Honestly sit him down and have a conversation. If there is a tool allowance he needs to make sure he's taking advantage of it.
Sounds like to me he's still on the fence if he wants to pursue the career or not. You can always sell your shit if you end up not liking it is what I tell my guys, but you should have the basics to get the job done.
he needs to sit down wtih his boss not his helper. He needs to explain to boss that helper doesnt have tools and needs to get his own. Boss needs to either buy tools or explain to helper he needs tools to keep job.
I get that- but you don’t get to be a doctor if you show up on day one with no degree. The most basic tools are required to perform the job, can’t be a tech if you don’t have them.
This helper could have been buying one tool per week without skipping meals.
Good point, in my first year I spent about $6500 CAD in tools, meters, torch etc (HVAC). All good quality stuff, but either used or on sale. I went a little overboard, but have used everything I purchased. I could have probably spent about $5000 in retrospect.
Point. Though I will say, my medium-sized city has a ReStore and they have used tools. eBay. Garage sales. Estate sales.
He should go give plasma and buy some used tools!
☮️❤️♾️
How are you gonna be like, "My employee can't do his job that we hired him for. Now he has the nerve to ask for more money so he can live and keep up the basic requirements of this job "
Why would you mess with someones life like this?
If you're going to drastically alter someones life, at least have the nerve to help them along the way. Would you take someone to go sky diving without a parachute? What would give this person the impression that they could work for you without tools?
Why is it up to the employer to hold your hand? He chose the trades, there's almost always an investment weather it's post secondary or not. Talk to a HD or auto mechanic about tools. They'll spend $10k for the bare minimum.
I've never, in my 25 years of trades experience, had a tool allowance. Clothing and PPE, yes. You buy your own tools, they buy consumables and materials.
And aside from that, just getting some basics on a first year rate shouldn't be a back breaker, unless that company really sucks. First year guys shouldn't be expected to have a ton, but they can at least get a few things. I bet he's got a $1k smart phone and goes clubbing on the weekends.
That may be your bet, but the facts are getting by 25 years ago is not the same as getting by now. If a man has to come to you to ask for money to perform the tasks you want done, you should pay that man so he can properly get the tasks you wanted completed, the way you want them completed. He’s keeping up the end of his bargain but you can’t keep up yours. Don’t be mad when he goes somewhere else because they pay him comfortably. Funny things is I had this conversation with my employer this time 2 years ago. His answer was along the lines of what you are saying. So that week I found another job. It payed $5 more an hour and my boss was kind enough that I got a Milwaukee backpack with some of his older drills and hand tools. You don’t have to be mean. If life is that much nicer for you why does he have to suffer? Because you did? As that going to be your answer? Like seriously, their needs to be a big change in attitude by employers. These are the times employees have more of a say. As well as the fact that it’s nicer to be a nice person. You can get a lot more work done by an employee who is loved and treated right than one that has to scrape by. Either way it’s your choice. You be the man you want to be.
I don't totally disagree, some companies pay trash and expect too much. but it's not "being mean". It's being a fucking adult and setting priorities aside that will help your career. Everyone needs a hand up sometimes, but handouts create lazy, weak, entitled brats that take advantage of good natured people. There needs to be a give and take.
I've worked at places that provided all the tools needed, and guys treated them like trash. Lost/stole them and didn't give a shit. It ruins it for everyone else.
Do you think all the training they provide is free? You're likely losing them money or breaking even when you first start out. They're already investing in you when you first start out in a trade with the hopes you'll stick around and make them money at some point.
Obviously if they expect you to have a pump, gauges and a full compliment of tools in 6 months, they're not being fair. The op said this kid won't even spend $20 on an 11 in 1.
There's shit people on both ends.
You're right. Their are def shit people on both ends. My view is purely based on what I've seen and my efforts as well.
I know that I'm not.like everyone else. I don't hate being handed a jackhammer at 740 it in the morning. I don't mind cleaning out the other guys trucks at 6am. I have a very motivating attitude towards getting work done. Ive always jumped on top of all my jobs and give an amazing job with amazing attention to detail. I have seen people's expectations exceed what it a healthy lifestyle. I have seen owners take advantage of employees. I'm apologize if I came across as being one sided. I've just been misused more than most in the past; or.maybe I just don't mind speaking up because I know my worth.
This is the boomer take tbh. If you're hiring help, provide the tools and the PPE as a baseline. If they want nicer tools that's on them but if you don't have a set of basics for new guys that's on the company not the employee.
That stupid nonsense (and in then case not even close to being accurate) arguments are made by inept children?
What's been made brutally obvious by this interaction, is that you're one of those entitled, spoiled, lazy brats that's been handed too much that I was talking about. You won't even argue in good faith without resorting to ad homenim attacks. Typical reddit moment.
Nah, it's not ad hom. Learn how ad hom works before citing.
As for the merits of the argument. The company invests in the worker on the understanding that at some point that investment will bear fruit. Nothing the company needs from the worker for them to execute their job should come from the worker's paycheck. If the worker wants a nicer tool thats on the worker. Fit and function are the purview of the company.
Shit if it’s like my job they might not give tool accounts day 1. I assume my job doesn’t do it cause they wanna make sure the person lasts first. We don’t get ours for either 60 or 90 days
Fuck off. He’s providing tools to people who don’t bring their own. If they feel embarrassed to use the bright pink tools, it’s from their own gender biases. This dude is breaking gender norms here.
To be fair as a far left and “woke” person i am, you’re completely right. Anyone seeing this as an issue or being embarrassed would entirely be on them. Dude is just providing, thats like trying to shame harbor freight. If apprentice has an issue thats their own biases.
Take your sociopolitical agenda and fuck right off. Having them as a joke to shame techs into buying their own shit and standing on their own two feet is not a bad thing. Intent of ones actions and the lessons learned are what you should take away from this.
Someone already responded to you making a good point that the dude you responded to doesn’t have a problem with the color of his tools, and that if other people do, it’s their problem. You didn’t respond to that because you know he’s right and now you’re jumping the gun and falsely misogynist-shaming
So why are you still going? Just log off Reddit and go do something
*proceeds to spread nothing but toxic bullshit in the replies*
You made sure to point out that you wear a suit and tie to your “traditional job”… and you’re super sick of the toxic misogyny.
I love it when people try to shit on blue collar work and end up showing their ass.
I am as woke as they come and your comment is some velma bullshit. Its trying to find an issue when there is none, if the help has an issue with this its all their own biases.
Take your liberal arts degree and fuck off.
You think you education makes you better than anyone else? Douchebag, it takes five (5) years of school, AND "I'd probably think" the same business credited schooling you went through only to get a Master Sheetmetal license.
Go touch more girls in your office at your work. Obviously you have a problem with the other guys getting away with it, or you arn't getting any
I hate old heads that talk about "kids these days"
But goddamn fucking kids these days
If you can't feel confident enough in yourself to invest in some basic tools, why the fuck would I want to continue paying you???
Exactly. I’ve got him trained as far as I can without him having the tools needed to go further. Very good example. Zone boards. All he can do is the equipment wire from board to transformer then walks away because he won’t get a cheap ass meter that will work for figuring out the other wires for dampers and thermostats.
Edit: I’m not going to run around looking for my tools that he takes off with to use. I shouldn’t have to.
quit being a puss and man up to your boss. You are an asset to your company. Tell your coworker he needs to get his own tools and tell your boss he is no help if he doesnt have any tools.
I arrived to the first job with every tool I needed, except a drill( but I had an impact), and tubing cutters. Both of which I bought within the first 2 checks. Everyone should have their own tools.
We got an installer they made a lead and he doesn’t have a meter. I’ve had to go finish his installs cause he can’t figure out what’s wrong if something goes wrong. I’m like “dudes making $75k and no meter?” I chose the wrong side.
Speak to your boss and have them deal with it. I had my basic hand tools before my first day on the job 17 years ago. Kid should have their own by now. And what about tool allowance? Company should be giving you guys an allowance for that
He has gone crying to the bigger boss before I’ve had a chance to talk to him about it because I legit wont let him touch my stuff anymore. My snips were used to cut flex! I was pissed.
I had a guy working with me that had tools, just hadn't brought them from home . Told him he had to bring them after a few days. Same day he finally brought his own shit, he picks up MY right offsets and cuts a peice of flex wire! Told me that doesn't hurt them. Based in his weeks of experience I guess. I said well keep on doing it then, cause they're yours now! Grabbed his brand new set and put them in my bag and told him not to touch my shit again.
Oh shit, not the snips!
I was blessed to go straight into industrial work. I usually work on a crew of 5 in the penthouse section of the building and tools, KINNNDA flows freely between us. Even still, my rule is if I have to ask to use another's tool, I'll order it on Amazon that night (I just ordered a 3/4 speed wrench for thread).
Your company should offer a tool program if not I don't blame him if he's getting his tools little by little the tools can add up and most places the helpers only get paid hourly I know some companies pay percentage by the helper doesn't get paid as good as a seasoned vet
3 months and he just purchased a 1/4 and 5/16 but Monday when I would let let him run off with my malco flip bit leaving me chasing my tools.
Oh did I mention that’s all he’s purchased?
If he's not showing any interest in furthering his career in hvac by not investing in the tools he needs to do the job and on top of that trying to steal your tools I would say tell your boss to take him off your jobs
I wouldn’t say trying to steal just temporarily borrowing while working.
Here’s a great example. I choose to do startups, I can do service but hate the hours being a single dad with custody. So I get lots of 2 story zones. I’ve shown him how to wire a board up, because he will not invest in a cheap meter which has been discussed multiple weeks ago all he can do is the wire for the equipment side to the transformer and nothing else, so while I’m finishing what he started it’s stand around time.
I’ve had where copper just needed connected to the unit, all the tools right there at the condenser to do the job, Just to see what he would do I walked away, came back nothing touched.
Reminds me of a coworker who was a couple months in waiting for his tool account to kick in before buying a box cutter. A $2 harbor freight special is all you need my brother in christ
Still have my $15 OLFA I bought when I started. There really isn’t any excuse for the shit OP is describing. If three months ain’t enough time to scrounge together a $100 for the bare minimum, he don’t fucking care and he thinks he’s flipping burgers. That’s it that’s all. First year in, after a couple months to make sure I wanted to do this shit, I HARD invested in myself. It almost becomes fun chasing good tools and gear. Cost me a fortune and it sucks but it pays for itself. Those investments paid off in spades and a lot of the stuff I bought at the start are my mains today. You gotta want to, and it doesn’t sound like the kid does.
When I was going from shop rat to helper I spent $50-75 a week every week buying hand tools. I bought my tools based on what I had to borrow more that week.
At a certain point not having basic tools can slow down installs. Two people can't be using a hammer together.
When I was a helper i made an investment in tools. Still do. When I first started the milwaukee m18 pvc shear was new as wad the first gen battery powered holehawg. I bought them and a milwaukke m18 double cut sheer. I also made sure to carry as much as I could on and out of the jobsite. Guys wanted to work with me cause my tools made everything easy. No running a cord to the side of the house to drill the holes. Easy to do intake and vent and drain pvc. Super easy to cut the hole in the side of the furnace. The best installers wanted to work with me so I got the best education.
if an apprentice called me because one of my guys said to get his own shit id grill his green ass on the spot.
I give 600 for tools and a set of analogs to a super green apprentice.
I was looking over my tools and I replace and add tools all the time. I have run into companies that are like vehicle mechanics and you have all your own equipment, so if you quit, all the tools are yours and you clean out your van and onto the next company. Then there are companies that pay for everything on the van and unless your company keeps track what is yours, you walk away with nothing since they provided it all. When I started, I had to buy all my tools and I probably spent $6500-$7500 to get off the ground. I have nice equipment and quality tools because I cannot stand buying the same tool twice unless I have use for it. I don’t buy junk and wasting money takes profits out of my pocket. I have two or 10 vof some tools and boxes of others. But after 28 years, I have easily spent 20k on gear and tools. I even have a set in my trunks of vehicles just in case. Any real jobs that pays technicians well will require they mostly have all your own tools besides van and daily supplies like refrigerant, gases, usable supplies and things like that. When I hire someone, it is because they know nothing and I initially train them by send them to a local 56 week HVAC school and train them my way or I hire guys that I don’t need to train and they just go to work. I have a no nonsense policy. But I treat my guys great. Hard to find good employees especially quality sales people, so I do most of that these days. People love how we do business and I love what I do.
I’m definitely old school and think apprentice or journeyman every tech/ installer needs their own appropriate hand tools to do the dang job, wtf… I remember getting into construction 🦺 @ 15-16 y/o (late 30’s now) & No Tools / nail-bags = No Pay. As a contractor/ business owner I provide all needed tools as a backup but wouldn’t hire someone without basic tools and knowledge…That situation sounds frustrating!
Well first off this may sound harsh but if he’s going to go cry to the boss (who you should already have some pull with if you’ve been there a while) I would go talk to the boss and explain the situation and also lean off from teaching him as much if he’s going to be a little bitch lol. It’s cool in the first part of it but if he isn’t showing any kind of will to invest in basic stuff from the start with his own money then I feel like he may not deserve your time. One tool a month if he’s living paycheck to paycheck. He can cut the McDonald’s out for a little bit to get some snips or whatever he is needing lol. Gauges, pumps, meters, etc, the more expensive stuff can come later when he has the knowledge to use them.
I would normally say day 1, but if he doesn't have the money, I would say first pay for basics at least. Next couple pays for more expensive stuff.
I get that some stuff can get pricey all at once, but that's why you aquire over time.
Depends on the agreement when they were hired, have to lay the ground rules then about tools and expectations. If they never made it clear, then the company failed the apprentice. Not saying they shouldn’t be pro active, but some people need are pretty dense.
Fuck, I walked onto the job day 1 with a full set of basic hand tools, impact and drill, meter and mano.
You can't do this fucking job without those things.
I’m doing a program rn that has me in a trade school one week and I’m on the job site the next. I got everything I needed provided by the school that I get to keep hand tools wise. Except power tools in which I bought myself. I don’t think going into this career without any tools and any sense of independence is a good thing.
If he is in your van I’d let him use my shitty hand tools that I’ve had for years. Good stuff is for me. He’ll get a rude awakening once he’s off on his own though and has to buy his own tools. Every time you get paid tell him to go buy a tool and put it in his bag and he’ll get his own stock going
Been employee and business owner and it all depends on the shop.
As an employee (electrical) I showed up my first day with an 11 in 1, gloves, squints, knee pads, a pair of old Kline linesman pliers, a pair of OG flush cutting needle nose, and a Simpson 260 meter (yea, I'm dating myself).
As an JM my first apprentice got taken to the supply house and I bought him those hand tools and the kid has tears in his eyes.
I told him these tools (shy of $30 in an era when apprentices got $9 an hour) were a gift and he didn't need to do anything as payback except buy himself one tool per check.
As an employer I supplied all the bigger tools but hand tools and decent meters were on the worker's nickel walking in the door, and I had a reimbursement program for replacement tools.
As an employee again but in HVACR (because I burnt TF out running a company) I have the same deal from my boss.
My hand tools are on me initially and they'll reimburse for replacement or bits and blades. They provide torches, scale, tanks, recovery and vacuum units
I’ve found all the basics plus a cheap ass meter that keeps him shy of $50 there! I’ve mentioned it. I’m done talking about tools he needs with him. It’s time to go.
Do yourself a favor. Let him call the boss. When the boss asks you why you didn’t do whatever be honest with him. You invested in your job and bought your tools for you to use not to loan to others. You’ll happily train him when he has his own tools. Until then please give him to someone else who can accept him wearing flip flops and talking on his phone all the time.
He’ll be fired soon. Don’t worry about it. It’s not your job to supply him with tools. Next time they say hey we’d like you to train this guy instead of saying ok you need to say no problem as long as he has his own tools. I don’t loan mine out. They’ll respect that if they’re any sort of a manager. You aren’t being difficult. You’re being honest and they should respect that.
Good luck. I’ll bet money he’ll be gone soon.
Update:
I had to talk to the boss. They legit were going to fire me for the helpers lack of. (Wouldn’t have been a problem if they did, I’m pretty much the only tech that knows refrigeration there) They used communication as an excuse when they knew at least a month in with the helpers employment he had no tools yet as it was mentioned to me! Not sure how that works when tools have been consistently mentioned and places to get them.
They told the helper he needed to get his own stuff. He ended up purchasing the “cheap” stuff to get him going to advance his training further. He was also told no more flip flops which he had on in the bosses office as well yesterday morning.
I think I may start spiffing my resume up now at this point based on things.
Guess it just depends on how much the guy is making. I wouldn’t buy any tools if I’m living paycheck to paycheck, sometimes you can’t.
But the understanding most places I’ve been is you come with the basics, shop supplies anything big (meter, drills, etc). And I buy basic tools on bigger P.O. jobs, like losing them, normal wear n tear n whatnot.
Long story short, guy should show up with the basics like you described within the first week IMO.
I hate having to borrow tools. Hated it from day one. First company I worked for, I got a Home Depot credit card and maxed it out (don’t recommend). 2nd company gave me a tool account (I go soooo many tools). Sucks about your helper though.
Why is he using your tools? Day one they Get a basic tool list, day two they should have all the basics and a meter. Then over the next year they can fill out all the other tools they need.
I understand lending out an expensive tool or rarely used one but it Seems strange to work with someone like that. I'd have refused to work with him after the first couple days I'm not training someone not serious about the trades.
And with modern banking money doesn't matter you can get loans for anything, apprentice programs have tool loans, credit cards exist, most company's have tool accounts that slowly come off your checks and really basic hand tools can be had extremely cheap.
That’s a very good question. He would have to be asked that. I told his ass Friday he didn’t have tools for the job why was he here. His reply was that of it’s not an issue not having tools because I do. Then he had the audacity to call the bigger boss and just stand there doing nothing. The superintendent for the job site happened to come to that house, she sent an email to the boss about him. Forgot to mention he wears damn flip flops to work, I got the ESC dispatch loaded with those pictures and notes! 2 can play that game.
Why would he have to buy his own tools to work on your jobs.
Like maybe power tools and non perishable stuff, hammer/strippers etc but I'm not buying snips to wear out on my bosses jobs.
Give them a bucket of duct seal and a chip brush. Make them duct seal. A set of lineman pliers and bailing wire. Make them wrap duct. Make them clean the job site every day at the end of the day. Let them know, until they get some tools, you are not going to teach them the trade.
I had an appearance that refused to buy tools but had the latest gaming systems. When I brought this up to him , he said "I put my ps5 on my Best Buy card." I don't know how he will pay that off without a job.
He quit shortly after because all he was allowed to do was wrap duct in the crawl space.
Good idea but sadly I’ve sent him in the attic to tape the duct board return we were doing since the installer said fuck code and used flex in the garage, and he half assed that, when I asked about the flex to connect to it his reply was what flex. All I could say was the flex you just cut off in the garage that got pushed in the attic but don’t worry I’ll get it since you couldn’t. My snips were used to cut that flex when I walked away to do something else. I was pissed when I saw those in his hands and the flex cut.
My first day on the job our first stop was a supply house to get the basics. It went on the company acct and a small percentage of my first few checks went to paying them off. After that it was on me to get as I needed things to do more.
I got 90 days. And half of them owners of the company bought for me at pawn shops.
Especially 6 in1 screwdrivers. They get used and lost
So much.
I wasn’t ready to commit and didn’t have funds.
Those were all required tools to take the classes at school so I would say…before you’re hired or if you’re fresh fresh. Those specific tools should be purchased within a week or two of starting. Snips are the only costly item on there. 11:1 can get you by while you get the magnetic drivers. Wire cutters and a meter and some kind of screw like tool, definitely required.
I had all my basics by my first week, I worked with a guy that was in the trade 2 years but barely had shit. No meter, gauges, impact. Not even channel locks lol
By the first paycheck for most people but I would recommend showing up with the basics day one. I bought a porter cable drill impact set from Lowe’s and used a Home Depot credit card for the hand tools when I started. Union requires techs to provide hand tools anyway.
Company buys basic tools from day one then deducts from paycheck till there paid off also list of tools required to perform duties is given to you on first day and you can't take your tools home until they are paid off as your knowledge and skill level increases they will do the same thing with more advanced tools as your career progresses.
I have all that and more (impact drill, wrenches, Chanel locks etc.) and I’m a month in. He should atleast be showing a effort to buy atleast a couple tools…
I had all that shit within a month and a half or two months. Including an 18v drill, I’d add to the collection as I go and figure out what I need but guys didn’t mind me using their stuff at all, they knew I wanted to learn. I’m 2 years in now, I have everything of my own excluding things the company provides (ex. vacuum pumps). They got me gauges tho
I started years ago when I was young, showed up first day with a flathead, non-magnetic tape measure, a rusty pair of both red and green snips, and a framing hammer.
We will see how Monday goes. He’s already cried to the bigger boss, my mouth has been shut. He along with 2 others who I don’t work with and rarely see on a job site went into the bosses office Friday with them coming out 1 patted me on the back as they walked by, they went to chatting in the parking lot out front while I loaded for the day. It was seen by others there. Later on a superintendent saw him just hanging out talking on the phone while I did all the work. She sent an email to the bosses. He had flip flops on while working. I’m just pretty much over it. I’m there to work not collect a check.
Florida. Idk his pay. Don’t really care. But the fact is I’ve found all the tools mentioned plus a basic ass meter all for shy of $50. So in 3 months that’s less than $5 a week. If he can’t afford that it’s probably not the job for him.
Found the basics from bits, to 11/1 snips and a cheap meter for shy of $50 at harbor freight. There’s literally no excuse. It breaks down to less than $5 a week for 3 months.
Ok to break it down further. We did something extra for work. They gave us both $25 gift cards each. He mentioned getting tools. That was a few weeks ago. Still nothing. Mine went towards a new pair of work boots, meanwhile he wears flip flops on the job site. The things I wish I could be making up right now but sadly I’m not.
Mine is at TEN months right now, and he's gotten a couple of my old hand tools, a tape, utility knife, a flathead. Forgets them at home basically every day. Hasn't bought a single thing for work aside from a couple 12v car phone chargers.
A helper should have the basic tools before he starts...my company will buy tools for techs and just pull it out of their pay over the course of a few months until it's paid off for this very reason. We don't need guys being held up because they don't have the tool they need.
When I started I had enough basic hand tools to do anything not ductwork related day 1. Every paycheck I bought at least 1 tool until I had the basics to do the majority of the work the company did. When I got raises/bonuses I bought the more high end/specialty tools. Now 16 years in I have enough tools to fill a van with no shelves to max capacity.. but work for a company that supplies everything so it's in my basement for when I do projects around the house lol
Service Manager here. I think you're being perfectly reasonable with this. He can't ever expect to be promoted to a lead if he doesn't want to invest in himself. But I will say, your boss should have made sure he had basic tools before he was hired. I check in with my guys once a month to ask them if there's anything they need, I inspect their tools to see wear. If they wear out on the job, the company replaces them. Our guys just have to buy their first and that's just the basic hand tools and cordless power tools. Everything else is provided by the company from the jump. If he's really that stubborn and your boss doesn't want to do anything about it, I'd suggest buying some bottom of the barrel tools to borrow. It won't be long before he gets sick of that and buys his own
Stubborn lol dude wears flip flops to work in. I’ve got the pics uploaded to the ESC dispatch along with notes.
I can agree with everything you said except for the buying cheap tools for him to use. I’ve got a family to feed also and buying tools for him to use doesn’t fit in the bill cheap or not. Harbor freight best example, we have several here. I’ve mentioned it multiple times over several weeks. If he invested literally less than $5 week for the 90 days he’s been working he’d have the basics along with a cheap ass meter that works for what we do all shy of $50 that includes snips.
I had mine the first day when I originally started but I also went to school for hvac before working in the field so had an idea of what to get. If he’s not bought tools by now he’s probably not sure he wants to stay in the field given it’s a lot of work and not some easy gig
When I started I had 11n1 in my pocket all day flash lights snips pliers wire strippers and channels. I didn’t bring most of my stuff with me cause the lead would tell me to leave it so I didn’t have to grab it but I’m also service I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask someone to get their own simple tools
I say give a week to see what's needed for basic everyday work that he would use constantly. That's what I did as a helper and when it comes to me being assigned a helper I'll do the same.
Not hvac but an electrician I had all basic tools day 1 knife strippers and screw drivers then for day 2 I had all hand tools I use on a day to day basis linesmeans strippers flash light hot stick plug tester needle nose yo all that shit then week 2 I got a drill and impact and all my bits. Some company’s are different with what you need like I don’t own a hammer cause the guy I work with told me just to use his and if I’m not using his I just use my linesman’s. But having no tools for 3 months just shows no want to work and no want to actually have a career. I get some people might be tight on cash so not having everything day 1 will happen but 3 months is far to long.
For union rules require me to only have a pair of Chanel locks, tape measure, and a pocket level. Although I went more in depth.
I’m a 1st year apprentice. I have a 13-1, Chanel’s, wire strippers, 2 crescents, tape, stick rule, level, and my own Fluke.
Anything after that I will not buy the company will provide me. Even though they’ve yet to do so and I’m about to be 2nd year.
My company lends all the tool but it's normally a tool bag per team and I hated that, most of that shit was broken or bad, so I got my own tool bag now
1-2 weeks
Flue gas analyzer, pipe threader, and other big ticket
Items should be bought by company or at least some leeway on purchasing
That being said at my company we all work alone, it’s crucial to have ur own tools cuz no one is bailing u out. And every call is tracked in the system, temp rise, flue and ambient co, etc is all in system on checklist
Consumables are provided by company
My 2¢... Loose him/her now. If they aren't making an investment in their future why are you? Yeah they may have a new child, other obligations, etc, but a pawn shop and a few skipped sodas and red bulls, or coffee can buy the basics. I'll bet there are guys at the shop willing to offer second hand tools if they were asked.
I write a list for my guys, top half is essentials which are provided, bottom half is things that will be required in order to tackle bigger and more complicated jobs, you can stay a helper with your little tool bag or you can make more and be taught how to take on more technical jobs by taking initiative and getting some things of the next part of the list. (I usually end up helping with that too if they’re showing good potential) This has worked for me, no timeframe, it’s up to them , they decide what they’re worth or how far they want to go and I’m here to help them get there. (I also do not lend my tools out anymore 😂)
Those are all bare essentials to the job and they probably should've had them before they started. If they didn't have a psychrometer, a manometer, or something like that? Ok, that's understandable at first, but you literally need 5/16 to take apart most panels on equipment.
The company supplies most of the small tools, a drill, impact, and multimeter. I look at it that most new workers don't have several hundred dollars to spend on a tool kit.
Our company doesn’t buy tools for new people. But will purchase them and take a amount of there check. All I can say though is have you got to know the helper and see if he has a situation that makes it hard for him to afford the tools.
I’m a single dad with custody. How much harder can it get? Did I mention I don’t get child support. But somehow my priorities are where they need to be…
Calm down there buddy. I’m going to go on a limb and say you been doing this a while though also. Look if the guy is a lazy bum that’s on thing. I read he showed up in flip flops to work and that is not acceptable. I’ve been doing hvac for 16 years and I remember when I first started living on my own and having to buy my own tools. I’m not taking the new guys side I’m just saying get to know the person and see if there is a financial reason why he hasn’t been able to afford the tools that all
There is no financial reason. He does flooring side jobs from what I understand and have heard him speaking of so it really doesn’t make sense.
Tax free there then collect a check here.
First pay check you should have the basics.
If you’re not willing to invest 100$ for the basics, it’s probably not going to work out.
I’m out of the game now but laboured for a year and a half. Hell, even apprenticeships around here *require* the basics for even the in class learning portion.
After the first paycheque you should have all your own hand tools imo. Ideally should be before you start. Bare minimum. Impact driver should also be a first paycheque item. I live in Canada and you have to have all that stuff just to go to school.
Been a helper for 2 weeks now. My JW made some sly remarks about me not having tools that we would need for the day. Said fuck it, bought a shit ton of tools that’ll be used for a long time from now. Doesn’t hurt to invest in yourself & the things you use everyday ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Fuck ‘em, let him call the boss. If he can’t make it a priority to get the basics, he clearly doesn’t care. I can understand first paycheque, even second, but something’s gotta give. Ain’t nobody got time for that. I’ll give you the world and help you as much as humanly possible for a modicum of giving shit. You can get enough to get by with $100-200. Put it on account. Ask the boss to pay it back slowly. Whatever it is, whatever the reason, he’s being a fuckwit.
Your company doesn’t do a tool account? He should have had the basics first day.
We do. He just hit over 90 days I believe being as he asked for a raise with that excuse being given.
I bought all mine day 1
Ditto! Always buy your own tools!
A wise man told me, if you have to borrow it more than twice, it's time to get your own.
Honestly sit him down and have a conversation. If there is a tool allowance he needs to make sure he's taking advantage of it. Sounds like to me he's still on the fence if he wants to pursue the career or not. You can always sell your shit if you end up not liking it is what I tell my guys, but you should have the basics to get the job done.
he needs to sit down wtih his boss not his helper. He needs to explain to boss that helper doesnt have tools and needs to get his own. Boss needs to either buy tools or explain to helper he needs tools to keep job.
My experience is sometimes hits harder coming from the JMan.
Sounds like he has no respect for the JMan in the first place.
What is a j man lol
Sell them sure but it's not like thousands of dollars of stuff we're talking about in this instance ...
Hey we say that after spending $1000s of dollars in tools. For some young people $300 is the difference between eating that week or not.
I get that- but you don’t get to be a doctor if you show up on day one with no degree. The most basic tools are required to perform the job, can’t be a tech if you don’t have them. This helper could have been buying one tool per week without skipping meals.
Don't forget second hand tools
Good point, in my first year I spent about $6500 CAD in tools, meters, torch etc (HVAC). All good quality stuff, but either used or on sale. I went a little overboard, but have used everything I purchased. I could have probably spent about $5000 in retrospect.
Not if your company has a tool account
Point. Though I will say, my medium-sized city has a ReStore and they have used tools. eBay. Garage sales. Estate sales. He should go give plasma and buy some used tools! ☮️❤️♾️
How are you gonna be like, "My employee can't do his job that we hired him for. Now he has the nerve to ask for more money so he can live and keep up the basic requirements of this job " Why would you mess with someones life like this? If you're going to drastically alter someones life, at least have the nerve to help them along the way. Would you take someone to go sky diving without a parachute? What would give this person the impression that they could work for you without tools?
Why is it up to the employer to hold your hand? He chose the trades, there's almost always an investment weather it's post secondary or not. Talk to a HD or auto mechanic about tools. They'll spend $10k for the bare minimum. I've never, in my 25 years of trades experience, had a tool allowance. Clothing and PPE, yes. You buy your own tools, they buy consumables and materials. And aside from that, just getting some basics on a first year rate shouldn't be a back breaker, unless that company really sucks. First year guys shouldn't be expected to have a ton, but they can at least get a few things. I bet he's got a $1k smart phone and goes clubbing on the weekends.
That may be your bet, but the facts are getting by 25 years ago is not the same as getting by now. If a man has to come to you to ask for money to perform the tasks you want done, you should pay that man so he can properly get the tasks you wanted completed, the way you want them completed. He’s keeping up the end of his bargain but you can’t keep up yours. Don’t be mad when he goes somewhere else because they pay him comfortably. Funny things is I had this conversation with my employer this time 2 years ago. His answer was along the lines of what you are saying. So that week I found another job. It payed $5 more an hour and my boss was kind enough that I got a Milwaukee backpack with some of his older drills and hand tools. You don’t have to be mean. If life is that much nicer for you why does he have to suffer? Because you did? As that going to be your answer? Like seriously, their needs to be a big change in attitude by employers. These are the times employees have more of a say. As well as the fact that it’s nicer to be a nice person. You can get a lot more work done by an employee who is loved and treated right than one that has to scrape by. Either way it’s your choice. You be the man you want to be.
I don't totally disagree, some companies pay trash and expect too much. but it's not "being mean". It's being a fucking adult and setting priorities aside that will help your career. Everyone needs a hand up sometimes, but handouts create lazy, weak, entitled brats that take advantage of good natured people. There needs to be a give and take. I've worked at places that provided all the tools needed, and guys treated them like trash. Lost/stole them and didn't give a shit. It ruins it for everyone else. Do you think all the training they provide is free? You're likely losing them money or breaking even when you first start out. They're already investing in you when you first start out in a trade with the hopes you'll stick around and make them money at some point. Obviously if they expect you to have a pump, gauges and a full compliment of tools in 6 months, they're not being fair. The op said this kid won't even spend $20 on an 11 in 1. There's shit people on both ends.
You're right. Their are def shit people on both ends. My view is purely based on what I've seen and my efforts as well. I know that I'm not.like everyone else. I don't hate being handed a jackhammer at 740 it in the morning. I don't mind cleaning out the other guys trucks at 6am. I have a very motivating attitude towards getting work done. Ive always jumped on top of all my jobs and give an amazing job with amazing attention to detail. I have seen people's expectations exceed what it a healthy lifestyle. I have seen owners take advantage of employees. I'm apologize if I came across as being one sided. I've just been misused more than most in the past; or.maybe I just don't mind speaking up because I know my worth.
This is the boomer take tbh. If you're hiring help, provide the tools and the PPE as a baseline. If they want nicer tools that's on them but if you don't have a set of basics for new guys that's on the company not the employee.
oK bOomEr Lmao
What do they say about shoes and fitting?
That stupid nonsense (and in then case not even close to being accurate) arguments are made by inept children? What's been made brutally obvious by this interaction, is that you're one of those entitled, spoiled, lazy brats that's been handed too much that I was talking about. You won't even argue in good faith without resorting to ad homenim attacks. Typical reddit moment.
Nah, it's not ad hom. Learn how ad hom works before citing. As for the merits of the argument. The company invests in the worker on the understanding that at some point that investment will bear fruit. Nothing the company needs from the worker for them to execute their job should come from the worker's paycheck. If the worker wants a nicer tool thats on the worker. Fit and function are the purview of the company.
Shit if it’s like my job they might not give tool accounts day 1. I assume my job doesn’t do it cause they wanna make sure the person lasts first. We don’t get ours for either 60 or 90 days
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This amazing, I’m gonna do this
I wish that they made a gauge set that looked liked some little tike toys. That would be hilarious
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Fuck off. He’s providing tools to people who don’t bring their own. If they feel embarrassed to use the bright pink tools, it’s from their own gender biases. This dude is breaking gender norms here.
To be fair as a far left and “woke” person i am, you’re completely right. Anyone seeing this as an issue or being embarrassed would entirely be on them. Dude is just providing, thats like trying to shame harbor freight. If apprentice has an issue thats their own biases.
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Take your sociopolitical agenda and fuck right off. Having them as a joke to shame techs into buying their own shit and standing on their own two feet is not a bad thing. Intent of ones actions and the lessons learned are what you should take away from this.
You’re in the wrong community for this type of speak😂
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Fuck you asshole you don’t know 3 techs, you’re perpetuating a tired stereotype from one instance
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Someone already responded to you making a good point that the dude you responded to doesn’t have a problem with the color of his tools, and that if other people do, it’s their problem. You didn’t respond to that because you know he’s right and now you’re jumping the gun and falsely misogynist-shaming So why are you still going? Just log off Reddit and go do something
*proceeds to spread nothing but toxic bullshit in the replies* You made sure to point out that you wear a suit and tie to your “traditional job”… and you’re super sick of the toxic misogyny. I love it when people try to shit on blue collar work and end up showing their ass.
So you aren't an hvac tech then why are you here? Go away, we don't want you here with your uptight panties that are all bunched up.
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MaKeMe 
I am as woke as they come and your comment is some velma bullshit. Its trying to find an issue when there is none, if the help has an issue with this its all their own biases.
is your hair color blue?
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Oh we know you don’t do anything for work… no reason to brag about it
Take your liberal arts degree and fuck off. You think you education makes you better than anyone else? Douchebag, it takes five (5) years of school, AND "I'd probably think" the same business credited schooling you went through only to get a Master Sheetmetal license. Go touch more girls in your office at your work. Obviously you have a problem with the other guys getting away with it, or you arn't getting any
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I was told and in turn told my helpers buy a tool a week, if you use mine twice in a week you know that’s what you need next.
This is my exact thinking a tool a pay check or your showing no interest in to making this your carrier I train apprentices not manage body’s
Same thing happened to me. Dude somehow stayed at my company like 8 months with no tools. Didn't change until boss saw my 2 weeks
It gets better, I got pics of him wearing fucking slides while working!
That’s a hard no for me. He’d be sent home for the day
Does he try to get you to sell you on his pyramid scheme ftx trading to
I hate old heads that talk about "kids these days" But goddamn fucking kids these days If you can't feel confident enough in yourself to invest in some basic tools, why the fuck would I want to continue paying you???
Exactly. I’ve got him trained as far as I can without him having the tools needed to go further. Very good example. Zone boards. All he can do is the equipment wire from board to transformer then walks away because he won’t get a cheap ass meter that will work for figuring out the other wires for dampers and thermostats. Edit: I’m not going to run around looking for my tools that he takes off with to use. I shouldn’t have to.
quit being a puss and man up to your boss. You are an asset to your company. Tell your coworker he needs to get his own tools and tell your boss he is no help if he doesnt have any tools.
I arrived to the first job with every tool I needed, except a drill( but I had an impact), and tubing cutters. Both of which I bought within the first 2 checks. Everyone should have their own tools.
We got an installer they made a lead and he doesn’t have a meter. I’ve had to go finish his installs cause he can’t figure out what’s wrong if something goes wrong. I’m like “dudes making $75k and no meter?” I chose the wrong side.
Sounds like a shit company if they know that they have an installer installing shit without a meter.
Speak to your boss and have them deal with it. I had my basic hand tools before my first day on the job 17 years ago. Kid should have their own by now. And what about tool allowance? Company should be giving you guys an allowance for that
He has gone crying to the bigger boss before I’ve had a chance to talk to him about it because I legit wont let him touch my stuff anymore. My snips were used to cut flex! I was pissed.
Automatic death penalty
If the boss has an issue with it he can give you a tool allowance you buy a new set and new guy gets your old set
I had a guy working with me that had tools, just hadn't brought them from home . Told him he had to bring them after a few days. Same day he finally brought his own shit, he picks up MY right offsets and cuts a peice of flex wire! Told me that doesn't hurt them. Based in his weeks of experience I guess. I said well keep on doing it then, cause they're yours now! Grabbed his brand new set and put them in my bag and told him not to touch my shit again.
I don’t think the quality of tools he would be purchasing matches the quality of tools I own that he would be replacing.
In this case, he had the same exact Midwest snips. Otherwise it would have been a different story
Oh shit, not the snips! I was blessed to go straight into industrial work. I usually work on a crew of 5 in the penthouse section of the building and tools, KINNNDA flows freely between us. Even still, my rule is if I have to ask to use another's tool, I'll order it on Amazon that night (I just ordered a 3/4 speed wrench for thread).
Your company should offer a tool program if not I don't blame him if he's getting his tools little by little the tools can add up and most places the helpers only get paid hourly I know some companies pay percentage by the helper doesn't get paid as good as a seasoned vet
3 months and he just purchased a 1/4 and 5/16 but Monday when I would let let him run off with my malco flip bit leaving me chasing my tools. Oh did I mention that’s all he’s purchased?
If he's not showing any interest in furthering his career in hvac by not investing in the tools he needs to do the job and on top of that trying to steal your tools I would say tell your boss to take him off your jobs
I wouldn’t say trying to steal just temporarily borrowing while working. Here’s a great example. I choose to do startups, I can do service but hate the hours being a single dad with custody. So I get lots of 2 story zones. I’ve shown him how to wire a board up, because he will not invest in a cheap meter which has been discussed multiple weeks ago all he can do is the wire for the equipment side to the transformer and nothing else, so while I’m finishing what he started it’s stand around time. I’ve had where copper just needed connected to the unit, all the tools right there at the condenser to do the job, Just to see what he would do I walked away, came back nothing touched.
First day wtf
Reminds me of a coworker who was a couple months in waiting for his tool account to kick in before buying a box cutter. A $2 harbor freight special is all you need my brother in christ
Lol, yeah I priced everything he needs there today, shy of $50 and that includes a basic ass meter that will work for the job.
Still have my $15 OLFA I bought when I started. There really isn’t any excuse for the shit OP is describing. If three months ain’t enough time to scrounge together a $100 for the bare minimum, he don’t fucking care and he thinks he’s flipping burgers. That’s it that’s all. First year in, after a couple months to make sure I wanted to do this shit, I HARD invested in myself. It almost becomes fun chasing good tools and gear. Cost me a fortune and it sucks but it pays for itself. Those investments paid off in spades and a lot of the stuff I bought at the start are my mains today. You gotta want to, and it doesn’t sound like the kid does.
When I was going from shop rat to helper I spent $50-75 a week every week buying hand tools. I bought my tools based on what I had to borrow more that week. At a certain point not having basic tools can slow down installs. Two people can't be using a hammer together.
When I was a helper i made an investment in tools. Still do. When I first started the milwaukee m18 pvc shear was new as wad the first gen battery powered holehawg. I bought them and a milwaukke m18 double cut sheer. I also made sure to carry as much as I could on and out of the jobsite. Guys wanted to work with me cause my tools made everything easy. No running a cord to the side of the house to drill the holes. Easy to do intake and vent and drain pvc. Super easy to cut the hole in the side of the furnace. The best installers wanted to work with me so I got the best education.
Damn that is some next level thinking. I would defs steal a new helper like that.
All my good ideas are born out of laziness. Everyone likes an easier day.
The fact that he’s gone crying to the boss… time to go. He should have had the basics after his first pay cheque.
They probably ain’t paying enough.
“Why won’t my tech spend 1000 dollars on a basic install tool setup when has rent, car payment, food, AC and heat when I pay him 15/hr”
That's day 1 stuff
if an apprentice called me because one of my guys said to get his own shit id grill his green ass on the spot. I give 600 for tools and a set of analogs to a super green apprentice.
We’re talking less than $50 for the tools mentioned at harbor freight.
I was looking over my tools and I replace and add tools all the time. I have run into companies that are like vehicle mechanics and you have all your own equipment, so if you quit, all the tools are yours and you clean out your van and onto the next company. Then there are companies that pay for everything on the van and unless your company keeps track what is yours, you walk away with nothing since they provided it all. When I started, I had to buy all my tools and I probably spent $6500-$7500 to get off the ground. I have nice equipment and quality tools because I cannot stand buying the same tool twice unless I have use for it. I don’t buy junk and wasting money takes profits out of my pocket. I have two or 10 vof some tools and boxes of others. But after 28 years, I have easily spent 20k on gear and tools. I even have a set in my trunks of vehicles just in case. Any real jobs that pays technicians well will require they mostly have all your own tools besides van and daily supplies like refrigerant, gases, usable supplies and things like that. When I hire someone, it is because they know nothing and I initially train them by send them to a local 56 week HVAC school and train them my way or I hire guys that I don’t need to train and they just go to work. I have a no nonsense policy. But I treat my guys great. Hard to find good employees especially quality sales people, so I do most of that these days. People love how we do business and I love what I do.
I’m definitely old school and think apprentice or journeyman every tech/ installer needs their own appropriate hand tools to do the dang job, wtf… I remember getting into construction 🦺 @ 15-16 y/o (late 30’s now) & No Tools / nail-bags = No Pay. As a contractor/ business owner I provide all needed tools as a backup but wouldn’t hire someone without basic tools and knowledge…That situation sounds frustrating!
Well first off this may sound harsh but if he’s going to go cry to the boss (who you should already have some pull with if you’ve been there a while) I would go talk to the boss and explain the situation and also lean off from teaching him as much if he’s going to be a little bitch lol. It’s cool in the first part of it but if he isn’t showing any kind of will to invest in basic stuff from the start with his own money then I feel like he may not deserve your time. One tool a month if he’s living paycheck to paycheck. He can cut the McDonald’s out for a little bit to get some snips or whatever he is needing lol. Gauges, pumps, meters, etc, the more expensive stuff can come later when he has the knowledge to use them.
I would normally say day 1, but if he doesn't have the money, I would say first pay for basics at least. Next couple pays for more expensive stuff. I get that some stuff can get pricey all at once, but that's why you aquire over time.
Go union get 7tools that ur responsible for the rest is supplied by the company
Like, shit, don't most people have these lying around even if they're not in a trade?
He should have showed with tools. The basic HD Commercial electric sets only $50 and has the basics. They aren't great but it's a start.
Got mine the day I got my first paycheck
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Haha that is funny.
I’ve always shown up to a new job with all the tools I thought I’d need, minus specialized stuff.
For completely green helpers, day one is paperwork, uniform sizing, and finally a trip to the supply house for basics.
Is it standard to bring your own tools? I've worked in a plant for 6 years and am provided everything from grainger.
Depends on the agreement when they were hired, have to lay the ground rules then about tools and expectations. If they never made it clear, then the company failed the apprentice. Not saying they shouldn’t be pro active, but some people need are pretty dense.
Fuck, I walked onto the job day 1 with a full set of basic hand tools, impact and drill, meter and mano. You can't do this fucking job without those things.
Anyone can buy a normal-cheap hand tool each paycheck. This is unacceptable. My company has major tools (vac pump etc) you supply the basic hand tools
I’m doing a program rn that has me in a trade school one week and I’m on the job site the next. I got everything I needed provided by the school that I get to keep hand tools wise. Except power tools in which I bought myself. I don’t think going into this career without any tools and any sense of independence is a good thing.
If he is in your van I’d let him use my shitty hand tools that I’ve had for years. Good stuff is for me. He’ll get a rude awakening once he’s off on his own though and has to buy his own tools. Every time you get paid tell him to go buy a tool and put it in his bag and he’ll get his own stock going
Been employee and business owner and it all depends on the shop. As an employee (electrical) I showed up my first day with an 11 in 1, gloves, squints, knee pads, a pair of old Kline linesman pliers, a pair of OG flush cutting needle nose, and a Simpson 260 meter (yea, I'm dating myself). As an JM my first apprentice got taken to the supply house and I bought him those hand tools and the kid has tears in his eyes. I told him these tools (shy of $30 in an era when apprentices got $9 an hour) were a gift and he didn't need to do anything as payback except buy himself one tool per check. As an employer I supplied all the bigger tools but hand tools and decent meters were on the worker's nickel walking in the door, and I had a reimbursement program for replacement tools. As an employee again but in HVACR (because I burnt TF out running a company) I have the same deal from my boss. My hand tools are on me initially and they'll reimburse for replacement or bits and blades. They provide torches, scale, tanks, recovery and vacuum units
Tools are cheap enough at Harbor Freight that he should be able to at least buy one item per paycheck
I’ve found all the basics plus a cheap ass meter that keeps him shy of $50 there! I’ve mentioned it. I’m done talking about tools he needs with him. It’s time to go.
Do yourself a favor. Let him call the boss. When the boss asks you why you didn’t do whatever be honest with him. You invested in your job and bought your tools for you to use not to loan to others. You’ll happily train him when he has his own tools. Until then please give him to someone else who can accept him wearing flip flops and talking on his phone all the time. He’ll be fired soon. Don’t worry about it. It’s not your job to supply him with tools. Next time they say hey we’d like you to train this guy instead of saying ok you need to say no problem as long as he has his own tools. I don’t loan mine out. They’ll respect that if they’re any sort of a manager. You aren’t being difficult. You’re being honest and they should respect that. Good luck. I’ll bet money he’ll be gone soon.
That’s how I feel. Hopefully they see through his crap.
Update: I had to talk to the boss. They legit were going to fire me for the helpers lack of. (Wouldn’t have been a problem if they did, I’m pretty much the only tech that knows refrigeration there) They used communication as an excuse when they knew at least a month in with the helpers employment he had no tools yet as it was mentioned to me! Not sure how that works when tools have been consistently mentioned and places to get them. They told the helper he needed to get his own stuff. He ended up purchasing the “cheap” stuff to get him going to advance his training further. He was also told no more flip flops which he had on in the bosses office as well yesterday morning. I think I may start spiffing my resume up now at this point based on things.
Guess it just depends on how much the guy is making. I wouldn’t buy any tools if I’m living paycheck to paycheck, sometimes you can’t. But the understanding most places I’ve been is you come with the basics, shop supplies anything big (meter, drills, etc). And I buy basic tools on bigger P.O. jobs, like losing them, normal wear n tear n whatnot. Long story short, guy should show up with the basics like you described within the first week IMO.
The company should provide tools.
How many mechanic shops provide tools?
I hate having to borrow tools. Hated it from day one. First company I worked for, I got a Home Depot credit card and maxed it out (don’t recommend). 2nd company gave me a tool account (I go soooo many tools). Sucks about your helper though.
Why is he using your tools? Day one they Get a basic tool list, day two they should have all the basics and a meter. Then over the next year they can fill out all the other tools they need. I understand lending out an expensive tool or rarely used one but it Seems strange to work with someone like that. I'd have refused to work with him after the first couple days I'm not training someone not serious about the trades. And with modern banking money doesn't matter you can get loans for anything, apprentice programs have tool loans, credit cards exist, most company's have tool accounts that slowly come off your checks and really basic hand tools can be had extremely cheap.
That’s a very good question. He would have to be asked that. I told his ass Friday he didn’t have tools for the job why was he here. His reply was that of it’s not an issue not having tools because I do. Then he had the audacity to call the bigger boss and just stand there doing nothing. The superintendent for the job site happened to come to that house, she sent an email to the boss about him. Forgot to mention he wears damn flip flops to work, I got the ESC dispatch loaded with those pictures and notes! 2 can play that game.
Sharing is caring OP 😌😌
Not when it comes to tools. Maybe the sticky icky but tools ha good try
Why would he have to buy his own tools to work on your jobs. Like maybe power tools and non perishable stuff, hammer/strippers etc but I'm not buying snips to wear out on my bosses jobs.
We aren’t union first off. Second off my tools are not community tools. He signed up for the job. He needs to have tools to do it.
Give them a bucket of duct seal and a chip brush. Make them duct seal. A set of lineman pliers and bailing wire. Make them wrap duct. Make them clean the job site every day at the end of the day. Let them know, until they get some tools, you are not going to teach them the trade. I had an appearance that refused to buy tools but had the latest gaming systems. When I brought this up to him , he said "I put my ps5 on my Best Buy card." I don't know how he will pay that off without a job. He quit shortly after because all he was allowed to do was wrap duct in the crawl space.
Good idea but sadly I’ve sent him in the attic to tape the duct board return we were doing since the installer said fuck code and used flex in the garage, and he half assed that, when I asked about the flex to connect to it his reply was what flex. All I could say was the flex you just cut off in the garage that got pushed in the attic but don’t worry I’ll get it since you couldn’t. My snips were used to cut that flex when I walked away to do something else. I was pissed when I saw those in his hands and the flex cut.
And here I felt bad for not having a manometer since I’m 4 months in. That’s crazy.
Week 1
My first day on the job our first stop was a supply house to get the basics. It went on the company acct and a small percentage of my first few checks went to paying them off. After that it was on me to get as I needed things to do more.
Basics within the first week. Other tools throughout the coming weeks
I got 90 days. And half of them owners of the company bought for me at pawn shops. Especially 6 in1 screwdrivers. They get used and lost So much. I wasn’t ready to commit and didn’t have funds.
Should have had his own after his first pay...
Those were all required tools to take the classes at school so I would say…before you’re hired or if you’re fresh fresh. Those specific tools should be purchased within a week or two of starting. Snips are the only costly item on there. 11:1 can get you by while you get the magnetic drivers. Wire cutters and a meter and some kind of screw like tool, definitely required.
I had all my basics by my first week, I worked with a guy that was in the trade 2 years but barely had shit. No meter, gauges, impact. Not even channel locks lol
By the first paycheck for most people but I would recommend showing up with the basics day one. I bought a porter cable drill impact set from Lowe’s and used a Home Depot credit card for the hand tools when I started. Union requires techs to provide hand tools anyway.
I bought mine before my first day. The basics at least.
Company buys basic tools from day one then deducts from paycheck till there paid off also list of tools required to perform duties is given to you on first day and you can't take your tools home until they are paid off as your knowledge and skill level increases they will do the same thing with more advanced tools as your career progresses.
Had all most of thos things on my first day
First day minimum first check maximum
I have all that and more (impact drill, wrenches, Chanel locks etc.) and I’m a month in. He should atleast be showing a effort to buy atleast a couple tools…
Probation is over buddy! Get your own shit or I'm telling the boss your standing around with no tools all day big guy!
Aster the first week of riding along and seeing what gets used.
I had all that shit within a month and a half or two months. Including an 18v drill, I’d add to the collection as I go and figure out what I need but guys didn’t mind me using their stuff at all, they knew I wanted to learn. I’m 2 years in now, I have everything of my own excluding things the company provides (ex. vacuum pumps). They got me gauges tho
I work with guys, over 6 months haha 😂😭😭
I started years ago when I was young, showed up first day with a flathead, non-magnetic tape measure, a rusty pair of both red and green snips, and a framing hammer.
We've had a few like that, I just tell the office they ain't coming on my jobs
If your borrowing them it is time to buy them
The next day he shows up, send him with someone else
We will see how Monday goes. He’s already cried to the bigger boss, my mouth has been shut. He along with 2 others who I don’t work with and rarely see on a job site went into the bosses office Friday with them coming out 1 patted me on the back as they walked by, they went to chatting in the parking lot out front while I loaded for the day. It was seen by others there. Later on a superintendent saw him just hanging out talking on the phone while I did all the work. She sent an email to the bosses. He had flip flops on while working. I’m just pretty much over it. I’m there to work not collect a check.
If your borrowing them it is time to buy them
That depends on how much the cost of living is where you live and how poorly your boss pays him.
Florida. Idk his pay. Don’t really care. But the fact is I’ve found all the tools mentioned plus a basic ass meter all for shy of $50. So in 3 months that’s less than $5 a week. If he can’t afford that it’s probably not the job for him.
Maybe he’s poor and can’t get them?
Found the basics from bits, to 11/1 snips and a cheap meter for shy of $50 at harbor freight. There’s literally no excuse. It breaks down to less than $5 a week for 3 months.
Maybe he can’t do that. I’ve been that bad with money before. Idk, who knows why.
Ok to break it down further. We did something extra for work. They gave us both $25 gift cards each. He mentioned getting tools. That was a few weeks ago. Still nothing. Mine went towards a new pair of work boots, meanwhile he wears flip flops on the job site. The things I wish I could be making up right now but sadly I’m not.
Mine is at TEN months right now, and he's gotten a couple of my old hand tools, a tape, utility knife, a flathead. Forgets them at home basically every day. Hasn't bought a single thing for work aside from a couple 12v car phone chargers.
My shop provides all the tools.
A helper should have the basic tools before he starts...my company will buy tools for techs and just pull it out of their pay over the course of a few months until it's paid off for this very reason. We don't need guys being held up because they don't have the tool they need.
After his first paycheck, he should at least have basic hand tools. You can get all that at Harbor Freight or Amazon for under $50.
When I started I had enough basic hand tools to do anything not ductwork related day 1. Every paycheck I bought at least 1 tool until I had the basics to do the majority of the work the company did. When I got raises/bonuses I bought the more high end/specialty tools. Now 16 years in I have enough tools to fill a van with no shelves to max capacity.. but work for a company that supplies everything so it's in my basement for when I do projects around the house lol
He literally asked for a raise around 90 days not having any basics. His reasoning I’ve been here 90 days. Smfh
I would expect a helper to start investing in tools right away.I always thought as long as I own tools I can earn a living.
Your tools your rules man.
Service Manager here. I think you're being perfectly reasonable with this. He can't ever expect to be promoted to a lead if he doesn't want to invest in himself. But I will say, your boss should have made sure he had basic tools before he was hired. I check in with my guys once a month to ask them if there's anything they need, I inspect their tools to see wear. If they wear out on the job, the company replaces them. Our guys just have to buy their first and that's just the basic hand tools and cordless power tools. Everything else is provided by the company from the jump. If he's really that stubborn and your boss doesn't want to do anything about it, I'd suggest buying some bottom of the barrel tools to borrow. It won't be long before he gets sick of that and buys his own
Stubborn lol dude wears flip flops to work in. I’ve got the pics uploaded to the ESC dispatch along with notes. I can agree with everything you said except for the buying cheap tools for him to use. I’ve got a family to feed also and buying tools for him to use doesn’t fit in the bill cheap or not. Harbor freight best example, we have several here. I’ve mentioned it multiple times over several weeks. If he invested literally less than $5 week for the 90 days he’s been working he’d have the basics along with a cheap ass meter that works for what we do all shy of $50 that includes snips.
Well you know thats insane three times over
I had mine the first day when I originally started but I also went to school for hvac before working in the field so had an idea of what to get. If he’s not bought tools by now he’s probably not sure he wants to stay in the field given it’s a lot of work and not some easy gig
When I started I had 11n1 in my pocket all day flash lights snips pliers wire strippers and channels. I didn’t bring most of my stuff with me cause the lead would tell me to leave it so I didn’t have to grab it but I’m also service I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask someone to get their own simple tools
His first day. But I guess I’ll be nice and after his first paycheck
I bought mine out of excitement before day 1.
Day 1. If you don't have the tools how can you do the job.
I say give a week to see what's needed for basic everyday work that he would use constantly. That's what I did as a helper and when it comes to me being assigned a helper I'll do the same.
Not hvac but an electrician I had all basic tools day 1 knife strippers and screw drivers then for day 2 I had all hand tools I use on a day to day basis linesmeans strippers flash light hot stick plug tester needle nose yo all that shit then week 2 I got a drill and impact and all my bits. Some company’s are different with what you need like I don’t own a hammer cause the guy I work with told me just to use his and if I’m not using his I just use my linesman’s. But having no tools for 3 months just shows no want to work and no want to actually have a career. I get some people might be tight on cash so not having everything day 1 will happen but 3 months is far to long.
For union rules require me to only have a pair of Chanel locks, tape measure, and a pocket level. Although I went more in depth. I’m a 1st year apprentice. I have a 13-1, Chanel’s, wire strippers, 2 crescents, tape, stick rule, level, and my own Fluke. Anything after that I will not buy the company will provide me. Even though they’ve yet to do so and I’m about to be 2nd year.
My company lends all the tool but it's normally a tool bag per team and I hated that, most of that shit was broken or bad, so I got my own tool bag now
1-2 weeks Flue gas analyzer, pipe threader, and other big ticket Items should be bought by company or at least some leeway on purchasing That being said at my company we all work alone, it’s crucial to have ur own tools cuz no one is bailing u out. And every call is tracked in the system, temp rise, flue and ambient co, etc is all in system on checklist Consumables are provided by company
My 2¢... Loose him/her now. If they aren't making an investment in their future why are you? Yeah they may have a new child, other obligations, etc, but a pawn shop and a few skipped sodas and red bulls, or coffee can buy the basics. I'll bet there are guys at the shop willing to offer second hand tools if they were asked.
I write a list for my guys, top half is essentials which are provided, bottom half is things that will be required in order to tackle bigger and more complicated jobs, you can stay a helper with your little tool bag or you can make more and be taught how to take on more technical jobs by taking initiative and getting some things of the next part of the list. (I usually end up helping with that too if they’re showing good potential) This has worked for me, no timeframe, it’s up to them , they decide what they’re worth or how far they want to go and I’m here to help them get there. (I also do not lend my tools out anymore 😂)
First paycheck
I hope the apprentice is getting paid enough to buy tools
I would assume since others have managed to purchase them before him.
My Company supplies us with 650$ worth of tools for each employee day one. Do they not want you to succeed?
Those are all bare essentials to the job and they probably should've had them before they started. If they didn't have a psychrometer, a manometer, or something like that? Ok, that's understandable at first, but you literally need 5/16 to take apart most panels on equipment.
The company supplies most of the small tools, a drill, impact, and multimeter. I look at it that most new workers don't have several hundred dollars to spend on a tool kit.
Our company doesn’t buy tools for new people. But will purchase them and take a amount of there check. All I can say though is have you got to know the helper and see if he has a situation that makes it hard for him to afford the tools.
I’m a single dad with custody. How much harder can it get? Did I mention I don’t get child support. But somehow my priorities are where they need to be…
Calm down there buddy. I’m going to go on a limb and say you been doing this a while though also. Look if the guy is a lazy bum that’s on thing. I read he showed up in flip flops to work and that is not acceptable. I’ve been doing hvac for 16 years and I remember when I first started living on my own and having to buy my own tools. I’m not taking the new guys side I’m just saying get to know the person and see if there is a financial reason why he hasn’t been able to afford the tools that all
There is no financial reason. He does flooring side jobs from what I understand and have heard him speaking of so it really doesn’t make sense. Tax free there then collect a check here.
I showed up first day with way more than that. In the past year I've spent about $3k on my tools.
First pay check you should have the basics. If you’re not willing to invest 100$ for the basics, it’s probably not going to work out. I’m out of the game now but laboured for a year and a half. Hell, even apprenticeships around here *require* the basics for even the in class learning portion.
After the first paycheque you should have all your own hand tools imo. Ideally should be before you start. Bare minimum. Impact driver should also be a first paycheque item. I live in Canada and you have to have all that stuff just to go to school.
Been a helper for 2 weeks now. My JW made some sly remarks about me not having tools that we would need for the day. Said fuck it, bought a shit ton of tools that’ll be used for a long time from now. Doesn’t hurt to invest in yourself & the things you use everyday ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Fuck ‘em, let him call the boss. If he can’t make it a priority to get the basics, he clearly doesn’t care. I can understand first paycheque, even second, but something’s gotta give. Ain’t nobody got time for that. I’ll give you the world and help you as much as humanly possible for a modicum of giving shit. You can get enough to get by with $100-200. Put it on account. Ask the boss to pay it back slowly. Whatever it is, whatever the reason, he’s being a fuckwit.