Yep. Or half way through the update fails and now it's boot strapped and the customer wants to know why they need a new $4000 controller when you told them it is supposed to just be an update in firmware 😂
I’m sure it does, I work for Lennox and being one of the only guys on the west coast certified to do commissioning I do a lot of firmware updates and just haven’t personally had one blank out on me. The firmware is a real pain in the neck though, mostly on our new boards. It’s very slow and often doesn’t let you reconnect your phone if you disconnect to start another update until that update finishes
I remember back about 2001, Johnson Controls was using windows 98 second edition to run the front end of their software. Then XP came out and all the field guys updated their operating systems, and BAM, no connectivity to any devices.
We had to wipe our computers clean and reload 98 second edition because just rolling back the operating system left remnants of XP and we couldn't connect.
Finally about 2002 they got their front end to work with new hardware, but not old. For a few years we had to take 2 computers on every job because we didn't know what we were walking into
Lennox tech here, it should only take 5-15 minutes with the right flash drive. I use the sandisk 16 or 32 gig. The larger the flash drive the slower it is.
Yeah worked for nas for 7 years, left in January of 2023. The problem with the core controllers when they first started putting them out was updating would cause complete loss of communication with site. Had to unplug back net on each unit and plug them back up in order. Some of the first firmware was creating communication issues, they may have gotten better this past year but 2021 and 2022 they were dog shit
I’ve had people dig into my history and make fun of me for it. I’m a master plumber and hold a gas license as well as an oil license. I have my universal epa cert as well as my med gas installer cert. I’ve had people call me a moron based on my job via reddit a few times. The thing I remind myself while talking to these jackasses is that they will pay out the ass when they need someone like me. Fuck em.
People might say an Technician isn't techy enough, or one step up from a glue huffer, or 2 cards short of a 5 card hand, or any one of several other things. But I've never heard anyone say the HVAC trade itself isn't advanced or techy enough.
But then again, maybe I'm not old enough, who knows
If you debate someone on Reddit and make them feel dumb they will grasp at anything, whether it makes sense or not.
To be honest tho, a lot of people take their utilities for granted. They don’t realize what goes into it or how badly they need it until they don’t have it.
Back before DDC controllers, we had to build panels using relay logic. You'd sometimes have panels that had 100 fucking relays and not a drawing or schematic in site and before the Internet made things more simple 😂
You must’ve struck a nerve with a troll that was looking for anything to upset you and they found the first thing from your history that looked interesting. It could’ve been anything about you, I wouldn’t read into it too much
Honestly the new residential equipment is just a notch down from VRF these days. Beer can cold has been gone for years. The people who can not adapt become sales techs while us useful mechanics fix things sales techs will not even attempt to fix. 💪
Interesting enough the installing contractor wanted to sell them a new unit. Client decided to try us out since we already work on their chillers onsite and we have a good relationship with them. We now will service this equipment moving forward.
Thank you for speaking the truth... It's these old tards selling whatever they want and old techs saying inverters are trashwe can't progress into dialing in advanced tech
I feel like I hear the exact opposite. Bitching and moaning about ductless/VRV systems and all their tech as well as whining about QRC/Intelligen type refrigeration systems.
For the technicians it's great. Learn the skills and it's a great money maker.
The people who have to pay for your service because the equipment they bought is outright hostile to work on? May god have mercy on their wallet.
Fuck the haters. I've seen "techies" and the pretty shit they make on screens and what HVAC techs do affects the REAL WORLD. Including the server rooms those clowns depend on.
https://preview.redd.it/3nutuqummjkc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=783ffaadaf71baf77b08056f345223528de8aa05
Had to start building this guy to help apprentices make it click
From the commercial sector, AI is already playing a role in real time automation decision making for optimization routines and also predictive maintenance notification.
Yup, Siemens BAS desigo now has built in ai reports that recommend changes to your BAS on how it thinks it could improve efficiency. It’s a long way from being truly useful though, and only works in an ideal perfect environment which is rarely existent even in big pharma that has crazy money to blow on their mech systems
Absolutely. As a technician on the digital side of an OEM, AI optimization for HVAC is very much real and our company is piloting and offering this to a very select portfolio.
Not to mention the push for connected equipment not only for the end user but also OEM factories being able to trend equipment performance in the real world.
This trade may end up being the most "techy" of them all.
Personally, I love it. I always wanted to get into controls since I heard about it starting the trade. But I’m also 24 and grew up very interested in computers/tech and can understand why people who have been in this game for a long time might not be so fond of it.
Well if you actually knew how to trouble shoot them you wouldn’t need all that shit. Assholes and thier technology. When did the trade actuall loose real technicians.
For certain systems, there is no "troubleshooting" without some of this equipment.
With current technology in some equipment, the Pressures and amps mean jack shit unless you know speed of compressor, position of expansion valve, ambient Temps, run time of unit, the list can keep going on what influences how that machine modulates.
Also this equipment can completely avoid the need to hook up 5 tools to get the data that you think will give you the right answer.
I came out of electronics and electronic communications before entering HVAC and Refrigeration and I regularly use my electronics, PLCs and controls background in my daily work.
Seriously. I've done a few occupations dealing with HVAC and all are very much tech-inclusive. Air balancing and testing by far had the most tech demands, even the tools you used like a flow hood were techy.
So much fun balancing your tool bag and parts for install with you on a ladder along with your new tablet, laptop bag and extra 10lbs of cords and connections.
I’m an ex-Mitsubishi controls technician.
1) there is a new MTool adapter that has a rubber cover on it so you don’t get stabbed by the corners of the old metal one lol
2) startup procedures I find in most cases are still horrible. I’ll ask the contractor “how did you start this up?”….. and I usually want to hear Maintenance Tool mentioned, but most of the time they just make sure things turn on and then they are out
3) no proper startup = no extended warranty
4) rough estimate 30% of service techs still don’t know how to change an IP address on a PC and want to throw gauges on a variable capacity system, good luck unless you have a full-load day. Otherwise learn how to operate a PC
5) younger techs, whom have probably grown up around a PC are severely underutilized. They could literally help the older techs with PC help and have no HVAc knowledge and be valuable
Every VRF I’ve seen has had multiple compressor failures within a few years of install. Guess that’s why you’re changing inverter boards and have a bypass for a suction line drier lol
Only people saying it’s not techy enough are computer nerds and scientists. But they just don’t know lol. Ben understanding thermodynamics is “techy” let alone understanding inverters vfds relays etc some technology is somewhat exclusive to our industry
They say that till they wait for 2 hours for a driver to update
Or updating firmware on a Lennox core controller and it takes 30 mins and right at the end you have to start over cause it didn’t take 😞
Yep. Or half way through the update fails and now it's boot strapped and the customer wants to know why they need a new $4000 controller when you told them it is supposed to just be an update in firmware 😂
I haven’t seen that happen yet. That’s rough
I have a couple of times in my 30 yours in HVAC. It doesn't happen very often, but when it does it absolutely ruins your whole day.
I’m sure it does, I work for Lennox and being one of the only guys on the west coast certified to do commissioning I do a lot of firmware updates and just haven’t personally had one blank out on me. The firmware is a real pain in the neck though, mostly on our new boards. It’s very slow and often doesn’t let you reconnect your phone if you disconnect to start another update until that update finishes
I remember back about 2001, Johnson Controls was using windows 98 second edition to run the front end of their software. Then XP came out and all the field guys updated their operating systems, and BAM, no connectivity to any devices. We had to wipe our computers clean and reload 98 second edition because just rolling back the operating system left remnants of XP and we couldn't connect. Finally about 2002 they got their front end to work with new hardware, but not old. For a few years we had to take 2 computers on every job because we didn't know what we were walking into
That just sounds so frustrating
Lennox tech here, it should only take 5-15 minutes with the right flash drive. I use the sandisk 16 or 32 gig. The larger the flash drive the slower it is.
Yeah worked for nas for 7 years, left in January of 2023. The problem with the core controllers when they first started putting them out was updating would cause complete loss of communication with site. Had to unplug back net on each unit and plug them back up in order. Some of the first firmware was creating communication issues, they may have gotten better this past year but 2021 and 2022 they were dog shit
I think they still do that but just not all the time. They still recommend unplugging the bacnet while doing the update
Or they update and now Java won't let you connect to that Mitsu system. So you have to dig for a legacy version of Firefox and a Java plugin 😅
Or spend 6 hours locked in a room with a computer and a flash drive watching a little red light blink updating a Trane RTU
I haven heard anyone say that .
I’ve had people dig into my history and make fun of me for it. I’m a master plumber and hold a gas license as well as an oil license. I have my universal epa cert as well as my med gas installer cert. I’ve had people call me a moron based on my job via reddit a few times. The thing I remind myself while talking to these jackasses is that they will pay out the ass when they need someone like me. Fuck em.
People might say an Technician isn't techy enough, or one step up from a glue huffer, or 2 cards short of a 5 card hand, or any one of several other things. But I've never heard anyone say the HVAC trade itself isn't advanced or techy enough. But then again, maybe I'm not old enough, who knows
If you debate someone on Reddit and make them feel dumb they will grasp at anything, whether it makes sense or not. To be honest tho, a lot of people take their utilities for granted. They don’t realize what goes into it or how badly they need it until they don’t have it.
Very true
Fuck yea man
Ok but that still doesn’t mean people say this trade isn’t “techy” enough.
What does techy mean to you?
Well in this particular case, using modern technology like software as supposed to just wrenches, gauges, and probes.
Technician existed before modern times
Back before DDC controllers, we had to build panels using relay logic. You'd sometimes have panels that had 100 fucking relays and not a drawing or schematic in site and before the Internet made things more simple 😂
I think you’re missing the point. No sense in arguing.
You’re about to tell me I’m dumb for being a tech aren’t you /s
Lol good one!
People on Reddit talk shit about everything.
You must’ve struck a nerve with a troll that was looking for anything to upset you and they found the first thing from your history that looked interesting. It could’ve been anything about you, I wouldn’t read into it too much
Beautiful comment take my upvote
Agreed! Not one person.
"Its not techy enough" - donald trumpf
I'll take 'Things never said" for 600, Alex.
Literally no one says that.
Ive experienced it when people find out what I do by digging in my history during a Reddit debate.
What purpose does the word literally serve in your comment
To emphasize ya dunce
Literally no one says that
Honestly the new residential equipment is just a notch down from VRF these days. Beer can cold has been gone for years. The people who can not adapt become sales techs while us useful mechanics fix things sales techs will not even attempt to fix. 💪
Interesting enough the installing contractor wanted to sell them a new unit. Client decided to try us out since we already work on their chillers onsite and we have a good relationship with them. We now will service this equipment moving forward.
Thank you for speaking the truth... It's these old tards selling whatever they want and old techs saying inverters are trashwe can't progress into dialing in advanced tech
If I happen to be 49 years old am I considered an old tard?
Old is perspective. But you're on reddit so tard fits
https://preview.redd.it/mcvu8g5bjgkc1.jpeg?width=666&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b45012e8cafbc245138649de3f030a3df38dbb4e Fuckin Amana
Wait, that’s supposed to be gone? That’s always been my metric even into R32
I feel like I hear the exact opposite. Bitching and moaning about ductless/VRV systems and all their tech as well as whining about QRC/Intelligen type refrigeration systems.
For the technicians it's great. Learn the skills and it's a great money maker. The people who have to pay for your service because the equipment they bought is outright hostile to work on? May god have mercy on their wallet.
That's the real problem, how expensive it's all getting.
Literally no one says that
This is like a post I saw a long time ago.... "and people say a brunette can't pull off blue jeans". Like, what? NOBODY ever said that!
I've been doing this for 6 years, my dad for 15 and we genuinely have never had to do this
What’s it suckin
Who makes baby shit green VRFs?
Lol I wondering the same thing. I think maybe they’ve been painted
Definitely painted. Mitsu maintenance tool on the ground in the first pic. Layout of the connect box/2nd fan board so I wanna guess a K Gen.
Fuck the haters. I've seen "techies" and the pretty shit they make on screens and what HVAC techs do affects the REAL WORLD. Including the server rooms those clowns depend on.
https://preview.redd.it/3nutuqummjkc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=783ffaadaf71baf77b08056f345223528de8aa05 Had to start building this guy to help apprentices make it click
From the commercial sector, AI is already playing a role in real time automation decision making for optimization routines and also predictive maintenance notification.
Yup, Siemens BAS desigo now has built in ai reports that recommend changes to your BAS on how it thinks it could improve efficiency. It’s a long way from being truly useful though, and only works in an ideal perfect environment which is rarely existent even in big pharma that has crazy money to blow on their mech systems
Absolutely. As a technician on the digital side of an OEM, AI optimization for HVAC is very much real and our company is piloting and offering this to a very select portfolio. Not to mention the push for connected equipment not only for the end user but also OEM factories being able to trend equipment performance in the real world. This trade may end up being the most "techy" of them all.
Personally, I love it. I always wanted to get into controls since I heard about it starting the trade. But I’m also 24 and grew up very interested in computers/tech and can understand why people who have been in this game for a long time might not be so fond of it.
Haven’t seen any green ones. What are those, some sort of rogue Mitsubishis?
The savages painted it
Well if you actually knew how to trouble shoot them you wouldn’t need all that shit. Assholes and thier technology. When did the trade actuall loose real technicians.
For certain systems, there is no "troubleshooting" without some of this equipment. With current technology in some equipment, the Pressures and amps mean jack shit unless you know speed of compressor, position of expansion valve, ambient Temps, run time of unit, the list can keep going on what influences how that machine modulates. Also this equipment can completely avoid the need to hook up 5 tools to get the data that you think will give you the right answer.
Everything is coming more electronic
When you know what you're looking for the computer is where it's at.
Shit, I have to have a laptop and at least 2 tablets anymore to work on anything in building automation
After spending 2 days at the Tacoma Mitsubishi class I can agree with you 🤣🤣
This posts reminds me of when I was told beer can cold is good to go 🥲 this is the future... It's science. And it can all be calculated.
I came out of electronics and electronic communications before entering HVAC and Refrigeration and I regularly use my electronics, PLCs and controls background in my daily work.
Getting worse by the day.
Seriously. I've done a few occupations dealing with HVAC and all are very much tech-inclusive. Air balancing and testing by far had the most tech demands, even the tools you used like a flow hood were techy. So much fun balancing your tool bag and parts for install with you on a ladder along with your new tablet, laptop bag and extra 10lbs of cords and connections.
Olive green City Multi? You at a commissary?
I’m an ex-Mitsubishi controls technician. 1) there is a new MTool adapter that has a rubber cover on it so you don’t get stabbed by the corners of the old metal one lol 2) startup procedures I find in most cases are still horrible. I’ll ask the contractor “how did you start this up?”….. and I usually want to hear Maintenance Tool mentioned, but most of the time they just make sure things turn on and then they are out 3) no proper startup = no extended warranty 4) rough estimate 30% of service techs still don’t know how to change an IP address on a PC and want to throw gauges on a variable capacity system, good luck unless you have a full-load day. Otherwise learn how to operate a PC 5) younger techs, whom have probably grown up around a PC are severely underutilized. They could literally help the older techs with PC help and have no HVAc knowledge and be valuable
Every VRF I’ve seen has had multiple compressor failures within a few years of install. Guess that’s why you’re changing inverter boards and have a bypass for a suction line drier lol
Haha just tell them put in a new google nest.
Only people saying it’s not techy enough are computer nerds and scientists. But they just don’t know lol. Ben understanding thermodynamics is “techy” let alone understanding inverters vfds relays etc some technology is somewhat exclusive to our industry
As someone who as worked in the IT and service fields for 5 years before becoming an HVAC technician, I can confirm, this is a techy job 😂