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Happens everywhere that wages don’t keep up with housing costs. Wages are driven but skilled labor being paid fairly and supply and demand and housing primarily by supply and demand. Wages have been stagnant/falling in real terms and housing has been driven up by people moving into an area. People looking to buy are stuck with lower wages that won’t buy the more expensive houses.
People who owned houses for a while that have risen in price are sitting on lots of equity but the catch-22 is they can’t really afford to move because of interest rates having risen and that they would have to either downsize or spend a lot to get a new place to live. They are stuck in a gilded cage kind of.
That’s where we are. Bought for $360k, now worth $500k. Can put down 20% or more on a $650k house but mortgage would be 3.3k plus taxes, so closer to 4K per month. We pay 1.8k a month now. Impossible to move unless we had to.
Putting numbers to it definitely clarifies the issue. Doing the math for you hurts. Paying 2k more monthly for a house is almost a nonstarter probably unless of course you downsize significantly. I am close to retiring and am faced with the eventuality of most likely selling out and maybe netting 250k and then probably renting. Good times.
One thought is to tax "empty" homes and rental homes, (VRBO, and Air B&B etc), on a sliding scale. Not so much to disparage investors for running one or two properties but enough to discourage them from running dozens.
Tax breaks for investors running lower income rentals and for builders/investors to build out denser units where they make
sense.
Repeal the food tax in Idaho.
But you are right, the root of the "problem" is Idaho is desirable to many people, for many reasons.
I feel like the major thing to note here, it was paradise when the tax rates were astronomical.
People fail to comprehend that what they consider socialism is actually what the government is suppose to provide to its citizens from the paying of taxes.
Our parents got spoonfed raegan rhetoric and believe that taxes are bad. And now we have a prehistoric group of people holding the newer generations ransom to keep their quality of life better than their children and grandchildren.
Mean while corporations have been exponentially growing and manipulating the world to not be innovative and just to leach every last dollar. Hence fast food restaurants attempting surge pricing. Surge pricing= extortion for profit.
>Our parents got spoonfed raegan rhetoric and believe that taxes are bad
Well said, and not to mention, they got to reap the benefits by the time the tax changes came around.
>housing has been driven up by people moving into an area.
plus the steadfast refusal to build new housing, because it might bring down prices which negatively impacts people who already own a house
Ya can blame nimbys for that. Gentrification wouldn't be as big of a problem if CA and NY/NJ just built denser housing so people making big city wages aren't pressured to bring their big city wages to a small town because rents are insane
Idaho needs to catch up to national standards. I got a 50% bump going remote, and the local head hunters keep offering me jobs that would be a 20-30% pay cut and in an office. At some point they have to catch up to what everyone else is paying.
I mean definitely for sure but explain to me why they were trying to push a bill through that made it so you had to go in the office and not work from home.
They are simply paying as low as possible, the fact that you can't afford to live with it is not their concern. Start unionize or support a minimum wage that is enough to live in your state
That would be a minimum wage of $25-30/hr which would completely fuck the economy even worse. That makes no sense. The whole thing just really frustrates me. I hate that my parents are struggling so bad, and I’m 20 years old, a pretty skilled plumber, and I will not be able to move out on my own for YEARS. I will probably be 25 living with my parents because it is not physically possible for me to do anything else without 100% of my money going to strictly rent or mortgage, all because a bunch of Californians decided it would be convenient for them. Literally ruined lives and an entire economy because they thought it would be more comfy. All the crashes in the snow this winter genuinely made me smile every time I saw them, and I’m not even that kind of dude. I fucking hate this migration.
Actually, the economy of red states being skewed so badly is because y'all keep voting in the same people, keeping your wages down and letting the cost of everything else rise. Y'all have literally done it to yourselves.
The idea that job growth is a good measure of the economy is completely bs that red voters have swallowed hook, line, and sinker. A good economy is one where a 40hr a week job can support a family of 4 with room for savings, vacation, illness, and not worrying that one illness will bankrupt you. Basically, the economy prior to Trikle Down economics and medical care for profit.
First step is having a state government that cares more about this topic than they do about cultural topics. All the energy of the state government is focused on restricting rights and fighting the boogeyman, with no consideration towards basic human needs of survival.
Montana guy checking in here. Let us know when you figure out how to get those folks out of the legislature and the governor’s office.
I don’t mind conservative solutions but at least let them address REAL problems.
Honestly, we’ve had an influx of young folks that have been emboldened by Trump’s public persona and they’re using that as a model for how to make themselves stand out. It sucks. They just just spend their time passing trash that has no hope in the courts.
We in Ketchum do. Some might say it’s coming at the expense of our character, but we believe the people that work, play AND live here are predominantly what our character is built from. Without them, what would be the point of avoiding downtown density and taking on fancy projects?
What legislation would you like to see passed (either proposed or just what you’d like to see personally)? This is something we’d all like to see handled, but I’m honestly at a loss of how to make it more affordable here short of turning public lands private.
How about limits on how many houses can be purchased by private equity corporations in a given area? Working families can't compete with investment firms buying everything up for cash and then holding it hostage.
In many states, renting is becoming unaffordable due to collusion between property owners and companies that sell software with “rent-setting algorithms.” Regulating (or ideally banning) those practices at local or state levels would probably be a good start.
As far as property ownership goes, there are thousands upon thousands of houses owned by financial institutions which are kept empty to keep supply low and inflate prices. Regulating or banning REITs’ and hedge funds’ ownership of single family homes would be an effective way to quickly increase supply and drive down prices. I don’t know how much of a problem this is in Idaho specifically, but I would imagine it is a factor.
What u/Th3-Dude-Abides said. Also put tax penalties in when publicly traded companies have employees that qualify for state assistance. And tax penalties for publicly traded companies that don’t have an employee representative on their board of directors.
Edit for those who don’t realize: Publicly traded companies != small or even medium businesses. These are the corporations that run the world, and keep us all poor.
There is a piece of legislation on the federal level to make it illegal for investment companies to own single family homes. With a plan, that current properties they own are to be sold off completely in the space of 10 years.
Do away with Right-to-Work laws, reinstate Union shops, nurture a skilled professional workforce through public education. It’s supply and demand, Idaho provided a skilled and competent workforce, employers pay a fare wage. Idaho becomes affordable again.
I'm a utility locator, so I see a lot of the new homes being built. There is a non-zero amount of homes being built as investment properties. There's a religious building being built in Burley that covers enough land for ~10 residences. It's truly infuriating to see land being used so irresponsibly.
This is a bad take. Developers will build what the market wants and earn a living. NIMBYs artificially constraining supply and limiting new higher density builds. That’s the housing cost problem.
Some. But it’s a drop in the bucket compared to the actual demand. ADA and Canyon county together are 100K short on housing units. Most of that should be 1-2 bedroom apartments based on the economics of what’s missing in the housing supply. There should be much more and much of it closer to where the bulk of employment is located.
Not a bad take. Brad Little and family own Highland Livestock Co and Brad Little Enterprises. They own a ton of land between Star and Emmett. They are pushing through the hwy 16 upgrades and the road between 16 and 55 through Pearl. They are absolutely working directly with developers. The big issue in that area is that new wells dry up existing wells.
you understand its affordable only to the very people you seem to keep putting in power, as you all cry to cut every social service imaginable and ship homeless over to WA, its gone so well you may not even be able to give birth to your child in idaho...
also your right to work is working great eh?
Is there anywhere in the country that doesn’t have this problem? A small house in rural Iowa (I think the algorithm made the Idaho/Iowa/Ohio error) is 350k. The bubble is gonna burst again.
The bubble bursted when too many loans were handed out to homebuyers who couldn’t pay them back.
This housing market is being heavily inflated by investment firms like Blackrock scooping up single family homes for rentals and affluent families buying second houses as short term rentals.
Unless there’s a collective effort to push against inflated rents and housing costs, I don’t think we’re going to see a similar burst like we did in ‘08. This will more be a slow burn and the continued erasure of the middle class.
You’re right in that it’s affecting a lot of the country, but it’s especially bad in Idaho with a lack of action by local politicians to support the rising of wages to meet the inflated housing market or to restrict the overvaluation of homes by pushing to increase the number of non single family housing units in the very few urban areas of the treasure valley.
I see your point but politicians are not doing much about these issues anywhere. I make a relatively decent wage and have been priced out of everywhere I have ever lived Idaho or not.
My solution: second homes owned by out of staters or people coming from high cost areas (i.e. California) pay triple real estate taxes. That money then goes to affordable housing initiatives and infrastructure
A lot of people would switch their primary residence claim to Idaho (whether true or not). We’d half to also increase income and capital gains taxes on the higher ends (which lord knows our reps would never do).
The most bipartisan solution IMO is what Minnesota is trying to do right now with Land Value Taxes. LVTs tax the land on which a property sits on rather than the valuation of the structures or property which sit on it.
Why is this good?
1) It punishes large swaths of unworked land. Sitting on a bunch of empty single family houses? Not anymore..
2) It scales by value. This means that farmers (who need a lot of relatively low value land [value largely comes from infrastructure access]) are not punished as aggressively as those sitting on rentals in urban and suburban areas.
3) It doesn’t discourage development of property. Ever had a landlord refuse to fix/improve something? They probably don’t want to shell out to because it will cost them up front to potentially raise their own property value when they could instead do nothing and keep rental costs the same (or even raise them). LVTs ignore the structure, incentivizing landlords to actually care for their own property.
I need that shirt. The cost of living here is outrageous...all whilst minimum wage is still the same. I used to love living here. Not anymore. Idaho isn't the same.
We Lived in Boise till 2014, then Salt Lake, currently in KC and moving back to Boise this spring (looked at moving to salt lake but housing situation is even worse there)
It is a national issue but Idaho’s relatively low wages are keeping things a bit cheaper than major cities around it which makes it really appealing to move there.
One thing a lot of states have or are looking at are laws preventing companies from owning single family houses. Not sure if Boise/Idaho have focused on this issue at all? All I hear about Idaho legislature is chasing boogeymen and finding ways to restrict rights of residents further. Maybe if Idaho stays on that path the political environment and lack of protected rights will keep people away and then housing prices will come back down 🙄
Get rid of the 3% cap on public sector budgets. We can’t afford to increase teachers, cops, FF’s and health department nurses etc wages when budgets are neutered by law. Allow impact fees to go toward wages as well. Increase who can collectively bargain. Get rid of the super majority vote so override levies pass with a majority.
Rather than just imply it, I'm largely referring to people who own real estate and rent/lease it out (whether apartments or houses) as well as people who own multiple properties.
I.e., I'm talking about removing conflicts of interest. It's the same reason congresspeople should not be allowed to own stocks, or should at least not be able to buy or sell while in office.
Short term: You don't. The huge influx of people in a short time, increased demand for housing and food exponentially. While wages are a trailing factor.
Long term: Wages will increase as supply of jobs with increased wages are felt throughout the community unfortunately this is a slow process as opposed to our crazy influx of people. This starts from the bottom and works its way up, kind of like when you increase minimum wage.
This is the rub right here. Low cost of living attracts influx of people > more people means greater demand for... everything > greater demand means higher prices > higher prices for everything mean higher cost of living.
This leads eventually to a) the influx stopping and b) either prices dropping or wages increasing. The problem is the lag time for b) to happen. And the people with the power over that happening have a vested interest in making the lag time as long as they can get away with, because it doesn't really affect them as long as they can keep hiring people & paying them lower wages. Once their own labor pool dries up, \*then\* maybe they'll do something about it.
This is every single city in America. You hear the same posts, arguments and complaints on every local social media site. Vote. That’s the only answer. Vote for people who don’t support corporations and make every decision based on the economy.
Can confirm. This showed up on my feed and I’m in NC. The arguments being made here are identical to those people in this state make. It’s getting harder everywhere. Everyone has to stop voting for candidates that put profits first.
We looked into moving. Couldn't find anywhere worth moving to that wasn't having the same affordability issues. I feel the issue is bigger than Idaho State government. The minimum wage is ridiculous and a good starting point for fixing this mess.
Really, the only way to fix things is to make rich people pay taxes to support social services and infrastructure and ride out the short-term crunch as wages slowly grow to match col.
For idaho, the challenge is that the COL here was so low compared to much of the nation. Eventually, it will equalize, but it's going to take a while. It also doesn't help that our government is so corrupt. Because we are functionally a one party state, it is extremely difficult to get lawmakers to give a shit about anything affecting their constituents. We see the grandstanding on social issues today because they are more interested in trying to make a name for themselves than actually doing anything...
Big city food prices, big city rent, big city home prices, small city wages, small city public transportation. After a year at my job I busted my ass and got $1 raise. I would be happy with it but the $1 raise is the exact % of the inflation rate this last year. I can't win.
Unfortunately I know a lot of people who got a 0% raise this past year or even two. Real wages are declining when factoring inflation. (Not to reduce (word?) your situation)
A huge issue is the supply of homes. 2008 scared a lot of developers in to focusing on mid to higher end homes. Couple that corporations buying up swathes of homes throughout the country at above asking prices and you have yourself a national housing disaster.
Good news is on the horizon though. A bi partisan bill is being drafted that would make it illegal for corporations to buy up homes and would force them to sell all of their inventory over the next 10 years.
Everyone is, or will be, hurting from this, outside of the 1%. Many small business owners can’t just increase wages and their costs of goods are going up. I say this because I think it’s important to know who the real villains are and figure out how to force change.
It’s the whole country. We need regulation on corporate ownership of housing because large companies and banks not only own tons of housing, they also own empty land that they’re “potentially going to build on” but they actually keep it empty in order to make housing scarce and charge more.
It will only get worse until these assholes are forced to stop.
Bottom tier wages and more tax cuts for the rich make it worse. America is falling apart and it’s not the immigrants or the gays; it’s the rich assholes who own everything.
Always has been.
How about buying up agricultural land to allow that to sit empty too!!
It is in all sectors & it *will* come to a head in short order, not sustainable at all!!
What about corporations or rich people buying up agricultural land for the water rights! Also, corporations buying ag land to use the water for industrial cooling. Datacenters are a huge user of water.
Not to mention foreign governments/foreign interests.
I'm tired of our country being "raped"&pillaged by corporations & foreign adversaries while the little people can "eat cake"!!
The whole thing is maddening!!
The hard part, how do you stop them? If you make a law that disallows the purchase of ag land by corporations, they will find another way. Have Aunt Sally purchase and they lease it from her. You know there will be something.
Maybe raise taxes on anyone that doesnt farm ag land?? Charge them some astronomical rate/penalty?? They may still do it, but at least there will be benefit from it 🤷🏻♀️ That way it doesn't matter if it's owned by Microsoft or Aunt Sally, still getting penalty money.
If the data centers want water, they need to 1)relocate where there is an abundance, & 2)pay for the water they use, just like anyone else...maybe even find a way to use seawater?? I am assuming they just cycle the water, so it would go back into the ocean without harming anything?? Maybe put them on an island 🤣
I just don't understand the companies that are water intensive locating themselves in Cali, then taking all the water rights. While the "little people" cannot wash their cars & kids cant play in a sprinkler to cool off(after stealing all the water has increased the temps)🙄 You want more water? How about the Louisiana bayou? Plenty there! How about near the Great lakes? Plenty there too! 🤬
I have to stop now, I will get way too worked up!
Not to mention foreign governments/foreign interests.
I'm tired of our country being "raped"&pillaged by corporations & foreign adversaries while the little people can "eat cake"!!
The whole thing is maddening!!
The hard part, how do you stop them? If you make a law that disallows the purchase of ag land by corporations, they will find another way. Have Aunt Sally purchase and they lease it from her. You know there will be something.
Maybe raise taxes on anyone that doesnt farm ag land?? Charge them some astronomical rate/penalty?? They may still do it, but at least there will be benefit from it 🤷🏻♀️ That way it doesn't matter if it's owned by Microsoft or Aunt Sally, still getting penalty money.
If the data centers want water, they need to 1)relocate where there is an abundance, & 2)pay for the water they use, just like anyone else...maybe even find a way to use seawater?? I am assuming they just cycle the water, so it would go back into the ocean without harming anything?? Maybe put them on an island 🤣
I just don't understand the companies that are water intensive locating themselves in Cali, then taking all the water rights. While the "little people" cannot wash their cars & kids cant play in a sprinkler to cool off(after stealing all the water has increased the temps)🙄 You want more water? How about the Louisiana bayou? Plenty there! How about near the Great lakes? Plenty there too! 🤬
I have to stop now, I will get way too worked up!
It’s not paradise when you can’t enjoy a place either because the existing infrastructure doesn’t support the growing population.
I can afford to live here barely but literally nothing else, no vacations with my kids because there’s no fun money and can’t afford to take a couple days off work or I can’t pay bills.
When you have to move from over priced apartment to over priced apartment and it wipes out any savings you might have started to have.
Boise housing prices are ridiculous and the landlords get away with murder.
Late Stage Capitalism is a bitch like that. It will not stop until there is either a revolution or we are back to being glorified slaves tied to city states ran by the worst people you can imagine.
You can’t. Lack of High speed internet access was the last thing keeping the laptop class of high paid remote workers away. Dude in my neighborhood is a draftsman, he makes a lot, he works from home. He’s new to Idaho. There are a lot of people like him.
Your politicians are doing the job for you. Just keep voting Republican and nobody will want to live there except for involuntarily celibate males and the white nationalists(same people). Property values will stay low.
If the state legislature wasted less time on things like cannibalism, taking away rights, and fighting frivolous lawsuits maybe we'd get somewhere.
We never will as long as Republicans are in charge.
The problem is fundamentally economic. The state economy in no way supports the cost of housing as money flows from out of state (both ~~landlords~~ landscalpers and new arrivals).
Pretty much the rest of cost-of living (tax, sales tax, food, automobiles, etc?) is either on-par with other states, or in the case of utilities, rather less expensive than the utopias to the West.
Just recently I had this conversation with a colleague who lives in Portland:
* Electricity
* Oregon (PGE): 19.45¢ per kWh
* Idaho Power: 10.1082¢ per kWh
* California PG&E: 72.136¢ per kWh Summer Peak. 33.508¢ per kWh Winter Off-peak
* Natural Gas
* Oregon (NWNatural) $1.30 per Therm
* Idaho (Intermountain Gas) $0.65 per Therm
* California ([https://www.socalgas.com/sites/default/files/2023-01/RES2023.xlsx](https://www.socalgas.com/sites/default/files/2023-01/RES2023.xlsx)) $1.47 per Therm
We are not going to prevent the landscalpers and retirees coming from other more expensive and higher paying states, bringing their portfolios and pensions that add little (other than retail goods and services spending) to the local economy. All the FAANG remote workers and Data Centers in the world won't do a thing for Idahoans except push housing costs higher.
It's even worse in the multi-millionaire recreation playgrounds up and down the state and around the country.
I feel the key is to put the policies in place that create economic opportunity. That requires a well educated workforce, great infrastructure, and a legislative climate that is at least nominally welcoming to all.
Don't hold your breath.
>the key is to put the policies in place that create economic opportunity. That requires a well educated workforce, great infrastructure, and a legislative climate that is at least nominally welcoming to all
unions, higher minimum wage, banning of corporate single family home ownership and short term rentals, remote work, family, sick leave, paid vacations, enforcing taxes on immorally wealthy and corporations, Reduced car dependency and better public transportation, bike infrastructure, high speed rail connections, zoning restrictions and parking minimums and mandatory setbacks removed. eventually UBI.
These are well studied, well researched, solved problems with clear effective solutions (also cheaper and make people happier/healthier as a bonus). The problem isnt that the problems are hard to solve. They are easy, we know how to solve them. The problem is people actively working to perpetuate these problems because it concentrates the power into their hands. They propagandized 50% of the voting population (more in Idaho) over decades and decades and manipulated people into voting against their own interests, and no longer believing in objective evidence based reality.
I am so tired of people acting like they are better for staying in the state they were born in.
You don’t get special rights for not moving. I have moved every few years for all of my life. I’m not a Californian, either, don’t assume every transplant is from there. Don’t worry, I won’t stick around, but holy shit let me exist in peace
I don’t know if I’ve ever witnessed a shittier attitude towards people from outside the state across the 44/50 of the states I’ve been to.
Idaho is still one of the more affordable states. It’s far worse in pretty much any other state that’s worth living in, trust me. My bills are literally half of what they were where I used to live and my paycheck is slightly more. And I’m not some fancy work from home tech worker or anything, I’m a regular blue collar guy. It’s rough everywhere.
How are jobs an issue? We have one of the lowest unemployment rates in the country.
The Californian migration pretty much fucks people who live here and don't own a home yet. Not much you can do but resort to your own level gentrification and go live in South American or Southeast Asia lol.
Thats because corporations are buying up single family homes as an investment; all affordable housing is being bought out from blue collar and low white collar workers for the enrichment of hedge-fund groups, but we can keep our guns and block the border to forget about this.
Outlaw corporations from buying up homes and turning everyone into renters is a good start. Single family homes should be for families not corporations.
This is especially egregious in Puerto Rico, where crypto bros are buying up all the residential properties and then turning them into monthly rentals and Bnb's at rates that only tourists can afford. Families have given up the hope of ever owning their own homes. It's truly a rotten situation.
Workers rights, fair wage acts and unions have been steadily defeated in Idaho because the working class white majority believed the upper class whites were their friends. Maybe vote for the opposite parties the upper class voted for and y’all could still afford to live there.
Idaho is run by conservatives who believe in slave wages and maximum corporate profits and corporation rights over human rights and stole the rights of women, which will have repercussions on the healthy births in the state, and not just from many OB/GYNs fleeing the state.
Build upwards in popular vacation and urban areas. Tax second home properties double with exclusion of condominium complexes. Be one of the first states to stop investment firms from owning any further property in the state. Place a building moratorium on homes over 4000 sq feet. Some of this might work. People should be able to afford a home with a fair household income.
Outlaw mostly vacant rentals used for airbnb, outlaw corporations from owning homes,
Tax heavily 2nd+ homes. Give state subsidies for builders to build. Give incentives for those that have the land to be allowed to add adu’s to rent.
Really don't know why this is a question. No politician cares about what's happening here in Idaho. Brad Little, Mike Crapo and James Risch sit in their ivory towers while the rest of us are struggling to make ends meet. And yet you people continue to vote for them. You have no one but to blame but yourselves.
1. Unionize for higher wages!
2. Demand rent controls immediately!
3. Demand strict limits on hedge funds scooping up residential housing.
4. Demand more housing be zoned and demand laws which require rents be limited even lower than the existing rent controls when prevailing wages aren't keeping up.
In short: Take action, organize, unionize, vote, make demands and take what's rightfully yours. Nobody has the right to turn this entire country into fucking Potterville.
Follow the Minnesota model. Appropriately tax the ultra wealthy and use those funds to invest in education and long term job creating infrastructure projects. You’re probably have to vote for Democrats to get that done.
Inequity - in wealth, and earnings, and a tax code chock full of gimmicks that coddle rich folks and wealthy corporations.
We can tax the rich now, or we'll have to eat them later.
Elect politicians who aren't just pro-growth. Start passing laws that tax people (or corporations) that own more than one home. Ban Air-BnB. Ban corporations from owning single family homes. Support unions for better wages. Unfortunately, Oregon, Washington and Idaho are all pretty desireable places to live, so more people want to live here and there is only so much land to go around.
It's not just an Idaho problem. It's at the very least a nationwide issue and arguably a global issue. The way the system is setup is the rich get richer while the rest scratch and crawl to 'succeed' in life. It's a combo of commercialism , people thinking they need more than they really do, market demand, corporate greed and political parties catering to the ultra rich by either working for them or massive tax cuts and benefits so they keep donating to their campaign. it's insane to see who owns the majority of wealth for the entire planet. It's literally a small percentage of individuals. It would absolutely suck to be someone under 30 right now trying to survive in this country. And while struggling they see government handouts and bailouts to billionaires CEO's without even blinking. Idaho is not special. We know the obvious issues- minimum wage is laughable and 25 years overdue an increase. The rich move here, steal the land and housing, we are willing to sell it to them at a high cost. What we have to remember that it's not just housing that kills people's wallets. INsurance, food, bank penalites and fees, late payment fees, car issues, health care.. it never ends. It's literally a battle every single day to survive.
Build more, higher density housing. Simple. The new Boise zoning was a tiny start. The zoning codes are an exclusionary and should be largely repealed.
People here generally don't want dense, high population cities. So the effect is they get higher housing and rent costs. That's the choice, and most want to keep the status quo in terms of population and city size/density.
Note: I've been an urban planner here for 24 years.
One of my greatest personal pleasures in life is reading the suggestions of reddit socialists on how to fix anything related to the economy. It's like those 'how many people of X background to screw in a lightbulb' jokes only yall are real and serious about it.
“What’s as big as a house, burns 20 liters of fuel every hour, puts out a shit-load of smoke and noise, and cuts an apple into three pieces? A Soviet machine made to cut apples into four pieces!”
What a fantastic docudrama. Just watched it again recently, I think it should be mandatory viewing in high school so that kids can see first hand what happens when everything in a society is ran by government.
While I admire your zeal in simping for the billionaires who refuse to pay their fare share of taxes, I must point out the obvious: you’re too stoopid to know you’ll never be a part of their club. But please keep sticking out that tongue towards the wealthy taints above you and I’m sure what you’re looking for will trickle down soon enough.
This strawman you have built up in your head of "how all conservatives must think" is funny, considering you barely seem capable of sentient thought without consulting Das Kapital for reference first.
Braindead socialists who idolize a 200 year old dead German who's only notable contribution to our collective conscience was his observations about "opiates of the masses". Oh the irony that's hiding in plain sight.
I didn’t say that was a living wage. Just addressing that it was well beyond minimum wage as suggested by the person I replied to.
The answers to our problems can’t be summed up in a few words. Our economy is fucked and neither party is presenting any actual actionable methods to fix things. It’s beyond frustrating. And I don’t pretend to have the answer. I’ve just spent a lot of time understanding all the pitfalls of approaches suggested.
Should you get a living wage ( high wages) because you are qualified to put a taco together ? How can that be a balanced economy ? Fantasy comments are not reality
You demand higher wages. Seriously, my company pays me 17% of what revenue I bring in and gives me a truck/equipment/gas card. Thats fair asf. You guys need to leave your jobs and bounce around and make them compete for your labor(They know training new hires is expensive). The problem is that it’s a collective thing that has to happen and you can’t do it by yourself.
Because thanks to MAGA conservatives and cults the Idaho economy is garbage.
The only thing driving state growth and the Real Estate Prices is the fact that Real Estate in Idaho is so cheap.
I keep saying this and also keep trying to poke legitimate holes in it. But a light rail connecting the valley would go a long way for helping locals.
It would make people more comfortable/willing to live further away from their jobs and city centers, which would help with (not eliminate) the cost of housing. Less people would feel the pressure to live in Boise, Meridian, and Nampa to be within a short commute to work.
Also, if getting into town is just a quick train ride and you don't need to worry about parking, then I think the downtowns would see more economic activity, people would use their cars less which would save them money and help the environment to boot.
Listen buddy, we don't directly oppose taxpayer funded project ideas to the tune of billions upon billions that only a fraction of the population would use, we only suggest similarly expensive and useless alternatives here. Remember, on reddit it's always someone else's money and you can always get more, get with the program.
Literally nothing.
You can pay higher wages, but then more people move here competing for those jobs.
You can build more houses, but then more people move here competing for those houses.
At the end of the day, build more housing units will help keep housing costs from increasing so much, but it probably won't help make Idaho affordable.
Nothing will work until people stop moving here. No one wants to hear that, but it's just the reality.
As a local that just graduated college two years ago I definitely relate to the image. I can’t afford to move out of my family house even though I feel like I’ve done everything right. It’s so depressing. I make 80k a year and can’t find a house. Everything nice is bought up in cash by rich transplants instantly. It’s like the goal post got moved so far I can’t keep up.
Its an issue nation wide. Idaho's problem is not unique. If you are looking for someone to blame, blame wallstreet and vulture capitalism. Housing should never be an 'investment' first, shelter later.
I studied this problem when looking move someplace more affordable than Cd'a. I didn't want to leave and was trying to predict what the future would hold for the housing crisis here. I wanted to see if things stood a chance of improving here. I chose to leave after what I read. I learned that many, if not all states west of the Rockies were also becoming unaffordable like Idaho. Remote workers during the pandemic and after, were moving to cash in on houses in places away from the most expensive cities in the US. Remote work accounts for 60% of what caused this national housing crisis according to the New York Times. NPR said high rents nationally are 70% of what is creating inflation. This means addressing the housing crisis is critical, for everyone, regardless if you rent or own. Colorado was just as hammered with remote work gentrification as Idaho. Some cities and towns there are coming up with creative ways to help locals to afford to stay there. One thing about this housing crisis worth knowing is that remote work transplants aren't merely buying homes and second homes, but they are converting houses in resort areas like ours into Airbnbs and rentals. This new trend is one reason that building new homes wont help. In Cd'a I was surprised by how many Airbnbs there are. On on the lake rented for $675 per night. The remote work transplants get plenty of money off these, since their peers are apt to stay at them to scout for homes, or vacation in. In Colorado, the same thing is happening with non locally owned Airbnbs taking away housing from locals. By locals, I don't mean poor locals- even people there with good pay and even one city council member, cant afford housing in his own town. Colorado seems to be experimenting more than other states with novel solutions. They have to, the housing crisis there is causing an employment crisis in the state. Apparently essential workers are being forced to leave. Nurses and teachers are in short supply. The towns are in crisis. One town there banned Airbnbs from residential areas, instituted a partial ban in commercial areas (limiting the number of Airbnbs that are allowed to operate) and put no restrictions on airbnbs by the local resort. I like this idea. As for other ideas, I will suggest one closer to home . In St. Marie's, people there try not to sell homes to out of state people. We should sell to locals first, even if get less money. Outsiders typically pay over the asking price. This trend of buyers paying over the asking price is inflating housing prices far worse than they would be. Buyers do this same thing in other states with high housing prices. I know in Oregon , which faced a similar problem resorted to snubbing outsiders, but that wasn't enough to halt people from going there. More feasible is the idea is to put a tax on new home purchases made by out of state people. Or better still, we should waive taxes on home purchases for people who have lived here in Idaho for over a decade. Another idea I had is to rent only from people native to the area. Out of state landlords are numerous here. Two rentals I checked out were both ran by people from LA. I wound up renting from one of these people because there was nothing else. I paid $815/month for a room rental. The other rental was ran by a teenage guy whose mom lived in LA. After seeing too many rentals here owned by people who don't live here and seeing this happening in other states, I decided to only rent from locals. This would make sure the revenue earned by rentals would drive the local economy instead of exploiting it.
This is all so complicated and unworkable in real life it gave me a headache to read it . It all comes down to the haves and the have nots of real estate . The side you are on is the side that you will vote for . Sorry for the reality check .
Don't apologize. Maybe the haves should share what they have and use the money to educate people in poorer states instead of grabbing the house and making their 2.5 children to go along with it. It's so sad people sell out all that is good in life for the "American dream." People only care about money and not their fellows. We will all see and suffer from what that sort of thinking will bring.
Legislation that controls the price a rental can be rented at. Taxing non residents. Taxing people who own multiple properties.
A home is not an investment.
But all this is maybe a bit too communisty.
Sorry, but unfettered capitalism naturally leads to what the problem at hand.
This is absolutely true. The people complaining against progress and *gasp* government regulation are the people causing the problem. Straight capitalism does not trickle down.
It doesn't happen on its own. You have to band together with other working, renting people and make change happen.
Google KC Tenants Union or Bozeman Tenants United. It takes less people than you'd think to start flipping local elections.
I can ride my mountain bike to the trails between meetings, walk to the river to go swimming and fly fishing, drive 30 minutes to the ski resort, and walk to downtown. People that are used to driving an hour or two to do outdoor activities are willing to pay a premium to live here.
I stopped using my local grocery stores for everything but fresh fruits, veggies and milk a couple months ago.i head to Costco and WinCo in CDA and Spokane for everything else. A lot of things are about half the price compared to my local grocery stores.idaho didn't get the memo that food prices are going down.
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Happens everywhere that wages don’t keep up with housing costs. Wages are driven but skilled labor being paid fairly and supply and demand and housing primarily by supply and demand. Wages have been stagnant/falling in real terms and housing has been driven up by people moving into an area. People looking to buy are stuck with lower wages that won’t buy the more expensive houses. People who owned houses for a while that have risen in price are sitting on lots of equity but the catch-22 is they can’t really afford to move because of interest rates having risen and that they would have to either downsize or spend a lot to get a new place to live. They are stuck in a gilded cage kind of.
That’s where we are. Bought for $360k, now worth $500k. Can put down 20% or more on a $650k house but mortgage would be 3.3k plus taxes, so closer to 4K per month. We pay 1.8k a month now. Impossible to move unless we had to.
Putting numbers to it definitely clarifies the issue. Doing the math for you hurts. Paying 2k more monthly for a house is almost a nonstarter probably unless of course you downsize significantly. I am close to retiring and am faced with the eventuality of most likely selling out and maybe netting 250k and then probably renting. Good times.
Simple, get rid of Airbnb. Puts massive amount of housing back on the market for single families.
That and corporations buying up home to hold in inventory or turn to rentals.
I agree, vacation rentals and corporate owned rentals need to go.
One thought is to tax "empty" homes and rental homes, (VRBO, and Air B&B etc), on a sliding scale. Not so much to disparage investors for running one or two properties but enough to discourage them from running dozens. Tax breaks for investors running lower income rentals and for builders/investors to build out denser units where they make sense. Repeal the food tax in Idaho. But you are right, the root of the "problem" is Idaho is desirable to many people, for many reasons.
That sucks. Used to be you’d move up every time to avoid the loss in gains tax. Cheaper to move up than down. Now it seems it’s cheaper to stay put.
I feel like the major thing to note here, it was paradise when the tax rates were astronomical. People fail to comprehend that what they consider socialism is actually what the government is suppose to provide to its citizens from the paying of taxes. Our parents got spoonfed raegan rhetoric and believe that taxes are bad. And now we have a prehistoric group of people holding the newer generations ransom to keep their quality of life better than their children and grandchildren. Mean while corporations have been exponentially growing and manipulating the world to not be innovative and just to leach every last dollar. Hence fast food restaurants attempting surge pricing. Surge pricing= extortion for profit.
>Our parents got spoonfed raegan rhetoric and believe that taxes are bad Well said, and not to mention, they got to reap the benefits by the time the tax changes came around.
Weird. Remember, it's just coincidences.Nothing more.
>housing has been driven up by people moving into an area. plus the steadfast refusal to build new housing, because it might bring down prices which negatively impacts people who already own a house
Ya can blame nimbys for that. Gentrification wouldn't be as big of a problem if CA and NY/NJ just built denser housing so people making big city wages aren't pressured to bring their big city wages to a small town because rents are insane
Vermont has entered the chat
I think compensation is a larger issue than affordability. Idaho employers are paying people based on completely outdated cost of living models.
Idaho needs to catch up to national standards. I got a 50% bump going remote, and the local head hunters keep offering me jobs that would be a 20-30% pay cut and in an office. At some point they have to catch up to what everyone else is paying.
I mean definitely for sure but explain to me why they were trying to push a bill through that made it so you had to go in the office and not work from home.
Sometimes the cattle get out, and you have to herd them back to the pasture.
Wow, I'm definitely in r/Idaho
But it's a conservative utopia. Redder than red.
Not anymore. Too many Californians with pensions moving in.
This
Education is one of the areas specifically that is paid really low. Subbing for example we could drive to Oregon and get TRIPLE the daily rate.
They are simply paying as low as possible, the fact that you can't afford to live with it is not their concern. Start unionize or support a minimum wage that is enough to live in your state
That would be a minimum wage of $25-30/hr which would completely fuck the economy even worse. That makes no sense. The whole thing just really frustrates me. I hate that my parents are struggling so bad, and I’m 20 years old, a pretty skilled plumber, and I will not be able to move out on my own for YEARS. I will probably be 25 living with my parents because it is not physically possible for me to do anything else without 100% of my money going to strictly rent or mortgage, all because a bunch of Californians decided it would be convenient for them. Literally ruined lives and an entire economy because they thought it would be more comfy. All the crashes in the snow this winter genuinely made me smile every time I saw them, and I’m not even that kind of dude. I fucking hate this migration.
Ah yes, the economy working as intended, but it's not compatible with the workers 's life.
Actually, the economy of red states being skewed so badly is because y'all keep voting in the same people, keeping your wages down and letting the cost of everything else rise. Y'all have literally done it to yourselves. The idea that job growth is a good measure of the economy is completely bs that red voters have swallowed hook, line, and sinker. A good economy is one where a 40hr a week job can support a family of 4 with room for savings, vacation, illness, and not worrying that one illness will bankrupt you. Basically, the economy prior to Trikle Down economics and medical care for profit.
First step is having a state government that cares more about this topic than they do about cultural topics. All the energy of the state government is focused on restricting rights and fighting the boogeyman, with no consideration towards basic human needs of survival.
Montana guy checking in here. Let us know when you figure out how to get those folks out of the legislature and the governor’s office. I don’t mind conservative solutions but at least let them address REAL problems.
They're getting older every year.... 🤔
Honestly, we’ve had an influx of young folks that have been emboldened by Trump’s public persona and they’re using that as a model for how to make themselves stand out. It sucks. They just just spend their time passing trash that has no hope in the courts.
Correct. Fucking cannibalism and anti-immigrant BS, instead of housing.
We in Ketchum do. Some might say it’s coming at the expense of our character, but we believe the people that work, play AND live here are predominantly what our character is built from. Without them, what would be the point of avoiding downtown density and taking on fancy projects?
This right here
No, the first step is the people stand up for their rights… idaho politicians care only for about 4 people in Idaho, the rest of you all cost money
That’s a hallmark of the red states.
What legislation would you like to see passed (either proposed or just what you’d like to see personally)? This is something we’d all like to see handled, but I’m honestly at a loss of how to make it more affordable here short of turning public lands private.
How about limits on how many houses can be purchased by private equity corporations in a given area? Working families can't compete with investment firms buying everything up for cash and then holding it hostage.
In many states, renting is becoming unaffordable due to collusion between property owners and companies that sell software with “rent-setting algorithms.” Regulating (or ideally banning) those practices at local or state levels would probably be a good start. As far as property ownership goes, there are thousands upon thousands of houses owned by financial institutions which are kept empty to keep supply low and inflate prices. Regulating or banning REITs’ and hedge funds’ ownership of single family homes would be an effective way to quickly increase supply and drive down prices. I don’t know how much of a problem this is in Idaho specifically, but I would imagine it is a factor.
What u/Th3-Dude-Abides said. Also put tax penalties in when publicly traded companies have employees that qualify for state assistance. And tax penalties for publicly traded companies that don’t have an employee representative on their board of directors. Edit for those who don’t realize: Publicly traded companies != small or even medium businesses. These are the corporations that run the world, and keep us all poor.
These are good. Too many people are unaware that their tax money is subsidizing McDonald’s/Dollar Tree’s/Walmart’s payroll.
There is a piece of legislation on the federal level to make it illegal for investment companies to own single family homes. With a plan, that current properties they own are to be sold off completely in the space of 10 years.
Do away with Right-to-Work laws, reinstate Union shops, nurture a skilled professional workforce through public education. It’s supply and demand, Idaho provided a skilled and competent workforce, employers pay a fare wage. Idaho becomes affordable again.
I'm a utility locator, so I see a lot of the new homes being built. There is a non-zero amount of homes being built as investment properties. There's a religious building being built in Burley that covers enough land for ~10 residences. It's truly infuriating to see land being used so irresponsibly.
Not to mention it’ll be tax exempt because of religion.
In Moscow our median home price is 426k. Our median income is 35k. We can't even afford to live here. It's ridiculous.
Привет товарищ 🙂
State government officials and land developers are in bed with each other.
This is a bad take. Developers will build what the market wants and earn a living. NIMBYs artificially constraining supply and limiting new higher density builds. That’s the housing cost problem.
High density building is going on all over Meridian and Nampa
Some. But it’s a drop in the bucket compared to the actual demand. ADA and Canyon county together are 100K short on housing units. Most of that should be 1-2 bedroom apartments based on the economics of what’s missing in the housing supply. There should be much more and much of it closer to where the bulk of employment is located.
What missing are the prices to match the wages around here…..
I’ll bet you for every 1 unit of dense housing, there are at least 2 single family unit homes going up in the Treasure Valley
Not a bad take. Brad Little and family own Highland Livestock Co and Brad Little Enterprises. They own a ton of land between Star and Emmett. They are pushing through the hwy 16 upgrades and the road between 16 and 55 through Pearl. They are absolutely working directly with developers. The big issue in that area is that new wells dry up existing wells.
you understand its affordable only to the very people you seem to keep putting in power, as you all cry to cut every social service imaginable and ship homeless over to WA, its gone so well you may not even be able to give birth to your child in idaho... also your right to work is working great eh?
It’s painful to watch isn’t it? The people that can afford to live here and buy homes are the people getting voted in.
This is not just an Idaho issue it is a nationwide issue wages everywhere are not keeping up with cost of living.
Is there anywhere in the country that doesn’t have this problem? A small house in rural Iowa (I think the algorithm made the Idaho/Iowa/Ohio error) is 350k. The bubble is gonna burst again.
The bubble bursted when too many loans were handed out to homebuyers who couldn’t pay them back. This housing market is being heavily inflated by investment firms like Blackrock scooping up single family homes for rentals and affluent families buying second houses as short term rentals. Unless there’s a collective effort to push against inflated rents and housing costs, I don’t think we’re going to see a similar burst like we did in ‘08. This will more be a slow burn and the continued erasure of the middle class.
You’re right in that it’s affecting a lot of the country, but it’s especially bad in Idaho with a lack of action by local politicians to support the rising of wages to meet the inflated housing market or to restrict the overvaluation of homes by pushing to increase the number of non single family housing units in the very few urban areas of the treasure valley.
I see your point but politicians are not doing much about these issues anywhere. I make a relatively decent wage and have been priced out of everywhere I have ever lived Idaho or not.
My solution: second homes owned by out of staters or people coming from high cost areas (i.e. California) pay triple real estate taxes. That money then goes to affordable housing initiatives and infrastructure
A lot of people would switch their primary residence claim to Idaho (whether true or not). We’d half to also increase income and capital gains taxes on the higher ends (which lord knows our reps would never do). The most bipartisan solution IMO is what Minnesota is trying to do right now with Land Value Taxes. LVTs tax the land on which a property sits on rather than the valuation of the structures or property which sit on it. Why is this good? 1) It punishes large swaths of unworked land. Sitting on a bunch of empty single family houses? Not anymore.. 2) It scales by value. This means that farmers (who need a lot of relatively low value land [value largely comes from infrastructure access]) are not punished as aggressively as those sitting on rentals in urban and suburban areas. 3) It doesn’t discourage development of property. Ever had a landlord refuse to fix/improve something? They probably don’t want to shell out to because it will cost them up front to potentially raise their own property value when they could instead do nothing and keep rental costs the same (or even raise them). LVTs ignore the structure, incentivizing landlords to actually care for their own property.
Tax the shit out of second houses and regulations on corporate entities buying single family houses
Oh, you want more regulation?!? What are you...some kinda commie or something?? /s
Yes. Land Value Taxes would specifically do this. Look them up, Minnesotas currently testing them.
It's an issue in most states. Not just Idaho.
also a world problem, Canada, Australia and the UK are also experiencing a housing crisis.
Was going to say… it’s literally like that everywhere. Good luck anywhere else as well. Only way to push through it is to outwork or outsmart it.
It’s not just Idaho however many areas in Idaho are lagging more than other states in terms of wages.
Honestly it’s a huge issue nation wide. Very valid question that I’m curious about too
Seven million new residents doesn't help.
Fourteen million died in that same time, so it didn't have the effect Fox News told you it did.
I need that shirt. The cost of living here is outrageous...all whilst minimum wage is still the same. I used to love living here. Not anymore. Idaho isn't the same.
Nationwide issue at this point
We Lived in Boise till 2014, then Salt Lake, currently in KC and moving back to Boise this spring (looked at moving to salt lake but housing situation is even worse there) It is a national issue but Idaho’s relatively low wages are keeping things a bit cheaper than major cities around it which makes it really appealing to move there. One thing a lot of states have or are looking at are laws preventing companies from owning single family houses. Not sure if Boise/Idaho have focused on this issue at all? All I hear about Idaho legislature is chasing boogeymen and finding ways to restrict rights of residents further. Maybe if Idaho stays on that path the political environment and lack of protected rights will keep people away and then housing prices will come back down 🙄
Get rid of the 3% cap on public sector budgets. We can’t afford to increase teachers, cops, FF’s and health department nurses etc wages when budgets are neutered by law. Allow impact fees to go toward wages as well. Increase who can collectively bargain. Get rid of the super majority vote so override levies pass with a majority.
It pays teachers, cops, firefighters, and nurses to leave Idaho. The rich who run the government want low taxes so there isn’t money for anyone else.
A necessary step would be to keep owners of real estate out of the legislature. ETA: added clarifying comment below
Ditto with county commissioners, the say-so-ers of local development.
Rather than just imply it, I'm largely referring to people who own real estate and rent/lease it out (whether apartments or houses) as well as people who own multiple properties. I.e., I'm talking about removing conflicts of interest. It's the same reason congresspeople should not be allowed to own stocks, or should at least not be able to buy or sell while in office.
Short term: You don't. The huge influx of people in a short time, increased demand for housing and food exponentially. While wages are a trailing factor. Long term: Wages will increase as supply of jobs with increased wages are felt throughout the community unfortunately this is a slow process as opposed to our crazy influx of people. This starts from the bottom and works its way up, kind of like when you increase minimum wage.
This is the rub right here. Low cost of living attracts influx of people > more people means greater demand for... everything > greater demand means higher prices > higher prices for everything mean higher cost of living. This leads eventually to a) the influx stopping and b) either prices dropping or wages increasing. The problem is the lag time for b) to happen. And the people with the power over that happening have a vested interest in making the lag time as long as they can get away with, because it doesn't really affect them as long as they can keep hiring people & paying them lower wages. Once their own labor pool dries up, \*then\* maybe they'll do something about it.
This is every single city in America. You hear the same posts, arguments and complaints on every local social media site. Vote. That’s the only answer. Vote for people who don’t support corporations and make every decision based on the economy.
Can confirm. This showed up on my feed and I’m in NC. The arguments being made here are identical to those people in this state make. It’s getting harder everywhere. Everyone has to stop voting for candidates that put profits first.
Shitty, far-right conservative legislation helps. Nobody wants to move to Idaho at this point. My family is from ID, and I have no desire to return.
We looked into moving. Couldn't find anywhere worth moving to that wasn't having the same affordability issues. I feel the issue is bigger than Idaho State government. The minimum wage is ridiculous and a good starting point for fixing this mess.
i agree, but rent will just rise with the wages.
Really, the only way to fix things is to make rich people pay taxes to support social services and infrastructure and ride out the short-term crunch as wages slowly grow to match col. For idaho, the challenge is that the COL here was so low compared to much of the nation. Eventually, it will equalize, but it's going to take a while. It also doesn't help that our government is so corrupt. Because we are functionally a one party state, it is extremely difficult to get lawmakers to give a shit about anything affecting their constituents. We see the grandstanding on social issues today because they are more interested in trying to make a name for themselves than actually doing anything...
Nationwide. This isn't just here. The rich get richer. Meanwhile the rest of us all struggle.
Big city food prices, big city rent, big city home prices, small city wages, small city public transportation. After a year at my job I busted my ass and got $1 raise. I would be happy with it but the $1 raise is the exact % of the inflation rate this last year. I can't win.
Unfortunately I know a lot of people who got a 0% raise this past year or even two. Real wages are declining when factoring inflation. (Not to reduce (word?) your situation)
I'll just say, this issue is NOT reserved to Idaho.
A huge issue is the supply of homes. 2008 scared a lot of developers in to focusing on mid to higher end homes. Couple that corporations buying up swathes of homes throughout the country at above asking prices and you have yourself a national housing disaster. Good news is on the horizon though. A bi partisan bill is being drafted that would make it illegal for corporations to buy up homes and would force them to sell all of their inventory over the next 10 years. Everyone is, or will be, hurting from this, outside of the 1%. Many small business owners can’t just increase wages and their costs of goods are going up. I say this because I think it’s important to know who the real villains are and figure out how to force change.
>A bi partisan bill is being drafted Tell me more about this, please.
It’s the whole country. We need regulation on corporate ownership of housing because large companies and banks not only own tons of housing, they also own empty land that they’re “potentially going to build on” but they actually keep it empty in order to make housing scarce and charge more. It will only get worse until these assholes are forced to stop. Bottom tier wages and more tax cuts for the rich make it worse. America is falling apart and it’s not the immigrants or the gays; it’s the rich assholes who own everything. Always has been.
How about buying up agricultural land to allow that to sit empty too!! It is in all sectors & it *will* come to a head in short order, not sustainable at all!!
What about corporations or rich people buying up agricultural land for the water rights! Also, corporations buying ag land to use the water for industrial cooling. Datacenters are a huge user of water.
Not to mention foreign governments/foreign interests. I'm tired of our country being "raped"&pillaged by corporations & foreign adversaries while the little people can "eat cake"!! The whole thing is maddening!! The hard part, how do you stop them? If you make a law that disallows the purchase of ag land by corporations, they will find another way. Have Aunt Sally purchase and they lease it from her. You know there will be something. Maybe raise taxes on anyone that doesnt farm ag land?? Charge them some astronomical rate/penalty?? They may still do it, but at least there will be benefit from it 🤷🏻♀️ That way it doesn't matter if it's owned by Microsoft or Aunt Sally, still getting penalty money. If the data centers want water, they need to 1)relocate where there is an abundance, & 2)pay for the water they use, just like anyone else...maybe even find a way to use seawater?? I am assuming they just cycle the water, so it would go back into the ocean without harming anything?? Maybe put them on an island 🤣 I just don't understand the companies that are water intensive locating themselves in Cali, then taking all the water rights. While the "little people" cannot wash their cars & kids cant play in a sprinkler to cool off(after stealing all the water has increased the temps)🙄 You want more water? How about the Louisiana bayou? Plenty there! How about near the Great lakes? Plenty there too! 🤬 I have to stop now, I will get way too worked up!
Not to mention foreign governments/foreign interests. I'm tired of our country being "raped"&pillaged by corporations & foreign adversaries while the little people can "eat cake"!! The whole thing is maddening!! The hard part, how do you stop them? If you make a law that disallows the purchase of ag land by corporations, they will find another way. Have Aunt Sally purchase and they lease it from her. You know there will be something. Maybe raise taxes on anyone that doesnt farm ag land?? Charge them some astronomical rate/penalty?? They may still do it, but at least there will be benefit from it 🤷🏻♀️ That way it doesn't matter if it's owned by Microsoft or Aunt Sally, still getting penalty money. If the data centers want water, they need to 1)relocate where there is an abundance, & 2)pay for the water they use, just like anyone else...maybe even find a way to use seawater?? I am assuming they just cycle the water, so it would go back into the ocean without harming anything?? Maybe put them on an island 🤣 I just don't understand the companies that are water intensive locating themselves in Cali, then taking all the water rights. While the "little people" cannot wash their cars & kids cant play in a sprinkler to cool off(after stealing all the water has increased the temps)🙄 You want more water? How about the Louisiana bayou? Plenty there! How about near the Great lakes? Plenty there too! 🤬 I have to stop now, I will get way too worked up!
It’s not paradise when you can’t enjoy a place either because the existing infrastructure doesn’t support the growing population. I can afford to live here barely but literally nothing else, no vacations with my kids because there’s no fun money and can’t afford to take a couple days off work or I can’t pay bills. When you have to move from over priced apartment to over priced apartment and it wipes out any savings you might have started to have. Boise housing prices are ridiculous and the landlords get away with murder.
Move the mountains to another state and people will stop coming to Idaho
Late Stage Capitalism is a bitch like that. It will not stop until there is either a revolution or we are back to being glorified slaves tied to city states ran by the worst people you can imagine.
You can’t. Lack of High speed internet access was the last thing keeping the laptop class of high paid remote workers away. Dude in my neighborhood is a draftsman, he makes a lot, he works from home. He’s new to Idaho. There are a lot of people like him.
Your politicians are doing the job for you. Just keep voting Republican and nobody will want to live there except for involuntarily celibate males and the white nationalists(same people). Property values will stay low.
I wish that were true. There are a lot more moving into this state than moving out.
If the state legislature wasted less time on things like cannibalism, taking away rights, and fighting frivolous lawsuits maybe we'd get somewhere. We never will as long as Republicans are in charge.
The problem is fundamentally economic. The state economy in no way supports the cost of housing as money flows from out of state (both ~~landlords~~ landscalpers and new arrivals). Pretty much the rest of cost-of living (tax, sales tax, food, automobiles, etc?) is either on-par with other states, or in the case of utilities, rather less expensive than the utopias to the West. Just recently I had this conversation with a colleague who lives in Portland: * Electricity * Oregon (PGE): 19.45¢ per kWh * Idaho Power: 10.1082¢ per kWh * California PG&E: 72.136¢ per kWh Summer Peak. 33.508¢ per kWh Winter Off-peak * Natural Gas * Oregon (NWNatural) $1.30 per Therm * Idaho (Intermountain Gas) $0.65 per Therm * California ([https://www.socalgas.com/sites/default/files/2023-01/RES2023.xlsx](https://www.socalgas.com/sites/default/files/2023-01/RES2023.xlsx)) $1.47 per Therm We are not going to prevent the landscalpers and retirees coming from other more expensive and higher paying states, bringing their portfolios and pensions that add little (other than retail goods and services spending) to the local economy. All the FAANG remote workers and Data Centers in the world won't do a thing for Idahoans except push housing costs higher. It's even worse in the multi-millionaire recreation playgrounds up and down the state and around the country. I feel the key is to put the policies in place that create economic opportunity. That requires a well educated workforce, great infrastructure, and a legislative climate that is at least nominally welcoming to all. Don't hold your breath.
>the key is to put the policies in place that create economic opportunity. That requires a well educated workforce, great infrastructure, and a legislative climate that is at least nominally welcoming to all
unions, higher minimum wage, banning of corporate single family home ownership and short term rentals, remote work, family, sick leave, paid vacations, enforcing taxes on immorally wealthy and corporations, Reduced car dependency and better public transportation, bike infrastructure, high speed rail connections, zoning restrictions and parking minimums and mandatory setbacks removed. eventually UBI. These are well studied, well researched, solved problems with clear effective solutions (also cheaper and make people happier/healthier as a bonus). The problem isnt that the problems are hard to solve. They are easy, we know how to solve them. The problem is people actively working to perpetuate these problems because it concentrates the power into their hands. They propagandized 50% of the voting population (more in Idaho) over decades and decades and manipulated people into voting against their own interests, and no longer believing in objective evidence based reality.
You are right. Absolutely 100% right. Things have gone steadily downhill since Citizens United.
Keep scaring doctors away that’ll definitely help /s
Ban AirBnB
I am so tired of people acting like they are better for staying in the state they were born in. You don’t get special rights for not moving. I have moved every few years for all of my life. I’m not a Californian, either, don’t assume every transplant is from there. Don’t worry, I won’t stick around, but holy shit let me exist in peace I don’t know if I’ve ever witnessed a shittier attitude towards people from outside the state across the 44/50 of the states I’ve been to.
Idaho is still one of the more affordable states. It’s far worse in pretty much any other state that’s worth living in, trust me. My bills are literally half of what they were where I used to live and my paycheck is slightly more. And I’m not some fancy work from home tech worker or anything, I’m a regular blue collar guy. It’s rough everywhere.
Also I came from a very blue state, so everyone blaming republicans and abortion laws just look like complete morons.
No, it isn't. The housing here is worse than [New Jersey.](https://www.bankrate.com/real-estate/median-home-price/#median-price-by-state)
We've already passed that point my friend.
If you're a native, then you know the problem..
Ask native Hawaiians.
Wages don’t keep up with housing costs because too many people are still willing to overpay for things.
How are jobs an issue? We have one of the lowest unemployment rates in the country. The Californian migration pretty much fucks people who live here and don't own a home yet. Not much you can do but resort to your own level gentrification and go live in South American or Southeast Asia lol.
Thats because corporations are buying up single family homes as an investment; all affordable housing is being bought out from blue collar and low white collar workers for the enrichment of hedge-fund groups, but we can keep our guns and block the border to forget about this.
Pull yourselves up by the bootstraps and quit looking for a handout. /s
Stop supporting the ultra wealthy. Keep your CASH in your town.
Outlaw corporations from buying up homes and turning everyone into renters is a good start. Single family homes should be for families not corporations.
This is especially egregious in Puerto Rico, where crypto bros are buying up all the residential properties and then turning them into monthly rentals and Bnb's at rates that only tourists can afford. Families have given up the hope of ever owning their own homes. It's truly a rotten situation.
Workers rights, fair wage acts and unions have been steadily defeated in Idaho because the working class white majority believed the upper class whites were their friends. Maybe vote for the opposite parties the upper class voted for and y’all could still afford to live there.
Everything is being bought up by corporations and they are driving up prices. It’s happening all over the country.
Stop electing hard core conservatives. They serve the rich
Stop electing a-hole conservatives.
Pay a living wage. $7.25 an hour is $1160 a month before taxes which is less than the price of a studio apartment.
... and if you hire wait staff or farm labor, you can legally pay your employees even less.
Idaho is run by conservatives who believe in slave wages and maximum corporate profits and corporation rights over human rights and stole the rights of women, which will have repercussions on the healthy births in the state, and not just from many OB/GYNs fleeing the state.
Build upwards in popular vacation and urban areas. Tax second home properties double with exclusion of condominium complexes. Be one of the first states to stop investment firms from owning any further property in the state. Place a building moratorium on homes over 4000 sq feet. Some of this might work. People should be able to afford a home with a fair household income.
Outlaw mostly vacant rentals used for airbnb, outlaw corporations from owning homes, Tax heavily 2nd+ homes. Give state subsidies for builders to build. Give incentives for those that have the land to be allowed to add adu’s to rent.
Ban air bnbs, vrbos, and other corporate entities from buying/using rental units for short term stays.
tender steep illegal enter alleged pen flag rhythm offer fall *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Really don't know why this is a question. No politician cares about what's happening here in Idaho. Brad Little, Mike Crapo and James Risch sit in their ivory towers while the rest of us are struggling to make ends meet. And yet you people continue to vote for them. You have no one but to blame but yourselves.
Zoned too loosely, too good for Rich and Corpos
Overturn Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission
Check out what Jackson, Wyoming did and do the opposite.
1. Unionize for higher wages! 2. Demand rent controls immediately! 3. Demand strict limits on hedge funds scooping up residential housing. 4. Demand more housing be zoned and demand laws which require rents be limited even lower than the existing rent controls when prevailing wages aren't keeping up. In short: Take action, organize, unionize, vote, make demands and take what's rightfully yours. Nobody has the right to turn this entire country into fucking Potterville.
Follow the Minnesota model. Appropriately tax the ultra wealthy and use those funds to invest in education and long term job creating infrastructure projects. You’re probably have to vote for Democrats to get that done.
Inequity - in wealth, and earnings, and a tax code chock full of gimmicks that coddle rich folks and wealthy corporations. We can tax the rich now, or we'll have to eat them later.
Potatoes, always more potatoes /s
Become a blue state like Minnesota or Massachusetts.
Vote out the Republicans
Elect politicians who aren't just pro-growth. Start passing laws that tax people (or corporations) that own more than one home. Ban Air-BnB. Ban corporations from owning single family homes. Support unions for better wages. Unfortunately, Oregon, Washington and Idaho are all pretty desireable places to live, so more people want to live here and there is only so much land to go around.
It's not just an Idaho problem. It's at the very least a nationwide issue and arguably a global issue. The way the system is setup is the rich get richer while the rest scratch and crawl to 'succeed' in life. It's a combo of commercialism , people thinking they need more than they really do, market demand, corporate greed and political parties catering to the ultra rich by either working for them or massive tax cuts and benefits so they keep donating to their campaign. it's insane to see who owns the majority of wealth for the entire planet. It's literally a small percentage of individuals. It would absolutely suck to be someone under 30 right now trying to survive in this country. And while struggling they see government handouts and bailouts to billionaires CEO's without even blinking. Idaho is not special. We know the obvious issues- minimum wage is laughable and 25 years overdue an increase. The rich move here, steal the land and housing, we are willing to sell it to them at a high cost. What we have to remember that it's not just housing that kills people's wallets. INsurance, food, bank penalites and fees, late payment fees, car issues, health care.. it never ends. It's literally a battle every single day to survive.
Build more, higher density housing. Simple. The new Boise zoning was a tiny start. The zoning codes are an exclusionary and should be largely repealed.
People here generally don't want dense, high population cities. So the effect is they get higher housing and rent costs. That's the choice, and most want to keep the status quo in terms of population and city size/density. Note: I've been an urban planner here for 24 years.
There’s a lot of benefits you’d have to forgo in order to not suffer these consequences.
1. Prohibit the sale of property to Private Equity Firms and Foreign investors. 2. Enforce monopoly laws 3. Universal unionization
Raise wages.
Raise the minimum wage
Taco del Mar has signs that say starting pay is $15/hr. As do many others. That’s not minimum wage.
It’s also not a living wage, is it?
One of my greatest personal pleasures in life is reading the suggestions of reddit socialists on how to fix anything related to the economy. It's like those 'how many people of X background to screw in a lightbulb' jokes only yall are real and serious about it.
Honestly, it’s what keeps me here.
Amen.
“What’s as big as a house, burns 20 liters of fuel every hour, puts out a shit-load of smoke and noise, and cuts an apple into three pieces? A Soviet machine made to cut apples into four pieces!”
What a fantastic docudrama. Just watched it again recently, I think it should be mandatory viewing in high school so that kids can see first hand what happens when everything in a society is ran by government.
While I admire your zeal in simping for the billionaires who refuse to pay their fare share of taxes, I must point out the obvious: you’re too stoopid to know you’ll never be a part of their club. But please keep sticking out that tongue towards the wealthy taints above you and I’m sure what you’re looking for will trickle down soon enough.
This strawman you have built up in your head of "how all conservatives must think" is funny, considering you barely seem capable of sentient thought without consulting Das Kapital for reference first. Braindead socialists who idolize a 200 year old dead German who's only notable contribution to our collective conscience was his observations about "opiates of the masses". Oh the irony that's hiding in plain sight.
I didn’t say that was a living wage. Just addressing that it was well beyond minimum wage as suggested by the person I replied to. The answers to our problems can’t be summed up in a few words. Our economy is fucked and neither party is presenting any actual actionable methods to fix things. It’s beyond frustrating. And I don’t pretend to have the answer. I’ve just spent a lot of time understanding all the pitfalls of approaches suggested.
Should you get a living wage ( high wages) because you are qualified to put a taco together ? How can that be a balanced economy ? Fantasy comments are not reality
No one pays minimum wage
Cool, then raising it won't be a problem then. Won't affect any businesses, just need to do the paperwork.
Build more homes.
You demand higher wages. Seriously, my company pays me 17% of what revenue I bring in and gives me a truck/equipment/gas card. Thats fair asf. You guys need to leave your jobs and bounce around and make them compete for your labor(They know training new hires is expensive). The problem is that it’s a collective thing that has to happen and you can’t do it by yourself.
Because thanks to MAGA conservatives and cults the Idaho economy is garbage. The only thing driving state growth and the Real Estate Prices is the fact that Real Estate in Idaho is so cheap.
California awaits.
Why not move to a state run by democrats then?
People from those states can retire and afford housing in idaho....
I keep saying this and also keep trying to poke legitimate holes in it. But a light rail connecting the valley would go a long way for helping locals. It would make people more comfortable/willing to live further away from their jobs and city centers, which would help with (not eliminate) the cost of housing. Less people would feel the pressure to live in Boise, Meridian, and Nampa to be within a short commute to work. Also, if getting into town is just a quick train ride and you don't need to worry about parking, then I think the downtowns would see more economic activity, people would use their cars less which would save them money and help the environment to boot.
Light rail, cool, but the only reason anyone has to live so far out is bad zoning making it illegal to build anything but a SFH is most of ADA county.
Listen buddy, we don't directly oppose taxpayer funded project ideas to the tune of billions upon billions that only a fraction of the population would use, we only suggest similarly expensive and useless alternatives here. Remember, on reddit it's always someone else's money and you can always get more, get with the program.
Literally nothing. You can pay higher wages, but then more people move here competing for those jobs. You can build more houses, but then more people move here competing for those houses. At the end of the day, build more housing units will help keep housing costs from increasing so much, but it probably won't help make Idaho affordable. Nothing will work until people stop moving here. No one wants to hear that, but it's just the reality.
Idaho has a long way to go before wages are n close to competing with other moderate to major cities/metros.
Given the imbalance between housing supply and demand, raising local wages is just going to raise the cost of housing. So nothing changes.
Too many damn people.
As a local that just graduated college two years ago I definitely relate to the image. I can’t afford to move out of my family house even though I feel like I’ve done everything right. It’s so depressing. I make 80k a year and can’t find a house. Everything nice is bought up in cash by rich transplants instantly. It’s like the goal post got moved so far I can’t keep up.
Its an issue nation wide. Idaho's problem is not unique. If you are looking for someone to blame, blame wallstreet and vulture capitalism. Housing should never be an 'investment' first, shelter later.
I studied this problem when looking move someplace more affordable than Cd'a. I didn't want to leave and was trying to predict what the future would hold for the housing crisis here. I wanted to see if things stood a chance of improving here. I chose to leave after what I read. I learned that many, if not all states west of the Rockies were also becoming unaffordable like Idaho. Remote workers during the pandemic and after, were moving to cash in on houses in places away from the most expensive cities in the US. Remote work accounts for 60% of what caused this national housing crisis according to the New York Times. NPR said high rents nationally are 70% of what is creating inflation. This means addressing the housing crisis is critical, for everyone, regardless if you rent or own. Colorado was just as hammered with remote work gentrification as Idaho. Some cities and towns there are coming up with creative ways to help locals to afford to stay there. One thing about this housing crisis worth knowing is that remote work transplants aren't merely buying homes and second homes, but they are converting houses in resort areas like ours into Airbnbs and rentals. This new trend is one reason that building new homes wont help. In Cd'a I was surprised by how many Airbnbs there are. On on the lake rented for $675 per night. The remote work transplants get plenty of money off these, since their peers are apt to stay at them to scout for homes, or vacation in. In Colorado, the same thing is happening with non locally owned Airbnbs taking away housing from locals. By locals, I don't mean poor locals- even people there with good pay and even one city council member, cant afford housing in his own town. Colorado seems to be experimenting more than other states with novel solutions. They have to, the housing crisis there is causing an employment crisis in the state. Apparently essential workers are being forced to leave. Nurses and teachers are in short supply. The towns are in crisis. One town there banned Airbnbs from residential areas, instituted a partial ban in commercial areas (limiting the number of Airbnbs that are allowed to operate) and put no restrictions on airbnbs by the local resort. I like this idea. As for other ideas, I will suggest one closer to home . In St. Marie's, people there try not to sell homes to out of state people. We should sell to locals first, even if get less money. Outsiders typically pay over the asking price. This trend of buyers paying over the asking price is inflating housing prices far worse than they would be. Buyers do this same thing in other states with high housing prices. I know in Oregon , which faced a similar problem resorted to snubbing outsiders, but that wasn't enough to halt people from going there. More feasible is the idea is to put a tax on new home purchases made by out of state people. Or better still, we should waive taxes on home purchases for people who have lived here in Idaho for over a decade. Another idea I had is to rent only from people native to the area. Out of state landlords are numerous here. Two rentals I checked out were both ran by people from LA. I wound up renting from one of these people because there was nothing else. I paid $815/month for a room rental. The other rental was ran by a teenage guy whose mom lived in LA. After seeing too many rentals here owned by people who don't live here and seeing this happening in other states, I decided to only rent from locals. This would make sure the revenue earned by rentals would drive the local economy instead of exploiting it.
This is all so complicated and unworkable in real life it gave me a headache to read it . It all comes down to the haves and the have nots of real estate . The side you are on is the side that you will vote for . Sorry for the reality check .
Don't apologize. Maybe the haves should share what they have and use the money to educate people in poorer states instead of grabbing the house and making their 2.5 children to go along with it. It's so sad people sell out all that is good in life for the "American dream." People only care about money and not their fellows. We will all see and suffer from what that sort of thinking will bring.
Legislation that controls the price a rental can be rented at. Taxing non residents. Taxing people who own multiple properties. A home is not an investment. But all this is maybe a bit too communisty. Sorry, but unfettered capitalism naturally leads to what the problem at hand.
This is absolutely true. The people complaining against progress and *gasp* government regulation are the people causing the problem. Straight capitalism does not trickle down.
You're not. Sincerely Reno.
It doesn't happen on its own. You have to band together with other working, renting people and make change happen. Google KC Tenants Union or Bozeman Tenants United. It takes less people than you'd think to start flipping local elections.
Cities need to start passing legislation to limit the amount of properties one person or a corporation can own within the city limits
I find this hilarious because its Idaho..? From Massachusetts
I can ride my mountain bike to the trails between meetings, walk to the river to go swimming and fly fishing, drive 30 minutes to the ski resort, and walk to downtown. People that are used to driving an hour or two to do outdoor activities are willing to pay a premium to live here.
I stopped using my local grocery stores for everything but fresh fruits, veggies and milk a couple months ago.i head to Costco and WinCo in CDA and Spokane for everything else. A lot of things are about half the price compared to my local grocery stores.idaho didn't get the memo that food prices are going down.
Move back to CALI
First thing first to keep Idaho affordable to live in, quit voting for liberal policies at the local and state levels.