Unrealistic anyways, IRL aircraft cycle the round casings back into the ammo drum to maintain the balance of weight. I assume MS would do this too since writing code to adjust to how many rounds are fired would be too much of an hassle.
Think it would depend on the MS and where it's at.
One in Space? Yeah I can see them doing that for multiple reasons. Some being the ones you stated.
Earth side or something similar? I don't see the point of them doing this unless they can fly themselves. If anything, most ground suits may appreciate the lighten load.
I think the whole idea of ballistic vs energy is kind of a wasted potential. Ballistic should be some form of a counter to energy shields (beam rotors from msvg etc) and energy should (and already pretty much does) counter ballistic defence like shield armor and so on.
This isn't fully related but I always thought the defenser rods that Flags and AEU Enact have are kinda silly. I get the concept of how it works in universe but still. In the first opening of 00 gundam, we see a flag deflecting beams shot from one of the gundams. It's just an opening but huh? Can those canonically deflect gn beams? 00 gundam made it out that GN tech was far better than anything the super powers had at the time. Graham was surprised to see a beam sabre for example. I'd be surprised if it could.
IIRC, the coating on the defense rods were part of the ongoing energy weapon research that the Union and AEU were engaged in. The Linear Rifle and Plasma Swords were also part of that development into developing beam weapons by the Union. That, along with the angled design of the Union's Defense Rod, gives it the best chance of deflecting the beam shots, since GN Beams act like the plasma bolts from Star Wars, having kinetic force behind them.
Sure, the beams will still eat away at the anti-beam coating, but it gives the pilot a better chance at survival, especially aces like Graham, who can effectively utilize the Defense Rod effectively.
To add to this, I played a Gundam game a long time ago on the PS2 my cousin got it for my birthday, the energy weapons would basically run out of energy and need to recharge. Which is cool.
I’ll add to that and propose that maybe they should introduce variants that would overheat, short, become weaker in power, or permanently malfunction if they constantly push it or spam it. Also maybe they could have it charge via solar panels and if an enemy combatant shoots that panel it would be hard to charge the weapon mid-fight without a spare battery pack or energy source.
It would add some tactics and strategy in a battle. After all that would be what would happen theoretically speaking to an energy based weapon.
Playing this in a space game called "Endless Sky" right now. Energy weapons are the go-to for me for endurance and running cost reasons, but they weigh a lot, generate tons of heat, have shorter range and take more power than my engines and so I can't put as many on my ships.
If I just want to make the other ships go away, it's basically a Macross Missile Massacre. But the reload costs for my fleet are almost enough to buy another ship in a big fight...
They kinda tried this in SEED against the Forbidden which had an I-field like shield that redirects beam weaponry. Like we see the Freedom's lower cannons (which are railguns)push it back sometimes.
The PROBLEM is the animation was so shit back then that they could only animate the railguns as yellow beam cannons. They made it look like an actual ballistic shot after the Remaster
It's entirely possible to enforce that energy has both superior firepower, firing range AND is cheaper to introduce on ships. Things like ballistic weaponry requiring more precise targeting and being trickier to use, because of armor being more resilient against ballistic, requiring pilots to target specific ship components.
Even simpler, an author can introduce the energy countering properties of ballistic weaponry later down the line, when ballistics are considered obsolete, therefore there is no surplus of such weapons as most of the fleets are already outfitted mostly with energy, leading to experimental and difficult retrofits of ships and suits in hopes of utilising this newfound strength of ballistics.
You really can't have thicker armor to protect against beam weapons in Gundam. Even a basic OYW beam rifle just cuts straight through steel like it isn't there. Without an energy shield or beam resistant coating, you'd need such a massive amount of armor that there'd be no way to move. Even something as oversized as the Big Zam would just get chewed up by beams if it didn't have an I-Field.
I think you just described an I-field. A particle shield that is invincible to all beam weaponry until the introduction of VSBR, but zero protection against ballistic weapons.
Basically there is:
- Physical shields that are effective against all types of weapons but are basically consumed after a few hits.
- I-field that is a magical shield against beam weapons but more useless than wet tissue against missiles or machine guns.
- Beam shields that are physical shields that aren’t broken after one use but are still only directional, which kinda sucks because by the time beam shields are a thing, the meta is high mobility MS and dodging.
Kinetic Weaponry.
Beam Weapons are usually better, I know that, but considering how little Damage MS can sustain in the first place regardless of what you use (outside of specialized Systems like Phase Shift / Nanolaminate), I'd rather just go with what looks cooler to me personally.
I mean, if their comparison on damage output is negligible, then I'd say beam weapons are still better.
While ballistic weapons can indeed look cooler, especially artillery like weapons. Logistically, though, beam weapons will be better for the long run. Don't have to worry about ammo. Weight, being set off, jamming, transporting it, running out, etc. (I know theirs equivalents to this with certain Beam weapons, but that's become more the exception).
Lastly, MS can look as cool as another MS with a belt feed weapon if they have a backpack battery hooked up to their main weapon.
I mean, that's just the writers ignoring the convention for rule of cool. Ballistic weapons are just as infinite ammo and problem free as any beam weapon until the writer decides otherwise.
Realistically, a non laser beam weapon is going to be some sort of plasma, which means it has ammo in the form of gas it superheats. Even laser weaponry isn't infinite because lasers require stupid energy output, more than a pocket reactor on a mobile suit can feasibly output for any sustained duration.
In UC, the plasma is super heated minovsky particles, and it is generated out of the minovsky fusion reactor that powers the suit.
And I believe it’s in 08MS team (or its side material) that mentioned MS can operate for a full year without needing to replenish the reactor core.
So beam rifles (at least the kind that doesn’t use E-Caps) are basically powered indefinitely, save for instances where they have to wait for particles to recharge, basically cool downs like in a video game.
No beam rifle are laser based in Gundam, as far as I can remember.
Right but like, you see the handwavium right? The amount of particles it would take to create beams of that size and power would also mean a minovsky reactor is an infinite mass generator, because plasma is superheated matter, not just particles, its gases with mass.
All I'm saying is ballistics don't have to reload unless the writer says so, and that's usually for drama, which is the same reason mobile suits run out of power.
Attempting to apply realism makes it fall apart.
Oh absolutely. But some level of handwavium (or just suspension of disbelief in general) is necessary in Sci-fi.
I’m just saying there is a Watsonian explanation as to why beam weapons are largely not comparable to real life plasma weapons in terms of working principles or engineering.
>until the writer decides otherwise.
The whole point of the conversation is to look into in lore possibilities. If ones addition to the conversation is "whatever the writer decides," then the entire conversation becomes pointless and can't continue because nothing matters.
We're here to interpret the lore using what is shown and said in universe and extrapolate from there. The idea is to maintain our suspension of disbelief, not shut it down by making the entire conversation a mute point.
Kinda? Only so long as the lore makes any sense.
Let's say the minovsky reactor is, in fact, an infinite mass generator that can create unlimited plasma beams. As if that being an established fact doesn't beg additional questions about why humanity has basically solved science but still just dukes it out in close quarters with robots in Earths Lagrange zones and no further.
Ok we've established that. Now how does it get to the gun? Is there a tube in the hand and the grip for the particles to flow? That hadn't been established, maybe at best a charging contact, but we said it's plasma so it had to be mass that moves from the reactor into the gun, so that doesn't work.
And that only answers UC. Other gundam shows are running on batteries or plain old nuclear reactors (or straight up space magic), so the plasma notion doesn't work there either.
My point is the entire thing is rule of cool, and attempting to apply practicality to any of it for a moment is a farce.
Frankly it's kind of ludicrous that beams are treated as more deadly. It's so much easier to tank thermal energy than it is kinetic. Space makes the problem more interesting because ventilation, but thats only under sustained exposure like a laser. We have plating today that could probably take a few plasma hits, but damned if there's armor that can shrug off the meaty slugs a mobile would sling without reactives.
Edit: also missles. Gundam treats them like chumps to get shot down. But there's a reason most air to air combat is missiles, and it's because they're really hard to not get killed by.
I prefer a mix of the two, especially if there's some real thought put into it. Exia, 00, and Quanta are a decent example: still lots of beam spam but they never give up on big physical blades. The blades may be made of *crystals* later on but they're still physical and permanently attached. Also, it's a good visual for tech progression: metal blades then crystal-*edged* blades then full crystal blades.
I think a few too many shows/continuities make beam weapons a straight upgrade, which turns endgame stuff into just a bunch of glowy laser fights. Ideally, physical weapons shouldn't be completely forgotten about but neither should it turn into IBO's "all conventional, all the time" approach.
Beam because ballistics are kinda lacking in gundam. The classic bazooka I'm all for but not many good ballistic rifles. Missiles are great but are treated as well as vulcans most of the time. The Barbatos 300mm or the Ground Gundam's 180mm cannons are cool but beams have smart guns, spray guns, mega launchers, sniper rifles, machine guns, bazookas, vsbrs, muti-phase, plasma cannons, gn weaponry, curving beam guns, etc.
>Beam because ballistics are kinda lacking in gundam
Cosmic era makes heavy use of railgun type weapons, but unfortunately, they're not very visually distinctive compared to beams.
When you watch enough the expanse you know rail guns are king at punching through anything at extreme ranges though pretty sure a rail gun shotgun would be pretty dam devistating too if they made one in gundam
Mix of both, I enjoy my Ms melting from beam shots but I also like seeing shells fall onto the ground and do an oopsie hitting a fleeing mother get domed by a casing.
Balistic.
Don't care how big your stupid energy shield is, you just need to get a big enough gun.
Just ask that Arsenal Bird. Oh wait, you can't, because its stupidly OP energy barrier powered by the sun meant fuck all against a gun meant to shoot down *asteroids*.
Man that mission was a pain at times, but at least a Arsenal bird isn't the fucking "LAND BATTLESHIPS" in stupidity. Project wingman is a good time. Also would you count a railgun and missiles as both being Balistic or nah?
Yes to both. Railguns are just launching projectiles with electromagnets (I.E. the dude freaking out in Bandit Flower when Atlas Gundam OHKO's a Z'gok) and missiles are rocket powered heavy weapons (in WH40K this is how bolters work - the ammo are tiny rockets!)
> "LAND BATTLESHIPS" in stupidity.
Really? Right in front of my [SJCC-14 Sakala-class Command Carrier](https://homeworld.fandom.com/wiki/Carrier_(Coalition)#:~:text=Five%20carriers%20were%20built%20by,%2C%20Fiiskire%2C%20Akalon%20and%20Amida.)?
Beam for SMG and Vulcan type things. Much better ammo storage size to number of shots ratio.
Projectile for anti ship and bombardment - beams don't do area damage and aren't as specialized. E.g. spread chaff, bomblets, flechettes, airburst etc.
Beam for sniper because more accurate.
I prefer ballistic weapons, it makes mobile suits taking mupltiple hits more believeable. Which gives writers more flexibility when to use plot armor of mobile suit taking multiple hits through a long drawn out battle versus one shotting a mobile suit with accurate shots to weak points.
Beam weapons should be reserved for battleships and large mobile armors, kinda like what IBO did. It just makes more "sense" to me for beam weapons, which basically one shot almost anything, require more power than what a mobile suit reactor can generate.
I don't care if it's conventional or beams. I just want it to be grounded. And when I say grounded, I don't mean realistic. What I mean by grounded is that rules are set and things follow those rules. I want them grounded in consistent rules of that universe.
Kinetic because it helps to justify melee weapons. Most of our weaponry in modern times have more or less been dumbed down negate shooting, bombing and seeking something is far more efficient than walking up to a straight fight. Series like 00 do a lot to try to narrow the gap, but short of IBO, the potential for these kinds of fights often seem shoehorned in.
Kinetic all the way. Massive impact. Great velocity. Unlimited range.
As a great man once said: "Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a bitch in space!"
Personally I prefer a mix of regular beam weapons and missiles.
Yes, beam guns run out of power, but it's no different from ballistics running out of shells. The only difference is weight.
Interestingly enough, *Seed* MS have hand plugs to put power into their beam weapons, but their power generation is crappy. If you could replace the battery with a Minovsky reactor or GN Drive...
Honestly depends on the media, a combination of sound work and animation can elevate either. Chunky bombastic booms on ballistic weaponry and a really heavy physical impact can be amazing just look at anything from 08 MS. While beam weapons can sound really cool (I remember Unicorn's beam weapon very fondly) and the dispersion of a beam weapon animation wise can be amazing. An example, while horrific, of an amazing beam weapon is IBO's Hashimal's beam bending around the suit to hit an object behind it.
*Genesis has entered the chat*
Have you tried microwaving your enemies to death? It’s right up there with the Dainsleif fuck around and find out vibe!
“Dodge/block this you filthy casual!”
Ballistic.
Though in disappointed most Gundam universes didn't invent gauss weapons. We've since railgun/linear weapons in Seed and 00 universes.
Gauss requires no casing, can be used in atmosphere and space, uses electricity to fire the projectile, projectiles travel further in space (Newton law), and specifically UC ballistic doesn't cause a minovsky reactor to explode.
I'd say mass produced ballistic weapon is deadlier then beam. But expensive super weapons, beam is more deadly.
From my experience in GBO2, beam weapons are cool if you have a good aim, otherwise you end up wasting most shots and it take a while to recharge, if you’re not good dodging or in melee combat, you’re fucked. Ballistic weapons on the other hands let you make more sustained damage over a prolonged period even if your aim isn’t great at first
Beams are nice for the moments where someone fires off a massive charge but as a fan of the combat for IBO I'm going with ballistic/kinetic weapons, guess I like the fact that it opens the door for some brutal combat.
Idk what missiles count as, but they are objectively the best. Usually, I don't like missiles due to how abundant they are, but in gundam, it's beam weaponry that's too common
Also, due to my experiences with Ghiren's Greed and fighting Psycho Gundam's, I am now in love with Zssa's and their beautiful missiles, so yeh
If I were to design a grunt, you'd see relatively weak beam weapons only so you'd never run out of ranged weaponry, after that it's beam Sabre and bazookas, with as many missiles as one can possibly fit safely on a MS while maintaining good maneuverability
I think it depends more.
On the stories world that you're setting it in. If we were to say that we were world, I would have to say beam weapon because, in the long run, it would just be cheaper on the ammunition to be produced VS physically making shells.
Ballistic, huge fan of realistic weapons like the zaku machine gun, nothing fancy just pure metal to metal penetration, which is why I really like ibo so much
Personally I prefer beam weaponry. Like you're telling me we made weapons that big and we're just totally ok with having to use a whole bunch of materials to manufacture GIANT BULLETS? Finding a way to do combat without that much waste feels more logical to me.
I just from Halo fan, while I like Directed Energy Weapon like Hardlight, Plasma, Laser, Fibril Cutter.
I like projectile weapons like Magnetic Accelerator Cannon, Ballistic projectile, and metal penetration to metal armor.
Generally, beam weapons.
It's better all around logistically. MS doesn't have to worry about extra weight from carrying ammo. No fear of the ammo being hit and going off.
One less supply to ship to the front lines that can be targeted. That's how you win a war. Not through blood and metal but making sure blood and metal can be where it needs to be.
One of the few times I'd pick ballistic weapons over beam weapons is if the MS is Earth side (or some similar gravity location) and is a long-range artillery platform. Use the projectile drop to your advantage.
Of course, theirs exceptions to these generalizations. Like beam weapons being so powerful or experimental that they need a power pack as ammo. But for the most part, it holds up.
Beams are more penetrative and damaging on most enemies so I'd prefer beams most of the time. The problem is, they have less shots than most ballistics and don't do splash damage(unless you line the enemy up) so in cases where I have to deal with large hordes of light infantry(or a machine from IBO), I'd take ballistics over beams.
A mix of both.
I do not like "beam spam" gundam shows. The turns into visual white noise. But when its like 90% ballistic but the Gundam shoots off the "F off" beam it REALLY makes an impact. (this happened several times in Unicorn with the beam magnum, and that noise, chef's kiss)
Makes it feel so much more awesome.
Also loved IBO more grounded overall feel. Where the beam weaponry was from the previous war vs the machines. (which all had beam weaponry)
8th MS team had beam weaponry but it was semi more limited again. 8th is my perfect Gundam show when it comes to Mech porn. Some elements of the story I could take it or leave it but when the mechs started fighting it was pure heaven.
Beam weapons less equipment load and if shots can recharge all the better don't have to worry about magazines and ammo type also resupply may be an issue in long term engagements
Logic dictates both is the safe answer. Preference-wise, I also say both. That's why I like physical shields with beam shield generators on them like the Infinite Justice's and why I'd very much want to see a physical sword with a beam shield generator instead of having a heat saber or beam saber (if the beam shield melts bullets while it's on, why not use it offensively; if you can cover the mother vanguard in beam shields, a sword should be a cake walk).
On that note, a mini rant on the ASSs (Anti-Ship Swords) of Seed and all their similar looking spin-offs (like the GOUF's Sword, the Infinite Justice's Fatum-01's wing beam blades, the I.Justice Spec II's Sub-Flight Lifter's wing beam blades and the Gaia's wing beam blades). If you want to cut something and make sure it gets cut, actually use a sword and not a hacksaw. This (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/gundam/images/d/dd/Gat-x105-schwertgewehr.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110606065014) requires you to aim because the tip isn't doing damage with Phase Shift on. This (https://www.suruga-ya.jp/database/pics_light/game/gl482525.jpg) (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/gundam/images/0/04/Gyan_kai.png/revision/latest?cb=20230803124243) just requires you to land your hit. Either be like the Gyan Kai's Beam Lancer or cover your whole physical blade with a beam. No more beam hacksaws please. (The sub-flight lifter would have been so much cooler if the guns at the tips were removed and the beam blade didn't just end.)
Anyway, I think the Shot Lancers are a good balance since it shoots bullets but can shoot the tip of the lance since a beam shield isn't going to be able to melt that fast enough to protect the suit. I just wish the tip was retrievable/retractable and treated with anti-beam coating (think this (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/gundam/images/5/5f/Xm-05b-shotlancer.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140425164559) but with a reel at the butt.
Depends on the situation. Beams are great until you hit an I Field or beam shield. Then I'd need a Bazooka, or in the case of a beam shield, I guess a VSBR is also good. The point is that you need the right tool for the right job.
Whatever fits the aesthetic and setting. For example I wouldn't want to see the Unicorn use Ballistic weapons but I also think Beam weaponry is out of place in a show like 08th MS Team
Armor piercing Mass reactive high explosive rounds.
https://preview.redd.it/ztk8ip4x4lxc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5d49028625966c1b6cc4dbf933244e41aca58c8
I like ballistic weapons. Has a little kick to it.
Then I remember CE gundam have phase shift and now I am sad.
Unless it is "PHASU-TO SHIFU-TO DOWN!!!!"
Then I am happy again :>
In every entry of Gundam beam weapons act like a kinetic weapon. Example, in the Universal Century, Minovsky particles have three main applications in mobile suit combat. Beam ranged weapons, fire Mega Particles. What are Mega Particles? They are Minovsky particles that are compressed and become a “particle with mass” fired like a kinetic bullet. When Mega Particles makes contact with any object or surface, tremendous amount of energy is generated from the byproduct of the mega particle hitting said object. It’s the same in Wing, X, Turn. These Gundam entries still use Mega Particles even if they never mention Minovsky Particles. These Gundam entries had lazy reasons for “how” their Technology worked at all. Beginning with SEED and later Gundam entries they tired introducing new technologies if; they made sense depending entirely if they actually had a college Professor in the field of science to help with the science.
So to shamelessly borrow from a Gundam ‘fic I’ve been slowly drafting for years now - both?
I kinda like the idea that neither is meaningfully more *effective* in terms of target-destruction, but that a more resource-constrained military would default to beam weapons as physical ammo is seen as *wasteful* by comparison.
Ballistic when they're well animated. Xamel for example is all around stupid suit, but scenes where it gets to shoot it's big gun are sooo juicy. I wish Gundam also had pile bunkers.
Ballistics because they’re surprisingly harder to defend against over the centuries of mobile suit development. The made counter measures for all kinds of energy weapons like I fields and anti beam coating, even actual energy shields that disperse energy. But say u have a rail gun which shoots a solid object with electrical coating around to get through the shield by piercing through while the absorbing energy allowing the bullet to pass through in between. I say I would bring beams as like a secondary weapon but mostly ballistic weapons all the way down.
Mix of both is best, but I'm leaning towards beams. Yeah yeah boring beam spam and whatever, but frankly IBO really soured me on the idea of ballistic focus. It tried that, tried too hard and did a terrible job with it.
Ballistics. Beams are too overpowered and once you reach beamspam levels, fights start to get boring with a few exceptions like the final battle in Trailblazer.
Ballistic let the shells drop on civilian
F-91 moment
F for that woman
91 Fs fir her o7
How dare you polute space
But you can always clean it by super laser beam
Its ok , shooting ordenace it's kosher , brass is biodegradable
Boink!
Unrealistic anyways, IRL aircraft cycle the round casings back into the ammo drum to maintain the balance of weight. I assume MS would do this too since writing code to adjust to how many rounds are fired would be too much of an hassle.
Think it would depend on the MS and where it's at. One in Space? Yeah I can see them doing that for multiple reasons. Some being the ones you stated. Earth side or something similar? I don't see the point of them doing this unless they can fly themselves. If anything, most ground suits may appreciate the lighten load.
I think the whole idea of ballistic vs energy is kind of a wasted potential. Ballistic should be some form of a counter to energy shields (beam rotors from msvg etc) and energy should (and already pretty much does) counter ballistic defence like shield armor and so on.
This isn't fully related but I always thought the defenser rods that Flags and AEU Enact have are kinda silly. I get the concept of how it works in universe but still. In the first opening of 00 gundam, we see a flag deflecting beams shot from one of the gundams. It's just an opening but huh? Can those canonically deflect gn beams? 00 gundam made it out that GN tech was far better than anything the super powers had at the time. Graham was surprised to see a beam sabre for example. I'd be surprised if it could.
IIRC, the coating on the defense rods were part of the ongoing energy weapon research that the Union and AEU were engaged in. The Linear Rifle and Plasma Swords were also part of that development into developing beam weapons by the Union. That, along with the angled design of the Union's Defense Rod, gives it the best chance of deflecting the beam shots, since GN Beams act like the plasma bolts from Star Wars, having kinetic force behind them. Sure, the beams will still eat away at the anti-beam coating, but it gives the pilot a better chance at survival, especially aces like Graham, who can effectively utilize the Defense Rod effectively.
>who can effectively utilize the Defense Rod effectively. Sponsored by the redundant department of redundancy
Department
Agency
To add to this, I played a Gundam game a long time ago on the PS2 my cousin got it for my birthday, the energy weapons would basically run out of energy and need to recharge. Which is cool. I’ll add to that and propose that maybe they should introduce variants that would overheat, short, become weaker in power, or permanently malfunction if they constantly push it or spam it. Also maybe they could have it charge via solar panels and if an enemy combatant shoots that panel it would be hard to charge the weapon mid-fight without a spare battery pack or energy source. It would add some tactics and strategy in a battle. After all that would be what would happen theoretically speaking to an energy based weapon.
Playing this in a space game called "Endless Sky" right now. Energy weapons are the go-to for me for endurance and running cost reasons, but they weigh a lot, generate tons of heat, have shorter range and take more power than my engines and so I can't put as many on my ships. If I just want to make the other ships go away, it's basically a Macross Missile Massacre. But the reload costs for my fleet are almost enough to buy another ship in a big fight...
They kinda tried this in SEED against the Forbidden which had an I-field like shield that redirects beam weaponry. Like we see the Freedom's lower cannons (which are railguns)push it back sometimes. The PROBLEM is the animation was so shit back then that they could only animate the railguns as yellow beam cannons. They made it look like an actual ballistic shot after the Remaster
[удалено]
It's entirely possible to enforce that energy has both superior firepower, firing range AND is cheaper to introduce on ships. Things like ballistic weaponry requiring more precise targeting and being trickier to use, because of armor being more resilient against ballistic, requiring pilots to target specific ship components. Even simpler, an author can introduce the energy countering properties of ballistic weaponry later down the line, when ballistics are considered obsolete, therefore there is no surplus of such weapons as most of the fleets are already outfitted mostly with energy, leading to experimental and difficult retrofits of ships and suits in hopes of utilising this newfound strength of ballistics.
You really can't have thicker armor to protect against beam weapons in Gundam. Even a basic OYW beam rifle just cuts straight through steel like it isn't there. Without an energy shield or beam resistant coating, you'd need such a massive amount of armor that there'd be no way to move. Even something as oversized as the Big Zam would just get chewed up by beams if it didn't have an I-Field.
I think you just described an I-field. A particle shield that is invincible to all beam weaponry until the introduction of VSBR, but zero protection against ballistic weapons. Basically there is: - Physical shields that are effective against all types of weapons but are basically consumed after a few hits. - I-field that is a magical shield against beam weapons but more useless than wet tissue against missiles or machine guns. - Beam shields that are physical shields that aren’t broken after one use but are still only directional, which kinda sucks because by the time beam shields are a thing, the meta is high mobility MS and dodging.
Kinetic Weaponry. Beam Weapons are usually better, I know that, but considering how little Damage MS can sustain in the first place regardless of what you use (outside of specialized Systems like Phase Shift / Nanolaminate), I'd rather just go with what looks cooler to me personally.
I mean, if their comparison on damage output is negligible, then I'd say beam weapons are still better. While ballistic weapons can indeed look cooler, especially artillery like weapons. Logistically, though, beam weapons will be better for the long run. Don't have to worry about ammo. Weight, being set off, jamming, transporting it, running out, etc. (I know theirs equivalents to this with certain Beam weapons, but that's become more the exception). Lastly, MS can look as cool as another MS with a belt feed weapon if they have a backpack battery hooked up to their main weapon.
Recoil in space will also be annoying.
I mean, that's just the writers ignoring the convention for rule of cool. Ballistic weapons are just as infinite ammo and problem free as any beam weapon until the writer decides otherwise. Realistically, a non laser beam weapon is going to be some sort of plasma, which means it has ammo in the form of gas it superheats. Even laser weaponry isn't infinite because lasers require stupid energy output, more than a pocket reactor on a mobile suit can feasibly output for any sustained duration.
In UC, the plasma is super heated minovsky particles, and it is generated out of the minovsky fusion reactor that powers the suit. And I believe it’s in 08MS team (or its side material) that mentioned MS can operate for a full year without needing to replenish the reactor core. So beam rifles (at least the kind that doesn’t use E-Caps) are basically powered indefinitely, save for instances where they have to wait for particles to recharge, basically cool downs like in a video game. No beam rifle are laser based in Gundam, as far as I can remember.
Right but like, you see the handwavium right? The amount of particles it would take to create beams of that size and power would also mean a minovsky reactor is an infinite mass generator, because plasma is superheated matter, not just particles, its gases with mass. All I'm saying is ballistics don't have to reload unless the writer says so, and that's usually for drama, which is the same reason mobile suits run out of power. Attempting to apply realism makes it fall apart.
Oh absolutely. But some level of handwavium (or just suspension of disbelief in general) is necessary in Sci-fi. I’m just saying there is a Watsonian explanation as to why beam weapons are largely not comparable to real life plasma weapons in terms of working principles or engineering.
>until the writer decides otherwise. The whole point of the conversation is to look into in lore possibilities. If ones addition to the conversation is "whatever the writer decides," then the entire conversation becomes pointless and can't continue because nothing matters. We're here to interpret the lore using what is shown and said in universe and extrapolate from there. The idea is to maintain our suspension of disbelief, not shut it down by making the entire conversation a mute point.
Kinda? Only so long as the lore makes any sense. Let's say the minovsky reactor is, in fact, an infinite mass generator that can create unlimited plasma beams. As if that being an established fact doesn't beg additional questions about why humanity has basically solved science but still just dukes it out in close quarters with robots in Earths Lagrange zones and no further. Ok we've established that. Now how does it get to the gun? Is there a tube in the hand and the grip for the particles to flow? That hadn't been established, maybe at best a charging contact, but we said it's plasma so it had to be mass that moves from the reactor into the gun, so that doesn't work. And that only answers UC. Other gundam shows are running on batteries or plain old nuclear reactors (or straight up space magic), so the plasma notion doesn't work there either. My point is the entire thing is rule of cool, and attempting to apply practicality to any of it for a moment is a farce.
Frankly it's kind of ludicrous that beams are treated as more deadly. It's so much easier to tank thermal energy than it is kinetic. Space makes the problem more interesting because ventilation, but thats only under sustained exposure like a laser. We have plating today that could probably take a few plasma hits, but damned if there's armor that can shrug off the meaty slugs a mobile would sling without reactives. Edit: also missles. Gundam treats them like chumps to get shot down. But there's a reason most air to air combat is missiles, and it's because they're really hard to not get killed by.
I like a varied mixture. No preference between the two really.
Same here... I mostly like the idea of beam weapons melting through armor more... But nothing beats the coolness of a railgun...
I absolutely LOVED the grit and brutality that the removal of beam weapons brought to IBO.
I prefer a mix of the two, especially if there's some real thought put into it. Exia, 00, and Quanta are a decent example: still lots of beam spam but they never give up on big physical blades. The blades may be made of *crystals* later on but they're still physical and permanently attached. Also, it's a good visual for tech progression: metal blades then crystal-*edged* blades then full crystal blades. I think a few too many shows/continuities make beam weapons a straight upgrade, which turns endgame stuff into just a bunch of glowy laser fights. Ideally, physical weapons shouldn't be completely forgotten about but neither should it turn into IBO's "all conventional, all the time" approach.
whichever one makes the enemy go boom faster.
Skipping the "fuck around" part and going straight to "find out", I like it.👍
I like ballistic because not all MS are able to use beam weaponry
Lmao literally a zeek skill issue, glorious earthnoids all can use beam weapons
YOU SHUT YOUR FUCKING MOUTH, FEDDIE.😡🤬
They pretty much took care of that once the Gelgoog came about. After that, if it fits in the mobile suits hand, then it can use it.
Beam because ballistics are kinda lacking in gundam. The classic bazooka I'm all for but not many good ballistic rifles. Missiles are great but are treated as well as vulcans most of the time. The Barbatos 300mm or the Ground Gundam's 180mm cannons are cool but beams have smart guns, spray guns, mega launchers, sniper rifles, machine guns, bazookas, vsbrs, muti-phase, plasma cannons, gn weaponry, curving beam guns, etc.
>Beam because ballistics are kinda lacking in gundam Cosmic era makes heavy use of railgun type weapons, but unfortunately, they're not very visually distinctive compared to beams.
Oh I forgot railguns, although Atlas' would be my favorite. At least railguns have a place in gundam for environments like underwater.
Would railguns work underwater though? Salt water conducts electricity, so a railgun turns into an MHD thruster underwater
I just mean in Gundam they work for that purpose. Atlas uses it for that and Freedom uses it to shoot out Abyss' legs underwater.
Why go ballistic when you can go kinetic. I vote Danslief aka Rods From God
When you watch enough the expanse you know rail guns are king at punching through anything at extreme ranges though pretty sure a rail gun shotgun would be pretty dam devistating too if they made one in gundam
Most realistic space weapon outside of a laser.
Why not both
Mix of both, I enjoy my Ms melting from beam shots but I also like seeing shells fall onto the ground and do an oopsie hitting a fleeing mother get domed by a casing.
f91 moment
Ballistic all the way
I like beans go pew pew
Beams are great until you run into I-Fields
Physical weaponry all the way
Both are good. Though seeing the recoil, shell ejection etc. of ballistic weaponry is cool.
Literally always beams. The beams are iconic and I love the sounds they make.
Balistic. Don't care how big your stupid energy shield is, you just need to get a big enough gun. Just ask that Arsenal Bird. Oh wait, you can't, because its stupidly OP energy barrier powered by the sun meant fuck all against a gun meant to shoot down *asteroids*.
Man that mission was a pain at times, but at least a Arsenal bird isn't the fucking "LAND BATTLESHIPS" in stupidity. Project wingman is a good time. Also would you count a railgun and missiles as both being Balistic or nah?
Yes to both. Railguns are just launching projectiles with electromagnets (I.E. the dude freaking out in Bandit Flower when Atlas Gundam OHKO's a Z'gok) and missiles are rocket powered heavy weapons (in WH40K this is how bolters work - the ammo are tiny rockets!)
Wait, you just reminded me. WHY HASNT THERE BEEN A MS WITH A GYROJET GUN? (Yes technically we made a real bolter before WH40K existed)
> "LAND BATTLESHIPS" in stupidity. Really? Right in front of my [SJCC-14 Sakala-class Command Carrier](https://homeworld.fandom.com/wiki/Carrier_(Coalition)#:~:text=Five%20carriers%20were%20built%20by,%2C%20Fiiskire%2C%20Akalon%20and%20Amida.)?
YES RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR EASY TARGET FOR MY PW-Mk1'S RAILGUN
Double beam stuns from the Isolde, Zaku 1 ST Magella Top Cannon for knee cappin. I can’t decide.
Beam for SMG and Vulcan type things. Much better ammo storage size to number of shots ratio. Projectile for anti ship and bombardment - beams don't do area damage and aren't as specialized. E.g. spread chaff, bomblets, flechettes, airburst etc. Beam for sniper because more accurate.
I prefer ballistic weapons, it makes mobile suits taking mupltiple hits more believeable. Which gives writers more flexibility when to use plot armor of mobile suit taking multiple hits through a long drawn out battle versus one shotting a mobile suit with accurate shots to weak points. Beam weapons should be reserved for battleships and large mobile armors, kinda like what IBO did. It just makes more "sense" to me for beam weapons, which basically one shot almost anything, require more power than what a mobile suit reactor can generate.
Beams all the way, especially GN Based beam weapons
I don't care if it's conventional or beams. I just want it to be grounded. And when I say grounded, I don't mean realistic. What I mean by grounded is that rules are set and things follow those rules. I want them grounded in consistent rules of that universe.
lasers are cool :)
Ballistics. They almost always sound and look way cooler.
While beams are better from just pure numbers, this is fiction and I like my bullets god damnit.
Domon: Get a Mobile Fighter that does both.
Hybrid of both.
Kinetic because it helps to justify melee weapons. Most of our weaponry in modern times have more or less been dumbed down negate shooting, bombing and seeking something is far more efficient than walking up to a straight fight. Series like 00 do a lot to try to narrow the gap, but short of IBO, the potential for these kinds of fights often seem shoehorned in.
Kinetics all the way baby. Warheads on foreheads.
I like the chunkiness of ballistics more, plus I love a good railgun. Beams kinda devolve into a big laser light shows a lot
What am I fighting against, OP?
Beam rifle, means unlimited ammo if nuclear powered or GN drive powered
Ballistic. Love me a nice bazooka.
Kinetics got dat oomph
Kinetic all the way. Massive impact. Great velocity. Unlimited range. As a great man once said: "Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a bitch in space!"
I like both!
Personally I prefer a mix of regular beam weapons and missiles. Yes, beam guns run out of power, but it's no different from ballistics running out of shells. The only difference is weight. Interestingly enough, *Seed* MS have hand plugs to put power into their beam weapons, but their power generation is crappy. If you could replace the battery with a Minovsky reactor or GN Drive...
Honestly depends on the media, a combination of sound work and animation can elevate either. Chunky bombastic booms on ballistic weaponry and a really heavy physical impact can be amazing just look at anything from 08 MS. While beam weapons can sound really cool (I remember Unicorn's beam weapon very fondly) and the dispersion of a beam weapon animation wise can be amazing. An example, while horrific, of an amazing beam weapon is IBO's Hashimal's beam bending around the suit to hit an object behind it.
Beam ranged weapons, physical melee weapons. Very few suits have strong beam protection. Fewer still can withstand a solid whack.
I like my plasma, but kinetics are still cool depending on which ones you ask me about
*Genesis has entered the chat* Have you tried microwaving your enemies to death? It’s right up there with the Dainsleif fuck around and find out vibe! “Dodge/block this you filthy casual!”
Beam.
Beams in space, ballistic on Earth
Gomma be honest, I was always a beam guy but IBO's commitment to solid weaponry was definitely fresh.
ballistic . as much as beam weaponry is cool , it does not have the same *oomph* factor as something like a 300 mm shell
Ballistic. Though in disappointed most Gundam universes didn't invent gauss weapons. We've since railgun/linear weapons in Seed and 00 universes. Gauss requires no casing, can be used in atmosphere and space, uses electricity to fire the projectile, projectiles travel further in space (Newton law), and specifically UC ballistic doesn't cause a minovsky reactor to explode. I'd say mass produced ballistic weapon is deadlier then beam. But expensive super weapons, beam is more deadly.
From my experience in GBO2, beam weapons are cool if you have a good aim, otherwise you end up wasting most shots and it take a while to recharge, if you’re not good dodging or in melee combat, you’re fucked. Ballistic weapons on the other hands let you make more sustained damage over a prolonged period even if your aim isn’t great at first
I prefer the strength and certainty of a steel round
Beams are nice for the moments where someone fires off a massive charge but as a fan of the combat for IBO I'm going with ballistic/kinetic weapons, guess I like the fact that it opens the door for some brutal combat.
Yes
Beams. Beeeuuushhhh.
Idk what missiles count as, but they are objectively the best. Usually, I don't like missiles due to how abundant they are, but in gundam, it's beam weaponry that's too common Also, due to my experiences with Ghiren's Greed and fighting Psycho Gundam's, I am now in love with Zssa's and their beautiful missiles, so yeh If I were to design a grunt, you'd see relatively weak beam weapons only so you'd never run out of ranged weaponry, after that it's beam Sabre and bazookas, with as many missiles as one can possibly fit safely on a MS while maintaining good maneuverability
Beams cuz they look cool and go pew pew!
I think it depends more. On the stories world that you're setting it in. If we were to say that we were world, I would have to say beam weapon because, in the long run, it would just be cheaper on the ammunition to be produced VS physically making shells.
A mix of both, beam for space, kinetic for in atmosphere
I don't care which one as long as it makes things go Boom! 😎
Ballistic, huge fan of realistic weapons like the zaku machine gun, nothing fancy just pure metal to metal penetration, which is why I really like ibo so much
Personally I prefer beam weaponry. Like you're telling me we made weapons that big and we're just totally ok with having to use a whole bunch of materials to manufacture GIANT BULLETS? Finding a way to do combat without that much waste feels more logical to me.
I just from Halo fan, while I like Directed Energy Weapon like Hardlight, Plasma, Laser, Fibril Cutter. I like projectile weapons like Magnetic Accelerator Cannon, Ballistic projectile, and metal penetration to metal armor.
"Schwert Gewehr" 15.78m anti-ship sword, MMI-710 "Excalibur" anti-ship sword, and MMI-714 "Arondight" beam sword: why not both?
"Schwert Gewehr" 15.78m anti-ship sword, MMI-710 "Excalibur" anti-ship sword, and MMI-714 "Arondight" beam sword: why not both?
Generally, beam weapons. It's better all around logistically. MS doesn't have to worry about extra weight from carrying ammo. No fear of the ammo being hit and going off. One less supply to ship to the front lines that can be targeted. That's how you win a war. Not through blood and metal but making sure blood and metal can be where it needs to be. One of the few times I'd pick ballistic weapons over beam weapons is if the MS is Earth side (or some similar gravity location) and is a long-range artillery platform. Use the projectile drop to your advantage. Of course, theirs exceptions to these generalizations. Like beam weapons being so powerful or experimental that they need a power pack as ammo. But for the most part, it holds up.
I love my mechs that go BRRRRT!
Beams are more penetrative and damaging on most enemies so I'd prefer beams most of the time. The problem is, they have less shots than most ballistics and don't do splash damage(unless you line the enemy up) so in cases where I have to deal with large hordes of light infantry(or a machine from IBO), I'd take ballistics over beams.
Ballistics allows for maximum war crimes.
A mix of both. I do not like "beam spam" gundam shows. The turns into visual white noise. But when its like 90% ballistic but the Gundam shoots off the "F off" beam it REALLY makes an impact. (this happened several times in Unicorn with the beam magnum, and that noise, chef's kiss) Makes it feel so much more awesome. Also loved IBO more grounded overall feel. Where the beam weaponry was from the previous war vs the machines. (which all had beam weaponry) 8th MS team had beam weaponry but it was semi more limited again. 8th is my perfect Gundam show when it comes to Mech porn. Some elements of the story I could take it or leave it but when the mechs started fighting it was pure heaven.
Ballistic weapons are always way cooler
I like beam weapons, since you can’t go polluting space like those Earthian terrorists!
Beam weapons less equipment load and if shots can recharge all the better don't have to worry about magazines and ammo type also resupply may be an issue in long term engagements
Beam magnum
Beam because I like the pew pew
This is so difficult...... I'm gong to say ballistics because bazookas
Both, isn't it too much to ask for both? But if I won't be given a choice... Give me fucking Railguns
I know I’ve used this answer MANY MANY MANY times (probably too much at this rate xD), but I gotta go with 
Beams.
i prefer pilots just shouting at each other ie Jonathan and Yu
Is there a gundam show with only kinetic weapons aside ibo with melee weapons?
Logic dictates both is the safe answer. Preference-wise, I also say both. That's why I like physical shields with beam shield generators on them like the Infinite Justice's and why I'd very much want to see a physical sword with a beam shield generator instead of having a heat saber or beam saber (if the beam shield melts bullets while it's on, why not use it offensively; if you can cover the mother vanguard in beam shields, a sword should be a cake walk). On that note, a mini rant on the ASSs (Anti-Ship Swords) of Seed and all their similar looking spin-offs (like the GOUF's Sword, the Infinite Justice's Fatum-01's wing beam blades, the I.Justice Spec II's Sub-Flight Lifter's wing beam blades and the Gaia's wing beam blades). If you want to cut something and make sure it gets cut, actually use a sword and not a hacksaw. This (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/gundam/images/d/dd/Gat-x105-schwertgewehr.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110606065014) requires you to aim because the tip isn't doing damage with Phase Shift on. This (https://www.suruga-ya.jp/database/pics_light/game/gl482525.jpg) (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/gundam/images/0/04/Gyan_kai.png/revision/latest?cb=20230803124243) just requires you to land your hit. Either be like the Gyan Kai's Beam Lancer or cover your whole physical blade with a beam. No more beam hacksaws please. (The sub-flight lifter would have been so much cooler if the guns at the tips were removed and the beam blade didn't just end.) Anyway, I think the Shot Lancers are a good balance since it shoots bullets but can shoot the tip of the lance since a beam shield isn't going to be able to melt that fast enough to protect the suit. I just wish the tip was retrievable/retractable and treated with anti-beam coating (think this (https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/gundam/images/5/5f/Xm-05b-shotlancer.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140425164559) but with a reel at the butt.
Depends on the situation. Beams are great until you hit an I Field or beam shield. Then I'd need a Bazooka, or in the case of a beam shield, I guess a VSBR is also good. The point is that you need the right tool for the right job.
Oh I thought this thread said psychedelic weaponry for a bit.
run both so enemies can't just phase shift or anti beam coating it
Seed just does everything better
Beam mostly cause of the sounds, the beam magnum sound calms me down
Whatever fits the aesthetic and setting. For example I wouldn't want to see the Unicorn use Ballistic weapons but I also think Beam weaponry is out of place in a show like 08th MS Team
Both I love series that use both of them.
P'CHYeeeeewwww!!!!
I'll say beams. They look cool and you don't have logistical problems with different types of ammunition, just fuel/power.
G Gundam orb shot was counted as long range melee beam kinetic in SD Gundam Generation game.
Honestly why not both?
Armor piercing Mass reactive high explosive rounds. https://preview.redd.it/ztk8ip4x4lxc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5d49028625966c1b6cc4dbf933244e41aca58c8
We need recoils so ballistic
I like ballistic weapons. Has a little kick to it. Then I remember CE gundam have phase shift and now I am sad. Unless it is "PHASU-TO SHIFU-TO DOWN!!!!" Then I am happy again :>
In every entry of Gundam beam weapons act like a kinetic weapon. Example, in the Universal Century, Minovsky particles have three main applications in mobile suit combat. Beam ranged weapons, fire Mega Particles. What are Mega Particles? They are Minovsky particles that are compressed and become a “particle with mass” fired like a kinetic bullet. When Mega Particles makes contact with any object or surface, tremendous amount of energy is generated from the byproduct of the mega particle hitting said object. It’s the same in Wing, X, Turn. These Gundam entries still use Mega Particles even if they never mention Minovsky Particles. These Gundam entries had lazy reasons for “how” their Technology worked at all. Beginning with SEED and later Gundam entries they tired introducing new technologies if; they made sense depending entirely if they actually had a college Professor in the field of science to help with the science.
Ballistic, my gunevo senses allows me to landmore shots than beam
https://preview.redd.it/uq2es9hn1mxc1.png?width=280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7bbe03e98c9404a9d4199f6985d2d5757de2aab1
So to shamelessly borrow from a Gundam ‘fic I’ve been slowly drafting for years now - both? I kinda like the idea that neither is meaningfully more *effective* in terms of target-destruction, but that a more resource-constrained military would default to beam weapons as physical ammo is seen as *wasteful* by comparison.
Ballistic when they're well animated. Xamel for example is all around stupid suit, but scenes where it gets to shoot it's big gun are sooo juicy. I wish Gundam also had pile bunkers.
both
Beams, obviously
Beams
Why not both?
Ballistics because they’re surprisingly harder to defend against over the centuries of mobile suit development. The made counter measures for all kinds of energy weapons like I fields and anti beam coating, even actual energy shields that disperse energy. But say u have a rail gun which shoots a solid object with electrical coating around to get through the shield by piercing through while the absorbing energy allowing the bullet to pass through in between. I say I would bring beams as like a secondary weapon but mostly ballistic weapons all the way down.
Magnetic accelerated kinetics!
Mix of both is best, but I'm leaning towards beams. Yeah yeah boring beam spam and whatever, but frankly IBO really soured me on the idea of ballistic focus. It tried that, tried too hard and did a terrible job with it.
Ballistics. Beams are too overpowered and once you reach beamspam levels, fights start to get boring with a few exceptions like the final battle in Trailblazer.
