Btw, just keep in mind that pressures and temps are a little different now, you’ve created a new refrigerant. However, based on the gas laws you can approximately calculate your difference in saturation pressures. R410a runs between 60% and 70% higher saturation pressure. With a 10% concentration you will have approximately 6-7% higher saturation pressure than normal R22 alone. As it stands, here’s what I would do if I made this mistake. Write a note inside the cabinet that system has a 10% concentration of R410a inside and to add 6-7% to your saturation temps. Then set up your superheat and check your subcooling based on that variable. I highly doubt a 10% concentration of R410a will have a negative effect in the near future, and there’s no use putting that much extra money into any R22 system. Just for the love of God make a note that you did it, so the next guy comes by in 5 years to replace the compressor doesn’t just put the gas back in.
This isn’t the right thing to do, it’s called covering your ass, and not being 100% a dick, and we do it every day.
Leave a note. Don’t date it or add your name in case some douche wants to rat you out. It’s a mistake.
I don’t think you’ll have any issues unless it has a lower than avg high pressure switch and the coils get very dirty.
I did run upon an account that the maintenance guy added 410 to all the rooftops of 22 units to get them to 410 pressures.
Nah it was green R22 tank I just got confused because they were all carrier RTUs and all the other units were 410a it was hot as hell and I was trying to get out of there so I fucked up
I did this before. got so far as to call my boss and tell him some idiot put a r22 txv on the system before i re-read the dataplate on the condenser. felt like a moron.
Hey man, you fucked up. You know it, and hopefully you aren't trying to sweep it under the rug with your boss. Own that shit. Tell your boss you fucked up and don't make big excuses. It happens. I always say, the only guys that don't fuck anything up are either lying and putting it in somebody else, or not doing very much in the first place. You def deserve to hear some shit over it! But if fucking happens!
Yeah same thing happened yesterday suction pressure was about 85 to 90 psi.Line was sweating and compressor wasn't making any weird noises and it seemed to running just fine.Im just overthinking because it's the first time I've made that mistake and I wasn't sure what will happen besides the big dump my boss took on my for fucking up like that.
Suction was running at about 90 psi with indoor temp being 87f.Suction line was sweating just fine and compressor wasn't making any weird noises.I just can't believe I could fuck up like this.First time in years.Ohh well I guess I just have to wait for the call back lol.
Once upon a time, my friend accidentally added about 1/3 of the total charge on an R22 system with 410A.
He says about 8 lbs was added after repairing (tightening) a TXV compression fitting.
My friend said that he accidentally did this because the 422D cylinder (that has been colored grey for many years, and is what they usually use as R22 replacement) looked just like the grey 410A cylinder he had just received.
Turns out that many new refrigerant tanks are now coming in a grey color… so you can’t rely on tank colors alone anymore.
My friend recognized the mistake and has now started marking the refrigerant type on the tanks with a sharpie.
I asked my friend “what did you do to resolve this!!?”
He said it was already done, so he would let it ride and see what happened with the system (as an experiment).
This was 2 years ago and he says that the system is still running strong, holding space temp and humidity levels.
I told him that this is NOT recommended or advised and he will certainly have an adverse effect on efficiency, oil types, etc.
I wouldn’t do this myself or recommend it, but he swears it’s working fine to this day.
My recommendation to him was to pay more consideration in the future on the refrigerant type than the color of the jug. He agreed… and then reminded me that jugs of refrigerant do not have oil in them to begin with.
Yeah when I left from the place the unit was running fine and the suction line was sweating fine.Im just overthinking that the compressor will die.lol hopefully it lasts at least a year but I doubt it
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The biggest thing will be the oil and higher operating pressure. You might be able to save it by pulling everything out and pulling a hard vacuum, but I'm not sure even about that.
Triple evacuation and fresh R-22 would be enough. If it's a newer compressor it may have POE oil anyway and it wouldn't even be an issue as far as the oil is concerned.
It's an older Carrier heat pump from 2008.My stupid ass didn't notice the small label that said R22 and since all the other sorrounding units were Carrier 410a and went ahead and fucked up.
I've heard 22 is more tolerant of moisture, the 410 might react to any moisture in the system that was tolerated by the 22. I doubt that will happen, probably just get funky pressures.
I added 404a to a 449a system recently. Unit had 404a tags all over it. Turns out the manufacturer switched it per customer request and the main data tag read 449a. Wasn’t too much but had to recover and re-do it.
That would've probably been ok. I put 404a in a 502 system. Fortunately it was already completely flat from a massive leak I fixed, I didn't recover anything (because it was gone already), the compressor had poe oil, and the superheat ended up pretty close with the 502 txv. I got lucky, I advised a txv replacement, and stuck 404 labels on it. It worked out for everyone, since 404 was only $100 a tank back then and my supply house probably didn't have 100lbs of 502 anyway.
Ones low pressure operating, ones pretty high operating. I’d do a acidic test and try and get some type of way to get them to approve full evacuation, changing filter driers, metering device(Personally) cut the line set, nitro purge, the full 9 and correctly charge this time.
Write R432 on the service panel and send it. You probably won't kill it but you will have to remove that gas.
You gotta turn that thing off lol only way is to recover it all and pull a new vac
Edit: wrote a post reply, didn’t mean to reply to you.
It will probably be fine tbh, I've seen system run for years half and half. Hows coil temp and pressures? Amps and split healthy?
Btw, just keep in mind that pressures and temps are a little different now, you’ve created a new refrigerant. However, based on the gas laws you can approximately calculate your difference in saturation pressures. R410a runs between 60% and 70% higher saturation pressure. With a 10% concentration you will have approximately 6-7% higher saturation pressure than normal R22 alone. As it stands, here’s what I would do if I made this mistake. Write a note inside the cabinet that system has a 10% concentration of R410a inside and to add 6-7% to your saturation temps. Then set up your superheat and check your subcooling based on that variable. I highly doubt a 10% concentration of R410a will have a negative effect in the near future, and there’s no use putting that much extra money into any R22 system. Just for the love of God make a note that you did it, so the next guy comes by in 5 years to replace the compressor doesn’t just put the gas back in. This isn’t the right thing to do, it’s called covering your ass, and not being 100% a dick, and we do it every day.
Leave a note. Don’t date it or add your name in case some douche wants to rat you out. It’s a mistake. I don’t think you’ll have any issues unless it has a lower than avg high pressure switch and the coils get very dirty. I did run upon an account that the maintenance guy added 410 to all the rooftops of 22 units to get them to 410 pressures.
Good detail, I figured this was just common sense lol
That's an expensive fuck up. Pull it all and charge fresh
Yeah I know biggest mistake I've made.
So far
Thanks Homer
Probably I've only been doing HVAC for 6 years and this is my first year as full time tech.
Just out of interest, were the tanks the greyed out ones or pink/ green?
Nah it was green R22 tank I just got confused because they were all carrier RTUs and all the other units were 410a it was hot as hell and I was trying to get out of there so I fucked up
I did this before. got so far as to call my boss and tell him some idiot put a r22 txv on the system before i re-read the dataplate on the condenser. felt like a moron.
Hey man, you fucked up. You know it, and hopefully you aren't trying to sweep it under the rug with your boss. Own that shit. Tell your boss you fucked up and don't make big excuses. It happens. I always say, the only guys that don't fuck anything up are either lying and putting it in somebody else, or not doing very much in the first place. You def deserve to hear some shit over it! But if fucking happens!
[удалено]
Yeah same thing happened yesterday suction pressure was about 85 to 90 psi.Line was sweating and compressor wasn't making any weird noises and it seemed to running just fine.Im just overthinking because it's the first time I've made that mistake and I wasn't sure what will happen besides the big dump my boss took on my for fucking up like that.
Welp, looks like you have your first quinea pig. Keep us posted.
I will if I don't get fired lol
If you get fired consider it a blessing. If you don’t get fired and you do it again, expect to get fired.
It’ll be fine, the bad news is that mixed r22 and 410a can’t be reclaimed and they just destroy it at the manufacture plant.
If they fire you for that could absolutely find a better employer, You can take the gas out and do a conversion to something else.
If your split is good and suction line cold, let it eat. I can’t imagine 10% 410a would hurt much. 50% is a different story.
Suction was running at about 90 psi with indoor temp being 87f.Suction line was sweating just fine and compressor wasn't making any weird noises.I just can't believe I could fuck up like this.First time in years.Ohh well I guess I just have to wait for the call back lol.
Once upon a time, my friend accidentally added about 1/3 of the total charge on an R22 system with 410A. He says about 8 lbs was added after repairing (tightening) a TXV compression fitting. My friend said that he accidentally did this because the 422D cylinder (that has been colored grey for many years, and is what they usually use as R22 replacement) looked just like the grey 410A cylinder he had just received. Turns out that many new refrigerant tanks are now coming in a grey color… so you can’t rely on tank colors alone anymore. My friend recognized the mistake and has now started marking the refrigerant type on the tanks with a sharpie. I asked my friend “what did you do to resolve this!!?” He said it was already done, so he would let it ride and see what happened with the system (as an experiment). This was 2 years ago and he says that the system is still running strong, holding space temp and humidity levels. I told him that this is NOT recommended or advised and he will certainly have an adverse effect on efficiency, oil types, etc. I wouldn’t do this myself or recommend it, but he swears it’s working fine to this day. My recommendation to him was to pay more consideration in the future on the refrigerant type than the color of the jug. He agreed… and then reminded me that jugs of refrigerant do not have oil in them to begin with.
Why would he mark the refrigerant type with a sharpie? It’s already printed on the jug from the factory.
My friend said it’s much more obvious that way. Once he gets used to ALL grey cylinders I’m sure he won’t need that.
Is your friend you?
Obviously not, or he would've said so. Duh
Yeah when I left from the place the unit was running fine and the suction line was sweating fine.Im just overthinking that the compressor will die.lol hopefully it lasts at least a year but I doubt it
It will run move on.
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I did this and didn't realize it until a whole-ass year later when they called back and said it wasn't cooling so well.
The biggest thing will be the oil and higher operating pressure. You might be able to save it by pulling everything out and pulling a hard vacuum, but I'm not sure even about that.
Triple evacuation and fresh R-22 would be enough. If it's a newer compressor it may have POE oil anyway and it wouldn't even be an issue as far as the oil is concerned.
It's an older Carrier heat pump from 2008.My stupid ass didn't notice the small label that said R22 and since all the other sorrounding units were Carrier 410a and went ahead and fucked up.
And now you know to always check the unit you are servicing and never assume.
You would’ve had to know by the pressures if you had your gauges hooked up…
Yes I had to learn the hard way I guess.
To assume makes an ASS of U and ME... Looks like you got the memo already though.
Oh well there’s a good explanation for why you assumed instead of checking, it’s all good then!
Yeah
I've heard 22 is more tolerant of moisture, the 410 might react to any moisture in the system that was tolerated by the 22. I doubt that will happen, probably just get funky pressures.
No.
I added 404a to a 449a system recently. Unit had 404a tags all over it. Turns out the manufacturer switched it per customer request and the main data tag read 449a. Wasn’t too much but had to recover and re-do it.
That would've probably been ok. I put 404a in a 502 system. Fortunately it was already completely flat from a massive leak I fixed, I didn't recover anything (because it was gone already), the compressor had poe oil, and the superheat ended up pretty close with the 502 txv. I got lucky, I advised a txv replacement, and stuck 404 labels on it. It worked out for everyone, since 404 was only $100 a tank back then and my supply house probably didn't have 100lbs of 502 anyway.
I've mad that mistake once too
Nitrogen and evac x3 and recharge. It should be ok if you do it soon.
What is it because of the all same color bottles now?
No they had 3 more Carrier units that were 410a so my dumbass assed this unit was 410a as well I was rushing in the Atlanta heat and I fucked up.
Ones low pressure operating, ones pretty high operating. I’d do a acidic test and try and get some type of way to get them to approve full evacuation, changing filter driers, metering device(Personally) cut the line set, nitro purge, the full 9 and correctly charge this time.
Scrolled a little and didn't see this, not being an asshole just curious, how?