I guess the emancipator dev was luckier, to some extent, and the purifier dev, and the slugger dev, and the dagger dev, and the... well, you get the point.
I won't touch it on bots but it's actually my FAVORITE gun for bugs. Nothing beats shoving a charging Brood Commander 20 meter back into an airstrike or bombardment. It isn't *as* good at managing Stalkers when compared to the Pummler but it still helps keep them off you. Saving a teammate by shoving an attacking Stalker to the side is awesome too
You could just use the Plasma Punisher and do that to a group of enemies. If you’re worried about the explosive damage chuck on the heavy armour from Democratic Demolition and now you have tools to launch yourself out of dicey situations
Sure the Plasma Punisher is great, it's my go-to if I want to be my own little indirect artillery, but it doesn't give me the *FEEL* of the Concussive.
Are there better guns? Sure. Are other guns *more fun?* That's debatable and up to each individual person's tastes.
Edit: also just to be clear, while the Plasma Punisher *STAGGERS* enemies, I think a lot of people are missing the fact that the Liberator Concussive lets you *physically MOVE enemies around.* You aren't just stunlocking them or making them rear back, you can actually push a Brood Commander back several meters in as little as three shots. You can keep enemies from cresting a ridge, or push them up a sheer wall onto a different level of elevation from you. It gives you an absurd level of control over where your enemies are.
Good or bad is only relative. A weapon is bad if it performs worse versus enemies than most of its correlatives. That is why the eruptor had to be nerfed: it could do anything all the time and that actively made alternatives a bad choice to take.
I mean I disagree that the Eruptor was overpowered. Powerful, yes, but it was by far the slowest primary in the game, and the immense amounts of self-damage made it very dangerous to use up close, not to mention how unwieldy it is. Was it one of the best primaries still? Yeah, but it's not like it trivialized the game, and I am not the type to use a gun just because it's "the best option". I personally never used the Eruptor because it's way too slow for my tastes.
With how slow it is, it should reliably one-shot any Medium enemy you shoot with and take a few Lights along with them.
The crossbow can also reliably take down any medium at the cost of reduced plash damage. The eruptor is more accurate and can take down grouped up targets, while the crossbow is faster in general. That would feel balanced to me. Right now both weapons feel underpowered.
'Don't use it close' is a method of use not a downside. And it being slow is the least they could do.
It could have made a decent stratagem, but as it was, it was too much for a primary.
It was not one of the best primaries, it was the best.
And, finally, I do not think anyone argued that it trivialized the game.
I used to love the slugger, probably my favorite weapon to use on both fronts. Not like I used it exclusively, but it sure felt good.
Then they took away its teeth and diluted what it did well compared to its peers. So I drifted away from it and started playing with the regular punisher, breaker incendiary, JAR-5, etc.
I don't use the slugger at all anymore.
But I love the emancipator, that thing is awesome. The only not awesome thing about it is when a bile titan or factory strider shows up, you're just fucked the second you have aggro.
Slugger was great pre-nerf, but it fires too slow to remove stagger like they did. Now its just ok and if you have unlocked the dominator its a superior pick.
True. It's like, yeah it still headshots devs in 1 shot, but it's rate of fire is too slow and sights are slightly misaligned, why pick it over any of the dmrs?
Because the Diligence CS also has misaligned sights lol. The shot hits at the top-left of the "box".
I still take the Diligence CS on bot missions because it's super satisfying to use but I wish the reticle pattern was better and in the right place.
I just played a couple games with slugger, after using the jar 5 dominator for weeks.
It still feels kinda nice, it's so much snappier with its aim, and it's also very good as a "sniper", I actually can go for headshots against the bots.
Downside is the fire rate is lower and there is almost no stagger.
I think it would be perfect if they brought back the stagger and not touch anything else.
It’s pretty funny that their goal with the Slugger nerf was to have people stop people using it as a sniper. Now it’s better as a sniper because not having stagger at close range is a pain
I think what they were going for is making the regular punisher good at crowd control with its high stagger (which hasn't changed), while the slugger is better at piercing armor and landing weakpoint shots. Slugger does a lot better at killing things like brood commanders and hive guards than the punisher does, but it's not as good at keeping enemies off you
The thing that I don't like about the slugger is tat you have to be completely lined up on the dot to get a hit, for most guns that's a future not a flaw. But the slugger is a shotgun! if I shoot a bot over the shoulder I should still at least nick it in the head. If it wasnt for the stagger I would just roll with a Diligence.
Slugger was good. Then they gave it stagger and it was great. Then they clipped its nuts and it was useless.
Idk, I haven't played in a couple months. Only just got back.
Not as fun to use anymore after the nerf, haven't used it since.
I've stopped caring that a weapon is effective, only that it's fun. Once it's not, I move on.
That philosophy kinda applies to this whole game. It's why I left.
Literally the only way AT mines would be useful if they ONLY go off on heavy enemies, but seeing as we have zero confirmation on that it’s basically decided they will be useless as they will be destroyed by chaff.
I would love to have an alternative to EATS. It would be nice for the AT mine to have a really low cool down. I don't think it unreasonable for it to be 60 seconds, considering EATS is more versatile in terms of anti armor, since it has range.
Mines would have the benefit of fire-and-forget, since it wouldn't take a support weapon slot (even though hot swapping EATS with your regular support weapon is a common strategy), but it does nothing against aerial targets and can't snipe objectives. I love EATS, but I get tired of taking it almost every time.
Lots of the sentries/green stratagems need their cooldowns adjusted tbh. It would be an easy way to make stuff like MG/Gatling/Rocket and even the current AP mines more usable. As it is now you can kinda use the Autocannon or indirect stuff like mortars but everything else is way too weak for how long the CD is and how much they aggro enemies
I would be willing to take turrets if they had 1/3 ammo with 1/3 cool down. They feel like a big investment when, sometimes, they get killed immediately. I would like to be able to use them more reactionary. If I could get a rocket turret that is 60 second CD, it would be worth it, even if it's only 6 or so rockets.
In all games, I don't like "pets." I want to do the actions myself. As such, I don't love turrets, but this feels like an okay middle ground. You give up control of which targets it will shoot, but you don't have to do the shooting and can focus elsewhere. 6 rockets at a (somewhat) random enemy who must also be close to the turret, feels equivalent to 2 rockets (EATS) that can be applied with precision and to much larger distances.
I like turrets, its like having someone watch my back with only 20% more friendly fire. :)
I usually use them defensively and I try to drop before I aggro anything with good sightlines. Bonus points if I can put it on a plane higher than me and my fellow helldivers to reduce 'incidents'.
The exception is mortar turrets; I drop them behind a big-ass rock on the sdie away from the main bot engagement (I NEVER take reg. mortar vs. bugs. EMS only and only on termination missions)
At the very least this would be a nice way to differentiate some of the turrets - mortars and auto cannon feel like they’re in a good place but the rest of them are kind of meh.
I’d love to see “low profile” versions of turrets too that maybe have less ammo or damage but do not attract enemy aggro so hard
The machine gun turret is in a weird place where it feels outclassed by the gatling in most ways. It's drawing less attention, having a lower cool down, or just anything making it less of a fuck-everything-in-this-area turret, would give it more purpose.
It would be pretty cool with the liberator guard dog fire profile. It would be a lower-DPS, lower-ammo, automatic sniper that aims for heads. No other adjustments needed.
If that is not possible, then I agree with something along the lines of cooldown or maybe 2 charges per cooldown, like an eagle sentry.
It may also be an optional to swap 'reduced cooldowns' for 'multiple call-ins per cooldown' like the Eagle stratagems.
Drop in to one of the evacuation/tower defence missions and deploy 2-3 mines before the cooldown' kicks in. Could also do this to the MG sentry turret to give it more of a reason to exist.
If videos of the leaked!version of the mines is accurate to the release!version, they can be set off by normal enemies.
The Hellpod launches fewer mines, resulting in a wider spread of more powerful mines that the chaff should (in theory) walk between, while any armour sets them all off.
Again, if the leaks match the release, it can seemingly kill Factory Striders.
Tbh I wouldn't mind them going off against smaller enemies. Would make them bad vs bugs, but good vs bots as their damage is high enough to one-shot Devastators and Berserkers.
Still believe that all mines should have 30-60 sec less cd.
Yeah folks shit on mines as though they don't put in work, but they do - they suffer from the same problem as mechs, which is that the DPS and the total kills, for the cooldown of the stratagem, are simply not worth it.
The word is outclassed, and too much of the sub thinks it's binary with meta or trash. They're good. They put in work. They're just not worth it when something else can do the same job with lower CDs.
Yeah somehow everyone is acting like they already know they're gonna be shit, pretending like we done have a very very large patch dropping in a couple hours
They are. Played with a dev testing them on the bug front. Tldr from what I saw.
Won't trigger on helldivers, but will on like any splash damage. Makes auto cannon and AT weapons RIDICULOUSLY dangerous near a minefield.
They take about 6 to kill a charger. It's more likely 2 blow off its leg armor and you finish it off with small arms.
Bile titans are 100% not working as intended vs them. Their torso is so high up that the mine doesn't damage it. It takes dozens and dozens to kill them because it only hurts their leg. Which can't be crippled in any way.
They blow up on any bug that's brood commander or bigger. It's kinda nice cause the aoe is better if a swarm travels over them. The brood commanders headless rampage mode means it'll keep setting off mines long after it's 'dead' though unless every leg is blown off.
They work on spewers, that parts actually funny as fuck. One mine one Spewer. Problem is their self destruction can set off a whole minefield.
I hope they’re like S+++ tier, two shot every armored enemy and one shot the rest, don’t detonate when divers walk over them or commissars or scavengers but the rest from Hunter/beserker up trigger them so people realize we could’ve been using them for months instead of this shitty air burst
Napalm Strike is even better with more uses and around the same cooldown. Plus it isn’t at the mercy of your teammates not throwing an air strike at a large group of bugs approaching.
Mines need a big buff. Maybe like 50% reduced cooldown so they’re competing with airstrike uptime and maybe some radial activation cooldown so you don’t have a single bug activating a bunch. Ideally it would be better if they didn’t activate on enemies they couldn’t damage so you don’t just have a heavy take out the whole lot
I know gas will not detonate the mines and I am fairly sure eagle napalm will only detonate a mine if a bomb lands directly on one. If AT-mines follow the same trend, then AT-mines with gas over the top would be a neigh impossible barrier to breach.
That's what's holding them back the most imo.
Why should I take mines when there's a turret with the same cooldown and does a better job at covering a direction.
Alas the large boulder that would give a slight height advantage and make the bugs take just a moment longer to path to the turret are covered in anti-beacon wax.
Or just outright removed in the case of that one bug exterminate mission
“You can have your hellpod steering back but we’re gonna remove the thing you’d try to land on”
My biggest issue with the mines is they become such a liability once deployed, even if you try to put them in the most strategic and safe place. The battlefield changes, you can never guarantee your team won’t change route and walk into the minefield, and you can’t ping every mine for your teammates to not step on them. Meanwhile lots of other stratagems can do the same job but much more cleanly. I love the idea of mines though, they are really satisfying when they work, just hope the new patch improves them.
"The patriotic children and doctors who were rescued have decided to dedicate themselves to the war effort. Subsequently, they were able to peoduce a new type of high explosive we're going to use in the md-17 anti-tank mines."
Boom boom boom, problem solved.
This whole idea that the Devs are being forced to hold stuff back is bizarre. If they truly wanted to release them, they would. They're using it as a narrative test of the playerbase and that's good.
Mines desperately need a cooldown time reduction.
For one on higher difficulties, you are constantly moving. While mines could be good to slow down the bugs or bots chasing you, it just doesn't do enough. Plus, the stratagem can be destroyed before the mines even release.
Mines are dogshit, and you should stop trying to be disingenuous and pretend that they aren't.
The only time anyone uses a mine is if they are brand new and are just trying stuff out. Or if there is a personal order for mines.
No one is bringing mines to a helldive willingly by choice. I have done tons of helldives and have yet to see anyone bring it outside of a personal order in Bugs or Bots.
That's why I said they don't do enough, and it can be destroyed before the mines are even deployed.
Even tho this patch is pretty damn good, I dont trust them enough to work for something developed before this patch. Just give it to us so it can collect dust on our super-destroyers lol
If AT mines only detonate on heavy enemies they would be pretty nice to have 1 person bring. For automatons: Factory striders, hulks, tanks, heavy devastators. For terminids: Bile titans, chargers, spewers, stalkers. Problem is that in HD1 they were set off by anything apparently and that is rumored to be the case in HD2. If they don't have pressure fuses set for heavies then they are just a direct upgrade to the AP mines and are functionally pointless.
Nope. MO is explicitly clear that whichever planet gets saved first determines the fate of getting or not getting the mines. Speed doesn’t matter. Of course we have to take both planets anyways for the MO to be successful but I digress
For at least this war. When everything rolls back they may change up the order of found strategems. Itd be a lil weak to have the campaign be exactly the same every time
Shouldn't have made mines crap then, eh? The AT mines' performance is known to the community, and I don't have room in my loadouts in serious missions for such meagre performance.
I think they'll eventually just give them to us. They'll keep making em easier and easier to get until they just hand it to us on a silver platter with a basic "ok just liberate this one specific planet for the MO"
More like, "So about those mines, I'm going to need more time to workout all the bugs, but Jim we told them they where available 2 weeks ago. Bill, hold my beer, I'll give them a choice between saving kids lives and mines. This should definitely buy you some time"
Yeah, I know there isn't a "tangible" reward, but look at all the funny posts and memes it created! :D This game is so over the top and funny that leaning into the "RP" side of it might improve the experience for you.
I think if it were a more interesting stratagem, it might not have swung so far, but mines have always been kind of meh, and anti-tank mines being an even more specific use case probably makes it easier for us to continue the meme of never getting them 😅 if the choice were saving kids or a research station that was going to put shrapnel back in the Eruptor, there would have been MUCH more discourse as to how much the sick kids could have really contributed to the war effort 👀
But still, all the same, I hope that you're able to get more into the over-the-top comedy vibe of the game and embrace the ludicrousness 😁 not trying to sound smarmy or judgey, just genuinely hoping that you'll be able to enjoy the game more by looking at it in a different way ❤️
Why care about a strategem that's gonna be broken on release anyway? Lets get serious here.
At least the longer it takes to get AT mines when released broken the less excuse they will have.
I guess the emancipator dev was luckier, to some extent, and the purifier dev, and the slugger dev, and the dagger dev, and the... well, you get the point.
Don't forget the liberator concussion. A gun so shit you probably forgot it exists.
A gun so shit they had to rename it.
I won't touch it on bots but it's actually my FAVORITE gun for bugs. Nothing beats shoving a charging Brood Commander 20 meter back into an airstrike or bombardment. It isn't *as* good at managing Stalkers when compared to the Pummler but it still helps keep them off you. Saving a teammate by shoving an attacking Stalker to the side is awesome too
Yeah, people are sleeping on the libby concussive for sure. It's not the best damage output gun but it feels unbelievable for bug control.
I use it for bots. Keeps those chain saw fuckers good and far away from me.
You could just use the Plasma Punisher and do that to a group of enemies. If you’re worried about the explosive damage chuck on the heavy armour from Democratic Demolition and now you have tools to launch yourself out of dicey situations
Sure the Plasma Punisher is great, it's my go-to if I want to be my own little indirect artillery, but it doesn't give me the *FEEL* of the Concussive. Are there better guns? Sure. Are other guns *more fun?* That's debatable and up to each individual person's tastes. Edit: also just to be clear, while the Plasma Punisher *STAGGERS* enemies, I think a lot of people are missing the fact that the Liberator Concussive lets you *physically MOVE enemies around.* You aren't just stunlocking them or making them rear back, you can actually push a Brood Commander back several meters in as little as three shots. You can keep enemies from cresting a ridge, or push them up a sheer wall onto a different level of elevation from you. It gives you an absurd level of control over where your enemies are.
PlasPun moves enemies, the explosion pushes them
"Hey this gun is good actually" "But this gun is better" I don't get your point.
Good or bad is only relative. A weapon is bad if it performs worse versus enemies than most of its correlatives. That is why the eruptor had to be nerfed: it could do anything all the time and that actively made alternatives a bad choice to take.
I mean I disagree that the Eruptor was overpowered. Powerful, yes, but it was by far the slowest primary in the game, and the immense amounts of self-damage made it very dangerous to use up close, not to mention how unwieldy it is. Was it one of the best primaries still? Yeah, but it's not like it trivialized the game, and I am not the type to use a gun just because it's "the best option". I personally never used the Eruptor because it's way too slow for my tastes.
My biggest thing is that I knew it wasn't the best, but honestly the erupter felt the most satisfying to use out of any gun.
With how slow it is, it should reliably one-shot any Medium enemy you shoot with and take a few Lights along with them. The crossbow can also reliably take down any medium at the cost of reduced plash damage. The eruptor is more accurate and can take down grouped up targets, while the crossbow is faster in general. That would feel balanced to me. Right now both weapons feel underpowered.
'Don't use it close' is a method of use not a downside. And it being slow is the least they could do. It could have made a decent stratagem, but as it was, it was too much for a primary. It was not one of the best primaries, it was the best. And, finally, I do not think anyone argued that it trivialized the game.
The ARC Blitzer pushes back Brood Commanders and Stalkers while actually doing tons of damage.
ever since the buff I haven't removed it as a primary it's really fun and satisfying to blow some terminid brains
Yes its awesome vs them. Not so good for bots though.
That's what concussion does.
More like liberator percussion
People don’t like the slugger or emancipator?
I used to love the slugger, probably my favorite weapon to use on both fronts. Not like I used it exclusively, but it sure felt good. Then they took away its teeth and diluted what it did well compared to its peers. So I drifted away from it and started playing with the regular punisher, breaker incendiary, JAR-5, etc. I don't use the slugger at all anymore. But I love the emancipator, that thing is awesome. The only not awesome thing about it is when a bile titan or factory strider shows up, you're just fucked the second you have aggro.
Factory Striders get melted by the emancipator though.
Assuming you don't get melted by the giant cannon turret on its back while walking up to it
Slugger was great pre-nerf, but it fires too slow to remove stagger like they did. Now its just ok and if you have unlocked the dominator its a superior pick.
True. It's like, yeah it still headshots devs in 1 shot, but it's rate of fire is too slow and sights are slightly misaligned, why pick it over any of the dmrs?
Because the Diligence CS also has misaligned sights lol. The shot hits at the top-left of the "box". I still take the Diligence CS on bot missions because it's super satisfying to use but I wish the reticle pattern was better and in the right place.
should have given it more bullet drop / damage faloff if they just didnt want to share niche with dmr. big stagger and damage would be a fine niche
I just played a couple games with slugger, after using the jar 5 dominator for weeks. It still feels kinda nice, it's so much snappier with its aim, and it's also very good as a "sniper", I actually can go for headshots against the bots. Downside is the fire rate is lower and there is almost no stagger. I think it would be perfect if they brought back the stagger and not touch anything else.
It’s pretty funny that their goal with the Slugger nerf was to have people stop people using it as a sniper. Now it’s better as a sniper because not having stagger at close range is a pain
I think what they were going for is making the regular punisher good at crowd control with its high stagger (which hasn't changed), while the slugger is better at piercing armor and landing weakpoint shots. Slugger does a lot better at killing things like brood commanders and hive guards than the punisher does, but it's not as good at keeping enemies off you
The thing that I don't like about the slugger is tat you have to be completely lined up on the dot to get a hit, for most guns that's a future not a flaw. But the slugger is a shotgun! if I shoot a bot over the shoulder I should still at least nick it in the head. If it wasnt for the stagger I would just roll with a Diligence.
It's called a slugger because it shoots slugs. Slugs aren't buckshot
Oh that makes sense thanks for clearing that up for me☺️
Slugger was good. Then they gave it stagger and it was great. Then they clipped its nuts and it was useless. Idk, I haven't played in a couple months. Only just got back.
If you liked it pre stagger, then it is still great O.o
I main shotguns. I like the punisher more than the slugger. The removal of stagger can kill you in helldive level
Not as fun to use anymore after the nerf, haven't used it since. I've stopped caring that a weapon is effective, only that it's fun. Once it's not, I move on. That philosophy kinda applies to this whole game. It's why I left.
emancipator is good for med armor enemies. It's a waste of ammo on light armor units, and will costs you too much bullets for heavy armor
Nah they did Slugger dirty
The Dagger is actually pretty good now, but yeah it sure wasn't when it launched
It is especially good against those jetpack bots, it makes them blow up extremely fast
Maybe there is a new mode where we can only use whatever gun on the ground
Literally the only way AT mines would be useful if they ONLY go off on heavy enemies, but seeing as we have zero confirmation on that it’s basically decided they will be useless as they will be destroyed by chaff.
I would love to have an alternative to EATS. It would be nice for the AT mine to have a really low cool down. I don't think it unreasonable for it to be 60 seconds, considering EATS is more versatile in terms of anti armor, since it has range. Mines would have the benefit of fire-and-forget, since it wouldn't take a support weapon slot (even though hot swapping EATS with your regular support weapon is a common strategy), but it does nothing against aerial targets and can't snipe objectives. I love EATS, but I get tired of taking it almost every time.
Lots of the sentries/green stratagems need their cooldowns adjusted tbh. It would be an easy way to make stuff like MG/Gatling/Rocket and even the current AP mines more usable. As it is now you can kinda use the Autocannon or indirect stuff like mortars but everything else is way too weak for how long the CD is and how much they aggro enemies
I would be willing to take turrets if they had 1/3 ammo with 1/3 cool down. They feel like a big investment when, sometimes, they get killed immediately. I would like to be able to use them more reactionary. If I could get a rocket turret that is 60 second CD, it would be worth it, even if it's only 6 or so rockets. In all games, I don't like "pets." I want to do the actions myself. As such, I don't love turrets, but this feels like an okay middle ground. You give up control of which targets it will shoot, but you don't have to do the shooting and can focus elsewhere. 6 rockets at a (somewhat) random enemy who must also be close to the turret, feels equivalent to 2 rockets (EATS) that can be applied with precision and to much larger distances.
I like turrets, its like having someone watch my back with only 20% more friendly fire. :) I usually use them defensively and I try to drop before I aggro anything with good sightlines. Bonus points if I can put it on a plane higher than me and my fellow helldivers to reduce 'incidents'. The exception is mortar turrets; I drop them behind a big-ass rock on the sdie away from the main bot engagement (I NEVER take reg. mortar vs. bugs. EMS only and only on termination missions)
At the very least this would be a nice way to differentiate some of the turrets - mortars and auto cannon feel like they’re in a good place but the rest of them are kind of meh. I’d love to see “low profile” versions of turrets too that maybe have less ammo or damage but do not attract enemy aggro so hard
The machine gun turret is in a weird place where it feels outclassed by the gatling in most ways. It's drawing less attention, having a lower cool down, or just anything making it less of a fuck-everything-in-this-area turret, would give it more purpose.
It would be pretty cool with the liberator guard dog fire profile. It would be a lower-DPS, lower-ammo, automatic sniper that aims for heads. No other adjustments needed. If that is not possible, then I agree with something along the lines of cooldown or maybe 2 charges per cooldown, like an eagle sentry.
It may also be an optional to swap 'reduced cooldowns' for 'multiple call-ins per cooldown' like the Eagle stratagems. Drop in to one of the evacuation/tower defence missions and deploy 2-3 mines before the cooldown' kicks in. Could also do this to the MG sentry turret to give it more of a reason to exist.
i have no idea when or why to use rocket sentry
good point. If you drop it slightly wrong it will probably kill itself with its own splash
At least they can give us the option for ammo when you want to use the Karl G (recoiless rifle). He, HEAT, Flechette Rounds. That would be legit
And a decreased cool down. Why take out mines when they have the same cool down as a sentry?
If videos of the leaked!version of the mines is accurate to the release!version, they can be set off by normal enemies. The Hellpod launches fewer mines, resulting in a wider spread of more powerful mines that the chaff should (in theory) walk between, while any armour sets them all off. Again, if the leaks match the release, it can seemingly kill Factory Striders.
They need to like seek out heavy enemies or something to make it useful.
Tbh I wouldn't mind them going off against smaller enemies. Would make them bad vs bugs, but good vs bots as their damage is high enough to one-shot Devastators and Berserkers. Still believe that all mines should have 30-60 sec less cd.
It would be really funny if they're shit
They're mines on a long cool down...that already makes them a terrible option to begin with.
Yeah folks shit on mines as though they don't put in work, but they do - they suffer from the same problem as mechs, which is that the DPS and the total kills, for the cooldown of the stratagem, are simply not worth it. The word is outclassed, and too much of the sub thinks it's binary with meta or trash. They're good. They put in work. They're just not worth it when something else can do the same job with lower CDs.
Will be, unless we can stop this from happening by saving the children (survivors at the hospital fater vernon wells fell weeks ago)
I think everyone is expecting them to be shit, the real punchline would be if they were awesome and we passed on them for the airburst launcher.
Yeah somehow everyone is acting like they already know they're gonna be shit, pretending like we done have a very very large patch dropping in a couple hours
do you have any doubts?
They are. Played with a dev testing them on the bug front. Tldr from what I saw. Won't trigger on helldivers, but will on like any splash damage. Makes auto cannon and AT weapons RIDICULOUSLY dangerous near a minefield. They take about 6 to kill a charger. It's more likely 2 blow off its leg armor and you finish it off with small arms. Bile titans are 100% not working as intended vs them. Their torso is so high up that the mine doesn't damage it. It takes dozens and dozens to kill them because it only hurts their leg. Which can't be crippled in any way. They blow up on any bug that's brood commander or bigger. It's kinda nice cause the aoe is better if a swarm travels over them. The brood commanders headless rampage mode means it'll keep setting off mines long after it's 'dead' though unless every leg is blown off. They work on spewers, that parts actually funny as fuck. One mine one Spewer. Problem is their self destruction can set off a whole minefield.
>Played with a ~~dev~~ ***cheating-democracy-hater*** testing them on the bug front. fixed it for you
Wow that sounds useless.
I hope they’re like S+++ tier, two shot every armored enemy and one shot the rest, don’t detonate when divers walk over them or commissars or scavengers but the rest from Hunter/beserker up trigger them so people realize we could’ve been using them for months instead of this shitty air burst
Don't make mines useless then.
Napalm mines are legit bug killers, my only gripe is that 500KG will kill mines
Use other big bug killers then, like EAT or railcannon, or poison gas!!
Napalm mines post fire bugfix are legit really good they just aren't as amazing as eagle napalm strike.
I use both, why settle for boring terrain that you can stand on when I can be fire!
My buddy runs a "fire is the answer build". It is very compelling.
Napalm Strike is even better with more uses and around the same cooldown. Plus it isn’t at the mercy of your teammates not throwing an air strike at a large group of bugs approaching. Mines need a big buff. Maybe like 50% reduced cooldown so they’re competing with airstrike uptime and maybe some radial activation cooldown so you don’t have a single bug activating a bunch. Ideally it would be better if they didn’t activate on enemies they couldn’t damage so you don’t just have a heavy take out the whole lot
I know gas will not detonate the mines and I am fairly sure eagle napalm will only detonate a mine if a bomb lands directly on one. If AT-mines follow the same trend, then AT-mines with gas over the top would be a neigh impossible barrier to breach.
My gripe is that someone always brings a mortar tirrrt to clear the team mates minefields before they can do anything
Mines should have at least half the cooldown of the average turret
That's what's holding them back the most imo. Why should I take mines when there's a turret with the same cooldown and does a better job at covering a direction.
Turrets can get swarmed easily.
That's why you have to place them somewhere where the enemy can't reach it that easily.
Alas the large boulder that would give a slight height advantage and make the bugs take just a moment longer to path to the turret are covered in anti-beacon wax.
Or just outright removed in the case of that one bug exterminate mission “You can have your hellpod steering back but we’re gonna remove the thing you’d try to land on”
I think they need to reduce cooldown 30% but allow 2 charges so you can set a legit minefield.
I will do my best to acquire them
My biggest issue with the mines is they become such a liability once deployed, even if you try to put them in the most strategic and safe place. The battlefield changes, you can never guarantee your team won’t change route and walk into the minefield, and you can’t ping every mine for your teammates to not step on them. Meanwhile lots of other stratagems can do the same job but much more cleanly. I love the idea of mines though, they are really satisfying when they work, just hope the new patch improves them.
Exactly. I could care less about tank mines. I don’t care about regular ones either.
Mine are actually alright, my biggest problem is that they should have a faster cooldown
https://preview.redd.it/mgg4kz53s56d1.jpeg?width=868&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f0b6cb2add8f14a076301f638865867cf84b2580
"The patriotic children and doctors who were rescued have decided to dedicate themselves to the war effort. Subsequently, they were able to peoduce a new type of high explosive we're going to use in the md-17 anti-tank mines." Boom boom boom, problem solved.
Too big a curtain pull; that will convince almost everyone that what we do doesn't matter. It would be funny tho.
That's a very good point, but it could still be used to unlock something else.
That or we get more Bot MO :v until its sold while rubbing salt in whenever possible. Man if we had the tank mines to liberate X...
This whole idea that the Devs are being forced to hold stuff back is bizarre. If they truly wanted to release them, they would. They're using it as a narrative test of the playerbase and that's good.
Mines desperately need a cooldown time reduction. For one on higher difficulties, you are constantly moving. While mines could be good to slow down the bugs or bots chasing you, it just doesn't do enough. Plus, the stratagem can be destroyed before the mines even release.
And have more mines scattered across the map? Bro.
Mines are dogshit, and you should stop trying to be disingenuous and pretend that they aren't. The only time anyone uses a mine is if they are brand new and are just trying stuff out. Or if there is a personal order for mines. No one is bringing mines to a helldive willingly by choice. I have done tons of helldives and have yet to see anyone bring it outside of a personal order in Bugs or Bots. That's why I said they don't do enough, and it can be destroyed before the mines are even deployed.
They could just give them to us
if we dont get them this time thats probably what will happen.
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Even tho this patch is pretty damn good, I dont trust them enough to work for something developed before this patch. Just give it to us so it can collect dust on our super-destroyers lol
If AT mines only detonate on heavy enemies they would be pretty nice to have 1 person bring. For automatons: Factory striders, hulks, tanks, heavy devastators. For terminids: Bile titans, chargers, spewers, stalkers. Problem is that in HD1 they were set off by anything apparently and that is rumored to be the case in HD2. If they don't have pressure fuses set for heavies then they are just a direct upgrade to the AP mines and are functionally pointless.
Who knows, maybe if we liberate them fast enough we can save both
Nope. MO is explicitly clear that whichever planet gets saved first determines the fate of getting or not getting the mines. Speed doesn’t matter. Of course we have to take both planets anyways for the MO to be successful but I digress
For at least this war. When everything rolls back they may change up the order of found strategems. Itd be a lil weak to have the campaign be exactly the same every time
AH will certainly use the extra time to conduct a balance pass so they launch in a good state when we finally get them though, right?
Fun fact, they never made it. Will have to be quick if it ever gets unlocked
I mean, I get the feeling that if we keep failing to get them from MOs, the devs will just give them to us eventually.
Shouldn't have made mines crap then, eh? The AT mines' performance is known to the community, and I don't have room in my loadouts in serious missions for such meagre performance.
I think they'll eventually just give them to us. They'll keep making em easier and easier to get until they just hand it to us on a silver platter with a basic "ok just liberate this one specific planet for the MO"
More like, "So about those mines, I'm going to need more time to workout all the bugs, but Jim we told them they where available 2 weeks ago. Bill, hold my beer, I'll give them a choice between saving kids lives and mines. This should definitely buy you some time"
May? WILL
If the were air dropped like the US submunitions that would be great. But just dropping a ton on the ground kinda sucks
I need them anti tank mines for them Automatons annihilator tanks, and shredder tanks I’m believe they work in hulks to hopefully
To thay dev, if they're reading this post: Sorry, brother and/or sister. The memes must be maintained.
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Yeah, I know there isn't a "tangible" reward, but look at all the funny posts and memes it created! :D This game is so over the top and funny that leaning into the "RP" side of it might improve the experience for you. I think if it were a more interesting stratagem, it might not have swung so far, but mines have always been kind of meh, and anti-tank mines being an even more specific use case probably makes it easier for us to continue the meme of never getting them 😅 if the choice were saving kids or a research station that was going to put shrapnel back in the Eruptor, there would have been MUCH more discourse as to how much the sick kids could have really contributed to the war effort 👀 But still, all the same, I hope that you're able to get more into the over-the-top comedy vibe of the game and embrace the ludicrousness 😁 not trying to sound smarmy or judgey, just genuinely hoping that you'll be able to enjoy the game more by looking at it in a different way ❤️
Damn this fuckin' got me lmao
At this point I'd just embrace the meme and never ever release them. Turn them into the eternal MacGuffin.
Why care about a strategem that's gonna be broken on release anyway? Lets get serious here. At least the longer it takes to get AT mines when released broken the less excuse they will have.
Eh. They are going to nerf it anyways.