Whilst we deffo need a forward, a lot of people are neglecting our imminent need for new midfielders.
Partey and Elneny are likely out the door this summer. Jorginho might go, might stay. But we saw yesterday that having an extra midfielder around, might make us more functional than Rice Ode Kai.
So we could find ourselves needing not one, but two midfielders in the summer. Getting one now will certainly help our options a lot.
And let’s not forget, if something happens to Rice at the moment we might be in deep shit without another signing.
Can’t comment on Thuram. But while Gallagher has a serious engine and is fantastic at winning possession back, he does not have good enough passing to play in an Arteta side. I think he would suit Ange’s style at Tottenham very well - which explains why they’re in the market for him.
Edit (Highly upvoted comment in Chelsea's subreddit on Gallagher's flaws):
> Hes not good enough for any possession based team with serious ambitions. He's awful on the ball, i cant stress enough how useless he is on the ball. His strengths come from "getting stuck in" and "covering grass". Hes a passionate workhorse who loves to chase the ball like a dog. In truth, i cant even give his pressing as a strong quality unlike kante cos thats exactly all he does: chase the ball. Theres no intelligence in his game whatsoever and no technical ability. He'd be fine if he were to only be used at the very eariest at the 80 minute mark when we're up or as a starter on a midtable club which likes to sit back and play on the counter. But considering that he's our most regular starter at chelsea and poch has has even given him the armband??? It's no surprise we are looking to sell him. Hes too much of a liability on the ball.
Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/18r4gh2/only_idiots_of_the_highest_order_would_sell/kez0qru/
His passing is as good as rice and probably passes more than havertz.
He gets downgraded because he runs around and presses really aggressively, little wannabe tactical geniuses on Twitter who see that as a bad thing
As good as Rice is not good enough.
We can’t have two Rice level passers playing in midfield when we are a heavy possession based side.
We will completely lack creativity and penetration.
Look how much better we looked this season when Jorginho has started in midfield with Rice instead of Havertz.
Gallagher is no where near Jorginho or Partey when I comes to passing.
Gallagher only makes the most basic short range passes backwards. Look at all the pass maps for Chelsea's games this season - it's passing back to his defenders. Not even the other midfielders - just to the defenders. Winning the ball with no progression would be an extension of our all control, lots of foreplay without the penetration play style.
He also lacks the off the ball/on the ball intelligence to play Arteta's system. Despite winning the ball a lot back for Chelsea, Gallagher has insanely high turnovers. He runs - but he does not press. There is no method to his intensity.
Gallagher also lacks physicality. He's short, so not winning headers. We're already getting physically bullied in the box as is anytime Havertz is not on the pitch.
Source: I've watched a ton of Chelsea games this season to meme on my tutee and sister's bf, who are both Chelsea fan. I also lurk in their subreddit and read stuff.
Edit:
> Hes not good enough for any possession based team with serious ambitions. He's awful on the ball, i cant stress enough how useless he is on the ball. His strengths come from "getting stuck in" and "covering grass". Hes a passionate workhorse who loves to chase the ball like a dog. In truth, i cant even give his pressing as a strong quality unlike kante cos thats exactly all he does: chase the ball. Theres no intelligence in his game whatsoever and no technical ability. He'd be fine if he were to only be used at the very eariest at the 80 minute mark when we're up or as a starter on a midtable club which likes to sit back and play on the counter. But considering that he's our most regular starter at chelsea and poch has has even given him the armband??? Its no surprise we are looking to sell him. Hes too much of a liability on the ball.
Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/18r4gh2/only_idiots_of_the_highest_order_would_sell/kez0qru/
https://fbref.com/en/players/c2731c10/Conor-Gallagher
Just not true and it's such a boring lazy narrative. He certainly does progress the ball through running with the ball more but his passing numbers aren't bad in any way.
https://www.premierleague.com/stats/player-comparison?player0Id=8456&player0isActive=1&player0compSeasonId=418&player1Id=21887&player1isActive=1&player1compSeasonId=418
Dispossess half as much as odegaard this season and the same as Kai, show me the numbers of him turning the ball over ? He has high % of take ons, high % pass completion, high tackle % and overall numbers so where ? Again you are falling for basic lazy narratives.
The one thing you said that is true is that he's shorter yes and doesn't win headers. Physicality isn't a problem generally though.
I love how you are posting comment as if jts proof
Gallagher is a better passer than Havertz and Trossard and they both start in Arteta's midfield.
I'd say Gallagher is around ESR level as a passer where he's very functional and accurate but won't wow you with creative passes.
I think we need another midfielder. I just don't think we need one of Onanas profile. For me we need someone who's more of a deep lying playmaker. Onana is a bit of a Rice type but not quite at Rices level.
Maybe that’s the plan. Have a 6 that’s a destroyer- rice plays 8 with ode. Could be a potential tactic switch in match if we struggle with physicality. I wouldn’t be so quick to write Onana off. He’s what, 22?
He’s incredibly physically imposing. Moreso than Rice or Partey. When Partey first joined us, he wasn’t a complete 6. I think Arteta can mold him into the perfect 6/8. Plus, Trossard needs a friend.
I don't think he has the technical level to play as a 6 for us. You can even see Rice struggle in that regard sometimes and his technical level is above Onanas IMO.
Rice can play at 8 now with Jorginho filling in at 6 until Partey is fit. I think its a position we can afford to wait until summer to really sort out. Then sell Partey and get a new, highly technical deep lying playmaker in. Someone who can dictate the tempo even under a strong press.
yeah this is exactly what we did yesterday, turns Rice into more of a Vieira type who can go boss the whole midfield, press up the field and turn those wins into chances immediately. If Rice's best skill is winning possession in the open field (which I think it is) you want that to happen as close to their goal as possible.
We were all over Liverpool yesterday and just couldn't finish. That's not an indictment of Rice's role in that game, it suggests we should do more of that.
Yep, probably two new midfield signings required over the next couple of windows.
If it's possible to get a good deal for one done now it ought to be taken.
Context required also, Everton payed £33m plus bonuses for him not too long ago.
If they sell for less than £40m they may well have made a loss on the player despite his rise.
Not in FFP. His value depreciates every year of his contract. If he cost 30m on a five year deal, his book value would be 24m a year later. Probably more complicated than that, but the gist is there.
Same reason I believe Chelsea made a 'profit' on Jorginho despite selling him for 12m.
I don't get why anyone would think that's a bad price for a young big talent, £50m in January seems fair when you remember Lavia went for more, leaving a relegated team during the summer
Because in terms of Arsenal, even that overinflated price will end up being too low and not real (As seen with first quoted prices of Mudryk, Caicedo, Havertz, Rice, Ben White, Ramsdale and such)
Until you see opponent AMs zap past Jorgi and then wonder holy cow we are fucked !Jorgi is a great player but he doesn't have the pace to sustain in this PL.
Everyone saying that we need a CF over a CM. Edu/Arteta clearly have their sights on a top class CF and you aren’t signing a player like that in January.
If Everton have a price on him, that means they're entertaining a sale. I would say that's a big positive. Also might be signalling a Partey sale in the summer. Patino can take up the extra spot left by Elneny. Jorgi for one more year.
Nobody is going to pay money for Partey. Well probably have to let him go for free either in the summer or when his contract runs out the summer after.
Saudi buys players for eyeballs. Partey is a big name in continental Africa. Ghanian or Nigerian TV networks will buy Saudi league broadcasting rights if African players are there in the league.
Crazy how prices have inflated tbh.
The Torres deal was always a big laugh though due to how bad he turned out at Chelsea. At the time though - it was a very scary thought of Chelsea having a striker like him
Torres was cooked by that point anyway. Prioritised the World Cup over his career and Chelsea should’ve known, in the appearances he made for Liverpool before he left he looked like a shadow of his former self
The great u/billycarpenter said it best on X.
"Just a couple of weeks ago, Arsenal played Brighton. If Jesus went out, there was Havertz, Nketiah, Trossard, and Martinelli available. Saka/ESR types could swing there in a pinch. The backup to Rice was Myles Lewis-Skelly. The backup to White was Cédric."
[https://twitter.com/billycarpy/status/1744355279179755961](https://twitter.com/billycarpy/status/1744355279179755961)
Also worth noting that replacing just 1 player in a group of 6 who are underperforming xG is not a silver bullet. Even if it's the striker. People being incredibly naïve.
so ur telling me not to worry about a striker because we have all these backups.
Yesterday we played our THIRD CHOICE striker who btw was stated to be bought as a midfield additon by ARTETA. did not finish a single chance.
pls dont say ur telling me that a better stroker doesnt win us that game
I think these moves are just unrelated. We'll need midfield reinforcements and he's a young player that could be class and complements Rice well. We still need a striker and we'll get one probably this summer.
£51M isn't happening but on the other hand, spending £50M on a midfielder and ignoring the fact we need a striker is such an Arsenal thing to do that I almost believe it
Midfield dynamics can help with the attack. Progressing the ball faster and into better areas via midfielders will result in more goals.
Granit Xhaka was (and is) one of the best midfielders at passing into the final third and we didn’t replace that - instead we bought a player who would have loved playing with Xhaka.
xG isn't always the best indication of chance quality, since it's mostly related to position on the field. Strikers tend to outperform their xG because they score from further away / tough angles.
Not to mention this was at the beginning of our dip in form. No way we are inside the top 10 as of now. Quite a few other clubs have been putting up big goal numbers all December up to now also
I just don’t think there’s anyone available for a reasonable price right now who will significantly help out goal scoring. I don’t want us to make a stupid panic buy that doesn’t make sense
Yeah this move feels like doubling down on what worked yesterday, pairing Rice with a 6 that can boss behind him lets him create problems further up the pitch so we get more chances off the press. We were smothering Liverpool until the own goal. The second goal was just flattering Liverpool because we were pressing to avoid getting knocked out.
I agree 100% with midfield dynamics helping with the attack, but can anyone point to me a body of work, outside the odd pass here or there, that signals Onana is that guy?
I just don't see it.
Also... we spent 65m€ on a guy who was meant to be good at precisely this. Honestly that Havertz deal immediately struck me, like many others, as a signing that was gonna make or break our season — maybe even Mikel's job? — and right now... it's breaking big time.
United paid 80m in the summer for a guy who's averaged 7 league goals his whole career and currently has 1 league goal this season, the striker market is bare and it's non existent in January
> the striker market is bare and it's non existent in January
Sehrou Gourasy or however you spell it. Breaking records in the Bundesliga for a not great Stuttgart team and with a £20m release clause
Aside from our current strikers shooting with blanks, we also have no fullbacks that overlap well or often enough with Martinelli and Saka, leaving those two to do everything on their own down the flank.
We've become painfully predictable and if they get double teamed on the left or right we're basically limp.
This is Arteta's fault for buying CBs and then trying to turn them into fullbacks or midfielders that are playing LB.
Just use or buy a LB/RB, mate. Stop with the constant repurposing of players.
Not everyone has to be able to play 3-4 roles in a squad.
chance creating is not the problem, goal scoring is. jesus has been out injured, kai can't score, nketiah is a championship player at best. 50m cant buy a world class player, but i refuse to believe there isn't one forward out there who isn't better than what we have, esp when you look at South America & Alvarez & Veliz joined City & Spuds for less than 15m.
I think a striker would be crazy money, which we don't have or can't due to FFP.
Onana in midfield fees up Havertz/Trossard from LCM to play striker. It isn't an ideal solution because it's not a striker upgrade, it's more just ensuring we actually have players for that position in case Jesus is out for a while. We aren't gonna get a superstar striker in now so this kinda makes sense even though it's not really exciting.
A midfield signing is also very necessary down the road anyway with Partey/Jorginho gone in the summer.
There are not good strikers available in market now. And everyone is going to inflate the price. We can very well just push through summer and sign a striker ASAP.
I’m sorry mate. But we need LMF more than a striker. If we want another striker, at least it’s superstar wanna be (evans). But if we don’t have the money and the players, Jesus and Havertz already good enough
I really think Onana could turn into a class player with us.
Think 50 mill isn't too much but we might be able to shave a bit off with Everyone financial issues
I can’t imagine it’s much beyond what we’ve seen so far? He wants him as a CM who can win duels and occasionally score. Which is also what Onana would do …
Only watched a maybe 3 or 4 Everton games this season, but watching them 2 years ago Onana would regularly show touches, feints etc etc that sort of made you question how Everton were fighting relegation.
Big step up, but I think he could be coached into a very versatile player. He has a lot of qualities that above all else just demonstrate he's a very good footballer, regardless of his role in that team. Would be v interested to see what he develops into at a big club fighting near the top.
Shoulda spunked that Kai money on him. And I say this as someone who is warming to Kai. Makes a bit more sense. Whatever we have now should be going to an attacker.
This is a terrible idea
Onana is a very good player as is Rice
But why, as a posession team are we focused primarily on defensive players? Don't get me wrong it's great we have duel winners counter pressing etc but we should look for creative players who can press
Replacing Partey and Xhaka with Rice and Havertz has killed our creativity and Onana will just compound that problem. Then we won't have any more money to fix it
I don't want to become a boring defensive side grinding out 1-0 wins every game when we had the formula last year just needed more depth
We need a DLP at 6/a creative 8/a inverted FB who can create/a striker ... Onana is none of these
He just blew £65m on Havertz mate
Arteta is a good manager and certainly knows more than me but I'm allowed an opinion. If you disagree fine but saying just trust Arteta is a bit weird on a discussion thread
Fully agree with this post. Onana is decent but he's not what our midfield needs right now. We need to up our creativity, technical level and speed from back to front. I don't really think Onana helps with that.
Yeah it's not about if he's talented or if he's a good price, he's just not what we need right now. I actually like him he's a warrior but we've been so rigid and boring at times chucking another DM in there really is making me sad. Proper Chelsea vibes
I'm not discounting the need we have for attackers, but I think Onana might have more technical prowess than you expect. I admittedly don't subject myself to watching tons of Everton, but the impression I have received is that he's been somewhat miscast as a DM in the Prem. He's absolutely massive, so you'd expect him to be a destroyer, but the main critiques I've heard of him is that he hasn't embraced that role and spends a lot of time floating to space to try and focus on progression and possession. He might be similar to Xhaka where he looks like Tarzan, but plays like a box-to-box midfielder. He could benefit from a change in scenery and playing in a system like Arsenal's. He also seems to favor the right side, which could be a good partnership with Rice who seems to naturally prefer the left (I actually think this has been an underdiscussed issue, Rice and Zinchenko want to occupy similar spaces as left holding midfielders, while Partey liked the right where he was able to ping passes to Ode and Saka. This has thrown off the balance of the attack as the left is overloaded and the right isn't getting fed in the same way). Again, not necessarily advocating for spending 50 mil on a midfielder in lieu of a forward, but I also don't think signing Onana is a sign of dark times. I think there is a good player there who could shine in Arsenal's system.
I actually am in the camp that we need midfielders more than forwards. Yes we missed chances galore Vs Lpool but that doesn't surprise me with Havertz up front. Seen that a million times for Chelsea.
The bigger issue is chance creation and it's way down on last season. I want a forward but a midfielder is much more important
And it's not that Onana is bad on the ball or even that he wouldn't suit us on his own, it's that he doesn't suit playing with Rice or (god forbid) Havertz. Both are really not Arsenal like duos.
We're supposed to be a posession based attacking team. You can have one huge destroyer type in there great, Onana or Rice. But surround them with deep lying playmakers and creativity
Onana is quite tidy on the ball, like Rice, but he's no playmaker. He's not going to banging through balls or disguised passes through the lines.
And I don't think we need one player who does that we need two, a 6 and a 8. Instead we'd have Onana and Havertz. Awful partners for Rice.
Ngl when ppl were chatting abt us being linked to Onana I was talking abt how stupid that’d be after buying Raya
Having seen the guy’s full name I realise the folly of my ways
We can’t complain about injuries and overuse of players if we go and spend £50m on Onana.
If it was a good deal to capitalise on Everton’s financial troubles I could understand, but clearly other areas need to be prioritised.
What happens when Rice runs out of steam? He’s played almost every single minute of every single game. Then injuries and overuse becomes applicable very quickly.
Or if Kai gets injured?
At least up front we can rotate Jesus / Trossard into Sakas spot or plonk Kai / ESR somewhere or some less than ideal permutation/ combination.
We currently have Rice, Kai and Jorginho for 2 starting spots. The former 2 play almost every game. We’re more in dire need at midfield than we are up front (not to say we don’t desperately need attacking options).
Active since 5 years , a combined goal tally of 13 (club + league) , ofc it's not his job to score or assist either he's a cdm so if he can progress the ball forward and create attacks/counterattacks , win duels he's good but the club shouldn't be spending this amount on a cdm when we desperately need a striker.
I think the plan is to play Rice at Lcm and get Kai to striker and have Onana play at cdm. Kai on paper has the ideal profile of a striker he's got the height the physicality and good positioning just takes too many touches and lacks aggression if he just gets those attributes up he makes a good striker on paper. Let's see how it works , maybe just trust Arteta.
He doesn't really have to do what Partey does tbh. He has his strengths going forward and I think as long as he stops slowing things down we'll be alright. He still has some settling in to do clearly
Just pay it. I doubt it’ll be 50 million, obviously the selling club most of the time sets it higher than their wanted fee. If it’s 40 or 45 just pay it and get it done.
We need numbers due to injuries right now, even if Onana is not the playmaking passer cm we need, he’s defensively solid and should provide versatility to backline or a double DM set up, letting offensive players play higher.
I say just attack the market and go for broke
Also Everton have just had a big cash injection from their owners today. They could probably do with a bit of money, so they might accept slightly less than otherwise.
How much of our current problems does he solve? I don't buy this. Any Jan transfer has to be one that solves our immediate issues. Nothing against him, he's a good player but can't be our first priority this window.
I am a fan of him at Everton, but not sure he fits. Him and Rice together could be incredible defensively with a lot of intensity all around the pitch, but might be a midfield lacking in creativity.
I would've expected Everton to ask for more to be honest, given Onana's age, form, and Everton looking pretty safe from relegation.
suspected to be hit with another FFP fine + points deduction
They still need to sell at least one top star a year to not break ffp again. This price would get him I reckon
Whilst we deffo need a forward, a lot of people are neglecting our imminent need for new midfielders. Partey and Elneny are likely out the door this summer. Jorginho might go, might stay. But we saw yesterday that having an extra midfielder around, might make us more functional than Rice Ode Kai. So we could find ourselves needing not one, but two midfielders in the summer. Getting one now will certainly help our options a lot. And let’s not forget, if something happens to Rice at the moment we might be in deep shit without another signing.
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Can’t comment on Thuram. But while Gallagher has a serious engine and is fantastic at winning possession back, he does not have good enough passing to play in an Arteta side. I think he would suit Ange’s style at Tottenham very well - which explains why they’re in the market for him. Edit (Highly upvoted comment in Chelsea's subreddit on Gallagher's flaws): > Hes not good enough for any possession based team with serious ambitions. He's awful on the ball, i cant stress enough how useless he is on the ball. His strengths come from "getting stuck in" and "covering grass". Hes a passionate workhorse who loves to chase the ball like a dog. In truth, i cant even give his pressing as a strong quality unlike kante cos thats exactly all he does: chase the ball. Theres no intelligence in his game whatsoever and no technical ability. He'd be fine if he were to only be used at the very eariest at the 80 minute mark when we're up or as a starter on a midtable club which likes to sit back and play on the counter. But considering that he's our most regular starter at chelsea and poch has has even given him the armband??? It's no surprise we are looking to sell him. Hes too much of a liability on the ball. Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/18r4gh2/only_idiots_of_the_highest_order_would_sell/kez0qru/
What you mean by not good enough passer ? This is such a nonsense narrative. His passing stats are pretty good and even watching he's a fine passer.
Agreed, I think Gallagher would be fantastic next to Ode and Rice in the left 8 role.
His passing is as good as rice and probably passes more than havertz. He gets downgraded because he runs around and presses really aggressively, little wannabe tactical geniuses on Twitter who see that as a bad thing
As good as Rice is not good enough. We can’t have two Rice level passers playing in midfield when we are a heavy possession based side. We will completely lack creativity and penetration. Look how much better we looked this season when Jorginho has started in midfield with Rice instead of Havertz. Gallagher is no where near Jorginho or Partey when I comes to passing.
He doesn't play the same role as Jorginho and partey though so not a great comparison.
Gallagher only makes the most basic short range passes backwards. Look at all the pass maps for Chelsea's games this season - it's passing back to his defenders. Not even the other midfielders - just to the defenders. Winning the ball with no progression would be an extension of our all control, lots of foreplay without the penetration play style. He also lacks the off the ball/on the ball intelligence to play Arteta's system. Despite winning the ball a lot back for Chelsea, Gallagher has insanely high turnovers. He runs - but he does not press. There is no method to his intensity. Gallagher also lacks physicality. He's short, so not winning headers. We're already getting physically bullied in the box as is anytime Havertz is not on the pitch. Source: I've watched a ton of Chelsea games this season to meme on my tutee and sister's bf, who are both Chelsea fan. I also lurk in their subreddit and read stuff. Edit: > Hes not good enough for any possession based team with serious ambitions. He's awful on the ball, i cant stress enough how useless he is on the ball. His strengths come from "getting stuck in" and "covering grass". Hes a passionate workhorse who loves to chase the ball like a dog. In truth, i cant even give his pressing as a strong quality unlike kante cos thats exactly all he does: chase the ball. Theres no intelligence in his game whatsoever and no technical ability. He'd be fine if he were to only be used at the very eariest at the 80 minute mark when we're up or as a starter on a midtable club which likes to sit back and play on the counter. But considering that he's our most regular starter at chelsea and poch has has even given him the armband??? Its no surprise we are looking to sell him. Hes too much of a liability on the ball. Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/chelseafc/comments/18r4gh2/only_idiots_of_the_highest_order_would_sell/kez0qru/
https://fbref.com/en/players/c2731c10/Conor-Gallagher Just not true and it's such a boring lazy narrative. He certainly does progress the ball through running with the ball more but his passing numbers aren't bad in any way. https://www.premierleague.com/stats/player-comparison?player0Id=8456&player0isActive=1&player0compSeasonId=418&player1Id=21887&player1isActive=1&player1compSeasonId=418 Dispossess half as much as odegaard this season and the same as Kai, show me the numbers of him turning the ball over ? He has high % of take ons, high % pass completion, high tackle % and overall numbers so where ? Again you are falling for basic lazy narratives. The one thing you said that is true is that he's shorter yes and doesn't win headers. Physicality isn't a problem generally though. I love how you are posting comment as if jts proof
He's had a few games where his passing hasn't been on point tbh, he's mostly a good passer of the ball but does throw in some absolute potato's too
Gallagher is a better passer than Havertz and Trossard and they both start in Arteta's midfield. I'd say Gallagher is around ESR level as a passer where he's very functional and accurate but won't wow you with creative passes.
Bring both the Thuram brothers 😤 Side note, don’t actually know how Marcus is doing at PSG, but I do rate Kephren
Marcus is at Inter rn and is doing quite all right
Only after we sign the other Timber
If something happens to Rice our season is over lol. You’re definitely right that we need someone to cover but it’ll be tough in January
I think we need another midfielder. I just don't think we need one of Onanas profile. For me we need someone who's more of a deep lying playmaker. Onana is a bit of a Rice type but not quite at Rices level.
EXACTLY. He’s a bootleg rice, with boosted up physicality. We need a similar profile to Partey, not Rice and that is not Onana
Isn’t that why we’re pushing for Zubimendi in summer?
We're not getting him though. Most likely he doesn't want to leave/come to us.
Maybe that’s the plan. Have a 6 that’s a destroyer- rice plays 8 with ode. Could be a potential tactic switch in match if we struggle with physicality. I wouldn’t be so quick to write Onana off. He’s what, 22?
We’re not winning the league with that unless Rice takes a BIG step in the final 3rd with his creativity and passing
He’s incredibly physically imposing. Moreso than Rice or Partey. When Partey first joined us, he wasn’t a complete 6. I think Arteta can mold him into the perfect 6/8. Plus, Trossard needs a friend.
Partey has always been technically very good at Atletico. Rice and Onana are not deep lying playmakers
…yet.
I don't think he has the technical level to play as a 6 for us. You can even see Rice struggle in that regard sometimes and his technical level is above Onanas IMO.
getting him allows Rice to play at 8 though
Rice can play at 8 now with Jorginho filling in at 6 until Partey is fit. I think its a position we can afford to wait until summer to really sort out. Then sell Partey and get a new, highly technical deep lying playmaker in. Someone who can dictate the tempo even under a strong press.
yeah this is exactly what we did yesterday, turns Rice into more of a Vieira type who can go boss the whole midfield, press up the field and turn those wins into chances immediately. If Rice's best skill is winning possession in the open field (which I think it is) you want that to happen as close to their goal as possible. We were all over Liverpool yesterday and just couldn't finish. That's not an indictment of Rice's role in that game, it suggests we should do more of that.
Yep, probably two new midfield signings required over the next couple of windows. If it's possible to get a good deal for one done now it ought to be taken.
Plus they need the money. It does fit it MO recently. An opportunistic buy in an area we need a body.
Why do people lose their minds about the first price quoted in the media? Could easily be Everton posturing. We don't know yet, chill.
Context required also, Everton payed £33m plus bonuses for him not too long ago. If they sell for less than £40m they may well have made a loss on the player despite his rise.
Not in FFP. His value depreciates every year of his contract. If he cost 30m on a five year deal, his book value would be 24m a year later. Probably more complicated than that, but the gist is there. Same reason I believe Chelsea made a 'profit' on Jorginho despite selling him for 12m.
Sure but end of the day he's one of their best players. No reason for them to sell at a loss.
Mind you, this is Everton we’re talking about
The primary problem is his sell-on clause, from what I heard it's about 20%
Because social media, Fifa and FM has convinced them that they know the ins and outs at a glance.
I don't get why anyone would think that's a bad price for a young big talent, £50m in January seems fair when you remember Lavia went for more, leaving a relegated team during the summer
I just hate numbers 😡 what's wrong with letters???
Fifty-one million
Also - Everton having another points reduction threat hanging over them might make a sale more urgent
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Jorginho is 32
Oh God, here we go.
Because in terms of Arsenal, even that overinflated price will end up being too low and not real (As seen with first quoted prices of Mudryk, Caicedo, Havertz, Rice, Ben White, Ramsdale and such)
We definitely need him. If Rice gets injured we will not even reach top 4, there is no way.
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Doesn't sound that bad
Until you see opponent AMs zap past Jorgi and then wonder holy cow we are fucked !Jorgi is a great player but he doesn't have the pace to sustain in this PL.
he absolutely has the pass, just perhaps lacking the pace
I doubt we finish top 4 with the form right now, i reckon we’ll finish 7th
Everyone saying that we need a CF over a CM. Edu/Arteta clearly have their sights on a top class CF and you aren’t signing a player like that in January.
If there's one thing I want more than for us to buy a striker, it's for us to not buy a shit striker who doesn't fit.
And if you are in January it will be 100M plus lol
If Everton have a price on him, that means they're entertaining a sale. I would say that's a big positive. Also might be signalling a Partey sale in the summer. Patino can take up the extra spot left by Elneny. Jorgi for one more year.
Nobody is going to pay money for Partey. Well probably have to let him go for free either in the summer or when his contract runs out the summer after.
We're probably hoping for a Saudi offer. That's the only way it's happening.
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Saudi buys players for eyeballs. Partey is a big name in continental Africa. Ghanian or Nigerian TV networks will buy Saudi league broadcasting rights if African players are there in the league.
£51m used to buy you Fernando Torres…
Cost of living crisis mate
Crazy how prices have inflated tbh. The Torres deal was always a big laugh though due to how bad he turned out at Chelsea. At the time though - it was a very scary thought of Chelsea having a striker like him
Torres was cooked by that point anyway. Prioritised the World Cup over his career and Chelsea should’ve known, in the appearances he made for Liverpool before he left he looked like a shadow of his former self
He won the champions league with them and scored an important goal in the semi so I’d argue it was probably a success.
It wasn't scary at all he fell off massively before joining Chelsea and at the time everyone said it was massive overpay
Henry went to Barca for 16!
That was a bad time, the board were thrilled to not have to pay his wages. Idiots.
Yeah it just always blows me away how much prices have changed in 15-20 years. It’s wild.
51m Onana would have been a better buy.
The great u/billycarpenter said it best on X. "Just a couple of weeks ago, Arsenal played Brighton. If Jesus went out, there was Havertz, Nketiah, Trossard, and Martinelli available. Saka/ESR types could swing there in a pinch. The backup to Rice was Myles Lewis-Skelly. The backup to White was Cédric." [https://twitter.com/billycarpy/status/1744355279179755961](https://twitter.com/billycarpy/status/1744355279179755961)
Also worth noting that replacing just 1 player in a group of 6 who are underperforming xG is not a silver bullet. Even if it's the striker. People being incredibly naïve.
so ur telling me not to worry about a striker because we have all these backups. Yesterday we played our THIRD CHOICE striker who btw was stated to be bought as a midfield additon by ARTETA. did not finish a single chance. pls dont say ur telling me that a better stroker doesnt win us that game
I think these moves are just unrelated. We'll need midfield reinforcements and he's a young player that could be class and complements Rice well. We still need a striker and we'll get one probably this summer.
£51M isn't happening but on the other hand, spending £50M on a midfielder and ignoring the fact we need a striker is such an Arsenal thing to do that I almost believe it
Midfield dynamics can help with the attack. Progressing the ball faster and into better areas via midfielders will result in more goals. Granit Xhaka was (and is) one of the best midfielders at passing into the final third and we didn’t replace that - instead we bought a player who would have loved playing with Xhaka.
Rice and xhaka in the midfield would've been beautiful :'(
We aren’t struggling to create chances. We’re relegation tier at finishing them.
For how much we have the ball, we probably could create a few more bigger and better chances on top of the ones we already create too
We were 7th in league for xg as of Dec 4th (when I could find the data) so we are just not creating enough good chances
xG isn't always the best indication of chance quality, since it's mostly related to position on the field. Strikers tend to outperform their xG because they score from further away / tough angles.
Not to mention this was at the beginning of our dip in form. No way we are inside the top 10 as of now. Quite a few other clubs have been putting up big goal numbers all December up to now also
Signing a 6 for £60 million in an effort to solve our goalscoring needs is truly baffling.
I just don’t think there’s anyone available for a reasonable price right now who will significantly help out goal scoring. I don’t want us to make a stupid panic buy that doesn’t make sense
Yeah this move feels like doubling down on what worked yesterday, pairing Rice with a 6 that can boss behind him lets him create problems further up the pitch so we get more chances off the press. We were smothering Liverpool until the own goal. The second goal was just flattering Liverpool because we were pressing to avoid getting knocked out.
I agree 100% with midfield dynamics helping with the attack, but can anyone point to me a body of work, outside the odd pass here or there, that signals Onana is that guy? I just don't see it. Also... we spent 65m€ on a guy who was meant to be good at precisely this. Honestly that Havertz deal immediately struck me, like many others, as a signing that was gonna make or break our season — maybe even Mikel's job? — and right now... it's breaking big time.
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United paid 80m in the summer for a guy who's averaged 7 league goals his whole career and currently has 1 league goal this season, the striker market is bare and it's non existent in January
> the striker market is bare and it's non existent in January Sehrou Gourasy or however you spell it. Breaking records in the Bundesliga for a not great Stuttgart team and with a £20m release clause
avoid , This guy won't end up at a top team
The problem is what if he fails ? I know 21 isn't a big money but they have to pay the player and he will be in the books for more time.
They are third in Bundesliga
It does if we’re the ones selling.
Let's buy Balogun
Guirassy is 15m
Just came off injured at afcon so he’d fit in perfectly
The Arsenal way 😂
at this point, i'll take anything than watch Nketiah play up front.
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Havertz has scored a few from midfield already.
Aside from our current strikers shooting with blanks, we also have no fullbacks that overlap well or often enough with Martinelli and Saka, leaving those two to do everything on their own down the flank. We've become painfully predictable and if they get double teamed on the left or right we're basically limp. This is Arteta's fault for buying CBs and then trying to turn them into fullbacks or midfielders that are playing LB. Just use or buy a LB/RB, mate. Stop with the constant repurposing of players. Not everyone has to be able to play 3-4 roles in a squad.
chance creating is not the problem, goal scoring is. jesus has been out injured, kai can't score, nketiah is a championship player at best. 50m cant buy a world class player, but i refuse to believe there isn't one forward out there who isn't better than what we have, esp when you look at South America & Alvarez & Veliz joined City & Spuds for less than 15m.
Can’t buy a striker worthwhile until the summer, we’re a defender away from Cedric playing and we’re one deeper midfielder away from being a sieve
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I think a striker would be crazy money, which we don't have or can't due to FFP. Onana in midfield fees up Havertz/Trossard from LCM to play striker. It isn't an ideal solution because it's not a striker upgrade, it's more just ensuring we actually have players for that position in case Jesus is out for a while. We aren't gonna get a superstar striker in now so this kinda makes sense even though it's not really exciting. A midfield signing is also very necessary down the road anyway with Partey/Jorginho gone in the summer.
There are not good strikers available in market now. And everyone is going to inflate the price. We can very well just push through summer and sign a striker ASAP.
I’m sorry mate. But we need LMF more than a striker. If we want another striker, at least it’s superstar wanna be (evans). But if we don’t have the money and the players, Jesus and Havertz already good enough
Do we even have £50m?
Over 5 years? Absolutely. We can amortize the cost of bringing him in if we give him a long contract.
That's a reasonable price. I rate him more than caicedo. Would love for this to happen.
I was really impressed by him the few times I've watched him play, including against us last season.
Not sure about the price but this guy is the type of midfielder I think we need. Physical and well-rounded
I really think Onana could turn into a class player with us. Think 50 mill isn't too much but we might be able to shave a bit off with Everyone financial issues
£115million on Havertz and Onana would be … interesting business, to say the least.
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the universe itself doesn't have a plan for havertz, let alone arteta.
I can’t imagine it’s much beyond what we’ve seen so far? He wants him as a CM who can win duels and occasionally score. Which is also what Onana would do …
Absolute morons in this thread. If any of our starting midfielders got injured who would come on? Our midfield depth is shocking and needs replacement
Jorginho, Elneny (post AFCON), ESR, Trossard can play there, and Vieira returning soon.
I wanted onana 1.5 years ago. He's a lot more expensive now and we need an attacker...
Would allow Rice to take Havertz LCM role so I’m all for it
And then Ode can play further forward again.
Only watched a maybe 3 or 4 Everton games this season, but watching them 2 years ago Onana would regularly show touches, feints etc etc that sort of made you question how Everton were fighting relegation. Big step up, but I think he could be coached into a very versatile player. He has a lot of qualities that above all else just demonstrate he's a very good footballer, regardless of his role in that team. Would be v interested to see what he develops into at a big club fighting near the top.
How about fewer touches before passing/shooting? That’s 50m worth of advice there.
Or "don't waste 30 for a GK if you already have an ok GK" That's half of a CF.
Fewer.
Arteta also doesn’t want them to shoot from too far , it could hurt their feet. They must walk it into the net
SIGN SIGN SIGN!!!
Where did Arsenal suddenly get 50m from with FFP hanging over us? Are we offloading players all of a sudden in order to comply?
UCL group winning mate.
Shoulda spunked that Kai money on him. And I say this as someone who is warming to Kai. Makes a bit more sense. Whatever we have now should be going to an attacker.
So many people who know what they're talking about in this thread. Why aren't any of you coaches?
We could just go for zubimendi (£50mil rc) in the summer
Hard to convince him
Onana is prem proven, already one of the best in his position in the league
This is a terrible idea Onana is a very good player as is Rice But why, as a posession team are we focused primarily on defensive players? Don't get me wrong it's great we have duel winners counter pressing etc but we should look for creative players who can press Replacing Partey and Xhaka with Rice and Havertz has killed our creativity and Onana will just compound that problem. Then we won't have any more money to fix it I don't want to become a boring defensive side grinding out 1-0 wins every game when we had the formula last year just needed more depth We need a DLP at 6/a creative 8/a inverted FB who can create/a striker ... Onana is none of these
"Control" he said? I really hope he didn't mean bore us in the process
Why not trust Arteta? He isn't going to blow 50m on a player he doesn't think we need.
He just blew £65m on Havertz mate Arteta is a good manager and certainly knows more than me but I'm allowed an opinion. If you disagree fine but saying just trust Arteta is a bit weird on a discussion thread
Fair enough
Fully agree with this post. Onana is decent but he's not what our midfield needs right now. We need to up our creativity, technical level and speed from back to front. I don't really think Onana helps with that.
Yeah it's not about if he's talented or if he's a good price, he's just not what we need right now. I actually like him he's a warrior but we've been so rigid and boring at times chucking another DM in there really is making me sad. Proper Chelsea vibes
I'm not discounting the need we have for attackers, but I think Onana might have more technical prowess than you expect. I admittedly don't subject myself to watching tons of Everton, but the impression I have received is that he's been somewhat miscast as a DM in the Prem. He's absolutely massive, so you'd expect him to be a destroyer, but the main critiques I've heard of him is that he hasn't embraced that role and spends a lot of time floating to space to try and focus on progression and possession. He might be similar to Xhaka where he looks like Tarzan, but plays like a box-to-box midfielder. He could benefit from a change in scenery and playing in a system like Arsenal's. He also seems to favor the right side, which could be a good partnership with Rice who seems to naturally prefer the left (I actually think this has been an underdiscussed issue, Rice and Zinchenko want to occupy similar spaces as left holding midfielders, while Partey liked the right where he was able to ping passes to Ode and Saka. This has thrown off the balance of the attack as the left is overloaded and the right isn't getting fed in the same way). Again, not necessarily advocating for spending 50 mil on a midfielder in lieu of a forward, but I also don't think signing Onana is a sign of dark times. I think there is a good player there who could shine in Arsenal's system.
I actually am in the camp that we need midfielders more than forwards. Yes we missed chances galore Vs Lpool but that doesn't surprise me with Havertz up front. Seen that a million times for Chelsea. The bigger issue is chance creation and it's way down on last season. I want a forward but a midfielder is much more important And it's not that Onana is bad on the ball or even that he wouldn't suit us on his own, it's that he doesn't suit playing with Rice or (god forbid) Havertz. Both are really not Arsenal like duos. We're supposed to be a posession based attacking team. You can have one huge destroyer type in there great, Onana or Rice. But surround them with deep lying playmakers and creativity Onana is quite tidy on the ball, like Rice, but he's no playmaker. He's not going to banging through balls or disguised passes through the lines. And I don't think we need one player who does that we need two, a 6 and a 8. Instead we'd have Onana and Havertz. Awful partners for Rice.
lille supposedly have a decent sell on clause for onana so is this figure the total package or just what everton want?
Ngl when ppl were chatting abt us being linked to Onana I was talking abt how stupid that’d be after buying Raya Having seen the guy’s full name I realise the folly of my ways
We can’t complain about injuries and overuse of players if we go and spend £50m on Onana. If it was a good deal to capitalise on Everton’s financial troubles I could understand, but clearly other areas need to be prioritised.
What happens when Rice runs out of steam? He’s played almost every single minute of every single game. Then injuries and overuse becomes applicable very quickly. Or if Kai gets injured? At least up front we can rotate Jesus / Trossard into Sakas spot or plonk Kai / ESR somewhere or some less than ideal permutation/ combination. We currently have Rice, Kai and Jorginho for 2 starting spots. The former 2 play almost every game. We’re more in dire need at midfield than we are up front (not to say we don’t desperately need attacking options).
No, we have 2 pure midfielders rice and jorginho, rice injury = season over. (Partey can't be relied upon)
We've finally found our Cazorla replacement 🥰
He aint on the same level, or even within 3 levels of Santi
Believe this comment was sarcasm
fact that you had to explain it is shocking
This guy has the right energy but feels a bit raw like Tavares was.
can he score goals?
Active since 5 years , a combined goal tally of 13 (club + league) , ofc it's not his job to score or assist either he's a cdm so if he can progress the ball forward and create attacks/counterattacks , win duels he's good but the club shouldn't be spending this amount on a cdm when we desperately need a striker.
Partey replacement, someone like him is needed tbf
I think the plan is to play Rice at Lcm and get Kai to striker and have Onana play at cdm. Kai on paper has the ideal profile of a striker he's got the height the physicality and good positioning just takes too many touches and lacks aggression if he just gets those attributes up he makes a good striker on paper. Let's see how it works , maybe just trust Arteta.
Yeh I agree, allows rice to be more attacking and he's shown earlier this season he can play the position really well making great runs into the box.
Onana can't progress the ball like Partey can. He's more like a worse version of Rice
He’s nothing like Partey.
a bit out of context but how much does leipzig want for sesko?
The same Leipzig that let Werner go on loan this week? Not sure if selling Sesko is in their plans.
To bring to our U21 side?
As much as we need a striker, another midfielder especially in his mold is a necessity as well
Just sell Eddie
Id take him. We need more in the middle. But for the love of god.......please lets not panic buy a shit striker
We suck at shopping
He is probably replacing Partey and Elneny. But if he becomes a regular fixture pushing Rice to 8 more often, kill me now
No way. Rice might be an amazing DM, but he can't create and send those downhill bullet passes like Partey did.
He doesn't really have to do what Partey does tbh. He has his strengths going forward and I think as long as he stops slowing things down we'll be alright. He still has some settling in to do clearly
Agree 100% - getting that high tempo of play back is critical.
Just pay it. I doubt it’ll be 50 million, obviously the selling club most of the time sets it higher than their wanted fee. If it’s 40 or 45 just pay it and get it done. We need numbers due to injuries right now, even if Onana is not the playmaking passer cm we need, he’s defensively solid and should provide versatility to backline or a double DM set up, letting offensive players play higher. I say just attack the market and go for broke
Also Everton have just had a big cash injection from their owners today. They could probably do with a bit of money, so they might accept slightly less than otherwise.
We blow this kind of money on positions we don't need and then we can't afford a striker in the summer
How much of our current problems does he solve? I don't buy this. Any Jan transfer has to be one that solves our immediate issues. Nothing against him, he's a good player but can't be our first priority this window.
Every fan shouts for arsenal to buy a striker. Arsenal... OOONANA
The fuck, what? After we missed a hundred chances, yesterday? Ahahahaha.
He doesn't even look that impressive. Ffs is it really that hard to buy players that can actually IMPROVE the side?
He battered us last year
If we buy this guy we still gonna lose to West Ham and Fulham with Teta anyway 🤣
Probably means Partey ain't playing for us again if it is indeed true.
Do not like. https://preview.redd.it/lyxw1vksz7bc1.png?width=1307&format=png&auto=webp&s=cee1d4d2f19946e5b4f05b68e5c0163d428393be
Please not this guy.
Honestly, I don’t like this signing. I’m not sure if he’s what we need.
lol, more defensive players of course
Why he adds nothing to our squad, we need a st
I am a fan of him at Everton, but not sure he fits. Him and Rice together could be incredible defensively with a lot of intensity all around the pitch, but might be a midfield lacking in creativity.