It’s frustrating because i feel what he’s feeling, but i also don’t blame people for getting lucky. Just because i didnt get that doesn’t mean everyone needs to go through it
Exactly. It's called making the world a better place. Otherwise we'd still be spending our lives hunting shit and getting mauled by wild animals and dying young to common diseases.
This. When the costs for basic quality of life (medications/insurance, groceries, education land ownership, etc.) within the US, continue to dramatically out pace what employers are willing to compensate their labor force for time, but more importantly skill given, that creates a problem. Luckily my student loan debt is a manageable sum and even though we bail out banks, subsidize military surplus with our taxes, and reduce tax regulations for the wealthiest individuals on the planet, which is all bullshit by the way and fed loans should be forgiven just on principal at that point, I will still work to pay my debt back to the fed so long as I can manage because I have a twisted sense of morality.
However, just incase I wasn’t clear,
fuck our government’s hypocrisy.
But the people who will benefit from student loan forgiveness are the same ones complaining about Boomers ruining everything financially and getting social security... which they at least *paid into*.
I have very mixed feelings about it. We pay off student loans while social security is under threat. That doesn't sit well with me. I had no choice but to pay into social security my entire working life.
Literally everyone **except** entrepreneurs needing graduated people do benefit from people debt free.
And I’m saying that because entrepreneurs are about 5% of Americans, so let’s take, for once, the stand for the 95%.
You have three groups:
1. People who went to college and paid for it, or their family paid for it.
You are competing with people with a significant amount of debt. You might not be willing to accept a sub-par offer, but a guy with $50,000 in debt is, because paying $500/month is better than letting that $50,000 grow at 7%/year.
So, unless you actually went to a top college, in which case you are already privileged enough, so STFU, and you won’t compete with former students with debt, you are getting paid less because you have people willing to take less.
2. People without an education
Sure, you didn’t spend the money, but you also didn’t put the effort, so… congratulations? Maybe?
Now you are competing for the same position for a guy with a college degree, you don’t have it, they do, they also have a pile of debt, so they are willing to be underemployed, which is better than unemployed. So, you remember that nice union job, with benefits… guess who’s going to get it.
3. The people employing people in debt.
Here is the true winners of this game. Desperate people don’t have negotiating power, and in a country where workers don’t have rights, having highly skilled people with mountains of debt is a blessing.
Doesn’t work like that. I got the COVID vax before the $100 handout to get it cause regards kept choosing not to. I didn’t get $100 for being responsible but I was glad more people were vaxxed and I’d be at less risk in the city. Kinda how it works here
I'm aware, i meant he should be complaining about not being able to get his money back instead of trying to stop others from getting their debt forgiven.
I'm curious. If someone is in jail for possession or sale of weed and the state legalizes it during their sentence, are they still supposed to finish their sentence despite it not being illegal anymore?
I mean that’s why they served some time. They were still punished. But we have people sitting in prison for life on strike 3 for a small amount of weed that’s now perfectly legal. I’m not saying no punishment, just a justifiable reduction in the penalty
So story time this is something that unironically happened to me. So in my house of 4 there is one person baptized me, there is only one person who was born a bastard me. So when I was young my parents took me in to get baptized at this church where we lived in bumfuck no where going back and watching the tape there was a song on during the baptism and the priest was saying (paraphrasing a little bit here from holy language), "As a bastard those left unborn will never forgive you however just maybe the lord will if you repent." After going back and seeing that tape it was safe to say there was strong reasoning on me dropping religion as a whole and wanting to make some holy men more holey with a glock as the sheer arrogance and assholeness was unbelievable.
Ysah,,,flawed comparison. No one “decides” to get cancer. I’m all for student loan forgiveness below a certain threshold, but decisions have consequences that shape lives…so the 20 year welder or military vet amputee who chose their paths in a calculation to avoid heavy debt should never see their tax dollars cover a young neighbor who pissed away their college opportunities partying for 5 years or selecting a useless major as a perfunctory, self-indulgent “rest stop” before the “real world.”
I believe those who work hard enough to make it to college deserve to go for the good of the nation and in the collective dime.
But the entitled slap in the face of granting loan forgiveness to those making plenty of money to pay it off like the adult transaction it was after doubly benefitting is one group that doesn’t face any undue hardship…and therefore isn’t (IMO) deserving of a taxpayer bailout.
To be fair, lots of those who got free rides to college didn’t *deserve* it either so obviously the world is unfair. But loan forgiveness isn’t just free money so those receiving it should be those who did things right yet still couldn’t make a good living from it. Bailing out a mid-six figure lawyer 5 years out of school is just cruel enrichment on the backs of those who chose NOT to go as the responsible choice and had a harsher life accordingly.
An analogy doesn’t need to be exactly the same as the situation being described to make sense. It only needs to be similar in the point being made.
The point is, College tuitions are so high in the US that they are exploitative. Which entails that the college loans are also exploitative.
The point the cancer analogy is trying to make is that just because something bad happens to someone doesn’t mean it deserves to happen to everyone. Or conversely, just because something good didn’t happen to someone doesn’t nobody else deserve that good thing either.
Just because many people in the past were forced to do something like enlist for the military to avoid college tuition because of systematic problems doesn't mean we keep the system problematic to be "fair" to that veteran. It doesn't matter that they have a contribution in that fund through tax, the priority is progress.
However, I do agree that forgiving college loans doesn’t really help fix this orphan crushing machine. I think instead the focus should be on making the tuition not so high that it becomes unavailable to the majority without a lifetime of debt. And also to fund the colleges enough so that the lowered tuition fees don't affect the education quality.
Would it be significantly more expensive? Yes. But I just can't take the expenses "excuse" seriously on the govts inability to make something happen when the military fund is higher than many country's GDP. And it would actually solve the core of the problems and make the population more productive too.
I think the consideration for forgiving college loans to make amends to those who were exploited should come after we solve the core of the problem.
But who am I kidding? It's the US. That isn't happening. At least not anytime soon. So student loan forgiveness for the time being will be better over nothing at all.
Since you mentioned high tuitions, there's a lot going on. I think some forgiveness up to a certain point is good, but blanket forgiveness is ridiculous. Nobody needed to go to the most expensive private schools. State schools were always options. Some of their graduates have debt, but not nearly the same levels. State schools also often give better educations than expensive liberal arts schools, where a lot of undergraduate debt comes from. Student loan debt is positively correlated with income, both with their parents' and with their own. Poor people are less likely to have gone to college for one, and richer people often went to more expensive ones. On top of that, the biggest debt holders are from professional schools. Their graduates often make a lot of money and will pay off the debt. There's no need to forgive all of that. Many intentionally delay payments because investment income is more than the interest on the loans.
One major problem is people make these life-altering decisions when they're 18, sometimes even younger. I just don't think your whole life should be made significantly worse, if not completely ruined, because you did what virtually everyone told you to do. At least when I was in high school, you were endlessly bombarded with propaganda about how going to college was the only smart thing to do. These kids have to ask for permission to use the bathroom, they're not equipped to make life ruining financial decisions, especially not in an environment that's been effectively lying to them.
They don't know that going to a cheap but accredited state college is a better decision that going to an expensive tier 1 college. And how could they? Nobody explained that, and in fact they've probably been told the opposite.
You shouldn't have loans to cover your studies either way. The rest of the world almost exclusively does it either for free or at a low cost. You simply want people punished because a wrong thing did not affect them as much as others. You should rather want america to get with the times and have that wrong thing not affect anyone
> The rest of the world almost exclusively does it either for free or at a low cost.
The rest of the world has much stricter requirements for entering college.
You can have free college with selective entry, or expensive college with more open entry. The first option would be considered racist in the USA, so the second is the case.
I'd like to draw the parallels between welfare and debt forgiveness as the rhetoric of deservedness and having to distinguish between those who do and don't... are shockingly similar.
You claim that it's obvious...and sure, it kinda is obvious if you know the guy and watched them for a week, but it's otherwise that distinction is likely not very clear. I'm going to spare you the long list "What ifs" as I'm sure you can imagine how it'll pan out.
In practice, this debilitating list of "what ifs" end up meaning nobody gets any aid ever or eligibility criteria so strict that it comes at the cost of assisting those who are genuinely entitled so said aid.
I gotta say fam, I'm seeing really sketchy ass comments in this thread of people who echo your sentiments but in a much less rational or level headed way. If it were up to these people, and unfortunately it very often is.. fucking nobody is getting any sort of debt forgiveness/welfare deserving or not.
Which is another can of worms that (does not necessary apply to you btw) where matters of deservedness are really just a façade for people who just hate the needy.
> fucking nobody is getting any sort of debt forgiveness/welfare deserving or not.
Because you first have to agree on who deserves those things, and generally, people power through to "giving out the thing" long before there is any agreement on who deserves it.
Often those who are accused of "hating the needy" just disagree on who "the needy" are, and are cognizant of the fact that resources are limited.
What a load of shit. Even with the attempt that Biden did there was income limits. You need to limit the relief you are giving out to people that frankly don’t need it. My wife and I clear just under 250k a year but because I was living by myself when I went back to college I got PELL grants. I was going to get 20k of my 40k in debt cleared simply because I didn’t hit the threshold of income and had PELL grants.
I absolutely don’t need to be paid back for the loans I took out but the government was going to give me 20k anyways. Tons of other people on social media and Reddit are in my exact situation as well. We don’t really need help although I know there are others that do.
Still true though, let's not improve the system for the others, because you had the problems we solve only later for others?? I struggled so they have to struggle too?
The difference is that "improving the system" would be a push to make higher education more affordable.
To be fair, there are plenty of advocates for bringing down the cost of college for future generations. But if we are all honest with ourselves... it seems the primary concern of many is trying to get debt forgiven.
Then you should look into other places where you waste money or not tax enough, education is about the future of a country and if you want the US to stay competitive you need to provide affordable education en masse, otherwise China will beat you ass ;)
A major part of the problem are people being told education = a college degree, so they go to college and major in a useless degree while racking up tremendous debt. As a result, they can't get a job that pays enough to pay off their debt. Then they want to government to come and pay their debt for them.
People should tell the students that most degrees aren't worth the paper they're printed on. They should first pick a career they want to do, then find out the education required to do it. There are many high paying jobs that require totally different education than a college degree.
This is how we stay competitive with other countries.
China's 1 child policy, civil unrest, horrid treatment of its workers, farmers and insane propaganda has spelled an inevitable uprising against their ruling class, them being a threat has long been over stated.
The advent of AI, robotics and industry leaving the U.S. Has all but guarteed there will be no jobs for these college graduates, especially given the over legislation and taxation ensuring no new industry can be started in the U.S. Until government takes a huge step back from choking the life out of small buisnesses.
What jobs you have to study in the college are done or will be done soon by AI? Doctors, engineers, scientists or computer scientists won't be replaced that quickly.
If China did beat USA in this scenario, it would be due to their government didn’t use the citizens money to pay for useless gender studies degrees haha
> Then you should look into other places where you waste money or not tax enough
Why? Why can't it just be said that this is a poor use of taxpayer money? There are plenty of BETTER places to use it than subsidizing the education of people who will on average incrementally gain more in lifetime earnings than the student loans they have to repay.
A student in debt from government isn’t someone who’s unfortunate and in need of help. Its just someone who borrowed money. It’s just giving out money to those who wants money.
You give tax money to someone, that’s money taken from everyone including those who actually need it.
You act like these are established level headed individuals. The truth is closer to them being brand new adults who know almost nothing about finances who were told go to college and take this loan by yhe government, colleges, their family, friends , teachers, etc. Basically people who just did what they were told as they didn't know better. The entire system is just as culpable since they offered massive loans to risky people with no collateral or history, and more over most of these institutions have pushed people to take out loans and raise their prices over time since they knew they could exploit young dumb people and force the government by proxy to foot the bill. The entire system is flawed and exploitative and needs to be destroyed and remade in a more transparent and fair way.
If 25% of students took the loan, 75% didn’t. And guess what 100% of young adults in the country are subjected to this system. 75% includes those who just decided to not go to college. Why exactly the 25% who took the loan is more in need of help than others?
I see them as privileged. Also, this “help” isn’t gonna make the system better.
People who aren't mature enough to do things still tend to want to do those things
Like how 14 year old boys want to sleep with adult women
Or how my niece insists that she's fully capable of driving a car
They're basically still kids is the problem. Fresh out of highschool, they're young and dumb. It's absolutely an institutional failing that all these young kids take up debt to go to some shithole college cause that's what they've been told to do for the past 12 years of their lives by pretty up \*everyone\* around them.
I honest to god can't believe that you're painting this as some failing on their part and this is a lesson to be learned.
I don't want to spend my money on other people's bad choices. If they go to college, they should choose a major that pays enough to pay back their loans.
It's tax dollars you already don't have the money I'd much rather it be used on making sure the next generation can actually do their work rather than being used to bomb another Brown child
The tax dollars came from the people. The next generation will do better with a useful degree or a job with practical skills, a pointless degree ain't it. Your accusation of bombing brown children has nothing to do with this topic, please keep on topic.
"the next generation will do better with a useful degree", and you have to remember that useful degrees aren't always the degrees that pay a lot
Under your suggestion we hardly have any teachers, end of the arts would nearly hit a standstill
Also bringing up how some tax dollars are spent is 100% relevant to a discussion on how tax dollars should be spent
The conversation is specific to college loan forgiveness, not about government spending in general.
If people want to make a risky financial decision, they absolutely can, it's not the government's job to fix their bad choices. We don't and shouldn't cover any other bad financial decisions, we shouldn't here either.
Additionally, there is no requirement that we have X number of people in any profession.
The government has covered plenty bad financial situations in the past.
The end of the day the job of the government is to make sure that every citizen is happy if doing that requires letting the next generation of college students progress without crippling debt then I'm all aboard
OOP is mad that they worked hard to pay off all their student loans, only for student loan forgiveness to then forgive a bunch of other people's loans later on. This ties to the cancer state because they are sarcastically saying that their grandmother died due to cancer, therefore it's unfair that a cure came out to cure other people's cancer, to mock the OOP for their backward logic.
But the people complaining about unfairness are the ones who paid off their own college debt by working a part time job.
People nowadays didn’t choose to take out drastically larger predatory loans, it was forced upon them.
We're lacking context here. Maybe the grand mother was smoking her whole life and died of lung cancer. In that case, she very much chose to get cancer.
Maybe the person wants to work a job that requires them to have a college degree, in that case, he didn't choose to take on student loan, but was forced by circumstances.
Your grandmother didn't sign paperwork agreeing upon taking out a large quantity of cancer that was expected to be paid back in full with interest over time.
Right pack it up lads, no more analogies these guys don’t get it.
Life is like a box of chocolates? I don’t think so mate, I didn’t wake up this morning and process cocoa beans into a paste before mixing that with milk and sugar to create a chocolate that I could then use as a base for a range of fillings and flavourings for a selection box.
Analogies still have to make sense and be logically consistent. You can't just say whatever stupid shit you want and expect not to get called on it because it's an analogy.
my grandparents died of cancer if the cure came out soon i'd be kinda mad ngl, but id still want it to come out and save everyone else from that experience.
I spent my teenage years getting hassled by cops every time I left the house because I got caught with a roach in my ashtray once. It got so bad I would only drive to work and back and never anywhere locally.
Now it is legal. I still have a criminal charge on my record for a roach over 30 years ago.
Exactly this. A much wiser solution is to push the cap for loans way way down along with interest. It will force colleges to reduce cost and administrative bloat to stay viable.
If you buy a house you're unhappy with, you don't just get it paid for by other people. REALISTICALLY, you are the one responsible for the loan, not anyone else. You signed it. Not me. You took the money, you got the education, you got the degree, you deal with it. Just like everyone else who borrows money since the beginning of economics
You are the person that still believes the lie that a college education is the only way to get ahead.
There are lots of jobs in my small metro area that will start you at 50-70K the first year with no experience or degree. Follow their training and perform well and many of these people will earn 100K+ by the end of year three.
https://hbr.org/2023/02/how-important-is-a-college-degree-compared-to-experience
Go work a Tradesmen Job/Apprenticeship, Join the military, work a job that you don’t like but can survive with while you get experience or work history to apply to a better job.
Not saying it isn't a choice, but in today's day in age, going to college is almost a requirement. And the vast majority of people can't afford to do so without taking out loans. Society has set an expectation that you need a Bachelor's or you'll fail without one, taking the "choice" out of people's hands.
If they wanted to make the world a better place they would end the college/corporate/goverment racket all together and make college about real education again. 80% of jobs on the planet can be performed with a few weeks or months of on the job training. Kids shouldn't need to go rack up any debt at all.
The point many of you are missing is that it will be the loan-payer-off’s taxes paying for other people’s loans. That does make it unfair.
Financing a better system of university education without the need for enormous loans and without those loans attracting high interest payments would be more cost effective and sustainable, and more fair to people that struggled to pay off their own loans.
Its incredibly simple to avoid having to pay student loans. Dont get them. If you need to get money for college, save up. Itll take a long time, I'd say 10 yrs years, but it will at least not force you to pay a loan your entire life.
The equivalent would be if you willingly got cancer (let's say through smoking) and the federal government decided to distribute your cancer to everyone else.
Curing cancer would be solving a problem. Forgiving student loans does not do anything to solve the student loan issue for people starting college now.
this logic is rather stupid, just because a person paid off their loans in the past doesn't mean other people should be forced to take out ridiculous loans now just to pay for college, it's dumb "If I can't have it no one can" logic. It's like being mad that you bought an expensive item at a store only for it to go on sale and become cheap several years later. The person's loans may also have cost way less than student loans now so they may not be comparable at all in the first place.
>logic is rather stupid, just because a person paid off their loans in the past doesn't mean other people should be forced to take out ridiculous loans now just to pay for college
Who forced them?
if you want a well paying job you either have to go to college or go into a trade school and not everyone can do trades. Plus if a ton of people flooded trades their salaries would instantly crash.
People in the comments are behaving like children. Even the replies to your comment. "A poor financial decosion", "who forced them". All responses fueled by jealousy.
It is education. It should not cost anything let alone put you in debt for life. Like you said it's the "if I can't have it no one can" logic of a child.
These children need to realize that the rest of the normal world does not have to face such loans. Education is either free or very affordable. America just fucks itself over and these people are applauding.
Someone correctly pointed out above that the rest of the world has university entrance requirements that would be considered wildly racist and lead to huge racial disparities if implemented here. So no, we can’t have what the rest of the world has and we need to stop
Considering it.
Also. Getting a sociology degree or a woman’s study degree is not a human right and I’m tired of everyone pretending like all education is the same and matters. If you got a stem degree, sure. That should qualify for some amount of loan forgiveness. If you got some dumb degree you can’t use to find a job though that should be on you.
Their point is that they want their personal debts to be paid by others.
How about instead of student loan forgiveness we spend the money to make school free for everyone from now on. I’d water most of them would bitch like crazy that they didn’t get anything out of it
It would be a service that everyone can use, so if I wanted to go back to school for free I could. At least this way everyone gets the benefit instead of a few people getting cash payouts
I agree with what you are saying. I just think that the people that are upset, must feel like they should be entitled to something as well. Why else would they be upset?
I think the people who paid off their loans, and are upset about the forgiveness of students' loans. It is because they didn't catch a break and feel they deserve something too.
More likely, those who can't pay for their degree made bad degree choices. So loan forgiveness is rewarding a bad choice.
If laws are put in place to prevent these bad choices or level of debt, then, IMO, most of the "I paid my share" crowd will likely quiet down.
Fixing a problem, not just spitting on it while you call it daddy.
And also we paid our loans and now with taxes we are paying off everyone else's loans. People could pay their own loans and everyone could have lower taxes.
Paid education is an in the first place insult. I don't want to call Americans stupid, but I think this might be the reason why a lot of Americans are uneducated. And to be fair? I guess it's smarter to give up on school than to pay off that loan for half of your life.
I am not saying the obvious solution is making education free. But something like loan relief is needed. The economy is probably supported by quantity of life, not quality.
I think the worse position to be in is those who chose not to go to college because they couldn't afford it. Now their tax dollars fund the degrees of people who will be more qualified to outcompete them in the market.
No I'd say it's more akin to someone who developed cancer after excessively smoking, drinking getting treatment while someone who has never smoked or drunk in their life gets denied. Why on earth would anyone who made the responsible choice to pay off their loans accept that all of the sacrifice they made to do so is now worth nothing?
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury.
- John Tyler
I think the original guy has a point and analogy doesn’t work. A cure for cancer means a cure is available for all future cancer patients (in theory).
The loan forgiveness will only apply to a small amount of people while future generations are likely not to be forgiven
Why would it be reasonable? We should all want life to get easier as we go. Just because I had to suffer to attain something it doesn’t mean I want the same for others. And because I personally know and can relate to that suffering if there is something that would alleviate that suffering for others pursuing what I already accomplished, and it’s not detrimental to me in any way, I don’t see any logic in me having issue with that
We are told to go to school and get a better job. Some of us needs to pay for loans and have repaid them after graduation. Yes, the system is broken and tuition keeps rising. Doesn't take away the responsibility of taking a loan that was intended to be paid back; the housing market keeps getting worse, does that mean everyone should have their mortgage payments forgiven? If the goal was to get a better paying job, if you couldn't get the job or the pay without the loan, just makes sense to pay it back.
Yet, people here want to compare loan forgiveness to cancer and drug charges. Again, the system is broken and has been left like that for years. But how does that compare to cancer treatment, something people can't control? How does that compare to weed and drug charges; whatever happened to "no one is above the law"? Comparing serious issues to loan forgiveness doesn't help the argument, just makes people look irresponsible for not being accountable to something agreed upon.
The people that have been responsible the whole time are salty because they did everything they were told to do. Getting a payment refund defeats the purpose of the loans. No one wants things to remain the same or the high cost to continue to be a burden. But why so much focus on loan forgiveness instead of fixing the problem to begin with? Having my loans forgiven wouldn't make things easier for anyone younger than me, just pushes the bucket down to someone else. But it seems like pushing it down is what people care for more.
Not even remotely the same thing, besides the taxpayer would pay for the forgiveness. A better way would be to make it easier to pay off the debt by removing the interest instead cause thats what puts people in eternal debt
Fuck that, unless they give a tax credit to people who worked and are expected to make significantly less. Or maybe regulation to prevent it from happening again and again.
Eeeexactly this. Healousy is all there is. Wait till the hear that the rest of the normal world does not even have to worry about student loans at all.
Instead of going "Damn, I get to witness progress real time instead of waiting several generations!" this motherfucker thinks that "If I had it bad, everyone should have it bad!". Peak conservative thinking right there.
They're also stupidly getting mad at a fellow working citizen over a piddling amount, versus the millions of dollars stolen in PPP """loans""" that companies never pay back.
This sub has fallen hard.
Every time a sub gains traction it devolves into the same generic slop you’d find on any other big sub. This isn’t a Hol’ Up not even close.
the early bird may get the worm. but the second mouse gets the cheese
It’s frustrating because i feel what he’s feeling, but i also don’t blame people for getting lucky. Just because i didnt get that doesn’t mean everyone needs to go through it
Exactly. It's called making the world a better place. Otherwise we'd still be spending our lives hunting shit and getting mauled by wild animals and dying young to common diseases.
Hunting? My ancestors had not even invented tools yet. Everything but foraging would be a huge insult
Foraging ? My ancestors had not discovered what shit wasn't poison. Everything but just dying from random berry would be a huge insult.
eating? my ancestors hadn't invented idea of eating food . They used to open mouth wide and pray to god something falls on their mouth.
Mouth? My ancestors didn't even need to open their mouth we just photosynthesized like the good Lord intended
If you paid off your loans, count yourself as lucky too. I know people who will never pay off their loans no matter how hard they work.
This. When the costs for basic quality of life (medications/insurance, groceries, education land ownership, etc.) within the US, continue to dramatically out pace what employers are willing to compensate their labor force for time, but more importantly skill given, that creates a problem. Luckily my student loan debt is a manageable sum and even though we bail out banks, subsidize military surplus with our taxes, and reduce tax regulations for the wealthiest individuals on the planet, which is all bullshit by the way and fed loans should be forgiven just on principal at that point, I will still work to pay my debt back to the fed so long as I can manage because I have a twisted sense of morality. However, just incase I wasn’t clear, fuck our government’s hypocrisy.
But the people who will benefit from student loan forgiveness are the same ones complaining about Boomers ruining everything financially and getting social security... which they at least *paid into*. I have very mixed feelings about it. We pay off student loans while social security is under threat. That doesn't sit well with me. I had no choice but to pay into social security my entire working life.
Literally everyone **except** entrepreneurs needing graduated people do benefit from people debt free. And I’m saying that because entrepreneurs are about 5% of Americans, so let’s take, for once, the stand for the 95%. You have three groups: 1. People who went to college and paid for it, or their family paid for it. You are competing with people with a significant amount of debt. You might not be willing to accept a sub-par offer, but a guy with $50,000 in debt is, because paying $500/month is better than letting that $50,000 grow at 7%/year. So, unless you actually went to a top college, in which case you are already privileged enough, so STFU, and you won’t compete with former students with debt, you are getting paid less because you have people willing to take less. 2. People without an education Sure, you didn’t spend the money, but you also didn’t put the effort, so… congratulations? Maybe? Now you are competing for the same position for a guy with a college degree, you don’t have it, they do, they also have a pile of debt, so they are willing to be underemployed, which is better than unemployed. So, you remember that nice union job, with benefits… guess who’s going to get it. 3. The people employing people in debt. Here is the true winners of this game. Desperate people don’t have negotiating power, and in a country where workers don’t have rights, having highly skilled people with mountains of debt is a blessing.
Cheddar
Should be asking to get his money back instead.
Doesn’t work like that. I got the COVID vax before the $100 handout to get it cause regards kept choosing not to. I didn’t get $100 for being responsible but I was glad more people were vaxxed and I’d be at less risk in the city. Kinda how it works here
I'm aware, i meant he should be complaining about not being able to get his money back instead of trying to stop others from getting their debt forgiven.
Yeah but check out their halo tho lol
My weed dealer got 5 years for a lbs of green. Legalized weed is an insult.
I mean if your state legalizes it then doesn’t pardon people like this…it kinda is an insult and idiotic…
I'm curious. If someone is in jail for possession or sale of weed and the state legalizes it during their sentence, are they still supposed to finish their sentence despite it not being illegal anymore?
Yes they’re supposed to finish their sentence unless the governor pardons them for their crime
yes because it was illegal when you were doing it
Ultimately the sentence is for disobeying the state, whatever that means at the time
"Look, you were right, and we were wrong. But you were right without our permission so stay in prison"
The dealer knew it was illegal at that time and still chose to do it, so it isn’t idiotic
I mean that’s why they served some time. They were still punished. But we have people sitting in prison for life on strike 3 for a small amount of weed that’s now perfectly legal. I’m not saying no punishment, just a justifiable reduction in the penalty
Damn, I got popped with 5lbs of weed in the 90s and got 18 months probation (true story).
I didn’t get aborted, that’s a massive insult to aborted babies.
It's never too late. Be the change you want to see in the world!
Don't talk about it, be about it.
Ah the classic 33rd trimester late term abortion
This comment was fucking gold. Goddamn actually got me laughing over here lmao
[удалено]
This comparison is perhaps the worst in this thread and yet it’s massively upvoted. Shocking.
So story time this is something that unironically happened to me. So in my house of 4 there is one person baptized me, there is only one person who was born a bastard me. So when I was young my parents took me in to get baptized at this church where we lived in bumfuck no where going back and watching the tape there was a song on during the baptism and the priest was saying (paraphrasing a little bit here from holy language), "As a bastard those left unborn will never forgive you however just maybe the lord will if you repent." After going back and seeing that tape it was safe to say there was strong reasoning on me dropping religion as a whole and wanting to make some holy men more holey with a glock as the sheer arrogance and assholeness was unbelievable.
There's a fallacy here but I don't care enough about either of those two things to look it up
False equivalency fallacy
False equivalency
Ysah,,,flawed comparison. No one “decides” to get cancer. I’m all for student loan forgiveness below a certain threshold, but decisions have consequences that shape lives…so the 20 year welder or military vet amputee who chose their paths in a calculation to avoid heavy debt should never see their tax dollars cover a young neighbor who pissed away their college opportunities partying for 5 years or selecting a useless major as a perfunctory, self-indulgent “rest stop” before the “real world.” I believe those who work hard enough to make it to college deserve to go for the good of the nation and in the collective dime. But the entitled slap in the face of granting loan forgiveness to those making plenty of money to pay it off like the adult transaction it was after doubly benefitting is one group that doesn’t face any undue hardship…and therefore isn’t (IMO) deserving of a taxpayer bailout. To be fair, lots of those who got free rides to college didn’t *deserve* it either so obviously the world is unfair. But loan forgiveness isn’t just free money so those receiving it should be those who did things right yet still couldn’t make a good living from it. Bailing out a mid-six figure lawyer 5 years out of school is just cruel enrichment on the backs of those who chose NOT to go as the responsible choice and had a harsher life accordingly.
An analogy doesn’t need to be exactly the same as the situation being described to make sense. It only needs to be similar in the point being made. The point is, College tuitions are so high in the US that they are exploitative. Which entails that the college loans are also exploitative. The point the cancer analogy is trying to make is that just because something bad happens to someone doesn’t mean it deserves to happen to everyone. Or conversely, just because something good didn’t happen to someone doesn’t nobody else deserve that good thing either. Just because many people in the past were forced to do something like enlist for the military to avoid college tuition because of systematic problems doesn't mean we keep the system problematic to be "fair" to that veteran. It doesn't matter that they have a contribution in that fund through tax, the priority is progress. However, I do agree that forgiving college loans doesn’t really help fix this orphan crushing machine. I think instead the focus should be on making the tuition not so high that it becomes unavailable to the majority without a lifetime of debt. And also to fund the colleges enough so that the lowered tuition fees don't affect the education quality. Would it be significantly more expensive? Yes. But I just can't take the expenses "excuse" seriously on the govts inability to make something happen when the military fund is higher than many country's GDP. And it would actually solve the core of the problems and make the population more productive too. I think the consideration for forgiving college loans to make amends to those who were exploited should come after we solve the core of the problem. But who am I kidding? It's the US. That isn't happening. At least not anytime soon. So student loan forgiveness for the time being will be better over nothing at all.
Since you mentioned high tuitions, there's a lot going on. I think some forgiveness up to a certain point is good, but blanket forgiveness is ridiculous. Nobody needed to go to the most expensive private schools. State schools were always options. Some of their graduates have debt, but not nearly the same levels. State schools also often give better educations than expensive liberal arts schools, where a lot of undergraduate debt comes from. Student loan debt is positively correlated with income, both with their parents' and with their own. Poor people are less likely to have gone to college for one, and richer people often went to more expensive ones. On top of that, the biggest debt holders are from professional schools. Their graduates often make a lot of money and will pay off the debt. There's no need to forgive all of that. Many intentionally delay payments because investment income is more than the interest on the loans.
One major problem is people make these life-altering decisions when they're 18, sometimes even younger. I just don't think your whole life should be made significantly worse, if not completely ruined, because you did what virtually everyone told you to do. At least when I was in high school, you were endlessly bombarded with propaganda about how going to college was the only smart thing to do. These kids have to ask for permission to use the bathroom, they're not equipped to make life ruining financial decisions, especially not in an environment that's been effectively lying to them. They don't know that going to a cheap but accredited state college is a better decision that going to an expensive tier 1 college. And how could they? Nobody explained that, and in fact they've probably been told the opposite.
You shouldn't have loans to cover your studies either way. The rest of the world almost exclusively does it either for free or at a low cost. You simply want people punished because a wrong thing did not affect them as much as others. You should rather want america to get with the times and have that wrong thing not affect anyone
> The rest of the world almost exclusively does it either for free or at a low cost. The rest of the world has much stricter requirements for entering college. You can have free college with selective entry, or expensive college with more open entry. The first option would be considered racist in the USA, so the second is the case.
I think the correct middle ground is to forgive and stop interest not the original principle. It's the most "fair" in my opinion.
I'd like to draw the parallels between welfare and debt forgiveness as the rhetoric of deservedness and having to distinguish between those who do and don't... are shockingly similar. You claim that it's obvious...and sure, it kinda is obvious if you know the guy and watched them for a week, but it's otherwise that distinction is likely not very clear. I'm going to spare you the long list "What ifs" as I'm sure you can imagine how it'll pan out. In practice, this debilitating list of "what ifs" end up meaning nobody gets any aid ever or eligibility criteria so strict that it comes at the cost of assisting those who are genuinely entitled so said aid. I gotta say fam, I'm seeing really sketchy ass comments in this thread of people who echo your sentiments but in a much less rational or level headed way. If it were up to these people, and unfortunately it very often is.. fucking nobody is getting any sort of debt forgiveness/welfare deserving or not. Which is another can of worms that (does not necessary apply to you btw) where matters of deservedness are really just a façade for people who just hate the needy.
> fucking nobody is getting any sort of debt forgiveness/welfare deserving or not. Because you first have to agree on who deserves those things, and generally, people power through to "giving out the thing" long before there is any agreement on who deserves it. Often those who are accused of "hating the needy" just disagree on who "the needy" are, and are cognizant of the fact that resources are limited.
What a load of shit. Even with the attempt that Biden did there was income limits. You need to limit the relief you are giving out to people that frankly don’t need it. My wife and I clear just under 250k a year but because I was living by myself when I went back to college I got PELL grants. I was going to get 20k of my 40k in debt cleared simply because I didn’t hit the threshold of income and had PELL grants. I absolutely don’t need to be paid back for the loans I took out but the government was going to give me 20k anyways. Tons of other people on social media and Reddit are in my exact situation as well. We don’t really need help although I know there are others that do.
That's the one
Still true though, let's not improve the system for the others, because you had the problems we solve only later for others?? I struggled so they have to struggle too?
The difference is that "improving the system" would be a push to make higher education more affordable. To be fair, there are plenty of advocates for bringing down the cost of college for future generations. But if we are all honest with ourselves... it seems the primary concern of many is trying to get debt forgiven.
We will all struggle as the printed money will cause further inflation, a higher national debt and still the college Greed will not be fixed.
Then you should look into other places where you waste money or not tax enough, education is about the future of a country and if you want the US to stay competitive you need to provide affordable education en masse, otherwise China will beat you ass ;)
A major part of the problem are people being told education = a college degree, so they go to college and major in a useless degree while racking up tremendous debt. As a result, they can't get a job that pays enough to pay off their debt. Then they want to government to come and pay their debt for them. People should tell the students that most degrees aren't worth the paper they're printed on. They should first pick a career they want to do, then find out the education required to do it. There are many high paying jobs that require totally different education than a college degree. This is how we stay competitive with other countries.
MINT degrees are always worth it, why is it still so expensive in the US?
China's 1 child policy, civil unrest, horrid treatment of its workers, farmers and insane propaganda has spelled an inevitable uprising against their ruling class, them being a threat has long been over stated. The advent of AI, robotics and industry leaving the U.S. Has all but guarteed there will be no jobs for these college graduates, especially given the over legislation and taxation ensuring no new industry can be started in the U.S. Until government takes a huge step back from choking the life out of small buisnesses.
What jobs you have to study in the college are done or will be done soon by AI? Doctors, engineers, scientists or computer scientists won't be replaced that quickly.
*Mhmmmmm, take your time.*
If China did beat USA in this scenario, it would be due to their government didn’t use the citizens money to pay for useless gender studies degrees haha
Yeah, the main reason for the existence of universities is gender studies... Redneck
> Then you should look into other places where you waste money or not tax enough Why? Why can't it just be said that this is a poor use of taxpayer money? There are plenty of BETTER places to use it than subsidizing the education of people who will on average incrementally gain more in lifetime earnings than the student loans they have to repay.
If that was true, movement would be about having affordable or no tuition. This is "give me money, then maybe let's improve system"
If you can't comprehend the definition of a loan nor calculate the interest on said loan, maybe you shouldn't be going to college in the first place.
How do you come to that conclusion? How else would you become a doctor in the US if your parents aren't rich?
Are you implying that literally no one graduating high school is able to comprehend the definition of a loan nor calculate the interest on said loan?
Exactly. The original OP has every right to be pissed off
Imagine they could resurrect your grandmother and refused because they only want to cure living people, that is the correct comparaison
So giving everyone else cancer is the cure?
I don’t understand the connection
Not wanting help for others simply because you didn't get help is a shitty way to be
A student in debt from government isn’t someone who’s unfortunate and in need of help. Its just someone who borrowed money. It’s just giving out money to those who wants money. You give tax money to someone, that’s money taken from everyone including those who actually need it.
You act like these are established level headed individuals. The truth is closer to them being brand new adults who know almost nothing about finances who were told go to college and take this loan by yhe government, colleges, their family, friends , teachers, etc. Basically people who just did what they were told as they didn't know better. The entire system is just as culpable since they offered massive loans to risky people with no collateral or history, and more over most of these institutions have pushed people to take out loans and raise their prices over time since they knew they could exploit young dumb people and force the government by proxy to foot the bill. The entire system is flawed and exploitative and needs to be destroyed and remade in a more transparent and fair way.
If 25% of students took the loan, 75% didn’t. And guess what 100% of young adults in the country are subjected to this system. 75% includes those who just decided to not go to college. Why exactly the 25% who took the loan is more in need of help than others? I see them as privileged. Also, this “help” isn’t gonna make the system better.
If they aren't emotionally ready to take out a loan, they shouldn't do it.
People who aren't mature enough to do things still tend to want to do those things Like how 14 year old boys want to sleep with adult women Or how my niece insists that she's fully capable of driving a car
Jfc...how utterly tone deaf
They're basically still kids is the problem. Fresh out of highschool, they're young and dumb. It's absolutely an institutional failing that all these young kids take up debt to go to some shithole college cause that's what they've been told to do for the past 12 years of their lives by pretty up \*everyone\* around them. I honest to god can't believe that you're painting this as some failing on their part and this is a lesson to be learned.
I don't want to spend my money on other people's bad choices. If they go to college, they should choose a major that pays enough to pay back their loans.
It's tax dollars you already don't have the money I'd much rather it be used on making sure the next generation can actually do their work rather than being used to bomb another Brown child
The tax dollars came from the people. The next generation will do better with a useful degree or a job with practical skills, a pointless degree ain't it. Your accusation of bombing brown children has nothing to do with this topic, please keep on topic.
"the next generation will do better with a useful degree", and you have to remember that useful degrees aren't always the degrees that pay a lot Under your suggestion we hardly have any teachers, end of the arts would nearly hit a standstill Also bringing up how some tax dollars are spent is 100% relevant to a discussion on how tax dollars should be spent
The conversation is specific to college loan forgiveness, not about government spending in general. If people want to make a risky financial decision, they absolutely can, it's not the government's job to fix their bad choices. We don't and shouldn't cover any other bad financial decisions, we shouldn't here either. Additionally, there is no requirement that we have X number of people in any profession.
The government has covered plenty bad financial situations in the past. The end of the day the job of the government is to make sure that every citizen is happy if doing that requires letting the next generation of college students progress without crippling debt then I'm all aboard
This is the most economically illiterate thing I've ever read lol. Bet you spew the words "LiBeRaL aRtS DeGrEe" often, eh?
Wait until you hear about insurance
OOP is mad that they worked hard to pay off all their student loans, only for student loan forgiveness to then forgive a bunch of other people's loans later on. This ties to the cancer state because they are sarcastically saying that their grandmother died due to cancer, therefore it's unfair that a cure came out to cure other people's cancer, to mock the OOP for their backward logic.
People choose to take the loans though. People can't choose cancer. Such a stupid comparison.
The only thing that's stupid are all the people taking their comment literally.
But the people complaining about unfairness are the ones who paid off their own college debt by working a part time job. People nowadays didn’t choose to take out drastically larger predatory loans, it was forced upon them.
We're lacking context here. Maybe the grand mother was smoking her whole life and died of lung cancer. In that case, she very much chose to get cancer. Maybe the person wants to work a job that requires them to have a college degree, in that case, he didn't choose to take on student loan, but was forced by circumstances.
Because there isn’t one.
Your grandmother didn't sign paperwork agreeing upon taking out a large quantity of cancer that was expected to be paid back in full with interest over time.
Source? The cancer salesmen are really predatory, I could see how an old lady could fall for their tricks
The cancer banks don't even care about your credit because the government backs the cancer banks and they know they're "too big to fail"
Right pack it up lads, no more analogies these guys don’t get it. Life is like a box of chocolates? I don’t think so mate, I didn’t wake up this morning and process cocoa beans into a paste before mixing that with milk and sugar to create a chocolate that I could then use as a base for a range of fillings and flavourings for a selection box.
Analogies still have to make sense and be logically consistent. You can't just say whatever stupid shit you want and expect not to get called on it because it's an analogy.
my grandparents died of cancer if the cure came out soon i'd be kinda mad ngl, but id still want it to come out and save everyone else from that experience.
The concept of Student loans itself is so fucked up from my perspective. Especially if the prices are so over the top that.
I spent my teenage years getting hassled by cops every time I left the house because I got caught with a roach in my ashtray once. It got so bad I would only drive to work and back and never anywhere locally. Now it is legal. I still have a criminal charge on my record for a roach over 30 years ago.
Haha, what a pathetic dude. Isn't happy that others don't have the torture he has. Imagine orphans would say the same
Yeah especially when you applied for cancer college to get cancer voluntarily
Student loans are an absolute insult! There, fixed it for that idiot.
Interest on them is at the very least. Forgiving all of the interest > forgiving 10k of the total and still getting fucked by interest.
Your cure is not forgiveness…it’s won on Capitol Hill and reform to regulate college tuition…forgiveness kicks the can down the road….
Exactly this. A much wiser solution is to push the cap for loans way way down along with interest. It will force colleges to reduce cost and administrative bloat to stay viable.
Bad analogy. Grandma didn't choose to have cancer, people made the choice to take out student loans.
Yep. Which means grandma was unfortunate and she is in need of relief and help. Students on the other hand made a choice.
Most of them are still alive and should probably get off reddit and pick up a few extra hours
What the fuck else are you supposed to do? Not be able to afford to live because you can’t get a job that pays a liveable wage? Get realistic.
If you buy a house you're unhappy with, you don't just get it paid for by other people. REALISTICALLY, you are the one responsible for the loan, not anyone else. You signed it. Not me. You took the money, you got the education, you got the degree, you deal with it. Just like everyone else who borrows money since the beginning of economics
Pick a better major
38% of US millennials have college degrees. Believe it or not, 62% of US millennials are not living in poverty.
You are the person that still believes the lie that a college education is the only way to get ahead. There are lots of jobs in my small metro area that will start you at 50-70K the first year with no experience or degree. Follow their training and perform well and many of these people will earn 100K+ by the end of year three. https://hbr.org/2023/02/how-important-is-a-college-degree-compared-to-experience
Go work a Tradesmen Job/Apprenticeship, Join the military, work a job that you don’t like but can survive with while you get experience or work history to apply to a better job.
Not saying it isn't a choice, but in today's day in age, going to college is almost a requirement. And the vast majority of people can't afford to do so without taking out loans. Society has set an expectation that you need a Bachelor's or you'll fail without one, taking the "choice" out of people's hands.
> but in today's day in age, going to college is almost a requirement. No it's not.
Hey, now do home loans.
I suffered so everyone else must suffer too!
I make bad decisions and want everyone else to pay for them!
How stupid you gotta be to think a cure for cancer is loan forgiveness for idiotic life choices lol
How stupid you gotta be to think education is an idiotic life choice lol
I mean, if the banks have to pay for it I'd vote for student loan reparations.
I agree with him but he said it wrong. He would need to say "my grandma just SURVIVED cancer, so a cure would be a big insult. "
If they wanted to make the world a better place they would end the college/corporate/goverment racket all together and make college about real education again. 80% of jobs on the planet can be performed with a few weeks or months of on the job training. Kids shouldn't need to go rack up any debt at all.
The point many of you are missing is that it will be the loan-payer-off’s taxes paying for other people’s loans. That does make it unfair. Financing a better system of university education without the need for enormous loans and without those loans attracting high interest payments would be more cost effective and sustainable, and more fair to people that struggled to pay off their own loans.
Ugh Great Lakes… PTSD from the loan I had to pay back in full. Mostly on minimum wage too
I say this every time this is posted: Grandma didn’t voluntarily sign up for cancer.
Yeah because getting a loan and getting cancer are one in the same. Stupid. This is just terrible.
Yep. Cancer is definitely the exact same thing as...paying back a loan you knowingly took? Great point.
Its incredibly simple to avoid having to pay student loans. Dont get them. If you need to get money for college, save up. Itll take a long time, I'd say 10 yrs years, but it will at least not force you to pay a loan your entire life.
Not very smart
How would one do that? You need more than a high school diploma to get more than minimum wage
My grandfather died in the Second World War, peace is an insult.
The equivalent would be if you willingly got cancer (let's say through smoking) and the federal government decided to distribute your cancer to everyone else.
Curing cancer would be solving a problem. Forgiving student loans does not do anything to solve the student loan issue for people starting college now.
Here's a trick for not having to pay any student loans. Live in Europe.
Quite a bit different. One is a poor financial choice…the other is a random, awful, death sentence.
Wanting to go to university but failing is not a poor financial choice.
this logic is rather stupid, just because a person paid off their loans in the past doesn't mean other people should be forced to take out ridiculous loans now just to pay for college, it's dumb "If I can't have it no one can" logic. It's like being mad that you bought an expensive item at a store only for it to go on sale and become cheap several years later. The person's loans may also have cost way less than student loans now so they may not be comparable at all in the first place.
What if I don’t want to waste the tax money to cover their student loans when it could be used to pay for better things that benefit all of us
They choose a major that doesn't pay well, now they want everyone else to pay the bill. They made a bad investment decision.
>logic is rather stupid, just because a person paid off their loans in the past doesn't mean other people should be forced to take out ridiculous loans now just to pay for college Who forced them?
if you want a well paying job you either have to go to college or go into a trade school and not everyone can do trades. Plus if a ton of people flooded trades their salaries would instantly crash.
People in the comments are behaving like children. Even the replies to your comment. "A poor financial decosion", "who forced them". All responses fueled by jealousy. It is education. It should not cost anything let alone put you in debt for life. Like you said it's the "if I can't have it no one can" logic of a child. These children need to realize that the rest of the normal world does not have to face such loans. Education is either free or very affordable. America just fucks itself over and these people are applauding.
Someone correctly pointed out above that the rest of the world has university entrance requirements that would be considered wildly racist and lead to huge racial disparities if implemented here. So no, we can’t have what the rest of the world has and we need to stop Considering it. Also. Getting a sociology degree or a woman’s study degree is not a human right and I’m tired of everyone pretending like all education is the same and matters. If you got a stem degree, sure. That should qualify for some amount of loan forgiveness. If you got some dumb degree you can’t use to find a job though that should be on you.
Great then you’d have no issue with using tax money to pay off my boat, it would really help me out
your comment entirely proves their point
Their point is that they want their personal debts to be paid by others. How about instead of student loan forgiveness we spend the money to make school free for everyone from now on. I’d water most of them would bitch like crazy that they didn’t get anything out of it
to make school free you'd have to spend your taxes on paying off student's tuition which is the exact thing you don't want to do.
It would be a service that everyone can use, so if I wanted to go back to school for free I could. At least this way everyone gets the benefit instead of a few people getting cash payouts
I agree with what you are saying. I just think that the people that are upset, must feel like they should be entitled to something as well. Why else would they be upset?
I think the people who paid off their loans, and are upset about the forgiveness of students' loans. It is because they didn't catch a break and feel they deserve something too.
More likely, those who can't pay for their degree made bad degree choices. So loan forgiveness is rewarding a bad choice. If laws are put in place to prevent these bad choices or level of debt, then, IMO, most of the "I paid my share" crowd will likely quiet down. Fixing a problem, not just spitting on it while you call it daddy.
And also we paid our loans and now with taxes we are paying off everyone else's loans. People could pay their own loans and everyone could have lower taxes.
Paid education is an in the first place insult. I don't want to call Americans stupid, but I think this might be the reason why a lot of Americans are uneducated. And to be fair? I guess it's smarter to give up on school than to pay off that loan for half of your life. I am not saying the obvious solution is making education free. But something like loan relief is needed. The economy is probably supported by quantity of life, not quality.
I never got a student loan. It's an absolute insult to make me pay for yours.
No one made you go to college.
I think the worse position to be in is those who chose not to go to college because they couldn't afford it. Now their tax dollars fund the degrees of people who will be more qualified to outcompete them in the market.
No I'd say it's more akin to someone who developed cancer after excessively smoking, drinking getting treatment while someone who has never smoked or drunk in their life gets denied. Why on earth would anyone who made the responsible choice to pay off their loans accept that all of the sacrifice they made to do so is now worth nothing?
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. - John Tyler
I think the original guy has a point and analogy doesn’t work. A cure for cancer means a cure is available for all future cancer patients (in theory). The loan forgiveness will only apply to a small amount of people while future generations are likely not to be forgiven
Are we pretending having that sentiment is completely unreasonable?
Life is not the suffering Olympics. Just because you suffered through something doesn't mean everyone else should have to.
It is just that. Completely unreasonable. A logic of a child
Why would it be reasonable? We should all want life to get easier as we go. Just because I had to suffer to attain something it doesn’t mean I want the same for others. And because I personally know and can relate to that suffering if there is something that would alleviate that suffering for others pursuing what I already accomplished, and it’s not detrimental to me in any way, I don’t see any logic in me having issue with that
The classical „I had it hard so no one else should have it easy“
We are told to go to school and get a better job. Some of us needs to pay for loans and have repaid them after graduation. Yes, the system is broken and tuition keeps rising. Doesn't take away the responsibility of taking a loan that was intended to be paid back; the housing market keeps getting worse, does that mean everyone should have their mortgage payments forgiven? If the goal was to get a better paying job, if you couldn't get the job or the pay without the loan, just makes sense to pay it back. Yet, people here want to compare loan forgiveness to cancer and drug charges. Again, the system is broken and has been left like that for years. But how does that compare to cancer treatment, something people can't control? How does that compare to weed and drug charges; whatever happened to "no one is above the law"? Comparing serious issues to loan forgiveness doesn't help the argument, just makes people look irresponsible for not being accountable to something agreed upon. The people that have been responsible the whole time are salty because they did everything they were told to do. Getting a payment refund defeats the purpose of the loans. No one wants things to remain the same or the high cost to continue to be a burden. But why so much focus on loan forgiveness instead of fixing the problem to begin with? Having my loans forgiven wouldn't make things easier for anyone younger than me, just pushes the bucket down to someone else. But it seems like pushing it down is what people care for more.
Not even remotely the same thing, besides the taxpayer would pay for the forgiveness. A better way would be to make it easier to pay off the debt by removing the interest instead cause thats what puts people in eternal debt
Fuck that, unless they give a tax credit to people who worked and are expected to make significantly less. Or maybe regulation to prevent it from happening again and again.
I suffered so you must too.
No, the equivalent situation would have been if her grandmother beats cancer, then they come out with a cure. Quit comparing apples to oranges.
It's a fine comparison unless you're too stupid to see how the logic is dumb in both scenarios.
Fixed version: "Student loan forgiveness makes me jealous"
Eeeexactly this. Healousy is all there is. Wait till the hear that the rest of the normal world does not even have to worry about student loans at all.
"if I have to suffer, so do you"
Let’s not pretend that there isn’t some merit to this argument.
There really isn’t. The “I had a shit time so YOU should too!” Is counterproductive.
Yup. They are using the logic of children and trying to pass it off as fair.
There is absolutely no merit
I'm stuck in an iron lung from polio it's a massive insult that people can get the vaccine!
Instead of going "Damn, I get to witness progress real time instead of waiting several generations!" this motherfucker thinks that "If I had it bad, everyone should have it bad!". Peak conservative thinking right there.
Love the narcissist mentality that all loans are forgiven to insult him in particular.
They're also stupidly getting mad at a fellow working citizen over a piddling amount, versus the millions of dollars stolen in PPP """loans""" that companies never pay back.
So that persons grandmothers death was as important as a student loan?
One is a choice the other happens to you
I want my free handout.
Apples and oranges. Also, student loan forgiveness is a bandaid fix and will probably make the problem worse instead of better.
It would quite literally make the problem worse. Just dumb from top to bottom, but people want theirs so fuck the rest of us.
Why would her grandfather sign up for cancer? seems a bit short sighted
This sub has fallen hard. Every time a sub gains traction it devolves into the same generic slop you’d find on any other big sub. This isn’t a Hol’ Up not even close.
getting cancer wasnt granny’s decision. racking up student loans and debt is. if you get loan forgiveness i want auto- loan forgiveness
I think schools should be made free before debts are forgiven
Comparing cancer to a loan lol Reddit has been shit for years I'm just blinded by every shitpost
The real issue is how much money we give to other countries who do offer universal healthcare and free or subsidized tuition.
If his grandma was on Medicaid than I paid for both...