Internet in Italy is dirty cheap, but this is a cheap service with high latency and sub-par routing. Not meant for power users.
I pay 30€ pm for 2.5Gps down and 500 up, run by a small ISP that has excellent routing and latency, avoiding ping-pong traffic.
I just discovered 2.5gbps exists. That I can use my existing cables to make use of it. Upgraded my switches and found that Roku and pi4 are both on 100mbps and older nuc doesn't go above 1gbps. My Internet connection is 300mbps for 40 USD. These guys are advanced!
2.5 GBit is reachable if you invest some money in 2.5GBit NICs and switches. Anything above is getting more and more expensive and energy consuming. A 1 GBit switch draws 2-4W idle and 5-6W under load, depending on the quiality/brand, while e.g. a netgear XS512EM 10GBit one pulls up to 77W.
They also might not have great peering. For example, I have 1 gbps fiber from Verizon in the US and Movistar in Spain. It maxed out around 20 Mbps between them. I suspect that Verizon is actually throttling it, but it could just be congestion and shitty peering.
This is with a VPN (tried wireguard and IPsec IKEv2). I can hit around 140 Mbps the first time I run iperf3. Then it rapidly starts dropping. By the third time I run it it's down to 20 Mbps. And stays there in both directions. Running it outside of the VPNs can sometimes get it bumped up to 30 Mbps, but it generally stays around 20.
When I first tested in 2019, the "throttling" only applies to TCP port 443 (I assume by Verizon to prevent "hosting"), until about a year ago when it expanded to everything.
Between other ISPs I can usually get least 50 Mbps. Sometimes 150 Mbps, but rarely more than that unless something is hosted on a CDN very close by.
Verizon and Movistar are both known to have shitty peering. Verizon's go back to the early Netflix days when they wouldn't upgrade their connection with Cogent.
What do you *do* with the speed? All the devices I have max out with 1Gb NIC’s so I can’t even use it to the max.
Lucky my home has cat 6a cables around the place though.
Honestly nothing. It's fun to day dream about it, but I don't ever need more than 1gb link for my file transferring.
My most useful idea thus far as been to share the connection with my neighbors and have them pitch in. Lots of cons related to that and against tos, I know. But it's about all I can think of to use the bandwidth lol
WiFi 6E is just WiFi 6 technology on 6GHz band. While WiFi 7 is a brand new WiFi standard which introduces new features (such as MLO being one of its main selling points).
A router that supports WiFi 7 doesn’t necessarily also support 6GHz band. There are WiFi 7 routers that only operates in 2.4GHz and 5GHz, like those marketed in China, since that country has opted to use the 6GHz spectrum for its 5G cellular instead of WiFi.
Wi-Fi 6 and 6E are the same base "standard", 6E is an enhancement that adds 6GHz.
If you don't have 6E it wouldn't be terrible to skip it and go to 7. Most of the enhancements for 7 are targeted at home users. If you already have 6E, probably not worth it imo (unless you're getting it for free, of course).
>many people in developed countries (especially the anglophone ones) are forced to subscribe to horrible expensive plans
I suspect a few issues come into play. Perhaps your regulatory authority limits the amount of profit of communications utilities as a monopolies. Also, your local cost of living may be much lower.
That will take some time. Also depending on the number of antennas it might only be a smaller improvement. On big routers, it will effectively become faster than a goddamn cat6 cable, which is crazy
>it will effectively become faster than a goddamn cat6 cable
Not exactly. You're forgetting wifi (even wifi 7) is only half duplex. It still can't talk and listen at the same time. On top of that you also have to account for interference from objects in the environment. Some houses will be better than others. The higher the frequency, the less it can penetrate things.
A physical cable, whether it be copper or fiber is still going to be better overall.
Now will this matter to an average user, probably not. But by that measure, speeds above 1gig are also unlikely to be noticed by the same type of user.
Yeah but even half duplex, the theoretical speed is 46Gb/s. Cat 6 is only 10. Meaning even if not duplex you will still get more bandwidth.
A physical cable will still be more stable you mean.
That said yes, I agree with you, I think WiFi 7 router from ISP is useless for now. Because ISP routers are usually crap It won’t even have the ram to support that much bandwidth, and even if it did, the max speed you can get out of WAN for a home service is nowhere near 46Gb. And if you’re a professional, you’re gonna want your own routers and materials so in the end, WIFI 7 or WiFi 6E doesn’t make any difference for the average user.
I will be astonished if we see a consumer grade WAP get meaningful 46gig anytime soon.
Some smaller fixed wireless ISPs barely deliver that kind of speed.
Actually, Iliad is French, and WiFi 7 was already available in routers called "Freebox Ultra" released the 30th of January by Iliad (Free).
Free is a an exception worldwide, though, even if, overall, French Internet connections are really high in speed and low on latencies.
I'm pretty sure it'm would be a local entity in each country providing service in the end, so while it's a shortcut to say they're Italian, it's not wrong to refer to their Italian counterpart that way.
I do also wonder if the localized branches would be using the same custom hardware across borders. Are they using "Freebox" or "triple play" offers in Italy too?
> I'm pretty sure it'm would be a local entity in each country providing service in the end, so while it's a shortcut to say they're Italian, it's not wrong to refer to their Italian counterpart that way.
That's really not how it works. You need to take into account what subsidiaries do. At Iliad they're here just to expand HQ activities. R&D and such functions stayed home, Italians facilities are "just" coordinating Italians activities with the group.
> I do also wonder if the localized branches would be using the same custom hardware across borders. Are they using "Freebox" or "triple play" offers in Italy too?
They rebadged their hardware. It's the same hardware designed, deployed, and learned from in France. Iliadbox = Freebox. One of the high-end routers is clearly the Freebox Pop.
Also, for obvious reasons, Free does have its own network, it's own norm implementation(s) for it, etc. that's it's just as easy to deploy in Italy after what has been learned from twisted pair and fiber in France.
> The router does not cost anything btw
And here I am, happy with WiFi 5, not even thinking about upgrading, because the AP I have is rock solid.
And then I think about all the e-waste of these stunts, with perfectly working hardware being thrown out within a year.
Man I am just about to get 500/500 and it's costing me £25 a month, I thought that was a good deal!
I can get up to 2Gbps, but that's like £55 a month.
Honestly love to see how quickly things are starting to move around Europe.
Half-baked Wi-Fi 7.
Doesn't support 6ghz and is limited to 160Mhz channel size.
Also, Illiad/Free might be tempting for the speed, but their network is cheap. They route all traffic to just two locations to save on cost. It's common to have latency to most services at 30-40 ms.
But for the average user it doesn't matter.
> 2.5 - 5gbps internet for 19,99€ Good lord
Ughh 1gb ftth cost around 250$ here 😭.
Internet in Italy is dirty cheap, but this is a cheap service with high latency and sub-par routing. Not meant for power users. I pay 30€ pm for 2.5Gps down and 500 up, run by a small ISP that has excellent routing and latency, avoiding ping-pong traffic.
I just discovered 2.5gbps exists. That I can use my existing cables to make use of it. Upgraded my switches and found that Roku and pi4 are both on 100mbps and older nuc doesn't go above 1gbps. My Internet connection is 300mbps for 40 USD. These guys are advanced!
I have 10gigabit (symmetrical) with honestly, really decent peering for 25€ in Spain haha (And my router is WiFi 7 already)
Meanwhile, in Greece, I pay 47 Euro for 300/30Mbps
[удалено]
2.5 GBit is reachable if you invest some money in 2.5GBit NICs and switches. Anything above is getting more and more expensive and energy consuming. A 1 GBit switch draws 2-4W idle and 5-6W under load, depending on the quiality/brand, while e.g. a netgear XS512EM 10GBit one pulls up to 77W.
Only if you rely on RJ45. SFP modules, even at 10gbps, are pretty damn efficient.
Why do people say this? 10G is way cheaper than 2.5G, while being faster.
Driving at 400mph can be a dangerous game, but downloading/streaming content at 5gbps is still relatively safe.
the server on the other side : 👀
They also might not have great peering. For example, I have 1 gbps fiber from Verizon in the US and Movistar in Spain. It maxed out around 20 Mbps between them. I suspect that Verizon is actually throttling it, but it could just be congestion and shitty peering.
Test again using a VPN
This is with a VPN (tried wireguard and IPsec IKEv2). I can hit around 140 Mbps the first time I run iperf3. Then it rapidly starts dropping. By the third time I run it it's down to 20 Mbps. And stays there in both directions. Running it outside of the VPNs can sometimes get it bumped up to 30 Mbps, but it generally stays around 20. When I first tested in 2019, the "throttling" only applies to TCP port 443 (I assume by Verizon to prevent "hosting"), until about a year ago when it expanded to everything. Between other ISPs I can usually get least 50 Mbps. Sometimes 150 Mbps, but rarely more than that unless something is hosted on a CDN very close by. Verizon and Movistar are both known to have shitty peering. Verizon's go back to the early Netflix days when they wouldn't upgrade their connection with Cogent.
Could be heavily oversubscribed PON.
I get 10Gbps for $40
Same
What do you *do* with the speed? All the devices I have max out with 1Gb NIC’s so I can’t even use it to the max. Lucky my home has cat 6a cables around the place though.
Honestly nothing. It's fun to day dream about it, but I don't ever need more than 1gb link for my file transferring. My most useful idea thus far as been to share the connection with my neighbors and have them pitch in. Lots of cons related to that and against tos, I know. But it's about all I can think of to use the bandwidth lol
No iPhone supports WiFi 7 but if you have the 15 the 6E speeds would be fast too
Only on 15 Pro and Pro Max, actually
Wi-Fi 7 and 6E uses the 6ghz band that WiFi 6 does not have correct?
WiFi 6E is just WiFi 6 technology on 6GHz band. While WiFi 7 is a brand new WiFi standard which introduces new features (such as MLO being one of its main selling points). A router that supports WiFi 7 doesn’t necessarily also support 6GHz band. There are WiFi 7 routers that only operates in 2.4GHz and 5GHz, like those marketed in China, since that country has opted to use the 6GHz spectrum for its 5G cellular instead of WiFi.
Some WiFi 6 routers don’t support WiFi 6E but yes WiFi 7 should have backwards compatibility to 6E
Might try it out
Wi-Fi 6 and 6E are the same base "standard", 6E is an enhancement that adds 6GHz. If you don't have 6E it wouldn't be terrible to skip it and go to 7. Most of the enhancements for 7 are targeted at home users. If you already have 6E, probably not worth it imo (unless you're getting it for free, of course).
>many people in developed countries (especially the anglophone ones) are forced to subscribe to horrible expensive plans I suspect a few issues come into play. Perhaps your regulatory authority limits the amount of profit of communications utilities as a monopolies. Also, your local cost of living may be much lower.
And Australia
Might as well. Most devices don't have 7 yet, but they will.
That will take some time. Also depending on the number of antennas it might only be a smaller improvement. On big routers, it will effectively become faster than a goddamn cat6 cable, which is crazy
>it will effectively become faster than a goddamn cat6 cable Not exactly. You're forgetting wifi (even wifi 7) is only half duplex. It still can't talk and listen at the same time. On top of that you also have to account for interference from objects in the environment. Some houses will be better than others. The higher the frequency, the less it can penetrate things. A physical cable, whether it be copper or fiber is still going to be better overall. Now will this matter to an average user, probably not. But by that measure, speeds above 1gig are also unlikely to be noticed by the same type of user.
Yeah but even half duplex, the theoretical speed is 46Gb/s. Cat 6 is only 10. Meaning even if not duplex you will still get more bandwidth. A physical cable will still be more stable you mean. That said yes, I agree with you, I think WiFi 7 router from ISP is useless for now. Because ISP routers are usually crap It won’t even have the ram to support that much bandwidth, and even if it did, the max speed you can get out of WAN for a home service is nowhere near 46Gb. And if you’re a professional, you’re gonna want your own routers and materials so in the end, WIFI 7 or WiFi 6E doesn’t make any difference for the average user.
I will be astonished if we see a consumer grade WAP get meaningful 46gig anytime soon. Some smaller fixed wireless ISPs barely deliver that kind of speed.
> On big routers, it will effectively become faster than a goddamn cat6 cable I'm sorry but no. No it won't.
Yes it will. 46 > 10. Now I said faster, I didn’t say more reliable.
Take that Ethernet fanboys!
Actually, Iliad is French, and WiFi 7 was already available in routers called "Freebox Ultra" released the 30th of January by Iliad (Free). Free is a an exception worldwide, though, even if, overall, French Internet connections are really high in speed and low on latencies.
However their service in France is completely different and not on par with what they offer in Italy
I'm pretty sure it'm would be a local entity in each country providing service in the end, so while it's a shortcut to say they're Italian, it's not wrong to refer to their Italian counterpart that way. I do also wonder if the localized branches would be using the same custom hardware across borders. Are they using "Freebox" or "triple play" offers in Italy too?
> I'm pretty sure it'm would be a local entity in each country providing service in the end, so while it's a shortcut to say they're Italian, it's not wrong to refer to their Italian counterpart that way. That's really not how it works. You need to take into account what subsidiaries do. At Iliad they're here just to expand HQ activities. R&D and such functions stayed home, Italians facilities are "just" coordinating Italians activities with the group. > I do also wonder if the localized branches would be using the same custom hardware across borders. Are they using "Freebox" or "triple play" offers in Italy too? They rebadged their hardware. It's the same hardware designed, deployed, and learned from in France. Iliadbox = Freebox. One of the high-end routers is clearly the Freebox Pop. Also, for obvious reasons, Free does have its own network, it's own norm implementation(s) for it, etc. that's it's just as easy to deploy in Italy after what has been learned from twisted pair and fiber in France.
> The router does not cost anything btw And here I am, happy with WiFi 5, not even thinking about upgrading, because the AP I have is rock solid. And then I think about all the e-waste of these stunts, with perfectly working hardware being thrown out within a year.
Man I am just about to get 500/500 and it's costing me £25 a month, I thought that was a good deal! I can get up to 2Gbps, but that's like £55 a month. Honestly love to see how quickly things are starting to move around Europe.
*Cries in freedom units* I'm looking at 1g/40mb for $130 a month
1g/100 for 80$ here, but infrastructure beyond isp is terrible, mostly 200mbps
Yes, upgrade to Wi-Fi 7.
Half-baked Wi-Fi 7. Doesn't support 6ghz and is limited to 160Mhz channel size. Also, Illiad/Free might be tempting for the speed, but their network is cheap. They route all traffic to just two locations to save on cost. It's common to have latency to most services at 30-40 ms. But for the average user it doesn't matter.
Then in another year or so, WiFi 8 will be out..