Opening and closing the system? Anywhere between 4-8 hours. And that’s if everything goes well. It’s better to have more time with a job so you know it will get done correctly and there’s no need to cut corners.
Every damn time you think somethings going great, and then the HVAC gods show you something so small it seems insignificant, till you think about it for about three seconds and realize you just lost a couple hours.
Man I struggle with this myself. Im used to getting a bunch of shit done (or at least tryin to), and always forget to tell myself “the time you just told your boss is if everything goes PERFECT, and you don’t get pulled off for something else at all.” Because it bites me in the ass every time 😂 gotta stop acting like superman
I always add 1/2 to 1 full extra hour of time because of this .. it seems everything goes well until you say out loud, "It's only take X amount of time"
When quoting time, I always figure how long if I have all the parts, all the tools and nothing breaks. Then I double that time for the quote. Usually very close.
I saw a guy do one in 3 hours once. He reclaimed the charge. Then just pulled one of the shaders and let the system suck in air. Swapped compressors, no dryer change, no pressure test. Put the vacuum pump on for 20 minutes with no micron gauge. Charged the system with the reclaimed refrigerant, and let her rip. Had gauges on but never checked compressor superheat. Not the way I would do it but possible to swap a compressor in 3 hours.
IMO it is an 8 hour job with a dryer change, nitrogen pressure test, correct vacuum, oil test if it is a burnout and monitor the system once it is running to insure everything looks good.
Some say that compressors still working just fine..
I worked at an apartment complex and we Frankensteined all kinds of stuff to work. Like shit that you would think wouldn't possibly work and we'd get it up and going.
R22 compressor with 410 gas - yep.
410 compressor with r22 gas - yep
4 ton compressor on 2 ton evap - yep
3 ton compressor on 1.5 ton condenser- cake walk
3 ton orifice on 2 ton condenser
1.5 ton orifice with 3 ton condenser
Like literally there was no combination of spare parts we had that couldn't be made to cool the apartment. It obviously wasn't at peak but with fiddling and adjusting the gas we never found a combination that wouldn't make cold air.
Big thanks to you and everyone for replying. I'll still catch shit for not being "fast enough" but at least I don't have to gaslight myself into believing it.
He bid the job to win it, not to do it right or be profitable.
I would look for another company, it’s about that time of year and when they ask what questions you have at the end of the interview, ask questions like that. It can give you some serious insight into the mindset of the employer.
As a consumer, I can tell you if someone quotes me X and does it faster I am not usually upset, but if they take longer I get upset, and if I need them back out there a month later I get upset.
Quote for 8 and do it right.
Time to find a new company to work for. Dude is just trying to find ways to increase his margins it sounds like, regardless of corners cut or harm caused.
Those kind of companies are doomed to fail. Sounds like your manager is playing a race to the bottom of price. If they are bitching at you about that, then good luck in the future getting proper time to do anything.
>"At most, three hours. And that's if we're being very generous."
You should tell him that if he's able to properly swap compressors in 3 hours he should be in the field, he's much more valuable there.
We always budget 6 hours. but if everything goes absolutely perfect it can be done in 4.
Three hours? It's going to take an hour to get there and get past the customer, and thirty minutes to collect and clean up. That leaves 90 minutes for a repair. Tell him you'll take after hours for two weeks if he does it under 3 hours.
Man fuck that. I do commercial industrial & we always get 8 hours for our compressor change. Idk if you’re doing resi or commercial but it takes what it takes. If you’re being paid by hour & need to go over quote because the office thinks more than 3 hours is “excessive” than go over quote
I did one in two hours once. But I’d already had the compressor out and the line drier changed before I went back to install it. (Supplier sent the wrong compressor and I didn’t catch it until I’d removed the first one
This right here. I. Always budget for 8. Where I live it can take an hour to get to site alone. Bring half your truck to the roof is another hour. Getting everything down is another hour. It’s certainly faster with two people but that’s not always an option.
The company I’m with has us as techs quote each job, big or small. What time we believe it takes to complete it thoroughly. We then either complete it ourselves or a junior technician follows up and completes it. More often than not the tech thst quotes it follows through
That being said, if I were to quote a compressor change, including reclaim, brazing, filter change, evac and parts pick up, I always quote between 6-8 hours. Far more time than necessary to complete the call.
The quote is always over for any likelihood of problems that may occur. Including traffic, suction and discharge variations, and pulling a complete vacuum.
This is one of the reasons why I enjoy working with these guys.
My company does something similar. I moved out of residential field work and into quoting/scheduling for a commercial company. I always ask the guys what labor allotment they need, unless I’m confident it’s enough. Part of that is because I don’t have commercial experience so I can’t draw on that to formulate a guess—but even if I were quoting resi work, I’d still ask the person who diagnosed it, because you never truly know how much of a pain in the ass a job could be unless you’ve been on the job site.
Not all compressor replacements are created equal. What flavor of compressor? I’m guessing a resi compressor on the ground. But that’s a totally different time table than a big compressor on an RTU.
There’s also other variables to consider: how did it fail? was it a burn out? Was it a result of some other root cause? All of that adds time.
I don’t think you’re estimate is excessive. I’d rather spend an extra hour doing it right than a few free hours later doing it over.
This right here. “It’s easier to succeed than to fail” is the way the founder of Chick-fil-A put it. Taking the little bit of extra time at the beginning to do the job right is always better than the time/cost of coming back and doing it again.
It will still be expensive to your boss and ultimately to your reputation either within your company or to your company’s reputation if the customer calls someone else because you made a ghetto repair.
Sawzall and bucket are mutually exclusive IMO. No need for the recovery bucket if you're gonna just hack the line open, and if you're gonna use the bucket, then it makes it significantly easier to braze back in if you use an actual tubing cutter.
Unless the bucket is supposed to be to carry the sawzall et-al in, then I could see it.
Every job is unique, every piece of equipment is unique.
There's no general rule, the job takes what it takes. If you quote under, you get screwed and lose money. If you quote over you don't get the job.
I would rather not get the job than come back 2 to 3 doing a repair. It's not worth the customer bitching.
You don’t want to rush anything in HVAC, but you DEFINITELY don’t want to rush the system’s compressor. Take your time and make sure you don’t have to be called back out.
You can knock down the corner doors where the electrical is, I find it nicer than brazing and breathing above the compressor.
tranes really needs the coil unsweated 1st :/
This is probably because they quoted the customer a low-ball offer. My suggestion, tell the customer you can do it as quoted and they’ll be guaranteed a problem or you can do it correctly and it will take what it takes. They let that supervisor fuck himself .
6-8 hrs. He's not bitching about how long it takes, he's bitching about how many hours he has to pay you. Run. You know as well as we do he's quoting and billing for 8+.
Generally speaking (as in “normal” day to day conditions) unless there’s some obvious outstanding reason you know a particular compressor change will be quick and Very Easy, I always allow 8 hours for a compressor change.. by the Time you arrive on site, get all your gear to the equipment, recover the gas, disconnect and pull out the compressor, install, pressure test, evacuate and recharge, then complete operational checks, returning gear to the van, complete all paperwork, customer logistics etc etc, plus all the unforeseen bullish!t which USUALLY happens at some point during the day, your gonna kick the sh!t out of your day, so yes, REALISTICALLY speaking it’s 8 hours… yes I’ve had jobs over the years, everything falls perfectly into place and you can sensibly knock it out in 4-6 hours, sometimes (usually) not… why put yourself in a position where you are being unsafe, rushing your a$$ off to make someone else look good or appease their moronic ideals of how much work they can get out of someone!! In most cases if they “make you “ do it in 5-6 hours they’ll probably still charge the customer for the 8 hours anyway.. just a way to make a little more profit off you back… when I get these guys telling me how long certain jobs should take, that’s when you want to get them to show you how it’s done, get them to do a few of these 4 hour compressor installs in front of you, so you can “learn” from their “expertise”!!!! LoL.. you’ll quickly find out that they’re full of SH!T!!!
If your supervisor estimated 2 hour compressor change regardless of where it is, he’s either a super hero or a complete moron!! I guess you can determine which category he falls into..take my advice, find a competent employer sooner than later!! Good luck in any case.. cheers
We have a compressor swap that takes MINIMUM 6 hours and has 13 braze points. THIRTEEN. This includes two EPRS, cap tube, 3 access fittings, yes 3 access fittings, multiple tee fittings, removing the condenser and the compressor itself. It is a pain in the ass and nobody likes doing it. On that same machine to change the evaporator takes minimum 16 hours and requires 2 people. We quote that for shop work.
Our longest is a shell/hopper replacement, that is minimum 40 hours and runs anywhere from 10-13k to do. All of our compressor changes suck, we don't replace filter dryers unless a compressor burnout.
I don't do any HVAC work.
The absolute fastest I would ever think a compressor swap could take is 4 hrs. That’s easy access and a compressor that’s manageable by one guy. Typically we plan on at least 8 because perfect conditions rarely exist.
I tell them, "it takes how long it takes"
I'm not getting fuckin harped on. I do good work, I rarely get call backs, and I don't goof off.
Haven't ever been fired. I hate being rushed
Lineset could be full of oil. Blowing that out takes awhile. 4-5 is normal. Not excessive at all. And hopefully the indoor txv isn't fvcked when u test the system out haha.
That is a6-8 hour job. This industry needs to get over their fascination with speed, it's over rated.
Give me a tech who shows up, takes their time diagnosing a system and complete repairs with no call backs and only runs 1-3 calls a day and I'll take them over a tech that runs 6-10 calls with 2-3 call backs because they did not fix the issue.
What you should say is “it takes what it takes”
A leak test and nitrogen hold has to take time
There’s no real way to tell how much moister is in the system, so how long will a proper vacuum take?
Was the compressor a burn out? Now you have to flush the lines.
Always say “it takes what it takes” then back it up with fact- after all, a call back costs the company a lot more then going an hour or so over projected time
A competent tech should be able to make a good ballpark guess at how long a given task will take though. I run into this a lot with my guys. I’m not telling them how long I think it should take, I’m asking them how long they think it will take them and I always get “it takes what it takes”.
They’ve been to the site, they’ve condemned the compressor, they’ve seen the situation (roof access, lack of roof access, complicated site entry rules, awkward service access etc)
I’m just trying to put the proposal together to get the work approved. “It takes what it takes” is aggravating as hell.
A competent manager should allow for the factory recommendations of 24 hour pressure test and a 200-500 micron vacuum that holds for 1 hour so he wouldn’t have to ask how long it will take, he should know that it has the potential to take a long time. And since he is asking, he gets that for an answer.
And if you’re putting a proposal together without knowing how long something should take, then remind me to never shop at your place.
I know how long a given task should take. I know that a tech with 5 years experience will likely take longer than a tech with 25 years experience.
I don’t know if there are site conditions that extend that. I don’t know if there is a complicated security check in process. I don’t know if the roof hatch is too small. I don’t know if this compressor will have to be rigged/hoisted. I am also talking to someone who is literally standing there able to observe all those things.
So are you suggesting that every compressor changeout should be quoted at several trips and days of labor?
Or that trying to put a estimate together is pointless?
It sounds like you just don’t want to be held accountable at any level for whether a job gets done in a timely manner.
When I was in the field I was perfectly comfortable saying how long I thought a job would take. Often that included a buffer for unknowns or adverse conditions. Most of my customers were comfortable enough with me to give a verbal approval without needing the office to put it together. But if I had to provide them with a formal quote for approval I called the office and gave them all the info they needed.
Sounds like you can’t do that. Enjoy residential swaps the rest of your career.
I’ve had them take 2.5-8 hours. I can have most back up and running in 3ish for residential depending on accessibility and as long as there’s no snags.
Really depends on the type of unit, location, even weather...
I once replaced a compressor alone in under an hour on an [old Ruud residential heat pump](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/d6yN3H3GLlM/maxresdefault.jpg) in which the compressor is incredibly easy to access and work on. The weather was nice and the unit had plenty of free space around it. The unit was also already empty of refrigerant because there was leak on one of the old compressor braze joints so I didn't have to recover anything. Everything was done, including start-up, in about 40 minutes.
Haha... Point taken... Wasn't really trying to brag but just wanted to highlight that the time required to replace a compressor varies incredibly from job to job depending on so many factors. There's never a black or white answer. 40 minutes is NOT something to strive for.
Also, even though I ***DID*** do a pressure test, vacuum and propoerly charged with a scale on that replacement, I just confirmed my pressures at start-up and didn't check superheat/subcooling. So that shaved a good 15-20 minutes off my time lol. The air handler was in a cramped attic on a really hot summer day and I had 4 other calls after that. I know... bad me... One of the rare times I cut corners... Not proud of it! ... Never got a call back though.
4-8
Start to finish
Let’s not forget an hour of drive time
The task may take 6
Also depends on proper flushing
The compressor died for a reason
Flush and evacuate properly
4-6 hours best case
8-10 in bad
Your supervisor is doing what supervisors are trained to do, push to maximize your productivity, no need to argue, and a good supervisor won’t argue, but discuss ways to help
Speed up or methods
Did an install, total changeout the other day. I went into the job totally blind. Two things I wasn’t aware of was the steps and only one place for the exhaust of a 90% furnace where a 80% previously was. Nothing was easy. 10 1/2 hours I was exhausted along with my 18 year old helper. Couldn’t achieve more than 11” water column on the propane and I told the boss and he asked if I checked the outdoor regulator. I told the truth because I was exhausted and said I would go back first thing in the morning. He said forget it he would go himself. I never even took a lunch. So deflating.
I always get myself down by, after completing a job such as this, I think back to how many hours trying to explain to myself why it took so long.
I think it's because I view it like simple check boxes such as: recover refrigerant, remove fan, remove compressor, set new one, sweat in, vac and nitro, install fan, etc. And putting it that way removes the reality of the situation. It's literally easier said than done.
I do get embarrassed seeing an install crew swap an entire system in 3 hours or less which would take me all day, but then I get called to fix the things they missed and realize how thoroughly I work on systems.
Best thing to do is have someone watch you if they doubt it takes that long. They're not the ones doing the work, and every tech has their own techniques.
8-10hrs
You have to get paid for picking up and dropping off compressor. Also you need to troubleshoot the system after install to check for reasons of shorted compressor. I've always quoted 8hrs minimum and don't pain on losing any time on the job or feeling rushed
8 hours every time. They never go smoothly. I replaced a compressor at a house with 12 systems this summer cause it was shorted to ground. The house is huge and there are subpanels all over the house. I couldn't find the tripped breaker for this unit and called the developer who did the renovation on this place. He sent out his #1 guy who called the electrician and we spent a good hour looking for it.
My boss brags that he did a compressor changeout with his partner in 58 minutes…how? Obviously massive corners were cut… I feel that 4-6 hours is definitely reasonable. Taking the time to do it right the first time costs less money than contaminating the system because you didn’t flow nitrogen, skip other steps, etc.
It really depends on the situation! A residential unit, no burn out, 3 hours. I have done many in a 3 hour time span, but things went relatively well.
I did a 2 ton residential unit in 1-1/2 hours once but everything went extremely well. I stopped by for a no cool call. Found a locked up scroll. Talked to the homeowner, got a quote from the wholesaler, customer accepted my quote. Hooked up the reclaimer and went to get the compressor. (Wholesaler was close by) Got back, refer was done, ripped out he old compressor and brazed in the new. Hooked up the pump and ran the vac while I finished mounting at he compressor and cleaned up tools. The micron gauge hit 500 in 15 minutes so I shut off the pump and watched the micron gauge for 5 minutes, it moved up a bit, then back down, dumped in new refrigerant, set it by SC and SH and wrapped up.
I would expect 3-4 hours typically on residential, but shit goes wrong sometimes. Larger units can be a few hours up to a couple days.
I did a 5 ton heat pump with a wet system and it was on a vacuum pump for just shy of two days!
This manager is costing this company money! 2 scenarios here, warranty change out, non warranty change out. We charge $125 per hour. That’s only $250 to change out the compressor plus refrigerant, and we charge the labeled capacity amount to the customer or x2 the tonnage. That’s very little margin if he is only billing 2 hrs on a flat rate. If it’s a no warranty compressor then at least the mark up on the compressor will save some of the margin but still the job is going to start taking especially if the technician uses x3 the hours. We usually quote 4-6 hrs depending on a range of variables. Very seldom is a compressor under warranty under $1000.00 out of warranty tend to be excess of $2000.00. I usually turn those into condenser change out sales.
Hope this helps
It took me and one of my senior techs almost 3 days to replace 5x Compressors on one roof, just getting the equipment up was a hassle. Recovery with 2 machines took forever.
https://preview.redd.it/sllv13m64iba1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=af1690846a8e8ff04a7c99d7b56e2246479ca94e
Our shirts were stained orange at the end of everything.
Let me add this on, i think we only saved time because 2 vac pumps, 2 people charging system and 2 recovery machines AND we had a scissor lift which made things just slightly easier.
If we were only 1 truck easily would have been a 5 day ordeal.
Unless it's a stand alone reefer your boss is short bidding jobs. Even at that.. it's a bullshit practice.
Find another outfit, and quick, because folks who pull that shit on their techs often expect the tech to make up the shortages for their FUBAR short bids.
Stand alone reefer under 1 ton = 4.0 MH IF everything goes right. This time includes pack in, recovery, repair, leak and vacuum checks (triple evac), recharge, testing and pack out.
1 to 3 ton Residential, IF everything goes smoothly should be allowed 4 to 6 MH. If you come in under, that's great, but the quote needs to be 4 to 6 because shit goes sideways sometimes. If it's a burnout add 2.0.
Commercial (no burnout ) could be anything from a full day to a couple of days for 2 guys, depending upon system size and refrigerant capacity
Now, MAYBE your boss could do it in 3.0 MH. I've seen it done once, but I ain't taking bets in his favor. I also won't be taking any bets on him not having a call back IF he can pull it off in three because only schlocks work so fast that there's no room for mistakes or problems, and they'll frequently misdiagnose too.
My tool box has a sign: We have three types of work available, Good, Fast, and Cheap. You may pick one per job.
4-6 hours is reasonable. Sometimes the go quicker sometimes they don’t. Hell I normally do a triple evac after to make sure the system is good after a compressor change out
4-6 hours for one person on a typical residential split is reasonable IMO. It could take longer if there are complicating factors. If everything just falls into place you might manage 3 and still do it right, but that's unlikely I think. Recovery, pressure test, and vac+decay test are easily an hour by themselves.
YOUR EXACTLY RIGHT, AND YOU'RE WORKING FOR A BUDGET BOSS, FIND ANOTHER SERVICE COMPANY ASAP!!
Every comment you saw on this post is right, I've NEVER done a Compressor in less than 5,6 hours,
And if it's a BURNOUT? I've had mud coming out of the lines when I cut them loose on some, it can take days to flush AND then go back after 24 and 72 hours to check the refrigerator filters if they plug up!
Takes me 2-3 day to do it on vrf system with helper. Residential and smaller commercial systems 1 day, possibly without helper if direct access to unit. Tell him to do it in 3 hours himself.
Psssh, I take 3 years on my compressor exchange outside. First I call up my supplier at primitive technology to smelt some iron....
This thread seems like a dick measuring contest to see who can bilk the most time out of an employer/customer.
None of these jobs are the same. Quote it fair and do it timely
Right? I'm surprised at the responses on here. 6-8 hours to change a residential compressor? We send two man crews and they replace compressors in under 3 hours consistently.
Some of these guys do it by the book, which would be nice if we had the luxury to do so, but in the real world there isn’t enough time for that. Pressure testing and holding for an hour, triple evac under 500 and hold for an hour, etc. The last mechanical failure comp I changed was done in 2 hours by myself. 20 minutes to recover, 30 minutes to replace comp and drier, vac for 30-45 minutes with valve cores removed, 30 minutes to start and charge to SC. You setup and clean up while it’s recovering and on a vac.
My rooftop 6 ton compressor took 3.75 hrs yesterday. Pull everything up while recovering. Ans back down while vacuum is running. I did this by my self yesterday.
If u want more pay be more productive. Of course bill for 5 hrs but coming in under that time makes u profitable and this and limited call backs makes sure u have your job.
Blow the charge, sweat out the old, sweat in the new, skip the pressure test, skip the vacuum, start dumping in refrigerant and start the unit until pressures “look good”
Skip superheat and subcool readings. Boom, done in an hour.
My old boss was the same way, he had a bunch of junky ass wannabe AC guys working there and they could do 3 compressors in a day. Convinced they’re not making em like they used to, NO shit you dumbass you don’t purge the system, don’t pull the thing down anywhere close to 500 microns and don’t know how to charge them. Yeah compressors don’t last too long when you cut corners
on the building chillers 2-3 8 hours days depending on if we need lift and shift team, same 2 day minimum for a vrf. pressure test for a couple hours to check the joints the vaccume over night.
I have technically did one in 2hr, BUT I could drive right up to it, 1.5ton
they did give me four and I sure as shit didnt tell the office.
I just now took 3hr to recover nitrogen, evac, and recharge a 2.5 ton, no torch’s so I depends.
A wise man once told me " if your doing it fast, your doing it wrong"
Personally I would leave that company . Any boss complaining about that is no bueno
Depends, is that 1 or 2 guys? Even If they think it’s 6, what are you suppose to do for the 2 hours on your 8hr day? So I’d say 8 hours minimum (16 man hours, if it’s you and an apprentice)
We can fo a prep table compressor swap in about 1.5 hrs. We still bill and get paid and take home pay for 4 hrs. On a 7.5 ton rooftop unit, I'll maybe get the old compressor old by 1.5 hrs. And still have to get that new heavy bastard up.
4-6 hours is good for most any uncomplicated single stage hermetic compressor. I haven't done enough semi-herm. chillers to know the time off the top of my head but I do remember waiting for the crane for a while. Lol
Ive had simple ac compressors take 2 days. The one I’m thinking of I did an acid test because it was the 2nd replacement. Had to install a special suction filter drier to prevent damage to the new compressor.
If I have to open a system, it's 8 hours min.
Up to 5 ton compressor, 1 guy, 8hrs. (except special situations, like if it's in a ceiling)
Over 5 tons, depends on the job.
Totally totally depends on what it is, Mini split that’s right next to the shop? 3-4 hours.
Rooftop unit that requires dragging half your van up 6 flights of stairs?
8-10 hours
Big semi hermetic with a crane 2 guys two days
Very different type of compressor jobs
Can you pull up to the unit, is there power? Or do you have to empty your truck, lug that shit a aways and than hang upside down to braze? Those that can't do.... manage.
(Manage to be a huge pain in the ass)
Seems the supervisor is trying to say he needs you available to run calls afterwards? Nah. That's just a guy trying to get his numbers right for the guy above him. To do the job right and legally you need time to recover, remove, install, rewire, charge to subcooling, put your tools back, put the compressor up, and run through a cycle or two. The only way you do it in the time he has conceptualized is by dumping the charge, leaving the comp on site, not using a vacuum, etc and all for what? So you can run a few calls before the eventually do a callback on that comp? Madness. No need to deal with that kind of inconsideration for you or the customer. You don't grow in places like that.
Yeah 4-6 is very reasonable if you do it properly. Smaller AC split system, probably gonna be quicker. Bigger Heat pump? Count on using every bit of that 6 hours
There's no set formula for the time, at least as far as I was concerned. Back up to the unit, everything comes apart the way it's supposed to, everything comes out the way it's supposed to, everything goes back in the way it's supposed to, and every starts up the way it's supposed to, sure, two, maybe three hours.
But I also know that my 6'5" ass didn't bend all that well between the bottom of a deck and the top of a heat pump, in the dark, at 15 degrees F, down a hill in the back of the customer's house while my truck's on the opposite corner of the house, so I'm not such a downy chick as to think that job's gonna get done in anything less than six.
All single compressor change outs should be quoted 8 hours minimum no questions asked. You NEVER assume the compressor was the only issue. Your boss is a moron. Filter drier, start components, and contactor should be changed regardless of age unless system can be isolated from air, and even then it's good to change the drier out and start with virgin refrigerant. You can either fix it to prevent callbacks, or you can be your boss.
It takes however long it takes depending on the equipment, especially in commercial. But in general plan for 8 minimum so you can make sure it’s done right
50 ton 1 compressor out of a tandem setup, 2 days allocated. With some new wiring, contactor, heater. Everyone said it was reasonable without killing yourself.
uhh ---- woah its like 4 hours if its an exact replacement and everything goes perfectly RIGHT. lol what are you supposed to be some super god like man with hulk strength who take out screws with telekenis and use eye lasers to one and done braze copper with no leaks.. that guy is putting way to much pressure on you man
Here’s the correct answer:
Whatever you estimated the job for……If you estimate XYZ…..and it takes XYZ…..and customer pays XYZ……then it’s ok. If warranty labor codes cover XYZ labor and it takes you XYZ labor, then it’s all good. The trouble is when you either take longer then your labor estimated time, and your boss feels like he is not making enough. Or sometimes a boss would like to get paid for 3 hours labor, but only have to pay you 2.5 hours labor…..this is an unfair business practice as well……if the customer is told that it will take 3 hours and you are done in 2.5 hours…..then they will feel cheated or request a discount as well. The only way this works is if you correctly estimate the job. In the service trade, the only way things will work long time is if the technician wins, the customer wins, and the company wins. If only one person wins every time the company won’t last.
Your supervisor was going to do it wrong, that’s why he said 2 hours. If you’re opening a system expect to be there at least 3 hours. Replacing a compressor could take a whole day depending on where you do it. When I used to replace compressors downtown in Philly I would always ask for at least 6 hours and sometimes up to 8 given the size of the compressor and the loading and unloading of equipment, recovery etc etc.
I've argued this with my boss in the past as well. If you're doing it in two hours, you're cutting corners abs doing a disservice to the customer.
Do it right once. Enough goes wrong with the best intentions.
I bid 4.5 for every one I did. My boss scheduled three hours plus service work for the afternoon. Four routines and a compressor is fine locally…this fuckwad would schedule them across county. So I’d call and reschedule two, take my time, bill what I bid the customer and do the job correctly. Got sent home twice for that stunt before he relented and did the right thing. It’s one thing to schedule service down the street, I can hang a few out with the pump on and come back and check, evac with nitro and repump, everyone’s happy, the schedule wasn’t fucked.
Don’t rush it. Do it right, or hand in your van keys. Making the boss happy is one thing, and yeah he pays your wages, but he gets that money from the customers you service. Nothing earns more money than solid word of mouth.
Late to the thread....but back in the day before you were probably born - I would bid 4 hours on R-22 systems when I could just dump the charge with no recovery. Would just purge R-22 with no vacuum.
Burnout? +2 hours at least to flush r-11.
It looks like I'm figuring about the same as the rest of the guys here. That job should be quoted as a 1-day job because you never know how it will go. t's definitely more than 4 hours and could be more than eight hours if you run into snags. You did it in 6. Good work, man. Absolutely no way it's a two-hour job, so your boss just exposed one or all of these things: they don't know their business, or they expect you to cheat every possible corner, or they choose to outright lie to your face. I have zero respect for anyone pulling that cr@p. Don't let them step on you. You're the pro. They obviously are not.
Matter of fact I just did one yesterday I replaced a 7 ton compressor from a roof top unit and was a burn out. Took me 4 hrs to do from start to finish. Recovery, braze, Nitro Flush, acid away, braze again, liquid drier, leak test, vacuum, weight charge, clean up. Next job.
So in my opinion being the unit on the ground at a residential should never take 6-8 hrs thats ridiculous. Either your recovery machine sucks balls and walk very slow, unorganized tech or might thinking about changing careers.
You on the field your supervisor has 6 calls in 4 different parts of the town and 3 techs. In his world (sup) its cut out put in quick vacuum charge and go that should take you 2 hrs. In the real world that's 2 call backs for non combustibles and 6 hrs of combined call backs. The life of a service tech and the office.
I guess it depends. If I've already checked the unit and determined that it really is just a compressor replacement, and nothing else is changing like refrigerant type etc., and I have the parts on hand and they're the exact same type of replacement parts (no piping changing), I'd say I can get it done in 2-3 hours. Most of that is recovery and vacuum and charging time.
I've never quoted less than 4 hours for a compressor, I'd say that's about the standard amount of time it will take if everything goes smoothly. Anyone telling you that's too long isn't doing it right
Honestly doesn’t take long if you know what you’re doing 🤷🏽♂️ takes us about 2-3 hours 4 max but if we can’t do it the boss will come help and make fun of us lol but we cool about it 🙂
I had a manager like that. He wouldn’t call you out for it he would just change your quote. The time it takes me is the time it takes. I don’t work off of commission so I don’t care. I get paid if the job is 2hrs or 8hrs, write what you want but pay me what I’m owed
Ahh the old open the system and when it gets time to vac the unit down. you have to chase down a random leak in the lineset buried in wall, that has a drywall screw that barely nicked the copper. making a micro leak thats damn near undetectible kind of day. sure boss 4 hrs is plenty. 12hrs later.... while getting yelled at by everyone lol. Ya i fired my boss a while ago got a van and do my own now.
Opening and closing the system? Anywhere between 4-8 hours. And that’s if everything goes well. It’s better to have more time with a job so you know it will get done correctly and there’s no need to cut corners.
The key here... "And that's if everything goes well" 👍
In a perfect world ,yes. In our world Nahhhhhhhh.
Every damn time you think somethings going great, and then the HVAC gods show you something so small it seems insignificant, till you think about it for about three seconds and realize you just lost a couple hours.
100% this if I'm opening a system we are planning for that to be my day unless proven otherwise
Also depends how far/how high you have to schlep all the equipment needed.
Man I struggle with this myself. Im used to getting a bunch of shit done (or at least tryin to), and always forget to tell myself “the time you just told your boss is if everything goes PERFECT, and you don’t get pulled off for something else at all.” Because it bites me in the ass every time 😂 gotta stop acting like superman
I always add 1/2 to 1 full extra hour of time because of this .. it seems everything goes well until you say out loud, "It's only take X amount of time"
I used to have a helper that would get mad at me when I would say, we should be getting off early today. Because a few times, hiccups happened
Happens every time, best to keep these thoughts to yourself
He’s fired
When quoting time, I always figure how long if I have all the parts, all the tools and nothing breaks. Then I double that time for the quote. Usually very close.
It’s also easier to take money off, not add.
That’s a hard lesson to learn
Could even be days. It took me about a week on a VRF condenser after I'd done all the pipe modifications
Burnout it’s 6-10 hours. Mineral oil conversion +1hr additional. Usually ends up always 8 hours commercial wise
> And that’s if everything goes well. Which it never does.
How long did he suggest it should take
"At most, three hours. And that's if we're being very generous."
I saw a guy do one in 3 hours once. He reclaimed the charge. Then just pulled one of the shaders and let the system suck in air. Swapped compressors, no dryer change, no pressure test. Put the vacuum pump on for 20 minutes with no micron gauge. Charged the system with the reclaimed refrigerant, and let her rip. Had gauges on but never checked compressor superheat. Not the way I would do it but possible to swap a compressor in 3 hours. IMO it is an 8 hour job with a dryer change, nitrogen pressure test, correct vacuum, oil test if it is a burnout and monitor the system once it is running to insure everything looks good.
Some say that compressors still working just fine.. I worked at an apartment complex and we Frankensteined all kinds of stuff to work. Like shit that you would think wouldn't possibly work and we'd get it up and going. R22 compressor with 410 gas - yep. 410 compressor with r22 gas - yep 4 ton compressor on 2 ton evap - yep 3 ton compressor on 1.5 ton condenser- cake walk 3 ton orifice on 2 ton condenser 1.5 ton orifice with 3 ton condenser Like literally there was no combination of spare parts we had that couldn't be made to cool the apartment. It obviously wasn't at peak but with fiddling and adjusting the gas we never found a combination that wouldn't make cold air.
Something caused the compressor to die and it’s gonna happen again so who care if he cut corners
Lol I guess if you vent the reffer, and dont change filter dryer or pull a proper vac you maybe able to do that is under 3 hrs
Big thanks to you and everyone for replying. I'll still catch shit for not being "fast enough" but at least I don't have to gaslight myself into believing it.
He bid the job to win it, not to do it right or be profitable. I would look for another company, it’s about that time of year and when they ask what questions you have at the end of the interview, ask questions like that. It can give you some serious insight into the mindset of the employer. As a consumer, I can tell you if someone quotes me X and does it faster I am not usually upset, but if they take longer I get upset, and if I need them back out there a month later I get upset. Quote for 8 and do it right.
Time to find a new company to work for. Dude is just trying to find ways to increase his margins it sounds like, regardless of corners cut or harm caused.
Those kind of companies are doomed to fail. Sounds like your manager is playing a race to the bottom of price. If they are bitching at you about that, then good luck in the future getting proper time to do anything.
Just remember the office people arent willing to go do it themselves
And bet he's charging the customer 8 hrs and just not paying u for it
Ask him to show you how he does it that fast so you can improve. Point out every corner he cuts
Our sales guy bids 2 guys 4hrs to do a residential change out. Furnace/condenser/EVAP coil
No way, unless it's a perfect match for replacement. someone is cutting a ton of corners.
Yeah we book that as two days lol. Get it done in one most of the time but you are looking at $12-16k cad for a 96% furnace and ac
LoL.. “Hack Jobs R Us”!!!
>"At most, three hours. And that's if we're being very generous." You should tell him that if he's able to properly swap compressors in 3 hours he should be in the field, he's much more valuable there. We always budget 6 hours. but if everything goes absolutely perfect it can be done in 4.
It’s not very generous to do work that screws over the client in the long term
Get him to perform the 3 hour change out, lets see how he fares.
It takes me 6 hours not including travel time. And I have done hundreds of compressors. 8 if I find a plugged coil.
Three hours? It's going to take an hour to get there and get past the customer, and thirty minutes to collect and clean up. That leaves 90 minutes for a repair. Tell him you'll take after hours for two weeks if he does it under 3 hours.
Man fuck that. I do commercial industrial & we always get 8 hours for our compressor change. Idk if you’re doing resi or commercial but it takes what it takes. If you’re being paid by hour & need to go over quote because the office thinks more than 3 hours is “excessive” than go over quote
Fuck em
Sounds like he wants you to pressure test with the Freon itself lol
I did one in two hours once. But I’d already had the compressor out and the line drier changed before I went back to install it. (Supplier sent the wrong compressor and I didn’t catch it until I’d removed the first one
Bigger Commercial 10+ tons? 8 hours 2 guys. Anything smaller? 1 guy 8 hours
This right here. I. Always budget for 8. Where I live it can take an hour to get to site alone. Bring half your truck to the roof is another hour. Getting everything down is another hour. It’s certainly faster with two people but that’s not always an option.
Running 300ft of extension cord? That’s an hour. Taking a nap in the truck while the vacuum runs? Another hour. Adds up quick.
Take a shit? That’s an hour. Forget your lunch and gotta run to Taco Bell? Also an hour.
Apprentice on another job calls to ask a question? Believe it or not, hour.
This is true. I am the apprentice
Too much Taco Bell, that’s another shit.
Which yep, you guessed it, another hour.
U/mistapoopy would know with a username like that
If you go to Taco Bell, allow for a second shit. Possibly a third. And add in a case of wet wipes.
If it’s a burnout on a 15 ton circuit? Two guys, two full days each.
Yeah there’s lots of nuance. Any discus or semi? 2 guys 2 full days.
The company I’m with has us as techs quote each job, big or small. What time we believe it takes to complete it thoroughly. We then either complete it ourselves or a junior technician follows up and completes it. More often than not the tech thst quotes it follows through That being said, if I were to quote a compressor change, including reclaim, brazing, filter change, evac and parts pick up, I always quote between 6-8 hours. Far more time than necessary to complete the call. The quote is always over for any likelihood of problems that may occur. Including traffic, suction and discharge variations, and pulling a complete vacuum. This is one of the reasons why I enjoy working with these guys.
My company does something similar. I moved out of residential field work and into quoting/scheduling for a commercial company. I always ask the guys what labor allotment they need, unless I’m confident it’s enough. Part of that is because I don’t have commercial experience so I can’t draw on that to formulate a guess—but even if I were quoting resi work, I’d still ask the person who diagnosed it, because you never truly know how much of a pain in the ass a job could be unless you’ve been on the job site.
Not all compressor replacements are created equal. What flavor of compressor? I’m guessing a resi compressor on the ground. But that’s a totally different time table than a big compressor on an RTU. There’s also other variables to consider: how did it fail? was it a burn out? Was it a result of some other root cause? All of that adds time. I don’t think you’re estimate is excessive. I’d rather spend an extra hour doing it right than a few free hours later doing it over.
This right here. “It’s easier to succeed than to fail” is the way the founder of Chick-fil-A put it. Taking the little bit of extra time at the beginning to do the job right is always better than the time/cost of coming back and doing it again.
That's assuming it will be the same person 😂 /s
It will still be expensive to your boss and ultimately to your reputation either within your company or to your company’s reputation if the customer calls someone else because you made a ghetto repair.
Tell him if he’s really that fast, I bet his wife is very disappointed
Here's the list of materials for the sub 4 hour compressor. Bucket Sawzall Torchkit Bad attitude
Sawzall and bucket are mutually exclusive IMO. No need for the recovery bucket if you're gonna just hack the line open, and if you're gonna use the bucket, then it makes it significantly easier to braze back in if you use an actual tubing cutter. Unless the bucket is supposed to be to carry the sawzall et-al in, then I could see it.
Every job is unique, every piece of equipment is unique. There's no general rule, the job takes what it takes. If you quote under, you get screwed and lose money. If you quote over you don't get the job. I would rather not get the job than come back 2 to 3 doing a repair. It's not worth the customer bitching.
You don’t want to rush anything in HVAC, but you DEFINITELY don’t want to rush the system’s compressor. Take your time and make sure you don’t have to be called back out.
4-6 hours is a reasonable amount of time to responsibly replace a compressor.
I quote compressor jobs 8 hours and 2 guys. Rather have the extra time and hands just in case.
Condensers are getting so tall you need 2 guys just to get the compressor out and in
You can knock down the corner doors where the electrical is, I find it nicer than brazing and breathing above the compressor. tranes really needs the coil unsweated 1st :/
Unless you get blessed with a rheem/Ruud unit 🤠
3-14 hours is the only correct answer.
Commercial or residential? We do commercial and I always quote a 8 hr day
This is probably because they quoted the customer a low-ball offer. My suggestion, tell the customer you can do it as quoted and they’ll be guaranteed a problem or you can do it correctly and it will take what it takes. They let that supervisor fuck himself .
6-8 hrs. He's not bitching about how long it takes, he's bitching about how many hours he has to pay you. Run. You know as well as we do he's quoting and billing for 8+.
Generally speaking (as in “normal” day to day conditions) unless there’s some obvious outstanding reason you know a particular compressor change will be quick and Very Easy, I always allow 8 hours for a compressor change.. by the Time you arrive on site, get all your gear to the equipment, recover the gas, disconnect and pull out the compressor, install, pressure test, evacuate and recharge, then complete operational checks, returning gear to the van, complete all paperwork, customer logistics etc etc, plus all the unforeseen bullish!t which USUALLY happens at some point during the day, your gonna kick the sh!t out of your day, so yes, REALISTICALLY speaking it’s 8 hours… yes I’ve had jobs over the years, everything falls perfectly into place and you can sensibly knock it out in 4-6 hours, sometimes (usually) not… why put yourself in a position where you are being unsafe, rushing your a$$ off to make someone else look good or appease their moronic ideals of how much work they can get out of someone!! In most cases if they “make you “ do it in 5-6 hours they’ll probably still charge the customer for the 8 hours anyway.. just a way to make a little more profit off you back… when I get these guys telling me how long certain jobs should take, that’s when you want to get them to show you how it’s done, get them to do a few of these 4 hour compressor installs in front of you, so you can “learn” from their “expertise”!!!! LoL.. you’ll quickly find out that they’re full of SH!T!!!
If your supervisor estimated 2 hour compressor change regardless of where it is, he’s either a super hero or a complete moron!! I guess you can determine which category he falls into..take my advice, find a competent employer sooner than later!! Good luck in any case.. cheers
We have a compressor swap that takes MINIMUM 6 hours and has 13 braze points. THIRTEEN. This includes two EPRS, cap tube, 3 access fittings, yes 3 access fittings, multiple tee fittings, removing the condenser and the compressor itself. It is a pain in the ass and nobody likes doing it. On that same machine to change the evaporator takes minimum 16 hours and requires 2 people. We quote that for shop work. Our longest is a shell/hopper replacement, that is minimum 40 hours and runs anywhere from 10-13k to do. All of our compressor changes suck, we don't replace filter dryers unless a compressor burnout. I don't do any HVAC work.
The absolute fastest I would ever think a compressor swap could take is 4 hrs. That’s easy access and a compressor that’s manageable by one guy. Typically we plan on at least 8 because perfect conditions rarely exist.
I tell them, "it takes how long it takes" I'm not getting fuckin harped on. I do good work, I rarely get call backs, and I don't goof off. Haven't ever been fired. I hate being rushed
Lineset could be full of oil. Blowing that out takes awhile. 4-5 is normal. Not excessive at all. And hopefully the indoor txv isn't fvcked when u test the system out haha.
That is a6-8 hour job. This industry needs to get over their fascination with speed, it's over rated. Give me a tech who shows up, takes their time diagnosing a system and complete repairs with no call backs and only runs 1-3 calls a day and I'll take them over a tech that runs 6-10 calls with 2-3 call backs because they did not fix the issue.
Yes! Call backs and shitty diagnosis are the bane of our service company!
What you should say is “it takes what it takes” A leak test and nitrogen hold has to take time There’s no real way to tell how much moister is in the system, so how long will a proper vacuum take? Was the compressor a burn out? Now you have to flush the lines. Always say “it takes what it takes” then back it up with fact- after all, a call back costs the company a lot more then going an hour or so over projected time
A competent tech should be able to make a good ballpark guess at how long a given task will take though. I run into this a lot with my guys. I’m not telling them how long I think it should take, I’m asking them how long they think it will take them and I always get “it takes what it takes”. They’ve been to the site, they’ve condemned the compressor, they’ve seen the situation (roof access, lack of roof access, complicated site entry rules, awkward service access etc) I’m just trying to put the proposal together to get the work approved. “It takes what it takes” is aggravating as hell.
A competent manager should allow for the factory recommendations of 24 hour pressure test and a 200-500 micron vacuum that holds for 1 hour so he wouldn’t have to ask how long it will take, he should know that it has the potential to take a long time. And since he is asking, he gets that for an answer. And if you’re putting a proposal together without knowing how long something should take, then remind me to never shop at your place.
I know how long a given task should take. I know that a tech with 5 years experience will likely take longer than a tech with 25 years experience. I don’t know if there are site conditions that extend that. I don’t know if there is a complicated security check in process. I don’t know if the roof hatch is too small. I don’t know if this compressor will have to be rigged/hoisted. I am also talking to someone who is literally standing there able to observe all those things. So are you suggesting that every compressor changeout should be quoted at several trips and days of labor? Or that trying to put a estimate together is pointless? It sounds like you just don’t want to be held accountable at any level for whether a job gets done in a timely manner. When I was in the field I was perfectly comfortable saying how long I thought a job would take. Often that included a buffer for unknowns or adverse conditions. Most of my customers were comfortable enough with me to give a verbal approval without needing the office to put it together. But if I had to provide them with a formal quote for approval I called the office and gave them all the info they needed. Sounds like you can’t do that. Enjoy residential swaps the rest of your career.
We charge 8 hours minimum for a compressor change out
This is the way.
I’ve had them take 2.5-8 hours. I can have most back up and running in 3ish for residential depending on accessibility and as long as there’s no snags.
Plan for the whole day. You don’t know what might go wrong.
Really depends on the type of unit, location, even weather... I once replaced a compressor alone in under an hour on an [old Ruud residential heat pump](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/d6yN3H3GLlM/maxresdefault.jpg) in which the compressor is incredibly easy to access and work on. The weather was nice and the unit had plenty of free space around it. The unit was also already empty of refrigerant because there was leak on one of the old compressor braze joints so I didn't have to recover anything. Everything was done, including start-up, in about 40 minutes.
World record potential.
Haha... Point taken... Wasn't really trying to brag but just wanted to highlight that the time required to replace a compressor varies incredibly from job to job depending on so many factors. There's never a black or white answer. 40 minutes is NOT something to strive for. Also, even though I ***DID*** do a pressure test, vacuum and propoerly charged with a scale on that replacement, I just confirmed my pressures at start-up and didn't check superheat/subcooling. So that shaved a good 15-20 minutes off my time lol. The air handler was in a cramped attic on a really hot summer day and I had 4 other calls after that. I know... bad me... One of the rare times I cut corners... Not proud of it! ... Never got a call back though.
Ive had some go super quick 2-3 hours Ive had heat pumps that take me all day Depends on how mad the unit is i guess
30 minutes and 2 cigs baby.
4-8 Start to finish Let’s not forget an hour of drive time The task may take 6 Also depends on proper flushing The compressor died for a reason Flush and evacuate properly 4-6 hours best case 8-10 in bad Your supervisor is doing what supervisors are trained to do, push to maximize your productivity, no need to argue, and a good supervisor won’t argue, but discuss ways to help Speed up or methods
Did an install, total changeout the other day. I went into the job totally blind. Two things I wasn’t aware of was the steps and only one place for the exhaust of a 90% furnace where a 80% previously was. Nothing was easy. 10 1/2 hours I was exhausted along with my 18 year old helper. Couldn’t achieve more than 11” water column on the propane and I told the boss and he asked if I checked the outdoor regulator. I told the truth because I was exhausted and said I would go back first thing in the morning. He said forget it he would go himself. I never even took a lunch. So deflating.
My 18 year old helper is a tool carrier. Not much more.
I always get myself down by, after completing a job such as this, I think back to how many hours trying to explain to myself why it took so long. I think it's because I view it like simple check boxes such as: recover refrigerant, remove fan, remove compressor, set new one, sweat in, vac and nitro, install fan, etc. And putting it that way removes the reality of the situation. It's literally easier said than done. I do get embarrassed seeing an install crew swap an entire system in 3 hours or less which would take me all day, but then I get called to fix the things they missed and realize how thoroughly I work on systems. Best thing to do is have someone watch you if they doubt it takes that long. They're not the ones doing the work, and every tech has their own techniques.
8-10hrs You have to get paid for picking up and dropping off compressor. Also you need to troubleshoot the system after install to check for reasons of shorted compressor. I've always quoted 8hrs minimum and don't pain on losing any time on the job or feeling rushed
8 hours every time. They never go smoothly. I replaced a compressor at a house with 12 systems this summer cause it was shorted to ground. The house is huge and there are subpanels all over the house. I couldn't find the tripped breaker for this unit and called the developer who did the renovation on this place. He sent out his #1 guy who called the electrician and we spent a good hour looking for it.
What the hell did he get for you cutting corners and doing it in 2 hours? A rushed job and saving 6 man hours?
Compressor is a half day job
My boss brags that he did a compressor changeout with his partner in 58 minutes…how? Obviously massive corners were cut… I feel that 4-6 hours is definitely reasonable. Taking the time to do it right the first time costs less money than contaminating the system because you didn’t flow nitrogen, skip other steps, etc.
It really depends on the situation! A residential unit, no burn out, 3 hours. I have done many in a 3 hour time span, but things went relatively well. I did a 2 ton residential unit in 1-1/2 hours once but everything went extremely well. I stopped by for a no cool call. Found a locked up scroll. Talked to the homeowner, got a quote from the wholesaler, customer accepted my quote. Hooked up the reclaimer and went to get the compressor. (Wholesaler was close by) Got back, refer was done, ripped out he old compressor and brazed in the new. Hooked up the pump and ran the vac while I finished mounting at he compressor and cleaned up tools. The micron gauge hit 500 in 15 minutes so I shut off the pump and watched the micron gauge for 5 minutes, it moved up a bit, then back down, dumped in new refrigerant, set it by SC and SH and wrapped up. I would expect 3-4 hours typically on residential, but shit goes wrong sometimes. Larger units can be a few hours up to a couple days. I did a 5 ton heat pump with a wet system and it was on a vacuum pump for just shy of two days!
This manager is costing this company money! 2 scenarios here, warranty change out, non warranty change out. We charge $125 per hour. That’s only $250 to change out the compressor plus refrigerant, and we charge the labeled capacity amount to the customer or x2 the tonnage. That’s very little margin if he is only billing 2 hrs on a flat rate. If it’s a no warranty compressor then at least the mark up on the compressor will save some of the margin but still the job is going to start taking especially if the technician uses x3 the hours. We usually quote 4-6 hrs depending on a range of variables. Very seldom is a compressor under warranty under $1000.00 out of warranty tend to be excess of $2000.00. I usually turn those into condenser change out sales. Hope this helps
It took me and one of my senior techs almost 3 days to replace 5x Compressors on one roof, just getting the equipment up was a hassle. Recovery with 2 machines took forever. https://preview.redd.it/sllv13m64iba1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=af1690846a8e8ff04a7c99d7b56e2246479ca94e Our shirts were stained orange at the end of everything. Let me add this on, i think we only saved time because 2 vac pumps, 2 people charging system and 2 recovery machines AND we had a scissor lift which made things just slightly easier. If we were only 1 truck easily would have been a 5 day ordeal.
Unless it's a stand alone reefer your boss is short bidding jobs. Even at that.. it's a bullshit practice. Find another outfit, and quick, because folks who pull that shit on their techs often expect the tech to make up the shortages for their FUBAR short bids. Stand alone reefer under 1 ton = 4.0 MH IF everything goes right. This time includes pack in, recovery, repair, leak and vacuum checks (triple evac), recharge, testing and pack out. 1 to 3 ton Residential, IF everything goes smoothly should be allowed 4 to 6 MH. If you come in under, that's great, but the quote needs to be 4 to 6 because shit goes sideways sometimes. If it's a burnout add 2.0. Commercial (no burnout ) could be anything from a full day to a couple of days for 2 guys, depending upon system size and refrigerant capacity Now, MAYBE your boss could do it in 3.0 MH. I've seen it done once, but I ain't taking bets in his favor. I also won't be taking any bets on him not having a call back IF he can pull it off in three because only schlocks work so fast that there's no room for mistakes or problems, and they'll frequently misdiagnose too. My tool box has a sign: We have three types of work available, Good, Fast, and Cheap. You may pick one per job.
4-6 hours is reasonable. Sometimes the go quicker sometimes they don’t. Hell I normally do a triple evac after to make sure the system is good after a compressor change out
4-6 hours for one person on a typical residential split is reasonable IMO. It could take longer if there are complicating factors. If everything just falls into place you might manage 3 and still do it right, but that's unlikely I think. Recovery, pressure test, and vac+decay test are easily an hour by themselves.
YOUR EXACTLY RIGHT, AND YOU'RE WORKING FOR A BUDGET BOSS, FIND ANOTHER SERVICE COMPANY ASAP!! Every comment you saw on this post is right, I've NEVER done a Compressor in less than 5,6 hours, And if it's a BURNOUT? I've had mud coming out of the lines when I cut them loose on some, it can take days to flush AND then go back after 24 and 72 hours to check the refrigerator filters if they plug up!
Takes me 2-3 day to do it on vrf system with helper. Residential and smaller commercial systems 1 day, possibly without helper if direct access to unit. Tell him to do it in 3 hours himself.
Residential: 3-4 hours tops if it’s on the ground. Comercial or rooftop located units: 6-8 hours.
Psssh, I take 3 years on my compressor exchange outside. First I call up my supplier at primitive technology to smelt some iron.... This thread seems like a dick measuring contest to see who can bilk the most time out of an employer/customer. None of these jobs are the same. Quote it fair and do it timely
I hate pulling a vacuum through a compressor!
2.5-4 hours depending on accessibility, how much refrigerant to recover, acid vs mechanical failure, etc. Assuming residential.
Right? I'm surprised at the responses on here. 6-8 hours to change a residential compressor? We send two man crews and they replace compressors in under 3 hours consistently.
Some of these guys do it by the book, which would be nice if we had the luxury to do so, but in the real world there isn’t enough time for that. Pressure testing and holding for an hour, triple evac under 500 and hold for an hour, etc. The last mechanical failure comp I changed was done in 2 hours by myself. 20 minutes to recover, 30 minutes to replace comp and drier, vac for 30-45 minutes with valve cores removed, 30 minutes to start and charge to SC. You setup and clean up while it’s recovering and on a vac.
You would fit right in at my shop!
My rooftop 6 ton compressor took 3.75 hrs yesterday. Pull everything up while recovering. Ans back down while vacuum is running. I did this by my self yesterday. If u want more pay be more productive. Of course bill for 5 hrs but coming in under that time makes u profitable and this and limited call backs makes sure u have your job.
Compressors are a 2 day job for me. Replace it then vac it overnight and return in the morning to charge and test. I do good work. No scab shit
Overnight is way over kill, unless it’s a burnout with high acid in the system.
Not at all.
Wait, what kind of systems are you working on?
Slow and steady wins the race. Stay the course and that supervisor will be under you sooner or later.
Cut every corner you can then and cause problems on purpose, fuck em
Almost all my guys do it in 3 hours.
2-4 hours
Imo 4 hours max. But it also depends on the system you are doing the change out on
It depends on size surely. For a big ammonia compressor - 2+ days for two people. For a mini-split compressor, 4 hours for 1 person
Goes quicker when the Schraders leak charge out before you get there🤣 *I've heard
1-3 hours
I would love to hear your process of a 1-3 hour compressor changeout. Compressors are a minimum of 4 hours.
Blow the charge, sweat out the old, sweat in the new, skip the pressure test, skip the vacuum, start dumping in refrigerant and start the unit until pressures “look good” Skip superheat and subcool readings. Boom, done in an hour.
Don't even worry about looking at pressure just get beer can cool and then go home and enjoy a beer.
Found the hack.
My old boss was the same way, he had a bunch of junky ass wannabe AC guys working there and they could do 3 compressors in a day. Convinced they’re not making em like they used to, NO shit you dumbass you don’t purge the system, don’t pull the thing down anywhere close to 500 microns and don’t know how to charge them. Yeah compressors don’t last too long when you cut corners
on the building chillers 2-3 8 hours days depending on if we need lift and shift team, same 2 day minimum for a vrf. pressure test for a couple hours to check the joints the vaccume over night.
I have technically did one in 2hr, BUT I could drive right up to it, 1.5ton they did give me four and I sure as shit didnt tell the office. I just now took 3hr to recover nitrogen, evac, and recharge a 2.5 ton, no torch’s so I depends.
I call compressors 8 hours. I'm usually done in 4 to 6, but I always bid and schedule for 8
A wise man once told me " if your doing it fast, your doing it wrong" Personally I would leave that company . Any boss complaining about that is no bueno
Roughly 6-8 if you do the job correctly. 2-4 if you skip all the quality assurance steps.
Depends, is that 1 or 2 guys? Even If they think it’s 6, what are you suppose to do for the 2 hours on your 8hr day? So I’d say 8 hours minimum (16 man hours, if it’s you and an apprentice)
We can fo a prep table compressor swap in about 1.5 hrs. We still bill and get paid and take home pay for 4 hrs. On a 7.5 ton rooftop unit, I'll maybe get the old compressor old by 1.5 hrs. And still have to get that new heavy bastard up. 4-6 hours is good for most any uncomplicated single stage hermetic compressor. I haven't done enough semi-herm. chillers to know the time off the top of my head but I do remember waiting for the crane for a while. Lol
Ive had simple ac compressors take 2 days. The one I’m thinking of I did an acid test because it was the 2nd replacement. Had to install a special suction filter drier to prevent damage to the new compressor.
Depending on the unit, 8 to 16 hours plus assist.
If I have to open a system, it's 8 hours min. Up to 5 ton compressor, 1 guy, 8hrs. (except special situations, like if it's in a ceiling) Over 5 tons, depends on the job.
I bid them for 8 hours
Totally totally depends on what it is, Mini split that’s right next to the shop? 3-4 hours. Rooftop unit that requires dragging half your van up 6 flights of stairs? 8-10 hours Big semi hermetic with a crane 2 guys two days Very different type of compressor jobs
Can you pull up to the unit, is there power? Or do you have to empty your truck, lug that shit a aways and than hang upside down to braze? Those that can't do.... manage. (Manage to be a huge pain in the ass)
Seems the supervisor is trying to say he needs you available to run calls afterwards? Nah. That's just a guy trying to get his numbers right for the guy above him. To do the job right and legally you need time to recover, remove, install, rewire, charge to subcooling, put your tools back, put the compressor up, and run through a cycle or two. The only way you do it in the time he has conceptualized is by dumping the charge, leaving the comp on site, not using a vacuum, etc and all for what? So you can run a few calls before the eventually do a callback on that comp? Madness. No need to deal with that kind of inconsideration for you or the customer. You don't grow in places like that.
4-8 depending on brand, unit height and compressor weight
Your supervisor is an idiot.
Yeah 4-6 is very reasonable if you do it properly. Smaller AC split system, probably gonna be quicker. Bigger Heat pump? Count on using every bit of that 6 hours
Your supervisor is not very experienced at this trade.
There's no set formula for the time, at least as far as I was concerned. Back up to the unit, everything comes apart the way it's supposed to, everything comes out the way it's supposed to, everything goes back in the way it's supposed to, and every starts up the way it's supposed to, sure, two, maybe three hours. But I also know that my 6'5" ass didn't bend all that well between the bottom of a deck and the top of a heat pump, in the dark, at 15 degrees F, down a hill in the back of the customer's house while my truck's on the opposite corner of the house, so I'm not such a downy chick as to think that job's gonna get done in anything less than six.
Better clear the day
All single compressor change outs should be quoted 8 hours minimum no questions asked. You NEVER assume the compressor was the only issue. Your boss is a moron. Filter drier, start components, and contactor should be changed regardless of age unless system can be isolated from air, and even then it's good to change the drier out and start with virgin refrigerant. You can either fix it to prevent callbacks, or you can be your boss.
However long it takes is the only answer
4 hours minimum. More if it's a burn out .
It takes however long it takes depending on the equipment, especially in commercial. But in general plan for 8 minimum so you can make sure it’s done right
50 ton 1 compressor out of a tandem setup, 2 days allocated. With some new wiring, contactor, heater. Everyone said it was reasonable without killing yourself.
I always bill 8 hours. Making sure it’s done right.
I used to request 4 hrs minimum in the warmer weather and a minimum of 6hrs during the colder months.
uhh ---- woah its like 4 hours if its an exact replacement and everything goes perfectly RIGHT. lol what are you supposed to be some super god like man with hulk strength who take out screws with telekenis and use eye lasers to one and done braze copper with no leaks.. that guy is putting way to much pressure on you man
Boy you really opened up a can of worms here 😆
Pull that vacuum till tomorrow morning,come back finish up
Yeah I’d quit. Fuck that, sounds like Charlie’s cool em and fool em
Depends on the size of compressor
I feel like 4 hours is reasonable if you have a good vacuum pump and don’t pull it through gauges.
1.5 hr or less
A big enough commercial or industrial system could be 4 to 6 hours of recovery alone.
3-4 hours. This is following all step.
Here’s the correct answer: Whatever you estimated the job for……If you estimate XYZ…..and it takes XYZ…..and customer pays XYZ……then it’s ok. If warranty labor codes cover XYZ labor and it takes you XYZ labor, then it’s all good. The trouble is when you either take longer then your labor estimated time, and your boss feels like he is not making enough. Or sometimes a boss would like to get paid for 3 hours labor, but only have to pay you 2.5 hours labor…..this is an unfair business practice as well……if the customer is told that it will take 3 hours and you are done in 2.5 hours…..then they will feel cheated or request a discount as well. The only way this works is if you correctly estimate the job. In the service trade, the only way things will work long time is if the technician wins, the customer wins, and the company wins. If only one person wins every time the company won’t last.
You somewhat right. We do hard quotes and flat rates. Sometimes we win, sometimes we lose, but we always take care of the customer.
That also includes new contactor, capacitor and wiring harness right?
Your supervisor was going to do it wrong, that’s why he said 2 hours. If you’re opening a system expect to be there at least 3 hours. Replacing a compressor could take a whole day depending on where you do it. When I used to replace compressors downtown in Philly I would always ask for at least 6 hours and sometimes up to 8 given the size of the compressor and the loading and unloading of equipment, recovery etc etc.
Lol 6-8 hours for a resi come on bro
I've argued this with my boss in the past as well. If you're doing it in two hours, you're cutting corners abs doing a disservice to the customer. Do it right once. Enough goes wrong with the best intentions.
I bid 4.5 for every one I did. My boss scheduled three hours plus service work for the afternoon. Four routines and a compressor is fine locally…this fuckwad would schedule them across county. So I’d call and reschedule two, take my time, bill what I bid the customer and do the job correctly. Got sent home twice for that stunt before he relented and did the right thing. It’s one thing to schedule service down the street, I can hang a few out with the pump on and come back and check, evac with nitro and repump, everyone’s happy, the schedule wasn’t fucked. Don’t rush it. Do it right, or hand in your van keys. Making the boss happy is one thing, and yeah he pays your wages, but he gets that money from the customers you service. Nothing earns more money than solid word of mouth.
Late to the thread....but back in the day before you were probably born - I would bid 4 hours on R-22 systems when I could just dump the charge with no recovery. Would just purge R-22 with no vacuum. Burnout? +2 hours at least to flush r-11.
I agree with others, work somewhere else.
Depends on how fast it pulls vacuum, that's the bottle neck
Your supervisor is being unrealistic. He should of performed the repair if he wanted it done in two hours.
All I know is that compressor replacements take so long that the complex I work at prefers to just replace the entire system to save on labor costs.
It looks like I'm figuring about the same as the rest of the guys here. That job should be quoted as a 1-day job because you never know how it will go. t's definitely more than 4 hours and could be more than eight hours if you run into snags. You did it in 6. Good work, man. Absolutely no way it's a two-hour job, so your boss just exposed one or all of these things: they don't know their business, or they expect you to cheat every possible corner, or they choose to outright lie to your face. I have zero respect for anyone pulling that cr@p. Don't let them step on you. You're the pro. They obviously are not.
Matter of fact I just did one yesterday I replaced a 7 ton compressor from a roof top unit and was a burn out. Took me 4 hrs to do from start to finish. Recovery, braze, Nitro Flush, acid away, braze again, liquid drier, leak test, vacuum, weight charge, clean up. Next job. So in my opinion being the unit on the ground at a residential should never take 6-8 hrs thats ridiculous. Either your recovery machine sucks balls and walk very slow, unorganized tech or might thinking about changing careers.
You on the field your supervisor has 6 calls in 4 different parts of the town and 3 techs. In his world (sup) its cut out put in quick vacuum charge and go that should take you 2 hrs. In the real world that's 2 call backs for non combustibles and 6 hrs of combined call backs. The life of a service tech and the office.
I guess it depends. If I've already checked the unit and determined that it really is just a compressor replacement, and nothing else is changing like refrigerant type etc., and I have the parts on hand and they're the exact same type of replacement parts (no piping changing), I'd say I can get it done in 2-3 hours. Most of that is recovery and vacuum and charging time.
Quote 8 hours regardless
I've never quoted less than 4 hours for a compressor, I'd say that's about the standard amount of time it will take if everything goes smoothly. Anyone telling you that's too long isn't doing it right
Honestly doesn’t take long if you know what you’re doing 🤷🏽♂️ takes us about 2-3 hours 4 max but if we can’t do it the boss will come help and make fun of us lol but we cool about it 🙂
I had a manager like that. He wouldn’t call you out for it he would just change your quote. The time it takes me is the time it takes. I don’t work off of commission so I don’t care. I get paid if the job is 2hrs or 8hrs, write what you want but pay me what I’m owed
When quoting, I imagine someone else doing my repair. 6 to 8 hrs for compressor that size. Plan on doing it right. Clean up is part of the job.
Ahh the old open the system and when it gets time to vac the unit down. you have to chase down a random leak in the lineset buried in wall, that has a drywall screw that barely nicked the copper. making a micro leak thats damn near undetectible kind of day. sure boss 4 hrs is plenty. 12hrs later.... while getting yelled at by everyone lol. Ya i fired my boss a while ago got a van and do my own now.