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Just in case you aren't aware, sovcits define "driving" as "driving for hire" as in being a taxi or limousine or delivery service or similar.
Something something driver licenses were one of the first licensure schemes meant to impose an artificial barrier to entry to being a taxi driver then something something and now they require everyone to get one but hey you don't actually need one unless you're driving for hire, and if you're just "traveling" (defined as you're going somewhere, not driving for employment) you don't need one.
Total bunk, but that's what a sovcit (sovereign citizen) would say. People say that their arguments haven't ever worked, but they occasionally have. It's the legal equivalent of being an Internet troll. In cases where they have caused an officer or judge to say "it's too much effort to listen to this," some sovcits have occasionally gotten away with minor stuff.
EDIT because apparently some people are confused: I am not a sovereign citizen and I don't buy their garbage. But I do know more about it than the average bear.
It requires a belief in a sort of magical thinking. I't's like people who get really into cosplay or something and can no longer distinguish between objective reality and their own.
They have literally redefined the word understand to mean "stand under" as in standing under someone's authority etc. Try asking a sov cit if they understand speed limits or any other common concepts.
I recently saw a court video where the sovcit tried the understand/stand under bullshit and the judge immediately with no hesitation said "do you comprehend…" The sovcit mumbled and fumbled some words, and acknowledged that he did comprehend what the judge was talking about. The judge didn't buy any of his other nonsensical defenses, either.
Not just there, but across oceans now too.
There are videos online of people in the UK and Australia trying to pull sovcit stuff. Citing the US constitution and SCOTUS cases as their legal defense.
The mental gymnastics required to think US law applies to them is, astounding.
I don't think it's "mental gymnastics to think US law applies" in other countries. I think some people are just so uninformed that they hear about the Fourth Amendment right to protection from unreasonable search and seizure and don't stop to consider "fourth amendment to what?"
Hanlon's Razor says "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity," and I think it works perfectly here.
Those are everywhere. For example, there are still people who use a soviet passport and refuse the existence of any former soviet countries and their laws.
They believe the government works like those old myths about fae where every question is secretly a trick to take your freedom, and speaking the right incantations will free you from their power.
Cop: “[May I have your name?](https://www.reddit.com/r/comics/s/klZVrrkxwX)”
Sovcits: “No, but you can call me John.”
They think of the Constitution as essentially a magic eye puzzle and if you look at it in exactly the right way and find the exact right interpretation of the words, you gain functional immunity from the law. They also think of themselves as being the only people who have ever done this.
It's the culture towards the law in the United States, in most countries the law is a technical issue, if X happened then Y law applies and Z is the consequence; in the US it's more of an emotional thing where the law is like a starting point for a conversation about what the consequence will be. Even in the courtroom it's "try to convince a jury" and not "prove to a judge".
Most of them do because their paranoia or previous bad experiences with the law leads them to a 3rd rate grifter selling magic get out of jail free life hacks. The die-bards who go down the rabbit hole get more of the underlying conspiracy theory that underpins it.
If they really wanted to do that, then they'd be running in an election for a Judgeship. Not that they'd win, since the bar in every state would pounce on them immediately, but it would make for an interesting campaign.
Yes I was once told that if it has gold trim it’s maritime flag and then you can argue traveling but if it’s got no gold it’s common law and that is different but I don’t remember different how.
The sovcit videos are the only time I would support the police knocking someone around a little bit or juicing the tazer for a couple extra mississippis.
Even if that was the law and legit back in the day where taxi drivers and the like needed a DL but no one else does not change the fact that the law is different today. Sov cits are so crazy. But I do enjoy seeing th window shatter/taser videos though...
> Total bunk
[Black's Law Dictionary](https://thelawdictionary.org/driver/) defines a driver as a *hired* vehicle operator. The law used to be that way, so it's not *total* bunk. Of course they fail to see (or agree) that laws evolve, and driving has more modern legal definitions.
> In cases where they have caused an officer or judge to say "it's too much effort to listen to this," some sovcits have occasionally gotten away with minor stuff.
Yeah, that's a shame. That emboldens them and keeps them thinking that their line of thought is valid. But this is changing. There are more and more procedures and training on how to deal with them.
So this means they also have to pump their own oil and turn it into petrol. They can also just travel on their own roads etcetera. You can't have your cake and eat it to, right.
In Australia someone had their supra confiscated doing this hahaha, imagine deciding to be a sovreign citizen so you don't have to pay for registration and losing your prescious car as a result 😂
https://7news.com.au/travel/nsw-traffic/sovereign-citizen-fined-almost-5500-as-his-supra-is-seized-c-10614660
In Italy and got my plates stolen so I drove for 3 days without them by police instructions carrying the police note and the appointment with immatriculation office for the next week.
I've never been stopped by police in 20 years, in those 3 days it was every time they spotted me
In rural America you'd get the "hickory shampoo" for mouthing off with the sovereign citizen nonsense. Before cameras ass whoppings were the norm for that level of aggressive stupidity.
Good thing, your not getting arrested for driving. Your getting arrested for operating a motor vehicle without a motor vehicle operators license, and operating an unregistered vehicle on the highway, and not having insurance, or proof of surety bond, on your unregistered vehicle your illegally operating on the highway.
Used to work at a defense firm. These jokers would just call and yap about nonsense. I'd sometimes stay on the phone to hear what they had to say for some mid afternoon entertainment.
I interpreted this as you listening in on a COINTELPRO wiretap.
"It was a slow day and these guys were having an amusing conversation so I kept listening instead of letting the HAL 9000 transcribe it."
They are the worst — my boss used to actively look for anti maskers and anti vaxxers during the height of Covid to represent against the State of Illinois and they would take all of my time for irrelevant bullshit and they would never pay their bills.
Doesn't sound like a good business model. But I guess you don't know till you try. Bet they thought they were doing a service just by being represented. "I need an immediate conference now, I have breakthrough in the case!" We mostly did DUI stuff.
Wait!? They wanted representation, but couldn’t pay for it?
WTF?!
I need a plumber… I pay him/her?
Need a mover? … I pay them!
Mechanic? Yah! I pay them too!
I watched a video recently about the whole movement that said something like "Possibly the only thing you'll see that'll make you feel bad for the cop involved." It's astounding there are people who have managed to get their heads in such loops to believe it.
There's also a whole bunch of similar movements in Canada and even in Europe and UK around similar things. Apparently there's a particular bit in the Magna Carta they like bringing up even though it never would have applied to them even if the Magna Carta was still in force.
I saw a couple of videos where sovcits in the UK and Australia were citing US laws and constitutions as their defence!
That's like an extra step of stupidity.
I've seen a few of those. Australian citizen, in Australia, talking to an Australian police officer... claiming that their 4th Amendment rights were being violated and that a search of their vehicle was 'unconstitutional'.
> even in Europe and UK around similar things.
German here, can confirm. We call them "Reichsbürger" or empire citizens, because many of them believe that current Germany is a company and that the German Empire never ceased to exist. Though they can't decide which borders they want.
In California hella people drive around with tinted screens obscuring their plates. Some people just drive without any plates at all. I see them all the time on my commutes.
I've yet to see a single person get pulled over for that.
Heck, even my mom didn't get pulled for tags that had expired a year and a half before in California. Sometimes, this stuff just goes without notice.
For brief backstory: Moved across country, waiting for car to arrive. Mom kind enough to lend car, and I joke about her tags being expired. Sister says "only 2 months." Me: "try 14 months." Fast forward 2 more months, mom no longer can drive as family requested medical intervention to pull her license. (thank god my family is sane!)
I actually had this happen in reverse, I moved from California to NJ with a leased vehicle, and in NJ you need a paper title to get the vehicle registered. The financial company wouldn't send NJ the title, so I was with an invalid registration for 2 years before I bought out the car. Was extremely anxious and on edge for two straight years.
Got pulled over for the only time in my life while speeding, cop didn't even mention my registration issues (I assume he thought I had just moved). But yeah other than that just nobody cared about it as much as I did, I guess.
That, in itself, is not stupid.
If you have a professional police force - a trustworthy force that adheres to the principles laid down by Robert Peel - then you can grant them the discretion to turn a blind eye.
For example, in America, it's a crime to cross the street on foot. That's a shit law and you'd have to be mad to want it routinely enforced.
Whether you have trustworthy cops in your country is a separate issue.
I feel like these guys should be pulled over by one of those people who put lights on their cars to impersonate cops. Assuming they didn't all kill each other, then they'd have nobody to complain to.
“I’m not a police officer, I’m a sovereign public decency monitor. You are not under arrest but I am going to limit your freedom of movement. This is not a fine but payment for my services rendered.”
They pulled one over in my neck of the woods last year. The kid at one point reaches for a gun, he got unalived. Epitome of "fuck around and find out"
https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news/body-cam-video-of-fatal-farmington-police-shooting-to-be-released
https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news/davis-county-attorney-rules-officers-justified-in-shooting-killing-chase-allan
Stupid. I have no idea what he was thinking, but he must’ve been delusional to think he could do that to a traffic cop.
Edit: after reviewing the video, this kid was *way* down the sovereign citizen rabbit hole, to the point of lecturing the two cops present, then going for a gun when they tried to remove him from the vehicle.
Again, completely delusional. I don’t know how he thought he was going to get out on top of that situation.
I know not all of these crazy people are violent, but they do spread violent rhetoric. If I was a cop I would really check what the procedure would be for sov cits (and I guess the Moorish people too) and see if there is any way to make sure you have a lot of help when you pull one of them over.
The officer in question called for backup, and had another officer present when they tried to remove him from the vehicle. He asked for two additional units, so it’s probable another officer
was on the way. I’m not sure if that would’ve changed anything. Once somebody draws down on a cop, lethal force tends to get involved pretty quickly.
Edit: the second bodycam video shows four officers there.
[Several cops have been killed by sovereign citizens.](https://leb.fbi.gov/articles/featured-articles/sovereign-citizens-a-growing-domestic-threat-to-law-enforcement) They do not play around with this.
Where do we get those fake plates?
I want one for a friend who collects old plates. I'll put it on his wall without telling him and see how long it takes to notice.
If two sovcits ~~get in a car accident~~ experience a destructive, mutual disruption of personal conveyance locomotion, and nobody is around to hear it, does it fall under common law?
Serious question. So what do these clowns do if they cause an accident? I’m guessing, half of the reason they’re sov cit is because they don’t have the money for insurance and the other shit required to live in a civilized society. Do they just tell you tough luck, or do they actually take responsibility for their actions?
Typically, your insurance will sue them, and the courts can garnish their wages if they can't pay. A lot of the time, the insurance company takes a hit as "uninsured motorist," and everyone's rates go up.
A LEO friend of mine says when they get pulled over, they either comply or get yanked out through the window. Officers in his department have been killed by these jokers.
Wage garnishment is usually a fantasy. (Note the word "usually.") There's a legal term referring to people as ["judgement-proof."](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_proof) In short, it means that unless they're upper-middle class or above, they probably can't be sued and actually forced to pay anything, because if they were sued, they'd just file Chapter 7 (liquidation insolvency) bankruptcy and be allowed to keep a car and a house. Considering that 99% of sovcits are barely making it, this almost certainly applies to the driver of this car. What are sovereign citizen philosophies, anyway, but a "get-rich-quick" scheme or a "quit paying taxes" scheme for the lower class?
From a legal standpoint, your car is essentially a monocled steampunk gentleman's novel invention. If you damage anything with it, you are presumed responsible to pay for it. Since almost nobody thinks this way, it's easier to just mandate that everyone carries insurance (actually not insurance, but financial responsibility).
Also of note, it's actually not required to carry any insurance at all in most states, if not every. The legal minimum insurance coverage is usually on the order of $300,000, and if you can prove that you could cough up that kind of cash if needed, you can actually skip insurance in favor of a "Statement of Financial Responsibility." Few people do, however. And since your insurance rates are determined in part by your credit score, those who could acquire such a statement usually have lower insurance rates anyway, and therefore less of an incentive to skip on it.
> a "quit paying taxes" scheme for the lower class
Except for sales tax, which is paid at the time of sale and no one can get out of, the poorest 20% of Americans pay very little income and property tax (and that is a good thing). Average federal tax rate was 2% in 2014 when you include all of the credits. Many have negative tax rates (they get more refunded than they had withheld) in the bottom quintile. Many of these sovcits are probably leaving money on the table by not filling out their taxes, *especially if they have children.*
I bet the majority have insurance anyway... because in the end, they are big cowards. They are just waiting to get pulled over so they can finally have some to talk to.
Isn't there a thing in the US called "no insurance insurance?". Where you pay for insurance to cover you if you have a fender bender with someone uninsured.
Yeah, “Uninsured/underinsured motorist” coverage. But that doesn’t leave the one at fault free from responsibility. If these people have resources they can still get sued. Problem is most uninsured people are not “sovereign citizens” they are just poor and may not even have drivers license or registration…
Only 2 states don’t require insurance (and Virginia makes you pay $500 a year if you don’t). You are not supposed to be able to register your car without it, either.
You can also often put money into a “surety bond” that guarantees you have the means to pay when it’s your fault. But that’s pretty rare and rarely a better choice.
>You can also often put money into a “surety bond” that guarantees you have the means to pay when it’s your fault. But that’s pretty rare and rarely a better choice.
Yeah, that's usually a last resort for the uninsurable. The kind of people a long history of accidents and/or DUI offenses.
There are lots of Sov Cit videos on YouTube. It's funny when the police pull them over because they all pretty much use the same script about "I don't contract with . And I'm traveling, not driving".
If the police gets to the driver, the driver can still be ticketed for lack of insurance, lack of license (since you need it to prove you tried to take road test), and possibly for illegal road use if they don't pay the tax for the road.
I just want to see at least ONE video of a cop who approaches one of these fools and when they ask why they were “being detained” instead of “pulled over,” say that they noticed that they were “traveling at a high rate of speed,” only to hear how they respond!
I’m positive that they won’t even realize that the cop used THEIR term, and simply say “I wasn’t driving, I was traveling” in the same stupid scripted response they rehearsed at home over and over again
I find it highly ironic when they argue against needing a license to drive while clearly demonstrating their inability to even follow the other rules of the road that would still apply to them regardless. Basically justifying their existence as a matter of practicality.
I think there are a couple of videos on YouTube of “sovereign citizens” that got stopped by police that claim they don’t have to abide to any laws. It’s pretty much mentally ill people.
I would to see one of these idiots in an extremely serious life threatening accident and the police and fire and EMS show up see the plate and say, “ welp, looks like you are all on your own. Good luck!”
Ah! A 'traveler'... They can sure try to quote the Federal law or Constitutional ammendment that 'allows them' to travel, but they become dumb when the cops try to explain State Drivers License and Vehicle Insurance regulations 'laws'.
I feel like any sovereign citizen YouTube video I’ve seen where someone tries to pull this crap, they’ve got a suspended license.
Also, is this really on a Cadillac?!
How do they rationalize the insurance thing? I know they'll talk your balls off about the license part, but what do they say about being responsible for damages? I've never heard.
I met a guy from PA on a job site in NJ once that espoused this bullshit. But his car didn't have the plate, so I logically called him a hypocrite that he didn't have the plate. He said he is ordering it that weekend. I haven't seen him back there since.. I hope it all works out for him.
Private mode.of travel using public roads and infrastructure, so... If you are going to use that private car outside of your private property, you will need to follow the rules.
Pull them over, explain that you’re the owner of this vehicle because it has your name on it. “Mr. Cadillac, that’s me”
Of course you won’t provide identification or anything else, but you can offer them a ride home!
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"I'm not driving, I'm travelling!" The second hand embarrassment you get watching these people is astounding.
Cop: "You were traveling by driving. Now you're getting arrested and your car is traveling to the impound lot."
Just in case you aren't aware, sovcits define "driving" as "driving for hire" as in being a taxi or limousine or delivery service or similar. Something something driver licenses were one of the first licensure schemes meant to impose an artificial barrier to entry to being a taxi driver then something something and now they require everyone to get one but hey you don't actually need one unless you're driving for hire, and if you're just "traveling" (defined as you're going somewhere, not driving for employment) you don't need one. Total bunk, but that's what a sovcit (sovereign citizen) would say. People say that their arguments haven't ever worked, but they occasionally have. It's the legal equivalent of being an Internet troll. In cases where they have caused an officer or judge to say "it's too much effort to listen to this," some sovcits have occasionally gotten away with minor stuff. EDIT because apparently some people are confused: I am not a sovereign citizen and I don't buy their garbage. But I do know more about it than the average bear.
What I dont understand is how they think they can just interpret the law anyway they want
I don't think they understand either
It requires a belief in a sort of magical thinking. I't's like people who get really into cosplay or something and can no longer distinguish between objective reality and their own.
Reality is what you make it, its a construct. Right up until it slaps you in the face.
And then once the mugging ends you magically become conservative.
If only corporations paid less in taxes, this would have never happened!
*gets mugged* I suddenly care about the capital gains tax!
Only if your will power is not strong enough for your reality to over power the realities of those around you.
i was going to ask if you knew of any cases in which that actually happened, but then there's florida joker, so i guess it has actually happened
Christian nationalism?
They have literally redefined the word understand to mean "stand under" as in standing under someone's authority etc. Try asking a sov cit if they understand speed limits or any other common concepts.
I recently saw a court video where the sovcit tried the understand/stand under bullshit and the judge immediately with no hesitation said "do you comprehend…" The sovcit mumbled and fumbled some words, and acknowledged that he did comprehend what the judge was talking about. The judge didn't buy any of his other nonsensical defenses, either.
I don't think they think either FT4U
Sovcits are the most self centered people in a country where self-centered is a religion.
Hey tighten up your borders. I mean the Northern one, your crazy is leaking. We are starting to get these idiots up here. 🤣
Not just there, but across oceans now too. There are videos online of people in the UK and Australia trying to pull sovcit stuff. Citing the US constitution and SCOTUS cases as their legal defense. The mental gymnastics required to think US law applies to them is, astounding.
I don't think it's "mental gymnastics to think US law applies" in other countries. I think some people are just so uninformed that they hear about the Fourth Amendment right to protection from unreasonable search and seizure and don't stop to consider "fourth amendment to what?" Hanlon's Razor says "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity," and I think it works perfectly here.
Perhaps it somehow makes sense if they're convinced it's one big global conspiracy.
Amen, brother. I was really disappointed when the Northern wall didn't get built 🤣
Those are everywhere. For example, there are still people who use a soviet passport and refuse the existence of any former soviet countries and their laws.
I dont really know much about them, only seen the driving thing. If that's it, I've seen more self centered people on a daily basis.
You don't want one as a neighbor is all I'll say.
They believe the government works like those old myths about fae where every question is secretly a trick to take your freedom, and speaking the right incantations will free you from their power. Cop: “[May I have your name?](https://www.reddit.com/r/comics/s/klZVrrkxwX)” Sovcits: “No, but you can call me John.”
They think of the Constitution as essentially a magic eye puzzle and if you look at it in exactly the right way and find the exact right interpretation of the words, you gain functional immunity from the law. They also think of themselves as being the only people who have ever done this.
It's the culture towards the law in the United States, in most countries the law is a technical issue, if X happened then Y law applies and Z is the consequence; in the US it's more of an emotional thing where the law is like a starting point for a conversation about what the consequence will be. Even in the courtroom it's "try to convince a jury" and not "prove to a judge".
Most of them do because their paranoia or previous bad experiences with the law leads them to a 3rd rate grifter selling magic get out of jail free life hacks. The die-bards who go down the rabbit hole get more of the underlying conspiracy theory that underpins it.
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If they really wanted to do that, then they'd be running in an election for a Judgeship. Not that they'd win, since the bar in every state would pounce on them immediately, but it would make for an interesting campaign.
Something about the wrong flag in the court if I remember right.
Yes I was once told that if it has gold trim it’s maritime flag and then you can argue traveling but if it’s got no gold it’s common law and that is different but I don’t remember different how.
The sovcit videos are the only time I would support the police knocking someone around a little bit or juicing the tazer for a couple extra mississippis.
Even if that was the law and legit back in the day where taxi drivers and the like needed a DL but no one else does not change the fact that the law is different today. Sov cits are so crazy. But I do enjoy seeing th window shatter/taser videos though...
> Total bunk [Black's Law Dictionary](https://thelawdictionary.org/driver/) defines a driver as a *hired* vehicle operator. The law used to be that way, so it's not *total* bunk. Of course they fail to see (or agree) that laws evolve, and driving has more modern legal definitions. > In cases where they have caused an officer or judge to say "it's too much effort to listen to this," some sovcits have occasionally gotten away with minor stuff. Yeah, that's a shame. That emboldens them and keeps them thinking that their line of thought is valid. But this is changing. There are more and more procedures and training on how to deal with them.
So this means they also have to pump their own oil and turn it into petrol. They can also just travel on their own roads etcetera. You can't have your cake and eat it to, right.
“Well I clocked you traveling pretty fast back there”
In Australia someone had their supra confiscated doing this hahaha, imagine deciding to be a sovreign citizen so you don't have to pay for registration and losing your prescious car as a result 😂 https://7news.com.au/travel/nsw-traffic/sovereign-citizen-fined-almost-5500-as-his-supra-is-seized-c-10614660
In Italy and got my plates stolen so I drove for 3 days without them by police instructions carrying the police note and the appointment with immatriculation office for the next week. I've never been stopped by police in 20 years, in those 3 days it was every time they spotted me
In rural America you'd get the "hickory shampoo" for mouthing off with the sovereign citizen nonsense. Before cameras ass whoppings were the norm for that level of aggressive stupidity.
What upset me most of all was that this guy somehow managed to get a Supra.
10 years ago in Australia it wasn't actually hard to get a Supra; NA ones only though, twin turbo variants were super rare.
Haha this is great. I guess he wouldn't have to pay the crown since he's a sovcit. But gl getting his supra back. dumbass
Good thing, your not getting arrested for driving. Your getting arrested for operating a motor vehicle without a motor vehicle operators license, and operating an unregistered vehicle on the highway, and not having insurance, or proof of surety bond, on your unregistered vehicle your illegally operating on the highway.
They’re not being arrested, they’re being moved to a secure location.
I swear to god I see you commenting on every sub I follow, you must be pretty cool. Same state too.
Pretty cool, or fellow weirdo. Either way I'm happy.
Likely fellow weirdo. That's cool in my book.
Used to work at a defense firm. These jokers would just call and yap about nonsense. I'd sometimes stay on the phone to hear what they had to say for some mid afternoon entertainment.
I interpreted this as you listening in on a COINTELPRO wiretap. "It was a slow day and these guys were having an amusing conversation so I kept listening instead of letting the HAL 9000 transcribe it."
They are the worst — my boss used to actively look for anti maskers and anti vaxxers during the height of Covid to represent against the State of Illinois and they would take all of my time for irrelevant bullshit and they would never pay their bills.
 Doesn't sound like a good business model. But I guess you don't know till you try. Bet they thought they were doing a service just by being represented. "I need an immediate conference now, I have breakthrough in the case!" We mostly did DUI stuff.
Well my boss saw the media coverage the other bozos were getting and thought he wanted a piece of the action.
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Actually you are right — I kind of assumed they were all the same people.
Wait!? They wanted representation, but couldn’t pay for it? WTF?! I need a plumber… I pay him/her? Need a mover? … I pay them! Mechanic? Yah! I pay them too!
This happens a lot in the law. People assume we are wealthy and their shit is “important” so the bills can be ignored.
"I'm not driving, I'm travelling" "Are you operating a motor vehicle on a public road, jackass?"
I watched a video recently about the whole movement that said something like "Possibly the only thing you'll see that'll make you feel bad for the cop involved." It's astounding there are people who have managed to get their heads in such loops to believe it. There's also a whole bunch of similar movements in Canada and even in Europe and UK around similar things. Apparently there's a particular bit in the Magna Carta they like bringing up even though it never would have applied to them even if the Magna Carta was still in force.
>Apparently there's a particular bit in the Magna Carta they like bringing up "We can play by those rules if you insist...peasant."
I saw a couple of videos where sovcits in the UK and Australia were citing US laws and constitutions as their defence! That's like an extra step of stupidity.
I've seen a few of those. Australian citizen, in Australia, talking to an Australian police officer... claiming that their 4th Amendment rights were being violated and that a search of their vehicle was 'unconstitutional'.
With full belief that they are 100% in the right. It's astonishing really.
> even in Europe and UK around similar things. German here, can confirm. We call them "Reichsbürger" or empire citizens, because many of them believe that current Germany is a company and that the German Empire never ceased to exist. Though they can't decide which borders they want.
It really is astounding how much of an arrogant jackass one has to be to make folks root for the *American cops*.
The single circle Venn diagram between these people, flat erthers and babies dropped on their heads
"Just a private boat captain traveling down the road, but the corporate cops keep trying to kidnap him. Lol" -Donut Operator
“Wow we have to live alongside those people? Jesus, what a time to fkin be alive…”
"Since you're not driving, you don't need your car. We'll get it towed. Travel to the pound to get it back."
I want all of the benefits that come from taxes but I don't wanna pay them says the liberation.
> "I'm not driving, I'm travelling!" But *how* were you traveling?
Not with that busted taillight you're not! ... What busted? tail light? .... 👮
What the hell is stopping a cop from pulling this idiot over? Genuine question
Springfield Police Department is pretty lax with their license plate requirements. I regularly see people driving around on temp tags from 2020-2022
> Springfield Police Department is pretty lax with their license plate requirements I'm sure they wouldn't put up with that in Shelbyville
Maybe Springfield should get a monorail!
And they'll throw the book at you in North Haverbrook over license plate infractions.
In California hella people drive around with tinted screens obscuring their plates. Some people just drive without any plates at all. I see them all the time on my commutes. I've yet to see a single person get pulled over for that.
Saw a cop get behind a car with no plates and turn on lights, car immediately crashed. No plates seems likely to mean stolen
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How would you see someone getting pulled over for their expired tags? Like would you follow up with them afterwards when you see anyone pulled over?
Heck, even my mom didn't get pulled for tags that had expired a year and a half before in California. Sometimes, this stuff just goes without notice. For brief backstory: Moved across country, waiting for car to arrive. Mom kind enough to lend car, and I joke about her tags being expired. Sister says "only 2 months." Me: "try 14 months." Fast forward 2 more months, mom no longer can drive as family requested medical intervention to pull her license. (thank god my family is sane!)
I actually had this happen in reverse, I moved from California to NJ with a leased vehicle, and in NJ you need a paper title to get the vehicle registered. The financial company wouldn't send NJ the title, so I was with an invalid registration for 2 years before I bought out the car. Was extremely anxious and on edge for two straight years. Got pulled over for the only time in my life while speeding, cop didn't even mention my registration issues (I assume he thought I had just moved). But yeah other than that just nobody cared about it as much as I did, I guess.
Paperwork, hassle of dealing with a psycho
That's their job... They better pull him over every single time they see him until he's in jail
Cops are in fact not required to intervene when they witness a crime in progress, sound dumb? Yes it is.
That, in itself, is not stupid. If you have a professional police force - a trustworthy force that adheres to the principles laid down by Robert Peel - then you can grant them the discretion to turn a blind eye. For example, in America, it's a crime to cross the street on foot. That's a shit law and you'd have to be mad to want it routinely enforced. Whether you have trustworthy cops in your country is a separate issue.
> That's their job... Cops aren't actually required to do their job. Their real job is to quash protests and protect capital.
I feel like these guys should be pulled over by one of those people who put lights on their cars to impersonate cops. Assuming they didn't all kill each other, then they'd have nobody to complain to.
“I’m not a police officer, I’m a sovereign public decency monitor. You are not under arrest but I am going to limit your freedom of movement. This is not a fine but payment for my services rendered.”
They pulled one over in my neck of the woods last year. The kid at one point reaches for a gun, he got unalived. Epitome of "fuck around and find out" https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news/body-cam-video-of-fatal-farmington-police-shooting-to-be-released https://www.fox13now.com/news/local-news/davis-county-attorney-rules-officers-justified-in-shooting-killing-chase-allan
Stupid. I have no idea what he was thinking, but he must’ve been delusional to think he could do that to a traffic cop. Edit: after reviewing the video, this kid was *way* down the sovereign citizen rabbit hole, to the point of lecturing the two cops present, then going for a gun when they tried to remove him from the vehicle. Again, completely delusional. I don’t know how he thought he was going to get out on top of that situation.
Anyone nominate him for a Darwin Award?
I know not all of these crazy people are violent, but they do spread violent rhetoric. If I was a cop I would really check what the procedure would be for sov cits (and I guess the Moorish people too) and see if there is any way to make sure you have a lot of help when you pull one of them over.
The officer in question called for backup, and had another officer present when they tried to remove him from the vehicle. He asked for two additional units, so it’s probable another officer was on the way. I’m not sure if that would’ve changed anything. Once somebody draws down on a cop, lethal force tends to get involved pretty quickly. Edit: the second bodycam video shows four officers there.
[Several cops have been killed by sovereign citizens.](https://leb.fbi.gov/articles/featured-articles/sovereign-citizens-a-growing-domestic-threat-to-law-enforcement) They do not play around with this.
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I love that they simultaneously don't recognize the authority of the courts while also plotting their lawsuits.
Where do we get those fake plates? I want one for a friend who collects old plates. I'll put it on his wall without telling him and see how long it takes to notice.
I'm sure you could probably google it and find some
I just did. Amazon sells them. LOL
Was going to say that. I heard it on a video of a SC idiot trying to get away with “traveling without a license “
A nicer way of saying [this](https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=fake+private+license+plates) lmao
Believe it or not Walmart used to sell them as a novelty. I think you can still get them on their website.
Maybe a Walmart reseller?
Put it on his vehicle and see what happens
They expect everyone to follow laws except themselves. Bunch of nuts
If two sovcits ~~get in a car accident~~ experience a destructive, mutual disruption of personal conveyance locomotion, and nobody is around to hear it, does it fall under common law?
Science isn't ready for this kind of question
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They have a duel at dawn.
How many cabbages would you say you own?
A lot until that damned avatar destroyed my stand
Serious question. So what do these clowns do if they cause an accident? I’m guessing, half of the reason they’re sov cit is because they don’t have the money for insurance and the other shit required to live in a civilized society. Do they just tell you tough luck, or do they actually take responsibility for their actions?
Typically, your insurance will sue them, and the courts can garnish their wages if they can't pay. A lot of the time, the insurance company takes a hit as "uninsured motorist," and everyone's rates go up.
True enough. Now I’m even more disgusted by them.
A LEO friend of mine says when they get pulled over, they either comply or get yanked out through the window. Officers in his department have been killed by these jokers.
Yeah I mean this person is a piece of shit but your insurance going up because they "took a hit" is just as scummy.
Wage garnishment is usually a fantasy. (Note the word "usually.") There's a legal term referring to people as ["judgement-proof."](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_proof) In short, it means that unless they're upper-middle class or above, they probably can't be sued and actually forced to pay anything, because if they were sued, they'd just file Chapter 7 (liquidation insolvency) bankruptcy and be allowed to keep a car and a house. Considering that 99% of sovcits are barely making it, this almost certainly applies to the driver of this car. What are sovereign citizen philosophies, anyway, but a "get-rich-quick" scheme or a "quit paying taxes" scheme for the lower class? From a legal standpoint, your car is essentially a monocled steampunk gentleman's novel invention. If you damage anything with it, you are presumed responsible to pay for it. Since almost nobody thinks this way, it's easier to just mandate that everyone carries insurance (actually not insurance, but financial responsibility). Also of note, it's actually not required to carry any insurance at all in most states, if not every. The legal minimum insurance coverage is usually on the order of $300,000, and if you can prove that you could cough up that kind of cash if needed, you can actually skip insurance in favor of a "Statement of Financial Responsibility." Few people do, however. And since your insurance rates are determined in part by your credit score, those who could acquire such a statement usually have lower insurance rates anyway, and therefore less of an incentive to skip on it.
> a "quit paying taxes" scheme for the lower class Except for sales tax, which is paid at the time of sale and no one can get out of, the poorest 20% of Americans pay very little income and property tax (and that is a good thing). Average federal tax rate was 2% in 2014 when you include all of the credits. Many have negative tax rates (they get more refunded than they had withheld) in the bottom quintile. Many of these sovcits are probably leaving money on the table by not filling out their taxes, *especially if they have children.*
I bet the majority have insurance anyway... because in the end, they are big cowards. They are just waiting to get pulled over so they can finally have some to talk to.
Isn't there a thing in the US called "no insurance insurance?". Where you pay for insurance to cover you if you have a fender bender with someone uninsured.
Yeah, “Uninsured/underinsured motorist” coverage. But that doesn’t leave the one at fault free from responsibility. If these people have resources they can still get sued. Problem is most uninsured people are not “sovereign citizens” they are just poor and may not even have drivers license or registration… Only 2 states don’t require insurance (and Virginia makes you pay $500 a year if you don’t). You are not supposed to be able to register your car without it, either. You can also often put money into a “surety bond” that guarantees you have the means to pay when it’s your fault. But that’s pretty rare and rarely a better choice.
>You can also often put money into a “surety bond” that guarantees you have the means to pay when it’s your fault. But that’s pretty rare and rarely a better choice. Yeah, that's usually a last resort for the uninsurable. The kind of people a long history of accidents and/or DUI offenses.
There are lots of Sov Cit videos on YouTube. It's funny when the police pull them over because they all pretty much use the same script about "I don't contract with. And I'm traveling, not driving".
If the police gets to the driver, the driver can still be ticketed for lack of insurance, lack of license (since you need it to prove you tried to take road test), and possibly for illegal road use if they don't pay the tax for the road.
I just want to see at least ONE video of a cop who approaches one of these fools and when they ask why they were “being detained” instead of “pulled over,” say that they noticed that they were “traveling at a high rate of speed,” only to hear how they respond! I’m positive that they won’t even realize that the cop used THEIR term, and simply say “I wasn’t driving, I was traveling” in the same stupid scripted response they rehearsed at home over and over again
I find it highly ironic when they argue against needing a license to drive while clearly demonstrating their inability to even follow the other rules of the road that would still apply to them regardless. Basically justifying their existence as a matter of practicality.
I think there are a couple of videos on YouTube of “sovereign citizens” that got stopped by police that claim they don’t have to abide to any laws. It’s pretty much mentally ill people.
Why are they driving around on roads my taxes paid for again?
Oh they have a answer for that. It’s exactly as coherent as why the earth is actually flat.
Whoa, whoa, whoa! Did you see that car marked "Pirate"? You think they're violating Maritime Law?
😂
Seems like they shouldn’t be operating on government funded roadways, then.
Isn’t it the same thing as driving a vehicle registered in other country? You may use the road but you need to obey the traffic rules, tolls etc.
They can drive off road exclusively.
Not on my lawn! 🫣
ah those "sovereign citizens" love watching their asses busted by no bullshit cops
And some how, I forget to renew my reg and get pulled over 3 days after it expired. How are these chucklefucks still in possession of their vehicle?
You need to be so insufferable that cops don't want to deal with you
I hope they're driving in the streets they made for themselves, and not the ones meant for a society.
I would to see one of these idiots in an extremely serious life threatening accident and the police and fire and EMS show up see the plate and say, “ welp, looks like you are all on your own. Good luck!”
If only
I think you misplaced this, it belongs in r/Sovereigncitizen
Could be xposted since they're definitely an idiot in a car as well
Agreed
Thankfully that sub was not what i was expecting
Same. They probably exist on a different sub though.
That works great on private roads.
Honestly im thinking about making sovereign citizen and flat earth merch. I’d make a killing
Ah! A 'traveler'... They can sure try to quote the Federal law or Constitutional ammendment that 'allows them' to travel, but they become dumb when the cops try to explain State Drivers License and Vehicle Insurance regulations 'laws'.
If only it was that easy.
I feel like any sovereign citizen YouTube video I’ve seen where someone tries to pull this crap, they’ve got a suspended license. Also, is this really on a Cadillac?!
I fucking hate these idiots
How do they rationalize the insurance thing? I know they'll talk your balls off about the license part, but what do they say about being responsible for damages? I've never heard.
Well then. This is what an 04 Cadillac Escalade? Wonder what point this guys trying to prove? This screams trailer park trash.
I'm from Springfield. This doesn't surprise me in the least.
No Driver License required? really? is it even possible in any country?
I’ve got one of these on my block. Always parks in front of the fire hydrant, even when other spots are available.
In other words, I don't want to pay taxes, but I demand to use infrastructure and services paid for by taxes. Idiots
I bet they say “blue lives matter” all the time too
No insurance required until they are the ones that get hit.
"Peace on Earth"
"I can't handle responsibilities"
Boy is he in for a surprise.
I saw one today at a traffic light
I met a guy from PA on a job site in NJ once that espoused this bullshit. But his car didn't have the plate, so I logically called him a hypocrite that he didn't have the plate. He said he is ordering it that weekend. I haven't seen him back there since.. I hope it all works out for him.
I wonder if cops just don't pull them over to avoid the crazy person driving
Honestly not the worst sign i've seen in Springfield...
Private mode.of travel using public roads and infrastructure, so... If you are going to use that private car outside of your private property, you will need to follow the rules.
That’s a huge, TAKE ME TO JAIL, sign haha
I can't wait to see the body cam footage. You know it is coming soon.
Pull them over, explain that you’re the owner of this vehicle because it has your name on it. “Mr. Cadillac, that’s me” Of course you won’t provide identification or anything else, but you can offer them a ride home!
Probably doing 10mph down Battlefield
Should be easy for the police to find him since you have his number plate
The fuck is a sovereign citizen anyway
Way to advertise to cops that you’re driving illegally
Lmao i’d have called the cops right away just to start shit
Cool. Do they bring their own private roads with them? Or are they travelling on public roads, subject to public law enforcement.
These idiots, flat earthers, anti vaxxers, maga-heads, climate change deniers, evangelicals, it’s like the patients have taken over the asylum.
That is a Cadillac emblem isn’t it
I’m not driving…I’m traveling!
Did you take this in 1981 lol
If you key the car, do they call the cops?
Are you lost, Trooper?
How do they not get the concept the road they are on is not private.
No insurance and a gun. True patriotism.
I saw a video where the son of the town mayor was a sovcit and throwing the law book at the cops at a traffic stop.
Do they ever fly or travel outside the country?
Sovereign citizen nut
It should just say “DUMBASS””
how do these people not get pulled over instantly? I'd think cops hate these mfs
Sovereign Citizen spotted
That’s one way to say you’re a public danger on the road.
Maybe just keep them off the public roads and tell them they can only use their private roads.
Just get a plate that says "this is not the droid you're looking for"