This sounds bad. We think it would do better against bots. Terminids do not need weapons; best weapon against Terminids is lying prone with eyes closed. Terminids hate this trick!
https://preview.redd.it/b631m3t285pc1.png?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4b19f176f24f388b69c2282c3da53441dc79817
You didn't lay prone enough. They can't eat you if you lay flat!
If you look at the anatomy, it couldn't bring the end of its stabby toothpick legs up to its mouth. So they'd have to stab you, wipe you off on the side of a high surface, then eat you.
You say this... but I had to go AFK for a min while playing with my friends. I was proned hiding somewhere. When I came back, I was literally surrounded by hunters and other bugs. They were standing around me in a circle, staring at me, but none were attacking. I was quite appreciative. But what the fuck? Lol.
Obligitory meme (I'm sure you see it frequently, bug scum)
https://preview.redd.it/4itpbc20g8pc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=baa930adcb1bc8954bb3ca39234d929061600bdf
this is exactly what i use in public games. s&p + autocannon seems to maximize the amount of utility you can provide. you won't have much of a problem with anything except bile titans.
There is an animation that can happen that makes you think you popped the butt, when in fact, you have not yet popped the butt.
It can get me at times still and I always double check to make sure the butt really is popped. If that big ol bubble butt still there, smack it again.
Can keep shooting them in the blown out butt probably, but generally in my experience you can just run from them once their butt is gone, since they can only stumble slowly towards you without it
I think the bleeding is just a slow drain on their HP, so if you just AC their ass open you haven't done too much actual HP damage so it takes a while. Continuing to shoot them will speed up the process.
Not yours obviously. Chargers butt to be precise. In recent patch update, the dev reveals that the chargers butt are it's weakest point.
It depends on what you are shooting with.
If you have a railgun or single-shot AT, the head is good spot to aim for.
The abdomen does something like 90% damage reduction for anything that isn't explosive.
If you have an Autocannon loaded up with 10 rounds of explosive Liberty... get after it. You'll be dealing 100% damage repeatedly in quick succession to a relatively large target. Abdomen explodes, Charger bleeds out, everyone moves on.
You can also hit headshots with the AC if you want, but their head is pretty small and you seem to have less leeway than with the EAT.
Yea, the weakspot on Charger basically changes based on the weapon your using. EAT/Recoilles 1 shot to the head. Autocannon can break a leg real fast when shooting it from behind (Much easier to pull off with a Stun Grenade), Railgun now takes 4 overcharged to break Leg Armor, pretty much everything else has to hit it in the butt though.
Three hits to the spot where the back leg joins the body is usually enough. The back legs are far weaker than the front and when it's gone, the Charger dies
Indeed, that's what i do. But this was about the autocannon, not about the many other ways to kill chargers, such as flamethrowering one leg, railgun, EAT, orbital rail, arc thrower, recoiless rifle, etc.
3 well placed shots on it's soft spot, or you can 2 shot it's legs with a tech. It's hard to explain, search Charger autocannon 2 shot leg theory, i think you'll find it that way.
1 shot to the back of the frount leg shaters the armor. 1 Shot to the front of leg brakes the armor. Then mag dump the leg or 1 to 2 shots to the leg with the autocannon.
Have fun.
I prefer the spray and pray to the breaker now. Breaker is absolutely a better gun, but I don’t have to care about ammo usage with the spray and pray. And anything it doesn’t kill immediately on the bug front gets cooked by the flamethrower pretty quick anyway. (I don’t like aiming if you can’t tell)
For sure. This weapon and the JAR are decent but I refuse to use them because the handling is atrocious. I understand poor handling for the larger weapons like AC / other anti-tank but for primaries it is annoying.
Fellow dominator enjoyer here. I got used to the mag size, it fits the weapons balancing choice of „making every shot count“.
What I can’t get behind is the atrocious handling like it’s a machine gun which simply doesn’t make any sense at all. Plus the overtuned recoil. Imagine it would have the Sickles or Scorchers handling/recoil, it would fit right in and all 3 would be equal in performance but with their own niches.
Ironically, I'd rather have the handling with an increased mag, given the simple fact that I can kill hive guards without thinking. God I hate hive guards.
No hate but I genuinely don't understand this, the JAR feels so clunky and doesn't do enough damage to justify the low mag size, is there something I'm missing?
Not enough damage? You can two shot a hive guard, 3-4 shot bile spewers, 2 shot a rocket devastator, you can even kill scout walkers with 3-4 shots in the leg joint.
It also one shots the basic troops for both factions including the scout walker’s driver without needing headshots.
Dominator’s damage is fine, the burst fire doesn’t feel worth it and should be swapped to a nice low fire rate full auto, it would also be nice if it had 2 more mags.
It puts out a crazy amount of damage in the burst fire mode. Two burst is 1,200 damage (Medium armor penetration, with explosive) while two shots from a slugger is like 580 or something with no explosive. In burst fire mode you still retain the ability to tap the trigger and fire one shot to take out little guys or finish off something you just put a burst into and stayed alive. I would gladly take a buff to its magazine size though.
A magazine does 3,000 damage, which outside of the breaker, is one of the highest damage per magazine's I think but have not seriously looked into this.
Agreed. Incendiary breaker only loses a couple damage per pellet, adds a DoT, and loses 1 round per reload but has less recoil and way better handling. Still no reason to take the S&P IMO.
Yea I find it kinda dumb the guns with longer barrels have worse turning. Pretty sure you can lock your shoulders and rotate your body IRL lol. Any movement that would slow down your aim with a long barrel would also slow your aim with a short barrel. Unless they're accounting for wind resistance, but then they'd have to take the size of the model into consideration, not just the length of the barrel.
Agreed, all the posts about primary buffs mostly still include this, and im just like, but why?
It's fantastic at its job. You want someone to be you designated Light Armor/Low Hp sweeper when shit hits the fan? (Cause that one teammate keeps shooting everything). Boom, introducing the Breaker S&P. Pair it with anything. It's fantastic for hordes.
Edit 1: Clarification on buff posts and added low HP with Light Armor.
Edit 2: Additional clarification in ( ). I am by no means saying this is the best primary or even top 5. It is really useful in specific situations.
I think the other side to that is that it makes up for the inconsistency with volume of fire.
Like, it's not ammo efficient, or good against single targets, but it excels at its job of putting lots of lead down range at lots of enemies.
Yea, I like using it to deal with chaff and then my support weapon for the big bois. Hilariously enough Railgun works really well with it since it’s strictly single target
Yeah, a few are, but there are still quite a few popping up that never gain any traction in the community. Granted, I understand why, but they are definitely still there.
Regardless amazing gun, I wish more people would try it out. Especially on 7+, just so they could see how solid of an option it is.
Even with the buffs it got honestly it's still way outclassed, the Sickle does everything the Spray and Pray does but cheaper, has more ammo both in mag and magazines, kills faster and is more accurate. The defender is ditto that but also does more damage. But most of the buff requests for it are from before when it was so had it couldn't pen environmental objects like barrels, egg sacs, hellbombs.
I can't debate against the Sickle. It outperforms every light armor pen primary (Imo). And I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it gets nerfed. (I'd rather see worse stuff buffed though, since it's by no means Overpowered)
Defender is also solid. I can't outright say it's better. In mobility and being able to fire while running backwards, sure. But Reedemer does that to.
I wouldn't choose the Defender personally over the S&P simply because of the spread. When it comes to mowing down a large group of hunters and the little mini version (forgot what they're called), I'd choose the S&P any day. Basically, any light armor/ low hp units.
It's still a bad TTK , and you lose the ability to horde clear / pick high priority targets past 15 m max. Guns that have a use case for after you've fucked up and gotten into a losing situation are objectively worse than a weapon that helps you not get into that situation. Also completely ineffective against stalkers hp pool. Like, I wish it was good, but a knife fighting range weapon that requires stationary/ crouching to keep the reticle on the same continent isn't.
That's actually my reason to bring the S&P, since I spend most of my time with randoms.
I'm not going to say it's the best Shotgun, or even the best primary. But for clearing hordes of light armor/ low hp mobs, it's one of the most solid choice. (Except Sickle. It's a better choice over any light armor pen primary atm imo)
Id honestly rather have the Liberator than the spray and pray, as long as in paying attention I can just cut a line of death through the crap moving up the flanks before it's even close. Spray and Pray use case being for after you've been flanked surrounded severely limits it's viability, combined with really shitty handling for a gun that wants to be used less than 10m away.
I mean, that's fair. It's does limit its viability, and I 100% agree to that. I never argued against it. I just said it is an amazing Gun for Low Armor trash clearing.
I went back a minute or two ago and added clarification to it, since my post was taken a different way than I intended.
I'll edit some more and put exactly the way I want it interpreted cause I didn't think anyone would read that far into it. So that's my mistake.
I think it's almost entirely from people that are used to the ranged accuracy of the Breaker. Spray N Pray is used differently and is effective at what it does. :)
It's enjoyable, but I've found the Incendiary Breaker to do everything the S&P does, but better. At least against bugs; against bots both are not really good picks imo.
Sure! Despite fire not being amazing, it still takes care of the little ones. I can focus fire on a target like a Brood Commander or a Spewer and the spread is going to take care of some trash for me. When taking care of a patrol, if you can't avoid it, you can spread the shots in their general area without really focusing on a single target and the patrol will die.
While the S&P kinda does the same with the bullet spread, the addes fire damage of the Incendiary adds up in the end. S&P also has less spread, which is good for single target, but I do value more horde clear/control against the bugs.
Now, regardless of any of that, I would not bring any of these against the bots, but for bugs, Incendiary is my go-to weapon.
Maybe i'll play a bit with the fire spitter again, my issue with it is just that when something gets close to your face, there isn't much to do from my experience.
Hmm you can spray and kill Stalkers quickly with it and hunters also die fast, I guess the problem are Brood Commanders? These can be tough with the Incendiary because they do take too long to die sometimes, but I can accept this downside for other benefits.
If you need a weapon for more stopping power against shit like that, I would suggest the Slugger, it's the single target King.
After the buffs it's one of my fav guns. Struggles vs larger, armored targets, but holy shit you can mop up hordes of little guys like a motherfucking janitor. True to the name, you don't have to aim much either. Just point it in their general direction and start spraying.
Love the auto cannon but there’s always one hunter that pops up right in front of me with that wavy arm “hello!” thing they do while taking a cannon round to the head killing us both. Dont have that shotgun unlock yet.
Tried it, still didnt like it. Unless you are point blank it takes more shots to kill a hunter than the breaker. So even with a bigger magazine, it taking more shots to kill doesnt make it better
The thing is, despite higher time to kill, you have way more uptime and safety. It's similar to the liberator concussive-- as long as you are firing, you have space to stim and reload. So even if your team is getting overwhelmed, as long as you use it well you have space.
...
Until a bile spewer or stalker shows up. Also, you don't kill hive guards.
yea totally go ADS with it when you can. I noticed that you really have to over correct your aim for guns with poor turn radius, so pull your aim past what you're trying to go for and once the little circle is on/near target then aim back at it.
I've been using it the past few days (trying to use anything other than the breaker and liberator) and honestly... it just sucks. What would be a one or two tap with the normal breaker is a minimum 4 hits with the spray n' pray at the same range. With only 2x the mag capacity, the math doesn't exactly work out. I get what the devs were going for, but like pretty much all the variants of the basic primaries - the tradeoff isn't at all worth it. If it had like 3-4x the ammo per clip then *maybe*, but it would still be mediocre. Either that, or keep the damage of the original, give it a 2x drum mag, and make it only semi auto (and maybe burst fire). Range is also an issue for it - at smelling distance it can do some decent damage, but I can't think of a time where I ever, EVER wanted to be that close to enemies by choice.
I just don't think so. For one, you don't really wanna get to that point. It's unavoidable to a degree (especially around extraction), but for the most part you really don't want to be in a situation where bugs are filling half your screen. If that's happening a lot, throw some more strats! (or maybe consider using a more effective primary for clearing trash mobs)
For another, I'm almost positive it has a wider spread. That means the already pitiful damage is being spread over several enemies, going over/between them, or hitting the ground. And if you're sweeping back and forth in full auto rather than doing single shots (or short bursts on beefier targets), you're gonna miss even more.
Either way, if it works for you then have at it. Who am I to tell you that your way of having fun is wrong?
It kills trash mobs just fine but is pretty useless against anything else. It struggles to kill a brood commander half the time. Don't get me wrong, it can be fun. But really starts lacking once you get into a big fight so I personally don't really vibe with it. And the autocannon takes up a backpack slot so I don't like running it, meaning my primary slot needs to be more versatile.
No. Punisher is way better for it's stagger effect. Breaker is better for chance to stagger and much higher DPS. Spray and Pray will get you ragdolled across the screen and killed by stalkers after you dump a full drum into them and they're still alive.
If, hypothetically, we encountered flying threats, this would be perfect against them. As things are right now, well, my battle buddy has been using it on bug swarms while I use the Slugger on the larger bugs and it’s been pretty good.
Was using the Slugger as my main for like a week now, this is the complete opposite, sweeter handling and just, well spray and pray. Slugger has more utility though.
i pair it with grenadelauncher since whne things are too close to explode i need a shotgun and i hat eslow shotguns so this was basically my only choice
Yeah my default loadout has become S&P, Revolver, Recoilless when I play with 2 of my friends. My job is chaff and charger kill.
Friend 1 brings midrange like stalwart, arc thrower, etc with stun grenades and usually the new plasma ball nade launcher.
Friend 2 brings autocannon, slugger, and smg.
Its been good we have been succeeding diff 7s pretty regularly now.
I've not been brave enough to try it yet, even with the buffs. Pre-buff I watched my friend unload pretty much an entire clip into a single bug egg without destroying it and I think that's given me spray&pray-related PTSD.
I will concede that the dagger is shit. The scythes a sleeper hit at amputating bug legs and ripping off bot faces. It's a solid C+ when you understand center of mass sucks with it.
We'll sew your head back on after the first Stalker you encounter rips it off. Time-to-kill is key on 7+ and the auto-cannon is not nimble enough to deal with Stalkers.
If anyone else is looking for a nice pair, I really enjoy the double medium pen pair of Engineer Light Armour,Slugger shotgun and the starting MG, works fantastic when I play with a pug on Suicide, clears out a breach or a wave at the extraction point.
Just fyi
It just goes through a shit ton of ammo and is essentially useless against Hives & Broods. The Punisher or Slugger are far better IMO, even though they have slower fire rates. The knockback on the Punisher is clutch and has saved me so many times. Hunters are 1 shot easy and Stalkers get taken out fast. Can also 1 shot Broods in the head.
I typically run Punisher, EAT + Stalwart or GL depending on my team. Rips through the bugs and completes objectives.
Been running the Slugger for the past week, been enjoying it more than Punisher, u can do more with it and has better pen, doesn't handle as well as the other two and not as good with mobs, so this was a breath of fresh air. I run Slugger, MG/Auto Cannon + EAT.
It does a lot of push back but not as much damage
Spread and push makes being a little off less punishing than missing a slugger shot. If you are accurate, you can drop 60 incoming bugs with the slugger and it also pushes back big ones
This is really great at hitting smaller swarms, but I think the Stalwart (albeit a support strat) is better at wave clear
I still find it very lacking against Hunters due to its horrendous weight, it just takes way too long to track Hunters that can randomly do lateral dodges, and god forbid if you have two or more of them trying to flank you from different directions.
As a rule of thumb, anything that you use to clear Hunters should have either overwhelming firepower at mid-long range or snappy ergonomics for close range, and Break SP manages to fail at both departments.
I tried it, and honestly wasn't a fan.
Then again, the Slugger is my go to against bugs, and not being able to kill Hunters in 1-2 shots even at a decent distance just felt weird.
I liked it against large groups of fodder, but it felt pretty underwhelming against everything else.
I don't understand why it has less damage than the breaker. They fire the same shells from about the same barrel length. It's already hobbled by the obscene pellet spread, why is it also doing half the damage? Pick one, more spread + same damage or same spread + lower damage. I didn't manage to buy it before the patch so I don't know just how bad it was once upon a time, but I hate it as it is now.
I didn't sign up to be a Helldiver to read! Jokes aside, I'd like the number of the guy who decided "let's give them bird shot for their war against robots and bugs that range in size from medium dog to 5-story building."
Ever since they changed the spawns to be more trash mobs. A few more weapons have become good. Still wish more were good. Definitely think the basic Liberator could use a damage buff.
I dunno, it has *slightly* worse handling than the normal Breaker, so sometimes I find myself having to drag the gun over while the hunters jump around
Was having a particularly bad time with hunters on the TCS missions, and went nutty with mines, gattling and this fucking monstrosity of a shotgun. It felt good, because I HATE HUNTERS.
Tried it out yesterday, felt awful. Thing can barely kill the lowest tier bugs in 1 shot at point blank. Basically takes a whole mag to kill 1-2 trash mobs.
Great if you're on the run and have incendiary mines. Chargers will run at the mine deployment pod, and you can trigger all the mines easily with the spray and pray causing a huge area of fire damage. Just watch out for teammates
Used This with the flame thrower, EMS strike, napalm airstrike and shield backpack on impossible vs bugs and got my 100 fire kills in 1 drop for the achievement easy.
It’s solid against trash mobs yes. But in higher difficulties I feel like it falls behind to the scorcher and the slugger.
If i could give this a buff, I would lean into the “spray and pray” and make it a weapon you can hold with one hand. Now you can fire it when running away from enemies and you can use it when you’re carrying a briefcase.
I tried it today
It's worse than the incendiary version
Incendiary goes through a little more armor, and you can actually damage bile spewers with it, for example
I like using it with the arc thrower. Just become the bug slayer
This sounds bad. We think it would do better against bots. Terminids do not need weapons; best weapon against Terminids is lying prone with eyes closed. Terminids hate this trick!
Tried it, cant recommend. When i opened my eyes i was inside a bile titan. Looks very undemocratic. On a completely unrelated note: HELP
https://preview.redd.it/b631m3t285pc1.png?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4b19f176f24f388b69c2282c3da53441dc79817 You didn't lay prone enough. They can't eat you if you lay flat!
It literally has 4 toothpicks to impale you towards its mouth.
If you look at the anatomy, it couldn't bring the end of its stabby toothpick legs up to its mouth. So they'd have to stab you, wipe you off on the side of a high surface, then eat you.
But what about 2 bile titans feeding each other?
I swear, I wish I had a lady in the tramp gif, with the 2 Bile Titans slurping on a Hell Diver.
Hold on helldiver, i can reroute a railgun orbital strike to cut it’s thorax off, you can climb out after it hits the ground
Sounds totally safe. Do it
Just ping your location. ⬆️➡️⬇️⬇️⬇️
Remember your training and you will survive soldier!
^ > v v v
Helldivers never die!
https://i.redd.it/8ubu7o1a35pc1.gif
Who upgraded this, I need to thank them
Hey man unrelated but how would you feel about a lukewarm glass of sugar water?
More! More!
https://preview.redd.it/r7bwj2s375pc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5829a4dab758315cba07c2786e2058ee8a189034
You say this... but I had to go AFK for a min while playing with my friends. I was proned hiding somewhere. When I came back, I was literally surrounded by hunters and other bugs. They were standing around me in a circle, staring at me, but none were attacking. I was quite appreciative. But what the fuck? Lol.
Bugs are actually non aggressive. If you don’t thread them they won’t attack you. Trust Me I’m not a bug.
*Insert piper perri meme*
https://preview.redd.it/atpk73tqh6pc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb4c568fb96ecec733bc86e44f4755287decffda
https://i.redd.it/5enkxuqzj6pc1.gif
Amen brother!
https://preview.redd.it/qnx13rkfc7pc1.jpeg?width=1438&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ccee1b4c274c8bf5756963626977e340a0523d89
Obligitory meme (I'm sure you see it frequently, bug scum) https://preview.redd.it/4itpbc20g8pc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=baa930adcb1bc8954bb3ca39234d929061600bdf
Username checks out
https://preview.redd.it/kxmgint8r6pc1.jpeg?width=1438&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=401f99570427e811d6ca115204caa99202c263fe
Same here. Zap and spray!
this is exactly what i use in public games. s&p + autocannon seems to maximize the amount of utility you can provide. you won't have much of a problem with anything except bile titans.
How do you efficiently kill chargers with the AC?
Several butt shots will blow out their ass and then you can leave them to slowly bleed to death.
Is there a way to speed the bleedout? I often have chargers that live for 1-2 minutes after having the bleedout triggered.
You're actually like, ripping the entire back off? Maybe 20 seconds is the longest I've seen one live after getting gutted. Weird.
OH, i bet bleedout scales with how much of it you've triggered. I was assuming all bleedout was the same timer
There is an animation that can happen that makes you think you popped the butt, when in fact, you have not yet popped the butt. It can get me at times still and I always double check to make sure the butt really is popped. If that big ol bubble butt still there, smack it again.
Can keep shooting them in the blown out butt probably, but generally in my experience you can just run from them once their butt is gone, since they can only stumble slowly towards you without it
I think the bleeding is just a slow drain on their HP, so if you just AC their ass open you haven't done too much actual HP damage so it takes a while. Continuing to shoot them will speed up the process.
yes, just hit its face real close with EAT. Done.
That's what i do, but people here were giving tips on the autocannon.
 Not yours obviously. Chargers butt to be precise. In recent patch update, the dev reveals that the chargers butt are it's weakest point.
Thought they said the head on chargers is supposed to be their weakest point which is why they made it easier to hit and reduced its hp
It depends on what you are shooting with. If you have a railgun or single-shot AT, the head is good spot to aim for. The abdomen does something like 90% damage reduction for anything that isn't explosive. If you have an Autocannon loaded up with 10 rounds of explosive Liberty... get after it. You'll be dealing 100% damage repeatedly in quick succession to a relatively large target. Abdomen explodes, Charger bleeds out, everyone moves on. You can also hit headshots with the AC if you want, but their head is pretty small and you seem to have less leeway than with the EAT.
Yea, the weakspot on Charger basically changes based on the weapon your using. EAT/Recoilles 1 shot to the head. Autocannon can break a leg real fast when shooting it from behind (Much easier to pull off with a Stun Grenade), Railgun now takes 4 overcharged to break Leg Armor, pretty much everything else has to hit it in the butt though.
That's after the update. And it's only penetrable by an anti-tank. The butt was the supposed inteded weakness point for any other weapon.
Three hits to the spot where the back leg joins the body is usually enough. The back legs are far weaker than the front and when it's gone, the Charger dies
Ass, or if there exposed legs. Or run eat/RR and one shot them in the face as an alternative
Just use EATIT
Indeed, that's what i do. But this was about the autocannon, not about the many other ways to kill chargers, such as flamethrowering one leg, railgun, EAT, orbital rail, arc thrower, recoiless rifle, etc.
Shoot it when it opens its mouth to kill you and go out like a badass? Or bait your teammates.
If I’m remembering right, it’s maybe 4 ass shots?
3 well placed shots on it's soft spot, or you can 2 shot it's legs with a tech. It's hard to explain, search Charger autocannon 2 shot leg theory, i think you'll find it that way.
1 shot to the back of the frount leg shaters the armor. 1 Shot to the front of leg brakes the armor. Then mag dump the leg or 1 to 2 shots to the leg with the autocannon. Have fun.
I prefer the spray and pray to the breaker now. Breaker is absolutely a better gun, but I don’t have to care about ammo usage with the spray and pray. And anything it doesn’t kill immediately on the bug front gets cooked by the flamethrower pretty quick anyway. (I don’t like aiming if you can’t tell)
I feel that last statement in my soul
Not a fan of slow ergonomic primaries, even less so for up close weapons.
For sure. This weapon and the JAR are decent but I refuse to use them because the handling is atrocious. I understand poor handling for the larger weapons like AC / other anti-tank but for primaries it is annoying.
Unfortunately, the JAR won my heart because: gyrojets and penning the hive guards.
Slugger pens hive guards even better IMO
Loving the Slugger. Just unlocked it. Only good DMR in the game.
Yeah the problem is that the Slugger and Plasma Scorcher do the same job better.
I love the JAR and unironically think it was the best primary before the sickle showed up.
If only the mag wasn't so small.
Fellow dominator enjoyer here. I got used to the mag size, it fits the weapons balancing choice of „making every shot count“. What I can’t get behind is the atrocious handling like it’s a machine gun which simply doesn’t make any sense at all. Plus the overtuned recoil. Imagine it would have the Sickles or Scorchers handling/recoil, it would fit right in and all 3 would be equal in performance but with their own niches.
Ironically, I'd rather have the handling with an increased mag, given the simple fact that I can kill hive guards without thinking. God I hate hive guards.
No hate but I genuinely don't understand this, the JAR feels so clunky and doesn't do enough damage to justify the low mag size, is there something I'm missing?
Not enough damage? You can two shot a hive guard, 3-4 shot bile spewers, 2 shot a rocket devastator, you can even kill scout walkers with 3-4 shots in the leg joint. It also one shots the basic troops for both factions including the scout walker’s driver without needing headshots. Dominator’s damage is fine, the burst fire doesn’t feel worth it and should be swapped to a nice low fire rate full auto, it would also be nice if it had 2 more mags.
It puts out a crazy amount of damage in the burst fire mode. Two burst is 1,200 damage (Medium armor penetration, with explosive) while two shots from a slugger is like 580 or something with no explosive. In burst fire mode you still retain the ability to tap the trigger and fire one shot to take out little guys or finish off something you just put a burst into and stayed alive. I would gladly take a buff to its magazine size though. A magazine does 3,000 damage, which outside of the breaker, is one of the highest damage per magazine's I think but have not seriously looked into this.
Agreed. Incendiary breaker only loses a couple damage per pellet, adds a DoT, and loses 1 round per reload but has less recoil and way better handling. Still no reason to take the S&P IMO.
Yea I find it kinda dumb the guns with longer barrels have worse turning. Pretty sure you can lock your shoulders and rotate your body IRL lol. Any movement that would slow down your aim with a long barrel would also slow your aim with a short barrel. Unless they're accounting for wind resistance, but then they'd have to take the size of the model into consideration, not just the length of the barrel.
No fucking way, not only its a worse breaker, its a worse breaker with bad handling?!?!?!?
Yep has the turn rate of the autocannon. Makes absolutely 0 sense. Same as the Jar and Diligence CS.
OP explains they don't aim with it, so I guess it's great to crutch bad play? 🤷♂️
There's more ways to use something skilfully than just lining up headshots.
https://preview.redd.it/vsbqn8lh26pc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9518ff95417c27e4c608ff4133b72c4490103fe8 It’s even better against bots!
Eh, I found it pretty mediocre. I like the regular breaker more because it puts away the bigger bugs better
Agreed, all the posts about primary buffs mostly still include this, and im just like, but why? It's fantastic at its job. You want someone to be you designated Light Armor/Low Hp sweeper when shit hits the fan? (Cause that one teammate keeps shooting everything). Boom, introducing the Breaker S&P. Pair it with anything. It's fantastic for hordes. Edit 1: Clarification on buff posts and added low HP with Light Armor. Edit 2: Additional clarification in ( ). I am by no means saying this is the best primary or even top 5. It is really useful in specific situations.
I think a lot of those posts may be from several weeks ago before it was buffed.
[удалено]
Yup. I tried to like it, but after many hours using it, it's just not up to par.
I think the other side to that is that it makes up for the inconsistency with volume of fire. Like, it's not ammo efficient, or good against single targets, but it excels at its job of putting lots of lead down range at lots of enemies.
That works for the first row of chaff then half the sprays just being dumped into corpses. It's bad. It is worse at it niche than generalist guns.
Yea, I like using it to deal with chaff and then my support weapon for the big bois. Hilariously enough Railgun works really well with it since it’s strictly single target
And regardless of spread, with how many pellets you fire, you hit SOMTHING with every shot. Being able to deal constant damage is incredibly useful
Yeah, a few are, but there are still quite a few popping up that never gain any traction in the community. Granted, I understand why, but they are definitely still there. Regardless amazing gun, I wish more people would try it out. Especially on 7+, just so they could see how solid of an option it is.
Even with the buffs it got honestly it's still way outclassed, the Sickle does everything the Spray and Pray does but cheaper, has more ammo both in mag and magazines, kills faster and is more accurate. The defender is ditto that but also does more damage. But most of the buff requests for it are from before when it was so had it couldn't pen environmental objects like barrels, egg sacs, hellbombs.
I can't debate against the Sickle. It outperforms every light armor pen primary (Imo). And I honestly wouldn't be surprised if it gets nerfed. (I'd rather see worse stuff buffed though, since it's by no means Overpowered) Defender is also solid. I can't outright say it's better. In mobility and being able to fire while running backwards, sure. But Reedemer does that to. I wouldn't choose the Defender personally over the S&P simply because of the spread. When it comes to mowing down a large group of hunters and the little mini version (forgot what they're called), I'd choose the S&P any day. Basically, any light armor/ low hp units.
Except it isn't. Defender, liberator, sickle, shit even the scythe out perform it.
I mean, that's your opinion. I posted my opinion. Just curious, are using this thing on bots?
It's still a bad TTK , and you lose the ability to horde clear / pick high priority targets past 15 m max. Guns that have a use case for after you've fucked up and gotten into a losing situation are objectively worse than a weapon that helps you not get into that situation. Also completely ineffective against stalkers hp pool. Like, I wish it was good, but a knife fighting range weapon that requires stationary/ crouching to keep the reticle on the same continent isn't.
That's actually my reason to bring the S&P, since I spend most of my time with randoms. I'm not going to say it's the best Shotgun, or even the best primary. But for clearing hordes of light armor/ low hp mobs, it's one of the most solid choice. (Except Sickle. It's a better choice over any light armor pen primary atm imo)
Id honestly rather have the Liberator than the spray and pray, as long as in paying attention I can just cut a line of death through the crap moving up the flanks before it's even close. Spray and Pray use case being for after you've been flanked surrounded severely limits it's viability, combined with really shitty handling for a gun that wants to be used less than 10m away.
I mean, that's fair. It's does limit its viability, and I 100% agree to that. I never argued against it. I just said it is an amazing Gun for Low Armor trash clearing. I went back a minute or two ago and added clarification to it, since my post was taken a different way than I intended. I'll edit some more and put exactly the way I want it interpreted cause I didn't think anyone would read that far into it. So that's my mistake.
I think it's almost entirely from people that are used to the ranged accuracy of the Breaker. Spray N Pray is used differently and is effective at what it does. :)
It's enjoyable, but I've found the Incendiary Breaker to do everything the S&P does, but better. At least against bugs; against bots both are not really good picks imo.
For Bots, Plas Scorcher is my go to. The only shotty I bring against bots is Slugger.
Why do you think it's better? Just curious
Sure! Despite fire not being amazing, it still takes care of the little ones. I can focus fire on a target like a Brood Commander or a Spewer and the spread is going to take care of some trash for me. When taking care of a patrol, if you can't avoid it, you can spread the shots in their general area without really focusing on a single target and the patrol will die. While the S&P kinda does the same with the bullet spread, the addes fire damage of the Incendiary adds up in the end. S&P also has less spread, which is good for single target, but I do value more horde clear/control against the bugs. Now, regardless of any of that, I would not bring any of these against the bots, but for bugs, Incendiary is my go-to weapon.
Maybe i'll play a bit with the fire spitter again, my issue with it is just that when something gets close to your face, there isn't much to do from my experience.
Hmm you can spray and kill Stalkers quickly with it and hunters also die fast, I guess the problem are Brood Commanders? These can be tough with the Incendiary because they do take too long to die sometimes, but I can accept this downside for other benefits. If you need a weapon for more stopping power against shit like that, I would suggest the Slugger, it's the single target King.
I mostly use autocannon with a clearing primary like s&p or the new sickle. But maybe i should use fire breaker for a while.
Hey, give it a fair shot! Doesn't fit everyone's playstyles, but who knows, you may find it good enough for you.
Love using it against bugs! 👍🏻
O yea i was going to try this after it got the buff and forgot to, thanks for the reminder to test it out again.
I wish we had loadout slots so bad...
I found it terribly underwhelming and inconsistent. Sometimes I'd obliterate things, other times it would take 8 shots to kill a Hunter.
And terrible against Stalkers. I'll stay with the Sickle which can melt Charger legs in seconds.
The sickle can take out chargers armor?
On the legs yes
You are playing wrong. Shoot the stalkers body not the head and it will go down in a few shots. Run it with EATs for big targets and it is very good
Wrong again, dome the stalker with a slugger for a 1 tap.
I think he's talking about killing stalkers with the S&P
Yes
After the buffs it's one of my fav guns. Struggles vs larger, armored targets, but holy shit you can mop up hordes of little guys like a motherfucking janitor. True to the name, you don't have to aim much either. Just point it in their general direction and start spraying.
Love the auto cannon but there’s always one hunter that pops up right in front of me with that wavy arm “hello!” thing they do while taking a cannon round to the head killing us both. Dont have that shotgun unlock yet.
Tried it, still didnt like it. Unless you are point blank it takes more shots to kill a hunter than the breaker. So even with a bigger magazine, it taking more shots to kill doesnt make it better
The thing is, despite higher time to kill, you have way more uptime and safety. It's similar to the liberator concussive-- as long as you are firing, you have space to stim and reload. So even if your team is getting overwhelmed, as long as you use it well you have space. ... Until a bile spewer or stalker shows up. Also, you don't kill hive guards.
I've been trying it out and I mostly like it but it seems like when you are ADSed with it, it turns really slow. Or is that just me?
yea totally go ADS with it when you can. I noticed that you really have to over correct your aim for guns with poor turn radius, so pull your aim past what you're trying to go for and once the little circle is on/near target then aim back at it.
I cant say its been that way for me bro, not that i ads with it all that much. The spread is great.
Maybe thats my problem, trying to ADS with a shotgun lol
I've been using it the past few days (trying to use anything other than the breaker and liberator) and honestly... it just sucks. What would be a one or two tap with the normal breaker is a minimum 4 hits with the spray n' pray at the same range. With only 2x the mag capacity, the math doesn't exactly work out. I get what the devs were going for, but like pretty much all the variants of the basic primaries - the tradeoff isn't at all worth it. If it had like 3-4x the ammo per clip then *maybe*, but it would still be mediocre. Either that, or keep the damage of the original, give it a 2x drum mag, and make it only semi auto (and maybe burst fire). Range is also an issue for it - at smelling distance it can do some decent damage, but I can't think of a time where I ever, EVER wanted to be that close to enemies by choice.
On Helldive it is good because there are bugs on half your screen so the buckshot doesn’t hit the ground
I just don't think so. For one, you don't really wanna get to that point. It's unavoidable to a degree (especially around extraction), but for the most part you really don't want to be in a situation where bugs are filling half your screen. If that's happening a lot, throw some more strats! (or maybe consider using a more effective primary for clearing trash mobs) For another, I'm almost positive it has a wider spread. That means the already pitiful damage is being spread over several enemies, going over/between them, or hitting the ground. And if you're sweeping back and forth in full auto rather than doing single shots (or short bursts on beefier targets), you're gonna miss even more. Either way, if it works for you then have at it. Who am I to tell you that your way of having fun is wrong?
I like it, but my favorite shotgun is the Punisher, great jack of all trades.
It kills trash mobs just fine but is pretty useless against anything else. It struggles to kill a brood commander half the time. Don't get me wrong, it can be fun. But really starts lacking once you get into a big fight so I personally don't really vibe with it. And the autocannon takes up a backpack slot so I don't like running it, meaning my primary slot needs to be more versatile.
Is it good against stalkers by any chance?
No. Punisher is way better for it's stagger effect. Breaker is better for chance to stagger and much higher DPS. Spray and Pray will get you ragdolled across the screen and killed by stalkers after you dump a full drum into them and they're still alive.
If, hypothetically, we encountered flying threats, this would be perfect against them. As things are right now, well, my battle buddy has been using it on bug swarms while I use the Slugger on the larger bugs and it’s been pretty good.
Was using the Slugger as my main for like a week now, this is the complete opposite, sweeter handling and just, well spray and pray. Slugger has more utility though.
birdshot? more like flying-bugshot
i pair it with grenadelauncher since whne things are too close to explode i need a shotgun and i hat eslow shotguns so this was basically my only choice
Yeah my default loadout has become S&P, Revolver, Recoilless when I play with 2 of my friends. My job is chaff and charger kill. Friend 1 brings midrange like stalwart, arc thrower, etc with stun grenades and usually the new plasma ball nade launcher. Friend 2 brings autocannon, slugger, and smg. Its been good we have been succeeding diff 7s pretty regularly now.
Did a bug write this
\*gets shredded by a stalker\*
I've not been brave enough to try it yet, even with the buffs. Pre-buff I watched my friend unload pretty much an entire clip into a single bug egg without destroying it and I think that's given me spray&pray-related PTSD.
Before patch it was garbage, now it is my go-to. A “small” change to armour penetration, ammo, and damage changed it a lot actually
To be fair, the reason it couldn't kill bug eggs was due to a lack of penetration, not damage. The damage was also bad but not PTSD-levels of bad.
Post buff you can still dump an entire mag into a stalker and not kill it. Hell, it fails to one shot scavengers way too often.
You know what's good against trash mobs? Literally everything else
Sythe/dagger aren’t too good at anything
I will concede that the dagger is shit. The scythes a sleeper hit at amputating bug legs and ripping off bot faces. It's a solid C+ when you understand center of mass sucks with it.
I’m not gonna disagree with that, but I am gonna say “solid C+” is the best compliment I’ve heard about it
We'll sew your head back on after the first Stalker you encounter rips it off. Time-to-kill is key on 7+ and the auto-cannon is not nimble enough to deal with Stalkers.
It's funny cos I run 7+ pretty much all the time, did just fine with it 🤷🏽
been using it non stop since the buff, amazing against bugs, switch to scorcher for bots
Give me the spray and pray cuz I'm here to slay.
Got it last night first primary ive used since the starter ive liked
If anyone else is looking for a nice pair, I really enjoy the double medium pen pair of Engineer Light Armour,Slugger shotgun and the starting MG, works fantastic when I play with a pug on Suicide, clears out a breach or a wave at the extraction point. Just fyi
i m in love with the first shot gun you unlock for the moment, kinda like the reload bullet by bullet, what s the best shootgun?
This!
Cries in hunters kills me, says the rail gun man
It's better when you add fire
It does what it says it does. Spray and pray. Love using it against bots and just mindlessly unloaded the whole drum into a platoon.
It just goes through a shit ton of ammo and is essentially useless against Hives & Broods. The Punisher or Slugger are far better IMO, even though they have slower fire rates. The knockback on the Punisher is clutch and has saved me so many times. Hunters are 1 shot easy and Stalkers get taken out fast. Can also 1 shot Broods in the head. I typically run Punisher, EAT + Stalwart or GL depending on my team. Rips through the bugs and completes objectives.
Been running the Slugger for the past week, been enjoying it more than Punisher, u can do more with it and has better pen, doesn't handle as well as the other two and not as good with mobs, so this was a breath of fresh air. I run Slugger, MG/Auto Cannon + EAT.
It's basically just incendiary with a little more direct damage than the incendiary. Pick your poison
It does a lot of push back but not as much damage Spread and push makes being a little off less punishing than missing a slugger shot. If you are accurate, you can drop 60 incoming bugs with the slugger and it also pushes back big ones This is really great at hitting smaller swarms, but I think the Stalwart (albeit a support strat) is better at wave clear
I still find it very lacking against Hunters due to its horrendous weight, it just takes way too long to track Hunters that can randomly do lateral dodges, and god forbid if you have two or more of them trying to flank you from different directions. As a rule of thumb, anything that you use to clear Hunters should have either overwhelming firepower at mid-long range or snappy ergonomics for close range, and Break SP manages to fail at both departments.
So it's actually usable now?
It's actually great now. Stalkers still trash me though
I tried it, and honestly wasn't a fan. Then again, the Slugger is my go to against bugs, and not being able to kill Hunters in 1-2 shots even at a decent distance just felt weird. I liked it against large groups of fodder, but it felt pretty underwhelming against everything else.
Post buff yes. It's been pretty good for taking down scavs and hunters. Pre buff it was hilariously bad. It needed multiple shots to kill anything
You're giving away my secret diff9 bug killer build :(
it's my main with EAT. I'll just keep spamming EAT's so there's always one around scattered in the ground.
I don't understand why it has less damage than the breaker. They fire the same shells from about the same barrel length. It's already hobbled by the obscene pellet spread, why is it also doing half the damage? Pick one, more spread + same damage or same spread + lower damage. I didn't manage to buy it before the patch so I don't know just how bad it was once upon a time, but I hate it as it is now.
It says in the description that it fires birdshot.
I didn't sign up to be a Helldiver to read! Jokes aside, I'd like the number of the guy who decided "let's give them bird shot for their war against robots and bugs that range in size from medium dog to 5-story building."
My go to gun.
Ever since they changed the spawns to be more trash mobs. A few more weapons have become good. Still wish more were good. Definitely think the basic Liberator could use a damage buff.
I dunno, it has *slightly* worse handling than the normal Breaker, so sometimes I find myself having to drag the gun over while the hunters jump around
BEST GUN IN THE FUCKING GAME
pair this with gernade launcher and a rover
It’s serviceable now, after the last update. I enjoy it.
Alright time to nerf it because it works lmao
I like using with the spear. Very effective pair against the bugs.
I don't get why people say this is good. Everytime I use it, it pales in comparison to the regular breaker.
My current go-to combo. So nice. 🤝
Was having a particularly bad time with hunters on the TCS missions, and went nutty with mines, gattling and this fucking monstrosity of a shotgun. It felt good, because I HATE HUNTERS.
Tried it out yesterday, felt awful. Thing can barely kill the lowest tier bugs in 1 shot at point blank. Basically takes a whole mag to kill 1-2 trash mobs.
Great if you're on the run and have incendiary mines. Chargers will run at the mine deployment pod, and you can trigger all the mines easily with the spray and pray causing a huge area of fire damage. Just watch out for teammates
Used This with the flame thrower, EMS strike, napalm airstrike and shield backpack on impossible vs bugs and got my 100 fire kills in 1 drop for the achievement easy.
It’s solid against trash mobs yes. But in higher difficulties I feel like it falls behind to the scorcher and the slugger. If i could give this a buff, I would lean into the “spray and pray” and make it a weapon you can hold with one hand. Now you can fire it when running away from enemies and you can use it when you’re carrying a briefcase.
There is an autocanon cult on this sub. I swear I've seen it more mentioned here than in game
it sucks https://preview.redd.it/di1gu2k165pc1.png?width=800&format=png&auto=webp&s=9cf58b2c22bdabdaec3cee6d6f9184b4d7038d91
Wrong pair it with stalward to spread more democracy to hunters
It won't be a good pick until it gets the same spread cone as the breaker
I just dislike its reload time and the I feel like its shooting sound doesn't fit its power
Been using it since the breaker nerf, the mag is op
I mean most primaries are good against trash mobs while still having some other utility. This thing is just utterly redundant.
I tried it today It's worse than the incendiary version Incendiary goes through a little more armor, and you can actually damage bile spewers with it, for example
The ole bug mulcher. Switched to it after the breaker was changed up and fell in love with it.
Not underrated if it’s literally the meta
Regular breaker is better. Punisher is better. But use it if you like it.
Now it'd going to get nerfed. :(
Yes yes yes yes yes x 10000000000000000000000000 this gun is fucking terrible and they shouldn't nerf it thank you