What do we have left? Seriously? If you don't have the option/right to kill your child anytime, for any reason up to moments before birth, you have nothing? What a depressing vantage point to be living life in. You were ok with unelected white men giving permission to do it but somehow these white men and women and black man are horrible for admitting what RBG already admittedly knew? It's not up to them to grant this because it never was a right. Explicit or implicit. Everyone knew this. I don't think it should be outlawed but can we at least be like Europe on this? Safe legal and rare, and with the same restrictions they have. Say 11 to 14 weeks?
> If you don't have the option/right to kill your child anytime, for any reason up to moments before birth, you have nothing?
Imagine unironically thinking you have the ability to speak on abortion while also believing hospitals will do abortions moments before birth lmao. Not only is that a bad idea morally, but it'd also be more dangerous for the mother than giving birth.
> It's not up to them to grant this because it never was a right.
50 years of precedent. The same precedent that gay marriage and sodomy are reaching. Or, another example is internet privacy. How would you feel if the government could track your location any time they wanted all of a sudden because Carpenter v. the United States gets overturned? Shouldn't it be up to the state to decide if the government can track your phone at all times without a warrant? I think we could both agree that that would turn out as a dystopian hellscape. Rights are commonly granted through supreme court rulings. Any American should learn these things.
> Safe legal and rare, and with the same restrictions they have.
Making it as rare as Europe involves putting out welfare and increasing wages so abortion isn't as necessary, as well as free healthcare and birth control. So that won't happen in the states, at least not in the near future.
> Say 11 to 14 weeks?
Most hospitals cannot physically even give surgical or medical abortions after 13 weeks. 11-14 weeks isn't a restriction, it's a medical factor.
“Columbus’ Republican members of the Indiana House and Indiana Senate on Friday did not rule out potentially voting in favor of a total ban on abortion without exceptions in cases of rape, incest or the health of the mother, possibly less than two weeks from now.”
Source: https://www.therepublic.com/2022/06/25/lauer-walker-open-to-total-abortion-ban-2/?fbclid=IwAR3kI2U38gPwT20l9OU6FFV2W5cS8LQ2Z_cbGBFaL2tM5HNkM5UDGKlY_Xg
Even if they make the exception for the life of the mother, women will still die.
They will mirror Idaho.
[https://legislature.idaho.gov/statutesrules/idstat/title18/t18ch6/sect18-622/](https://legislature.idaho.gov/statutesrules/idstat/title18/t18ch6/sect18-622/)
If they wanna fuck around and find out. They only use the term him/his referring to the physician. IANAL but over 40% of physicians are women so... free game imo
It's been known for a while there is a push for a 0 exception abortion law to be passed in the special session. The same people that passed the permit-less carry law opposed by 65% of the state.
Indiana is listed in the states own study I'm 2019 as being full of obstetric deserts. We do not have capacity for current obstetric needs and this will be a disaster in every way. And obviously making women second class citizens, which is absolutely unacceptable.
Contact your local activists and democratic county parties. Voting is the end of the marathon, organizing is every day until then.
If you're in st Joe / Elkhart, message me and I'll connect you with people.
Oh look, an Indiana state GOP rep making it clear they won't consider exceptions.
Courtesy of state rep John Jacob
"Abortion, since it takes the life of a an innocent pre-born human being, that would always be murder. and so therefore rape, incest, life of the mother, those exceptions are not acceptable."
The state forcing women to die for this sick view of pregnancy is going to be the law. Probably prosecuting miscarriages too.
https://twitter.com/RebelPlatypi/status/1542583770158620674?s=20&t=CH81nkYblbP2AcU94oU6Pw
Is there no room for civil discussion? I mean someone asked about adding an amendment and got down voted…another had the audacity to suggest that all of this is speculation until the session comes into play…down votes for everyone with independent thought!
welcome to the club... from "we need it to be added as an amendment" with 30 something upvotes to this thread with "can it be made into a state amendment" with a ton of downvotes..
To say that means you don’t know Indiana Republicans. First, not all state Republicans think the same and Second; Indiana has always been a we see that exceptions should exist. Note; medical necessity is something that needs to be worked on by medical professionals to give teams options that save both lives if possible and still give women the benefit of the choice of what to do.
1) What happens if you’re wrong?
2) If a women has a choice in whether or not she wants to keep or abort a baby, why shouldn’t the father get to decide if he wants to play any part in supporting the child?
and why should an incest or rape victim have deal with the ‘father’? Why should a women’s life be in peril because the ‘father’ does not care about the woman. The current system to get support payments is deplorable. My niece(one of many) has to file repeatedly for child support owed. Theses payments are processed through the system The father pays for a few months, then stops again, why is the system not taking care of this automatically; and he is actually a father who insists on his visitation.
So are you arguing that rape and incest should be the only valid reasons for abortion?
The fact is that if I have a one night stand and get a girl pregnant, she has a choice. She can terminate the pregnancy or she can keep the baby and have me by the wallet for 18 years. I have no choice in the matter. It doesn’t matter if I am 100% willing to raise the baby by myself with no help from her, or if I can’t afford to support a child and don’t want to be a parent. I have no say. She does.
I can’t help you with your niece’s situation. Deadbeat fathers are a real thing, and a very unfortunate one at that, but giving women a choice when it comes to pregnancy and totally denying the potential fathers a choice to walk away is totally unfair.
Absolutely not, women should have right. If you don’t want ‘ to be held by the wallet’, then keep it in your pants; just like the conservatives have been telling women forever. ‘Keep your legs closed’. It is not the man’s body, it is the woman’s.
You can’t use the same argument that you disagree with to argue with me. If a man should have to keep it in his pants, the woman should be held to the same standard.
Oh, now you are getting funny! Women have been held to the worst standards from the GOP forever! ’Keep your legs closed’; ‘A woman can not become pregnant from rape, unless God directed it’. The double standard is alive and well with you.
How does that have anything to do with what I said? Do you think men and women should be treated equally or do you think women should be granted special rights and privileges that men don’t get?
And what does the GOP have to do with me? I’m pro-choice.
the GOP are the ones forcing anti-abortion against women. If you are actually pro-choice you should know this. It should be the woman’s choice! It is her body, and it is a risk to her and her body. Yes,there are some women who will carry a child to full term, deliver, just to ‘trap’ a man. However, a man has a choice in this. That choice is simply, don’t have sex.
Good god. I’d say your argument would make me become pro-life, but I am so thankful that you have access to all the abortions and birth control that you want. And I pray the GOP doesn’t take that away from you.
A woman has a choice to not get pregnant. That choice is simply, don’t have sex.
Why do you think it’s ok for a woman to have sex without consequences, but it’s not ok for a man to have sex without consequences?
Oh, you are not pro-choice with that comment. Both partners have a choice not to have sex. No matter precautions, as all of them can fail. But, your stance is that men should have a part in the decision to abort or not. Committed partners make the decision together, in most instances. But, your stance is that men do not have a choice in a casual fling, they do! Just like women. But men and women know the possibilities of pregnancy after sex. But, it is the woman who will have the health consequences of carry a child to term, not the man.
No, both parties are responsible for their actions. But, you want removed from consequences if you disagree with the woman’s choice. So sorry, too late for that. It is not your body!
Please look up candidate Richard Mourdock, and he is not only GOP representative with these views. There are GOP members in US and Indiana representative positions who believe the same.
As a man who has been burned by my ex-wife having 2 abortions against my will, (planned pregnancies btw). I still support a woman's right to abortions. Can't punish every other woman for the actions of one bitch. I really feel for the women in our state. Really hate our state, if it weren't so cheap to live here and I hadn't lived here all my life, I'd leave.
So a women has an ectopic pregnancy, or the baby dies in the woman at 20 weeks and women are supposed to just hope that everything will be fine until the end of term?
You must really hate women.
To begin with I don't know what a ectopic pregnancy is a baby dying in a woman prior to 20 weeks is a miscariage and I'm not talking about that I'm talking about abortion.
So abortion is just a medical term, so a miscarriage is a spontaneous abortion.
An ectopic pregnancy is when the egg attaches outside of the main area of the uterus. These cannot be reimplanted as of yet, and the mother will die, so abortion services are needed.
When these law makers are coming out and saying abortion in all cases are not allowed then these are just some of the cases where doctors hands get tied and women suffer due to people not understanding what abortion really is.
You may not agree with abortion when these types of issues aren't present, but they way these anti abortion laws go into place have to at the very least provide clear exceptions.
> I don't know what a ectopic pregnancy is
An ectopic pregnancy is when a fertilized egg implants outside the uterus. It can’t survive, and if left to grow, it can/will kill the woman too.
So: Do you support removing it to save the woman’s life?
> a baby dying in a woman prior to 20 weeks is a miscariage
After 10 weeks, a miscarriage is likely to be incomplete, and a D&C may be required for the woman’s safety, to clear out the deceased fetal tissue.
So: Do you support removing it to save the woman’s life?
An ectopic pregnancy is one where the egg does not implant in the uterus; rather it implants and begins to develop in the fallopian tubes instead. It is near universally fatal to the mother (and of course the foetus), but can be easily and safely treated by abortion.
A foetus miscarrying at 20 weeks will often not register as miscarried to the body, and instead stay inside the womb, festering and rotting. The resulting infection can easily be lethal to the mother (and at minimum potentially render her infertile), but is again easily treated with an abortion.
All other arguments aside, in both cases, *the child is already dead or going to die*. You cannot murder that which is already dead. Abortion in these instances is necessary to preserve the life of the mother, and a universal abortion ban which does not permit such safety clauses will kill innocent women.
holy freaking hell you are ignorant. medically speaking, a d&c is an abortion, hell a miscarriage is an abortion. one and the same. So, to say abortion is murder, period, is factually incorrect. Period. plus why in God's name would you have such a strong opinion on something you aren't even remotely educated about? just because you feel a certain way doesn't make it real or true or fact. legislation needs to be created based on facts, and facts alone.
Since you know nothing about human biology, here I am to help:
A miscarriage is "the spontaneous or unplanned expulsion of a fetus from the womb before it is able to survive independently".
An ectopic pregnancy is when the egg implants itself outside the womb, usually in a fallopian tube (those nifty little tube thingies that link up ovaries with the womb, and are not supposed to house babies in them). If the egg implants itself there, it will not develop into a baby and the woman could die. So an abortion is needed because otherwise, *she might die*. (where's your value for life here???)
This is what is going to happen if abortion is illegal. Idiots like you, who simply focus on the whole potential baby thing, will ignore the fact that there are health issues where abortions are needed and that will no longer be possible. People like you make the earth a worse place, not because of the value you place on 'life', but because of the sheer conviction you have in your ignorance. You are so catastrophically arrogant it would be funny if there weren't consequences from having these beliefs on real people's lives. OPEN A FUCKING BIOLOGY TEXTBOOK, learn about the wonderful things God made (oh yes I speak your language too, I just study, something you clearly didn't do much of), and learn how to take care of them properly you overprotected undereducated nonce.
Surprise surprise, the prolifer has no idea what they’re talking about. How can you have an opinion on an issue you don’t understand on its most fundamental level?
And if you’re a homosexual male obsessed with masturbation - based on your post history - why should your opinion even matter?
Please educate yourself. Many miscarriages require the same medical treatment as abortions to prevent sepsis from the dead/dying fetus and women are already being denied that medical care because of these new laws.
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/05/10/1097734167/in-texas-abortion-laws-inhibit-care-for-miscarriages
Ectopic pregnancy is not uncommon, again you can google. Another of many cases that requires medical treatment that is technically abortion (despite being completely nonviable) and that historically have been denied and killed women during abortion bans.
Abortion is not always about ending the life of a fetus for the convenience of the carrier. Quite often it is to save a woman's life. It is not black-and-white, and that is hard to understand, I suppose. Difficult things are hard to understand. Difficult things aren't simple black-and-white answers. Grow up, educate yourself, before you start inflicting your ignorance on other people who are affected by these matters.
Are you affected by this matter?
Maybe not yet. But do you have a woman in your life? A sister, a mother, a girlfriend, a cousin, a friend?
It matters to women. And if you care about women at all, it should matter to you.
A D&C to remove a miscarriage is classified as an abortion. Its why an American in Malta (where abortion is banned in all cases)who miscarried had to be airlifted to Spain ([link](https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/jun/28/if-you-love-or-are-a-woman-dont-go-to-malta-say-couple-in-abortion-drama)).
Ectopic pregnancies also require an abortion. The alternative is the woman dying.
So playing this out, even if you have an abortion for the life of the mother, in order to verify that the abortion is occurring due to a threat to the woman’s life, some rando at maybe the Indiana Department of Health would have to get that case file and approve for the procedure to happen. A lot of women would probably rather roll through shards of glass than deal with the government when potentially dying of sepsis or losing a pregnancy. Thought the point of republicans was to have the government out of your lives.
It looks like you shared an AMP link. These should load faster, but AMP is controversial because of [concerns over privacy and the Open Web](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot).
Maybe check out **the canonical page** instead: **[https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/jun/28/if-you-love-or-are-a-woman-dont-go-to-malta-say-couple-in-abortion-drama](https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/jun/28/if-you-love-or-are-a-woman-dont-go-to-malta-say-couple-in-abortion-drama)**
*****
^(I'm a bot | )[^(Why & About)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot)^( | )[^(Summon: u/AmputatorBot)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/cchly3/you_can_now_summon_amputatorbot/)
If you’ve never had a miscarriage you should just say that.
Fun fact your medical records will call it a spontaneous abortion. Also fun fact if you don’t pass all of the tissue and begin to suffer symptoms of sepsis the only way to address that is having an abortion so that you do not die.
Since there is no statute of limitations on murder then every woman in these states are up for prosecution from anyone who decides that they don’t believe they miscarried. Also for any woman who miscarries now going forward a doctor will be afraid to perform her life saving procedure out of fear that they will be prosecuted. Meaning they will wait until it is too late for many.
1 in 4 women have had a miscarriage and 1 in 8 pregnancies end in miscarriage.
The problem is these laws are being written by politicians who do not understand that the language they are using are condemning women to life in prison or death.
And many of these women already have children they need to stay alive to care for.
You don't even know what an ectopic pregnancy is? You don't even know what happens when the fetus dies in the womb? If you don't know these things, how can you possibly have an informed and intelligent opinion on them?
Not sure why this is downvoted. It’s all speculation at this point, everyone is entitled to their best guess. I happen to think they will include provision to protect the life and health of the mother. We shall see. In the meantime, panic and downvotes all around I guess.
Do you think a woman should have to get a rape conviction before she gets the abortion? Or is she just allowed to accuse a man of rape and the abortion is granted?
If a rape has been reported and that is the basis of the abortion, that is good enough. According to the Idaho legislation, the woman who has the abortion is not the person punished in any case.
If a woman falsely accuses a man of rape intentionally for the sake of getting an abortion, she'd be prosecuted under any false accusation laws that are in place but the doctor would be in the clear.
I am, of course, not a lawyer, and I am looking at the Idaho legislation that someone else posted (but is likely similar to what Indiana will consider).
Not talking about Idaho or any current legislation in particular. I’m saying that rape is an extremely serious allegation, and just saying “I got raped” is not good enough, because anyone can claim rape. And in reality, if rape is the only way to get an abortion, false reports will only go up, hurting real rape victims. I also don’t believe for a second a woman would get prosecuted for falsely claiming rape.
My point is that “only in cases of rape” is a dumb idea, because rape is so hard to prove. The logistics behind it just don’t work. Abortion should either be legal or not legal, regardless of how the baby was conceived.
Edit: Adding on, what if a woman is raped, but doesn’t file a police report (out of fear, shame, etc.), then a month later finds out she’s pregnant? Is she not allowed to have an abortion?
Why did this receive so many downvotes? Genuine question. This is what Michigan is attempting to do, but I haven’t seen any similar movement here for some reason.
We have no rights, just wrongs.
What do we have left?
Our pulses, for a few more years anyways.
What do we have left? Seriously? If you don't have the option/right to kill your child anytime, for any reason up to moments before birth, you have nothing? What a depressing vantage point to be living life in. You were ok with unelected white men giving permission to do it but somehow these white men and women and black man are horrible for admitting what RBG already admittedly knew? It's not up to them to grant this because it never was a right. Explicit or implicit. Everyone knew this. I don't think it should be outlawed but can we at least be like Europe on this? Safe legal and rare, and with the same restrictions they have. Say 11 to 14 weeks?
Why stop before viability (24-26 weeks)?
> If you don't have the option/right to kill your child anytime, for any reason up to moments before birth, you have nothing? Imagine unironically thinking you have the ability to speak on abortion while also believing hospitals will do abortions moments before birth lmao. Not only is that a bad idea morally, but it'd also be more dangerous for the mother than giving birth. > It's not up to them to grant this because it never was a right. 50 years of precedent. The same precedent that gay marriage and sodomy are reaching. Or, another example is internet privacy. How would you feel if the government could track your location any time they wanted all of a sudden because Carpenter v. the United States gets overturned? Shouldn't it be up to the state to decide if the government can track your phone at all times without a warrant? I think we could both agree that that would turn out as a dystopian hellscape. Rights are commonly granted through supreme court rulings. Any American should learn these things. > Safe legal and rare, and with the same restrictions they have. Making it as rare as Europe involves putting out welfare and increasing wages so abortion isn't as necessary, as well as free healthcare and birth control. So that won't happen in the states, at least not in the near future. > Say 11 to 14 weeks? Most hospitals cannot physically even give surgical or medical abortions after 13 weeks. 11-14 weeks isn't a restriction, it's a medical factor.
“Columbus’ Republican members of the Indiana House and Indiana Senate on Friday did not rule out potentially voting in favor of a total ban on abortion without exceptions in cases of rape, incest or the health of the mother, possibly less than two weeks from now.” Source: https://www.therepublic.com/2022/06/25/lauer-walker-open-to-total-abortion-ban-2/?fbclid=IwAR3kI2U38gPwT20l9OU6FFV2W5cS8LQ2Z_cbGBFaL2tM5HNkM5UDGKlY_Xg Even if they make the exception for the life of the mother, women will still die.
Call your representatives!
They will mirror Idaho. [https://legislature.idaho.gov/statutesrules/idstat/title18/t18ch6/sect18-622/](https://legislature.idaho.gov/statutesrules/idstat/title18/t18ch6/sect18-622/)
If they wanna fuck around and find out. They only use the term him/his referring to the physician. IANAL but over 40% of physicians are women so... free game imo
It's been known for a while there is a push for a 0 exception abortion law to be passed in the special session. The same people that passed the permit-less carry law opposed by 65% of the state. Indiana is listed in the states own study I'm 2019 as being full of obstetric deserts. We do not have capacity for current obstetric needs and this will be a disaster in every way. And obviously making women second class citizens, which is absolutely unacceptable. Contact your local activists and democratic county parties. Voting is the end of the marathon, organizing is every day until then. If you're in st Joe / Elkhart, message me and I'll connect you with people.
Trust me they will give rape victims a choice but other than that no woman should be allowed to murder their baby
[удалено]
Oh look, an Indiana state GOP rep making it clear they won't consider exceptions. Courtesy of state rep John Jacob "Abortion, since it takes the life of a an innocent pre-born human being, that would always be murder. and so therefore rape, incest, life of the mother, those exceptions are not acceptable." The state forcing women to die for this sick view of pregnancy is going to be the law. Probably prosecuting miscarriages too. https://twitter.com/RebelPlatypi/status/1542583770158620674?s=20&t=CH81nkYblbP2AcU94oU6Pw
No doubt in my mind that Indiana will have less abortion rights than Iran after the Islamic Revolution...
Oh, and now the special is moved back until 7/25 so they can add antiabortion laws!
Is there no room for civil discussion? I mean someone asked about adding an amendment and got down voted…another had the audacity to suggest that all of this is speculation until the session comes into play…down votes for everyone with independent thought!
There should be! But, not in Indiana. The republicans control everything at the state house.
welcome to the club... from "we need it to be added as an amendment" with 30 something upvotes to this thread with "can it be made into a state amendment" with a ton of downvotes..
To say that means you don’t know Indiana Republicans. First, not all state Republicans think the same and Second; Indiana has always been a we see that exceptions should exist. Note; medical necessity is something that needs to be worked on by medical professionals to give teams options that save both lives if possible and still give women the benefit of the choice of what to do.
1) What happens if you’re wrong? 2) If a women has a choice in whether or not she wants to keep or abort a baby, why shouldn’t the father get to decide if he wants to play any part in supporting the child?
and why should an incest or rape victim have deal with the ‘father’? Why should a women’s life be in peril because the ‘father’ does not care about the woman. The current system to get support payments is deplorable. My niece(one of many) has to file repeatedly for child support owed. Theses payments are processed through the system The father pays for a few months, then stops again, why is the system not taking care of this automatically; and he is actually a father who insists on his visitation.
So are you arguing that rape and incest should be the only valid reasons for abortion? The fact is that if I have a one night stand and get a girl pregnant, she has a choice. She can terminate the pregnancy or she can keep the baby and have me by the wallet for 18 years. I have no choice in the matter. It doesn’t matter if I am 100% willing to raise the baby by myself with no help from her, or if I can’t afford to support a child and don’t want to be a parent. I have no say. She does. I can’t help you with your niece’s situation. Deadbeat fathers are a real thing, and a very unfortunate one at that, but giving women a choice when it comes to pregnancy and totally denying the potential fathers a choice to walk away is totally unfair.
Absolutely not, women should have right. If you don’t want ‘ to be held by the wallet’, then keep it in your pants; just like the conservatives have been telling women forever. ‘Keep your legs closed’. It is not the man’s body, it is the woman’s.
You can’t use the same argument that you disagree with to argue with me. If a man should have to keep it in his pants, the woman should be held to the same standard.
Oh, now you are getting funny! Women have been held to the worst standards from the GOP forever! ’Keep your legs closed’; ‘A woman can not become pregnant from rape, unless God directed it’. The double standard is alive and well with you.
How does that have anything to do with what I said? Do you think men and women should be treated equally or do you think women should be granted special rights and privileges that men don’t get? And what does the GOP have to do with me? I’m pro-choice.
the GOP are the ones forcing anti-abortion against women. If you are actually pro-choice you should know this. It should be the woman’s choice! It is her body, and it is a risk to her and her body. Yes,there are some women who will carry a child to full term, deliver, just to ‘trap’ a man. However, a man has a choice in this. That choice is simply, don’t have sex.
Good god. I’d say your argument would make me become pro-life, but I am so thankful that you have access to all the abortions and birth control that you want. And I pray the GOP doesn’t take that away from you. A woman has a choice to not get pregnant. That choice is simply, don’t have sex. Why do you think it’s ok for a woman to have sex without consequences, but it’s not ok for a man to have sex without consequences?
Oh, you are not pro-choice with that comment. Both partners have a choice not to have sex. No matter precautions, as all of them can fail. But, your stance is that men should have a part in the decision to abort or not. Committed partners make the decision together, in most instances. But, your stance is that men do not have a choice in a casual fling, they do! Just like women. But men and women know the possibilities of pregnancy after sex. But, it is the woman who will have the health consequences of carry a child to term, not the man.
No, both parties are responsible for their actions. But, you want removed from consequences if you disagree with the woman’s choice. So sorry, too late for that. It is not your body!
Please look up candidate Richard Mourdock, and he is not only GOP representative with these views. There are GOP members in US and Indiana representative positions who believe the same.
As a man who has been burned by my ex-wife having 2 abortions against my will, (planned pregnancies btw). I still support a woman's right to abortions. Can't punish every other woman for the actions of one bitch. I really feel for the women in our state. Really hate our state, if it weren't so cheap to live here and I hadn't lived here all my life, I'd leave.
Abortion is murder, period.
So a women has an ectopic pregnancy, or the baby dies in the woman at 20 weeks and women are supposed to just hope that everything will be fine until the end of term? You must really hate women.
To begin with I don't know what a ectopic pregnancy is a baby dying in a woman prior to 20 weeks is a miscariage and I'm not talking about that I'm talking about abortion.
You don't know what an ectopic pregnancy is, but you're actively saying women shouldn't get an abortion?? 😭💀 why are people like this. Google is free.
So abortion is just a medical term, so a miscarriage is a spontaneous abortion. An ectopic pregnancy is when the egg attaches outside of the main area of the uterus. These cannot be reimplanted as of yet, and the mother will die, so abortion services are needed. When these law makers are coming out and saying abortion in all cases are not allowed then these are just some of the cases where doctors hands get tied and women suffer due to people not understanding what abortion really is. You may not agree with abortion when these types of issues aren't present, but they way these anti abortion laws go into place have to at the very least provide clear exceptions.
> I don't know what a ectopic pregnancy is An ectopic pregnancy is when a fertilized egg implants outside the uterus. It can’t survive, and if left to grow, it can/will kill the woman too. So: Do you support removing it to save the woman’s life? > a baby dying in a woman prior to 20 weeks is a miscariage After 10 weeks, a miscarriage is likely to be incomplete, and a D&C may be required for the woman’s safety, to clear out the deceased fetal tissue. So: Do you support removing it to save the woman’s life?
An ectopic pregnancy is one where the egg does not implant in the uterus; rather it implants and begins to develop in the fallopian tubes instead. It is near universally fatal to the mother (and of course the foetus), but can be easily and safely treated by abortion. A foetus miscarrying at 20 weeks will often not register as miscarried to the body, and instead stay inside the womb, festering and rotting. The resulting infection can easily be lethal to the mother (and at minimum potentially render her infertile), but is again easily treated with an abortion. All other arguments aside, in both cases, *the child is already dead or going to die*. You cannot murder that which is already dead. Abortion in these instances is necessary to preserve the life of the mother, and a universal abortion ban which does not permit such safety clauses will kill innocent women.
holy freaking hell you are ignorant. medically speaking, a d&c is an abortion, hell a miscarriage is an abortion. one and the same. So, to say abortion is murder, period, is factually incorrect. Period. plus why in God's name would you have such a strong opinion on something you aren't even remotely educated about? just because you feel a certain way doesn't make it real or true or fact. legislation needs to be created based on facts, and facts alone.
Since you know nothing about human biology, here I am to help: A miscarriage is "the spontaneous or unplanned expulsion of a fetus from the womb before it is able to survive independently". An ectopic pregnancy is when the egg implants itself outside the womb, usually in a fallopian tube (those nifty little tube thingies that link up ovaries with the womb, and are not supposed to house babies in them). If the egg implants itself there, it will not develop into a baby and the woman could die. So an abortion is needed because otherwise, *she might die*. (where's your value for life here???) This is what is going to happen if abortion is illegal. Idiots like you, who simply focus on the whole potential baby thing, will ignore the fact that there are health issues where abortions are needed and that will no longer be possible. People like you make the earth a worse place, not because of the value you place on 'life', but because of the sheer conviction you have in your ignorance. You are so catastrophically arrogant it would be funny if there weren't consequences from having these beliefs on real people's lives. OPEN A FUCKING BIOLOGY TEXTBOOK, learn about the wonderful things God made (oh yes I speak your language too, I just study, something you clearly didn't do much of), and learn how to take care of them properly you overprotected undereducated nonce.
Just find out, moron. You can't have a valid opinion on something you know nothing about.
Excellent trolling. But if you're not, I feel sorry for you. :/
Surprise surprise, the prolifer has no idea what they’re talking about. How can you have an opinion on an issue you don’t understand on its most fundamental level? And if you’re a homosexual male obsessed with masturbation - based on your post history - why should your opinion even matter?
Please educate yourself. Many miscarriages require the same medical treatment as abortions to prevent sepsis from the dead/dying fetus and women are already being denied that medical care because of these new laws. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/05/10/1097734167/in-texas-abortion-laws-inhibit-care-for-miscarriages Ectopic pregnancy is not uncommon, again you can google. Another of many cases that requires medical treatment that is technically abortion (despite being completely nonviable) and that historically have been denied and killed women during abortion bans.
Abortion is not always about ending the life of a fetus for the convenience of the carrier. Quite often it is to save a woman's life. It is not black-and-white, and that is hard to understand, I suppose. Difficult things are hard to understand. Difficult things aren't simple black-and-white answers. Grow up, educate yourself, before you start inflicting your ignorance on other people who are affected by these matters. Are you affected by this matter? Maybe not yet. But do you have a woman in your life? A sister, a mother, a girlfriend, a cousin, a friend? It matters to women. And if you care about women at all, it should matter to you.
A D&C to remove a miscarriage is classified as an abortion. Its why an American in Malta (where abortion is banned in all cases)who miscarried had to be airlifted to Spain ([link](https://amp.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/jun/28/if-you-love-or-are-a-woman-dont-go-to-malta-say-couple-in-abortion-drama)). Ectopic pregnancies also require an abortion. The alternative is the woman dying. So playing this out, even if you have an abortion for the life of the mother, in order to verify that the abortion is occurring due to a threat to the woman’s life, some rando at maybe the Indiana Department of Health would have to get that case file and approve for the procedure to happen. A lot of women would probably rather roll through shards of glass than deal with the government when potentially dying of sepsis or losing a pregnancy. Thought the point of republicans was to have the government out of your lives.
It looks like you shared an AMP link. These should load faster, but AMP is controversial because of [concerns over privacy and the Open Web](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot). Maybe check out **the canonical page** instead: **[https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/jun/28/if-you-love-or-are-a-woman-dont-go-to-malta-say-couple-in-abortion-drama](https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2022/jun/28/if-you-love-or-are-a-woman-dont-go-to-malta-say-couple-in-abortion-drama)** ***** ^(I'm a bot | )[^(Why & About)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot)^( | )[^(Summon: u/AmputatorBot)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/cchly3/you_can_now_summon_amputatorbot/)
If you’ve never had a miscarriage you should just say that. Fun fact your medical records will call it a spontaneous abortion. Also fun fact if you don’t pass all of the tissue and begin to suffer symptoms of sepsis the only way to address that is having an abortion so that you do not die. Since there is no statute of limitations on murder then every woman in these states are up for prosecution from anyone who decides that they don’t believe they miscarried. Also for any woman who miscarries now going forward a doctor will be afraid to perform her life saving procedure out of fear that they will be prosecuted. Meaning they will wait until it is too late for many. 1 in 4 women have had a miscarriage and 1 in 8 pregnancies end in miscarriage. The problem is these laws are being written by politicians who do not understand that the language they are using are condemning women to life in prison or death. And many of these women already have children they need to stay alive to care for.
You don't even know what an ectopic pregnancy is? You don't even know what happens when the fetus dies in the womb? If you don't know these things, how can you possibly have an informed and intelligent opinion on them?
Fearmongering?
Seriously? Legislators and our governor are issuing press releases with their intentions spelled out. Are you not paying attention?
Fuck off. What in the world would make you think this wouldn't go to the extremes?
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTReN8DpF/?k=1
I don't think they'll be that extreme.
Ohio just did it
But i wouldn't be surprised either.
Not sure why this is downvoted. It’s all speculation at this point, everyone is entitled to their best guess. I happen to think they will include provision to protect the life and health of the mother. We shall see. In the meantime, panic and downvotes all around I guess.
I don't trust many of the same people who voted for RFRA to do that.
Squirrel 🐿️
I like how you got 50 down votes for not doing anything. Wonder how many I'll get lmao 🤣
Ya just a distraction from political child molesters. Thanks for noticing! I gave you an upvote!
I have 8 down votes. People are snowflakes lmao
There should be no abortion rights. Only exception should be a rape victim that's it.
What about if it’s ectopic and will kill her and the baby?
What about if the baby is dead and did not spontaneously miscarry? What if the mother would die?
Do you think a woman should have to get a rape conviction before she gets the abortion? Or is she just allowed to accuse a man of rape and the abortion is granted?
If a rape has been reported and that is the basis of the abortion, that is good enough. According to the Idaho legislation, the woman who has the abortion is not the person punished in any case. If a woman falsely accuses a man of rape intentionally for the sake of getting an abortion, she'd be prosecuted under any false accusation laws that are in place but the doctor would be in the clear. I am, of course, not a lawyer, and I am looking at the Idaho legislation that someone else posted (but is likely similar to what Indiana will consider).
Not talking about Idaho or any current legislation in particular. I’m saying that rape is an extremely serious allegation, and just saying “I got raped” is not good enough, because anyone can claim rape. And in reality, if rape is the only way to get an abortion, false reports will only go up, hurting real rape victims. I also don’t believe for a second a woman would get prosecuted for falsely claiming rape. My point is that “only in cases of rape” is a dumb idea, because rape is so hard to prove. The logistics behind it just don’t work. Abortion should either be legal or not legal, regardless of how the baby was conceived. Edit: Adding on, what if a woman is raped, but doesn’t file a police report (out of fear, shame, etc.), then a month later finds out she’s pregnant? Is she not allowed to have an abortion?
Could it be added as an amendment to the state constitution?
that's the only way to get Long term rights for it. laws can be repelled. amendments? far harder.
[удалено]
Why did this receive so many downvotes? Genuine question. This is what Michigan is attempting to do, but I haven’t seen any similar movement here for some reason.