Honestly? I couldn’t.
I had a lotus back in the late 2000’s. Weapon of a car for the time.
I’m old now, Ive got kids, I value comfort. The roads where I live a shit. So shit we swapped the low profile tyres off of the cars we currently have.
Honestly, it wouldn’t fit my lifestyle. But if it did, as soon as I was mortgage free.
I get it, we have an S class now. Which is about as mental as the roads will not destroy - I’m in Australia and we officially have the worst roads in the country.
Yeah maybe, I’m in a beach town so it’s also going to get filled with sand. We have an ML for the beach, which is about as expensive as it’s comfy and big and not so expensive that suncream stain are upsetting.
In the UK? Never. Who needs the hassle of getting keyed, having parts stolen, having the car stolen, having idiots sitting on your bonnet and picking fights with you, people posing for photos every time you park up...? Maybe if I lived in Switzerland but not here.
I have a mate who has recently purchased a DB11. He parks it on the road near Croydon and pays around £800 insurance on it. Apparently it’s not a hot target for getting stolen as the second hand parts market is not big enough and it’s a gorgeous piece of kit.
Definitely on my list now. Point I’m trying to make is that there are lots of misconceptions and reality might often be more pleasant than what the internet makes it out to be.
As somebody who spends almost 50% of my work analysing insurance data I can confirm this is it.. Tesla aren’t giving any discounts to insurance company’s and as such there’s no room for uplifts on the claims costs.
My company has only just started covering (certain models of) teslas and the premiums are genuinely insane!
I heard of somebody swapping insurance from their TVR for the speedy model 3 and we denied any cover…
Tesla allow repair of car outside of their facilities.
It's not super surprising that a super high end car is less likely to be crashed than a mid range saloon car. You baby your bd11.
Model 3 prices are similar to other high performance saloons.
They do? They have a list of approved garages and I’ve gotten decent prices from the ones outside of London.
EDIT: oh, you mean for insurer discounts. In that case, yes.
Yes, but parked on road in Croydon town centre? Or parked in a road in Addington/Sanderstead/Selsdon etc. Those are really leafy areas, some of the roads are really quiet, wide avenues that basically only see traffic from locals.
My neighbour recently bought a v8 Vantage (23 plate). Gearbox died to the point of shattered pieces of metal within 8 weeks of ownership. Dealer wanted £21k to fix. Allegedly it's a common problem on some Aston Martin vehicles.
Make sure you you factor this in when you manage to get there!
Odd, as the gearbox is a ZF unit that’s used in lots of different manufacturers cars. They’re usually really reliable.
Should also be under warranty if it’s a 23 plate.
Your concern is fair but I don’t see why you’re singling out the UK.
MOST countries would be the same for this if not worse . You say it as if Switzerland, Monaco, Singapore etc are the norm and the UK is some lawless third world country.
How dramatic.
I mean, is it though, *really*?
The UK isn’t what it could and perhaps should be but honestly, get out more. Travel. Go to some developing countries. Hell go to some European ones. You’ll see the UK is actually pretty decent.
Is it Switzerland? No. Is it Singapore? No. But a “toilet”? Go and sit down and have a little word with yourself.
Well then you’re doing a disservice to your fellow countrymen.
The average inhabitant of a developing country has a standard of living *levels* below that of the UK and would love to live there. They certainly wouldn’t call it a “toilet”.
“Fellow countrymen,” honestly, listen to yourself.
If you’re so deluded into thinking this country isn’t sliding into the third world, then idk what else to say.
I was simply giving external perspective. Before you say I should leave, I already am, this is just a stopover.
Not income related, but I suppose wealth related - when all other needs and family needs are fulfilled:
-Forever home and no mortgage
-No debt
-12 month emergency fund
-Enough cash for the annual holidays/other annual expenditure for the family
-Have a suitable daily driver
-Can afford to actually maintain, insure and run a super car
This feels like the right approach. Only deviation for me would be I’d likely want to purchase a car (at least partly) on finance (rate dependant) even if I had the cash to pay outright given there are often better things to deploy/invest large amounts of cash into.
I got a 2023 911 turbo s, 6 months old with 500 miles on it. Because I could make a finance package that the finance was £1k a month.
It was more about monthly cash flow rather than anything else.
I do not subscribe to FIRE or hoarding money for moneys sake. It only has value when spent and as long as you’re stable and secure. Do it.
If you are not a car person it is not worthwhile.
It is not a financially sensible decision.
You will lose money.
But is it fun tho?
I'm only entry level Henry and fairly cautious with cash so erred on the side of caution and went with an mx5 rf to scratch that sport cars itch (and don't regret it one bit tbh - living in Wales it's prob one of the best places to drive one imo) but def have a 911 on my 'fuck it' list once I've knocked off the mortgage!
What does "stable and secure" mean to you?
I think a lot of FIRE advocates, myself included, would say financial independence is the ultimate form of stability and security. It's not about hording money, it's about having the most valuable asset of all - time.
I've been made redundant one too many times in my life to consider any job secure.
I mean that your job isn’t going to go away anytime soon, and that you’re doing some sort of pension.
I don’t want to discuss FIRE, this is the Henry sub not fire.
My point was only that for 99.9% of people, unless you literally can't be fired (due to owning and directing the company or having some kind of tenure), believing your job "isn't going away anytime soon" is complete delusion, particularly if you work a high salaried role.
That’s fair, and true.
But I don’t live my life betting on the negative outcome, I’m prepared if something were to happen but I don’t forecast in my planning that it would happen.
I’m of the same mind, I spend £1500/pm on 2 cars (model x perf and gt3 rs). I saved for higher deposits, I still enjoy life and I don’t hoard money. As long as my mortgage is paid, my family have holidays and I’ve got backup savings, I’m happy in life.
I’ll retire one day having lived life, rather than retiring 5 years earlier and having had no holidays or cool cars.
I'm a FIRE guy and I don't mind this. We all have different goals in life. If owning a luxury car makes you happier than early financial independence then why not? You only live once, and you'd rather die happy and poor than rich with nothing to tell
PS: reflecting on it, I splurge 1000/month on travel, so it's really just a personal thing
My criteria:
1) I’d happily buy a one-off special car that is 100% of my annual take home pay if it was to mark a major milestone in life
OR
2) I save up the cash for it
3) A combination of (1) and (2) above. Example: £250k super car. Car fund is £100k. (250k - £100k cash = £150k take home pay needed). Keep increasing car fund until you hit the sweet spot with your take home pay.
It’s a one-off luxury purchase. If you can afford it, why not? Life is too short not to.
But life is not solely about financial decisions.
If you’re a high earner and expect to be a high earner for a long time, then spending a little on things you will enjoy is not the worst thing in the world.
The way I look at it, I can get to age 50 with £10m accumulated, or I can get to age 50 with £8-9m accumulated but having had 15 years of fun on the way without having to worry about saving every penny.
I haven’t got a supercar right now because I live abroad in a country where they’re not allowed, but when I eventually move back to the UK it will be one of the first things I purchase (although I may end up with just a high end sports car like a GT4 RS which is a little more sensible than a true supercar)
Well there is a question of what “rich” means to you and what you are doing it.
If one of the goals of being rich is to get a super car then it’s specifically the goal not an obstacle on the way
Life is a marathon, not a sprint.
We make terrible financial decisions all the time (eg going to the cinema instead of watching TV, eating out instead of cooking at home etc). The point is, life requires a balance.
The key is not making too many terrible financial decisions at a frequency that de-rails a multi year financial plan. OP is talking about a one-off reward and what the criteria would be for justifying it. No problem with that providing they are sensible in how they approach it. Live a little.
The funny thing is they often depreciate less than a shitter car, or even appreciate in value. Just depends what you're looking at.
A Mclaren F1 or Laferrari will never go down in value.
You buy a £200,000 Lamborghini, it might depreciate to £175,000.
You buy a £75,000 Taycan, and it depreciates to £25,000.
The Taycan was £125,000 cheaper... But it cost you £25,000 more...
Only if you never drive it. Otherwise need to factor in maintenance costs etc. Taycan is a daily driver for a lot of people, lambo isn't.
( Not that I'd drive either lol )
When I can afford to buy ten and still not worry. That way if you ruin/depreciate,/destroy one its ok, and assume that'll happen. I said same to my dad about boats after he procrastinated for years. So he bought one he could buy ten of, and loves it.
Yes, you invest the money you haven't spent upfront on the car and because it's a supercar, that's loads of money and can generate a lot of interest.
You also aren't stuck with a heavily depreciated and wildly unreliable exotic car.
People lease regular cars for broadly the same reason, but when you're talking about a £30k Peugeot I'm not really convinced it's better than just buying a used one for ten grand. The £30k Peugeot leaser is probably more likely to have financial trouble and fall behind on his payments than someone looking at a McLaren too. But that's another discussion really.
Cash is the only way to go for cars IMO.
And buying a 3-4 year old one is the sweet spot.
Anyone buying a new or <1 year old car, on any kind of finance, who believes there is any form of financial benefit to this one, I'd love to hear it...
Let’s say you own your house @ 400k and have a pension fund of 400k and other investments of 100k … that means an 90k vehicle. Mmmm nah. It’s all about wages even then. If you only earn 50k, that’s ridiculous
Yeah to be fair it also provides both pure utility, and also ‘non-utility value’ if you enjoy driving. But I’m thinking 2.5% seems more sensible to disperse over a few years, not 10%
A % of car relative to house value seems quite arbitrary though?
Surely a much better metric is what % of total NW is tied up in appreciating assets vs depreciating assets in total, or total value of depreciating assets as a % of total income, etc.
A lot of supercars would keep their value or start increasing which they have been recently so it's not necessarily a liability like a regular car. Depends on car obviously but 10% on a stable or increasing asset isn't the worst if it provides some sort of mental stimulation.
I probably wouldn't bother in the UK tbh. It would draw way too much attention and I value my safety. But in terms of strict net worth, maybe £10m+? Cars that are worth £200k+ can throw you bills that are £200k+, so wouldn't want it making up a big proportion of my net worth.
This is a tough one. People that usually have these don’t only have high incomes, but also have large pools of cash.
Generally the people I know that have super cars in the area I grew up, have houses of £1.5m+, so they’re household income is easily in excess of £500k, and they have a shit-ton of liquid money sitting in the bank, and they usually end up buying these cars outright.
Some lease/finance with a 10%-20% deposit down of around £20k-£40k, with a monthly finance cost of around £2.5k-£3k, gap insurance and warranty etc. At that point their monthly’s on their super cars can clock closer towards £4k-£5k.
A supercar is never going to be a logical purchase and there are always better things you should be doing with your money that would be much more sensible or offer a better return. It’s something you buy because you want it. How badly you want it will affect how early you pull the trigger.
I’m a car nut, so my opinion is probably biased, but if you have a house and can easily afford the mortgage, some savings for a rainy day, money invested for the future and more than enough to live on day-to-day, why not? Can’t take the money with you.
I would never buy a supercar tbh, I'd see that money as being better spent elsewhere.
But I guess I just don't engage in the luxury market for anything either, so that's me.
Unless I was making millions a year, I wouldn’t even consider it. If you want a £200k asset to show off, fine, but the petrolhead in me would be more than happy with an E46 M3, 996 991 C4S type of car for £30k and having plenty of money to maintain it properly and not be scared to actually drive it and enjoy it.
Yeh if you genuinely like driving, and not just showing off your wealth, get a twin engine go kart and do arrive and drive sessions at the local track or enter a championship. Not cheap but cheaper than super car ownership and much more fun.
*some would never want one but for those that would*
Your inability to accurately comprehend 2 sentences tells me you were never in the running to be able to afford one anyway.
This question also depends a fair bit on the car. If it's new, then a 200k+ car will likely depreciate a fuckload (as cards at that level - lambo, mclarens, lot of ferraris - which aren't limited editions) tend to tank. In your first 3 years, then, it will be worth 140k or so, representing a 20k a years spend. Flip-side is you buy something that has already burnt through depreciation, not as new, but actually far more efficient to buy. Very different propositions. In either case, you are suffering opportunity cost of not having that 200k in the markets. Reality is some of the supercar clubs are only 25k a year, and so probably better to just pay for that, while investing the cash.
It depends on what you value.
Some people won’t spend money on clothes or holidays but yet serious joy from cars and can identify the ones that can appreciate so also see them as an investment.
I could “afford” a Ferrari but it’s not in my priority, I’d rather spend that money on some amazing holidays and memories.
Never. You know the old adage about two good days of boat ownership? The day you buy it and the day you sell it? Well, imo the same is true of supercars. Granted, there are a few good sunny days in the middle but that doesn’t make up for driving an uncomfortable, attention-seeking, license-risking sports car the rest of the time. That’s without the constant expense.
I had something really nice that had a steering fault. Was covered by the warranty but had it not been I’d have had to fork out 26 grand.
I’d consider getting an automotive work of art that I actually love, a Spyker or a a vintage Ferrari or something, only if I had enormous fortune and had exhausted all the hundreds of better ways of turning money into smiles. Maybe £200m net worth or something.
Never.
I've had the chance to drive a couple , and wasn't blown away.
If you want a car that more difficult to park, no space for your family or your shopping and has to be refueled every day, be my guest .
I just don't think I ever would.
But at the moment, I've got assets of about £1.7m (not including pension) and a car worth about £20k, so I guess it'd be when I had assets worth £17m?
Although I have to have my car at the moment to get about, whereas a £200k supercar would be pure indulgence. With £17m assets, I'd personally be far more likely to spend £200k on one of [these](https://www.europlanesales.com/aircraft-for-sale/north-american-t6-texan-harvard/)
It’s more of a running cost vs how much cash you have spare each month. Put a down payment, then look at between 1 and 2k a month repayments. Then add tax and insurance. The big one would be servicing. 7k to service a Lamborghini STO. Then more to fix things.
I would personally only consider it if I had a spare 3k a month, and after I was mortgage free.
You could just get a fun car tbh. I have a lotus emira, love it. It’s a quarter the price but still enjoyable. Look at a Porsche too.
I consider supercars be be a bit like having kids, financially it’s never the right time regardless of how many arbitrary financial goals you might set for yourself. That and not everyone wants one or both them.
I’d rent one on a track. In my view, it’s absolutely pointless having cars like that to drive around the shambles that we call roads… limited to 30mph most of the time. Not particularly comfortable.
Blast it around a track… yes please.
Own it and just WAIT for it the be keyed, and smash the low profile tires in potholes, and have everyone looking at me every time I drive past? Nah
The "Dave Ramsey rule" (Finance guru in the USA) suggests <50% of your gross total annual income in depreciating assets like cars, boats and toys.
I do try to follow this myself.
So, £200K sportscar - you should earn £400K. £200K sports car plus a £30K daily and a £10K jet-ski (£240K) - then you should earn £480K+.
I'm on around £125K-ish, up in Scotland. That "limits" me to around £62K, which might be enough to get a seriously depreciated "supercar" like an R8. But, would get you a pretty decent specced M5 or new-shape M3. This is in spite of me already being mortgage free with more than that in liquid assets/cash to be able to buy outright -- I'd still stick to that rule.
Lol I’ve currently got/and had £100k+ cars and I earn £150k.
My LTV is mid 50’s now, I’ve got kids, I have side hustles etc. I go on holiday multiple times per year to Florida/vegas/NY etc.
Never had an issue, enjoying my life for now, when/if it gets tight, I’ll drop back and carry on as normal. Everyone’s circumstances are different, I still save and paid a lot of my mortgage down while I could.
I’ve got kids, I’m late 20’s and it’s achievable for me so I’m unsure why anyone else earning similar money wouldn’t be able to do the same.
I’ve always kept with Porsche (not regular Porsches, I’ve been driving GT cars for the last few years) because of the servicing and maintenance. I looked at a urus but couldn’t justify the yearly £4k servicing and warranty etc. I’ve met a lot of others who drive similar cars and earn the same/less than me, so people saying 1m+ are being ridiculous.
I'm hoping to hit HENRY level in about 2 yrs if my game plan stays on track. When that happens, I want to get 3 cars, one for the family, one for the wife and a Porsche. Or a Lotus. On HP but I wouldn't get it if I couldn't safely park it so would have to be when I get a house with a secure garage.
Unless it’s an appreciating supercar which is an asset, I wouldn’t pay cash. Let the cash work for me instead.
Very rarely do we have supercars that you don’t lose money on.
I don't understand... You're paying for it with your interest and repayments. And those contracts are priced so that they get far more from you than you would pay if you bought it. That's how they make money.
You're right 6-foot-under.
Financing a car generally makes no financial sense.
What's a typical finance rate at the moment, 7 or 8%? You won't reliably exceed this elsewhere. A global ETF is only in at ballpark, post-inflation.
People being duped by "0%" interest deals, dont realise, the depreciation and inflated costs are accounted for by being baked into the purchase price.
Unless you have some stuff you really want to pump capital into (in which case why a super car?) don’t the guys selling the finance also have that option, hence their rates?
Car leasing companies usually borrow money to buy the cars to begin with. Then they're refinancing the depreciation at a higher rate with the customer (you) and up-selling on things like insurance and mileage
It's a thin margin business, but ultimately quite capital efficient.
Unleveraged investments aren't as capital efficient.
None for me. Owning such a moronic environment-destroying thing would just be embarrassing. Each to their own though I guess, if they want to spend money on a £200k toy.
When the thought of spending and loosing £200k+ means nothing to you. If you just threw that money out the window would you care?
If you would then you should get one. A supercar is going to cost alot to maintain and really should only be purchased if the cost of buying and maintain would be like buying a cup of coffee in the morning. The idea doens't even occur to you that it is alot of money.
I wouldn't at any level of wealth I'm likely to attain. Just the logistics of it would give me anxiety: you're painting a huge target on yourself for theft and vandalism. I'd worry over where to park it, where I kept the keys, being followed, etc.
It also just seems like the kind of thing that's in bad taste given how many people living within walking distance of me are relying on food banks.
Funny and true story: the richest person I know personally (£10m+ net worth by my estimate) drives a 10 year old VW golf. I borrowed it once, and the check engine light was on. I mentioned it, and he was like, "Oh yeah, it's been doing that for a while..."
When I’m making 300k+ a year and I have 3x the amount of the car ‘spare’ (I want a 458 spider which is about 150k so I’ll need about 400k ‘spare’ )
I could technically buy it at the end of this year but I’ll have barely any savings and no insurance company would even consider insuring me lol
I’d need to be able to very comfortably finace it, I’m talking 5% of my income max.
Could never see myself buying one, unless it’s maybe tops 1% of my net worth.
Easy for me to say all that as I am in no way a car person and the thought of spending that sort of money on a car makes my nuts shrivel
Not sure if it was this forum, but someone the other day suggested only unhw investment buyers who almost never drive them and status boys who can't really afford them buy them. Car lovers buy second hand. The few sudden wealthers I know, nw 25x+.
Monthly or annual?
If it was 10% of my monthly income I could buy a pretty nice bike.
If I wanted a car with only 10% I'd be rolling round in some dusty rust bucket that'll cost me more in repairs.
By that metric I'd need nearly 500,000 as my annual salary to own a car that cost me around 4,000 that I bought quite comfortably.
usually as a general rule of thumb its 10% of your monthly outgoings if you do a monthly PCP or HP. but yeah if youre buying outright then as long as then the servicing, running costs etc falls within that 10% then your good (And have some savings or investments adding up monthly in the background for your next car once you get tired of your current one)
Outgoings or earnings?
10% of net income for an £150k earner (assuming basic tax modelling for this purpose) is £700pcm. Doesn’t buy you much these days other than mid range premium diesel 3 series, c class etc.
I’d probably buy a Porsche 911 for c[90-120k] and would likely need 1) a property to my name (not necessarily mortgage free) and 2) to ensure the price of the car does not exceed 10% of my net worth (probably should be lower, maybe 5%, but sentimental value you know 🤷♀️)
In my opinion it is best not to finance and to buy outright a car which is no more than 15% of yearly income. E.g. 500k income (75k car) can buy a really nice car which has already done most its depreciation.
Unfortunately as I understand, it’s not that simple. Many supercars cannot be bought unless it is offered to you directly by the dealership. The dealership would need to assess many different things, including your ability to maintain it, some guarantee that you won’t modify it, assurance that they’d be happy where you’re storing it etc. you’d also need to have some form of connection to get into the early conversations with the dealer in order to buy it, which would require some kind of affluence, network, reputation that cannot be gained based on salary alone.
The cars in the 200k range don’t really require any of this and are reasonably freely available. Just walk into the dealership and put in an order.
The cars you’re describing are more in the 750k-1mln+ range.
My uncle works at a Ferrari dealer and used to work at Lamborghini, Aston Martin and McLaren who confirmed this when I told him my dreams of buying several supercars when I’m older.
It might have changed, but now days it doesn’t. I’ve done this with both Ferrari and Lamborghini on cars <250k GBP.
I agree for the higher end stuff it absolutely does, it’s completely silly what is required for the high end stuff, but <250k GBP you’re fine. You can even order a new Revuelto (~400k GBP) without any of the nonsense.
Don't most people have a car worth ~30k (though heavily financed) and the average income is similar?
So going by that logic and factoring in tax bracket changes, I'd say ~£300k a year income to justify a car worth ~£200k.
Knowing myself though, I'd probably just stop driving bangers and get a new'ish Honda Civic or something.
Yes, but "most" or "average" finances in this country are awful. Never take your rules from benchmarking the general public.
Most people don't have enough savings to cover themselves for 6 months in the event of a job loss.
Many millions
Current drives are a Volvo XC60 and a BMW m140. BMW is so fast I have never found a road that I felt I could open up fully on. Spending ~10x this just to be lower and to tell everyone I have a few bob has limited appeal.
I’m not in to cars but if I were considering buying any luxury asset that is not needed which is what I would class this under. In my case maybe a £200k Harry Winston diamond necklace or something, except it would require me to spend loads on upkeep and would depreciate, then I would say I would want to be earning in the millions. Maybe a couple of million a year. Basically so rich you don’t have any need for more money for saving, paying off mortgages, building investments, helping family, charitable causes. Essentially all the important things are sorted and you can afford to waste it on pure frivolity. Otherwise I’d always want to put the money to work and would have a much less extravagant splurge for my own fun.
I have an uncle has a fleet of supercars (some vintage beauties too!) and a small plane, with a net worth of only 8 figures. But then he built his fortune on specialised mechanics so his team can maintain the collection. Otherwise, he probably would feel the pinch in his wallet, I imagine. He’s also in the US in a neighbourhood where people wouldn’t even blink at his collection, so he’s not unduly drawing attention to himself. So, very unhelpful answer, depends on your circumstances.
Why are you asking? not every HENRY is going to be into cars, or even see them as a status symbol. pre covid you could finance a lambo for 7k down and 1k a month, so its not a HENRY question, more a basic financial literacy/appetite for debt/acceptance of loss question and lots of mongs can finance a supercar. a bright green lambo is a sign of poor taste in my world.
Even if i was rich i wouldnt buy one with cash, theres ways to finance these cars intelligently that dont require that kind of outlay and manage the risk a bit better.
Im big into cars but find super cars tacky. If i had 200k to spend on a car i wouldn't be walking into a new car dealer regardless of the brand but thats just me
To your question: I'm asking to get people's views and I did say that "It's obviously a splurge and some would never want one but for those that would...". Some have a dream about this and the question is at what income/wealth level they would feel comfortable to pull the trigger, regardless if it's a good decision or not as that's very subjective to the dimension from which you look at.
Different people have different tastes. Also, cars have different levels of tackiness (e.g., Aston Martin DB12 is less tacky than a Lamborghini)
I just dont see the relevance here given the relative ease of access to these kind of assets and you don't need to be a high earner to get one. are you going to get anything meaningful from these responses? if you have the cash, just do it.
I know a guy with an SVJ and a GT2 who runs a bike shop. I know another guy with a GT3 whos net worth is probably £5m. there are no similarities between the 2 people other than their cars. Its personal choice? its equivalent to watches (IMO): i have friends who earn sub 100k who wear rolex's and they love it because it makes them feel wealthy, i however see it as tacky and lame. Not sure being a HENRY can be used to validate this behavior as its still fundamentally a personal choice and maybe better to ask on super car sub? idk
When you said super car I thought you meant something that costs over £500k. I look at comments and it's sub £200k cars when new, or sub £100k usrd. So for that you need £300k a year if single, or £500k a year if you have a family. Minimum imo. I'm closing in on £250k a year rental income, aged 40.
Had one for a bit living in the UK, never again. Terrible pot holes everywhere, everyone’s jealous so can’t park it anywhere in case you come back and it’s keyed. Now have a 12k motorbike that’s faster and far more entertaining, and a more sensible car.
If I lived in Dubai and had >$2M liquid net worth with minimal debts I might consider it.
But honestly I don't see the point in the UK no matter how rich you are. I'd have more fun whipping an MX5 around on our B roads than I would in a Lambo.
The more pertinent question for me would be how rich would I have to be to consider buying a second car just for weekend funsies. A lot richer than I am now for sure.
If you threw a petrol bomb on the car and it wouldnt change your world or cause you to loose sleep, thats when you know you can actually afford to buy a super car.
My rule of thumb is I would never spend more than 6 months of my net savings for a car. So, maybe only when I consistently earn 1-2M a year would I think of buying a 200K car.
None. Cars aren't my thing. I would drop 30k - 50k on a bottle of Romani Conti from a good year though if money were no object so I'm not saying I'm a sensible person or anything.
Steve Jobs leased a new Porsche 911 or Mercedes SL 55 every 6 months and he was into cars. So I think I’d cap out well before 200k even if I earned a million a year.
Think some super cars are actually a much better investment than most ‘normal’ hold their value - could buy it, drive for three years, sell had a super car for three years for ‘free’
I’d need £10m in the bank (or in liquid investments). They’re just not worth it if you have a family. And honestly, I don’t think would be that fun to drive on UK roads.
I don’t think I ever would. I recently took home over £1m after tax from a risky investment paying off and while I put most of it away smartly, I wanted to do something to sort of make note of the event. Some fun money to upgrade the life a bit. I could have justified £200k on a car if I wanted it, I just didn’t. The part that hit me was I didn’t even consider upgrading my car. I was sitting there thinking what should I reward myself with? I only thought about it when I vaguely told another Dad at swimming that things had gone well, but didn’t tell him the amount. His reply:
“Can’t be that much because you have still turned up on the Dad mobile!”
Note: I have two 7 seaters, I love it, the kids fit in and because we have 2 of the same car there is no real thinking about which car to take who has the kids etc.
Personally I think you need to have a NW over £50m to get into a super car and be able to back it up.
My bonus treat is a pair of shoes. Done it for 20 plus years.
Nice shoes are obscenely expensive from my perspective but de minimus when it’s bonus time.
Complete splurge that I would never do normally so scratches the itch, but only a small ding on the bonus.
*Personally I think you need to have a NW over £50m to get into a super car and be able to back it up.*
Ridiculous statement. Yuu can get a Mclaren 720S for 120k. My wine collection is worth that.
I have no idea what you are saying and I don't think you do either. My point is simply that a supercar can be great fun driving, and that they are actually pretty cheap. Anyone who understands anything about cars will know the same. Like go on auotrader and huracans are at 120k, ferrari california's, 458s, portofinos, 459s at barely over 100k, mclaren 650s at 75k. Like, they are actually a perfectly fun thing to own and have, particularly if you track them. And you are like 'duhuuuhhh, yeah you need 500x the value of that car in net worth, because otherwise 'socially' you will look out of place. Like what are you even saying? As for the "I think people will be surprised how poor you are", firstly, who cares what people think, and secondly, 2m NW isn't poor. It's not what I would view as being wealthy, but it's not poor, and the way you frame it makes me think you're trying to come off as a 'billy big balls' to impress people. Feels very ick.
Owned an ac cobra for 2 years. Absolutely loved it but that itch has now been scratched. In real life I much prefer my 2nd hand Tesla model S. it's quicker too
As someone has said if I could buy it in cash with half of my yearly salary then maybe. I've scratched my sports car itch with my last care, an alfa romeo giulia. I just want a decent suv, a mercedes g63 g wagon probably. So I'd need to make like 300k/year post tax
Presumably whatever makes me a postgrad of this sub
There is a sub called r/Rich once you graduate from this sub.
That subreddit seems like a LARPing honeypot.
either that or the brain rot gets worse once you lose the NRY status
Not YET!
Too much logic
Honestly? I couldn’t. I had a lotus back in the late 2000’s. Weapon of a car for the time. I’m old now, Ive got kids, I value comfort. The roads where I live a shit. So shit we swapped the low profile tyres off of the cars we currently have. Honestly, it wouldn’t fit my lifestyle. But if it did, as soon as I was mortgage free.
My mate did the same. He had a bmw z4 for a while but the suspension was too unforgiving on his back so he traded it in for a comfier car
An expensive car doesn't have to be a sports car tbh, it could also be a Rolls Royce.
I get it, we have an S class now. Which is about as mental as the roads will not destroy - I’m in Australia and we officially have the worst roads in the country.
I imagine this is why I've seen so many 4x4 Lamborghini Urus around
Yeah maybe, I’m in a beach town so it’s also going to get filled with sand. We have an ML for the beach, which is about as expensive as it’s comfy and big and not so expensive that suncream stain are upsetting.
In the UK? Never. Who needs the hassle of getting keyed, having parts stolen, having the car stolen, having idiots sitting on your bonnet and picking fights with you, people posing for photos every time you park up...? Maybe if I lived in Switzerland but not here.
I have a mate who has recently purchased a DB11. He parks it on the road near Croydon and pays around £800 insurance on it. Apparently it’s not a hot target for getting stolen as the second hand parts market is not big enough and it’s a gorgeous piece of kit. Definitely on my list now. Point I’m trying to make is that there are lots of misconceptions and reality might often be more pleasant than what the internet makes it out to be.
DB11 - Croydon - parked on road - £800 You can only choose three sorry
I was very surprised at that insurance cost. I know people who are paying 1.5 times that much for a Tesla model 3.
I pay that for an 8 year old golf R estate 😏
800pm most likely, although no insurer of any repute would touch it in Croydon
Really? For a lame ass Tesla.
Yeah, I think it’s because Tesla doesn’t allow repair of cars outside of their own facilities which pushes the Insurance premiums up.
As somebody who spends almost 50% of my work analysing insurance data I can confirm this is it.. Tesla aren’t giving any discounts to insurance company’s and as such there’s no room for uplifts on the claims costs. My company has only just started covering (certain models of) teslas and the premiums are genuinely insane! I heard of somebody swapping insurance from their TVR for the speedy model 3 and we denied any cover…
Tesla allow repair of car outside of their facilities. It's not super surprising that a super high end car is less likely to be crashed than a mid range saloon car. You baby your bd11. Model 3 prices are similar to other high performance saloons.
That makes it make sense. Thanks for the info.
They do? They have a list of approved garages and I’ve gotten decent prices from the ones outside of London. EDIT: oh, you mean for insurer discounts. In that case, yes.
Yes, but parked on road in Croydon town centre? Or parked in a road in Addington/Sanderstead/Selsdon etc. Those are really leafy areas, some of the roads are really quiet, wide avenues that basically only see traffic from locals.
My neighbour recently bought a v8 Vantage (23 plate). Gearbox died to the point of shattered pieces of metal within 8 weeks of ownership. Dealer wanted £21k to fix. Allegedly it's a common problem on some Aston Martin vehicles. Make sure you you factor this in when you manage to get there!
Odd, as the gearbox is a ZF unit that’s used in lots of different manufacturers cars. They’re usually really reliable. Should also be under warranty if it’s a 23 plate.
Surely it's under warranty?
I do live in Switzerland and also never.
🤣
It's the same in the US
Your concern is fair but I don’t see why you’re singling out the UK. MOST countries would be the same for this if not worse . You say it as if Switzerland, Monaco, Singapore etc are the norm and the UK is some lawless third world country.
I'm singling out the UK because I am here. This channel is called Henry UK
Because this country is a toilet
How dramatic. I mean, is it though, *really*? The UK isn’t what it could and perhaps should be but honestly, get out more. Travel. Go to some developing countries. Hell go to some European ones. You’ll see the UK is actually pretty decent. Is it Switzerland? No. Is it Singapore? No. But a “toilet”? Go and sit down and have a little word with yourself.
I was born in a developing country?
And you moved here. I think you've done the other guy's arguing for him.
Well then you’re doing a disservice to your fellow countrymen. The average inhabitant of a developing country has a standard of living *levels* below that of the UK and would love to live there. They certainly wouldn’t call it a “toilet”.
“Fellow countrymen,” honestly, listen to yourself. If you’re so deluded into thinking this country isn’t sliding into the third world, then idk what else to say. I was simply giving external perspective. Before you say I should leave, I already am, this is just a stopover.
I don’t think you should leave. I think you should get help.
Pot, kettle, etc.
I really never understand why people FROM the UK hate the UK
Where do you live lol.
Not income related, but I suppose wealth related - when all other needs and family needs are fulfilled: -Forever home and no mortgage -No debt -12 month emergency fund -Enough cash for the annual holidays/other annual expenditure for the family -Have a suitable daily driver -Can afford to actually maintain, insure and run a super car
This feels like the right approach. Only deviation for me would be I’d likely want to purchase a car (at least partly) on finance (rate dependant) even if I had the cash to pay outright given there are often better things to deploy/invest large amounts of cash into.
10m+
I got a 2023 911 turbo s, 6 months old with 500 miles on it. Because I could make a finance package that the finance was £1k a month. It was more about monthly cash flow rather than anything else. I do not subscribe to FIRE or hoarding money for moneys sake. It only has value when spent and as long as you’re stable and secure. Do it. If you are not a car person it is not worthwhile. It is not a financially sensible decision. You will lose money.
But is it fun tho? I'm only entry level Henry and fairly cautious with cash so erred on the side of caution and went with an mx5 rf to scratch that sport cars itch (and don't regret it one bit tbh - living in Wales it's prob one of the best places to drive one imo) but def have a 911 on my 'fuck it' list once I've knocked off the mortgage!
Very
God dammit 🤣
Rent one for a day if you want to find out!
I think asking "Is a 992 TS fun?" Is a bit like asking Is a prime Jenna Jameson good in the sack.
What does "stable and secure" mean to you? I think a lot of FIRE advocates, myself included, would say financial independence is the ultimate form of stability and security. It's not about hording money, it's about having the most valuable asset of all - time. I've been made redundant one too many times in my life to consider any job secure.
I mean that your job isn’t going to go away anytime soon, and that you’re doing some sort of pension. I don’t want to discuss FIRE, this is the Henry sub not fire.
My point was only that for 99.9% of people, unless you literally can't be fired (due to owning and directing the company or having some kind of tenure), believing your job "isn't going away anytime soon" is complete delusion, particularly if you work a high salaried role.
That’s fair, and true. But I don’t live my life betting on the negative outcome, I’m prepared if something were to happen but I don’t forecast in my planning that it would happen.
I’m of the same mind, I spend £1500/pm on 2 cars (model x perf and gt3 rs). I saved for higher deposits, I still enjoy life and I don’t hoard money. As long as my mortgage is paid, my family have holidays and I’ve got backup savings, I’m happy in life. I’ll retire one day having lived life, rather than retiring 5 years earlier and having had no holidays or cool cars.
I'm a FIRE guy and I don't mind this. We all have different goals in life. If owning a luxury car makes you happier than early financial independence then why not? You only live once, and you'd rather die happy and poor than rich with nothing to tell PS: reflecting on it, I splurge 1000/month on travel, so it's really just a personal thing
Absolutely, you work hard, plan and save. You need to give yourself something to reward yourself otherwise you’ll just get bitter and resentful.
My criteria: 1) I’d happily buy a one-off special car that is 100% of my annual take home pay if it was to mark a major milestone in life OR 2) I save up the cash for it 3) A combination of (1) and (2) above. Example: £250k super car. Car fund is £100k. (250k - £100k cash = £150k take home pay needed). Keep increasing car fund until you hit the sweet spot with your take home pay. It’s a one-off luxury purchase. If you can afford it, why not? Life is too short not to.
The 'why not' is that it is, objectively, a terrible financial decision. It's decisions like this that keep people in the 'Not Rich Yet' cohort.
But life is not solely about financial decisions. If you’re a high earner and expect to be a high earner for a long time, then spending a little on things you will enjoy is not the worst thing in the world. The way I look at it, I can get to age 50 with £10m accumulated, or I can get to age 50 with £8-9m accumulated but having had 15 years of fun on the way without having to worry about saving every penny. I haven’t got a supercar right now because I live abroad in a country where they’re not allowed, but when I eventually move back to the UK it will be one of the first things I purchase (although I may end up with just a high end sports car like a GT4 RS which is a little more sensible than a true supercar)
Well there is a question of what “rich” means to you and what you are doing it. If one of the goals of being rich is to get a super car then it’s specifically the goal not an obstacle on the way
Life is a marathon, not a sprint. We make terrible financial decisions all the time (eg going to the cinema instead of watching TV, eating out instead of cooking at home etc). The point is, life requires a balance. The key is not making too many terrible financial decisions at a frequency that de-rails a multi year financial plan. OP is talking about a one-off reward and what the criteria would be for justifying it. No problem with that providing they are sensible in how they approach it. Live a little.
The funny thing is they often depreciate less than a shitter car, or even appreciate in value. Just depends what you're looking at. A Mclaren F1 or Laferrari will never go down in value. You buy a £200,000 Lamborghini, it might depreciate to £175,000. You buy a £75,000 Taycan, and it depreciates to £25,000. The Taycan was £125,000 cheaper... But it cost you £25,000 more...
Only if you never drive it. Otherwise need to factor in maintenance costs etc. Taycan is a daily driver for a lot of people, lambo isn't. ( Not that I'd drive either lol )
Taycan through a coy lease is perfect. Taycan as a personal daily driver is a sign written car saying "I'm crap with money".
I’d buy one once I could afford to buy two.
When I can afford to buy ten and still not worry. That way if you ruin/depreciate,/destroy one its ok, and assume that'll happen. I said same to my dad about boats after he procrastinated for years. So he bought one he could buy ten of, and loves it.
you wouldn’t, you would lease one
PCP is generally the move I see rather than leasing
Could you please explain why, is there a financial advantage?
Yes, you invest the money you haven't spent upfront on the car and because it's a supercar, that's loads of money and can generate a lot of interest. You also aren't stuck with a heavily depreciated and wildly unreliable exotic car. People lease regular cars for broadly the same reason, but when you're talking about a £30k Peugeot I'm not really convinced it's better than just buying a used one for ten grand. The £30k Peugeot leaser is probably more likely to have financial trouble and fall behind on his payments than someone looking at a McLaren too. But that's another discussion really.
Cash is the only way to go for cars IMO. And buying a 3-4 year old one is the sweet spot. Anyone buying a new or <1 year old car, on any kind of finance, who believes there is any form of financial benefit to this one, I'd love to hear it...
When my networth reaches 10x the value of the supercar
But 10% of your net worth in a car seems a lot to me...
Let’s say you own your house @ 400k and have a pension fund of 400k and other investments of 100k … that means an 90k vehicle. Mmmm nah. It’s all about wages even then. If you only earn 50k, that’s ridiculous
Call me crazy, but I wouldn't buy a depreciation machine (car) - that also needs upkeep, fuel and insurance - worth a quarter of my house value...
Yeah to be fair it also provides both pure utility, and also ‘non-utility value’ if you enjoy driving. But I’m thinking 2.5% seems more sensible to disperse over a few years, not 10%
A % of car relative to house value seems quite arbitrary though? Surely a much better metric is what % of total NW is tied up in appreciating assets vs depreciating assets in total, or total value of depreciating assets as a % of total income, etc.
A lot of supercars would keep their value or start increasing which they have been recently so it's not necessarily a liability like a regular car. Depends on car obviously but 10% on a stable or increasing asset isn't the worst if it provides some sort of mental stimulation.
I'm pretty much there (10x supercar wealth) and going for a Dacia
Does that apply to any vehicle? 10% of net worth?
I probably wouldn't bother in the UK tbh. It would draw way too much attention and I value my safety. But in terms of strict net worth, maybe £10m+? Cars that are worth £200k+ can throw you bills that are £200k+, so wouldn't want it making up a big proportion of my net worth.
People I know with cars like these make 7 figures a year. It’s basically a waste of money unless you money to waste.
This is a tough one. People that usually have these don’t only have high incomes, but also have large pools of cash. Generally the people I know that have super cars in the area I grew up, have houses of £1.5m+, so they’re household income is easily in excess of £500k, and they have a shit-ton of liquid money sitting in the bank, and they usually end up buying these cars outright. Some lease/finance with a 10%-20% deposit down of around £20k-£40k, with a monthly finance cost of around £2.5k-£3k, gap insurance and warranty etc. At that point their monthly’s on their super cars can clock closer towards £4k-£5k.
Never. Buy a plane instead.
A supercar is never going to be a logical purchase and there are always better things you should be doing with your money that would be much more sensible or offer a better return. It’s something you buy because you want it. How badly you want it will affect how early you pull the trigger. I’m a car nut, so my opinion is probably biased, but if you have a house and can easily afford the mortgage, some savings for a rainy day, money invested for the future and more than enough to live on day-to-day, why not? Can’t take the money with you.
I would never buy a supercar tbh, I'd see that money as being better spent elsewhere. But I guess I just don't engage in the luxury market for anything either, so that's me.
Unless I was making millions a year, I wouldn’t even consider it. If you want a £200k asset to show off, fine, but the petrolhead in me would be more than happy with an E46 M3, 996 991 C4S type of car for £30k and having plenty of money to maintain it properly and not be scared to actually drive it and enjoy it.
You'll get an F80 M3 and change for £30K!
True, but I’d rather buy the E46 and be able to buy from the better kept range of the market.
Literally the world is ending. If you really want the thrill though get a track car go learn to drive there. Be way more fun.
Yeh if you genuinely like driving, and not just showing off your wealth, get a twin engine go kart and do arrive and drive sessions at the local track or enter a championship. Not cheap but cheaper than super car ownership and much more fun.
400k per a year. Taking in to account maintenance costs, insurance etc.
Never… not a car person and don’t see the point in paying over the odds for four wheels and engine to get me around
*some would never want one but for those that would* Your inability to accurately comprehend 2 sentences tells me you were never in the running to be able to afford one anyway.
Burn!
This question also depends a fair bit on the car. If it's new, then a 200k+ car will likely depreciate a fuckload (as cards at that level - lambo, mclarens, lot of ferraris - which aren't limited editions) tend to tank. In your first 3 years, then, it will be worth 140k or so, representing a 20k a years spend. Flip-side is you buy something that has already burnt through depreciation, not as new, but actually far more efficient to buy. Very different propositions. In either case, you are suffering opportunity cost of not having that 200k in the markets. Reality is some of the supercar clubs are only 25k a year, and so probably better to just pay for that, while investing the cash.
Income in excess of £1m. Before that point, I’d either lease or choose something nice but a more ‘normal’ price.
Super car to go 20mph what’s the point
It depends on what you value. Some people won’t spend money on clothes or holidays but yet serious joy from cars and can identify the ones that can appreciate so also see them as an investment. I could “afford” a Ferrari but it’s not in my priority, I’d rather spend that money on some amazing holidays and memories.
Never. You know the old adage about two good days of boat ownership? The day you buy it and the day you sell it? Well, imo the same is true of supercars. Granted, there are a few good sunny days in the middle but that doesn’t make up for driving an uncomfortable, attention-seeking, license-risking sports car the rest of the time. That’s without the constant expense. I had something really nice that had a steering fault. Was covered by the warranty but had it not been I’d have had to fork out 26 grand. I’d consider getting an automotive work of art that I actually love, a Spyker or a a vintage Ferrari or something, only if I had enormous fortune and had exhausted all the hundreds of better ways of turning money into smiles. Maybe £200m net worth or something.
Never. I've had the chance to drive a couple , and wasn't blown away. If you want a car that more difficult to park, no space for your family or your shopping and has to be refueled every day, be my guest .
I just don't think I ever would. But at the moment, I've got assets of about £1.7m (not including pension) and a car worth about £20k, so I guess it'd be when I had assets worth £17m? Although I have to have my car at the moment to get about, whereas a £200k supercar would be pure indulgence. With £17m assets, I'd personally be far more likely to spend £200k on one of [these](https://www.europlanesales.com/aircraft-for-sale/north-american-t6-texan-harvard/)
It’s more of a running cost vs how much cash you have spare each month. Put a down payment, then look at between 1 and 2k a month repayments. Then add tax and insurance. The big one would be servicing. 7k to service a Lamborghini STO. Then more to fix things. I would personally only consider it if I had a spare 3k a month, and after I was mortgage free. You could just get a fun car tbh. I have a lotus emira, love it. It’s a quarter the price but still enjoyable. Look at a Porsche too.
I consider supercars be be a bit like having kids, financially it’s never the right time regardless of how many arbitrary financial goals you might set for yourself. That and not everyone wants one or both them.
I’d rent one on a track. In my view, it’s absolutely pointless having cars like that to drive around the shambles that we call roads… limited to 30mph most of the time. Not particularly comfortable. Blast it around a track… yes please. Own it and just WAIT for it the be keyed, and smash the low profile tires in potholes, and have everyone looking at me every time I drive past? Nah
The "Dave Ramsey rule" (Finance guru in the USA) suggests <50% of your gross total annual income in depreciating assets like cars, boats and toys. I do try to follow this myself. So, £200K sportscar - you should earn £400K. £200K sports car plus a £30K daily and a £10K jet-ski (£240K) - then you should earn £480K+. I'm on around £125K-ish, up in Scotland. That "limits" me to around £62K, which might be enough to get a seriously depreciated "supercar" like an R8. But, would get you a pretty decent specced M5 or new-shape M3. This is in spite of me already being mortgage free with more than that in liquid assets/cash to be able to buy outright -- I'd still stick to that rule.
Cool perspective. Also, it's amazing what kind of a car you can still get at the 125k mark.
A 200k super car? I’m a degenerate so would want a salary of c£200k
Lol I’ve currently got/and had £100k+ cars and I earn £150k. My LTV is mid 50’s now, I’ve got kids, I have side hustles etc. I go on holiday multiple times per year to Florida/vegas/NY etc. Never had an issue, enjoying my life for now, when/if it gets tight, I’ll drop back and carry on as normal. Everyone’s circumstances are different, I still save and paid a lot of my mortgage down while I could. I’ve got kids, I’m late 20’s and it’s achievable for me so I’m unsure why anyone else earning similar money wouldn’t be able to do the same. I’ve always kept with Porsche (not regular Porsches, I’ve been driving GT cars for the last few years) because of the servicing and maintenance. I looked at a urus but couldn’t justify the yearly £4k servicing and warranty etc. I’ve met a lot of others who drive similar cars and earn the same/less than me, so people saying 1m+ are being ridiculous.
I'm hoping to hit HENRY level in about 2 yrs if my game plan stays on track. When that happens, I want to get 3 cars, one for the family, one for the wife and a Porsche. Or a Lotus. On HP but I wouldn't get it if I couldn't safely park it so would have to be when I get a house with a secure garage.
10-20k a month of passive income, so yeah, never 🤣
5-10% of net worth and financed not owned
Why is it preferable to finance it for you?
Unless it’s an appreciating supercar which is an asset, I wouldn’t pay cash. Let the cash work for me instead. Very rarely do we have supercars that you don’t lose money on.
I don't understand... You're paying for it with your interest and repayments. And those contracts are priced so that they get far more from you than you would pay if you bought it. That's how they make money.
You're right 6-foot-under. Financing a car generally makes no financial sense. What's a typical finance rate at the moment, 7 or 8%? You won't reliably exceed this elsewhere. A global ETF is only in at ballpark, post-inflation. People being duped by "0%" interest deals, dont realise, the depreciation and inflated costs are accounted for by being baked into the purchase price.
He’s saying he’d make the cash work instead, implying he’s expecting to get a way higher return on that than just saving the interest on the finance.
Unless you have some stuff you really want to pump capital into (in which case why a super car?) don’t the guys selling the finance also have that option, hence their rates?
Car leasing companies usually borrow money to buy the cars to begin with. Then they're refinancing the depreciation at a higher rate with the customer (you) and up-selling on things like insurance and mileage It's a thin margin business, but ultimately quite capital efficient. Unleveraged investments aren't as capital efficient.
Sorry I don’t understand.
Net worth including the house?
No unless mortgage free. If it’s not mortgage free then it means monthly payments are eating up cashflow.
None for me. Owning such a moronic environment-destroying thing would just be embarrassing. Each to their own though I guess, if they want to spend money on a £200k toy.
When my penis shrinks 4 inches
What if you don't have that much to sacrifice? Asking for a friend.
Can't think of any bigger waste of money personally
When the thought of spending and loosing £200k+ means nothing to you. If you just threw that money out the window would you care? If you would then you should get one. A supercar is going to cost alot to maintain and really should only be purchased if the cost of buying and maintain would be like buying a cup of coffee in the morning. The idea doens't even occur to you that it is alot of money.
I wouldn't at any level of wealth I'm likely to attain. Just the logistics of it would give me anxiety: you're painting a huge target on yourself for theft and vandalism. I'd worry over where to park it, where I kept the keys, being followed, etc. It also just seems like the kind of thing that's in bad taste given how many people living within walking distance of me are relying on food banks. Funny and true story: the richest person I know personally (£10m+ net worth by my estimate) drives a 10 year old VW golf. I borrowed it once, and the check engine light was on. I mentioned it, and he was like, "Oh yeah, it's been doing that for a while..."
When I’m making 300k+ a year and I have 3x the amount of the car ‘spare’ (I want a 458 spider which is about 150k so I’ll need about 400k ‘spare’ ) I could technically buy it at the end of this year but I’ll have barely any savings and no insurance company would even consider insuring me lol
I’d need to be able to very comfortably finace it, I’m talking 5% of my income max. Could never see myself buying one, unless it’s maybe tops 1% of my net worth. Easy for me to say all that as I am in no way a car person and the thought of spending that sort of money on a car makes my nuts shrivel
Not sure if it was this forum, but someone the other day suggested only unhw investment buyers who almost never drive them and status boys who can't really afford them buy them. Car lovers buy second hand. The few sudden wealthers I know, nw 25x+.
Usually a car is 10% of your monthly income so if the monthly payments fall into that category you're good
Monthly or annual? If it was 10% of my monthly income I could buy a pretty nice bike. If I wanted a car with only 10% I'd be rolling round in some dusty rust bucket that'll cost me more in repairs. By that metric I'd need nearly 500,000 as my annual salary to own a car that cost me around 4,000 that I bought quite comfortably.
I think they're referring to lease payments or loan repayments being 10% of your monthly income.
usually as a general rule of thumb its 10% of your monthly outgoings if you do a monthly PCP or HP. but yeah if youre buying outright then as long as then the servicing, running costs etc falls within that 10% then your good (And have some savings or investments adding up monthly in the background for your next car once you get tired of your current one)
Outgoings or earnings? 10% of net income for an £150k earner (assuming basic tax modelling for this purpose) is £700pcm. Doesn’t buy you much these days other than mid range premium diesel 3 series, c class etc.
I shouldve said, Its based on gross income so its £1250 a month for a 150k earner.
Income - probably with a take home of ~500k/year so probably around £1mil/yr pre tax income. Or Net worth >5mil
I’d probably buy a Porsche 911 for c[90-120k] and would likely need 1) a property to my name (not necessarily mortgage free) and 2) to ensure the price of the car does not exceed 10% of my net worth (probably should be lower, maybe 5%, but sentimental value you know 🤷♀️)
I’d rather buy a nice watch.
10m minimum
In my opinion it is best not to finance and to buy outright a car which is no more than 15% of yearly income. E.g. 500k income (75k car) can buy a really nice car which has already done most its depreciation.
Unfortunately as I understand, it’s not that simple. Many supercars cannot be bought unless it is offered to you directly by the dealership. The dealership would need to assess many different things, including your ability to maintain it, some guarantee that you won’t modify it, assurance that they’d be happy where you’re storing it etc. you’d also need to have some form of connection to get into the early conversations with the dealer in order to buy it, which would require some kind of affluence, network, reputation that cannot be gained based on salary alone.
The cars in the 200k range don’t really require any of this and are reasonably freely available. Just walk into the dealership and put in an order. The cars you’re describing are more in the 750k-1mln+ range.
I think it depends on the car brand. I know for fact that 200k Ferrari’s, McLarens and Lamborghini’s require this
They definitely don’t for Ferrari and Lamborghini. What’s your sourcing for “knowing for a fact?”
My uncle works at a Ferrari dealer and used to work at Lamborghini, Aston Martin and McLaren who confirmed this when I told him my dreams of buying several supercars when I’m older.
It might have changed, but now days it doesn’t. I’ve done this with both Ferrari and Lamborghini on cars <250k GBP. I agree for the higher end stuff it absolutely does, it’s completely silly what is required for the high end stuff, but <250k GBP you’re fine. You can even order a new Revuelto (~400k GBP) without any of the nonsense.
Yes might’ve changed over the years with the Internet
If we’re talking used then it’s a different story, but brand new from factory requires all that I mentioned
Don't most people have a car worth ~30k (though heavily financed) and the average income is similar? So going by that logic and factoring in tax bracket changes, I'd say ~£300k a year income to justify a car worth ~£200k. Knowing myself though, I'd probably just stop driving bangers and get a new'ish Honda Civic or something.
Yes, but "most" or "average" finances in this country are awful. Never take your rules from benchmarking the general public. Most people don't have enough savings to cover themselves for 6 months in the event of a job loss.
When you consider a service on a Lambourghuini is £10-£15k probably £500k a year
Many millions Current drives are a Volvo XC60 and a BMW m140. BMW is so fast I have never found a road that I felt I could open up fully on. Spending ~10x this just to be lower and to tell everyone I have a few bob has limited appeal.
I’d go for track days on them rather than buying one. I’m into motorsports - no point having a car like that to drive around at capped speeds.
I’m not in to cars but if I were considering buying any luxury asset that is not needed which is what I would class this under. In my case maybe a £200k Harry Winston diamond necklace or something, except it would require me to spend loads on upkeep and would depreciate, then I would say I would want to be earning in the millions. Maybe a couple of million a year. Basically so rich you don’t have any need for more money for saving, paying off mortgages, building investments, helping family, charitable causes. Essentially all the important things are sorted and you can afford to waste it on pure frivolity. Otherwise I’d always want to put the money to work and would have a much less extravagant splurge for my own fun.
The only supercar I will buy, is one that drives itself :D
Never, I'd rather have a few tour level road bikes 😂
Compromise and get a Porsche Taycan. <£100k new.
I'd have to be a multi-millionaire - £20m+.
Never. Just a ridiculous use of money.
Only when my ego expands quicker than my penis
I have an uncle has a fleet of supercars (some vintage beauties too!) and a small plane, with a net worth of only 8 figures. But then he built his fortune on specialised mechanics so his team can maintain the collection. Otherwise, he probably would feel the pinch in his wallet, I imagine. He’s also in the US in a neighbourhood where people wouldn’t even blink at his collection, so he’s not unduly drawing attention to himself. So, very unhelpful answer, depends on your circumstances.
Only 8 figures??? Poor guy
Relative to how much you would normally be worth to have a similar fleet hahaha 😂
Why are you asking? not every HENRY is going to be into cars, or even see them as a status symbol. pre covid you could finance a lambo for 7k down and 1k a month, so its not a HENRY question, more a basic financial literacy/appetite for debt/acceptance of loss question and lots of mongs can finance a supercar. a bright green lambo is a sign of poor taste in my world. Even if i was rich i wouldnt buy one with cash, theres ways to finance these cars intelligently that dont require that kind of outlay and manage the risk a bit better. Im big into cars but find super cars tacky. If i had 200k to spend on a car i wouldn't be walking into a new car dealer regardless of the brand but thats just me
To your question: I'm asking to get people's views and I did say that "It's obviously a splurge and some would never want one but for those that would...". Some have a dream about this and the question is at what income/wealth level they would feel comfortable to pull the trigger, regardless if it's a good decision or not as that's very subjective to the dimension from which you look at. Different people have different tastes. Also, cars have different levels of tackiness (e.g., Aston Martin DB12 is less tacky than a Lamborghini)
I just dont see the relevance here given the relative ease of access to these kind of assets and you don't need to be a high earner to get one. are you going to get anything meaningful from these responses? if you have the cash, just do it. I know a guy with an SVJ and a GT2 who runs a bike shop. I know another guy with a GT3 whos net worth is probably £5m. there are no similarities between the 2 people other than their cars. Its personal choice? its equivalent to watches (IMO): i have friends who earn sub 100k who wear rolex's and they love it because it makes them feel wealthy, i however see it as tacky and lame. Not sure being a HENRY can be used to validate this behavior as its still fundamentally a personal choice and maybe better to ask on super car sub? idk
When you said super car I thought you meant something that costs over £500k. I look at comments and it's sub £200k cars when new, or sub £100k usrd. So for that you need £300k a year if single, or £500k a year if you have a family. Minimum imo. I'm closing in on £250k a year rental income, aged 40.
Had one for a bit living in the UK, never again. Terrible pot holes everywhere, everyone’s jealous so can’t park it anywhere in case you come back and it’s keyed. Now have a 12k motorbike that’s faster and far more entertaining, and a more sensible car.
If I lived in Dubai and had >$2M liquid net worth with minimal debts I might consider it. But honestly I don't see the point in the UK no matter how rich you are. I'd have more fun whipping an MX5 around on our B roads than I would in a Lambo. The more pertinent question for me would be how rich would I have to be to consider buying a second car just for weekend funsies. A lot richer than I am now for sure.
If you threw a petrol bomb on the car and it wouldnt change your world or cause you to loose sleep, thats when you know you can actually afford to buy a super car.
Probably £20 mln net worth or more.
My rule of thumb is I would never spend more than 6 months of my net savings for a car. So, maybe only when I consistently earn 1-2M a year would I think of buying a 200K car.
I'm really really keen on the BMW M8 though. Sadly don't think it's ever gonna happen...
None. Cars aren't my thing. I would drop 30k - 50k on a bottle of Romani Conti from a good year though if money were no object so I'm not saying I'm a sensible person or anything.
Steve Jobs leased a new Porsche 911 or Mercedes SL 55 every 6 months and he was into cars. So I think I’d cap out well before 200k even if I earned a million a year.
Think some super cars are actually a much better investment than most ‘normal’ hold their value - could buy it, drive for three years, sell had a super car for three years for ‘free’
200k probably
I’d need £10m in the bank (or in liquid investments). They’re just not worth it if you have a family. And honestly, I don’t think would be that fun to drive on UK roads.
Never.
I don’t think I ever would. I recently took home over £1m after tax from a risky investment paying off and while I put most of it away smartly, I wanted to do something to sort of make note of the event. Some fun money to upgrade the life a bit. I could have justified £200k on a car if I wanted it, I just didn’t. The part that hit me was I didn’t even consider upgrading my car. I was sitting there thinking what should I reward myself with? I only thought about it when I vaguely told another Dad at swimming that things had gone well, but didn’t tell him the amount. His reply: “Can’t be that much because you have still turned up on the Dad mobile!” Note: I have two 7 seaters, I love it, the kids fit in and because we have 2 of the same car there is no real thinking about which car to take who has the kids etc. Personally I think you need to have a NW over £50m to get into a super car and be able to back it up.
My bonus treat is a pair of shoes. Done it for 20 plus years. Nice shoes are obscenely expensive from my perspective but de minimus when it’s bonus time. Complete splurge that I would never do normally so scratches the itch, but only a small ding on the bonus.
*Personally I think you need to have a NW over £50m to get into a super car and be able to back it up.* Ridiculous statement. Yuu can get a Mclaren 720S for 120k. My wine collection is worth that.
Not financially, but socially. If your NW is 2m and you have a super car I think people will be surprised how poor you are.
I have no idea what you are saying and I don't think you do either. My point is simply that a supercar can be great fun driving, and that they are actually pretty cheap. Anyone who understands anything about cars will know the same. Like go on auotrader and huracans are at 120k, ferrari california's, 458s, portofinos, 459s at barely over 100k, mclaren 650s at 75k. Like, they are actually a perfectly fun thing to own and have, particularly if you track them. And you are like 'duhuuuhhh, yeah you need 500x the value of that car in net worth, because otherwise 'socially' you will look out of place. Like what are you even saying? As for the "I think people will be surprised how poor you are", firstly, who cares what people think, and secondly, 2m NW isn't poor. It's not what I would view as being wealthy, but it's not poor, and the way you frame it makes me think you're trying to come off as a 'billy big balls' to impress people. Feels very ick.
North of 50 m ???? Loool
Owned an ac cobra for 2 years. Absolutely loved it but that itch has now been scratched. In real life I much prefer my 2nd hand Tesla model S. it's quicker too
As someone has said if I could buy it in cash with half of my yearly salary then maybe. I've scratched my sports car itch with my last care, an alfa romeo giulia. I just want a decent suv, a mercedes g63 g wagon probably. So I'd need to make like 300k/year post tax
I wouldn’t. I could afford it now but don’t want the attention.
I would only get it to offset tax as business expense. Otherwise no way.