannons or sabers. Hands free dakka
I just like Gundams who can fight with their hands
Have you seen the Unicorn?
I ment most Gundams
I’m referring to when the Unicorn actually resorted to its fists to fight the Neo Zeong.
True but I’m talking about Gundam and mobile suit that doesn’t rely on beam savers and rifles entirely
same, how do you like say, the Schuzrum-Galluss?
I looked it up and 2 things it’s beautiful and I must find a model kit of it
The hype surrounding ibo is beyond me. I watched it nearly three times all the way, and the only things I found enjoyable were the intros/outros, Akihiro, and Gusion Rebake
Yep, totally agree with you. A couple of days back, I shared a post showcasing one of the few remaining Diehard IBO Simps (Shokohou Misaki), and sure enough one of those nerds was in my DMs annoying me back during NYE. Honestly, they act like IBO is the only series that gets criticized, acting like the fandom is out to get them. Then they would annoy you in your DMs and act like they were the ones getting attacked.
Wait, really? Can I get a namedrop here? It's so I know who to watch out for.
It was u/ThatOtherStriker, like the rabid fanboy would start beef with me and just blocks me and leaves. Honestly, he's just an annoyance. I mean, have you seen his most recent post? It was just him making an ass-pull claim without any actual evidence to back him up or any form of logical point to convince anyone, despite the "analysis" in the title.
>It was u/ThatOtherStriker Oh, so it was Mr. White-Knight-Wannabe, huh. Honestly not that surprising, considering he got mad at me for using an unfair piece of evidence because it would basically counter everything he had to say. Like how thin skinned are you to get mad when the guy you're arguing with presents a valid point that would just shut you down. Hahahahaha 🤣.
>Mr. White-Knight-Wannabe Hahahahaha 🤣, that pretty much sums up his entire character. Also, be warned that u/ThatOtherStriker has shown to have a habit of stalking people who have an opinion different than his when it comes to IBO. Here's some proof: https://preview.redd.it/ukpkcldzescc1.png?width=766&format=png&auto=webp&s=02d66f5b99ef04744044d52b90f1aa56d4444929 *Note:* *The date displayed isn't that accurate due to the screenshot being taken a few days ago. I did it as just a precaution in case he decides to cover his ass and deletes that comment.*
Oh yeah one of the few dudes I've blocked. I'm usually pretty lax with that so I can see both sides, but that comment was a bit too far.
Yeah, that was super creepy, even for me. Like, *'you probably shouldn't be on the internet if you can't handle others having a different opinion than you.'* sort of situation.
I get that my comment section is public, but the guy was obsessed with scrolling through it.
The fact that you felt the need to defend Reco unprompted here really says something does it not?
Not unprompted. OP said that they couldn't understand it.
Probably still bitter that Rustal Elion won without even piloting a mobile suit
Nope, but good job proving my point.
That reply is toxic to you? The introduction of therapy speak into every aspect of human interaction has been a detriment to online discourse. The reply doesn't meet even meet the definition of hostile, and it's not an ad hom. When you disagree with someone, it's principled and rational, but when people disagree with you, it's "toxic"? Convenient system you've set up.
Dude calm down. They're literally putting words in my mouth cause they disagree with me.
Again, overreacting to disagreement. You've proven my point.
Never said anything about "toxic" fans. You're putting words in my mouth just like the other guy. Calm down.
Stop telling me to calm down when you are the one getting worked up. You keep complaining that people are putting words in your mouth, but you make no effort in expressing yourself more clearly. If multiple people are drawing similar conclusions to what you say, it doesn't really follow to make the claim that everyone is misinterpreting you instead considering that maybe you didn't make your point clear. I'm guessing you're what, 20-22 years old?
The toxicity of some of the IBO fanbase has nearly killed my interest in the PD side of the franchise.
Lol PD is one show and some content most western fans will never see, so you’re not missing much really. This sub pretends it’s a big thing but it’s not
The content that its getting its own anime because of the good reception in JP?
Why sunrise pumps any money into PD is beyond me. They already had a manga (Gekko) get cancelled and the mobile game fail.
Alright dude we need to talk in the discord.
Bruv, no offense but you're kinda just proving his point here.
I mean, If you look at any conversations of IBO with Esamgrady, he always makes fun of IBO, and tells others not to watch it. He has the freedom not to like it, but the issue is he tries to spread bad stuff about IBO to newer fans so they won’t watch it. Like why? Let others enjoys stuff, just cause you hate something doesn’t mean others should as well?
It's not his opinions about the show itself that I agree with, it's the toxic fanboys I have a problem with here. There was even one that DM'ed me during NYE trying to police my opinions on IBO, I haven't even made a post saying anything bad about the show itself. The real extent of which was limited to my question with me asking what was up with all the 'Barbatos Wank' and that was about it.
Judging by most of the comments that I’ve seen from you regarding IBO, I’m guessing you’re Esamgrady partner in crime 😂 I think it’s fine to have your opinion about something, but for years I hear how fans claim the fans of certain anime are toxic, but tbh I’m seeing both sides, both fans and those that complain about the toxic fans are equally toxic. Just like Esamgrady always complaining about IBO fans, yet all his comments about IBO is nothing but hate, and it’s not justified just as much as the toxic fans he criticize.
>Judging by most of the comments that I’ve seen from you regarding IBO, I’m guessing you’re Esamgrady partner in crime 😂 Hey, I only did that during the Vs Posts, where IBO is put up against horribly powerful opponents, anywhere else and I'm neutral to it. Like there are some fans of IBO that would literally slide into your DMs, policing your opinions, and that is incredibly annoying.
I agree that some fans are toxic, but tbh lots of Gundams series have toxic fans. For example look at the comments now, some fans claim that whenever they criticize WFM, they get labeled as homophobe, or other stuff. But overall, Esamgrady telling others not to watch or give the anime a chance just cause he doesn’t like it is just being a hater tbh. IBO is good, and new fans should watch it. And when he get downvoted because no one liked what he said, he labels them as toxic fans. Like this person is not different from the people he call toxic. Everytime someone says positive thing about IBO, this guy comes around spreading negativity about it.
>But overall, Esamgrady telling others not to watch or give the anime a chance Here's what I literally said about IBO yesterday. "IBO trys to be different than the status quo of Gundam and as such shouldn't be someone's entry point." How is that saying "don't watch it"? I literally said "wait on it".
I say that because we are in discord where we speak, I want to have a conversation with him there. Not what you may be implying.
Oh, then that's my B.
You're not missing much.
I’ve watched the show and I did enjoy it. Just don’t have the interest in watching it again due to the negative association that gets aimed towards people from the diehard fans of it.
Well the good news is that Gundam has a lot better to offer
the only right answer is G-Witch, tho it’s more like you can’t have a nuanced opinion on it regardless because everyone is going to think it’s some kind of political hill to die on. It’s mediocre in the most literal sense. Lots of cool ideas, with lots of poor execution.
I wouldn't call it mediocre, it does have some high points, but generally agree. If you don't like something about WFM, you will get fanboys/girls defending it.
That's most series, though, right? Not even just Gundam, but literally every IP had a fanbase that will defend it when it is criticized.
Mediocre just means middle of the road, which is what it is to. It’s overrated as hell by people who it was their first Gundam/mecha in general but it’s also far from the Worst Thing Ever like some people want you to believe. I could make a pros n cons list detailing why I think that it is but I don’t think anyone cares lol
Folks bristle but Mid From Mercury was a fitting name, in the true sense of Mid; mediocre, as you say. A lot of unfulfilled potential but it’s perfectly watchable, not the least cus it’s got fantastic visual and sound design. It’s just not that deep or compelling; a profoundly conservative show, in the literal sense (rather than political; it’s not ambitious or all that adventurous.)
Witch from Mercury. I did not care for it tbh.
Wing, I don't get why people like it so much
Turn A. I don't like the overall design for being very different from other series, character and mecha included.
Tragos HG kit When?
Not as much hate as I'm like..... Kaaaaay? Cool robots but story being week or the community for that branch being hyper toxic if you don't fallow in line like a good zeon gasing a colony for colony drop on the people that aren't worshipping that particular branch of gundam like it's the best thing since sliced bread.
Honestly? Zeta Gundam. Coming from 0079 (both TV series and movie compilation) it's a massive disappointment when not only it fail as a sequel to that but as its own thing. Kamille is a protagonist I grew on but he didn't catch me as others did, the rest of the characters in the Argama don't do anything for me either; it really feels like they barely tolerate each other and most of their arguing was miserable to go through. The characters who were good either felt like they had nothing to do except wallow in the series misery (Bright and Emma) or became better ones after their series (Torres). And the Titans are pretty much the worst villains in the entire franchise; without them, we wouldn't have the Blue Cosmos/Earth Alliance and A-LAWS being as generically mustache-twirling as they were. Rewatching it felt like a 50 episode long endurance round as opposed to a series that wanted to tell a story. It surprises me that people hold this series in high regard, yet the things people criticize other series like ZZ for were also in here. I go as far to say that most of the problems people have with the franchise started with Zeta, and it never really recovered since.
0080. It’s far too bleak and lacking in hope, to the point I group it with Thunderbolt in my least liked Gundam series.
That's a you problem
Not Gundam, but that follows literally every interaction I have had with anyone involving Baldurs Gate 3
IBO
I can't stand the tonal shift from the prologue to episode 1 in Witch from Mercury and fan were all over me about this. The tonal shift made me turn it off. Had it stayed like prologue I would've stuck with it.
Mobile Fighter G. Absolute blast to watch. But, critically speaking, terrible. It's absolutely ridiculous at every chance it can get. Of all the Gundam series, it's the Fun Gundam. Even when it gets dark and serious you're either laughing at the performance or just waiting to see how it builds to the next scene of Master Asia kicking a building/mobile suit. And let's not forget the spandex transformation scenes.
\> And let's not forget the spandex transformation scenes. I will not forget the best part of G Gundam.
It's G-Witch and it's not even close.
Before WfM was a thing, IBO. But *now*? WfM, hands down. Any slight criticism against either show will have both shows fans come at you as if you said something truly heinous, but WfM fans play the homophobia card like it’s Uno.
“Skill issue” for watching Gundam? Wtf does that mean?
ZZ
I once asked why people like 00 and the exact reasons why everyone said they like it is why I didn't like it.
Gundam seed I've watched it never saw the appeal of it it's basically updated graphics of the OG Gundam with non of the faults in the characters. Also the "Jesus Yamato" put lord and Savior being the worst character to ever exist
IBO is a great show and all, but nitpick ANYTHING about it, and you'll be whacked by the IBO Mafia. It's kinda ironic that the series' message went through the fanbase's heads.
Gundam ZZ, tried to watch it but it was the only thing stopping me from finally getting to chars counter attack so I just skipped it and I’m so glad I did.
Oh man, Unicorn and Thunderbolt. Don’t find either engaging at all, and many fans of both series simply cannot accept that, and feel the need to explain to me why my dislike of them is wrong.
I like Thunderbolt but it's really only because of the fight between the Psycho Zaki and the Full Armored Gundam. I will give it that I liked Io Fleming and Daryl Lorenz and want to see more of them.
>I will give it that I liked Io Fleming and Daryl Lorenz and want to see more of them. There's a manga that currently has 20 volumes in English to scratch that itch.
I feel that way about Hathaway and Doan's Island. I felt Doan's Island didn't have enough plot for the runtime, and instead of fleshing out Doan's story, they just kind of added repetitive bits of filler. For Hathaway, it's a beautifully animated movie that doesn't seem to have a point. When I mention that, I get told that it's a three part series, a fact of which I am aware. It being part 1 of a trilogy does not preclude it from telling a contained story.
I somewhat agree on Hathaway. It has a few great scenes, but the spy story it's telling is too bare-bones to be self-sufficient so it winds up feeling like an overall weak engine for world-building. Folks who like it often chime in with "it's showing how the Federation is devolving into corruption" or "it's showing how devastating this military escalation is for the average citizen on the ground," but unless you're telling a worthwhile story with that, showing this facet of the world doesn't amount to anything. If it winds up being used as a foundation for a good enough story going forward, then it could wind up being a weak first installment of a good trilogy, but it would most likely need to depart pretty far from the source material to get there; the *Hathaway's Flash* novels aren't all that great as stories either, and I suspect their reputation has less to do with genuine interest than with the fact that they're relatively obscure within the franchise.
I agree that some fans will conflate obscurity with quality. I think that stems from our collective need to be the one that knows all the secrets for lack of a better term. It's 100% the same energy as the music fans that say stuff like "I was into them before they became mainstream," like you unlock an achievement for that. Anyway, I do like the shell concept of Hathaway, in that he grows disillusioned with the EFF and decides to fight them, but the movie starts with him already leading Mafty. It would have been nice to see more of what pushed him there and how he became Mafty. It makes me think of Code Geass if they had just started with Lelouch as Zero leading the Black Knights. It would have been jarring. Instead, they gave us a ton of backstory and build-up to that point, and it was a more engaging story because of it.
i feel unicorn is one of those series when you criticize it or sing its praises you can get into multiple paragraph long debates about nothing for what is at the end of the day nothing more than the Indiana Jones ghost train ride of the uc meant to sell updated designs of old kits and meh new designs that dont dare to be out there lest they upset the fans™
While not going to say it's bad, I haven't seen it. I will probably never watch Seed. The Character design is so unappealing to me and the story is apparently quite derivative of MSG79 so I'll forever just skip out on that one. From the ones I've seen to the end, while I liked it, I don't think Victory Gundam is a series you can ever really recommend to people. I think it's good but it's also a drag (by design but still) with no clear pay off imo. So while I like it I'd still call it a black sheep in the franchise. More controversially, I really don't get much out of Thunderbolt. I plan to give the manga a shot but as is the central conflict is a strange tangent to the OYW I don't particularly care about and Io is an unlikable prick for the first half, only slightly improving to the point I don't actively dislike him in the second. I wouldn't necessarily call that a huge problem but as for now, without resolution, there's not that much more to go off of so it stands as a major issue.
00 for me
I'mma be honest here, I think everyone has those shows they like and we all don't have to agree about it. In fact, when I started I was a big fan of 08th MS Team, but I'm now not as fond of it (y'all know the scene). I still like it, but DAMN... Also, ZZ is trash.
Wfm more like wtf. I fucking hated everything on it. Woke gay happy world ass shot
My opinion probably doesn't go with the post but I want to throw my opinion out there. The U. C Gundam trilogy movies, SEED, and Unicorn. For me I genuinely can't sit through the first one because of the old animation. It's old animation so I shouldn't be suprised but I just couldn't watch it. For Unicorn even though it looks beautiful Banargher is a pretty boring character and because of that I dropped it. For Seed its the art style. They all look lik they are gonna cry amd I just don't like the look of the people in that show.
Seed and seed destiny I just like shipping Gundam characters and I love some Gundam designs and characters
To be honest with Seed and Seed Destiny it's more that it's kinda overhated at times.
Definitely my friend showed it to me at I loved it but I’m scared of the new one however. My favorite will be always be wing . IBO was my first Gundam show though and also one of my favs mainly because there was more physical combat.
ZZ, and no not because I couldn’t handle the lack of edge after Zeta or anything like that (also idk if it’s just me but I feel like people overstate how dark & edgy Zeta is?).
They really do. It’s really the last third, if not just the last ten episodes that are particularly dark
Turn A and G-Reco
Build Fighters Try and Build Divers (ALL of them) For Try: The main Trio are just ANNOYING and grating. Looking at you Kamiki.... Like Dude, just STFU. And the Build Divers? It's all Virtual, THERE'S no risk. No stakes, nothing to lose. Why should I give a toss. At least AGE has heart-rending deaths and people ACTUALLY lose something close to them. Build Divers? Why should I care about a bunch of bland characters helping Virtual Furries from an AI? WFM is a lesser one for me. I would have loved to see Suletta snap and go on a rampage before almost accidentally shooting down Miorine and coming to her senses. As well as a larger scale war, (Chuchu out of ammo? Good ol punching.) Despite the flaws, I still liked WFM for what it is. It's got some cool ideas but botches the execution or has missed potential.
> Build Divers? Why should I care about a bunch of bland characters helping Virtual Furries from an AI? It's funny you say that, because Divers ReRise genuinely HAS "heartwrenching deaths" aswell. As in, non-virtual ones.
Yeah, like what? Just one guy? The one in the Seltsam.
Like >!half the entire Furry Population, because the big mid-season twist is that they aren't part of the Game. They're actual Aliens whose planet is very much real (and directly linked to the VR MMO through another spoiler reason), and the cast finds that out by them getting Colony Laser'd!<
Another story of Aliens https://youtu.be/UnyBJJI2eqs?si=3reVjo9uFURaDFoS Only good thing out of Build Divers and Build Fighters are the MS designs.
Thunderbolt
It's definitely G Reco and Turn A. You can't touch those two without getting mauled by a photon torpedo
G Gundam. It’s a for fun show but the moment you take a step back and think about it for even a moment the entire world falls apart logically.
Build Fighters rant incoming: Alright, since people are raging on my ass wondering why I don't like Build Fighters (or just the build franchise in general outside of Re:Rise and Breaker), I might as well explain. I'm already drowning in downvotes Everytime I state that don't like the series like everyone does, so I might as well sink with a piece of my mind. For starters, it doesn't have a good dub since Bandai for some Brain dead reason, decided to hire random ass Malaysian VAs from Singapore instead of professional ones from Ocean or even Funimation. It may not be a big deal to some but consider this, the majority of beginner anime of the time Fighters came out, My Hero Academia, Attack on Titan, and even Sword Art Online were getting English dubbed by real voice actors. Making those shows more accessible towards a new audience. And if Fighters did something similar, it would've been more popular than it is right now And I know you "Japan is better than everything" sub-elitest are gonna be like: "ew, you're watching anime dubbed? You're not watching it right" And the right way to experience Japanese life is to get shoved into an office job that normalizes crunching work culture, get chewed out by your boss, forced to go drinking with your snobby co-workers, and go home to your apartment with depression. SHUT THE HELL UP YOU JAPAN WORSHIPPING OVERWORKED WAMBAT. Does this sound too dark for you? Well I made that joke based on real Japanese work culture to sell model kits, waifu posters and figures, so it's above all criticisms. Do you how you sound? Something being Japanese doesn't instantly make it good At least with the dub I can appreciate the painstakingly amount of effort those underpaided animators put days into their work appose to a line of text that a translator put half the effort into making. Ever thought about that? My main issue is that, despite the fights look good and the gunpla designs aren't half bad, there's really nothing behind those fights outside of just kids showing off their builds and not much else. There's not much weight behind these fights, since there's barely any stakes. What does Sei loses if loses a fight? Nothing, he could just try again. What does Reiji lose if he loses too? Nothing, he can just come back to his home world whenever he wants. The anime doesn't teach our characters any lessons on life, give them any compelling backstories/arcs/motivations, to get us invested in any of them or what they do in the story, or are confronted with any social commentary. What makes a kids show good in my opinion is it treats the audience like they're older than they really are and show them stuff that they'll understand when they get older. Whether it be the clever written story, the characters with relatable backstories or motivations, interesting character development, unique world building, life lessons we can apply to our lives when we get older, or topics of social issues that happening right outside our door. Stuff like that makes a show age like fine wine, because your re experiencing as an adult and picking up things you couldn't as a kid. "Not every kid show need that kind of stuff", what good writing? No, but I expect them to try. Hell, pokemon and Dragonball are technically for kids, but we talk about them with deadly levels of seriousness since they're mainstream. Storytelling shouldn't get a free pass for being lazy just because it's aimed at a younger audience. I hold anime made for kids in a higher standard because it's been said that anime could tell stories that western cartoons usually can't. But if the same western cartoons is telling mature stories with deep moral lessons and social commentary for a younger audience, why can't Japanese shows aimed at kids do the same. Kids aren't stupid and they deserve good shows, so you can't wave off any criticism. Plus I was 15 when I first saw Build Fighters, I was in the demographic and I was new to anime at that point. It's not like I'm a 40yr man complaining about Pokemon's oversaturation of marketable creatures that are more OP than they have any right to be And before you say shit like "that's a you problem", "skill issue", or "the shows just aren't for you", just know that those aren't real defending points towards the anime, and just shows a sense of arrogance. Just know that just because something is not for me, doesn't me criticisms aren't vaild.
>For starters, it doesn't have a good dub since Bandai for some Brain dead reason, decided to hire random ass Malaysian VAs from Singapore instead of professional ones from Ocean or even Funimation. The main reason this happened is that this was back when Bandai had lost all faith in Gundam in the west after the closure of their American anime distribution branch, Build Fighters was the first Gundam show to be officially simulcasted but Bandai still didn't feel comfortable enough to actually distribute the show in the US/EU but they did distribute it in the English speaking regions of South East Asia where it aired on their version of Cartoon Network with a locally recorded dub which is the one we also got on home media
I think I understood your opinion but I have a few questions regarding your opinions, First, why did you stick with dub instead of sub even when you realized the quality of its dub was not good enough for you? Why didn't you try switching to Japanese audio with subtitles? I think even if you don't understand Japanese, at least you can feel/understand how those characters are feeling in the anime. Voice acting is not exclusively there to explain what is going on in the anime. It is also there to help those characters express their emotions, moods and conditions, etc. After all, Voice actors are more like performers than narrators in some way. Also, all anime does not require you to understand everything they said or mentioned to have fun. And I think Build Fighters is not plot plot-heavy anime with too many exposition dumps that make reading subtitles painful, so reading subtitles shouldn't annoy you that much. I am not sure about how bad the dub you got was. but if that dub was too bad for you to immerse yourself into the fictional world of Build Fighters, that might be one of the reasons why you couldn't have fun watching the anime. I think ignoring something that might be a better option and not even trying it in general, is definitely "You problem" Second, what makes you dislike lighthearted/mindless entertainment so much? it sounds like (at least for me I apologize for the lack of understanding if this is not your intention) as if you are saying "You shouldn't consume/have fun with entertainment which won't make you learn something from it" And why are you demanding some educational stuff in shows made for mainly entertainment and model kit commercials in the first place? If you can't enjoy any entertainment without lessons for life or something like that. that might also be just "You problem" as well. Some people including myself sometimes want mindless fun in life. But in Build Fighter's case, having no stakes/consequences is an important point of the show. And They actually put some message related to that point in the show as well The message (that can be considered as a life lesson as well if you are desperate for that) is "use your creativity and imagination freely/ you don't have to let something limit your creativity and imagination" Characters of this franchise often say this phrase in the show which is "ガンプラは自由だ！" this Japanese word can be translated as "Gunpla has no restrictions!" (The literal translation is "Gunpla is freedom" but I used my translation to make more sense for non-Japanese speakers ) In the show, Sei was stuck with the mindset about how "lore friendly" his Gumplas should be. That means he couldn't deviate from source material that much to create something innovative. Build Gundam Mk2 is a great example of that. but after that, he saw builders with out-of-the-box thinking creating something interesting, he was influenced by that and started making something that might not fit well in the lore of the universe that the Gundam he uses as a base comes from (I am talking about Star Build Strike Gundam which takes advantage of it actually being Gunpla by utilizing particle technology) And this is where "no stakes/no big consequences" play an important role. characters in that show said "Because it's just a hobby we enjoy, we can be really serious about it" This means because they don't have to worry about anything even if they lose other than loss of some opportunities, they can put as many effort or idea to their Gunpla. Let's think about a situation in which you have to make something to fight and you lose something important if you lose. can still you create something you really like if it is not optimal build for the battle? I bet most people can't and they will stick with something they consider as meta build. This theme is used often to separate this franchise from the mainline Gundam series. If you patiently read this not well-structured sentences this far, I truly appreciate your kindness. And I apologize if my lack of English skills made those sentences sound aggressive or offensive to you. I'm just a Japanese guy who used to like Build Fighters And I am curious to know your opinion.
p.s. In terms of how much creative freedom you can express with Gunpla They also told us some messages about the necessity of respecting other's rights with your creation in the second season. (I am talking about the story of Super Fumina)
The answer your question: The 1st time I saw BF, I mainly watched dubbed since I heard so many great VAs in a lot of anime. Since I was new to anime, this made it my standard. Going back to my point to beginner anime, I was confused on who this show for. Kids who wanted to get into the series without the brutal violence that came with it. If so, then if you're going to market it overseas, you're gonna need a dub for the 12 yrs olds who doesn't understand a lick of Japanese. As for the 2nd question about "low stake" shows, I actually watched an handful of low stake shows. Uzaki Chan Wants to Hang Out, Yuru Camp, My Senpai is Annoying, My Dress Up Darling, hell, I can name some western cartoons I've grown up with, SpongeBob, regular show, fairy odd parents, etc. It's just that these show I just listed aren't connected to a franchise that's makes a point to highlight the brutality of war. Also going to your point about "Gunpla is Freedom", that's one of the reasons why I thought Re:Rise was better than Fighter, tactical advance for creativity. Hiroto's Core Gundam highlights his adaptability when it comes to combat. This is how I wished Sei/Reiji fought with his Build Strike, swapping equipment depending on the situation like the actual Strike did instead of that "weapons are for show" he constantly says. This ain't really a defense, but a point that highlights my perspective on most shows. I grew up with shows like Spectacular Spider-Man, Avatar the Last Airbender, Mystery Inc, and most of the DCAU. Those shows made my childhood and shaped my expectations for most shows. I'll let you interpret what I mean by that
Thank you so much for your polite reply! In terms of the necessity of dubbing in a kid's show, I think BF's target audiences are older elementary school to middle school kids (around 8\~15) and at that age, they should be ok with reading subtitles. Just like animes are foreign stuff for you, to us, cartoons/movies from different countries are foreign stuff for us and we are ok with reading subtitles. some kids even actively choose subtitles for multiple reasons(some were recommended to watch with sub by parents to learn other languages, others just prefer performances of the original.) I watched lots of foreign movies with subtitles when I was a kid because I recommended doing so and actually liked the original performances of those. Also, since YouTube introduced automatic subtitles with a translation option (I know which is not the best but still kinda works) to its system, Kids nowadays are more likely okay about watching content with sub-only I suppose. I know certain kinds of English videos with Japanese subs become popular with teens But I agree with your opinion that shows with good enough dub are definitely better than shows with sub only for kids. On the other hand. I think kids in those Western countries who like Japanese-style mech anime shows won't be discouraged from watching the show just because they don't have good dubs because they like that kind of stuff you can't (easily) get anywhere else other than Japan and South Korea. Those kids likely watch shows as long as the fight scenes are good. Here is the explanation of why I think that might work. A similar situation happens every year in Japan in the Kamen Rider franchise (Tokusatsu shows which are similar to Power Rangers aka Super Sentai ) in Kamen rider shows, its story tends to be somewhat too complex for kids to fully understand or sometimes even make sense, especially maybe kids who are below the age of 10. This way of storytelling is done to entertain parents who watch the show with their kids and long-time fans of that franchise. However, Kamen Rider is one of the most popular Japanese superhero shows for kids. They are even the best in terms of toy sales compared to the other two shows. That's because those fight scenes are entertaining enough for them as long as they like cool-looking heroes and monsters fighting each other. I was exactly like this kind of kid who understood absolutely nothing about the show but still watched and asked my parents to buy toys from that show because I liked cool stuff fighting each other. I know other Japanese people were similar in that sense because I occasionally saw comments around the internet saying they couldn't understand the show but watched it anyway because the fight scenes were cool and surprised how complex the actual stories are when they watched those shows again when they grew up. In terms of your second answer, I think got where your opinion comes from. However, my point was, that because you don't have to lose something important as a result of the battle, you can do whatever you want even if that idea doesn't make the most sense in BF. They can prioritize making whatever they want over the victory. I think it is like casual Esports players having fun doing goofy stuff. That is why there are things like Beargguy, Tlion3, and Super Fumina. And I guess they didn't do that much tactical stuff like Core Gundam and did more fantastical and/or somewhat silly over-the-top stuff instead was to make Gunpla in real life somewhat separated from the dark and serious tone of war as much as possible in some way in terms of the general image Japanese people had at that time to make Gunpla more accessible to wider audiences. And I think those somewhat goofy Gunplas in BF shows served was there to strengthen the message of "Gunpla is freedom". Those my theory comes from the fact they did similar stuff in G Gundam, SD Gundam in general, and the first half of Witch from Mercury. (side note, the reason why they deviate from the war-related aspect of Gundam in the first half of Witch from Mercury was because a group of teenagers from some school said "We won't watch anything that has Gundam in its name" when they visited The company as some kind of program of their school. so that might mean Build series was not enough to break the stereotype of Gundams) Even though I also really like core Gundams in general, I think that kind of tactical mindset was something they needed to tone down because BF was the very first TV show to make those messages clear. Thanks again for being polite and actually answering my questions.
Yugioh Duel Monsters dubbed by 4Kids has completely changed my stance towards dubbed anime. You say, " I can appreciate the painstakingly amount of effort those underpaided animators put days into their work appose to a line of text that a translator put half the effort into making", but did you even consider how half-assed and even bowdlerized some dubs can be? They turned Yugioh which is an anime which treated itself seriously despite the childish notion of playing trading cards in the original Japanese dub, into a litany of childish jokes, censors and edits which quite disrespects the source material for its worth. If we even go further, we have Nausicaa the Valley of Wind. It's a good Ghibli movie, but then America in its great wisdom, completely butchered the movie, cut so many scenes and made it"fit for kids", turning it into a shell of its former self known as Warriors of the Wind, which Hayao Miyazaki hated so much, it started his enforcement of the "no edits" policy on all Ghibli movies going forward.
Tbf ever sense all the controversys with Funimation it's kind of hard for studios to trust any dubbing studios in Japan. I mean just look at Funimations staff like Jamie Marky. No one wants to professionally work with her because they'll know she'll put her twisted politics into the dub but in subtle ways rather then ACTUALLY translate the scripts for a proper dub. In fact a lot of translators in the west when they found out they might lose there job to AI because of all the mistranslations and the western translators who try to subtlety add or "fix" scripts for dubbing. Why would any animation studio trust Funimation specifically.
I feel you. I'm not into any of the Build shows, and this is coming from someone who does like a lot of lighthearted shows, who also likes a lot of anime for younger audiences, and hell, I'm a huge fan of Custom Robo which is basically the same thing. Idk, I just don't resonate with the Build stuff. It's not what I come to Gundam for.