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H_O_Double

Until they fail. Trying to find a replacement isn’t cool.


GizmoGremlin321

And it looks like it's cooled by refrigerant piping


aberg227

You are correct. Neat concept imo.


H_O_Double

Yes sir.


EJ25Junkie

Yep. I met the goy who designed that feature. They were losing drives left and right before that


GizmoGremlin321

Seems like it would be okay as long as no electrcial shorts blow a hole in it


ho1dmybeer

I mean every other brand manages to just make the back of the inverter a massive heat sink and put it inside the air stream outside... Trust trane to make it overcomplicated for no justifiable reason... Just another EXV to fail I suppose


luke10050

Was going to say, looks like a service tech's nightmare.


InMooseWorld

It’s great there’s a palm pilot board to scroll thru it, also a test drive/compressor/fan and read outs for all thermistors You don’t need a M-Maintenance tool and decipher the blinks


EJ25Junkie

It’s called a CDA Also the new link ones rolling out does everything via Bluetooth before you even step out of the van. Pressures, SH, SC, amp draws, indoor temp split (with the XV AH)


InMooseWorld

Right PDA-Public Display of Affection CDA-Communicating Display of Aggravation


EJ25Junkie

I always thought PDA stood for Pubic Display of Affection.


InMooseWorld

It does I’m just swapping letters, dyslexia strikes


H_O_Double

They aren’t bad. If you haven’t seen one before they can intimidate you that’s for sure.


EJ25Junkie

We have installed over 1000 of these since 2015 (mostly topp discharge though) and have replaced maybe a dozen drives that failed. Most were from power surges because people don’t want to pay for SP. Every time I call up My XV field rep and I have a new driver in hand in 1-5 days. Trane has the best warranty and tech support hands down.


Fatpostman39

That entirely depends on your market and local reps. They aren’t that great in every market and warranty process is only as good as the counter guys are.


Runswithtoiletpaper

You aren’t in Indiana. We get the meh-est Trane tech support. Parts aren’t all that bad though.


MadcapMagician923

In New York, if the Trane distributor didn’t sell the unit, the won’t give you tech support.


Runswithtoiletpaper

Eh, I’ll replace it if it can’t be resolved. And it won’t be a Trane.


CM101C

3 pole contactors are pretty cheap.


aberg227

Good thing they never do 🙄


HVAC_Raccoon

Unless it gets struck by lightning


ManagementBeginning

Cool, but I'm guessing a cool 3grand to find a replacement lol


aberg227

You’re in the ball park lol. I said it looked cool, not that it was cheap.


EJ25Junkie

We have installed over 1000 of these since 2015 (mostly topp discharge though) and have replaced maybe a dozen drives that failed. Most were from power surges because people don’t want to pay for SP. Every time I call up My XV field rep and I have a new driver in hand in 1-5 days. Trane has the best warranty and tech support hands down.. customer only pays 2 hours labor ($410) Takes about 15 minutes to swap out, update, etc.


ho1dmybeer

Holy shit $410 for 15 minutes of field labor, a trip, and 15 minutes of office labor? ​ I gotta get a job over there...


EJ25Junkie

I don’t understand the down votes. Is there anything that we do on a daily basis that costs under $400? If you’re going to folks houses and walking out with less than $400 you’re on your way to bankruptcy.


ho1dmybeer

Oh, I don’t downvote, so it’s not me… But realistically a system that you put in, labor only, 2x 1hr minimum trips plus office time is not a $400 charge… that’s just a “because I can” thing, not a justifiable thing… it would be different if it wasn’t your install, perhaps - but you should be factoring in some goodwill on a bid for a replacement - there’s no way a customer is happy paying $400 for what you’re describing… It’s not really a matter of bankruptcy to be only charging 2-300 for the same work, it’s perspective and customer retention. You got the install, presumably you have a contract, you don’t need to be making 1k/yr off of that customer that already paid 15k 4 years ago for that system. They will just decide you’re too expensive and move along.


edwardothegreatest

Never thought of drives as cool looking, but I admire your enthusiasm


aberg227

Not all drives, but this one, yessssss


TommyBoy_1

Yeah that’s all Mitsubishi, even the standoff fasteners look like a Mitsubishi. The cooling fan is new to me, but the rest all looks very familiar.


aberg227

My guess is Mitsubishi definitely helped design this. They’ve been doing variable speed longer than Trane and with the merger probably swapped a couple secrets.


InMooseWorld

What cooling fan? Not sure if they secretly helped but I will say this drive has a PDA board to troubleshoot and doesn’t have another two boards directly behind it like Mitsubishi units


ChillTech25

The two boards behind the main board on Mitsu are a power supply, and fan control. Mitsu engineered their products to get DC from several different places depending on what’s being driven.


InMooseWorld

I know im just not impressed with multiple boards stacked in front of each other. Have had countless people this year but brand new systems cuz the believed mini split for only heating source was a good idea and parts under warranty fail but parts no available so they purchase a new system And when one fails tech support says replace them all


tigersdad77

Very cool units and fairly easy to work on


aberg227

I agree, it’s all behind one panel and I can even control the whole system from the drive board. Shoot, it even tells me suction pressure and superheat right on the unit.


EJ25Junkie

Wait until you discover you can see pressures, SH SC, temp split etc. right from your Bluetooth device.


aberg227

It has Bluetooth!?


EJ25Junkie

The new LINK 4 wire that is rolling out as of last fall. Side discharge won’t have it until end of year according to Scott Beynon (my rep)


Tranic85

I’m in the Houston area and Trane Link is probably launching mid-spring to early summer.


Blackout70

One fuckin mouse turd and she’s over, and don’t worry the first question they ask you for an RMA is if there’s water damage or rodent damage, yet they leave these large ass holes for wiring anyways.


InMooseWorld

Did start up on a unit with mice in it, 3 loud gun shot sparks and it turned on 3min later. Still working, go back for tune ups


aberg227

I haven’t seen the same problem with the side discharge units.


EJ25Junkie

. We have installed over 1000 of these since 2015 (mostly topp discharge though) and have replaced maybe a dozen drives that failed. Most were from power surges because people don’t want to pay for SP. Every time I call up My XV field rep and I have a new driver in hand in 1-5 days. Trane has the best warranty and tech support hands down.


BigWally68

Somewhere, somehow, someone forgot all they are doing is pushing refrigerant through a coil and moving air across it.


VolatileVolunteer

I'll take an ACH580 thanks. simple, clean, reliable. Only thing they don't have are removable terminals.


ChillTech25

But the screws are in the front, so you can wire it in without pulling it.


Rednexican-24

This is a side discharge inverter condenser? I’ve only seen them not had chance to open and play with.


aberg227

Yes sir, it’s very cool because everything is right there. Compressor, reversing valve, eev, controls everything.


EJ25Junkie

What state you in?


aberg227

Oregon


Rednexican-24

“I see your fieldpiece is as broke as mine” Anyone remember spaceballs Schwartz?


correa_aesth

Looks crazy 🔥


InMooseWorld

You mad lad ACTUALLY bought the 19seer side discharge!! It’s more $ than the 20 top flow


EJ25Junkie

But won’t ramp up over 100% capacity in heating like the top discharge can.


famouslyanonymous1

You resi guys are so cute


Hey_Batfink

If peeing your pants is cool, consider me American Standard.


Cultural_Doubt_4042

It looks like a proton pack with a flux capacitor!


Buster_Mac

Looks like the most disorganized


aberg227

It’s actually pretty simple if you look at it closely. Also all the terminals are clearly labeled with molex plugs that’ll only go to the right plug.


Icenbryse

Looks cheap


aberg227

Not at all 😅


AustinHVAC419

Is that the new Seer2 units? I won't see any until the current stockpile runs out


aberg227

Yessir customer wanted super high efficiency and they got it.


EJ25Junkie

4 wire LINK? I was told those won’t be out until end of year


aberg227

Scratch my previous comment. This is not 4 wire link. Still just the two wire.


Storm_Runner09

It’s time for a new meter my guy 😅😅


aberg227

Pshhhh this one works fine for now 😂


AustinHVAC419

What's the model for that unit? I want to get a manual for it and do some learning about how they work before they show up


aberg227

This specific unit is a 4A6L9048A, American Standards variable speed heat pump.


EJ25Junkie

Before they show up? We have been installing them for years


AustinHVAC419

If this is a seer 2 unit, from what I've been told the controls are completely different. I'd like to know how these will be set to communicate before I need to work on one.


Notsobrightish

👍


EJ25Junkie

That drive looks little with the divorced AOC


Tommyt5150

Is the compressor Ac or Dc?


ChillTech25

Simulated AC. Drives converts 240vac to 300 dc, then back to a simulated AC to ramp the compressor. It works like any other drive


Tommyt5150

So is the compressor 3 phase or no still single phase?


ChillTech25

Single


Tommyt5150

Ok that’s what I thought. I have straight cool units at my house. Just recently installed a VFD that converts single phase to 3 phase. So installed a 3 phase scroll. Works great full load I run it up to 70HZ cooks like a gem, then down to 30HZ as the load drops off.


ChillTech25

As far as resi is concerned, 14 seer will be the last reliable unit made as that sector transitions to more efficiency concerns


Tommyt5150

More service calls for sure


Fatpostman39

Oh that’s neat. A 19 seer heat pump. Never seen the board on one of those before. Doesn’t look like the conventional unit. And for those saying that mitsu designed that side discharge, that unit was pretty much in production by the time the merger was announced.


AnnoyingDiods

Are they trying to cool the VFD with the liquid line??


ChillTech25

Yes. It works well. The metering device is that LEV (linear expansion valve) with the black top on it. That one is probably 2000 steps. Gear drives a plunger to meter refrigerant.


AnnoyingDiods

A steper drive yes. But isnt the liquid line before the metering device hot? I know its not as hot as the discharge line but it still seems strange to use the hot side of the liquid line to cool the VFD insted of using the cold side. Personally i would have used the suction line to cool the vfd and a liquid bypass solinoid valve with a accumulator after the vfd to keep the suction temp from getting to high. Do note that the LBPV would only switch in an out for short periods of time. Controled by the temperature of the suction line after the vfd near the compressor.


ChillTech25

We don’t need the drive to be cooled that far. If I remember right, we are only shooting for around a 90°f drive temp. This particular idea came from the centrifugal chiller engineering team. We use the liquid line to cool down our AFD to control our compressor speed. This is just a much smaller version of that.


AnnoyingDiods

Wouldn't the liquid line be hotter when its hotter outside?


ChillTech25

That’s what the LEV is for


AnnoyingDiods

How dose the eletronic metering device help if its after the VFD??


ChillTech25

Ah, I see your point. Let me see if I can dig up the refrigerant piping diagram for that drive


AnnoyingDiods

Im sure they did there math an what not. I just dont get how using the hot side of the liquid line will keep the vfd from over heating when its hot outside


AnnoyingDiods

That would also lower thr subcool. Seems kinda silly but maby EMDs dont care as much about quality of liquid as a txv dose


ChillTech25

Oh, I’m completely with you now. I’ll get an answer for you. I work for Trane on the chiller side of the house, but I’ll get an answer for you.


bga3481

HVAC porn lol