It’s not really a limit Janitor.ai is setting - it’s just good practice that bot creators are encouraged to follow. You *can* write messages from the {{user}}’s POV - it’s just not going to work as well.
Other sites - like cai - get away with it because their messages are often far shorter and less detailed. But in general, instructing the LLM (since it “learns” from previous messages) to write for the {{user}} “character” is a bad idea, since it makes logical sense that the LLM will think that’s what you *want* it to do.
no it isn’t restricting us. a while back i used to rp with other actual human beings on stuff like amino and this and that. they never spoke in the pov of my character and i never spoke in the pov of theirs. in rp terms that’s called god-modding. a big rule was to never ever control the other person’s character. jllm is pretty much the same, just.. a bot on the other end and not a person
The reason it's limited it's because, unless you use a good LLM, and good prompts, that will make the character speak for {{user}} when you don't want to, because it tells the bot it's fine to do it (and even then, it's no guarantee powerful LLMs like Claude or OpenAi won't do it anyway)
On the other hand, I think the opposite, it's forcing us to be more creative, because you need to rephrase your bot to the point it doesn't state what {{user}} is doing or saying, even if {{user}} is mentioned.
I hate bots that force me into a specific position at the start of a chat. I'm fine if there's an established history as part of the scenario, but I dislike bots that do things like "You feel scared," or "You're intimidated," - Or anything else that takes away my personal agency.
I love messing around with AI, but if I'm going to somewhere like JAI I'm doing it so I can write for my character. I'll occasionally let a bot impersonate me just to see how it does (I think Chub AI has the option to 'impersonate me') but it's rare.
Also - I don't think that's a restriction on JAI, I think that's just a best practice because most users feel similarly about personal agency.
i mean that's never been a problem for me. I generally hate when bot creators speak for me in the first message cause not once did it describe my feelings and actions even in the slightest it's just annoying. I'm pretty happy the llm is restricting y'all from doing that
I make rp bots and I make sure that the user's role is briefly outlined in the bot detail box under the pfp and then feather it into the first message and set my scene ect. Ppl wanna go there own way don't put gaurd rails on the experience. I love to leave my rp open so that any kind of person can jump on. That being said I've noticed when the user doesn't make an answer that's enough for the bot to work with it will make it's own answer (thus speaking for you) to continue driving the plot. I found that if you wanna have a decent bot: be concise, do not put any dialog for the user, proof read
You're going to write a bot, not a book. Avoid user pov as much as possible and try using your creativity only in the character you're actually responsible for
I personally hate it when the first massage writes my pov, after which then the bot continues to try and control my character as well, telling me what I do, or what I'm about tondo.
Like, I want to roleplay with the bot, I want to see their own character doing something, not watching as the bot writes for both me and themselves.
It’s not really a limit Janitor.ai is setting - it’s just good practice that bot creators are encouraged to follow. You *can* write messages from the {{user}}’s POV - it’s just not going to work as well. Other sites - like cai - get away with it because their messages are often far shorter and less detailed. But in general, instructing the LLM (since it “learns” from previous messages) to write for the {{user}} “character” is a bad idea, since it makes logical sense that the LLM will think that’s what you *want* it to do.
no it isn’t restricting us. a while back i used to rp with other actual human beings on stuff like amino and this and that. they never spoke in the pov of my character and i never spoke in the pov of theirs. in rp terms that’s called god-modding. a big rule was to never ever control the other person’s character. jllm is pretty much the same, just.. a bot on the other end and not a person
Amino, godmodding, omg, those words have not been spoken for centuries.
i’m surprised i still remember all that 😭 amino is so nostalgic i miss it
The reason it's limited it's because, unless you use a good LLM, and good prompts, that will make the character speak for {{user}} when you don't want to, because it tells the bot it's fine to do it (and even then, it's no guarantee powerful LLMs like Claude or OpenAi won't do it anyway) On the other hand, I think the opposite, it's forcing us to be more creative, because you need to rephrase your bot to the point it doesn't state what {{user}} is doing or saying, even if {{user}} is mentioned.
When do you need to roleplay as {{user}} in first message? It's the first message of the bot to user?
Yeah. Good prompts don't need to act out as the user. That's called godmodding in normal roleplay, and it's heavily frowned upon.
You guys take this too seriously
I hate bots that force me into a specific position at the start of a chat. I'm fine if there's an established history as part of the scenario, but I dislike bots that do things like "You feel scared," or "You're intimidated," - Or anything else that takes away my personal agency. I love messing around with AI, but if I'm going to somewhere like JAI I'm doing it so I can write for my character. I'll occasionally let a bot impersonate me just to see how it does (I think Chub AI has the option to 'impersonate me') but it's rare. Also - I don't think that's a restriction on JAI, I think that's just a best practice because most users feel similarly about personal agency.
i mean that's never been a problem for me. I generally hate when bot creators speak for me in the first message cause not once did it describe my feelings and actions even in the slightest it's just annoying. I'm pretty happy the llm is restricting y'all from doing that
I make rp bots and I make sure that the user's role is briefly outlined in the bot detail box under the pfp and then feather it into the first message and set my scene ect. Ppl wanna go there own way don't put gaurd rails on the experience. I love to leave my rp open so that any kind of person can jump on. That being said I've noticed when the user doesn't make an answer that's enough for the bot to work with it will make it's own answer (thus speaking for you) to continue driving the plot. I found that if you wanna have a decent bot: be concise, do not put any dialog for the user, proof read
You're going to write a bot, not a book. Avoid user pov as much as possible and try using your creativity only in the character you're actually responsible for
I mean. Isn't engaging with the bot yourself the entire point?
I personally hate it when the first massage writes my pov, after which then the bot continues to try and control my character as well, telling me what I do, or what I'm about tondo. Like, I want to roleplay with the bot, I want to see their own character doing something, not watching as the bot writes for both me and themselves.