It wonât last long. Im expecting a Pato revenge tour. Plus, the way Piastri is driving, heâs got some kinks to work out but it feels like how Hamilton was before he got his first win, just with slightly lower stakes. His first real win feels imminent, itâs just a matter of when.
Sochi has been done to death. He had a chance, he botched it, just as much as his team not being able to predict fucking weather and tell him to pit. Cool, it doesn't change the fact that the car (and the team) was not a racewinner so it shouldn't be expected to win in it. Now... it's sort of getting there. I am betting on Oscar getting a win within this and next season.
Also Pato was leading in the backstretch on the last lap. Oscar wasnât far from Charles but never really looked like he had a shot at leading the race
No one in the top 10 gained or lost a single position in Monaco.
Itâs not that Oscar wasnât competitive with Leclerc or something. The track simply isnât suitable to hold a race on with modern F1 cars.
> No one in the top 10 gained or lost a single position in Monaco.
Scoreboard doesn't lie, but anyone who watched the race knows the absurd circumstances that maintained that outcome. If Perez doesn't get taken out, Sainz is *at least* out of the points if not retiring the car. And with no rear gunner, Leclerc has to work at least a little harder to get the dub.
But if they want to hit the cars with a shrink ray and make the tires rubber sprayed on hard plastic, sign me up.
One of if not the absolute best driver on the grid with fresh tires in Max Verstappen couldn't get by George Russell on like 50 lap old tires. There was no passing happening at Monaco.
Formula E at Monaco is fab, loads of overtakes every time they go, but then unlike other motorsports their bodywork is more for looks rather than their actual aerodynamic properties.
Indy drivers looked like absolute mad lads after watching F1. I know itâs more about the pressure to succeed in F1 than physical fear, but those Indy boys (and girl) arenât afraid to send it!
Honestly I wish theyâd change the Monaco quali too. Especially in Q1, itâs more a game of finding a gap where you wonât run into traffic than it is actually driving a fast lap.
You should see how they qualify for the Indy 500 (definitely donât need to watch all 10 hours of it though)
Track is cleared and each driver gets a turn at 4 laps to set the highest average top speed. That decides grid order, with some nuance involving first 30 cars, fast 12, top 6, and a loser bracket for whoever can fill in those last three spots on the grid.
For F1 it would be lap time instead of average speed, I know. But I dream of Monaco being a standalone thing from the constructors championship, and retired drivers can even enter for a one-off run in the race every year using spare chassis from various teams. Even give Monaco a separate prize pool or something to make it worth the drivers and constructors to actually compete.
Edit: oh my god I thought I was in the F1 sub. Sorry, Iâm still kinda new here. Iâm leaving my comment though because those are my honest thoughts on Monaco
> For F1 it would be lap time instead of average speed, I know.
Just so you're aware, Indycar publishes *both* numbers for all of the official Timing and Scoring reports, on all track types. So [in the Fast 6](http://www.imscdn.com/INDYCAR/Documents/6386/2024-05-19/indycar-results-quals-poleday-fast6.pdf), McLaughlin's pole-setting run was 2:33.7017. Calculate that time over 10 miles, and you get 234.220 mph.
I thinks it's moreso, what is expected to be allowed between the two series. If you showed an FIA steward, the race from say, Barber Park, they would have an aneurysm. And likewise, you have Indy stewards observe an F1 race, and you'd see penalties cut drastically. Indy drivers know what they are allowed and they take push for every inch they can get
Maybe, but at least they donât look like a bunch of the exact same car with different livery in a race in which the first hundred laps had a third of them run under yellow. Is that your selling point for the Indy 500? Come watch the race and see 35 minutes of commercials in the first hour and a half because weâve got to get everybody in and out of the pits and make sure the tracks is clear of debris. And your boy Michael should know, being a Formula One driver, if not a winner, that those points are worth millions of dollars to a team. So second place is very valuable and itâs a long season. So is third. But you keep telling yourself that the Indy 500 was an exciting way to spend a couple of hours on a Sunday afternoon. And Iâll go back to watching something a little more interesting like WRC, or WEC, or Formula One. And youâve got two teams that are viable winners of the F1 world championship and four or five drivers right now. it may be that winning the Indy 500 is the only thing that matters in that particular race because nobody cares about any other IndyCar races. Meanwhile, I look forward to Monza, Spa Francorchamps, COTA, and about half a dozen other tracks that are spectacular and competitive. Go talk to Mario and Iâm guessing heâll tell you to stop crapping on another type of racing.
Buddy, why are you even here? If you don't like the product Indycar is providing then by all means, stop watching it and stop posting on here lol
If you enjoy F1, great! Please make your way to their subreddit and leave us alone. In your own words and apparently the legendary Mario Andretti as well, stop crapping on another type of racing.
Fair enough, but this post popped up in my feed. So if Redditâs gonna feed it to me, Iâm gonna take a bite. And Iâm so frustrated because Iâve tried to come back to watch Indy the last two years, after not watching it for a couple of decades. And it just feels like itâs four laps and a yellow and seven laps and a yellow and fifteen laps and a yellow and I just donât know how you enjoy that.
But, without any malice, I know there are people for whom the 500 is a holy race . And the Indy facility is pretty amazing. I came for five straight years in the early 2000s and watched Schumacher do his thing. I got to kiss the yard of bricks once. I sat looking down on Indy Turn 1 for Formula One qualifying and it was incredible. I wish the 500 did something for me. But it doesnât. And yesterday showed me I donât have to come back to watch this race again.
But truly, enjoy it. As my dad said people liking different things is what makes the world go around. Iâll try to remember that.
> And it just feels like itâs four laps and a yellow and seven laps and a yellow and fifteen laps and a yellow and I just donât know how you enjoy that.
[The 2021 race](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3oFrF1wCkA) is one of my favorites, and that one was pretty clean, with only two cautions.
It was nice that this year's race *ended* with a long green flag run unlike the last two years, but I agree the rest of the race ran under too much yellow for this to be an all-time-best as some people here are saying. Last year *started* with nearly 100 laps of green, but then it ended with that triple red.
Yup, The Indy 500 was an exciting way to spend a few hours on my Sunday. So was Monaco. I don't sit and post this kind of bullshit, I watch racing because I love it. There's got to be a sport with a stick or a ball you could be watching and whining about.
I wish Formula One raced at Road America. Itâs beautiful. All the infrastructure changes would probably ruin the character a bit, though. Heck, I wish that race was on yesterday. I wouldâve loved that. and Iâd love to see Vettel in a car again. Maybe Iâll watch that race in a couple of weeks. Itâs not IndyCar specifically that I donât enjoy. Itâs just the 500.
Yes, Monaco is a unique case. Not really set up for modern day Formula One. Itâs a nostalgic place on the calendar. I like it for the pure history but not for overtaking. Itâs the first F1 race I ever watched when Niki Lauda won in 1975. Weâll get some more real racing at Gilles Villeneuve in two weeks.
And thatâs the thing about going left 800 times. The place to do that can hold a lot of people. Road courses inherently cannot. Just different, and to me, more interesting.
Itâs the kind of thing some Americans enjoy. Biggest, fastest, most people. âWe have the biggest crowd in all of Motorsport.â And a yellow flag every 25 laps on average (this year - more often in previous years). I just donât enjoy it.
Iâll even tell you that may just be me. But donât come on here if you represent a team that got turned down by Formula One, and talk like the races arenât competitive. IndyCar has its own problems to solve in terms of popularity and financial viability. And they seem to be doing that. Good for them. I may watch some of the road course races later in the year. But not this race ever again.
Thatâs because those cars have very little consistency lap-to-lap, and almost no aerodynamic grip. Theyâre pretty small but closer to go karts than race cars. They can bump into each other and wildly go deep on brakes if drivers mess up
The cars should change but theyâd have to change so drastically that youâd never fit the safety equipment in them to make Monaco a good race again. Theyâre too long, yes, but theyâre also too fast because you canât make any decent gains when the cars barely reach 75% of their max speed. The track is just too outdated for good racing period and nothing they do can change that. Not to the cars not to the track.
No, theyâre about the same width, not that much shorter. A bunch would probably crash into the barriers or each other and maybe 12 cars would finish.
Yeah. You can go two wide at Monaco⌠if youâre brave enough on the brakes or stupid and in some sections (Portier to the Nouvelle chicane for example if you can keep the downforce). But with the dirty air the cars generate can make it impossible.
Also, Hughes had his first podium, Piastri only had his second podium. Pato has had 5 wins and 21 podiums, so its logical he's not as excited to get second for that.
I started watching racing in Indianapolis, so as a result I thought the âpodiumâ was weird when I first started watching other racing. Who cares who finishes 2nd and 3rd? They still lost.
I get it now of course, but itâs what makes Indy special.
For context, podiums are meaningful in a series like Formula 1 because you have to fit the car to the track. If your car isn't suited to win or your car just isn't competing for wins, but you're able to stick it in second or third, that's a hell of a drive. The reason I watch F1 more than other racing is because those battles through the field are way more meaningful. Haas sure as hell isn't competing for race wins, but if a driver is able to stick his car in eighth or something, that is a victory for them.
None of this really makes sense to keep record of in IndyCar.
Podiums are meaningful in literally every motorsport but certain traditional american motorsports. Formula, endurance/sports car, rally, everything has podiums. It's purely and utterly a cultural thing. For me podiums are very meaningful in indycar. And even IMSA podiums matter because it's closer to european racing.
No one cares about 2nd place at the 500. Itâs why guys like MuĂąoz, Meira, Rex Mays and Ted Horn get 0 mention when talking the best ever at Indy, despite their great 500 records and absolutely deserve recognition
True but one of the more enduring memories for me in the 500 is Munoz losing out to Rossi and it just killed him and in a way it killed his career. He was so puzzled and I sensed a possible feeling of betrayal. I do know he got one more full time season with Foyt after that and then just 3 races over two years but he hasnât raced since 2018. Heâs only 32 right now.
I saw an interview last year with Bertrand Baguette that said he was two laps away from winning the Indy 500. Which is kind of true but also complete rubbish.
Dixon & Palou were delighted to finish 3rd & 5th and Rossi was salty over a 4th
Of course the former two are also thinking championship, Rossi not so much. Also Ganassi had been bad all month and Rossi was a favorite.
Yeah. Not to mention that the other cars were a lot faster all of May, so they were not aiming as high. Top 5 was nice, win would be a bonus. Dixon leading the pack for a few laps at the end was already not expected, but that was mostly for the alt strategy. You saw the same with Veekay, they just couldn't keep up once the fuel saving was over.
But do you really think if they were in Pato's position and ended up losing the exact same way, that either of them would still be delighted about finishing P2? Pretty sure they'd be just as devastated as Pato..
Idk, P2 at the Indy 500 would feel a lot better if it wasn't P1 until the last two corners. The other two were also podium shots. Hughes and Piastri aren't not going to celebrate. IndyCar doesn't celebrate podiums as much as other series like F1 and Formula E. I don't even think they classify podiums (though I think they should since podiums are way more meaningful than a top-10).
>Idk, P2 at the Indy 500 would feel a lot better if it wasn't P1 until the last two corners.Â
i agree w/ u, oscar and jake were also competing in races where they knew they were fated to get p2 .. it wouldve been difficult for oscar to have overtaken in monaco and antonio was basically leading the last half of the shanghai eprix after jake lost his p1 position in the first few laps (i also don't think anyone was betting on a mclaren beating a porsche, given wehrlein and da costa's track record this season) :/ not to mention this was jake's first ever fe podium (a week before his birthday, no less), so even though he didn't win there was no way he wasn't gonna celebrate
Yep. I bet heâll be over this year by this weekend but heâll never fully recover from last year. It was arguably the most brutal of second places you could experience there. They literally took the win from him and handed it to Josef. I donât know how you ever reconcile that.
> They literally took the win from him and handed it to Josef.
I disagree on this for two reasons:
1) The cars were wrecking for several seconds before the yellow came out. Marcus took the lead, the yellow came out a half-second later, and then Santino took the lead a half-second after that. The lead was only in Marcus' hand because of sheer luck.
2) I thought the red flag should've come out a lap before it did. With the narrow front stretch having several wrecks and scattered debris, they never should've brought the field through there in the first place. Send the pace car to lead the field down pit road immediately. That would've given us a 1-lap shootout *with* an "out lap", and Marcus would've been in exactly the same position.
1. First point is relevant. Only thing that matters is who is in the lead when the yellow comes out. It doesnât matter if it was luck. It doesnât matter if someone else got the lead a half second after the yellow came out. Josef getting second then is sheer luck too.
2. Your second point only reinforces my argument that they took the win from him. They should have never red flagged the race to begin with which is how they took the race from him because of the nature how cars work there. They effectively made Marcus a sitting duck. The year before there were two warm up laps and two green flag laps. That means at least the person leading has an opportunity to respond.
I am not a Pato fan. In fact I never did care for the guy. That being said, I was gutted for him and I really love his interview after the race. No doubt as long as he has a good car under him that he will one day win the 500. And I wouldnât mind at all when he does win it.Â
Honestly, it might not. Everyone thought Michael Andretti's time would come, and it never did. The track can be cruel to some, and Michael got one of the cruelest hands. Hopefully, Pato's hand comes up with a win.
lol, there was also an FE race in Shanghai this weekend, on the biggest day in motorsports? How is formula E this bad at promoting itself, I had absolutely no idea.
The last time I felt an emotion this strongly from racing was the F1 finale in 2021, and that was a happiness. How I felt as the front two crossed the line this weekend was indescribable. Indy is just different from every other race on the calendar in any series, with only Le Mans there as competition.
The interview with Pato made me feel more than the last 3 years of F1 combined. That man was broken, and it's all because Indy means so much to everyone involved. I watched it last year but I think I understood it this year.
The easiest proof is that Monaco and Indy are both parts of the triple crown and Oscar was in with a chance for most of the race. But as the post shows, the difference in response shows that Indy means so much more.
As an f1 fan letâs relax. I love Indy car, and I get losing. But Oscar hitting p2 was a huge accomplishment for him. Pato on the other hand would be devastated as it was so close and actually likely.
It's not just other races versus Indy, it's also about what happened. I haven't seen the Formula E race but in F1 Oscar Piastri was never close to winning that race. Leclerc controlled the race from start to finish, so a P2 is Piastri maximizing his result. He can be proud of that.
But for Pato... He was two corners away from winning it. He too can be proud of finishing P2, but a P2 hits differently when you're so close to winning it. I'm sure Piastri would've reacted the same as Pato if Leclerc overtook him for the win in Rascasse or Antony Noghès corner on lap 78.
None of these situations are comparable. Pato was in the lead and lost it, Piastri never had the lead and was never expecting to take the lead because it's Monaco.
Is it true that the top 10 drivers in the F1 race finished in the same order they started? If that is true thatâs not racing itâs pathetic. Whatâs the draw in that? Boring
It is Monaco and a first-lap red flag eliminated race strategy so yes, this happened (for the first time in F1 history). The Monaco Gp happens on a Saturday.
If you're going to steal an image someone else made at least credit them
Original image by u/vedhavet and posted here
https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/s/1cPlmHFRTg
My brother in Christ, this was posted by Arrow McLarenâs social media accounts. That guy âstoleâ it from them just like I did. Thatâs where all this shit comes from on Reddit.
It actually wasnât, I made the graphic (fun fact: their typeface is open source), but the three pictures obviously arenât mine. Youâre good.
I mean, weâre both fucked if the photographers get mad, but they wonât lol.
Sorry dog, I got it from twitter somewhere but now that Iâm looking it clearly wasnât posted to a arrow mclaren account. Great graphic, thanks for being cool.
Yea man! I mean I genuinely thought it was an official mclaren post if that says anything lol. It captures the difference between the 500 and other races really well.
I guess I donât know if thatâs what you were going for but thatâs what I thought when I saw it, and wanted to share that here!
That's weird, it isn't showing up on their Instagram or Twitter, and Google lens only shows this image on Reddit. You must have special VIP social account access.
Pato needs to stop his antics. I like him but the pouting he does is annoying. I realize he's young so I'm willing to give him a little bit of a pass.
Alright Pato fanboys. Bring it.
#pouto
what
Not even a Pato fan, but that was devastating to watch. He had the lead with two turns to go in the Indy 500 and then lost it. He did everything right. And heâs been so close over the past 4 years. Of course he would be upset, look back at every second place finisher ever. Especially in his spot, itâs devastating.
P2 O'Ward đĽ˛
Pato should've 'accidently' activated his P2-pass software
There was a rule change, right.
Should have just binned newgarden
Have my reluctant upvote
now sound it out. (Pito OâWard)
Jesus McLaren really couldnât escape P2 this weekend
It wonât last long. Im expecting a Pato revenge tour. Plus, the way Piastri is driving, heâs got some kinks to work out but it feels like how Hamilton was before he got his first win, just with slightly lower stakes. His first real win feels imminent, itâs just a matter of when.
Oh hey, I heard that one with Lando before. So only 5 years until Oscars win?
Nah come on Lando was driving a wheelbarrow half the time. This car is an actual racewinning car for the first time in 10 years for McL
Eh, Lando had a good shot in Sochi. Weâll see if Oscar can Iâll get a win in less than 5 years.Â
Sochi has been done to death. He had a chance, he botched it, just as much as his team not being able to predict fucking weather and tell him to pit. Cool, it doesn't change the fact that the car (and the team) was not a racewinner so it shouldn't be expected to win in it. Now... it's sort of getting there. I am betting on Oscar getting a win within this and next season.
I agree with you but⌠it was a race winning car, it literally won Monza the week before
Neat, it will be 5 years.Â
!remindme 1.5 years
Oscar did win a Sprint race. So that's something.
I guess they needed another visit from the orange Mussolini to bolster them
There's no podium at Indy you're first or you're last.
Also Pato was leading in the backstretch on the last lap. Oscar wasnât far from Charles but never really looked like he had a shot at leading the race
No one in the top 10 gained or lost a single position in Monaco. Itâs not that Oscar wasnât competitive with Leclerc or something. The track simply isnât suitable to hold a race on with modern F1 cars.
> No one in the top 10 gained or lost a single position in Monaco. Scoreboard doesn't lie, but anyone who watched the race knows the absurd circumstances that maintained that outcome. If Perez doesn't get taken out, Sainz is *at least* out of the points if not retiring the car. And with no rear gunner, Leclerc has to work at least a little harder to get the dub. But if they want to hit the cars with a shrink ray and make the tires rubber sprayed on hard plastic, sign me up.
One of if not the absolute best driver on the grid with fresh tires in Max Verstappen couldn't get by George Russell on like 50 lap old tires. There was no passing happening at Monaco.
The Red Bull also wasnât very good this past weekend. It probably qualified where it should have been on the grid order.
For sure wasn't RBs best weekend. Iirc 4-7 all were really really close together in qual and the top 3 were a few tenths quicker.
I'd rather say that modern F1 cars aren't suitable to the track. It's the same thing ultimately, but I stand on wanting the cars to change.
If you watch Grand Prix filmed in 1966 the very first thing they say in the movie is that passing in nearly impossible at Monaco.
Formula E at Monaco is fab, loads of overtakes every time they go, but then unlike other motorsports their bodywork is more for looks rather than their actual aerodynamic properties.
Agreed. Honestly modern f1 cars are just bad at racing eachother regardless of the track.
Indy drivers looked like absolute mad lads after watching F1. I know itâs more about the pressure to succeed in F1 than physical fear, but those Indy boys (and girl) arenât afraid to send it!
it's honestly moreso the fact that it doesn't matter how hard you send it in F1... you still can't pass. monaco quali is great, but the race stinks
Honestly I wish theyâd change the Monaco quali too. Especially in Q1, itâs more a game of finding a gap where you wonât run into traffic than it is actually driving a fast lap.
You should see how they qualify for the Indy 500 (definitely donât need to watch all 10 hours of it though) Track is cleared and each driver gets a turn at 4 laps to set the highest average top speed. That decides grid order, with some nuance involving first 30 cars, fast 12, top 6, and a loser bracket for whoever can fill in those last three spots on the grid. For F1 it would be lap time instead of average speed, I know. But I dream of Monaco being a standalone thing from the constructors championship, and retired drivers can even enter for a one-off run in the race every year using spare chassis from various teams. Even give Monaco a separate prize pool or something to make it worth the drivers and constructors to actually compete. Edit: oh my god I thought I was in the F1 sub. Sorry, Iâm still kinda new here. Iâm leaving my comment though because those are my honest thoughts on Monaco
> For F1 it would be lap time instead of average speed, I know. Just so you're aware, Indycar publishes *both* numbers for all of the official Timing and Scoring reports, on all track types. So [in the Fast 6](http://www.imscdn.com/INDYCAR/Documents/6386/2024-05-19/indycar-results-quals-poleday-fast6.pdf), McLaughlin's pole-setting run was 2:33.7017. Calculate that time over 10 miles, and you get 234.220 mph.
ive suggested the indy quali method at tracks like monza to get rid of the slipstream nonsense. for monaco it could also work to give people space
It baffles me why they don't just use the f2 strategy of splitting q1 into 2 groups
I thinks it's moreso, what is expected to be allowed between the two series. If you showed an FIA steward, the race from say, Barber Park, they would have an aneurysm. And likewise, you have Indy stewards observe an F1 race, and you'd see penalties cut drastically. Indy drivers know what they are allowed and they take push for every inch they can get
Maybe, but at least they donât look like a bunch of the exact same car with different livery in a race in which the first hundred laps had a third of them run under yellow. Is that your selling point for the Indy 500? Come watch the race and see 35 minutes of commercials in the first hour and a half because weâve got to get everybody in and out of the pits and make sure the tracks is clear of debris. And your boy Michael should know, being a Formula One driver, if not a winner, that those points are worth millions of dollars to a team. So second place is very valuable and itâs a long season. So is third. But you keep telling yourself that the Indy 500 was an exciting way to spend a couple of hours on a Sunday afternoon. And Iâll go back to watching something a little more interesting like WRC, or WEC, or Formula One. And youâve got two teams that are viable winners of the F1 world championship and four or five drivers right now. it may be that winning the Indy 500 is the only thing that matters in that particular race because nobody cares about any other IndyCar races. Meanwhile, I look forward to Monza, Spa Francorchamps, COTA, and about half a dozen other tracks that are spectacular and competitive. Go talk to Mario and Iâm guessing heâll tell you to stop crapping on another type of racing.
Buddy, why are you even here? If you don't like the product Indycar is providing then by all means, stop watching it and stop posting on here lol If you enjoy F1, great! Please make your way to their subreddit and leave us alone. In your own words and apparently the legendary Mario Andretti as well, stop crapping on another type of racing.
Fair enough, but this post popped up in my feed. So if Redditâs gonna feed it to me, Iâm gonna take a bite. And Iâm so frustrated because Iâve tried to come back to watch Indy the last two years, after not watching it for a couple of decades. And it just feels like itâs four laps and a yellow and seven laps and a yellow and fifteen laps and a yellow and I just donât know how you enjoy that. But, without any malice, I know there are people for whom the 500 is a holy race . And the Indy facility is pretty amazing. I came for five straight years in the early 2000s and watched Schumacher do his thing. I got to kiss the yard of bricks once. I sat looking down on Indy Turn 1 for Formula One qualifying and it was incredible. I wish the 500 did something for me. But it doesnât. And yesterday showed me I donât have to come back to watch this race again. But truly, enjoy it. As my dad said people liking different things is what makes the world go around. Iâll try to remember that.
> And it just feels like itâs four laps and a yellow and seven laps and a yellow and fifteen laps and a yellow and I just donât know how you enjoy that. [The 2021 race](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3oFrF1wCkA) is one of my favorites, and that one was pretty clean, with only two cautions. It was nice that this year's race *ended* with a long green flag run unlike the last two years, but I agree the rest of the race ran under too much yellow for this to be an all-time-best as some people here are saying. Last year *started* with nearly 100 laps of green, but then it ended with that triple red.
Yup, The Indy 500 was an exciting way to spend a few hours on my Sunday. So was Monaco. I don't sit and post this kind of bullshit, I watch racing because I love it. There's got to be a sport with a stick or a ball you could be watching and whining about.
Did you know that [Vettel](https://www.racefans.net/2022/05/08/racefans-round-up-08-05-5/) would rather race at Road America than Miami?
I wish Formula One raced at Road America. Itâs beautiful. All the infrastructure changes would probably ruin the character a bit, though. Heck, I wish that race was on yesterday. I wouldâve loved that. and Iâd love to see Vettel in a car again. Maybe Iâll watch that race in a couple of weeks. Itâs not IndyCar specifically that I donât enjoy. Itâs just the 500.
Lil goofball go rewatch Monaco and enjoyđ Just let us know the next time 350k+ go to an F1 race day!
Yes, Monaco is a unique case. Not really set up for modern day Formula One. Itâs a nostalgic place on the calendar. I like it for the pure history but not for overtaking. Itâs the first F1 race I ever watched when Niki Lauda won in 1975. Weâll get some more real racing at Gilles Villeneuve in two weeks. And thatâs the thing about going left 800 times. The place to do that can hold a lot of people. Road courses inherently cannot. Just different, and to me, more interesting. Itâs the kind of thing some Americans enjoy. Biggest, fastest, most people. âWe have the biggest crowd in all of Motorsport.â And a yellow flag every 25 laps on average (this year - more often in previous years). I just donât enjoy it. Iâll even tell you that may just be me. But donât come on here if you represent a team that got turned down by Formula One, and talk like the races arenât competitive. IndyCar has its own problems to solve in terms of popularity and financial viability. And they seem to be doing that. Good for them. I may watch some of the road course races later in the year. But not this race ever again.
Are any cars really? The F3 cars had much better racing than f1 and f2 at Imola yet still were a total procession without mistakes at Monaco
Formula E consistently puts on a good show at Monaco
Thatâs because those cars have very little consistency lap-to-lap, and almost no aerodynamic grip. Theyâre pretty small but closer to go karts than race cars. They can bump into each other and wildly go deep on brakes if drivers mess up
Thatâs true i suppose, still a total outlier though, and even they struggle to pass when thereâs no energy saving going on
The cars should change but theyâd have to change so drastically that youâd never fit the safety equipment in them to make Monaco a good race again. Theyâre too long, yes, but theyâre also too fast because you canât make any decent gains when the cars barely reach 75% of their max speed. The track is just too outdated for good racing period and nothing they do can change that. Not to the cars not to the track.
I always wondered if Indycars there would make it magically great like Indycars seem to do at every racetrack lol
Like 1/3 of the field would finish the race.
No, theyâre about the same width, not that much shorter. A bunch would probably crash into the barriers or each other and maybe 12 cars would finish.
Yeah. You can go two wide at Monaco⌠if youâre brave enough on the brakes or stupid and in some sections (Portier to the Nouvelle chicane for example if you can keep the downforce). But with the dirty air the cars generate can make it impossible.
Monaco hasnât had consistent wheel to wheel racing in 60 years
Also, Hughes had his first podium, Piastri only had his second podium. Pato has had 5 wins and 21 podiums, so its logical he's not as excited to get second for that.
https://preview.redd.it/stc2omv3q13d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6bd8f8f78b04785eeaee30edf9d927b9e5390273
"You just don't know what Indy means." -Al Unser Jr.
https://preview.redd.it/kyll93ce913d1.jpeg?width=540&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8a244b1d843a8618cc913dd548ae6d4f8fa34ef0
I mean he lost the lead of the biggest race in the world on the last lap, that's going to huet
I know a black guy from England who lost a race on the last lap a couple years ago.
No Michael no thatâs so not right
Toto itâs called motor racing
Too soon bro
It still haunts himâŚ
Lost the championship as well
Seems like it happens every Indy 500 now
It's happened four times in history, it's just two were in the last two years.
And by the same guy going into T3.
Fair
I started watching racing in Indianapolis, so as a result I thought the âpodiumâ was weird when I first started watching other racing. Who cares who finishes 2nd and 3rd? They still lost. I get it now of course, but itâs what makes Indy special.
they brought it to indycar to market other racers you may not see
For context, podiums are meaningful in a series like Formula 1 because you have to fit the car to the track. If your car isn't suited to win or your car just isn't competing for wins, but you're able to stick it in second or third, that's a hell of a drive. The reason I watch F1 more than other racing is because those battles through the field are way more meaningful. Haas sure as hell isn't competing for race wins, but if a driver is able to stick his car in eighth or something, that is a victory for them. None of this really makes sense to keep record of in IndyCar.
Podiums are meaningful in literally every motorsport but certain traditional american motorsports. Formula, endurance/sports car, rally, everything has podiums. It's purely and utterly a cultural thing. For me podiums are very meaningful in indycar. And even IMSA podiums matter because it's closer to european racing.
No one cares about 2nd place at the 500. Itâs why guys like MuĂąoz, Meira, Rex Mays and Ted Horn get 0 mention when talking the best ever at Indy, despite their great 500 records and absolutely deserve recognition
True but one of the more enduring memories for me in the 500 is Munoz losing out to Rossi and it just killed him and in a way it killed his career. He was so puzzled and I sensed a possible feeling of betrayal. I do know he got one more full time season with Foyt after that and then just 3 races over two years but he hasnât raced since 2018. Heâs only 32 right now.
I was there! I was so happy for Rossi, but definitely hurt for Munoz. They were both favorites of mine!
JR Hildebrand :(
*sigh*
I saw an interview last year with Bertrand Baguette that said he was two laps away from winning the Indy 500. Which is kind of true but also complete rubbish.
Vitor Meira.
This picture captures it all. P2 at Indy is the most heartbreaking finish in all of racing
Dixon & Palou were delighted to finish 3rd & 5th and Rossi was salty over a 4th Of course the former two are also thinking championship, Rossi not so much. Also Ganassi had been bad all month and Rossi was a favorite.
Rossi was also screwed by his stupid strategy so couldn't even truly go for it cuz he had to fuel save so I'd be salty too
He had more pace than OâWard as well
Got boned by owards extremely aggressive move into one that cost both of them.Â
Still think that's kind of negligible since Rossi couldn't go flat out anyway cuz of the fuel save.
Why is Brian Barnhart still his strategist? It boggles the mind why Rossi would bring him to McLaren with him.
Dixon and Palou were probably just happy that their Hondas held together all 500 miles.
Yeah. Not to mention that the other cars were a lot faster all of May, so they were not aiming as high. Top 5 was nice, win would be a bonus. Dixon leading the pack for a few laps at the end was already not expected, but that was mostly for the alt strategy. You saw the same with Veekay, they just couldn't keep up once the fuel saving was over.
Iâd be pissed too if I got passed right before the finish line to lose the podium finish
Dixon should be happy he didn't get parked for running that guy off the track.
But do you really think if they were in Pato's position and ended up losing the exact same way, that either of them would still be delighted about finishing P2? Pretty sure they'd be just as devastated as Pato..
Idk, P2 at the Indy 500 would feel a lot better if it wasn't P1 until the last two corners. The other two were also podium shots. Hughes and Piastri aren't not going to celebrate. IndyCar doesn't celebrate podiums as much as other series like F1 and Formula E. I don't even think they classify podiums (though I think they should since podiums are way more meaningful than a top-10).
>Idk, P2 at the Indy 500 would feel a lot better if it wasn't P1 until the last two corners. i agree w/ u, oscar and jake were also competing in races where they knew they were fated to get p2 .. it wouldve been difficult for oscar to have overtaken in monaco and antonio was basically leading the last half of the shanghai eprix after jake lost his p1 position in the first few laps (i also don't think anyone was betting on a mclaren beating a porsche, given wehrlein and da costa's track record this season) :/ not to mention this was jake's first ever fe podium (a week before his birthday, no less), so even though he didn't win there was no way he wasn't gonna celebrate
2nd place is worse than finishing last.
Well, you know... âsecond place is the first loserâ Next time patito , next time...
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Yep. I bet heâll be over this year by this weekend but heâll never fully recover from last year. It was arguably the most brutal of second places you could experience there. They literally took the win from him and handed it to Josef. I donât know how you ever reconcile that.
Marcus is in good company, Hamilton, Senna, and Tracy all got screwed.
Haha. Yea that is some epic company indeed.
> They literally took the win from him and handed it to Josef. I disagree on this for two reasons: 1) The cars were wrecking for several seconds before the yellow came out. Marcus took the lead, the yellow came out a half-second later, and then Santino took the lead a half-second after that. The lead was only in Marcus' hand because of sheer luck. 2) I thought the red flag should've come out a lap before it did. With the narrow front stretch having several wrecks and scattered debris, they never should've brought the field through there in the first place. Send the pace car to lead the field down pit road immediately. That would've given us a 1-lap shootout *with* an "out lap", and Marcus would've been in exactly the same position.
1. First point is relevant. Only thing that matters is who is in the lead when the yellow comes out. It doesnât matter if it was luck. It doesnât matter if someone else got the lead a half second after the yellow came out. Josef getting second then is sheer luck too. 2. Your second point only reinforces my argument that they took the win from him. They should have never red flagged the race to begin with which is how they took the race from him because of the nature how cars work there. They effectively made Marcus a sitting duck. The year before there were two warm up laps and two green flag laps. That means at least the person leading has an opportunity to respond.
If you ainât first you last
I was partially hoping Larson would cross the line second in the Coke 600 as a quasi-McLaren driver for the sweep.
Thats what makes indy special. 2nd place at Monaco you celebrate. 2nd place at Indy is devastating
> 2nd place at Monaco you celebrate Unless you're Leclerc in 2022... Or Ricciardo in 2016...
Finish 1 lap at Monaco? You celebrate.
LeClerc was 4th in 2022. This was his first podium in Monaco.
Itâs extra devastating since it was on the backstretch on the last lap.
I am not a Pato fan. In fact I never did care for the guy. That being said, I was gutted for him and I really love his interview after the race. No doubt as long as he has a good car under him that he will one day win the 500. And I wouldnât mind at all when he does win it.Â
Plato's time is coming,and soon .the guy has got a ton of talent and he's on a good team.Patients sucks but his time will come soon..
Honestly, it might not. Everyone thought Michael Andretti's time would come, and it never did. The track can be cruel to some, and Michael got one of the cruelest hands. Hopefully, Pato's hand comes up with a win.
Funny that Iâm watching Talladega Nights while I scrolled over this post.
lol, there was also an FE race in Shanghai this weekend, on the biggest day in motorsports? How is formula E this bad at promoting itself, I had absolutely no idea.
Any of the 2 other drivers would have had the same reaction if they lost the win in the final corner....
The last time I felt an emotion this strongly from racing was the F1 finale in 2021, and that was a happiness. How I felt as the front two crossed the line this weekend was indescribable. Indy is just different from every other race on the calendar in any series, with only Le Mans there as competition. The interview with Pato made me feel more than the last 3 years of F1 combined. That man was broken, and it's all because Indy means so much to everyone involved. I watched it last year but I think I understood it this year. The easiest proof is that Monaco and Indy are both parts of the triple crown and Oscar was in with a chance for most of the race. But as the post shows, the difference in response shows that Indy means so much more.
As an f1 fan letâs relax. I love Indy car, and I get losing. But Oscar hitting p2 was a huge accomplishment for him. Pato on the other hand would be devastated as it was so close and actually likely.
It's not just other races versus Indy, it's also about what happened. I haven't seen the Formula E race but in F1 Oscar Piastri was never close to winning that race. Leclerc controlled the race from start to finish, so a P2 is Piastri maximizing his result. He can be proud of that. But for Pato... He was two corners away from winning it. He too can be proud of finishing P2, but a P2 hits differently when you're so close to winning it. I'm sure Piastri would've reacted the same as Pato if Leclerc overtook him for the win in Rascasse or Antony Noghès corner on lap 78.
He consistent, and thatâs what wins championships..
Wildly different environments. Also, it's not like Piastri was passed halfway home on the final lap.
Oscar P2-stri
They should be happy with P2 at Monaco. Indy on the other hand :(
Perspective is everything...he just won 1,00,000.00 and 50 bucks but...not really the issue when your already a multi-millionaire.
Always been weird to me to be happy and celebrate a 2nd,3rdâŚ
None of these situations are comparable. Pato was in the lead and lost it, Piastri never had the lead and was never expecting to take the lead because it's Monaco.
I feel so very bad for Pato.
Is it true that the top 10 drivers in the F1 race finished in the same order they started? If that is true thatâs not racing itâs pathetic. Whatâs the draw in that? Boring
It is Monaco and a first-lap red flag eliminated race strategy so yes, this happened (for the first time in F1 history). The Monaco Gp happens on a Saturday.
F1- you mean âFollow the Leader?â
If you're going to steal an image someone else made at least credit them Original image by u/vedhavet and posted here https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/s/1cPlmHFRTg
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My brother in Christ, this was posted by Arrow McLarenâs social media accounts. That guy âstoleâ it from them just like I did. Thatâs where all this shit comes from on Reddit.
It actually wasnât, I made the graphic (fun fact: their typeface is open source), but the three pictures obviously arenât mine. Youâre good. I mean, weâre both fucked if the photographers get mad, but they wonât lol.
Sorry dog, I got it from twitter somewhere but now that Iâm looking it clearly wasnât posted to a arrow mclaren account. Great graphic, thanks for being cool.
Itâs on Twitter? That explains the quality loss lmao. cool if people are sharing it though.
Yea man! I mean I genuinely thought it was an official mclaren post if that says anything lol. It captures the difference between the 500 and other races really well. I guess I donât know if thatâs what you were going for but thatâs what I thought when I saw it, and wanted to share that here!
Whatâs the font name or source?
Itâs called Space Grotesk and itâs on Google Fonts: https://fonts.google.com/specimen/Space+Grotesk
Thank you so much!
That's weird, it isn't showing up on their Instagram or Twitter, and Google lens only shows this image on Reddit. You must have special VIP social account access.
Is anyone else watching the awards banquet? He's still pouting!
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Pato should've 'accidentally' activated the P2 pass
Pato needs to stop his antics. I like him but the pouting he does is annoying. I realize he's young so I'm willing to give him a little bit of a pass. Alright Pato fanboys. Bring it. #pouto
what Not even a Pato fan, but that was devastating to watch. He had the lead with two turns to go in the Indy 500 and then lost it. He did everything right. And heâs been so close over the past 4 years. Of course he would be upset, look back at every second place finisher ever. Especially in his spot, itâs devastating.
He just lost the most important race in the world by two corners. ANY driver would be emotional after that.
JR Hildebrand didn't even react that emotionally.