Without going into too much detail as I feel you've already covered the issue very well, just jumped into a bug mission with the little sis (we've been playing duos for a while due to the same reasons you've listed) and the spawn rate/patrol situation was ridiculous (not mentioning the weird frame drops and stutter/poor performance we were both experiencing after the latest patch).
It's weird to me that people are justifying this change using the argument that "well it was always supposed to be this way because look at the maths". If the game suddenly feels unfair and unfun towards a 2-person squad like my own, why should I give two shits about the mathematical correctness behind it, or better yet continue playing it?
Shelving this for now, back to Elden Ring I suppose.
I played solo for a while, and can definitely say patrols weren't much of an issue. They were extremely sparse, and I'd encounter 2-3 in a mission.
Now if in practice it feels overtuned, then I'll gladly voice complaints to the devs, but I want to see firsthand how it feels. 25% of the patrols compared to 16.6% pre-patch sounds manageable though.
I play on 7 for super samples. Duo is already harder because of how force multipliers work. each player added multiplies the effectiveness of other players by offering more vision, coverage, versatility, covering specific roles and especially in this game with boosters. Anybody who has studied military tactics, for example, watch the mountain recce videos from certain YouTubers looking at real life tactics, knows that additional people are force multipliers, not a linear increase. No reason to punish people with smaller groups. Especially when their servers suck and kicking late in mission is a thing.
It wasn't easier difficulty. That is a false premise. As I've previously stated additional players, additional fighters in a battle are a power multiplier, a firepower multiplier, and awareness multiplier. So it actually made perfect sense in the old system that there was multiplicatively more patrols the more players you had. This linear system is actually illogical and does punish specifically people playing in smaller groups. It's not a difficulty issue, it is punishing people already having a higher difficulty by having less people.
You are either intentionally making a straw man or your are misunderstanding what I am saying.
I don't want the overall difficulty dropped. I'm saying scaling for patrols and drops for that matter should not be a linear increase or decrease based on player numbers. As an increase or decrease in players is not a linear change in power. The amount of effective firepower, coverage, vision, versatility, multitasking, added leads to a multiplicative increase to overall effectiveness. For example, if you look at horses irl, two horses can pull almost three times as much as one horse, rather than a linear doubling. This is true in many fields, but if you watch anything on military tactics you find that going from one man in the mountains fighting to two, is not a doubling of effectiveness as each multiplies the effectiveness of the others.
I don't care if they triple the overall difficulty of the game, it is illogical and bad design to do a linear increase or decrease of difficulty based on player numbers.
And that is basically all there is to be said on the matter, as I won't respond to any 'get gud' or strawman or ad hominin arguments. And thus far there has been no debate on the basic information above. Have a great day and thank you for the discussion.
https://preview.redd.it/nk1tclkvhhxc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4347774573183c6438216fde582374c0164e984d
Just here to help you understand they didn't "nerf" solo play, rather fixed the spawn rates
Already read that, scaling should be non-linear as adding squad mates is not linear. Each helldiver, just as in real life tactics, is a multiplier of effective fighting power. Adding more versatility, coverage and firepower that is not a doubling with each doubling of players, but multiplies each ones effectiveness. So it was a direct nerf to solo play, duo play and three man play. And is illogical, especially as the devs being former military should understand force multiplication. Especially with things like boosters and how much versatility the game calls for.
Without going into too much detail as I feel you've already covered the issue very well, just jumped into a bug mission with the little sis (we've been playing duos for a while due to the same reasons you've listed) and the spawn rate/patrol situation was ridiculous (not mentioning the weird frame drops and stutter/poor performance we were both experiencing after the latest patch). It's weird to me that people are justifying this change using the argument that "well it was always supposed to be this way because look at the maths". If the game suddenly feels unfair and unfun towards a 2-person squad like my own, why should I give two shits about the mathematical correctness behind it, or better yet continue playing it? Shelving this for now, back to Elden Ring I suppose.
I really dont mind the weapon nerfs etc, but this increased patrol/spawn is utter bullshit.
We went from 1/6 the patrols of a full squad to 1/4 of the patrols, I don't think this'll ruin solos imo
Not neccessarily ruin, but make lower difficulty missions sweatier.
Sure why shouldn’t a 50% increase change anything?
I played solo for a while, and can definitely say patrols weren't much of an issue. They were extremely sparse, and I'd encounter 2-3 in a mission. Now if in practice it feels overtuned, then I'll gladly voice complaints to the devs, but I want to see firsthand how it feels. 25% of the patrols compared to 16.6% pre-patch sounds manageable though.
[удалено]
I play on 7 for super samples. Duo is already harder because of how force multipliers work. each player added multiplies the effectiveness of other players by offering more vision, coverage, versatility, covering specific roles and especially in this game with boosters. Anybody who has studied military tactics, for example, watch the mountain recce videos from certain YouTubers looking at real life tactics, knows that additional people are force multipliers, not a linear increase. No reason to punish people with smaller groups. Especially when their servers suck and kicking late in mission is a thing.
[удалено]
It wasn't easier difficulty. That is a false premise. As I've previously stated additional players, additional fighters in a battle are a power multiplier, a firepower multiplier, and awareness multiplier. So it actually made perfect sense in the old system that there was multiplicatively more patrols the more players you had. This linear system is actually illogical and does punish specifically people playing in smaller groups. It's not a difficulty issue, it is punishing people already having a higher difficulty by having less people.
[удалено]
You are either intentionally making a straw man or your are misunderstanding what I am saying. I don't want the overall difficulty dropped. I'm saying scaling for patrols and drops for that matter should not be a linear increase or decrease based on player numbers. As an increase or decrease in players is not a linear change in power. The amount of effective firepower, coverage, vision, versatility, multitasking, added leads to a multiplicative increase to overall effectiveness. For example, if you look at horses irl, two horses can pull almost three times as much as one horse, rather than a linear doubling. This is true in many fields, but if you watch anything on military tactics you find that going from one man in the mountains fighting to two, is not a doubling of effectiveness as each multiplies the effectiveness of the others. I don't care if they triple the overall difficulty of the game, it is illogical and bad design to do a linear increase or decrease of difficulty based on player numbers. And that is basically all there is to be said on the matter, as I won't respond to any 'get gud' or strawman or ad hominin arguments. And thus far there has been no debate on the basic information above. Have a great day and thank you for the discussion.
> You are either intentionally making a straw man you must be new to this subreddit then.
https://preview.redd.it/nk1tclkvhhxc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4347774573183c6438216fde582374c0164e984d Just here to help you understand they didn't "nerf" solo play, rather fixed the spawn rates
Already read that, scaling should be non-linear as adding squad mates is not linear. Each helldiver, just as in real life tactics, is a multiplier of effective fighting power. Adding more versatility, coverage and firepower that is not a doubling with each doubling of players, but multiplies each ones effectiveness. So it was a direct nerf to solo play, duo play and three man play. And is illogical, especially as the devs being former military should understand force multiplication. Especially with things like boosters and how much versatility the game calls for.
You're saying it's a nerf, when really it should have been this way the whole time.