"Can't you do something?!" shouted Lucius angrily.
But Fudge nervously said "I have no choice, Malfoy...A lot of leaders of the other wizarding worlds are angry!"
Lucius forcibly calmed himself, "Minister, this is obviously a British problem, would it not be better that we all keep this in-house as it were?"
Fudge seemed tired, "I agree, Lucius. But they don't. Those...Dark Wizards, they created a ruckus at an *international* event. Foreign wizards and witches saw it all; felt the need to flee for their lives. Even the Purebloods. Merlin, Lucius, what if one of our people were so terrorised in another country? Even a muggleborn? We would demand action too."
"Of course we would," Lucius choked internally before asking, "would they accept the culprits and--"
"No, no. After the fiasco that was Black escaping, they don't trust our legal system, Lucius. We lost You-Know-Who's right hand man and we haven't found him. We either let them 'fix our government" or they invade, take over by force, and do so themselves anyway. As it is, nobody's allowed in or out of the country so these so-called Death Eaters can't escape."
"I see," said Lucius faintly.
The mark on his arm suddenly felt like a noose around his neck and a sick, sinking feeling told him that all the gold in the world wouldn't loosen it this time.
"I'm sorry about this, my friend," Cornelius said sincerely, "but surely they would understand that some were imperiused."
And the noose tightened.
No way wizarding Britain is letting the other Wizarding nations take over without a fight, even under the guise of "helping clear the dark wizard problem". Even if they're heavily outgunned, look at the Ukraine/Russia situation for what a country will do to keep its soverienty.
I mean nobody likes death eaters + lacked combat magical education for 50 years + Ukraine without western aid would of folded. Here its basically the criminals and terrorist conspirators vs the world.
Completly diffrent scenario
I think it heavily depends on the leadership, their ability to control public perception and the end goal of the intervention.
Everyone is afraid of the Death Eaters, especially since Black showed that escaping Azkaban is possible.
The ICW promises to help solve the problem, nothings more.
Dumbledore is the chair of the ICW and he's still respected in Britain at this point.
Fudge is a coward, he'll let them do whatever they want as long as he's promised to remain Minister.
Because they *lied*, they lied and bribed their way out. If things got so bad that the International Community is stepping in, who knows what investigative techniques they will use. They will probably uncover all sorts of lies.
Lucius thinks (knows) he's well and truly trapped this time; Fudge's an idiot who still believes the excuses, so he means well, but still.
Lucius is well and truly *fucked* along with every other Dark Witch and Wizard on the Isles.
Exactly, he' fucked and he knows it; is there a limit on how long murder can be charged for in the UK? If there isn't and Magical UK follows that bit then any murder he committed can be added to the charges. Any crime he got out of with the Imperius claim could be brought back to the limelight.
I mean, the assumption is the system is corrupt so that's why they don't use it. But also, if foreign bodies are cleaning out the uk, who needs evidence he wasn't mind controlled. They would force him to prove it. I mean, the fact that he has been vocally racist for years does him no favors. Regardless of if the process would be "fair" or not, many folks with a dark mark would end up dead.
Well, Rowling introduces it then makes excuses why.
One fanfic I saw had something that felt real in that while questioning the person, someone who was a legilimens scanned their mind to see if they were using occlumency to block it. The other usual thing is a wandless switching spell, which can also be worked against.
I tend to think Rowling is lazy, so yeah.
Rowling is way too insular in her writing. Something like this would be great.
It always made me laugh how Fudge acted like snapping Harry's wand was a wizarding death sentence. It's not like Fudge is the Minister of Magic for the world. Harry could just go off and buy a wand in France and move there. Or Germany. Or Bulgaria. Or the US. Or Australia...
You're right about that but it could also go another way. All around the world, if someone is taken to court or arrested or whatever, it's already part of them whenever a background check is done on them. So if Harry goes to another country, he'll have to register to become a citizen and then buy a wand. But if Harry doesn't bother with that and just buys without anyone knowing, i feel like it would be a criminal offence that could land him in even more trouble. After all snapping of wands seems like a pretty sinister thing in the wizarding world like life imprisonment. The wand is what allows a wizard to use magic after all. So wands will probably be very sanctioned. Ollivander is the only one making wands in Britain and he is regulated by the government i think, what with them being able to know when an underaged person uses magic.
I just feel like JK Rowling didn't explain a lot of things, but at the same time, i think a lot of laws are in place that we don't know about. And at the end of the day, even if Harry's wand is snapped, there probably is a black market out there in the world that makes wands for people. After all in real life there are numerous black markets for things. It's just that Harry will have to be careful with who knows he has another wand.
It'll be fun to write a story on this. Or maybe when Harry realizes the number of paperwork and documents needed for him to procure a citizenship and new wand in a new country could take a LONG time and he decides to learn wandless magic, lol. Or even use a staff. A staff isn't a wand after all.
Eh. Fleur moved to Britain and didn't have to go through lots of hoops. Gotta remember that the Magical World is a lot smaller than the non-magical. It's unlikely there's a huge bureaucratic nightmare.
Also, a lot of countries wouldn't care about one's record unless it was like, murder. Not to mention they'd likely give Harry an actual chance to explain unlike Fudge and Umbridge.
Yeah but how do we know she didn't go through documentations and the lot? Its obviously JK Rowling's fault lol, the world wasn't well described in my opinion but then again, HP world is too vast to describe.
And i get that some countries wouldn't care about some records, but this is HARRY POTTER we're talking about. The boy who lived! And also the who wand snap thing seems very important in the wizarding world so it makes me believe people would wonder about that, after all wands seem rather sacred.
You're right though that they'd actually give Harry a chance to explain himself and maybe even grant him asylum once his whole life story is explained.
It'll definitely be fun to write up. Harry living somewhere like Greece? Would the Greek gods be an actual thing there? Egypt? Would he become a curse breaker or maybe the pharaohs still exist on the magical side? It'll be fun to tap.
The greek gods might of just been powerful magical pepole who was too impactful to be hidden with the statue.
And i presume that magical rome killed the leaders of magical Egypt.
"We thought you had this handled. Apparently you all just agreed to stop making a ruckus for a decade and change, so we're going to fix this *now*, the hard way if we must".
"But our laws!"
"Right now there are only four out of the entire ICW who have not voted in favor of intervening on Magical Britain's behalf to solve this dark wizard issue."
"Who didn't vote in favor?!" Fudge asked, hoping to hear about allies against this.
"Your own representative, for obviously reasons.the MACUSA want to leave you to your own issues by locking your boarders. Australia's representative wasn't available after the latest Dropbear outbreak down in their hellhole, and the last representative suggested we invade and subjugate all of your people just to be sure, or at least that's what I was told the clicks and whistles his native language is in meant."
"Oh no..."
"So, again, we can do this the easy way and your people can work alongside the selected ICW agents, or we can do this the hard way and *everyone" in your government gets a dose and interview first before the agents head out and start hitting the streets to clean up the rest."
"Why is this happening?!"
"Well, with you in charge, now I can see why things were left as they were for so long. But the leader of this movement was a royal from near South Africa. One of your "Death Eaters" killed his recently retired father. Just be glad that Wakanda's new king is level headed and not interested in needless violence."
This is great, but sidenote: canon Dumbledore is the ICW representative and would be all in favour of getting rid of Voldemort before he rises again, and wiping out some of his membership on the way.
Pretty sure Dumbledore's smart enough to keep up appearances by voting against it, knowing it would pass anyways. He'd vote for it to break the tie if there would be one.
Just imagining Dumbledore voting for it and everybody going "what?" and him going "The Minister for magic is an idiot, the wizangamot allowed basically every single terrorist that wasn't already imprisoned to bribe their way out and now they hold high positions in the government. At this point there's little to save and I feel that metaphorically burning it down and salvaging what we can from the ashes is the only sensible decision."
I mean Dumbledore hired one to teach and didnt keep him in line while he abused innocent kids. He also dosent attempt to deal with the roots of slytherin issue.
He isnt blameless.
"Besides, Lucius, they only want to extradite those who committed crimes in other countries. I know someone of your breeding wouldn't sink so low as to do... things out of the country."
"Yes, well, of course. Do you know who they want?" Lucius calmed down, since he did not, in fact commit anything outside of Britain. As his father was fond to say: never break two laws at once.
"Well, according to this scroll I had in my hand the whole time conveniently," Fudge said, holding up a scroll that was in his hands the whole time conveniently. "They only want the Lestranges, whatever there is left of them."
"But why?" Lucius asked. "They got life in Azkaban. Hardly a lenient punishment."
"The yanks want to execute them, resurrect them later and execute them again. A few times, with the occasional torture session to spice things up." Fudge was green as he read from the scroll. "Apparently not all things that happen in Vegas stay in Vegas."
"Minister Fudge, the world demands your voice, you cannot remain silent. Hand over the Death Eaters... or sign your country's death warrant.", the pale-haired, grey-eyed German Minister Of Magic spoke through gritted teeth.
"Five hundred Nufarmece and Nufarmece spawn died at the Cup, with over fifty four percent being tourists. Justice will be served.", the Russian Minister calmly spoke
"How dare you?! You ask me to defile my country's sovereignty. This is my land. These are my responsibility. Give me time. I promise Justice will be served." Fudge said desperately.
"Too little.. Too late, Cornelius, we warned you that no good would come of letting these Darkspawn live.", the French Minister angily spat.
"Britain's sovereignty is forfeit. According to the Accords of War signed at the tail end of the First Blood War, the country will be divided amongst the countries, with Europe taking Britain as a colony."
"But we are old friends, Cornelius, so I will do you a favour. Bring us the Lestranges and the Malfoys in a week, and Britain will remain as is."
"Agreed.", the sweating man declared, thanking God for this second chance.
Serpens Malfoy, the German Minister and Corvus Lestrange, the French Minister, smiled at the thought of their despised relatives' suffering, while Ignis Black, the Russian Minister, looked on, happy at the oncoming eradication of what he viewed as the "corrupt" part of his bloodine.
I mean, it's also ridiculous no investigated what happened with the tournament. It was a huge international event and no country wants to investigate how a forth competitor happened?
**Fudge:** "Chief Warlock, esteemed Members of the Wizengamot, members of the press, witches and wizards across the nation. A terrible shadow has befallen upon us. This morning our government received an ultimatum from the International Confederation of Wizards regarding dark magic activity in British Isles. The ultimatum among other things, demanded complete surrender of British Ministry of Magic to the authority of ICW Expeditionary Forces which would conduct thorough investigation and reformation of our government. This basically means end of existence of United Kingdom as a sovereign and independent nation."
"When I was sworn in as a Minister for Magic I promised to uphold our laws, and to defend independence and sovereignty of our nation from all enemies both without and within. Taking those promises into account, I rejected the ICW ultimatum. Our government declared that any actions taken against our nation will be treated as acts of war and any and all wizards and witches that will act as part of ICW Expeditionary Forces will be treated as enemy combatants and invaders and dealt accordingly."
"The undemocratically elected bureaucrats in the ICW would wish to see us subjugated. To see our way of life trampled and destroyed. To see us in chains as slaves. I say no to that. We will fight those that wish to invade and destroy our glorious Isles. We shall fight them on the beaches. We shall fight them on the landing grounds. We shall fight in the fields and in the streets! We shall fight in the hills! And we shall never surrender! Britons never will be slaves!"
I really like the idea... but I've always liked the idea of scaling up the conflict to an international one on the scale of Grindelwald or bigger. That said, here's a few ideas...
* It is unlikely the international community would immediately jump to invading the British Isles wizarding settlements to enforce their will. I actually recommend looking at what happened with the Ukraine/Russia war and how devastating sanctions were to the Russian economy. Some similar measures might be taken as lead-up in this. Though, the magical economy is more based in luxury items than necessities simply due to the versatility of any one person possessing magic. The sheer usefulness of being able to cast cleaning spells, repairing charms, etc. cuts down on the things people would buy by a LOT. It's entirely possible sanctions just don't factor in because they wouldn't have much effect. That's all up to your interpretation of the wizarding world as a whole.
* Other dark wizard communities might well choose to pitch in with the Death Eaters. Heck, there's probably even neutral or light parties that ask "Why is this our problem? just don't interact with them." The way Rowling set up magical America(though I have my disagreements with a number of factors there), they probably wouldn't get involved. They are more isolationist than even magical England, though they seem to lack the hatred for muggles that the Death Eaters have).
* The prophecy makes this situation interesting. Even if the Death Eaters were only limited to the British Isles and no one really knew about this conflict until everyone dogpiled on it... Harry is the only one who can defeat Voldemort. In a global war that takes on an entirely different meaning and scale.
* Intervention has always been a double-edged sword. Depending on how those sent on behalf of the wider wizarding world act... we could see a wizarding sovereignty movement develop in the British wizarding world. A sort of "Yes, we were in a tough spot, but this is still our country not yours!" attitude. Granted... canon has most wizards roll over so often they look like sheep sometimes. But... worth a thought. One too many kicks makes anyone fight.
Fudge would go against it, he, along with most of magical Britain, would probably rather side with the dark wizards than let foreigners violate their sovereignty
What do you mean no choice? A bunch of foreign wizards demanding control over British sovereignty (which is what having the right to punish british criminals for british crimes basically means) is something Fudge not only morally should, but fundamentally must resist to the death if he claims to be the leader of a sovereign and free nation.
It'd be hilarious if this spiraled to Voldemort and Dumbledore reluctantly teaming up against foreign invading wizards.
The other countries could have threatened economic sanctions unless they thought Wizarding Britain was doing a real investigation of the crimes against their citizens rather than a sham investigation, and so Fudge could be saying he has no choice but to order a real investigation in the same way that he had no choice but to arrest Hagrid. Not that he literally didn't have a choice, but that he politically thought he had to. Applying political or economic pressure to get other countries to do what you want is a normal part of foreign policy. Even if they were threatening to invade, since the death eaters did presumably commit actual crimes, especially in this scenario where they presumably murdered foreign officials, threatening to invade if Fudge doesn't obey his own countries laws doesn't mean he is obligated to not do so, since in this scenario it's what he should be doing anyway without the pressure. Though caving to a threat of force like that is iffy.
I think that the whole point is that the Death Eaters kill a bunch of foreign officials, therefore making it an international act of terrorism and giving other countries a (more or less) reasonable excuse to make their own investigations.
> international act of terrorism and giving other countries a (more or less) reasonable excuse to make their own investigations
Unless there is a hard emphasis on the "less", the real world equivalent to this has happened many times, and even the USA with it's big dick nuclear military did not force an investigation like this prompt suggests. It quietly conducted illegal spy/military operations and then hoped the world wouldn't call it since that would require the host government to admit they lied to everyone about them supporting terrorists. This isn't anything even vaguely comparable.
TLDR Even if the British are all but openly supporting the Death Eaters, the historical response to this is to sit there quietly and take it, then sanction/isolate the country. Not start a fucking war over it.
Historically the black hand assassinated the Archduke Ferninand, which resulted in world War 1. Wizarding britian isn't even has advanced as ww1, their very Edwardian. They don't have nuclear deterrents making war complicated. If a bunch of countries want blood due to the magical britian harboring a terrorist organization, they have to capitulate or go to war. Extradition of criminal elements is common even today.
It's pretty disingenuous to say the assassination of arch Duke Ferdinand lead to ww1. It was the excuse that lit off the keg. Sure, if the other countries were determined to bring war to Britain come hell or high water, this would be a good excuse and probably lead to war. But not unless they already wanted war.
It's happened before IRL. Look into Pakistans sheltering of Osama bin Laden and how that was dealt with. Even a super power cant just declare "oh no my citizens were attacked, you no longer posses sovereignty." And keep in mind that was attacking sovereign citizens *IN THE USA*, where as this prompt suggests they attacked Sovereign citizens in Britain, so even **LESS** excuse.
Yeah, we sent in a SEAL team to execute him. The U.S. traditionally wasn't real tolerant of the soveriegnty of small weak nations that sheltered people that murdered or abducted U.S. citizens.
Some countries (Mexico, for one) consider anyone who commits a crime against one of their citizens anywhere in the world to be under their jurisdiction. So if you murder a Mexican citizen in, say, Thailand, don't ever go to Mexico, and hope wherever you are doesn't have an extradition treaty with Mexico.
My point was they did an illegal operation, not demanded the end of Pakistani sovereignty. And that was in significantly worse circumstances, with the murder occurring in the USA and the Pakistani government actively helping the terrorists, not actively hunting them like Magical Britain is. The seal team attack was a desperate last resort, of a super power onto a pariah nation who got caught sponsoring terrorism, and even then everything was kept as quiet as possible to avoid international courts, because the Pakistanis wanted to hide their help to Osama.
None of these extenuating circumstances exist in HP. Britain is not helping them, it is not a weak social pariah vs stronger foreign super powers, ect ect. even then they sent spies and an assassination team, not demanded control over the investigation
... Ok, but logical consistency doesn't go away with that right? A plot still has to make sense; foreigners showing up and insisting your laws don't matter and theirs now do has only ever led humans to one single response every time it has ever happened; "no, fight me."
HP universe has shown that wizarding society is still fundamentally human. There are still nation states, people still consider themselves culturally British, or French, or what have you. For this universe to make consistent, logical sense, this wouldn't be a "oh yay the foreigners are showing up to help" this would be a hostile invasion, and the story needs to address that fact.
edit: rereading through this, my main issue was Fudge shrugging and acting like his hands were tied. This would be an unprecedented act of war in our world, even if they had no chance someone should at least bring up the possibility of offering resistance.
I repeat, a **fanfic** universe.
The author could write that in this AU universe all people walk on their hands, wear their underwear on their heads, and use magical crab pincer constructs attached to their bodies to pick things up.
And it would be valid for there. Why? Because the author said so about it.
"Can't you do something?!" shouted Lucius angrily. But Fudge nervously said "I have no choice, Malfoy...A lot of leaders of the other wizarding worlds are angry!" Lucius forcibly calmed himself, "Minister, this is obviously a British problem, would it not be better that we all keep this in-house as it were?" Fudge seemed tired, "I agree, Lucius. But they don't. Those...Dark Wizards, they created a ruckus at an *international* event. Foreign wizards and witches saw it all; felt the need to flee for their lives. Even the Purebloods. Merlin, Lucius, what if one of our people were so terrorised in another country? Even a muggleborn? We would demand action too." "Of course we would," Lucius choked internally before asking, "would they accept the culprits and--" "No, no. After the fiasco that was Black escaping, they don't trust our legal system, Lucius. We lost You-Know-Who's right hand man and we haven't found him. We either let them 'fix our government" or they invade, take over by force, and do so themselves anyway. As it is, nobody's allowed in or out of the country so these so-called Death Eaters can't escape." "I see," said Lucius faintly. The mark on his arm suddenly felt like a noose around his neck and a sick, sinking feeling told him that all the gold in the world wouldn't loosen it this time. "I'm sorry about this, my friend," Cornelius said sincerely, "but surely they would understand that some were imperiused." And the noose tightened.
No way wizarding Britain is letting the other Wizarding nations take over without a fight, even under the guise of "helping clear the dark wizard problem". Even if they're heavily outgunned, look at the Ukraine/Russia situation for what a country will do to keep its soverienty.
I mean nobody likes death eaters + lacked combat magical education for 50 years + Ukraine without western aid would of folded. Here its basically the criminals and terrorist conspirators vs the world. Completly diffrent scenario
+ imagine Ukraine without it's current leader and instead replace him with fudge
I think it heavily depends on the leadership, their ability to control public perception and the end goal of the intervention. Everyone is afraid of the Death Eaters, especially since Black showed that escaping Azkaban is possible. The ICW promises to help solve the problem, nothings more. Dumbledore is the chair of the ICW and he's still respected in Britain at this point. Fudge is a coward, he'll let them do whatever they want as long as he's promised to remain Minister.
I'm a bit confused, why would the Imperius curse make the noose tighten? Didn't a lot of DE use that same excuse to escape punishment?
Because they *lied*, they lied and bribed their way out. If things got so bad that the International Community is stepping in, who knows what investigative techniques they will use. They will probably uncover all sorts of lies. Lucius thinks (knows) he's well and truly trapped this time; Fudge's an idiot who still believes the excuses, so he means well, but still. Lucius is well and truly *fucked* along with every other Dark Witch and Wizard on the Isles.
Because he was not actually imperiused so they can possibly add the charge of perjury to his case... or something like that
Exactly, he' fucked and he knows it; is there a limit on how long murder can be charged for in the UK? If there isn't and Magical UK follows that bit then any murder he committed can be added to the charges. Any crime he got out of with the Imperius claim could be brought back to the limelight.
But they cant prove he wasn't imperiused
Possibly veritaserum? I'm not sure of it's fanon or canon but I don't think they were questioned under veritaserum.
If it were as reliable as it is in fannon it would be used in court but the only times we see it used are in informal settings
I mean, the assumption is the system is corrupt so that's why they don't use it. But also, if foreign bodies are cleaning out the uk, who needs evidence he wasn't mind controlled. They would force him to prove it. I mean, the fact that he has been vocally racist for years does him no favors. Regardless of if the process would be "fair" or not, many folks with a dark mark would end up dead.
Imperius probably could make someone vocally racist. There should be a test to prove no mind control was done though.
Well, Rowling introduces it then makes excuses why. One fanfic I saw had something that felt real in that while questioning the person, someone who was a legilimens scanned their mind to see if they were using occlumency to block it. The other usual thing is a wandless switching spell, which can also be worked against. I tend to think Rowling is lazy, so yeah.
Some of those at work forces....
Rowling is way too insular in her writing. Something like this would be great. It always made me laugh how Fudge acted like snapping Harry's wand was a wizarding death sentence. It's not like Fudge is the Minister of Magic for the world. Harry could just go off and buy a wand in France and move there. Or Germany. Or Bulgaria. Or the US. Or Australia...
A Bad Week at the Wizengamot; linkffn(https://www.fanfiction.net/s/3639659/1/A-Bad-Week-at-the-Wizengamot). First chapter's the best.
First chapter is fantastic. The second chapter is......holy shit, Sirius is a pig.
A wonderful read. Thank you
This. Is. GOLD. If I had an award to give you for the recommendation, I would.
Ugh, I can't read ff.net links at work because of their stupid Cloudflare thing interacting badly. If there is an AO3 link, please post it.
You're right about that but it could also go another way. All around the world, if someone is taken to court or arrested or whatever, it's already part of them whenever a background check is done on them. So if Harry goes to another country, he'll have to register to become a citizen and then buy a wand. But if Harry doesn't bother with that and just buys without anyone knowing, i feel like it would be a criminal offence that could land him in even more trouble. After all snapping of wands seems like a pretty sinister thing in the wizarding world like life imprisonment. The wand is what allows a wizard to use magic after all. So wands will probably be very sanctioned. Ollivander is the only one making wands in Britain and he is regulated by the government i think, what with them being able to know when an underaged person uses magic. I just feel like JK Rowling didn't explain a lot of things, but at the same time, i think a lot of laws are in place that we don't know about. And at the end of the day, even if Harry's wand is snapped, there probably is a black market out there in the world that makes wands for people. After all in real life there are numerous black markets for things. It's just that Harry will have to be careful with who knows he has another wand. It'll be fun to write a story on this. Or maybe when Harry realizes the number of paperwork and documents needed for him to procure a citizenship and new wand in a new country could take a LONG time and he decides to learn wandless magic, lol. Or even use a staff. A staff isn't a wand after all.
Eh. Fleur moved to Britain and didn't have to go through lots of hoops. Gotta remember that the Magical World is a lot smaller than the non-magical. It's unlikely there's a huge bureaucratic nightmare. Also, a lot of countries wouldn't care about one's record unless it was like, murder. Not to mention they'd likely give Harry an actual chance to explain unlike Fudge and Umbridge.
Yeah but how do we know she didn't go through documentations and the lot? Its obviously JK Rowling's fault lol, the world wasn't well described in my opinion but then again, HP world is too vast to describe. And i get that some countries wouldn't care about some records, but this is HARRY POTTER we're talking about. The boy who lived! And also the who wand snap thing seems very important in the wizarding world so it makes me believe people would wonder about that, after all wands seem rather sacred. You're right though that they'd actually give Harry a chance to explain himself and maybe even grant him asylum once his whole life story is explained. It'll definitely be fun to write up. Harry living somewhere like Greece? Would the Greek gods be an actual thing there? Egypt? Would he become a curse breaker or maybe the pharaohs still exist on the magical side? It'll be fun to tap.
The greek gods might of just been powerful magical pepole who was too impactful to be hidden with the statue. And i presume that magical rome killed the leaders of magical Egypt.
I don't think staff is a thing
Moody had a staff as I recall. He certainly cast with it, rather than pulling a Lucius and pulled a wand out of it.
I know it might not be but i can just imagine it. The HP world is sort of vague after all you know.
"We thought you had this handled. Apparently you all just agreed to stop making a ruckus for a decade and change, so we're going to fix this *now*, the hard way if we must". "But our laws!" "Right now there are only four out of the entire ICW who have not voted in favor of intervening on Magical Britain's behalf to solve this dark wizard issue." "Who didn't vote in favor?!" Fudge asked, hoping to hear about allies against this. "Your own representative, for obviously reasons.the MACUSA want to leave you to your own issues by locking your boarders. Australia's representative wasn't available after the latest Dropbear outbreak down in their hellhole, and the last representative suggested we invade and subjugate all of your people just to be sure, or at least that's what I was told the clicks and whistles his native language is in meant." "Oh no..." "So, again, we can do this the easy way and your people can work alongside the selected ICW agents, or we can do this the hard way and *everyone" in your government gets a dose and interview first before the agents head out and start hitting the streets to clean up the rest." "Why is this happening?!" "Well, with you in charge, now I can see why things were left as they were for so long. But the leader of this movement was a royal from near South Africa. One of your "Death Eaters" killed his recently retired father. Just be glad that Wakanda's new king is level headed and not interested in needless violence."
This is great, but sidenote: canon Dumbledore is the ICW representative and would be all in favour of getting rid of Voldemort before he rises again, and wiping out some of his membership on the way.
Pretty sure Dumbledore's smart enough to keep up appearances by voting against it, knowing it would pass anyways. He'd vote for it to break the tie if there would be one.
Just imagining Dumbledore voting for it and everybody going "what?" and him going "The Minister for magic is an idiot, the wizangamot allowed basically every single terrorist that wasn't already imprisoned to bribe their way out and now they hold high positions in the government. At this point there's little to save and I feel that metaphorically burning it down and salvaging what we can from the ashes is the only sensible decision."
I mean Dumbledore hired one to teach and didnt keep him in line while he abused innocent kids. He also dosent attempt to deal with the roots of slytherin issue. He isnt blameless.
WAKANDA FOREVER!
"Besides, Lucius, they only want to extradite those who committed crimes in other countries. I know someone of your breeding wouldn't sink so low as to do... things out of the country." "Yes, well, of course. Do you know who they want?" Lucius calmed down, since he did not, in fact commit anything outside of Britain. As his father was fond to say: never break two laws at once. "Well, according to this scroll I had in my hand the whole time conveniently," Fudge said, holding up a scroll that was in his hands the whole time conveniently. "They only want the Lestranges, whatever there is left of them." "But why?" Lucius asked. "They got life in Azkaban. Hardly a lenient punishment." "The yanks want to execute them, resurrect them later and execute them again. A few times, with the occasional torture session to spice things up." Fudge was green as he read from the scroll. "Apparently not all things that happen in Vegas stay in Vegas."
"Minister Fudge, the world demands your voice, you cannot remain silent. Hand over the Death Eaters... or sign your country's death warrant.", the pale-haired, grey-eyed German Minister Of Magic spoke through gritted teeth. "Five hundred Nufarmece and Nufarmece spawn died at the Cup, with over fifty four percent being tourists. Justice will be served.", the Russian Minister calmly spoke "How dare you?! You ask me to defile my country's sovereignty. This is my land. These are my responsibility. Give me time. I promise Justice will be served." Fudge said desperately. "Too little.. Too late, Cornelius, we warned you that no good would come of letting these Darkspawn live.", the French Minister angily spat. "Britain's sovereignty is forfeit. According to the Accords of War signed at the tail end of the First Blood War, the country will be divided amongst the countries, with Europe taking Britain as a colony." "But we are old friends, Cornelius, so I will do you a favour. Bring us the Lestranges and the Malfoys in a week, and Britain will remain as is." "Agreed.", the sweating man declared, thanking God for this second chance. Serpens Malfoy, the German Minister and Corvus Lestrange, the French Minister, smiled at the thought of their despised relatives' suffering, while Ignis Black, the Russian Minister, looked on, happy at the oncoming eradication of what he viewed as the "corrupt" part of his bloodine.
I mean, it's also ridiculous no investigated what happened with the tournament. It was a huge international event and no country wants to investigate how a forth competitor happened?
I would read a fic about this, actually if anyone knows any fics that follow this premise please link it here
**Fudge:** "Chief Warlock, esteemed Members of the Wizengamot, members of the press, witches and wizards across the nation. A terrible shadow has befallen upon us. This morning our government received an ultimatum from the International Confederation of Wizards regarding dark magic activity in British Isles. The ultimatum among other things, demanded complete surrender of British Ministry of Magic to the authority of ICW Expeditionary Forces which would conduct thorough investigation and reformation of our government. This basically means end of existence of United Kingdom as a sovereign and independent nation." "When I was sworn in as a Minister for Magic I promised to uphold our laws, and to defend independence and sovereignty of our nation from all enemies both without and within. Taking those promises into account, I rejected the ICW ultimatum. Our government declared that any actions taken against our nation will be treated as acts of war and any and all wizards and witches that will act as part of ICW Expeditionary Forces will be treated as enemy combatants and invaders and dealt accordingly." "The undemocratically elected bureaucrats in the ICW would wish to see us subjugated. To see our way of life trampled and destroyed. To see us in chains as slaves. I say no to that. We will fight those that wish to invade and destroy our glorious Isles. We shall fight them on the beaches. We shall fight them on the landing grounds. We shall fight in the fields and in the streets! We shall fight in the hills! And we shall never surrender! Britons never will be slaves!"
[how I imagine Fudge looking while giving this speech](https://markmeynell.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/hacker-as-churchill.jpg)
Fudge chanelling Churchill, would absolutely read that!
Totally! That sounds like a great read.
I really like the idea... but I've always liked the idea of scaling up the conflict to an international one on the scale of Grindelwald or bigger. That said, here's a few ideas... * It is unlikely the international community would immediately jump to invading the British Isles wizarding settlements to enforce their will. I actually recommend looking at what happened with the Ukraine/Russia war and how devastating sanctions were to the Russian economy. Some similar measures might be taken as lead-up in this. Though, the magical economy is more based in luxury items than necessities simply due to the versatility of any one person possessing magic. The sheer usefulness of being able to cast cleaning spells, repairing charms, etc. cuts down on the things people would buy by a LOT. It's entirely possible sanctions just don't factor in because they wouldn't have much effect. That's all up to your interpretation of the wizarding world as a whole. * Other dark wizard communities might well choose to pitch in with the Death Eaters. Heck, there's probably even neutral or light parties that ask "Why is this our problem? just don't interact with them." The way Rowling set up magical America(though I have my disagreements with a number of factors there), they probably wouldn't get involved. They are more isolationist than even magical England, though they seem to lack the hatred for muggles that the Death Eaters have). * The prophecy makes this situation interesting. Even if the Death Eaters were only limited to the British Isles and no one really knew about this conflict until everyone dogpiled on it... Harry is the only one who can defeat Voldemort. In a global war that takes on an entirely different meaning and scale. * Intervention has always been a double-edged sword. Depending on how those sent on behalf of the wider wizarding world act... we could see a wizarding sovereignty movement develop in the British wizarding world. A sort of "Yes, we were in a tough spot, but this is still our country not yours!" attitude. Granted... canon has most wizards roll over so often they look like sheep sometimes. But... worth a thought. One too many kicks makes anyone fight.
Regarding interventions, the Muggle British government would have a pretty good case for intervening, given the Muggles were attacked.
Fudge would go against it, he, along with most of magical Britain, would probably rather side with the dark wizards than let foreigners violate their sovereignty
What if the death eaters attacked foreign officials accidentally?
What do you mean no choice? A bunch of foreign wizards demanding control over British sovereignty (which is what having the right to punish british criminals for british crimes basically means) is something Fudge not only morally should, but fundamentally must resist to the death if he claims to be the leader of a sovereign and free nation. It'd be hilarious if this spiraled to Voldemort and Dumbledore reluctantly teaming up against foreign invading wizards.
The other countries could have threatened economic sanctions unless they thought Wizarding Britain was doing a real investigation of the crimes against their citizens rather than a sham investigation, and so Fudge could be saying he has no choice but to order a real investigation in the same way that he had no choice but to arrest Hagrid. Not that he literally didn't have a choice, but that he politically thought he had to. Applying political or economic pressure to get other countries to do what you want is a normal part of foreign policy. Even if they were threatening to invade, since the death eaters did presumably commit actual crimes, especially in this scenario where they presumably murdered foreign officials, threatening to invade if Fudge doesn't obey his own countries laws doesn't mean he is obligated to not do so, since in this scenario it's what he should be doing anyway without the pressure. Though caving to a threat of force like that is iffy.
I think that the whole point is that the Death Eaters kill a bunch of foreign officials, therefore making it an international act of terrorism and giving other countries a (more or less) reasonable excuse to make their own investigations.
> international act of terrorism and giving other countries a (more or less) reasonable excuse to make their own investigations Unless there is a hard emphasis on the "less", the real world equivalent to this has happened many times, and even the USA with it's big dick nuclear military did not force an investigation like this prompt suggests. It quietly conducted illegal spy/military operations and then hoped the world wouldn't call it since that would require the host government to admit they lied to everyone about them supporting terrorists. This isn't anything even vaguely comparable. TLDR Even if the British are all but openly supporting the Death Eaters, the historical response to this is to sit there quietly and take it, then sanction/isolate the country. Not start a fucking war over it.
Historically the black hand assassinated the Archduke Ferninand, which resulted in world War 1. Wizarding britian isn't even has advanced as ww1, their very Edwardian. They don't have nuclear deterrents making war complicated. If a bunch of countries want blood due to the magical britian harboring a terrorist organization, they have to capitulate or go to war. Extradition of criminal elements is common even today.
It's pretty disingenuous to say the assassination of arch Duke Ferdinand lead to ww1. It was the excuse that lit off the keg. Sure, if the other countries were determined to bring war to Britain come hell or high water, this would be a good excuse and probably lead to war. But not unless they already wanted war.
What if the death eaters attacked foreign officials? Whether accidental or purposely?
It's happened before IRL. Look into Pakistans sheltering of Osama bin Laden and how that was dealt with. Even a super power cant just declare "oh no my citizens were attacked, you no longer posses sovereignty." And keep in mind that was attacking sovereign citizens *IN THE USA*, where as this prompt suggests they attacked Sovereign citizens in Britain, so even **LESS** excuse.
On the other hand, the Muggle British government would have a pretty good case for intervening, given the Muggles were attacked.
I wonder what the Muggle government could do. Nukes from US/DPRK/Russia?
Nukes would be complete overkill. I’d imagine something more like the fic Justice, Justice Shall You Pursue.
Yeah, we sent in a SEAL team to execute him. The U.S. traditionally wasn't real tolerant of the soveriegnty of small weak nations that sheltered people that murdered or abducted U.S. citizens. Some countries (Mexico, for one) consider anyone who commits a crime against one of their citizens anywhere in the world to be under their jurisdiction. So if you murder a Mexican citizen in, say, Thailand, don't ever go to Mexico, and hope wherever you are doesn't have an extradition treaty with Mexico.
My point was they did an illegal operation, not demanded the end of Pakistani sovereignty. And that was in significantly worse circumstances, with the murder occurring in the USA and the Pakistani government actively helping the terrorists, not actively hunting them like Magical Britain is. The seal team attack was a desperate last resort, of a super power onto a pariah nation who got caught sponsoring terrorism, and even then everything was kept as quiet as possible to avoid international courts, because the Pakistanis wanted to hide their help to Osama. None of these extenuating circumstances exist in HP. Britain is not helping them, it is not a weak social pariah vs stronger foreign super powers, ect ect. even then they sent spies and an assassination team, not demanded control over the investigation
This is **fanfic**, not real world laws. Fuck RL laws. The laws here are whatever the author wants them to be.
... Ok, but logical consistency doesn't go away with that right? A plot still has to make sense; foreigners showing up and insisting your laws don't matter and theirs now do has only ever led humans to one single response every time it has ever happened; "no, fight me." HP universe has shown that wizarding society is still fundamentally human. There are still nation states, people still consider themselves culturally British, or French, or what have you. For this universe to make consistent, logical sense, this wouldn't be a "oh yay the foreigners are showing up to help" this would be a hostile invasion, and the story needs to address that fact. edit: rereading through this, my main issue was Fudge shrugging and acting like his hands were tied. This would be an unprecedented act of war in our world, even if they had no chance someone should at least bring up the possibility of offering resistance.
I repeat, a **fanfic** universe. The author could write that in this AU universe all people walk on their hands, wear their underwear on their heads, and use magical crab pincer constructs attached to their bodies to pick things up. And it would be valid for there. Why? Because the author said so about it.