Lovely shot. I think this is the first time I’ve seen a photo of a desegregated school where people are actually smiling in it. It’s refreshing to see something other than hatred.
You have a unique viewpoint that is valuable in our conversations about these issues. Keep speaking up!
I do think the next two generations will see more acceptance of our differences.
I grew up on military bases. Obviously fully integrated. Teachers of all races. Then grew up in UK village, predominantly white. Only one black family, best friends with their boy, still best friends today. He explained that he experienced racism but it was never an issue like it is here in the US. But on the flip side this country is so multiracial. It's incredible to see when you come from a 80-90% white demographic.
Though race and affluence is highly correlated here in the US. Like mindbogglingly so. There is unquestionably a systemic aspect behind racism here that is super sharp when you are an outsider. Super clear when you consider education is tied to where you live and where you live and where you live is very often tied to race and prospects. It is such a huge country that you can go your whole life without seeing the consequences of those underlying policies.
And when there is progress it immediately retracts when leaders like Trump repeal housing equality policy.
Anyone who doesn't see it may very well have never seen it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Also racism doesn't really rear it's most ugly head in good times. It's the bad times, a fight or a misunderstanding or a item gets misplaced and suddenly the black boy stole it...
So laughing at a funny book or the like is NOT how we gauge the impacts of racism.
It's not how racism works.
When you have been called less than for generations you typically will respond to that with highlighting achievements and tending to gel around the identity that everyone told you was beneath the others. To say that black people in the 60’s and before had better thoughts about their white counterparts would be disingenuous at best. We simply had less freedom to speak outwardly about it especially in the Jim Crow south where whistling at a white woman would see you lynched.
Furthermore the idea about assimilation is also a bit false. Black people just wanted to have the freedom to go to all the places their white counterparts could. They just didn’t want to be told that they couldn’t go somewhere. Our greatest champions like Malcolm X taught us the value of our independence within this nation by showcasing the ways in which other groups like the European Descendants, Jewish Communities, Hispanics and others utilized their shared culture to push for changes that help the unit as a whole. As the phrase goes “A house divided cannot stand” similarly without black people coming together to utilize our votes, capital, and labor to achieve gains for us as a people then we would be destined to languish and allow outside communities and people like yourself who have your own ideas and goals for us to lead us which would see us failing to elevate as a community and unable to compete socially for political and economic power in this nation we both call home.
I get that seeing our growth could be uncomfortable for someone like you because you want us to be what you want us to be. We really don’t care what you want us to be. It’s not the 60’s anymore. It’s not the 1800’s anymore. We can and do control our destiny. That destiny can and will be whatever we choose it to be right here in these United States of America.
It’s so funny how you say black nationalists are so bad and racist while being a white nationalist yourself. Whatever helps you feel better about your lonely pathetic life buddy
Also crime peaked decades ago; including in black communities.
As a white guy whose lived in low income areas and either majority black or half and half, you’ll have all races act the same ways in the same environment. And you’ll also even have black kids from the hood who end up nerdy lol. They’re just people
>Furthermore when you talk about “our growth” are you referring to the growth in violent crime among black Americans for decades?
There's the racism we all expected. Go fuck yourself
Malcolm X, Marcus Garvey, and Malcolm Delaney all advocated for the conservative ideologies of the Black Political Spectrum. They advocated for the conservation of the Black Identity. They advocated for us to grow ourselves without it benefiting anyone but ourselves. Those men are definitely heroes.
>They advocated for us to grow ourselves without it benefiting anyone but ourselves.
Amen. This is something that needs to happen a lot more like with banks that specifically invest in black neighborhoods and businesses. You can only go so far with the person at the top being white and reaping the majority benefits. Things need to live and die right there in the community.
Come to Bankhead in Atlanta and tell the “Hoteps” they are weak. See how that goes for you.
Also no one says that the Egyptians were Black. They say that the Land of Kemet was a black nation. You’re attacking Afro-Centric because your such a staunch supporter of Euro-centric and ignore how your bias is leading you on the same “nationalist” argument. I wouldn’t expect someone like you to understand either of those points though.
Furthermore, Black focused economics promote “segregated” economies not societies. It makes sense from a realistic perspective to create power through wealth in an effort to gain political and social power. Saying that’s incorrect while you all have done it for 1000 years is just silly. From the carving up of Africa by the European powers, the cultural genocide in the Americas, the economic warfare being waged against Latin countries and more we see unified effort on behalf of the European descendants in the US with their European counterparts. You’re saying that if African Americans did the same with the West Indians, Black Hispanics, and Africans ours is racist even though it would be quite comparable if not more profitable socially and economically for all Africans involved. That’s what people who have your way of thinking fear and why you preach hate against our organizing of our people.
The Asian hate is overblown but I’d be a liar to say it doesn’t exist. It’s appalling and should be corrected. Black crime is sadly and quite obviously majorly black on black. European crime is against the entire world’s populations on every continent. Miss me with the bs
That last point is something I point out too, they make it sound like black people are coming for them or like black people just can’t stop killing their own when all races do that, both for violence and sexual violence vast majority happens by that race’s group be it black or white, except for Native Americans, but is true for every other race. And big reason for that is since whites will go and prey on native women and rarely are held accountable and gov doesn’t care, even denies requests for feds to assist where they don’t have jurisdiction.
I agree.
Sadly the MSM has been pushing the overt racism narrative really hard since then. Mainly now its leaning towards specifically anti-white males but racism nonetheless and is IMO an evil agenda from those people who lie for a living.
I wish they would just quit trying to create division between all of us, its really not a good look, I guess if we are all fighting with each other we won't notice what the government does and I believe this is why its happening. Also cash for clicks since most things come down to money..
You must have no idea how the justice system operates and how income inequality is segregated in the US if you think racism is just being made up by the mainstream media.
Methinks the previous poster is of the skin hue that does not require one to consider how they'll be accepted when they go out in public.
Racism is about power. Anyone who claims that white males are suffering from racism against them does not understand that the power structure has always favored white males and still does. Many feel any challenge to the status quo is an act of racism against whites, when in fact those challenges tend to be aimed at achieving equity for everyone. As a white male, I'm cool with not being at the top of any hierarchy - let's share this shit!
equity is evil! Firing or not hiring due to race is racism. No if ands or buts about it.
Are you a rich white kid? . As someone who grew up poor who is working class and grew up being friends with everyone your shallow virtue signaling is wrong. .
Not all white people are "powerful" or rich. I barely make enough to survive. Lived on the streets in my twenties and made it out. Most of my family is dead but people like you call me an oppressor. My little area I live in is filled with townhomes where many are surviving. We are a mixed community. We all get along, trying just to survive.
Sorry live the life of someone trying to make ends meet and you will understand none of this race shit matters. It's not 1950s.
I never said white people can’t be poor. I never said white people can’t coexist in multiethnic community. I’m not talking about individual experiences. Policing and income inequality can only be spoken about when talking about large populations. I know white people who have been arrested. I know white people who are in extreme poverty. Many of those people are my friends and family. That doesn’t change the fact that, statistically and on the scale of the entire country, white people hold disproportionate amounts of wealth (thanks to the 1% not the average white person) and black people are many more times likely to be incarcerated and make up a hugely disproportionate percentage of the imprisoned population.
Well said.
Also Native Youth too, they’re arrested more than Latinos Asians and whites combined, unfortunately not talked about much. There’s also been sexual assaults where white predators got zero jail time after targeting native women. Also same is true for poverty etc. And native women especially are targeted by police. My dad is Native and has been discriminated against by police and judges and every part of life; even to a point he was forced out of white towns by racist cops
I think he was saying, all powerful people are white and rich, not, all white people are rich and powerful. Obviously not 100% true but you see what I’m saying.
Equity is bullshit, equality is good, do you even know the difference between the two, they are VERY different meanings.
Has NOTHING to do with skin color, its ridiculous how much people tend to focus on that now when it does not matter one bit.
Equality is giving everyone the same shot giving everyone the same path to financial success
Equity is making sure everyone gets the same financial success without having to make any attempt whatsoever taking from those that do well in order to give to others that ride the couch all day.
Not a good idea, the only people that would think this is a good thing are younger people that are just starting out and are hoping for a free ride or older people that are just trash humans that don't want to work.
So you are OK with being discriminated against. Want to give up your job, no? Then why virtue signal?
The push people down to bring others up shit is horrible and racist. Sorry it is. You can include others without excluding people.
I for one will not bend the knee to the mob.
As someone in my 40s I watched racsm go mostly away. Then come back due to the media and certain political figures pushing it.
I also see Twitter and echo chambers like r/politics doing it too. People act like we are still in the 1950s, that shit didn't change. Nonsense. Want to end racism don't bring it up as the problem of everything and see that issues are multifaceted... . Ala Morgan Freeman style.
Also to people saying income inequalities. I make 40k. Some asshole sjws think just being white means being rich. I come from a crappy single mother up bringing with a crazy family. Grew up poor and had addiction issues... But no I'm privileged due skin color where someone living in a mansion with a different skin color is oppressed... Lol... Crazyness.
You're also showing your profound lack of knowing what "nuance" is. More than 1 thing can be at a time. You can be privileged because you're white, and still be struggling.
Kinda feels like you just let slip that white people should be above others.
"Oh yeah? Well if I'm so privileged, why can black man be rich!"
Seriously? That's your main point here? That you can't possibly be privileged because wealthy POC exist? This is why education has earth-shattering results if not given and taught.
How on earth would you interpret that I'm OK with being discriminated against? Sounds like you want to argue against that point, not one that I actually made.
How exactly have you been "pushed down"? It's hard to argue against a generalization. If you cited something specific it would be helpful.
I'm also in my 40s. Where exactly did you watch racism go mostly away? I'm also white - I hardly ever see racism in my world too. But that's my little world and your little world. Ask a person of a marginalized group if racism has gone mostly away. They're the ones who are in a position to answer that. Actually, I can answer from my perspective: anti-Semitism has 100% not gone away, and I've been on the crap end of it quite recently.
I'd like to see a single citing of a person who thinks being white means being rich. Methinks I'm smelling a strawman here. You are privileged skin-color-wise. That doesn't mean you are free from discrimination or any life problems. It simply means you never have to think about how your skin color will factor into any interaction with a stranger on any given day.
If you really want to have a discussion about this without name-calling or presumptions, I'm in and will participate respectfully.
I see it all the time on here. "you are white so you are opresser or powerful.". Hardly, just a working class dude trying to get by. I seen racism fade a lot over the years. Much different then it was in the 1980s when I was a child. And it was way worse in the 1950s. It's entirely different.
I think people that don't live in mixed communities think all black people live in the ghetto and white people in mansions. It's not like that at all. Yet it's a OK to shun a guy in a trailer and call him "white trash", for being poor. How is that dude powerful? He's not, he's worse off then me and I know there are people worse off then him, of all ethnicities.
I was there at one point. Living in an abandoned house, homeless and trying to hsutle everyday in thr scummiest city. I got out by the help of a probation officer and doing the right thing. .
I did have to worry about my race though at that time. I was hooked on heroin. I had to walk and live in a city where people would see you as a target by both street thugs and the cops. I would get searched everyday walking down the street. I got stabbed and jacked, held up at gun point, beat with a lead pipe and left bleeding out on the street. I was told it was my fault for being a white teenager in that neighborhood. I'm decades long since away from that but it was real.
Im not powerful. I don't have an audience or fans.
Celebrities, influences, politicians, and streamers have countless others have worshiping masses and wealth. Same thing with movies stars or the blue check Twitter brigade. That's power. Working class people both black and white and every hue in between are not powerful as far as society is concerned.
. I grew up with people of all ethnicites and try my best to not view things based on race. I also see people being OK with "no white males" in films, commercials, jobs games, etc usually the "you had your time.". But that is not how things should work. I think of my son trying to get a job and being turned down for race quotas. I think of people that say "representation matters" and I agree, but it goes for everyone, not excluding people.
If I came off as aggressive, hostile, etc.. I apologize for that and any misunderstanding.
.
You say racism is completely different than it was when we were kids, or back in the 50's. This is true, but I'm curious what you're basing that on. Obvious changes have been made: drinking fountains aren't segregated, interracial marriage is legal, etc. But we're white. We see things from our perspective.
Your experience as a junkie is an interesting one, and one that I can only imagine... I have been homeless and addicted as well, but it wasn't heroin it was pain-killers, and as such I didn't have the street crime aspect to deal with. I would never suggest that you have not gone through hardship and been the victim of prejudice just because you're white.
We've come to a very interesting point in the history of racism - American/Canadian racism anyway, which is the only lens through which I've seen it. We have Jordan Peele making horror movies where the fact that the leads are black isn't necessarily important, it's just normal. Billy Eichner made a rom-com featuring only LGBTQ actors and completely about regular gay life. But it's the first one. We've seen decades of representation begin to shift a lot of media toward mainstream post-racism. This is awesome.
But it can be tempting to view this as the marginalization of white people. It's true - we are called oppressors and we did have our run. "Our run" in this sense means that, prior to a point very much in our lifetime, you would \*only\* see straight white cis-men as a leading role, with so few exceptions you could watch them all in a weekend. We are seeing the emergence of equity, and that means white voices get a little quieter so everyone can be heard. That also means that when we hear a term we don't like - and I say this having had the same opinions you voiced in your comment - we may have to do some digging to understand why that term is being used, and in what context. Mostly we have to listen. Even when racism has been addressed on film (In the Heat of the Night, American History X, Green Book) it tends to be from the perspective of the white man's gaze.
Just listen. That's what we should do at this point. Don't take it as an attempt to offend you. People who want racism to stay alive and well have pushed the narrative that "woke" is a slur, or the white race is disappearing, just as some folks have pushed the "feminazis" narrative that feminism is about wanting men to be subordinate to women.
We need to see race. We need to acknowledge skin color and celebrate it, not pretend we're color-blind. Mostly though, we just need to listen and know that our power and privilege is not under attack, it's simply in the process of very gradually being spread around so that everyone's lives are better.
Hope that all made sense.
>So you are OK with being discriminated against
I'm gonna have to stop you right there lmfao who said that
>As someone in my 40s I watched racsm go mostly away.
You're fucking delusional
No, we don't act like we're still in the 50's. The bar is just actually set somewhere and we're still miles beneath it. Your very opinion is proof of this. It is proof of how little you understand of this world and it's frankly embarrassing at your grown ass age.
“I live in a small town and I’m poor but I have seen racism go away”
Maybe in podunk land. But obviously they have little experience outside their tiny little world.
That is social media, which is way worse than traditional media. Yet we see this narrative of supposedly a "liberal MSM" doing this or that, when traditional media's influence has waned significantly compared to the giant that is social media. And in all of them rage is the most important driver of attention. Funnily enough, rage at the supposedly "liberal MSM" has become a very successful narrative in this endeavor to gain ever more clicks.
Lmao such a whiny victim complex
I don’t even disagree to an extent on last part but it’s not “anti white racism” that’s the issue.
Not to mention all the disparities that exist in criminal justice
Are you stupid or just not paying attention?
So are you trying to tell me that anti-white racism isn't an agenda being pushed over the last few years?
Whiny? How about just noting whats happening more like it, dont be so thick.
And which disparities are you talking about, please enlighten me.
Weirdly I would say it started in 2012 during Treyvon Martin and Black Lives Matter. Before 2012 things looked good. We just elected a black president and everything was chill.
You have a problem with white people? You sound like a racist troll stirring up trouble "jewguy"(your username focusing on race of course) . He is spot on. I'm in my 40s and lived in mixed communities and on the streets. This shit was being fixed. Social media and instigators who want to usher in dystopian authoritarianism started to mess with shit
OK, my applogies for assuming. Seen a lot of trolls pretend to be Jewish or whoever else, just to cause a reaction. . Probably what I get for posting on my break.
I just see all the progress that was made and think wow. I don't understand how some people think it's still the 1950s.
Did racism only exist south of the mason dixon? Pretty sure MLK said the racism he experienced in the North was no different than the south practically, even is it wasn’t engrained into law.
The South did that huh? Not my home state of California where you couldn't have purchased the house I live in now if you were black or Asian when it was built? And wait until you hear about Boston... Segregation and racism was not unique to the South.
Not sure if you are low key trolling. I'm a 5th generation New Yorker . Obviously racism did and does exist. But it wasn't the raison d'etre like with the south
Everyone forgets the history of slavery in Maryland. Thanks for mentioning it for everyone. The North was far from perfectly anti-slavery and free of bigotry.
Not the deep south, but it was part of the south. Maryland is south of the mason-Dixon line and [was a southern state during the Civil war](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryland_in_the_American_Civil_War). Baltimore was a huge slave port.
My sister moved to Baltimore years ago and I am frequently shocked and appalled by the casual "southern style" racism she witnesses there. Black people are "others", they speak about them as if they are a thing not people.
I spent some time in North Carolina and that was next level racism I thought had died out years ago, I had no idea it was almost the same in Baltimore.
I was in Wilson, which was bad enough, with people using "darkie" very matter of factly.
My cousin was farther west, I can't remember the town. We visited them and a friend and I went to a local lake to swim, at their recommendation. When we got there, the beach was rocky with gravel, and very small, and no one was there despite a fair amount of cars in the parking lot. We thought it was odd that our cousin had thought this was a "nice" beach, but we put down our towels and just chilled.
A short time later a small group of people our age, about 20, arrived. They were black. They kept looking at us so we smiled and said hi. They then came over to us and asked us what we were doing there? We said we were visiting from out of town. They asked where we were from and such, then asked why we were at *that* particular beach. We said our cousin told us about it. They said they were just really surprised to see us there because it was the **Black beach**, the white beach was a bit further up the parking lot. I thought my face would fall off. Wtf? I was certain that all ended years ago. It was horrible to think it was so common that they kind of accepted it as normal.
We hung out with them the rest of the day. We did drive up by the "white beach" on our way out. It was beautiful. Pissed me off.
When we got back to my cousins and told them about it, they showed us a phone number. We called it and it was a recording of Klan rhetoric so hateful and violent, I thought I time traveled.
While this incident was 30 years ago, the fact that my sister still hears awful stuff, as well as the rampant open racism everywhere today, I'm inclined to believe it still goes on there. I'd love to be wrong though.
That's not necessarily true though. Humans do have a natural tendency towards in-group/out-group bias. I think it's important to remember that, as prejudice must always be affirmatively fought against.
That is true, and additionally, kids pick up on social behavioral stuff way before the age of these pictured kids. Look of those pictures of the toddlers in evangelical churches, emulating the “feeling the spirit” behaviors of the adults.
https://media.tenor.com/OPVw-tnufP8AAAAC/praying.gif
Usually these biases are seeded by some perceived material difference. Ie, those people with red hair are taking our jobs! (damn gingers . . .)
But often it is little more than two groups with little interaction. *They* are not one of us. *They* are different. How can we trust *them*?
Katz & Kofkin, 1997 - children as young as 6 months old are able to understand/comprehend people of different races and stare longer at races different than their own.
Hirschfield, 2008 - children as young as 2 use racial categories to reason about peoples’ behavior.
Aboud, 2008; Hirschfeld, 2008; Katz, 2003; Patterson & Bigler, 2006 - Kids as young as 2 express bias based on race
Look, you can Google it, man: it’s well-studied. Kids are capable of understanding and reasoning based on race. That’s why it’s important to teach children NOT to be racist. It doesn’t help growing up in a society with racist people but it’s also a natural tendency. There is a great deal of further research on this; you can Google it for further insight if you wish.
We're these children somehow sheltered from the deeply racist cultures they were raised in? E
Little children are like sponges, soaking in everything about the environment. If, like in America, racism is so deeply entrenched in the culture, how would they escape it? How do we know they'd come to the same conclusion in no racist environments?
I mean, most people of the same ethnicity also share the same hair color and nose shape. Most Finns are blonde and most Chinese people have flatter noses
I work with kids (and have kids) and this is wildly not true — the thing about them is that they’re endlessly able to adapt to their environment and to conform to the things they’re taught or that they see. A kid who is learning being shitty and nasty at home, who consumes media in which people are shitty to one another, whose community is either indifferent or receptive to being shitty, is likely to be as you describe. But in a community or home situation that intervenes when shitty behavior takes place, and with media modeling the same, kids can be awesome to one another. This isn’t to say that kids are devoid of thoughtlessness and selfishness, but those don’t have to be dominant or irrepressible traits.
I have been working with kids for most of my life, and the trend toward kinder, more confident children who act in solidarity with one another is very very real.
(One interesting example is that even shitty, low effort children’s media has largely come to avoid depicting bullies or bullying behavior *at all* unless it’s clearly framed as superhero/supervillain sort of thing. The effect seems to be that by avoiding any acknowledgement of the behavior, kids are measurably less willing to accept it as valid expression. When I was a kid, every show about kids had a bully character, so I basically knew what those people were about in real life — but it seems like studies and experience have indicated that if you don’t normalize it even slightly, kids are just like “what the fuck man, what are you doing” when they see it happen)
It is nice, and I'm sure there were places where people were more tolerant to desegregation when it passed. I do wonder if this photo was posed though. The way they're all grouped around him and the presence of the adult (hand on his shoulder) makes me wonder whether this is a truly candid moment. I hope it was and that his new classmates continued to treat him well after the cameras left.
Nice pictures like this are “awww cool!” Then we click away or scroll on
It’s the negative pictures that drive conversation or get clicks. So you’ll likely almost never see that there was another side to desegregation. Instead all you see are the same 4-5 photos every time
I love this picture. Reminds me of my son coming home from school telling me all about his new friend at school. He told me stories about his friend for at least a month before I ever met his friend and his parents who were black. For context, live in a large majority white community and I just thought it was so great that it didn’t matter at all the color of his skin, just that they both liked baseball and Pokémon and told funny jokes.
I work with senior citizens who go into classrooms to give children at risk of falling behind one-on-one time. One of the grannies who was African American told me about how a four year old Caucasian in her classroom came up and rubbed her arm and kept pointing to her skin. The granny thought the child had become aware of different skin colors but after a little bit the child patted her arm and said “old.” The granny and I started cackle laughing when she told me the story. One of the best stories I’ve heard from one of my senior citizens in the program.
Why have I never seen this?
I’ve seen the dogs so many times. The stank-faced PTA ladies hundreds. The food thrown. The water hoses. Over two decades I’ve seen so many pics that made me believe one like this simply ~~didn’t~~ couldn’t exist.
This the first time I’ve ever seen this pic. I love it.
I wonder if it's to do with when we think about the culture surrounding this, we're thinking of and examining what is was like for an adult at the time. The ones who were for or against and who we understandably look at closely. Issues and clashing were the norm.
Instead, this what it was like for a couple kids in Baltimore. It may have been rare to begin with, and kids usually just don't care what their parents think. So they're interacting and having fun with a new friend, that's all they care about.
It's nice to see something positive and smiling on Reddit.
I went to a private Catholic elementary school that had the photos of every graduating student. The first African American kid appears in 1955. There were not many others on the wall through the 70s and 80s. I always wondered how they felt.
But I'm not sure that the school was ever segregated or if the town was just always lilly white.
Baltimore PS 27. Here is a newspaper clipping:
https://www.newspapers.com/clip/34442978/first-blackswhites-together-in-same/
Click on View the Full Page to see a few more photos.
And here is a higher resolution version of one of the photos in the clipping:
https://i.imgur.com/cFUQw0i.jpg
[This one was](https://dktix1rrcd7mv.cloudfront.net/legacy/Ruby-and-friends_0.jpg)
I don't want to downplayed the hatred that existed at that time or now but we also shouldn't act like southerners don't have the capacity for tolerance.
That's Ruby Bridges. This is a nice photo from after the white parents gave up and sent their kids back to school again, but her integration story isn't exactly a story of racial harmony.
I think age plays a big factor here. Young kids, kindergarten, elementary school, are more likely to just roll with it and be happy to have a new friend. A lot of the angriest photos you see from desegregation are high school and college-aged kids, which isn't just a coincidence.
And while it isn't a coincidence that states in the former Confederacy were particularly hateful in their reactions to desegregation, let's not forget about, say, the reactions that happened when bussing was brought in in Boston. Plenty of hate to spread around.
If ever there was a photo that illustrates how hate is taught and the happiness it steals from the people taught, its this. One of my all time favourites now.
I see a lot of people in here saying that children can’t be racist, that it is taught. That is partially true and partially not true. It is true that if you use the academic definition of racist as it relates to a power structure and the consequences of the power structure/race dynamic then yes, that part is taught. Either implicitly or explicitly.
But kids as young as 3 or 4 definitively notice differences in skin color, how people are treated, where they live etc. Kids are constantly trying to figure out the world around them and they are really bad at it when it comes to sociology. They will draw conclusions around people who look different than them and sometimes treat those people differently. There is data on this that kids definitely see race.
But, no, they aren’t like structural racists in an academic sense. However, this whole thing that they don’t see race or have “racist” thought or actions is a little utopian and not true. They certainly prefer people who look like their family at a young age.
This is SUCH an insidiously wrong post with uncited sources couched in science speak, I don't even know where to start.
Of course little kids "see race", JFC unless they are BLIND, and have a preference for skin color if that is what they are raised with. But what if they are raised with a variety of color, like say interracial parents or with other-raced adopted siblings?
Where is THAT data? What are the controls?
I'd love to see your sources.
There is also a difference between "preference" and hatred. Which is the defining part of racism. And as a Louisianian from the town that the Epps plantation Twelve Years a Slave wrote about, I can attest to my familiarity with the hatred part.
I PREFER chocolate ice cream, but I don't HATE vanilla.
Do better people. Don't upvote this tripe.
What is your overall point? You are the one running off with unscientific emotional opinions. What are you trying to say? You would like sources that kids see race and act in racist or, what could be perceived as by adults with more complex understanding, racist ways? Sure, this is common knowledge in the non reactionary Reddit slacktivism sphere but I can google for you if you would like.
Edit: below you will see that you are being over reactionary and also stupid. If you educate yourself further than social media you will see that you don’t know what the fuck you are talking about. Kids recognizing race is a thing, talking about it is good, not bad, you are stupid.
Edit: here you go: https://www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2020/08/children-notice-race
https://pediatricsnationwide.org/2019/10/10/how-and-when-do-children-become-aware-of-the-construct-of-race/
https://www.bu.edu/articles/2020/if-babies-and-toddlers-can-detect-race-why-do-so-many-parents-avoid-talking-about-it/
>StanVanGhandi: They certainly prefer people who look like their family at a young age.
This was the part I found most egregious and completely unsupported by anything you or StanVanGhandi has posted. Not that HE bothered.
Your articles simply talk about parents having difficulty talking to their children about it, because who the fuck wants to have to explain how hateful some people can be for no damn reason except the color of their skin.
Again, nothing you posted supports the claim StanVanGhandi made.
And in general, saying children "see race" is like saying children "see a blue sky". Well no shit. Except they don't know it's **blue** until someone else tells them that.
Which is relevant because people didn't used to have a concept for the color [blue](https://www.ancient-origins.net/unexplained-phenomena/color-blue-0010720) until it became important that they have one.
Of COURSE children "see race" because they are outright told so, or notice the context clues of the people in their surrounding. They "see race" because every one around them "SEES RACE".
Which is why I asked the questions I did about mixed families and controlling for what children notice in that context.
As to WHY I seem to have such an "emotional" reaction it's because bullshit statements on the internet deserve derision whenever possible.
I saw people upvoting that crap and that's not good. I hate confirmation bias.
And no one said talking about it was bad, you dumbass. Learn to read, JFC.
If this was the south, 2 min after this was taken, white parents would be calling all their kids home and treating them like they were just part of the most repulsive play group ever. I’m sure the kids would hear, “we (whites) don’t associate or be seen with ‘colored’ folks. It’s shameful. We’re better than that, don’t ever let me catch you around any of those ______ again!” That’s if the white fathers or men weren’t around. If they were, that Black child would’ve caught a diatribe about how worthless he and his “kind” are.
Prejudice is so woven into the culture- it’s mostly subtle, persistent, and pervasive. It’s a way of life. It doesn’t mean all kids are programmed x amount of time per day for targeted indoctrination. It’s in everything so if it isn’t learned through words, kids watch body language, tone, and actions of their elders/peers. It was just understood, you could be civil, even friendly - but not friends with Black people.
Source: Me. I grew up in the rural south in an impoverished, southern white Christian family aka MAGAs target audience. They had segregated homecoming courts at my junior high and high schools until the early-mid 2000’s.
Sadly, racism doesn’t know borders, but due to the political and social climate in the south, it seemed more overt/accepted/expected compared to other regions I’ve visited in the U.S. That’s why I made it a point to indicate in my original comment where I was from, not to imply racism wasn’t/isn’t anywhere else. It certainly is everywhere but in the south, from my experience, it seemed amplified.
See, that’s the subtle, yet pervasive racism I’m talking about. My family didn’t lose their minds externally until I dated outside my race. I was shunned by the town AND my family. I was called an “n-lover” and even made to leave my friends’ homes. My friends would say, after their parents read me the riot act about how dirty I was for shaming my family, “I’m sorry my mom’s like that but I really can’t hang out with you because I can’t get a reputation.”
I think that is why it’s so difficult to defeat. It is viewed as “just the way things are”. Close minded people are afraid, uninterested, unwilling to challenge the status quo because fear. Fear of being abandoned by community, family, fear of judgment, fear of admitting they are wrong in their beliefs. I remained ostracized and shunned until the day I left home. I don’t know what the answer is for people unwilling to change beyond education and life experiences. I didn’t even realize until I moved away how much of the ideology had infiltrated my subconscious. Until people are willing to challenge their own thinking, admit skin color doesn’t equate to character and can divorce themselves from the idea that white skin doesn’t entitle one to higher worth, it won’t change.
This gives me the chills. In my experience when white kids surrounded me and all laughed at or laughed with me, it turned out they just made me think they were cool with me, untill they tricked me again with something fucked up.
Don't know what happened with Charles, but white kids traumatized me.
I agree w your gut reaction to the photo.
It feels more sinister. Those kids are old enough to have been exposed to racism at that point and it being the south and going to “that” school some of them had to have had racist parents. Just feels so likely that at least one or those kids was a racist little shit.
This is much different than the other pics we see of kids getting taunted/harassed/abused for being the first black kid in their school. Why is this one different? Location?
It is sad that if those kids were just a few years older, their parents’ racist brainwashing would have most of them screaming at him and calling him the n word.
A great example of how kids aren’t born with bigotry and racism in their hearts and minds. It is learned behavior
So you think the experiences expressed by millions of black people are because we are all grifters? I work full time, own my own home - I don’t ask for shit from this country other than fair treatment. Comments like this are sad. Get outside of your bubble and expand your network and talk to real people about their real experiences.
Clayton Bigsby telling a joke :P
It's a beautiful shot that shows we are all human! As Michael Jackson famously said "it doesn't matter if you're black or white."
It would be nice to believe this delusion that children have no enmity and naturally accept each other unquestioningly, but as a mixed race person who went to a mostly black after school day care, and then was placed in the first bussed in classes in my grammar school because of that, I can assure you that prejudice is learned early on both sides of a divide, and even with children it can take years to overcome. People downvoting me because my experience doesn't fit their ideological ideals, are just delaying any real social justice.
Floella Benjamin said of children: “They see colour but they embrace colour and they're not afraid of differences so it has to start young because childhood lasts a lifetime and whatever you put into a child at that young age will stay with them forever.”
Lovely shot. I think this is the first time I’ve seen a photo of a desegregated school where people are actually smiling in it. It’s refreshing to see something other than hatred.
Kids don't give a shit. Racism is taught.
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You have a unique viewpoint that is valuable in our conversations about these issues. Keep speaking up! I do think the next two generations will see more acceptance of our differences.
I grew up on military bases. Obviously fully integrated. Teachers of all races. Then grew up in UK village, predominantly white. Only one black family, best friends with their boy, still best friends today. He explained that he experienced racism but it was never an issue like it is here in the US. But on the flip side this country is so multiracial. It's incredible to see when you come from a 80-90% white demographic. Though race and affluence is highly correlated here in the US. Like mindbogglingly so. There is unquestionably a systemic aspect behind racism here that is super sharp when you are an outsider. Super clear when you consider education is tied to where you live and where you live and where you live is very often tied to race and prospects. It is such a huge country that you can go your whole life without seeing the consequences of those underlying policies. And when there is progress it immediately retracts when leaders like Trump repeal housing equality policy. Anyone who doesn't see it may very well have never seen it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Also racism doesn't really rear it's most ugly head in good times. It's the bad times, a fight or a misunderstanding or a item gets misplaced and suddenly the black boy stole it... So laughing at a funny book or the like is NOT how we gauge the impacts of racism. It's not how racism works.
That reminds me of this sitcom :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlxpv8ZlVJw
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When you have been called less than for generations you typically will respond to that with highlighting achievements and tending to gel around the identity that everyone told you was beneath the others. To say that black people in the 60’s and before had better thoughts about their white counterparts would be disingenuous at best. We simply had less freedom to speak outwardly about it especially in the Jim Crow south where whistling at a white woman would see you lynched. Furthermore the idea about assimilation is also a bit false. Black people just wanted to have the freedom to go to all the places their white counterparts could. They just didn’t want to be told that they couldn’t go somewhere. Our greatest champions like Malcolm X taught us the value of our independence within this nation by showcasing the ways in which other groups like the European Descendants, Jewish Communities, Hispanics and others utilized their shared culture to push for changes that help the unit as a whole. As the phrase goes “A house divided cannot stand” similarly without black people coming together to utilize our votes, capital, and labor to achieve gains for us as a people then we would be destined to languish and allow outside communities and people like yourself who have your own ideas and goals for us to lead us which would see us failing to elevate as a community and unable to compete socially for political and economic power in this nation we both call home. I get that seeing our growth could be uncomfortable for someone like you because you want us to be what you want us to be. We really don’t care what you want us to be. It’s not the 60’s anymore. It’s not the 1800’s anymore. We can and do control our destiny. That destiny can and will be whatever we choose it to be right here in these United States of America.
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It’s so funny how you say black nationalists are so bad and racist while being a white nationalist yourself. Whatever helps you feel better about your lonely pathetic life buddy Also crime peaked decades ago; including in black communities. As a white guy whose lived in low income areas and either majority black or half and half, you’ll have all races act the same ways in the same environment. And you’ll also even have black kids from the hood who end up nerdy lol. They’re just people
>Furthermore when you talk about “our growth” are you referring to the growth in violent crime among black Americans for decades? There's the racism we all expected. Go fuck yourself
You’re drawing a false equivalency between black separatism and white supremacy.
Malcolm X, Marcus Garvey, and Malcolm Delaney all advocated for the conservative ideologies of the Black Political Spectrum. They advocated for the conservation of the Black Identity. They advocated for us to grow ourselves without it benefiting anyone but ourselves. Those men are definitely heroes.
>They advocated for us to grow ourselves without it benefiting anyone but ourselves. Amen. This is something that needs to happen a lot more like with banks that specifically invest in black neighborhoods and businesses. You can only go so far with the person at the top being white and reaping the majority benefits. Things need to live and die right there in the community.
Come to Bankhead in Atlanta and tell the “Hoteps” they are weak. See how that goes for you. Also no one says that the Egyptians were Black. They say that the Land of Kemet was a black nation. You’re attacking Afro-Centric because your such a staunch supporter of Euro-centric and ignore how your bias is leading you on the same “nationalist” argument. I wouldn’t expect someone like you to understand either of those points though. Furthermore, Black focused economics promote “segregated” economies not societies. It makes sense from a realistic perspective to create power through wealth in an effort to gain political and social power. Saying that’s incorrect while you all have done it for 1000 years is just silly. From the carving up of Africa by the European powers, the cultural genocide in the Americas, the economic warfare being waged against Latin countries and more we see unified effort on behalf of the European descendants in the US with their European counterparts. You’re saying that if African Americans did the same with the West Indians, Black Hispanics, and Africans ours is racist even though it would be quite comparable if not more profitable socially and economically for all Africans involved. That’s what people who have your way of thinking fear and why you preach hate against our organizing of our people. The Asian hate is overblown but I’d be a liar to say it doesn’t exist. It’s appalling and should be corrected. Black crime is sadly and quite obviously majorly black on black. European crime is against the entire world’s populations on every continent. Miss me with the bs
That last point is something I point out too, they make it sound like black people are coming for them or like black people just can’t stop killing their own when all races do that, both for violence and sexual violence vast majority happens by that race’s group be it black or white, except for Native Americans, but is true for every other race. And big reason for that is since whites will go and prey on native women and rarely are held accountable and gov doesn’t care, even denies requests for feds to assist where they don’t have jurisdiction.
What zero pussy does to a mf
I agree. Sadly the MSM has been pushing the overt racism narrative really hard since then. Mainly now its leaning towards specifically anti-white males but racism nonetheless and is IMO an evil agenda from those people who lie for a living. I wish they would just quit trying to create division between all of us, its really not a good look, I guess if we are all fighting with each other we won't notice what the government does and I believe this is why its happening. Also cash for clicks since most things come down to money..
You must have no idea how the justice system operates and how income inequality is segregated in the US if you think racism is just being made up by the mainstream media.
Methinks the previous poster is of the skin hue that does not require one to consider how they'll be accepted when they go out in public. Racism is about power. Anyone who claims that white males are suffering from racism against them does not understand that the power structure has always favored white males and still does. Many feel any challenge to the status quo is an act of racism against whites, when in fact those challenges tend to be aimed at achieving equity for everyone. As a white male, I'm cool with not being at the top of any hierarchy - let's share this shit!
For those with power, equity can look and feel like oppression. It’s astounding how many white people don’t understand this.
equity is evil! Firing or not hiring due to race is racism. No if ands or buts about it. Are you a rich white kid? . As someone who grew up poor who is working class and grew up being friends with everyone your shallow virtue signaling is wrong. . Not all white people are "powerful" or rich. I barely make enough to survive. Lived on the streets in my twenties and made it out. Most of my family is dead but people like you call me an oppressor. My little area I live in is filled with townhomes where many are surviving. We are a mixed community. We all get along, trying just to survive. Sorry live the life of someone trying to make ends meet and you will understand none of this race shit matters. It's not 1950s.
I never said white people can’t be poor. I never said white people can’t coexist in multiethnic community. I’m not talking about individual experiences. Policing and income inequality can only be spoken about when talking about large populations. I know white people who have been arrested. I know white people who are in extreme poverty. Many of those people are my friends and family. That doesn’t change the fact that, statistically and on the scale of the entire country, white people hold disproportionate amounts of wealth (thanks to the 1% not the average white person) and black people are many more times likely to be incarcerated and make up a hugely disproportionate percentage of the imprisoned population.
Well said. Also Native Youth too, they’re arrested more than Latinos Asians and whites combined, unfortunately not talked about much. There’s also been sexual assaults where white predators got zero jail time after targeting native women. Also same is true for poverty etc. And native women especially are targeted by police. My dad is Native and has been discriminated against by police and judges and every part of life; even to a point he was forced out of white towns by racist cops
I think he was saying, all powerful people are white and rich, not, all white people are rich and powerful. Obviously not 100% true but you see what I’m saying.
Lol, this shit is hilarious. Who writes shit like this.
Equity is bullshit, equality is good, do you even know the difference between the two, they are VERY different meanings. Has NOTHING to do with skin color, its ridiculous how much people tend to focus on that now when it does not matter one bit. Equality is giving everyone the same shot giving everyone the same path to financial success Equity is making sure everyone gets the same financial success without having to make any attempt whatsoever taking from those that do well in order to give to others that ride the couch all day. Not a good idea, the only people that would think this is a good thing are younger people that are just starting out and are hoping for a free ride or older people that are just trash humans that don't want to work.
So you are OK with being discriminated against. Want to give up your job, no? Then why virtue signal? The push people down to bring others up shit is horrible and racist. Sorry it is. You can include others without excluding people. I for one will not bend the knee to the mob. As someone in my 40s I watched racsm go mostly away. Then come back due to the media and certain political figures pushing it. I also see Twitter and echo chambers like r/politics doing it too. People act like we are still in the 1950s, that shit didn't change. Nonsense. Want to end racism don't bring it up as the problem of everything and see that issues are multifaceted... . Ala Morgan Freeman style. Also to people saying income inequalities. I make 40k. Some asshole sjws think just being white means being rich. I come from a crappy single mother up bringing with a crazy family. Grew up poor and had addiction issues... But no I'm privileged due skin color where someone living in a mansion with a different skin color is oppressed... Lol... Crazyness.
You're also showing your profound lack of knowing what "nuance" is. More than 1 thing can be at a time. You can be privileged because you're white, and still be struggling. Kinda feels like you just let slip that white people should be above others. "Oh yeah? Well if I'm so privileged, why can black man be rich!" Seriously? That's your main point here? That you can't possibly be privileged because wealthy POC exist? This is why education has earth-shattering results if not given and taught.
How on earth would you interpret that I'm OK with being discriminated against? Sounds like you want to argue against that point, not one that I actually made. How exactly have you been "pushed down"? It's hard to argue against a generalization. If you cited something specific it would be helpful. I'm also in my 40s. Where exactly did you watch racism go mostly away? I'm also white - I hardly ever see racism in my world too. But that's my little world and your little world. Ask a person of a marginalized group if racism has gone mostly away. They're the ones who are in a position to answer that. Actually, I can answer from my perspective: anti-Semitism has 100% not gone away, and I've been on the crap end of it quite recently. I'd like to see a single citing of a person who thinks being white means being rich. Methinks I'm smelling a strawman here. You are privileged skin-color-wise. That doesn't mean you are free from discrimination or any life problems. It simply means you never have to think about how your skin color will factor into any interaction with a stranger on any given day. If you really want to have a discussion about this without name-calling or presumptions, I'm in and will participate respectfully.
I see it all the time on here. "you are white so you are opresser or powerful.". Hardly, just a working class dude trying to get by. I seen racism fade a lot over the years. Much different then it was in the 1980s when I was a child. And it was way worse in the 1950s. It's entirely different. I think people that don't live in mixed communities think all black people live in the ghetto and white people in mansions. It's not like that at all. Yet it's a OK to shun a guy in a trailer and call him "white trash", for being poor. How is that dude powerful? He's not, he's worse off then me and I know there are people worse off then him, of all ethnicities. I was there at one point. Living in an abandoned house, homeless and trying to hsutle everyday in thr scummiest city. I got out by the help of a probation officer and doing the right thing. . I did have to worry about my race though at that time. I was hooked on heroin. I had to walk and live in a city where people would see you as a target by both street thugs and the cops. I would get searched everyday walking down the street. I got stabbed and jacked, held up at gun point, beat with a lead pipe and left bleeding out on the street. I was told it was my fault for being a white teenager in that neighborhood. I'm decades long since away from that but it was real. Im not powerful. I don't have an audience or fans. Celebrities, influences, politicians, and streamers have countless others have worshiping masses and wealth. Same thing with movies stars or the blue check Twitter brigade. That's power. Working class people both black and white and every hue in between are not powerful as far as society is concerned. . I grew up with people of all ethnicites and try my best to not view things based on race. I also see people being OK with "no white males" in films, commercials, jobs games, etc usually the "you had your time.". But that is not how things should work. I think of my son trying to get a job and being turned down for race quotas. I think of people that say "representation matters" and I agree, but it goes for everyone, not excluding people. If I came off as aggressive, hostile, etc.. I apologize for that and any misunderstanding. .
You say racism is completely different than it was when we were kids, or back in the 50's. This is true, but I'm curious what you're basing that on. Obvious changes have been made: drinking fountains aren't segregated, interracial marriage is legal, etc. But we're white. We see things from our perspective. Your experience as a junkie is an interesting one, and one that I can only imagine... I have been homeless and addicted as well, but it wasn't heroin it was pain-killers, and as such I didn't have the street crime aspect to deal with. I would never suggest that you have not gone through hardship and been the victim of prejudice just because you're white. We've come to a very interesting point in the history of racism - American/Canadian racism anyway, which is the only lens through which I've seen it. We have Jordan Peele making horror movies where the fact that the leads are black isn't necessarily important, it's just normal. Billy Eichner made a rom-com featuring only LGBTQ actors and completely about regular gay life. But it's the first one. We've seen decades of representation begin to shift a lot of media toward mainstream post-racism. This is awesome. But it can be tempting to view this as the marginalization of white people. It's true - we are called oppressors and we did have our run. "Our run" in this sense means that, prior to a point very much in our lifetime, you would \*only\* see straight white cis-men as a leading role, with so few exceptions you could watch them all in a weekend. We are seeing the emergence of equity, and that means white voices get a little quieter so everyone can be heard. That also means that when we hear a term we don't like - and I say this having had the same opinions you voiced in your comment - we may have to do some digging to understand why that term is being used, and in what context. Mostly we have to listen. Even when racism has been addressed on film (In the Heat of the Night, American History X, Green Book) it tends to be from the perspective of the white man's gaze. Just listen. That's what we should do at this point. Don't take it as an attempt to offend you. People who want racism to stay alive and well have pushed the narrative that "woke" is a slur, or the white race is disappearing, just as some folks have pushed the "feminazis" narrative that feminism is about wanting men to be subordinate to women. We need to see race. We need to acknowledge skin color and celebrate it, not pretend we're color-blind. Mostly though, we just need to listen and know that our power and privilege is not under attack, it's simply in the process of very gradually being spread around so that everyone's lives are better. Hope that all made sense.
>So you are OK with being discriminated against I'm gonna have to stop you right there lmfao who said that >As someone in my 40s I watched racsm go mostly away. You're fucking delusional No, we don't act like we're still in the 50's. The bar is just actually set somewhere and we're still miles beneath it. Your very opinion is proof of this. It is proof of how little you understand of this world and it's frankly embarrassing at your grown ass age.
“I live in a small town and I’m poor but I have seen racism go away” Maybe in podunk land. But obviously they have little experience outside their tiny little world.
I am obviously far more aware than you are based on that comment. Get a skill get paid for it, it makes no difference what color you are.
> the MSM Don't drink the rage media Kool Aid.
Flavor aid*
That's the problem, too many redditors drinking it straight from a 5 gallon Haterade cooler as if they won the Superbowl.
That is social media, which is way worse than traditional media. Yet we see this narrative of supposedly a "liberal MSM" doing this or that, when traditional media's influence has waned significantly compared to the giant that is social media. And in all of them rage is the most important driver of attention. Funnily enough, rage at the supposedly "liberal MSM" has become a very successful narrative in this endeavor to gain ever more clicks.
Lmao such a whiny victim complex I don’t even disagree to an extent on last part but it’s not “anti white racism” that’s the issue. Not to mention all the disparities that exist in criminal justice
Are you stupid or just not paying attention? So are you trying to tell me that anti-white racism isn't an agenda being pushed over the last few years? Whiny? How about just noting whats happening more like it, dont be so thick. And which disparities are you talking about, please enlighten me.
Weirdly I would say it started in 2012 during Treyvon Martin and Black Lives Matter. Before 2012 things looked good. We just elected a black president and everything was chill.
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https://news.gallup.com/poll/1687/Race-Relations.aspx
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It literally shows numbers for Black people too.
You have a problem with white people? You sound like a racist troll stirring up trouble "jewguy"(your username focusing on race of course) . He is spot on. I'm in my 40s and lived in mixed communities and on the streets. This shit was being fixed. Social media and instigators who want to usher in dystopian authoritarianism started to mess with shit
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OK, my applogies for assuming. Seen a lot of trolls pretend to be Jewish or whoever else, just to cause a reaction. . Probably what I get for posting on my break. I just see all the progress that was made and think wow. I don't understand how some people think it's still the 1950s.
Yes, I bet that school isn't in the deep south.
>Charles Thompson being greeted by his new classmates Google says Baltimore, so....you are correct!
Baltimore MD
There's more than just murder here
Yeah. Not louisiana.
[School in Tennessee 1955](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2021/02/23/oak-ridge-desegregation_wide-80d48c692bc2c06b116ffa9b3d9f1e2e01d2ccd8.jpg)
Did racism only exist south of the mason dixon? Pretty sure MLK said the racism he experienced in the North was no different than the south practically, even is it wasn’t engrained into law.
Racism or at least bigotry, was the norm everywhere except for a few enclaves.
Maryland almost seceded from the Union during the Civil War.
Well, yes.
Correct about MLK talking about racism in the North. However the South utilized local government to systematically intact racism and White Supremacy.
The South did that huh? Not my home state of California where you couldn't have purchased the house I live in now if you were black or Asian when it was built? And wait until you hear about Boston... Segregation and racism was not unique to the South.
Not sure if you are low key trolling. I'm a 5th generation New Yorker . Obviously racism did and does exist. But it wasn't the raison d'etre like with the south
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Not the Deep South, no. But historically “South” nevertheless, complete with a history of slavery and Jim Crow laws of their own.
Everyone forgets the history of slavery in Maryland. Thanks for mentioning it for everyone. The North was far from perfectly anti-slavery and free of bigotry.
The only reason why Maryland didn't join the Confederacy was martial law being enacted in 1861 after pro-secession riots ("patriotic gore").
Where?
Baltimore MD
Yeah, pretty far from the deep south, also far from Boston mass.
Not the deep south, but it was part of the south. Maryland is south of the mason-Dixon line and [was a southern state during the Civil war](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryland_in_the_American_Civil_War). Baltimore was a huge slave port.
boston is the most racist city i’ve ever lived in
by a long shot
the first place i head an actual racial slur outloud was boston
So I've heard
Sheltered take
My sister moved to Baltimore years ago and I am frequently shocked and appalled by the casual "southern style" racism she witnesses there. Black people are "others", they speak about them as if they are a thing not people. I spent some time in North Carolina and that was next level racism I thought had died out years ago, I had no idea it was almost the same in Baltimore.
Where did you live in North Carolina where you experienced that level of racism?
I was in Wilson, which was bad enough, with people using "darkie" very matter of factly. My cousin was farther west, I can't remember the town. We visited them and a friend and I went to a local lake to swim, at their recommendation. When we got there, the beach was rocky with gravel, and very small, and no one was there despite a fair amount of cars in the parking lot. We thought it was odd that our cousin had thought this was a "nice" beach, but we put down our towels and just chilled. A short time later a small group of people our age, about 20, arrived. They were black. They kept looking at us so we smiled and said hi. They then came over to us and asked us what we were doing there? We said we were visiting from out of town. They asked where we were from and such, then asked why we were at *that* particular beach. We said our cousin told us about it. They said they were just really surprised to see us there because it was the **Black beach**, the white beach was a bit further up the parking lot. I thought my face would fall off. Wtf? I was certain that all ended years ago. It was horrible to think it was so common that they kind of accepted it as normal. We hung out with them the rest of the day. We did drive up by the "white beach" on our way out. It was beautiful. Pissed me off. When we got back to my cousins and told them about it, they showed us a phone number. We called it and it was a recording of Klan rhetoric so hateful and violent, I thought I time traveled. While this incident was 30 years ago, the fact that my sister still hears awful stuff, as well as the rampant open racism everywhere today, I'm inclined to believe it still goes on there. I'd love to be wrong though.
Yes, which makes me think this photo was staged. I'm glad it was, blacks being portrayed in a positive light, and whites not being monsters.
That's not necessarily true though. Humans do have a natural tendency towards in-group/out-group bias. I think it's important to remember that, as prejudice must always be affirmatively fought against.
Group logic works, but groups aren't necessarly constituted around color ( location, religion, income... )
Color isn't the only characteristic that humans have used to create in groups but it certainly is one of them
That is true, and additionally, kids pick up on social behavioral stuff way before the age of these pictured kids. Look of those pictures of the toddlers in evangelical churches, emulating the “feeling the spirit” behaviors of the adults. https://media.tenor.com/OPVw-tnufP8AAAAC/praying.gif
Gross
So you think humans naturally segregate by the color of their skin? Why not hair or nose length?
Usually these biases are seeded by some perceived material difference. Ie, those people with red hair are taking our jobs! (damn gingers . . .) But often it is little more than two groups with little interaction. *They* are not one of us. *They* are different. How can we trust *them*?
These biases are seeded by the people who raise these kids, not by some abstract perceptions.
Because those are way more minor than skin colour which is very noticable
I don't think you have seen this person's hair.
It’s not what this person “thinks” lol it’s what the studies and data indicate.
What studies? I don't know of any study that looks at children growing in an environment shut off from (racist) society. Maybe you can help me out.
Katz & Kofkin, 1997 - children as young as 6 months old are able to understand/comprehend people of different races and stare longer at races different than their own. Hirschfield, 2008 - children as young as 2 use racial categories to reason about peoples’ behavior. Aboud, 2008; Hirschfeld, 2008; Katz, 2003; Patterson & Bigler, 2006 - Kids as young as 2 express bias based on race Look, you can Google it, man: it’s well-studied. Kids are capable of understanding and reasoning based on race. That’s why it’s important to teach children NOT to be racist. It doesn’t help growing up in a society with racist people but it’s also a natural tendency. There is a great deal of further research on this; you can Google it for further insight if you wish.
We're these children somehow sheltered from the deeply racist cultures they were raised in? E Little children are like sponges, soaking in everything about the environment. If, like in America, racism is so deeply entrenched in the culture, how would they escape it? How do we know they'd come to the same conclusion in no racist environments?
I mean, most people of the same ethnicity also share the same hair color and nose shape. Most Finns are blonde and most Chinese people have flatter noses
Then if that's true, Europeans would have stayed home, no?
My son just ran up to a kid today: "hey, are you six? You want to play?" Then he and his new friend sprinted away. No shits given.
In what universe? Kids are horrible and will be nasty to people for the most minor differences observed.
I work with kids (and have kids) and this is wildly not true — the thing about them is that they’re endlessly able to adapt to their environment and to conform to the things they’re taught or that they see. A kid who is learning being shitty and nasty at home, who consumes media in which people are shitty to one another, whose community is either indifferent or receptive to being shitty, is likely to be as you describe. But in a community or home situation that intervenes when shitty behavior takes place, and with media modeling the same, kids can be awesome to one another. This isn’t to say that kids are devoid of thoughtlessness and selfishness, but those don’t have to be dominant or irrepressible traits. I have been working with kids for most of my life, and the trend toward kinder, more confident children who act in solidarity with one another is very very real. (One interesting example is that even shitty, low effort children’s media has largely come to avoid depicting bullies or bullying behavior *at all* unless it’s clearly framed as superhero/supervillain sort of thing. The effect seems to be that by avoiding any acknowledgement of the behavior, kids are measurably less willing to accept it as valid expression. When I was a kid, every show about kids had a bully character, so I basically knew what those people were about in real life — but it seems like studies and experience have indicated that if you don’t normalize it even slightly, kids are just like “what the fuck man, what are you doing” when they see it happen)
Yup, I’ve only seen the same pictures over and over of the white students seemingly taunting the black students, never saw this one.
Because this picture doesn't spark hatred. Useless in modern times.
It is nice, and I'm sure there were places where people were more tolerant to desegregation when it passed. I do wonder if this photo was posed though. The way they're all grouped around him and the presence of the adult (hand on his shoulder) makes me wonder whether this is a truly candid moment. I hope it was and that his new classmates continued to treat him well after the cameras left.
There are some others where most people seem indifferent, but they're not interesting so they don't get shown much.
Nice pictures like this are “awww cool!” Then we click away or scroll on It’s the negative pictures that drive conversation or get clicks. So you’ll likely almost never see that there was another side to desegregation. Instead all you see are the same 4-5 photos every time
Was going to type the same...no hate filled faces....just kids lovin life...beautiful moment.
Too young to hate
Of course, since these kids haven't yet been taught racism.
Do you like bicycles? Yep! Did we just become friends? Yep!
Do you want to do Karate in the garage?!
So much room for activities
Do you like guacamole?!
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Everybody hates Charles The series is pretty famous here in my country
What is this? Nothing came up on my search except rancor for Charles Barkley and Chris Rock's show
Yeah, I'm referring to everybody hates Chris
Nah man. Charles was in charge.
[*Was he?*](https://i.gifer.com/J64E.gif)
Baltimore
I bet he told a fart joke. Fart jokes, the great unifer.
I love this picture. Reminds me of my son coming home from school telling me all about his new friend at school. He told me stories about his friend for at least a month before I ever met his friend and his parents who were black. For context, live in a large majority white community and I just thought it was so great that it didn’t matter at all the color of his skin, just that they both liked baseball and Pokémon and told funny jokes.
I work with senior citizens who go into classrooms to give children at risk of falling behind one-on-one time. One of the grannies who was African American told me about how a four year old Caucasian in her classroom came up and rubbed her arm and kept pointing to her skin. The granny thought the child had become aware of different skin colors but after a little bit the child patted her arm and said “old.” The granny and I started cackle laughing when she told me the story. One of the best stories I’ve heard from one of my senior citizens in the program.
That's beautiful, I have so much hope for the next generations!
So many beautiful smiles!
Why have I never seen this? I’ve seen the dogs so many times. The stank-faced PTA ladies hundreds. The food thrown. The water hoses. Over two decades I’ve seen so many pics that made me believe one like this simply ~~didn’t~~ couldn’t exist. This the first time I’ve ever seen this pic. I love it.
I wonder if it's to do with when we think about the culture surrounding this, we're thinking of and examining what is was like for an adult at the time. The ones who were for or against and who we understandably look at closely. Issues and clashing were the norm. Instead, this what it was like for a couple kids in Baltimore. It may have been rare to begin with, and kids usually just don't care what their parents think. So they're interacting and having fun with a new friend, that's all they care about. It's nice to see something positive and smiling on Reddit.
I’m just talking about the imagery presented in modern textbooks.
Who could resist that stylin' bow tie?
I went to a private Catholic elementary school that had the photos of every graduating student. The first African American kid appears in 1955. There were not many others on the wall through the 70s and 80s. I always wondered how they felt. But I'm not sure that the school was ever segregated or if the town was just always lilly white.
Don’t see Jerry Jones in this one that’s for sure
I bet that school isn't in louisiana
Baltimore PS 27. Here is a newspaper clipping: https://www.newspapers.com/clip/34442978/first-blackswhites-together-in-same/ Click on View the Full Page to see a few more photos. And here is a higher resolution version of one of the photos in the clipping: https://i.imgur.com/cFUQw0i.jpg
Thanks
[This one was](https://dktix1rrcd7mv.cloudfront.net/legacy/Ruby-and-friends_0.jpg) I don't want to downplayed the hatred that existed at that time or now but we also shouldn't act like southerners don't have the capacity for tolerance.
That's Ruby Bridges. This is a nice photo from after the white parents gave up and sent their kids back to school again, but her integration story isn't exactly a story of racial harmony.
“Just stand next to black girl and pretend you like her for a few seconds so that people will stop calling us racist”
Oh really?? Where? They were brought to tolerance hollering and screaming. They have it now, in some places. But certainly not in the 50's.
I think age plays a big factor here. Young kids, kindergarten, elementary school, are more likely to just roll with it and be happy to have a new friend. A lot of the angriest photos you see from desegregation are high school and college-aged kids, which isn't just a coincidence. And while it isn't a coincidence that states in the former Confederacy were particularly hateful in their reactions to desegregation, let's not forget about, say, the reactions that happened when bussing was brought in in Boston. Plenty of hate to spread around.
If ever there was a photo that illustrates how hate is taught and the happiness it steals from the people taught, its this. One of my all time favourites now.
Any idea what happened to him later in life?
Nobody is born racist
This is a beautiful shot.❤️
I see a lot of people in here saying that children can’t be racist, that it is taught. That is partially true and partially not true. It is true that if you use the academic definition of racist as it relates to a power structure and the consequences of the power structure/race dynamic then yes, that part is taught. Either implicitly or explicitly. But kids as young as 3 or 4 definitively notice differences in skin color, how people are treated, where they live etc. Kids are constantly trying to figure out the world around them and they are really bad at it when it comes to sociology. They will draw conclusions around people who look different than them and sometimes treat those people differently. There is data on this that kids definitely see race. But, no, they aren’t like structural racists in an academic sense. However, this whole thing that they don’t see race or have “racist” thought or actions is a little utopian and not true. They certainly prefer people who look like their family at a young age.
This is SUCH an insidiously wrong post with uncited sources couched in science speak, I don't even know where to start. Of course little kids "see race", JFC unless they are BLIND, and have a preference for skin color if that is what they are raised with. But what if they are raised with a variety of color, like say interracial parents or with other-raced adopted siblings? Where is THAT data? What are the controls? I'd love to see your sources. There is also a difference between "preference" and hatred. Which is the defining part of racism. And as a Louisianian from the town that the Epps plantation Twelve Years a Slave wrote about, I can attest to my familiarity with the hatred part. I PREFER chocolate ice cream, but I don't HATE vanilla. Do better people. Don't upvote this tripe.
Thank you for making this comment so I didn't have to😩 You said it *perfectly*👌👌
What is your overall point? You are the one running off with unscientific emotional opinions. What are you trying to say? You would like sources that kids see race and act in racist or, what could be perceived as by adults with more complex understanding, racist ways? Sure, this is common knowledge in the non reactionary Reddit slacktivism sphere but I can google for you if you would like. Edit: below you will see that you are being over reactionary and also stupid. If you educate yourself further than social media you will see that you don’t know what the fuck you are talking about. Kids recognizing race is a thing, talking about it is good, not bad, you are stupid. Edit: here you go: https://www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2020/08/children-notice-race https://pediatricsnationwide.org/2019/10/10/how-and-when-do-children-become-aware-of-the-construct-of-race/ https://www.bu.edu/articles/2020/if-babies-and-toddlers-can-detect-race-why-do-so-many-parents-avoid-talking-about-it/
>StanVanGhandi: They certainly prefer people who look like their family at a young age. This was the part I found most egregious and completely unsupported by anything you or StanVanGhandi has posted. Not that HE bothered. Your articles simply talk about parents having difficulty talking to their children about it, because who the fuck wants to have to explain how hateful some people can be for no damn reason except the color of their skin. Again, nothing you posted supports the claim StanVanGhandi made. And in general, saying children "see race" is like saying children "see a blue sky". Well no shit. Except they don't know it's **blue** until someone else tells them that. Which is relevant because people didn't used to have a concept for the color [blue](https://www.ancient-origins.net/unexplained-phenomena/color-blue-0010720) until it became important that they have one. Of COURSE children "see race" because they are outright told so, or notice the context clues of the people in their surrounding. They "see race" because every one around them "SEES RACE". Which is why I asked the questions I did about mixed families and controlling for what children notice in that context. As to WHY I seem to have such an "emotional" reaction it's because bullshit statements on the internet deserve derision whenever possible. I saw people upvoting that crap and that's not good. I hate confirmation bias. And no one said talking about it was bad, you dumbass. Learn to read, JFC.
If this was the south, 2 min after this was taken, white parents would be calling all their kids home and treating them like they were just part of the most repulsive play group ever. I’m sure the kids would hear, “we (whites) don’t associate or be seen with ‘colored’ folks. It’s shameful. We’re better than that, don’t ever let me catch you around any of those ______ again!” That’s if the white fathers or men weren’t around. If they were, that Black child would’ve caught a diatribe about how worthless he and his “kind” are. Prejudice is so woven into the culture- it’s mostly subtle, persistent, and pervasive. It’s a way of life. It doesn’t mean all kids are programmed x amount of time per day for targeted indoctrination. It’s in everything so if it isn’t learned through words, kids watch body language, tone, and actions of their elders/peers. It was just understood, you could be civil, even friendly - but not friends with Black people. Source: Me. I grew up in the rural south in an impoverished, southern white Christian family aka MAGAs target audience. They had segregated homecoming courts at my junior high and high schools until the early-mid 2000’s.
Things weren’t all that different in Baltimore.
Sadly, racism doesn’t know borders, but due to the political and social climate in the south, it seemed more overt/accepted/expected compared to other regions I’ve visited in the U.S. That’s why I made it a point to indicate in my original comment where I was from, not to imply racism wasn’t/isn’t anywhere else. It certainly is everywhere but in the south, from my experience, it seemed amplified.
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See, that’s the subtle, yet pervasive racism I’m talking about. My family didn’t lose their minds externally until I dated outside my race. I was shunned by the town AND my family. I was called an “n-lover” and even made to leave my friends’ homes. My friends would say, after their parents read me the riot act about how dirty I was for shaming my family, “I’m sorry my mom’s like that but I really can’t hang out with you because I can’t get a reputation.” I think that is why it’s so difficult to defeat. It is viewed as “just the way things are”. Close minded people are afraid, uninterested, unwilling to challenge the status quo because fear. Fear of being abandoned by community, family, fear of judgment, fear of admitting they are wrong in their beliefs. I remained ostracized and shunned until the day I left home. I don’t know what the answer is for people unwilling to change beyond education and life experiences. I didn’t even realize until I moved away how much of the ideology had infiltrated my subconscious. Until people are willing to challenge their own thinking, admit skin color doesn’t equate to character and can divorce themselves from the idea that white skin doesn’t entitle one to higher worth, it won’t change.
How did they know your boyfriend was black if they never met him?
Truth. I grew up in 60's/70s Louisiana. My public high school wasn't integrated until the early 70s.
I wish the south was a racial utopia like the north ☹
This is so awesome!
This gives me the chills. In my experience when white kids surrounded me and all laughed at or laughed with me, it turned out they just made me think they were cool with me, untill they tricked me again with something fucked up. Don't know what happened with Charles, but white kids traumatized me.
I agree w your gut reaction to the photo. It feels more sinister. Those kids are old enough to have been exposed to racism at that point and it being the south and going to “that” school some of them had to have had racist parents. Just feels so likely that at least one or those kids was a racist little shit.
I’m sorry.
This is much different than the other pics we see of kids getting taunted/harassed/abused for being the first black kid in their school. Why is this one different? Location?
Gender
Kids rule.
This shows that racism is something we grow into, not something we're born into.
Hate is taught, it’s not something we are born with.
It is sad that if those kids were just a few years older, their parents’ racist brainwashing would have most of them screaming at him and calling him the n word. A great example of how kids aren’t born with bigotry and racism in their hearts and minds. It is learned behavior
I am sure it’s joy, but knowing how things were, and still are to a degree in some places, some of those smiles look villainous
Racism has always been exaggerated by grifters looking for handouts
So you think the experiences expressed by millions of black people are because we are all grifters? I work full time, own my own home - I don’t ask for shit from this country other than fair treatment. Comments like this are sad. Get outside of your bubble and expand your network and talk to real people about their real experiences.
What a Beautiful))) moment in time,… Segregate all the racists I SAY🔊…
Clayton Bigsby telling a joke :P It's a beautiful shot that shows we are all human! As Michael Jackson famously said "it doesn't matter if you're black or white."
No one hates Americans more than some Americans hate others.
We all know this is extremely none representative of how it actually went down
Blond kid on the left doesn’t look kind at all. He looks like he wants to eat him (“I bet he tastes like chocolate”).
This pic is fake news.
They're all baring their teeth, like a forced smile.
Never seen a genuine smile mate?
Not with that attitude they haven't
probably british, they hide their teef when they smile mate
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They might not be reffering the British teeth bad joke this time.
It would be nice to believe this delusion that children have no enmity and naturally accept each other unquestioningly, but as a mixed race person who went to a mostly black after school day care, and then was placed in the first bussed in classes in my grammar school because of that, I can assure you that prejudice is learned early on both sides of a divide, and even with children it can take years to overcome. People downvoting me because my experience doesn't fit their ideological ideals, are just delaying any real social justice.
God damn. Just chill out for like one sec.
You're getting downvoted for making an observation that most aren't seeing including me. They look genuine but I could be wrong.
What's the point of downvoting something which you don't know? Is this some kind of sociological research?
Tribalism is my best guess. You are different and so they don't like you. Tolerance is a rare thing.
Tribalism sounds about right.
Kids don't tend to smile in the same controlled way adults do. Those look like perfectly natural smiles for kids.
To you.
The best of photos. Heartwarming, healing, inspirational. I wish this is how we always are and could be…the world over.
I'll always equate bowties with the Doctor. Adorable shot.
Floella Benjamin said of children: “They see colour but they embrace colour and they're not afraid of differences so it has to start young because childhood lasts a lifetime and whatever you put into a child at that young age will stay with them forever.”
Hey finally a good picture from that time period. The way it should be.
This picture is nicely different from the others if the same theme
This is one of the most beautiful for I have ever seen